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Georgia Libertarian Senate Candidate Could Sway Runoff; Feds Decline To Charge Giuliani, End Foreign Lobbying Probe; Could Trump's Third Presidential Run Impact Ongoing Investigations?; March Of Dimes: One In 10 Babies Born Prematurely In U.S. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired November 15, 2022 - 10:30   ET




ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR:: And to then hear him say I didn't know that kids were -- kids in there alive when we heard that audio of him saying how many eight to nine kids in that classroom?

SCIUTTO: Yes. Listen, the loss already tremendous but the idea that you had all those armed folks, armed and trained out there to get in quickly, that is the training and did not even though they knew there were still lives at risk.

HILL: Didn't try.


HILL: Still to come here, we are joined live by the Libertarian candidate in Georgia who received tens of thousands of votes in that Senate race helped push it into a runoff. Why Chase Oliver says he wants to hold a forum now with each candidate ahead of next month's runoff?



HILL: This morning, Republicans on the verge of taking control of the House, the Senate, though will remain in Democratic control even as Georgia's Senate race heads to a runoff. That could be in part because of Libertarian candidate Chase Oliver, who was able to rake in more than 2 percent of the votes may have kept incumbent Democrat Raphael Warnock or Republican challenger Herschel Walker from reaching that 50 percent threshold in the state.

Libertarian Chase Oliver, former Senate candidate is here now to talk to us about this right now. It's great to have you with us. You know, I read at one point, you said in an interview, you wanted this to go to a runoff. Why?

CHASE OLIVER, FORMER LIBERTARIAN GEORGIA SENATE CANDIDATE: Well, I wanted the message to be heard that there is frustration from voters that they want options outside of the two-party system. And a great way to force that is to force the runoff. I am also a big proponent of rank choice voting. And I think that's a solution to the cost and the time of runoffs and, you know, sometimes you have to show that something's broken in order to provide a solution to fix it.

HILL: Do you think it's getting enough traction?

OLIVER: Yes, I do. I think I'm hearing a lot of folks who maybe didn't think about rank choice voting before this election were now really jumping on board and getting excited about the fact that it would make democracy more responsive and let people outside the two-party system have a voice.

HILL: So as we wait to see what happens with that, there is, of course, this runoff happening, December 6, in Georgia. I know you've been asked multiple times, you have said you are not endorsing either candidate. As I understand, you do plan to vote though, you'd like to hold a forum with each of them to really get more information for voters on where they stand on the issues. Has either candidate taking you up on that offer?

OLIVER: Neither candidate has responded yet. We're going to send out a renewed invitation to these candidates. Because I think it's important that we hold a forum and not necessarily a debate. A debate, you're going to get one-minute canned, rehearsed answers. A forum, we actually can get a little bit more in depth and hear from these candidates, and how they want to earn those libertarian independent votes in this runoff.

And I want them to be responsive to those voters. And I think they now see what happens when they're not.

HILL: Who are those voters? I mean, do they fit in one nice, neat little box? I would imagine no.

OLIVER: No, looking at exit polling, the largest pool of voters that I pulled from was independence. Then that's actually the largest pool of voters that exist, because as the parties get more hyper partisan, people continue to walk away from identifying as either Democrat or Republican.

And so it's really votes across a spectrum of people who are just sick and tired of seeing the hyper partisanship and also seeing their taxes go up, spending increase, and they're not really getting anything for that other than renewed debt.

HILL: Have you --

OLIVER: And inflation.

HILL: -- had any pressure from either candidate or either campaign at this point, as you wait to see whether they take you up on that option to be a part of this forum? Has either tried to get you to endorse?

OLIVER: Well, you know, you get informal pressure from supporters on both sides, saying, you know, you need to endorse my candidate to save democracy, or you need to endorse my candidate to stop Biden in his tracks or stop Trump from growing or whatever. But the truth is, is I am a libertarian. I don't like holding power and wielding it over people.

Libertarians seek to take power from government and give it back to each and every individual. And that's what I'm doing with this vote. I'm not going to endorse because I'm not going to try to sway each individual voter where they should go. They know what's best for them, their family and their life. And that's a libertarian philosophy through and through, and that's what I'm going to go by. But I am going to provide those candidates an opportunity to speak to those voters,

HILL: You being -- you're in Georgia, obviously, being there in terms of people that you met on the campaign trail, also looking at those numbers, as you just pointed out, your largest group of supporters, independents, in those exit polls. Which voters do you think will be more motivated, given that Democrats do now have this one seat majority moving into the runoff?

OLIVER: Well, you know, I think both sides are still going to be motivated, it's still important because, you know, it's not just about 2022, it's about 2024, and continuing on. So I think you're going to see a ton of money coming in from both sides. I think, you know, I think Democrats, you know, I don't think they're going to just sit by and be like, oh, well we have a majority so we don't have to do anything here.

HILL: Yes.

OLIVER: And I don't think Republicans are going to go, well, we don't have the chance to get a majority, so we're not going to fight for this. I imagine there's going to be lots of interest down here in Georgia.

HILL: You know, plenty of money. You mentioned more money coming in. There was plenty spent before election day. You did not spend very much money. You spent I think something around 10 grand. Do you think there's any way to change the system, to change politics, which is such a business if you still have all that money?

OLIVER: Well, I think opening up the process to having more than two choices on the ballot and that involves ballot access reforms so that we can have more people get involved. And you're going to see that money kind of spread itself out and not say so concentrated within the two parties.


Because once you demonstrate the ability that other parties can rise up and challenge the duopoly, that money is going to go elsewhere. And I think what you're seeing right now in business, it would be like if you had two, you know, a two-company monopoly, essentially a duopoly, and that's what we have. We need to break that up so that we can have a healthy marketplace of ideas and actually grow in this country. And I think in a free marketplace of ideas, Libertarians like myself will do quite well. HILL: Chase Oliver, great to have you with us this morning. You're certainly sparking conversations. I have heard from people saying similar things, so be interesting to see where it goes. Thank you.

OLIVER: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: All right. Another race we're following. Former President Donald Trump expected to announce a new third bid for the White House tonight. Will it impact any of the investigations against him? He seems to hope so. We'll discuss the reality just ahead.



SCIUTTO: Rudy Giuliani will hold a news conference in 15 minutes about news that federal prosecutors have now closed a foreign lobbying investigation into him.

HILL: That investigation was related to Giuliani's activities in Ukraine and possible violations of foreign lobbying laws since early 2019. Officials though informed a judge yesterday they would not be seeking charges citing a lack of information available to the government. A spokesperson for Giuliani says, quote, the mayor has been completely and totally vindicated.

SCIUTTO: Other political news today, former President Trump widely expected to announce a third bid for the White House later today. That announcement does have the potential to complicate several ongoing investigations against Trump or at least the reactions to them.

HILL: For more, former U.S. Attorney Michael Moore joining us now. So, I think the bottom line for many people -- and Jim and I were having this discussion earlier this morning --


HILL: -- is, would an announcement of Donald Trump's candidacy shield him from any of these investigations?

MICHAEL MOORE, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: Well, good morning. I'm glad to be with both of you. It doesn't have the effect of giving any type of legal shield. You know, and I've been on your show before and I've been pretty critical of the legal performance that Trump has had so far. I mean, I think he's been lackluster, that might be generous to say that.

But you got every prosecutor around this, get their knives out for him now, and he needs to move to take the offensive position as opposed to being defensive. And so essentially what he's doing, and I think it's, you know, good legal advice, or whoever he's talking to him is giving good advice. Get out in front. That way, you're going to have access to a 24-hour news cycle, the tail everybody in the country that all these investigations are a witch hunt. And I don't think the case ever gets to a jury because I think there'll be appellate decisions that (INAUDIBLE). But as you go forward, it takes just one year to also believe it's a witch hunt.


MOORE: And so, this is a way that he's going to be able to talk to the country, talk to his supporters for the next two years about what he sees as an injustice.

SCIUTTO: There are multiple investigations underway. The Justice Department has a decision to make here. But in your state, in the state of Georgia, you have an ongoing investigation there. Let's set aside how a jury might react to this. How do -- does a prosecutor react to this?

MOORE: Well, you see that the D.A. is coming out trying to serve sort of what I would say would be an accelerated timeline in the Georgia investigation. And there's some bits on discussion that the investigation might be finished by January.

My guess is if she moves forward, if she moves forward in a very targeted way, if she moves forward with any type of charges, that that's what the jury recommend -- grand jury recommends and often she proceeds to deny it, she moves forward in a very clean case. And I don't know that this really has a lot of impact. But if you go forward in some kind of broad conspiracy climate, he's a big puppet master.

And if you're just believe this, then you can understand how Trump's a leader. You have to do anything for your calls and people to reach or your calls for people to have to make too many steps and not keeping a case simple, I think it can have an effect. And so from her perspective, those a prosecutor should just keep her head down, look for clean case and make the decision. And if you find that, if that's supported by the diamond, then move forward in a targeted way.

HILL: We're watching to see what happens. I would point out that in terms of having a platform, he never lost his platform. He's been calling everything a witch hunt for years.

MOORE: Indeed.

HILL: So any sort of announcing tonight certainly is not going to change that. Michael Moore --

MOORE: It does, but unless people come forward and let him come out now and be able to say, look, I'm running so they're targeting. And they're going to be people who believe in that. I mean, you still get people --

HILL: Right.

MOORE: -- to believe the election was stolen. So, I mean, that's what doing and I think ultimately changes the tone of the discussion.

HILL: I appreciate you being here this morning. Thank you.

MOORE: Good to be with you all

HILL: Still to come, the rate of babies being born prematurely here in the United States and around the world is on the rise. Why the World Health Organization says this is an urgent public health issue? That's next.



SCIUTTO: A new report this morning paints a worrying picture of the rising number of premature births in this country.

HILL: The March of Dimes now grading the USA as a deep plus when it comes to the high preterm birth rates. CNN's Health Reporter Jacqueline Howard joining us now. So what else did this report find?

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: Erica, this report really shows that preterm births are on the rise in this country. It says the U.S. preterm birth rate increased last year to 10.5 percent. The reasons why some women are giving birth later in age, some have underlying health conditions and some women gave birth while having COVID-19 which also increases your risk for preterm birth.

Now I did speak with the March of Dimes Chief Medical Officer Dr. Henderson about this. She told me the 10.5 percent birth rate for poor preterm births here in the U.S. is completely on acceptable. Have a listen.



DR. ZSAKEBA HENDERSON, INTERIM CHIEF MEDICAL & HEALTH OFFICER, MARCH OF DIMES: The main thing to take away I think is the fact that there are too many babies being born too soon, you know, one in 10. If you were to have 10 babies in front of you and one of them having to face the complications that comes with prematurity, that's unacceptable and we need to do better.


HOWARD: One in 10, and there are differences state by state. When you look at this map of the preterm birth rate by state, Vermont has the lowest in the country at 8 percent. But the states with the worst preterm birth rates you see here are concentrated in the south. Mississippi has the highest at 15 percent. And Erica and Jim, this is not just a national problem, but a global issue.

Just this morning, the World Health Organization said preterm birth complications are the leading causes of death for children under five. Erica and Jim?

HILL: Jacqueline Howard, appreciate it. Sobering. That's for sure.

Thanks so much for joining us today. I'm Erica Hill. SCIUTTO: And I'm Jim Sciutto. At This Hour with Kate Bolduan starts right after a quick break.