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Sources: Trump Aide Kash Patel Ordered To Testify Before Grand Jury; Trump Lawyers Thought Justice Clarence Thomas "Key" To Delaying Electoral Count; Iran Human Rights Expert: Up To 14,000 Arrested Over Last Six Weeks; U.S. Will Work To Remove Iran From U.N. Council On Women; Astros Throw 2nd No-Hitter In World Series History; Irving Takes "Responsibility" For Promoting Antisemitic Documentary. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired November 03, 2022 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: So Jim, look, there's a lot to ask him about. Not only is he a former Trump administration, national security and defense official, he is also one of the people that was designated by the former president to interact with the National Archives and the Justice Department as both of these agencies were trying to get back these classified records that Trump kept from his presidency.

Now, he has also said publicly that he witnessed Trump declassify some of these materials before he left office, and that is likely going to be something that prosecutors want to ask him about.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Right.

REID: Because if he says now that he has immunity that, yes, I witnessed him declassifying, that really kind of muddles any potential prosecution here. It makes it more complicated. But if he says, no, what I said publicly wasn't true, that's also problematic because now you have a potential witness who said one thing publicly and a different thing under questioning --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

REID: And any good defense attorney would tear him up. Now a lot of people asking, what does this mean for former President Trump? Look, it's never a good day, Jim, when one of your closest advisers is answering questions from federal prosecutors about potential crimes that happened on your property.

But anything beyond that, about him flipping, about this being, you know, really the huge sign that he's going to be indicted --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

REID: -- that just goes way beyond the reporting and it's speculation at this point. Right now, we're trying to figure out exactly when. Kash Patel will be answering this questions for the grand jury. SCIUTTO: As always, wait to see what they find.

REID: Exactly.

SCIUTTO: Paula Reid, thanks so much.

All right. Joining me now to discuss, Paul Rosenzweig, former Deputy Assistant Secretary for Policy at DHS, Senior Counsel as well for the Whitewater Investigation. Paul, good to have you on. I wonder first on the Kash Patel news, your read, particularly this granting of immunity there. Why shield him, because I suppose they're more interested in the facts than in going after him potentially?

PAUL ROSENZWEIG, FORMER SENIOR COUNSEL FOR WHITEWATER INVESTIGATION: Well, I actually read a little bit more into it than your reporter. They're treating Kash Patel like he's Donald Trump's alibi girlfriend. When a murderer says I was with my girlfriend and the girlfriend willing to say, yes, he was with me that night, you bring her into the grand jury and you make her say that under oath.

And either she lies in which case she exposes herself to criminal charges, or under the under the scrutiny of the grand jury under its case, she tells you the truth and says, no, he wasn't here. And that's what they're doing now with the declassification story, at least that's part of what they're doing. They're going to put a hotel to the choice of, you know, telling the grand jury of story that he's going to have to own for forever, or coming clean and saying he was lying when he was talking on Fox News.

And so that's actually pretty significant. Because you only do that to the girlfriend, when you think you're going to charge the murderer, right? You only do that if you're --

SCIUTTO: Interesting.

ROSENZWEIG: -- actually looking at next level up. So I think it's --

SCIUTTO: I see.

ROSENZWEIG: Yes, and clearly had speculation, but I think it's a pretty significant step.

SCIUTTO: Are you saying -- just asking for your prosecutorial sense here that they don't believe Kash's story that he saw the President declassifying these documents?

ROSENZWEIG: Well, I don't think many people believe that. There's no evidence of it. There's no written record of it. It's the story of a Trump sycophant that he told to, you know, right-wing news. But either way, you want to know -- you locked in his testimony. Whichever way he goes with this in front of the grand jury, he has to own that for the rest of this prosecution

If it turns out that he's lying, then he's got personal exposure to criminal charges for perjury. And if he recounts in front of the grand jury, he's not locked in. Either way, you've got -- you now know, you fixed the defense.

SCIUTTO: OK, another case. The January 6 emails, emails that recently turned over to the January 6 committee. In those lawyer for Trump describes Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas as quote, key to Trump's plan to delay Congress's certification of the 2020 election vote. Just quoting here, "We want to frame things so that Thomas could be the one to issue some sort of stay, or other circuit justice opinion saying Georgia is in legitimate doubt here."

Now, that doesn't mean Thomas would have done that necessarily, but that was at least their target as part of this plan. Given that and given Ginni Thomas's role already, what do you make of Thomas's decision thus far not recusing himself from anything January 6 related?

ROSENZWEIG: Well, I think that the January 6 investigation is broad enough that you could probably divide it up reasonably. You know, I think what this says is that should, for example, the Eastman email conflict and disclosure to the January 6 committee come before the court, he would probably have to recuse simply because his name is in the emails that are the subject of the dispute. And it certainly reflects the fact that had everybody on the Trump side thought he had a predilection about the case that was favorable to them.

[10:35:09]

But you can't stop. I mean, as your judge, you can't stop people speculating about what you mean.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ROSENZWEIG: And it's really not, you know, his responsibility to monitor what Kenneth Chesebro says to John Eastman. So he's got a little bit of a decent complaint here that I shouldn't recuse just because other people are talking about being behind my back.

SCIUTTO: Understood. Paul Rosenzweig, always good to have you on. Thanks so much.

ROSENZWEIG: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Well, North Korea is firing more ballistic missiles today. This as the country sends a warning to the U.S. and South Korea over those countries decision to extend their military drills. What we are learning? The seriousness of the situation on the peninsula, that's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:40:12]

SCIUTTO: Right now, on the ground in Ukraine, the Russian military is claiming to have repelled attacks by Ukraine inside the still contested Kherson region in the south. This video from earlier today appears to show the Russian flag removed from a local administration building. This amid reports of a possible broader Russian withdrawal. Two Ukrainian officials have denied that. One telling CNN that any statements about a possible Russia withdrawal are, quote, more like a trap. We'll watch closely there.

North Korea is escalating tensions this morning, firing three short range ballistic missiles just hours after government officials said a separate launch had failed. That failed launch involved a much bigger longer-range missile, an ICBM, intercontinental ballistic missile, a move the U.S. has violated multiple U.N. Security Council resolutions.

All of these comes after the U.S. and South Korea said they will extend joint military exercises as a response to these North Korean launches. North Korea called that decision, quote, a very dangerous and false choice. North Korea has launched some 30 missiles just this year.

Now turning to Iran, where one human rights expert says as many as 14,000 people have been arrested so far in the ongoing protests, originally sparked by the death of 22-year-old Mahsa Amini, in police custody in December. CNN cannot independently verify that number of those arrested.

We do know that Iran has announced the public trials of 1,000 people involved in those demonstrations. At least one report says dozens of them now faced charges that carry the death penalty.

Masih Alinejad is an Iranian journalist and activist. She is creator of the My Stealthy Freedom Facebook page, which highlights Iranian women who have discarded their hijabs that at the root of these latest protests. Masih, welcome back. It's good to have you on again.

MASIH ALINEJAD, IRANIAN JOURNALIST AND ACTIVIST: Thank you so much for having me.

SCIUTTO: So last time, we spoke just a little over a month ago, we were following these protests very closely. There was more international attention. Just in the last week we had back-to-back memorial services for Mahsa Amini, who really sparked this -- her death spark this, but also 16-year-old Nika Shakarami, who was killed just last month. I wonder, do you see those memorials keeping the momentum, the energy of these protests against the regime?

ALINEJAD: That's true. Today, Hadis Najafi, a 20-year-old girl's memorial become a turning point for Iranians to take back to the streets. Massive protests across Iran, not only in Tehran or Karachi. And people were chanting against dictators. You know what happened? The people who found each other across Iran, there is no -- I mean, there's no turning back to their home or to prison. They are there to end the Islamic Republic.

And as you mentioned last time, when I was in your show, I was angry, begging the international communities to take action. I was actually angry with the United Nation that I knew for democratic countries voted for the Islamic Republic to have a sit on top of women's body at the United Nations. But now, I see that they are changing their tone as well.

Kamala Harris -- thanks to the U.S. -- mentioned that they are going to push for removal of the Islamic Republic from United Nation. So these solidarity is actually giving hope to people and people are not going to give up in the streets.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, because Karim Sadjadpour, who I know you know well, studied Iran for a number of years, has said that for this regime, hijab is one of the pillars of it effectively. Forcing women to wear this to cover their hair along with Death to America and Death to Israel. I wonder, do you see any scenario in which the regime given how central this is to their message, if you want to call it that, gives up the hijab as a way to stop these protests?

ALINEJAD: That's a very good question. Look, the Iranian regime has two options to kill more people, which is going to create more anger and make people more determined to come back to the streets, or the Iranian regime actually come with concession or saying that, OK, we're going to get rid of compulsory hijab, we're going to get rid of morality police.

And that is going to be an end for Islamic ideology, for Islamic Republic. Because compulsory hijab is the main pillar of religious dictatorship.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ALINEJAD: It's like, as I always say, it's like the Berlin Wall. And if women get successful to make the Islamic Republic, put one step back, get rid of the compulsory hijab, then it's going to be the end for the Islamic Republic for sure. You don't see any single slogan in the street against compulsory hijab a job, it's beyond that.

[10:45:06]

These are -- the generation are saying, no to slavery, you know? This is like, I mean, the Americans know that. It's like saying no -- practicing your civil disobedience -- saying no to slavery. These are like Rosa Parks of Iran. This is a revolution led by women, but men shoulder to shoulder with women saying that this is 21st century, leave us alone. We deserve to have a secular democratic country.

SCIUTTO: I've been to Iran a dozen times and women I meet there always mentioned the hijab as a form of state control really. When we last spoke, your comments in support of Western sanctions on the Iranian regime, as you know, sparked some criticism of you from other members of the dissident community. Other people who support the protests going on, they're now saying that, in effect, it's the Iranian people who suffer most from those sanctions, not the regime. And I wonder what your answer is to that criticism.

ALINEJAD: Jim, the time of the apologist is over. The time of those who trying to sell the narrative of Islamic Republic to CNN, to United Nations, to the human rights organizations by saying that because of the sanction people, our industry, or people are suffering from the policy which has been made by Americans is over. You have to pay attention to the people inside Iran saying that they lie to us, that they say our enemy is America. Our enemy is right here, is the Islamic Republic. And we are suffering from the sanction that has been imposed on us by our own government, by the mullahs. The relative of the mullahs are here in America, enjoying the luxury lives.

What people of Iran want, is clear. They want the Western government to sanction the Islamic Republic, the way that they address Putin and Putin's relative. This is what the Iranian people want. The Iranian people now are in the streets facing guns and bullets. And they are asking the Western countries, the leaders of democratic countries to recognize this revolution.

This is a revolution led by women and people are getting killed in the street. And they have a clear message. The Democrats here in America, the Republican they should see this like bipartisan issue. The leaders of the E.U., the European countries, should see this as a -- I mean, this is about our dignity.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ALINEJAD: This is not about sanction. This is not about nuclear. And believe me, when the Western democratic countries come together and recognize this revolution, a free and democratic country would make the whole world a better place to live.

SCIUTTO: Right.

ALINEJAD: Would make the whole world actually a safer place. Right now, Iranian regime sending drones to Ukraine. Iranian regime send the money to Iraq, to Syria, you know?

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ALINEJAD: So that is why it's not about sanction, it is about one of the most barbaric regimes. Islamic Republic is like ISIS, and it should be addressed like ISIS as well.

SCIUTTO: We'll continue to follow those protests there. Masih Alinejad, nice to have you back on the program.

ALINEJAD: Thank you so much for not giving up on Iranian people.

SCIUTTO: We'll keep on it. Well, after promoting an antisemitic documentary, the NBA star Kyrie Irving says that he is now taking responsibility for the negative impact of his post. We're going to have more on that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:53:11]

SCIUTTO: The Houstonian Astros made history last night throwing a no- hitter against the Philadelphia Phillies in Game 4 of the World Series. CNN Correspondent Carolyn Manno has more details. Carolyn, I know it is shared among four pitchers, but, man, that's a hard thing to do particularly on that stage.

CAROLYN MANNO, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Really is. And when you consider the fact that we've only seen this twice in nearly 120 years in the history of the World Series, it does underscore that difficulty. This is the first combined no-hitter in the World Series.

But starter Cristian Javier is really the story here, Jim. I mean, he's 25 years old. He's got this incredible fastball, and he's one of the sports most underappreciated stars. He was undrafted from the Dominican Republic. He was actually pegged first as an outfielder in his teens. He signed a $10,000 contract as a 16-year-old, and now all the way to the sport's biggest stage.

You know his parents flew him before the game to see him pitch and they told him, God willing, you'll throw a no hitter here. And that is exactly what he and his teammates did. Javier striking out nine over six innings including five in a row at one point before he turned it over to the bullpen.

And Bryan Abreu in the seventh, Rafael Montero in the eighth, and Ryan Pressly slamming the door shut in the ninth. Just incredible. The Astros second combined no-hitter of the season. We're seeing more of those in the regular season. The other was also started back by Javier in June, but remarkable to do it at the World Series.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DUSTY BAKER, HOUSTON ASTROS MANAGER: He was electric and, you know, he did a ball up down and that shows you that the best pitcher in baseball so well OK at fastball. And, you know, he was calm and cool. That's why we kind of wanted Javier pitching that, you know, that fourth game. And, you know, like -- I mean, the guy was cool as if it was June or July. And that's how he is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MANNO: Remarkable composure for such a young player. The series tied at 2. Game 5 tonight in Philly, of course.

[10:55:03]

And Nets star Kyrie Irving, Jim, says that he didn't mean to harm anyone and that he's taking responsibility for the way his recent tweet negatively impacted the Jewish community. Not exactly an apology from the star but something of a mea culpa, a little bit of damage control here. I mean, the post that he put up promoted a documentary that featured antisemitic themes.

In a joint statement last night, Irving said he opposes all forms of hatred and oppression. He is now aware of the negative impact that the post had on the Jewish community before adding that he meant no harm when he made that post. So on top of that, Irving and the Nets organization both pledged $500,000 to the Anti-Defamation League and Kyrie has yet to face any discipline from the team or the NBA, which some people are calling for, Jim. They really don't think that this is enough. SCIUTTO: Carolyn Manno, always good to have on. Thanks so much.

Thanks so much all of you for joining us today. I'm Jim Sciutto. At This Hour with Kate Bolduan starts right after a short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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