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File Revelation at Mar-a-Lago; Bannon to Surrender Tomorrow; Suspect in Fletcher Killing to be Charged; Ukraine Forces Making Gains. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired September 07, 2022 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A very good Wednesday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow.

Well, this morning, just stunning new details about just how sensitive the classified documents were that the FBI seized last month in that search of Mar-a-Lago. "The Washington Post" reports that one of the highly classified documents found described a foreign government's nuclear capabilities. Let me read you part of their reporting. Quote, some of the seized documents detailed top secret U.S. operations so closely guarded that many senior national security officials are kept in the dark about them. Only the president, some members of his cabinet, or a near cabinet level official could authorize other government officials to know the details of these special access programs.

SCIUTTO: Even more sensitive than we knew to this point. And, of course, kept in an unsecured facility. If confirmed, it means the documents containing another nation's nuclear secrets, as well as some of the U.S.' most highly guarded top secret operations were sitting in an unsecured country club for more than 18 months after repeated requests to return those documents.

And another major story we are following this morning, this one out of Memphis, Tennessee. The man now charged with the death of 34-year-old Eliza Fletcher is facing multiple murder charges in her kidnapping and death, expected in court, in the next hour. We're going to bring you updates live, more in a moment.

First, though, we do want to begin with our top story this hour, "The Washington Post" story reporting a document detailing a foreign government's military defenses, including its nuclear capabilities, along with top secret U.S. operations, found in that group of classified documents in Mar-a-Lago.

Let's speak now to Shan Wu, defense attorney, former federal prosecutor. Also Shawn Turner, former director of communications for the Director of National Intelligence.

If I could begin with you, Shawn. You call this new reporting -- you say that it raises the bar for the intelligence community's damage assessment, which was - it was already doing for the classified documents we knew to this point. This, of course, more sensitive. So, folks at home can understand, explain what the danger is to this country's national security from information like that being potentially exposed, but also to the other country, the foreign country involved here, when it comes to their nuclear defenses.

SHAWN TURNER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes, thanks, Jim.

So, you know, the fact that we now know that there were highly classified, restricted access documents about another country's nuclear defense capabilities stored at Mar-a-Lago is a real - is a game changer with regard to the risk it poses to our national security. Exposure to these documents, you know, the fact that these documents may have been seen by unauthorized personnel, it do -- it does a couple of things. One, it tells individuals what our capabilities are with regard to intelligence collection related to nuclear programs. And that's extremely dangerous. But the other thing it does, and I think more important, is it identifies or exposes our gaps with regard to intelligence collection. The bottom line on this, Jim, is that others are going to look at this information and they're going to determine what we know and what we don't know and they're going to make decisions about their nuclear programs based on that information.

SCIUTTO: Wow.

TURNER: And that is an extremely dangerous thing and that's why these documents being at Mar-a-Lago in an unsecured location is such a concern for intelligence officials.

HARLOW: You know, Shan, a bit buried in this "Washington Post" reporting, but I think really striking, is the fact that this document that they're talking about that had to do with a foreign government's nuclear defense readiness was found in that last batch of documents that they obtained, right? That means from the search at Mar-a-Lago, not from the previously handed over ones, not in response to the subpoena, but that means that it took months and months of -- more than a year of back and forth, you know, between the National Archives, then the Justice Department, and Trump's lawyers to get these. And I wonder what that tells you about DOJ's criminal probe.

SHAN WU, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Well, I think it's a little bit hard to discern what that means about their stage of the probe itself. I think it certainly shows that the internal deliberations at DOJ were probably very painstaking. Going back and forth this way, they already tried a grand jury subpoena until finally they became alarmed enough that they had to execute the search warrants. So, I think it does show they really did bend over backwards before they took the step of executing the search warrant, which, you know, of course is unprecedented because it's a former president. And I'm not sure what Shawn feels about this, but I think it -- in a other kind of situation, knowing the degree of risk with the gravity of this type of material, they probably would have moved a lot sooner than they did.

[09:05:08] SCIUTTO: Shan, legal question, does the sensitivity of the intelligence that was left exposed here, does that increase the likelihood that the DOJ charges Trump? In other words, we already knew there were classified documents, but does the level of classification, the sensitivity, the potential damage to U.S. national security and that of others, does that increase the risk of charges here and is there a sort of format for that, is there a standard?

WU: Well, there's no standard when it comes to somebody who's a former president being charged. And, yes, I think the evidence was there. This is confirmation of the seriousness and the sensitivity of these documents. So, there's a certain kind of critical mass that has to be reached in terms of the worrisomeness of what was exposed. I think that's already there.

Ultimately, Jim, this is a matter of really completely prosecutorial discretion for Garland as a matter of the will of whether, you know, he's willing to take DOJ to a place it hasn't been before.

HARLOW: Can I get your insights, since it's hard for a lot of us to understand what all of these acronyms mean, Shawn. But what we do know from this "Washington Post" reporting is that some of the documents that were taken from Mar-a-Lago in August were marked HCS, and that refers to systems used to protect intelligence gathered from secret human sources.

How concerning is that as well in terms of potentially compromising actual people that are sources?

TURNER: Yes, it's extremely concerning. You know, HCS refers to Human Control System. That is intelligence that we know is collected because of our ability to leverage individuals, to provide information to our intelligence community. We're talking about real people on the other end of that intelligence. So HCS is one that certainly caused me a lot of concern.

But, to be really clear, when I saw the handling instructions for several of these documents, you know, I was concerned. There were no foreign documents in there, meaning no foreign government should see those documents. Handling instructions that suggested that the originator should control access to those documents. So, across the board, when you look at how this information should have been handled, what you walk away with is a clear and resounding understanding that under no circumstances should these documents have ever been stored in various places at a country club in Florida.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: No question about that.

Shawn Turner, thank you.

Shan Wu, we appreciate it very much.

SCIUTTO: Well, other news this morning. Long time Trump ally, adviser, Steve Bannon, he's expected to surrender to prosecutors in New York on Thursday to face state charges there related to his fundraising effort to build a wall along the U.S. southern border. Of course, the question, where did that money go?

HARLOW: Great question.

Let's get some answers from our Kara Scannell, following this story.

These are new charges that they come after Bannon allegedly defrauded donors. People will remember, you know, we will build the wall. That whole campaign. And people gave money for that.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: They gave $25 million according to federal prosecutors.

HARLOW: Not just pennies. So where did the money go?

SCANNELL: Well, so you remember Bannon was initially indicted on federal charges in a fraud scheme relating to this fundraising effort back in August of 2020.

HARLOW: Right.

SCANNELL: He was arrested on a yacht in the -- off the coast of Connecticut. Prosecutors allege then that they had misled the donors by telling them that all of the money that they raised would go toward the construction of that wall. But, instead, prosecutors said that a million dollars of it went to fund personal expenses of Bannon and his co-conspirators.

Now, the former president, Trump, had pardoned Bannon, just as he was leaving office, and that's when the Manhattan District Attorney's Office opened their state investigation into Bannon and into this same fundraising effort.

Now, because Bannon was not prosecuted, you know, he was indicted, but it wasn't completed, and then he was pardoned, that leaves a window here for state prosecutors to move both on the double jeopardy grounds and also because a presidential pardon doesn't affect a state investigation. So, we've seen the DA's office, you know, continue to work on this. We reported in June that they brought some people from Bannon's inner circle in before the grand jury. This is all teeing up to this week where Bannon is now expected to surrender tomorrow and be in court to face these new charges.

And it's just mounting legal problems for Bannon. We'll remember it was just two months ago that he was convicted of contempt of Congress for failing to comply with a subpoena from the House Select Committee investigating January 6th. Bannon's calling these new charges phony and says that it is a partisan, political weaponization of the criminal justice system.

HARLOW: More questions to answer. Thanks very much, Kara Scannell, for us.

Well, soon, the man accused of kidnapping and killing a 34-year-old mother and teacher, Eliza Fletcher, he will be arraigned in a Memphis courtroom. Cleotha Abston is charged with first degree murder, premeditated murder and murder in the perpetration of a kidnapping.

[09:10:04]

Officials found Fletcher's body Monday behind a vacant duplex.

SCIUTTO: Yes, this investigation moved so quickly.

CNN national correspondent Gary Tuchman, he's been following this story. He's in Memphis with the latest.

So, court appearance this morning. What do we expect to see?

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jim and Poppy, the man accused of killing Eliza Fletcher will have a second arraignment in two days. Today's arraignment will be on these two first degree murder counts. Yesterday he was arraigned on a kidnapping count and also tampering with evidence.

Now, the reason these counts weren't together in one arraignment is because her body was found on Monday evening but it wasn't identified yet during yesterday's arraignment. The prosecutor told the judge, we are adding two murder counts, because shortly before yesterday's arraignment, the positive identification of Eliza Fletcher came.

During the arraignment yesterday, the defendant, Cleotha Abston, was inside the courtroom wearing a mask, but we could tell that he had absolutely no emotion while he was standing there. He was given $500,000 bond, said he wouldn't be able to afford to get out, which is not surprising. We expect bond to be completely revoked today after the arraignment on these two murder counts.

Jim. Poppy.

HARLOW: Gary, according to this affidavit, as I understand it, they say that a pair of purple running shorts that actually matched the description of what Fletcher was last seen wearing were found in a trash bag near where she was found. What else have you learned?

TUCHMAN: So, we've learned a lot. First of all, we should tell you that Eliza Fletcher was an avid runner and she was running about four miles east of where she lives near the University of Memphis campus when she was attacked and kidnapped. Surveillance camera was on top of a building at the campus captured her being kidnapping, captured the SUV. So, authorities knew what the SUV looked like.

About an hour later, they saw video from cameras throughout the city of Memphis with the SUV driving about seven miles west to the south Memphis neighborhood. And that is where indeed they found her body. They were able to pinpoint the location of her body with the technology from the cameras along the route and also from an FBI cell analysis team. What they do is they actually analyze cell phone data. So, with that, they were able to find her body. And what's really important to note from the affidavit is where they found her body was a half mile away from where a witness saw this defendant frantically cleaning his car an hour and a half or two hours after the kidnapping.

Jim. Poppy.

SCIUTTO: That's quite a trail - quite a trail of evidence. And I understand we've now heard from Eliza's poor family. What did they have to say?

TUCHMAN: Yes, just so sad. I mean, keep in mind, she is a wife, a mother of two small children. Her parents are still alive. Just so sad. And they've come out with a statement. I want to read part of it to you. It says, we are heartbroken and devastated by this senseless loss. Eliza was such a joy to so many. We are grateful beyond measure to local, state and federal law enforcement for their tireless efforts.

Some family was in court yesterday. We expect them to be here again today.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

TUCHMAN: Jim. Poppy.

HARLOW: Oh, her poor family. Her poor little kids.

Gary Tuchman, we appreciate your reporting there. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Coming up next, we have new reporting on the Ukrainian counteroffensive in the south of the country. What senior U.S. and Ukrainian officials are telling us about the objectives, they're ambitious, and progress so far.

HARLOW: Plus, extreme heat in California is helping to fuel this wildfire that has already killed two people and forced many more to evacuate. We have a live update on that ahead.

And later this hour, five Texas DPS officers are now under investigation for their actions on the day of the Uvalde school shooting. Two of them have been suspended with pay. We will speak to Texas State Senator Roland Gutierrez as children in that district return for a second day of school.

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[09:18:11]

SCIUTTO: This news just in to CNN, U.S. and Ukrainian officials tell myself and my colleague, Tom Lister (ph), that Ukraine's latest counteroffensive is making forward progress in the south as they attempt to recapture Russian-occupied region of Kherson by the end of this year. Geolocation data shows the Ukrainians have launched their most ambitious ground assault since the beginning of the invasion just over the last week. A senior U.S. official says the Ukrainians have achieved some success attacking Russian supply lines aiming to cut off and isolate Russian troop deployed to the west of the Dnipro River. That's a key dividing line. Ukrainian officials also want to take the city of Nova Kekova (ph), which is the site of an important hydroelectric plant and a canal that crucially supplies Russian occupied Crimea with most of its water. A former British soldier working to help the Ukrainian military retake Kherson says it won't be easy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK AYRES, FORMER BRITISH SOLDIER FIGHTING FOR UKRAINE: It won't be quick. I mean it's hard, slow fought, meter by meter, position by position. Because we haven't got resources to do a massive blitzkrieg.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now, retired Army Major General James "Spider" Marks, CNN military analyst, head of geopolitical strategy at Academy Securities.

Good to have you on, Spider Marks.

You have said that what happens on the ground over the next couple of weeks will define the next couple of years. This is just nine days into this Ukrainian counteroffensive. The focus of the battle now down here with the aim of retaking Kherson. Why do you think these next several weeks are so crucial?

MAJ. GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, I think what we're seeing clearly is Ukrainians have really been gaining some tactical momentum and achieving some great success holding the Russians back. In this particular area, as you can see on the map that you just pointed out, Jim, the Ukrainians have a pretty good presence just north of Kherson.

[09:20:07]

So, the objective clearly is to try to isolate that, cut through that, create a corridor that would then allow the Ukrainians to hold to the east and then try to reduce in the direction of the west toward Kherson. They have the capability of doing that.

What we've not seen to date is the Ukrainians achieving great tactical success in order to push the Russians back. This would be the first time. Now, bear in mind, there are tactical victories, but operational momentum belongs to the Russians. They have chosen where they want to fight. They have covered down in this area from Kharkiv all the way to Kherson.

SCIUTTO: So, the goal is to take the city of Kherson, also this city here, which I noted early on has a key hydroelectric plant, but also to try to isolate Russian forces here to the west of the Dnipro River. And the U.S. has been seeing in recent weeks accurate attacks, particularly with these HIMARS systems, on Russian positions in their territory and now some ground movements that show some promise in your view. Is that an optimistic start to this counteroffensive?

MARKS: Oh, absolutely, it is. What you're seeing is the synchronization and a three-dimensional fight. You're achieving success at distance, the use of HIMARS and precision artillery, which (INAUDIBLE) have in pretty large numbers, and you're -- you see the junction of that with the movement of forces to achieve those larger operational objectives. In other words, it's just not simply an isolated fight or artillery. That's what the Russians are primarily doing. They're not synchronizing the battlefield. The Ukrainians are stepping up and (INAUDIBLE) a layer and a level of synchronization that they've not previously been able to achieve in great distance.

SCIUTTO: OK. One part of this synchronization is that what is happening down here, it's not all happening down here. There have also been attacks and activity around Kharkiv, as well as attempts to advance here in the east, in effect, extending the battlefield really several hundred miles here. What does that show you about Ukrainian capabilities? My understanding from U.S. officials is that they're doing this deliberately so that Russia cannot move forces to the south down here to protect this area where the bulk of the offensive is.

MARKS: Jim, if you took your two green dots from Kharkiv to the tip of the arrow that you have down in the south, and if that corridor, if the Russians could push in that southwesterly direction, they would then achieve a much greater bite of Ukraine. And that's where the Ukrainians are having great success. They're holding the Russians up there in the vicinity outside of Kharkiv, and they're now trying to push in the vicinity of Kherson. That prevents what would be called interior lines by the Russians of moving from one direction to the other in a straight line.

SCIUTTO: Right.

MARKS: So that what the Ukrainians are doing now is incredibly successful and is a tactical victory that (INAUDIBLE) the, you know, added upon as we go through. And I don't think that the Ukrainians are going to be in a position to push the Russians back into Russia or to further atrip (ph) them to a level where the Russians just put their hands up and say we're finished.

SCIUTTO: Right. Well, to that point, because no one expects Russia to just put their hands up. The objective here seems to be not just to defend the lines, but to gain back at least some Russian occupied territory. We know the Ukrainian president says he wants to gain it all back, but in the near term to gain back some. Is that, briefly, an achievable objective?

MARKS: Well, it is, and clearly that is the intent of this operation. Look, again, over the course of the next few weeks, the victories that the Ukrainians have, and the wins that the Russians might be able to achieve, which might be simply to hold what they have, will then define what any type of negotiation that might take place. I don't know that Zelenskyy is in a position to say I want to have a negotiation. But neither is Putin because you have both sides that have a we're winning narrative.

So, what you want to do is you want to force - you want to achieve these wins now so that if there is a movement going forward you have some type of negotiation.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

MARKS: It's what you - it's the status quo that they've been able to achieve. SCIUTTO: Absolutely. Facts on the ground. Always important if you're

able to get to the negotiating table.

Major General Spider Marks, thanks so much for walking us all through it.

MARKS: Thank you, Jim.

HARLOW: That was fascinating to see.

OK, still ahead, an interesting midterm matchup is brewing in Massachusetts. The challenges ahead for Republicans to try to keep the governor's mansion there.

We're also moments away from the opening bell on Wall Street. This morning, futures slightly down, virtually flat, falling earlier today, seeming to react to this "Wall Street Journal" reporting suggesting Fed Chair Jerome Powell and the Fed could raise rates by another three quarter percentage points when they meet this month.

[09:25:00]

Stocks added to their three-week slide yesterday, closing lower. We'll keep an eye on all of it. Stay with us.

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