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Attorney Releases More Footage of Black Man Beaten by Deputies in Georgia; Ex-White House Aide Hutchinson Testifying Before Grand Jury Today; Elon Musk to Twitter Staffers: Commit "Hardcore" Or Be Fired. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired November 16, 2022 - 15:30   ET



VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Newly released video is giving us a few new details about the beating of a black man by sheriff's deputies while he was in custody in Camden County, Georgia. I want to warn you that these videos we're about to show you are disturbing.

That video released earlier shows what happened moments before that man was dragged out of the cell when Jared Hobbs was beaten and then dragged into the hallway. Additional footage released today shows deputies patting each other on the back, calmly walking away.

Joining us now is Jared Hobbs' attorney, Harry Daniels. Harry, good to see you again. First, let me start with how is your client doing, Mr. Hobbs? How's he doing?

HARRY DANIELS, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: He's doing his best as can be expected. You know, he physically has healed from his injuries, but mentally he's not doing OK. You can imagine the type of beating that he endured on September 3rd. He's day by day. I spoke with him today. He just wanted everybody to know that he appreciates your support, has been shown his way. And he also has this message that he did not would help should be considered. I'm been with mental health or people who have mental health distress when it comes to the jail, they should not be subject to beatings and look at the way he was treated. So, he just wants this -- hopes his case is awareness for so many others to see.

BLACKWELL: Let me ask you about this new video you released. This is the first time we're getting audio with any of the videos. The others angles that we're seeing were inside the cell, and that's where we saw the beating. But beyond the audio, we saw them calmly walking away. What do you want people to take away from these new releases?

DANIELS: Well, they're complicit. This is a badge of courage, you know, of beating this guy.


This is not the first time these -- those officers here in this jail have committed these acts. They calmly went inside that jail cell and beat Mr. Hobbs and threw him against the wall.

BLACKWELL: Let me stop you here. When you say this is not the first time -- when you say this is not the first time that these deputies have done this, are you saying that because of what you read from body language or do you have evidence that they have beaten others the way that you saw treat your client?

DANIELS: We have evidence that has jailers, deputies, officers and other inmates. There's federal cases and litigations going on. We have evidence of coverups, affidavits from former jailers who have testified that the jail administration have made overt efforts to cover up beatings and use of force inside the jail. This is a systematic -- it's not just a bad apple. This is a bad orchard. So, this is not just body language that I'm speculating, this is evidence we have -- Victor.

BLACKWELL: All right, so let me ask you, your client was arrested in Georgia for a traffic violation, possession of a controlled substance, violated his probation in North Carolina. I mention that because in the North Carolina court documents related to that violation, Hobbs's parole officer who was not there in Georgia at the time wrote this.

Defendant resisted the jailers, subsequently punched one deputy in the face while punching another deputy in the side of the head. One deputy sustained a bruised eye and a broken hand as a result of the incident.

I'm not reading this to justify what we saw, well this must be the reason they did that.

DANIELS: I got you.

BLACKWELL: I'm just trying to understand what was the precipitate of action that they're even claiming because we don't see that on camera. Do you have video of that?

DANIELS: So where is Mr. Hobbs's banging on the door, using profanity and the reason why they came inside the jail cell. Let's be clear, Victor, that that was from Camden County and charging my client with obstruction and (INAUDIBLE) of law enforcement. And there was a point of violation that he was going to be violated by the United States probation officer and United States attorney's office, and the attorney of North Carolina received the video. Once they received the video, if you look further at North Carolina court records, they dismissed (INAUDIBLE) they didn't disclose (INAUDIBLE) those counts of violence. Because once they receive the video, they knew these officers were not telling the truth.

BLACKWELL: But are you saying there is no video -- there is no video of your client hitting these men as is written in this report from North Carolina. Is that what you are saying?

DANIELS: That's correct. There is no video of him striking anybody. The only time any physical altercations between him and his officers (INAUDIBLE) we've already seen. The video is entire shows Mr. Hobbs is inside the cell that let up to We have watched video of him being struck, and the only time any physical altercation took place is what the public have already seen. The video in its entirety shows Mr. Hobbs inside the cell that led up to him coming into the cell. So, there's no video. That's a lie. The statements from the Camden County was a lie. It's a lie.

BLACKWELL: All right. Harry Daniels, thank you so much. Listen to people watching at home, we had a little audio, a little video issue. Typically, we would just put the video we had over it to hide it, but we of course, don't want to continue to show that beating and to hear those screams. We showed you so you understand the story but I think you for staying with us through some of those technical glitches.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Yes, that was a really upsetting video to listen to.


CAMEROTA: OK, meanwhile, former White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson is testifying in front of the Georgia grand jury today. This is part of probe into former President Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election. What prosecutors hope she can offer this time. That's next.


CAMEROTA: Former White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson is testifying today in front of the Georgia grand jury. This is part of the state's investigation into efforts by former President Trump and his allies to overturn 2020 election results. Hutchinson you'll remember previously cooperated with the January 6 committee and the Justice Department investigations and she provided key insight on what she saw in the West Wing leading up to and during the deadly riot.

BLACKWELL: Now George's Republican Governor Brian Kemp he testified before the grand jury yesterday. Senator Lindsey Graham is scheduled to appear tomorrow. Well, let's start with today. Let's discuss with former U.S. attorney Harry Lipman. Harry good to see you. Let's start with Cassidy Hutchinson. The Fulton County case is about overturning the Georgia results. How helpful can Cassidy Hutchinson be in that case?

HARRY LIPMAN, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: It strikes me, Victor, that she can bury him or he's largely buried himself and she can further administer coup de grace. Remember, we've got conversation on audio tape that Raffensperger recorded anticipating Trump might lie, saying, I've got to get 11,780 votes. What can he say about that? The only thing one can even imagine -- it shouldn't matter legally, but the only thing I can imagine is, I really thought I won. I didn't think I had bad intent about it.


Hutchinson already has testified that she heard Trump say personally that he knew they had lost, and many other statements that she heard from Meadows to that effect which should be admissible. You put together what he did and that evidence about state of mind, that alone it seems to me is pretty close to guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

CAMEROTA: But as you say, Harry, she's already testified. We all remember her super compelling testimony that we all watched in front of the January 6th committee. I don't suppose the Georgia grand jury can use that. I mean, she was under oath. Like, why do they have to reinterview her about it all?

LIPMAN: Well, she's the one who has to testify to the people who make the decision. But you're right, Alisyn. If she said something different, then a prosecutor could say, now do you remember, Ms. Hutchinson you testified before, and could use it to impeach. But the jury and this select grand jury are entitled, and Trump is entitled that they hear from her directly, assess her credibility personally, and the like. So that's why she's testifying again. But we know what she is going to say, and she's a very credible witness.

BLACKWELL: Trump is now a candidate for the nomination heading into 2024. How does that impact --

LIPMAN: I heard that.

BLACKWELL: Yes, you heard that? How does that impact the half dozen plus civil and criminal cases that are going on?

LIPMAN: Basically, not at all. I have an op-ed I've written that talks about a wrinkle with the special counsel regulations within the Department of Justice, but essentially there is no entitlement for a candidate, even a -- well, for a candidate, let's leave aside a sitting president to not be prosecuted. It has happened, in fact, before not with a former president, but everything with Trump these days is unprecedented. The short answer is it avails him nothing.

CAMEROTA: Well, not sure that's what he thinks since he announced so early.

LIPMAN: I agree, yes.

CAMEROTA: And there's always the political calculations. But also, Harry, we have new CNN reporting that the Fulton County D.A. is hitting a major roadblock in terms of her investigation into those 12 fake electors that tried to overturn the Georgia results, Biden's victory there. They're stonewalling apparently and refusing to comply with the subpoena. So, this is new reporting. I don't know if you know about it yet, but now what? Now what can she do?

LIPMAN: Look. Unlike the Congress, a prosecutor, state or federal has real means to make people testify. We saw it just last week when the Department of Justice forced Kash Patel to testify by giving him immunity. Now she's got a lot of fish to fry, different crimes she's considering. She can decide whether it makes sense to push hard, but if she wants to push hard, she has tools. It used to be that Congress did as well, but after the last several years of having people ignore them, we've seen that that's less likely. But there are things she can do if she wants to.

CAMEROTA: Harry Lipman thank you.

LIPMAN: Thank you.

BLACKWELL: Commit to hardcore Twitter -- I don't even know what that is.

CAMEROTA: I don't either. I don't know if I want to know.

BLACKWELL: Hardcore Twitter or quit. That's the new ultimatum from Elon Musk to Twitter employees. The latest turmoil amid his takeover of the company. We'll have that for you ahead.



BLACKWELL: So, the new Twitter CEO Elon Musk issued an ultimatum to employees. He's telling them to commit to being extremely hardcore or leave. And there's a deadline.

CNN's Donie O'Sullivan joins us now with the latest. Donnie, what is extremely hardcore -- I shudder to ask.

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: All avoid making the video this afternoon. Look, I mean, this is bizarre and it would be funny obviously if people's livelihoods were not on the line with thousands of people who still work at Twitter.

I want to show you this email Musk sent out late last night, I should add.

He said, going forward to build a breakthrough Twitter 2.0 and succeed in an increasingly competitive world, we will need to be extremely hardcore. This will mean working long hours at high intensity. Only exceptional performance will constitute a passing grade.

Later in the email he went on to say: If you are sure that you want to be part of the new Twitter, please check yes on the link below. Anyone who doesn't do so by 5 p.m. Eastern tomorrow Thursday will receive three months of severance.

So, what he is saying there is if you don't want to be hardcore don't click that link and you can leave.

CAMEROTA: How many people clicked the link?

O'SULLIVAN: We don't know yet. I mean, from the folks who have been laid off from Twitter and people who are still in the organization that we've been speaking to -- and I me, when you get an email like this from the top boss very late in the night it's --

BLACKWELL: It doesn't seem like the way you motivate a workforce -- yes, no, maybe, on working extremely hardcore, but you been doing this --

CAMEROTA: Also, really long hours, working with -- he met the new Net generation?


CAMEROTA: They'll quit.

BLACKWELL: Quiet quit CAMEROTA: You're quietly navigating around the Net gen right now.

BLACKWELL: Let's go to Facebook now. The company tells its fact checkers to stop checking Donald Trump now that he is a declared candidate. What's that about?

O'SULLIVAN: Yes, so we got our hands yesterday on a memo that Facebook sent out to -- Facebook works with fact checkers, right, we've all seen those labels on Instagram and Facebook that says something false and puts you out to a late to fact-check. Politicians are exempt from that. Politicians who are not known to lie at all, whatsoever -- and politicians and candidates.

And so, since Trump left office, and since he lost the election, left the White House, he has been eligible to be fact-checked on Facebook.


This memo went out yesterday saying, by the way, as soon as he announces tonight in Mar-a-Lago, you cannot fact check him anymore, and that just -- I mean, as we know he is kicked off Facebook at the moment. He may be back as soon as January -- that's a whole other story. But as the fact checking ban extends to everything he says. So, if there is a clip of him saying something that's totally false, if there is a headline -- somebody post even a screenshot say of his post from Truth Social -- sometimes people post screenshots onto Facebook and they'll get fact checked now, not anymore.

CAMEROTA: This is such a puzzle. You should fact check politicians more. They're obligated to the public

O'SULLIVAN: Facebook's argument is it's not our place to do so.

CAMEROTA: Donie O'Sullivan thank you.


O'SULLIVAN: Hardcore.

CAMEROTA: Yes, exactly.

BLACKWELL: Hardcore.

CAMEROTA: And "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts after this very short break.