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Biden and Chinese Leader Hold High-Stakes Meeting This Hour; China Hopes U.S. Will Put Relations Back on Track; Ukrainian President Zelenskyy Visits Liberated Kherson City. Aired 4:30-5a ET

Aired November 14, 2022 - 04:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:30:00]

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: The two most powerful people in the world arguably, U.S. President Joe Biden and Chinese leader Xi Jinping are meeting on the sidelines of the G20 summit in Bali this hour.

BIANCA NOBILO, CNN ANCHOR: And it will be the first time the two leaders will sit down face-to-face since Mr. Biden took office and comes as U.S./China relations are at their worst in decades.

FOSTER: We're hoping to see pictures very soon. We are covering the story from all angles for you. Ivan Watson is live in Bali. Steven Jiang is joining us from Beijing. Ivan, I mean the first thing we're looking here is body language, right. We want to get a sense of how they are together with relations so low.

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And you know, President Biden has made it very clear that he values immensely face-to-face contact with his counterparts. And that's part of why this meeting is so important is because these two leaders have not met face-to-face since Biden was elected president two years ago.

They are known quantities to each other, however. They have been meeting especially since President Biden was serving as vice president and those meetings go back more than a decade. They have not met face- to-face since they were both in Davos in 2017. In fact, Xi Jinping has not met with a U.S. leader since meeting with Trump in 2019.

Both of these leaders are coming into this meeting with considerable, political wind in their sails. Xi Jinping has just secured a third precedent-breaking term in office after last month's Communist Party Congress. And of course, President Biden is coming in with unexpected relatively good results in last week's midterm elections, which he's basically alluded to. But added that he doesn't need the extra strength that this will give them.

The list of disagreements between Beijing and Washington are quite long. The biggest flash point being Taiwan. China accusing the U.S. of basically ignoring past agreements that Taiwan -- accusing the U.S. of intervening in its own internal affairs by allowing top government officials to visit the self-governing island. And just last month, the Biden administration put a ban on the transfer of semiconductor technology to China. We haven't heard a response yet from China on that. And there are other disagreements as well. That said, these two leaders do need to meet face-to-face. The White

House argues because of their immense role in global politics and in the economy as the world's two largest economies. The White House is saying that they want to reestablish lines of communication to maintain them going forward so that there can be some progress on day to day work between these two effectively superpowers.

And White House officials have also pointed out that Xi Jinping has kind of shaken up the leadership, added new loyalists into the top ranks of the government. And they say this is an important time to figure out who those individuals will be and to figure out if they will be empowered to work face-to-face with their American counterparts to deal with the everyday issues that come up -- Max.

[04:35:00]

NOBILO: And Steven, to you in Beijing, we've spoken quite a lot on the program and on the network about what the Biden administration hopes to achieve. They want to emphasize a rules-based order, freedom of navigation, a level economic playing field, but what are Xi Jinping's objectives going into this and how is it being presented in China?

STEVEN JIANG, CNN BEIJING BUREAU CHIEF: Well, Bianca, I think Xi Jinping wants time. Time for China to become to be self-reliant in key technology to upgrade its economy. But also, more crucially to upgrade its military to counterplay the U.S.

Obviously, he can afford to play the long game as Ivan pointed having just assumed that precedent breaking third term, paving the way for him to rule for life. So, in the past few days we have seen him offering a slightly more conciliatory tone by for example, telling a group of U.S. businessmen that he's willing to work with the U.S. to find ways to cooperate.

They're also have been signs or hints about China may possibly tweak its position on Ukraine. And so, it's going to be very interesting to see what Mr. Xi does or doesn't say to Mr. Biden on that issue in the coming hours.

So, overall, the state media here and officials here are echoing their American counterparts by portraying the meeting itself as a positive sign, stressing the importance of keeping lines of communication open especially at the highest level when tensions are running high.

But the problem here is this free fall in this relationship is not because of a lack of rapport between the two the two men, who have known each other for years. It's because how each side views its own strengths and the other's intention. Obviously, Washington has been very vocal about Xi Jinping's China increasingly getting authoritarian at home and increasingly aggressive abroad.

But from Xi's perspective, Biden has been doubling down on building this anti-China coalition to contain its rise on global stage, not only economically but also more importantly on the issue of Taiwan.

So that's why Xi Jinping has indicated that he is shifting the Communist Party's top priority from economic growth to national security, something he reminded his top generals just a few days ago that the focus of their training should be fighting and winning wars. So, it is this kind of rhetoric and the policy directions make this meeting so more -- so crucially important despite the low bar of expectations set by both sides -- Bianca and Max.

FOSTER: Ivan, we're probably going to hear, aren't we, from Biden after the meeting there will be a press conference. Let's have a look actually. We're told the pictures are coming in. There they are.

OK, so that is the two most powerful people in the world meeting ahead of a quite substantial meeting. Ivan, how long do you expect this meeting to last?

WATSON: The White House has blocked out hours potentially for this. And they have also indicated that Biden will be surrounded by his top advisers and they're expecting the same for the Chinese leader Xi Jinping as well.

We are not expecting a joint statement to come out of this meeting from both the Chinese and the U.S. sides. We will expect to hear Biden talk about this. He in advance of this said that he's not anticipating making any concessions on any issues. And he's repeatedly staked out U.S. positions. That whether it is Taiwan or the South China Sea or trying to get China to help reign in North Korea with its nuclear ambitions or the conduct of the grinding war in Ukraine from China's ally Russia. And trying to get China to help to try to reduce some of the loss of life and the damage to the global economy by that.

So, there are a whole host of issues that these two leaders can discuss here. The Chinese come back again and again to this one issue of Taiwan which they say is a core issue and they accuse the U.S. of meddling in their internal affairs every time a top government official travels to Taiwan or there are weapon sales to Taiwan. And it's hard to see where these two leaders can find some common ground when the disagreements are so stark between the two governments and where Taiwan has basically been a sticking point between Washington and Beijing going back generations as well.

So, we'll watch this closely. And this isn't just an outreach coming from Xi Jinping to the U.S. president here in Bali. We are also anticipating that he's going to meet with the Australian Prime Minister. Beijing has been very much at odds with Tambora in recent years and with the French President Emmanuel Macron as well -- Max and Bianca.

NOBILO: Thanks, Ivan.

[04:40:00]

Steven, it's quite clear that the expectations for this meeting in terms of any kind of progress are extremely low, even the way that it's referenced to try to find a floor in the relationship. But where are any potential areas of convergence of policy, of small issues even where they could begin to build trust and cooperation together. JIANG: Yes, Bianca. You know, one of the most mentioned issues, of

course, is climate change. Which they actually have not been talking officially since very controversial visit by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi to Taiwan in August. Even during the just concluded COP27 summit. The two envoys from both countries, even though they chatted privately, they actually did not hold any official talks because of the Chinese have suspended all official communications on this front. And of course, the Chinese blame the U.S. for this suspension.

But it is one of these issues you can see both sides may find some common ground and may also be relatively easy for them to resume communication at a working level if not at the more senior level. But at the end of day, though, this kind of handshaking, this kind of all smile photo ops they are not going to change the fundamental differences between the two countries because of their assessment of their own strengths and the other's intentions, as I mentioned.

That is at the end of the day what is increasingly worrying a lot of observers not only in this region but around the world. Because, you know, from the Chinese perspective, Biden could be talking the talk. But if he's not walking the walk because he has not only kept most of the Trump-era tariffs on Chinese imports ramping up restrictions including export controls --

FOSTER: Steven, I need to interrupt quickly because we've got the two leaders are going to the room. We're just interrupting there because the two leaders are going into the room where they're going to hold this negotiation. Ivan saying this could last hours. Certainly, about two hours, could be up to four. But this is a really sort of central meeting. This is probably, would you argue, the most important relationship in the world right now?

NOBILO: Yes, because they are each other's greatest strategic rival. Understandably and justifiably, there's been so much emphasis on the relationship between the U.S. and Russia because of Russia's invasion in Ukraine. But let's just take a listen. I feel like I think they're talking.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And you and I had a number of candid and useful conversations over the years. And since I became president as well. You're kind enough to call me to congratulate me and I congratulate you as well. And I believe there's little substitute though, for face-to-face discussions. And as you know, I'm committed to keeping the lines of communications open between you and me personally, but our governments across the board. Because our two countries have so much that we have an opportunity to deal with.

As the leaders of our two nations, we share a responsibility, in my view, to show that China and the United States can manage our differences, prevent competition from becoming anything ever near conflict, and to find ways to work together on urgent global issues that require our mutual cooperation.

And I believe this is critical for the sake of our two countries and the international community. This -- this was a key to the theme of the COP27 meeting, where I spoke on Friday. And we'll be discussing a lot of these challenges together, I hope, in the next couple hours.

And the world expects, I believe, China and the United States to play key roles in addressing global challenges, from climate changes to food insecurity, and for us to be able to work together. The United States stands ready to do just that -- work with you if that's what you desire.

So, President Xi, I look forward to our continuing and ongoing open and honest dialogue we've always had. And I thank you for the opportunity.

XI JINPING, CHINESE PRESIDENT (through translator) : Mr. President, it's good to see you. The last time we met was in 2017, during the World Economic Forum in Davos. That was already more than five years ago.

While since you assumed the presidency, we have maintained communication via video conferences, phone calls, and letters. But none of them can really substitute for face-to-face exchanges. And today, we finally have this face-to-face meeting.

[04:45:00]

From the initial contact and the establishment of diplomatic relations to today, China and the United States have gone through 50-plus eventful years. We have gained experience, and we've also learned lessons. History is the best textbook, so we should take history as a mirror and let it guide the future.

Currently, the China-U.S. relationship is in such a situation that we all care a lot about it, because this is not the fundamental interests of our two countries and peoples and it is not what the international community expects us.

As leaders of the two major countries, we need to chart the right course for the China-U.S. relationship. We need to find the right direction for the bilateral relationship going forward and elevate the relationship. A statesman should think about and know where to lead his country. He should also think about and know how to get along with other countries and the wider world.

Well, in this time and age, great changes are unfolding in ways like never before. Humanity are confronted with unprecedented challenges. The world has come to a crossroads. Where to go from here -- this is a question that is not only on our mind but also on the mind of all countries. The world expects that China and the United States will properly handle the relationship. And for our meeting, it has attracted the world's attention.

So, we need to work with all countries to bring more hope to world peace, greater confidence in global stability and stronger impetus to common development.

In our meeting today, I'm ready to have a candid -- as we always did -- have a candid and in-depth exchange of views with you on issues of strategic importance in China-U.S. relations and on major global and regional issues. I look forward to working with you, Mr. President, to bring China-U.S. relations back to the track of healthy and stable growth to the benefit of our two countries and the world as a whole.

Thank you.

FOSTER: So, cameras are being pulled away at this point for that major meeting to take place on the sidelines of the G20. Biden talking about how important it is to keep those lines of communication open. And both of them being quite positive about this -- well, Xi was talking about a cross roads in the relationship which the whole world is looking to them to negotiate.

NOBILO: Well, they have to be at this stage. I mean, those were just the opening remarks. And actually, despite it underscoring both of their intentions to try and start out on a positive note, and to underscored the lack of relationship that did exist. Because they were scraping the barrel in, you know, outlining the connections they had, the fact they called each other when they, you know, respectively were affirmed as head of state. But let's bring in Ivan Watson and Steven Jiang who have been listening to that as well. Ivan what were your first thoughts about those remarks we heard from both leaders?

WATSON: Right, while, just on a cosmetic front, you note that everybody except the two leaders are wearing masks there and that's a reflection of China and its dynamic zero-COVID approach.

Biden met with the Indonesian president, the host of the G20 summit earlier today. There the two delegations were not wearing masks. That's one difference. And we did hear Biden and importantly Xi Jinping saying that the world is paying attention to this meeting. The world wants some kind of movement forward and a dialogue to avoid basically bad things from happening.

I think it's important to note that he talked about a crossroads.

[04:50:00]

Xi Jinping in February when meeting with a man who's described as a close friend with no boundaries, the Russian President Vladimir Putin, they talked about establishing a new world order. They clearly chafe at the preeminent position the U.S. has had since World War II.

Meanwhile, President Biden is coming to this meeting trying to establish new guidelines -- as the White House put it -- to try to prevent a crisis from emerging between the U.S. and China. So, it does sound like these two leaders are talking about some kind of new framework for interacting with each other, recognizing that what's been going on in the past simply isn't working.

NOBILO: OK, Ivan, we'll come back to you as well, Steven, later on. There's so much to dissect here. That meeting, that crucial meeting under way between the world's two most powerful leaders of China and the United States. And the whole world really is genuinely watching today to try to get some positivity about that because it's so central. We'll be back in just a moment.

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[04:55:00]

NOBILO: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has visited the recently liberated city of Kherson. This as Ukraine is taking stock of the widespread damage that Russian troops left behind. CNN's Sam Kiley joins us now from the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv. Sam, what are you learning about the president's visit?

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, this was one that was anticipated, although obviously kept secret officially. There are large numbers of other international journalists now also getting into Kherson. As indeed are civilians and, of course, it's been the whole area that's been liberated is being invested with Ukrainian troops.

Now that poses great difficulties as the President Zelenskyy said last night they have already, they believe, uncovered evidence of some 400 war crimes but also perhaps more importantly in the immediate term, there is a very wide sewing of mines and booby traps across that region by the retreating Russian military. Who have also destroyed a lot of critical infrastructure, particularly electrical power generating plants which affecting the capacity of the region to move water around, for people to drink. The food supplies are not so bad. The communications have also been destroyed there.

So, he's going in to reassure the population that their government is back. Is back in earnest and able to repair the damage. But -- and this is a big but, Bianca -- on the other side of the river, the Russians dug in. They've had plenty of time to prepare for this moment. This was an organized retreat, not a rout by the Russians. And therefore, they will have large amounts of artillery and rockets that have already got predetermined targeting on areas in Kherson. And right along that western river bank there have been signs already that they have been targeting it and can be expected to go in very much heavier as more and more targets present themselves. And those targets, we know from the Russian perspective are civilians and militaries -- Bianca.

NOBILO: Sam Kiley in Kyiv, thank you so much.

FOSTER: And we are keeping an eye on the crucial meeting between Xi and Biden throughout the day. Stay with us as we bring you updates. Thanks for joining us here on CNN NEWSROOM, I'm Max Foster.

NOBILO: I'm Bianca Nobilo. "EARLY START" is next.

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