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Trump Hosted Holocaust Denier And Rapper Kanye West At Mar-a- Lago; DOJ Seeks Testimony From Mike Pence In January 6th Criminal Probe; Elon Musk Announces Amnesty To Suspended Twitter Accounts; Authorities Reveal New Details About The Walmart Mass Shooting; Authorities Reveal "Death Note" Found On Gunman's Phone; Dozens Flock To Bar Owned By Club Q Hero Rich Fierro; Putin Meets Mothers Of Russian Soldiers Amid Claims Of Poor Conditions; Argentina Stays Alive With 2-0 Win Over Mexico; Irene Cara, "Fame" And "Flashdance" Singer, Dies At 63. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired November 26, 2022 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:13]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Jim Acosta in Washington, and we begin this hour with new details about a dinner at Mar-a-Lago with the former president of the United States, rapper Kanye West and a holocaust denier and white supremacist named Nick Fuentes.

A source telling CNN Trump was engaged with Fuentes and found him, quote, "very interesting." At one point Trump even declared that he liked him, according to our reporting just into CNN. We did just get a reaction from President Biden, we will bring that to you in just a moment, but first I want to bring in CNN national political reporter Maeve Reston.

Maeve, what else are you -- I mean, this just comes I mean days after Trump announced that he's running.

MAEVE RESTON, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: Right.

ACOSTA: For president again, and he's been reinstated on Twitter and then he does this.

RESTON: And a very swift backlash that we're seeing from leaders with the Republican Jewish Coalition, obviously a very influential group, also some of his potential rivals like Chris Christie saying that it's just completely unacceptable for him to host someone like this at his private club. Sources have told our Kristen Holmes that Trump did not invite Fuentes. He knew that Kanye West was coming.

But it's his private club. And sources told her that they shared, you know, a two-hour Thanksgiving dinner, that Trump was very engaged with Fuentes who was telling Trump that he, you know, understood his base and that they like it when he adlibs, all those kinds of things that Trump loves to hear from his admirers. So it seems like he got a pretty warm reception and then since then Trump trying to create some distance and say that he didn't know this person. ACOSTA: Right. And how much you can believe that, I mean, we got a

bridge to sell you if you believe that. But, Maeve, this is not the first time Trump has claimed I didn't know who that was. He famously said the same thing back in 2016 when he was asked about former Ku Klux Khan grand wizard David Duke supporting his campaign. Let's take a listen to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, THEN-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, just so you understand, I don't know anything about David Duke, OK? I don't know anything about what you're even talking about with white supremacy or white supremacist. So I don't know. I mean, I don't know, did he endorse me, or what's going on because, you know, I know nothing about David Duke. I know nothing about white supremacists.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Of course, there was, after Charlottesville, when he said there were very fine people on both sides.

RESTON: The equivalent.

ACOSTA: There was the Proud Boys, when he talked about the Proud Boys, and he said stand back and stand by during a presidential debate. He's done this time and again. What has he offered in terms of an explanation after all this?

RESTON: So he has tried to clean this up a couple of times now on Truth Social just in the last 24 hours, and I want to read you what he said. "This past week Kanye West called me to have dinner at Mar-a- Lago. Shortly thereafter, he unexpectedly showed up with three of his friends whom I knew nothing about. We had dinner on Tuesday evening with many members present on the back patio. The dinner was quick and uneventful. They then left for the airport."

But then in a subsequent post, you know, of course because Kanye West has also been engulfed in controversy over his antisemitic remarks, Trump said more about the dinner on Truth Social saying that, you know, there was no antisemitism expressed during this conversation, but that same-old pattern that we're seeing where he's trying to not alienate part of his base, but at the same time keep this from becoming a huge problem for him.

ACOSTA: Yes. And if you're having dinner with somebody who has made antisemitic comments or is a holocaust denier, I mean, get up and leave. I mean, I just don't understand what --

RESTON: Right.

ACOSTA: What the -- you know, why he's even trying to explain this away, and the way he's doing it. It's just reprehensible.

And Maeve, we mentioned that Kanye West was part of this dinner. He's been in the headlines as you said for making these antisemitic comments. Apparently at one point during the dinner he asked Trump about 2024. What can you tell us about that?

RESTON: So as far as we know, Kanye West has not filed papers to officially run for president yet, but he, you know, jokingly, I guess, or maybe not jokingly asked Trump to be his running mate. Kristen reported that it got a little tense at that point and Kanye also mentioned this in his Mar-a-Lago debrief on Twitter saying that things got tense but apparently a light moment that, you know, with two men with big aspirations and we'll see where it goes from here.

ACOSTA: All right. Maeve Reston, very, very disturbing. Thank you very much.

We're just getting some reaction to all of this from President Biden. CNN White House correspondent Arlette Saenz is in Nantucket where the president is spending the holiday.

Arlette, the president, you know, presidents get asked questions all the time. He could have chosen not to say anything, but he did say something. What did he say?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim, President Biden was out shopping in downtown Nantucket.

[16:05:02]

And he did engage with a reporter's question when they asked for his reaction to former President Donald Trump dining with a white nationalist. The president held back a bit, but he did respond. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Mr. President, what do you think of Donald Trump having dinner with a white nationalist? What do you think of that, sir?

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You don't want to hear what I think.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: So while the president didn't further elaborate there the White House has offered a more detailed response. White House spokesperson Andrew Bates telling CNN after that dinner yesterday, he said, quote, "Bigotry, hate and antisemitism have absolutely no place in America, including at Mar-a-Lago. Holocaust denial is repugnant and dangerous and it must be forcefully condemned."

Of course, it's no surprise that the Biden White House would be responding to the fact that former President Trump is dining with a white nationalist. The president stakes so much of his 2020 campaign on trying to push back on hate-filled rhetoric and also prejudice, and said that one of the reasons he got into the race was because of the former president's response to those clashes down in Charlottesville.

ACOSTA: Right. I mean, and it's something that any president, Republican or Democrat, should condemn. I mean, a former president of the United States having dinner with somebody who has made antisemitic comments and Kanye West and somebody who is identified as a holocaust denier it's just why anybody would say otherwise is beyond me.

But let me ask you this, Arlette, because the president made news on another front. Two mass shootings in the U.S. in the past week, last week in Colorado, this week in Virginia. The president says he wants to get rid of access to assault weapons. How is that going to happen?

SAENZ: Well, the president is renewing his calls for further gun legislation specifically pointing to his desire to get an assault weapons ban past in Congress but he's running up against the political reality that the votes just simply don't exist to do that at this moment. Take a listen to what he told reporters on Thanksgiving Day.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: The idea, the idea we still allow semiautomatic weapons to be purchased is sick. It's just sick. It has no, no social redeeming value. Zero. None. Not a single solitary rationale for it except profit for the gun manufacturer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: So the president saying that he wants to count the votes to see what kind of legislation he could get passed but of course it will become much more difficult to get an assault weapons ban or other gun legislation passed once Republicans take control of the House in January -- Jim.

ACOSTA: All right. Arlette Saenz, thank you very much.

CNN is learning that former Vice President Mike Pence is open to discussing a possible agreement with the Justice Department which is seeking his testimony in the criminal investigation into efforts by former President Trump and his allies to stop the transfer of power after the 2020 election.

CNN senior legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Elie Honig joins us now.

Elie, that is fascinating that former Vice President Mike getting into some kind of a conversation with the Department of Justice about all of this. Can they force him if he refuses?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Jim. The short answer is yes, they can force him if he refuses and I think for that reason Mike Pence will work out some agreement where he either testifies in front of a grand jury or perhaps just gives an interview to DOJ.

It's really important to understand here. We are no longer in the realm of the January 6th Committee in Congress and congressional subpoenas and congressional request for information. We're now talking about a criminal investigation being carried out by the U.S. Department of Justice. And if you think back to the January 6th investigation, we saw plenty of people including Mike Pence himself sort of casually brush off the committee and nothing happened.

Well, it doesn't work that way when you're in front of DOJ and a grand jury. They can compel you to come forward and testify if you don't want to, if you don't agree to. And the arguments that Mike Pence made regarding January 6th, well, he said first of all there's a separation of powers problem with the former vice president testifying in front of Congress. That doesn't apply here. We're talking about the executive branch, DOJ.

And he said there could be an executive privilege issue. That may be but there are still plenty of topics on which Mike Pence can testify about. I also don't think executive privilege will hold here. So DOJ does have the upper hand and I do think Mike Pence will talk to them.

ACOSTA: And what does it say about the Justice Department strategy here?

HONIG: Well, it tell us that they're now looking at the top of the food chain, at the top of the power hierarchy. And it's taken some time for them to get there. I think that's the criticism. But we do know that DOJ now is focused squarely on Donald Trump. In fact, when Merrick Garland, the attorney general announced the special counsel a week or so ago, that was the first time DOJ specifically acknowledged that they are focused on Donald Trump himself.

But again here we are to the end of 2022 and DOJ is finally getting around to talking to Mike Pence. I don't see any reason they couldn't have done this in earlier mid-2021, but they are finally focused at the top.

[16:10:05]

ACOSTA: And Elie, this is also fascinating. This week, a federal appeals court heard arguments in the Justice Department's challenge to the special master appointed to vet the documents seized from Trump's Mar-a-Lago estate. A ruling could come any time. That ruling I imagine will be very important in all of this.

HONIG: It will, and it sure looks like the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals is going to side with the Justice Department and against Donald Trump, and put an end to the special master's review. Looking at that argument, Jim, the three-judge court of appeals panel was quite skeptical towards the rationale that Donald Trump's lawyers were arguing. I think Donald Trump's lawyers actually mishandled that argument.

They could have made a very straightforward argument of we have a special master, a person who both sides have agreed to, all we're asking is that he protect our privileges. Instead Trump's lawyers went a couple of steps beyond that and said, those documents belong to Donald Trump. They're his property, he gets to keep them. Sometimes lawyers make that mistake, they argue way more than they need in order to prevail on the issue. So you're right. We could hear any day, and if this goes in DOJ's favor then it will put an end to the special master ruling.

ACOSTA: All right. Fascinating. A lot of ground to cover, Elie Honig.

HONIG: As always.

ACOSTA: Thank you very much, as always. We appreciate it.

HONIG: Thanks.

ACOSTA: Still to come, general amnesty for banned Twitter accounts. Elon Musk says he will begin restoring previously suspended accounts in the coming days. We'll discuss that after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:15:33]

ACOSTA: In a matter of days, Twitter users banned for repeated violations including threats, harassment and misinformation will be able to return to the platform. Elon Musk is planning to issue what he calls a general amnesty.

And joining us now to talk about Twitter's changing landscape, contributing writer to "The Atlantic," Molly Jong-Fast, and with "Vanity Fair" as well.

Molly, what do we think about all of this? I mean, what is Elon Musk going to be doing with this site next week when he starts restoring these suspended Twitter accounts?

MOLLY JONG-FAST, CONTRIBUTING WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: I'm just curious what the play here is, right? Because you're making a lot of people on the far right very happy and you know, probably some other, you know, non-politically affiliated and maybe some even on the left, but I'm not sure how this helps him. I mean, isn't his goal to make money with the platform? And I know that originally Twitter made about 90 percent of its revenue from advertising, so I don't know how this would theoretically help grow your advertising revenue.

ACOSTA: And let's bring in CNN's Oliver Darcy into the conversation.

Oliver, what do you know about what's happening this coming week?

OLIVER DARCY, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Well, it seems like it's going to be a bit chaotic given the people who are going to be allowed back on the platform. But, Jim, there's not much transparency into what is going to exactly be happening. Musk has said basically if you haven't broken the law and you've been banned from the platform in the past that he's going to allow you back on, but he really hasn't detailed exactly what the criteria is.

I mean, look, earlier, he said that Alex Jones, the far-right conspiracy theorist, he was not going to be allowed on and he didn't do anything on the platform I don't think that necessarily broke the law. And so it's really just kind of unclear I think who's going to be allowed to come back on the platform and who's not, and there's not much transparency into this other than really what Musk says on the platform. ACOSTA: And Molly, I want to get your take on this tweet from Elon

Musk yesterday, someone asked if he would support Ron DeSantis in 2024, and he says yes. I mean, we saw this with Musk before the midterms, too, taking these political stances while doing controversial things, let's say, with Twitter.

JONG-FAST: I mean, it seems to me that he is a conservative trying to get the love of other conservatives which in itself is, you know, there's a storied history, you know, of that, and there's nothing wrong with that but it's just unclear to me how this helps him run the business or even save the business. You know, he has a lot of debt, you know, with this purchase. Billions of dollars. He has a lot of investors who, you know, he has all this Tesla stock, and I just -- I don't understand what the endgame here is unless it's to, like, win the Republican primary, you know? I just don't see how this works in any way that serves anyone.

ACOSTA: And Oliver, this one caught my eye. Twitter is launching this new color-coded verification system. I mean, is that going to affect folks like us? What happens? What's going on?

DARCY: Well, he says it's going to different verification badges depending on what the account is. So government accounts will get one color badge. News organizations maybe another, celebrities another color badge. It's going to be this multi-colored badge thing. I think the real issue here, though, Jim, is that he's had so many problems rolling out this Twitter blue subscription business that he wanted to roll out to supplement the ad business.

So if you look at what he did earlier, he chased all the advertisers away and then he was going to supplement some of the business with Twitter blue, this $8 you pay and you get a blue badge, he has had to delay that so many times because of various obvious issues and one of them being impersonation which became a big problem for the platform. And so they delayed it the last time and now he's saying it's going to be rolled out again theoretically starting later this week or next week.

And it's going to be now a multicolored badge system where someone manually verifies the person's identity and the whole thing just seems like a big mess for him -- Jim.

ACOSTA: And Molly, you wrote just a few weeks ago that you're not ditching Twitter. I see you're still up on the platform, although I have noticed that you've made mention of other Twitter-like platforms.

[16:20:00]

What are your thoughts? How much more of this can you take and what other sites out there, folks who're wondering, well, if I don't want to use Twitter anymore, what else could I use?

JONG-FAST: So, I mean, I don't think it's so far there's certainly more bots and it seems a little bit buggy occasionally, but ultimately the users are not the ones who are suffering right now. It's more of the, like, you know, all the Twitter employees who were laid off, but yes. I think people will stay on the platform until it gets like unwieldy.

There's a new platform called Post. It's in beta, but it looks a lot like Twitter, and it's right now on the waitlist, but as they are able to scale they will open the platform and that is like Twitter, but there's sort of -- there's a little space for a little bit more writing and the pictures look a little bit better. Then there's another thing called Mastodon which is an open server kind of product where nobody sort of owns it but that's a little bit harder to use.

I do think ultimately people are going to want to have a social network that's text based. So if it isn't Twitter it will be something else.

ACOSTA: And Oliver, what do you think? I mean, do you think we could end up with another Twitter-like platform that serves as, you know, this global town hall but Twitter really has been for several years now, but if Twitter just gets to a point where, you know, it's just a dumpster fire, could something step in its place?

DARCY: I mean, theoretically, Jim, I just think --

ACOSTA: I guess I could say Twitter is already a dumpster fire but even more of a dumpster fire. Already is.

DARCY: Twitter has been a dumpster fire for quite a long time, probably its entire life span, but I hear what you're saying. I think it's certainly possible something could take its place, but we don't really have any indication that there's going to be a big app that comes in right now and just sort of immediately replaces it. And I'd also note that conservatives, you know, they've accused Twitter largely baselessly, but they've accused Twitter in the past of being biased against their world view.

And they've tried launching a number of platforms and it's really difficult, none of them have really stopped despite a lot of attempts, you know, on the right to launch these competitors to Twitter. So I would be -- I think it'd be very difficult for someone to come in and immediately snatch up Twitter's user base.

ACOSTA: All right. Very interesting. Oliver Darcy, Molly Jong-Fast, great to see both of you. Thank you so much.

And a quick programming note, everybody. Settle in with CNN for the stories behind everything we love to watch at Christmas. "'TIS THE SEASON: THE HOLIDAYS ON SCREEN," premieres tomorrow night at 8:00.

Coming up, Vladimir Putin meets with mothers of Russian soldiers fighting in Ukraine as social media videos appear to show Russians on the frontlines complaining about lack of food and poor training and sanitary conditions. We'll discuss that next with a former undercover KGB agent. That's just ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:27:24] ACOSTA: We're learning new details about the youngest victim from the deadly mass shooting inside a Virginia Walmart. The city of Chesapeake, Virginia, says 16-year-old Fernando Chavez-Barron along with five co-workers were shot and killed Tuesday night when a manager opened fire in an employee break room before killing himself. Officials say the gunman had no criminal history and apparently wrote a death note on his cell phone before the attack.

CNN's Brian Todd has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JESSIE WILCZEWSKI, WALMART EMPLOYEE, SURVIVED SHOOTING: He had the gun up to my forehead and -- this is really hard.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Chilling new details released by police reveal that the man who killed six Walmart employee bought his weapon that very day. City officials say the shooter had no criminal history and that he legally bought the gun he used, a nine millimeter handgun. Officials releasing screenshots of writings found on the gunmen's phone, the title, "Death Note."

He describes that grievances he had, writing his associates were laughing and mocking him, saying they, quote, "gave me evil twisted greens. Mock me and celebrated my downfall the last day. That's why they suffered the same fate as me." In another part he writes, quote, "I wish I could have saved everyone from myself. My God, forgive me for what I'm going to do."

While the gunman spoke of specific people in the note, police say none of them were his victims. And the names were redacted for privacy.

CNN reached out to Walmart to inquire if the shooter had any complaints against him or had ever been disciplined or demoted. In response, Walmart said, quote, "There is nothing that can justify taking innocent lives."

One survivor, a fellow employee, told us earlier this week that she had been warned about the gunman.

BRIANA TYLER, WALMART EMPLOYEE, SURVIVED SHOOTING: I am new but I had heard from the very beginning that he was the one to watch out for.

TODD: The city also released the identity of the youngest victim. Now identified as 16-year-old Fernando Chavez-Barron. Friends say the teen had just started working at the Walmart and used his first paycheck to buy gifts for his mother.

JOSHUA TREJO-ALVARADO, FRIEND KILLED IN SHOOTING: I was hoping everything was a dream until they (INAUDIBLE). I wish he was so here standing with me.

TODD: With two people still in the hospital, dozens gathered Thursday to pray for the victims. As the community struggles to move forward, the survivor can't stop reliving the terror. WILCZEWSKI: The sound of the droplets -- it replays and replays and

replays, of how much blood was coming off the different chairs, it was making a rhythm.

[16:30:00]

And it was one of the most disturbing things I will -- I think will never let go of that.

BRIAN: The mayor of Chesapeake, Rick West, has announced that a vigil for the victims will be held in City Park in Chesapeake on Monday evening.

Walmart still not answering CNN's questions about whether any disciplinary measure had ever been taken against the shooter or any complaints by other employees had ever been made about him.

Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: And Virginia is not the only state coping with the aftermath of a mass shooting. In Colorado Springs, families affected by another deadly shooting at an LGBTQ club gathered for dinner where they can mourn the five people lost together.

There's also been a remarkable show of support for one of the heroes in that attack. Richard Fierro took down the shooter, and with the help of two others, beat the gunman, stopping the rampage.

Fierro and his wife own a local brewery. And in a Thanksgiving message, they thanked supporters who showed up to their business and said they have been flooded with company T-shirt orders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSICA FIERRO, SURVIVOR OF CLUB Q MASS SHOOTING: We are overwhelmed by the love and support everyone is giving us. And we feel it. All of the comments, just an outpouring of love. And it's beautiful and we just want to thank everyone.

RICHARD FIERRO, HERO & SURVIVOR OF CLUB Q MASS SHOOTING: We are very, very, very, grateful for every one of you. You're part of the Atrevida now.

Our attempt is to field everybody's request and reassure it may take us a year, it may take us 10 days. Who knows?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And Richard joins me now.

Richard, I'll take one of those T-shirts, too. My hats off to you for your heroism.

Tonight marks one week since this horrific attack happened. Tell us how you're doing.

FIERRO: We just got done with the celebration of life. And you know, this is a life-changing event for everybody in the building and their families and their friends.

Yesterday, we were able to open our brewery and the girls that worked there wanted to do so more for community to gather. And it was a beautiful, beautiful day.

I couldn't thank enough people. I tried to thank everyone who walked through the door.

But it was something that I'm very thankful that everybody is showing love. And hopefully, we can -- we can do a lot more of that.

ACOSTA: And the president called you. Tell us about that call. What did he have to say? And I guess, what has that been like?

FIERRO: Well, listen, I'm just a young kid. I grew up in San Diego. I never expected to ever talk to the president, more or less be around one or any of that stuff, a governor, a mayor. I am humbled.

You know, at the end of the day, I wish everybody could talk to him, and just to have that honor.

I'm an old soldier, so for me just to talk to a commander-in-chief is a big deal.

The discussion was between us. And I was grateful that he took the time to say thank you and just, you know, send his condolences about the families.

ACOSTA: And, Richard, you've had a week to reflect on what's happened. And I know you must be going through so many different, motions.

I'm just curious, what changes would you like to see? We know the president has been saying in the last couple of days that he would like to see the country take another try at an assault weapons ban in this country. Obviously, that's going to be difficult to get past.

But do you have any thoughts on what you would like to see. What needs to happen in this country so we don't have any more of these mass shootings?

FIERRO: Jim, I'll be honest, I was trained on a weapon as a soldier. I respect weapons. And my wife has a concealed carry license. We own guns and -- we don't own guns, but we work with guns.

So, again, it's something for the nation to figure out and whether that's the administration, it doesn't matter to me.

I would just like people to stop having so much anger. It shouldn't be something this tense. There's no reason for somebody to go to a dance club or a show or anything and have to worry about being shot.

I don't know if that has anything to do with guns, I just think people need to be a bit nicer to each other.

ACOSTA: Absolutely. And your family's brewery just re-opened for the first time since the shooting and people were lined up outside.

Tell us about this reception, this outpouring of love that your business has received since the shooting.

FIERRO: Jim, it was -- it was humbling. I literally -- we did not plan on being there. And we did not want to make this a thing. And it was just so much, we had to go back and help the girls with everything.

Everybody wiped us out. It was beautiful as a businessperson. And it was more beautiful as a person to see the variance, the difference, the diversity, the inclusion of everyone there, and everybody in the same room just having some joy and enjoying a beer.

[16:35:13]

You know, I tried to shake everyone's hand and thank them all.

I'm not a hero, Jim. Everyone else in that room was a hero with us. And everyone has a hero story to just try and survive.

And we lost five and there are still many more in the hospital. And my wife went down to see our friends, Chip and Joanne.

They've got a long road to go. And when all of the cameras are going, we'll still be living this thing.

ACOSTA: And that is the issue, isn't it, Richard? In that we're probably going to have another one of these. We have had one since what happened in Colorado Springs. We had a mass shooting at the Walmart in Virginia.

I guess, what are your thoughts on that that this keeps happening in this country over and over again?

FIERRO: Again, like I said, people need to start loving each other, man. I hug and shake hands with folks yesterday that I've never seen or met in my life. I think folks need to do a little more of that.

And you know, this whole anger thing and people picking teams, it's not cool. We all need to just shake hands and move forward. Move to the action. And that action needs to be more caring and more love across this nation.

ACOSTA: You're right about that. We're all on one team and you certainly demonstrated that a week ago, Richard.

Once again, thank you so much for what you did. We appreciate your time. I know you're going through a lot and thank you for what you're doing for that community out there. We greatly appreciate it.

FIERRO: Thank you, Mr. Acosta. I appreciate the time, too.

ACOSTA: Talk to you soon. Thanks so much. In the meantime, let's turn now to Russia's war on Ukraine. Nine

months since the invasion of Ukraine, Russian President Vladimir Putin is now insisting to mothers of Russian soldiers he knows their pain.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translation): I want you to know I personally and the entire leadership of the country share this pain. We understand that nothing can replace the loss.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: This meeting happened yesterday on Russia's Mother's Day.

Putin told the mothers that he spoke with soldiers on the phone and was surprised he said by their mood and attitude about their duty.

Joining me now is Jack Barsky, a former undercover KGB agent and author of "Deep Undercover."

Jack, great to have you on as always.

Putin is trying to make this argument, the suggestion here that spirits are high for his troops. I mean, and with the mothers and so on.

I suppose this is again, part of the propaganda that is, you know, all-encompassing in Russian society. But what do you see here?

JACK BARSKY, FORMER UNDERCOVER KGB AGENT & AUTHOR: Well, let me just start off with one thing. CNN has been really, really good to me, number one.

Number two, the person, Richard, who you had on before me, I want to meet him and hug him because he's exactly right.

Now I'm getting to Putin and Ukraine. The longer this war goes on, the more of a chance there might be that it becomes nuclear. Accidental, it doesn't matter.

I lived through the '80s. I was active through the '80s. And there were a number of situations where we got really, really close to a nuclear exchange. We can't have that.

Never mind -- you know, Putin -- Putin is fully in control of his country, no matter what the West is thinking and hoping that, you know, there will be rebels and they will overthrow him. And that's not going to happen, OK?

We -- we -- here's the problem that we have from the West. Like yesterday, the Belgian prime minister was shaking hands with Zelenskyy and says, well, you're welcome to join NATO and the E.U.

Not a good idea because there's a paranoia in the Russian DNA that Putin actually uses to stay in power, OK?

So, but -- but we need to find a way to dial this down or -- because our world is at risk.

And quite frankly, I am not 100 percent on Zelenskyy's side and I'm not 100 percent on the Ukrainian side because they're not good people either, OK?

Ukraine is an oligarchy, the same as Russia is, except, there's one thing, Russia had no business invading.

(CROSSTALK)

ACOSTA: Well, Jack, I mean, if I can disagree with you for a moment.

BARSKY: Yes.

ACOSTA: I think the Ukrainian people have shown --

BARSKY: Yes.

[16:40:01]

ACOSTA: -- tremendous courage.

BARSKY: Yes.

ACOSTA: And I mean, didn't you say that the courage of the Ukrainian people -- and it's not just people on top of Ukrainian society who are doing this and fighting for their country.

It's just been from top to -- to just the regular folks in Ukrainian society, they've all have pitched in to fight against Putin.

BARSKY: No, you're not disagreeing with me at all. I agree with you 100 percent.

But you know what? The Russian people are also good people. OK? So we're talking about the governing bodies, OK?

Russia, at this point, represents evil. And --

(CROSSTALK)

ACOSTA: They do.

BARSKY: But here's my but. You know that event when Ukrainian missiles misfired and landed in Poland, when Zelenskyy said, NATO, come on and join the fight, we can't have that because it's the world at stake.

And you need to think about this in the bigger picture. We need to find a common language. The Ukrainians and the Russians do it.

And I lived that. And I know Ukrainians. They are wonderful people. I love them. But their governments are not that good.

ACOSTA: But I hear what you're saying, Jack. But the polish prime minister said today that Russia is using death, starvation, hypothermia. BARSKY: Yes.

ACOSTA: He's been doing this throughout this entire Special Military Operation, as he calls it, which is, of course, ridiculous.

But he has been --

(CROSSTALK)

ACOSTA: -- ratcheting up the cruelty on the Ukrainian people. He's just trying to be --

(CROSSTALK)

BARSKY: I'm looking at this from a world perspective, OK? And we are one mistake away from wiping out civilization, OK?

So no matter how much right the Ukrainians are, you know, we need someone like Kissinger to find some kind of a diplomatic solution because I'm afraid that it's going to blow.

ACOSTA: All right.

Jack Barsky, to be continued. We'll keep this conversation going.

Thank you --

BARSKY: Thank you.

ACOSTA: -- for your time. Appreciate it.

Coming up, soccer superstar, Lionel Messi, keeps Argentina's World Cup hopes alive. We will bring you the latest on the Qatar World Cup. That's just ahead.

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[16:46:43]

ACOSTA: Now to a major update from the World Cup. Moments ago, Lionel Messi and Argentina kept their title hopes alive winning 2-0 in a must-win match against Mexico to the cheers of fans in Argentina. Of course, they're excited in Buenos Aires.

This, as the U.S. prepares for a sudden-death match of their own. They'll face off against Iran Tuesday after playing to a draw against a heavily favored England team last night. It was quite a match.

CNN's Patrick Snell joins me now.

Patrick, that was a huge win for Argentina and they desperately needed it.

PATRICK SNELL, CNN HOST, "WORLD SPORT": Jim, you are spot-on. Yes. A dramatic footballing perspective day out in the World Cup in Qatar. Real big-name players stepping up and doing the business. And moments ago, you're quite right, Argentina with the vital 2-0 win over Mexico.

Did I mention the name Leonel Messi, the Argentine standout, the icon, stepping up to plate when it matters most for his country. This was a really tight, tense affair. And it was really nip and tuck.

Neither side giving anything away until 64 minutes. And it's that man, Messi, who gets the vital breakthrough goal. A really well taken goal and it was from Messi, who has indicated this is likely his last-ever World Cup at 35 years of age.

And then Enzo Fernandez, with a second and a brilliant goal for Argentina. And 88,000-plus inside the stadium. A vital win for Argentina.

And their progression and their hope to get to the round of 16 in their own hands now. They have their own destiny in control of it.

They play Poland next in a huge match on Wednesday. Why is that important? Because Poland also very much in the mix now at this World Cup after their big win, 2-0, over Saudi Arabia earlier in the day.

And a really priceless moment, high emotion, indeed, for Robert Lewandowski. The 34-year-old scoring his first-ever World Cup goal. Really special.

He's a really ruthless goal scorer. And at a club-level over the years. But he's done it for the first time for his country at a World Cup.

And he's fighting back tears as well. Aa moment that will live long in the memory.

And a huge name as well taking center stage for the world champions, France, who beat Denmark by two goals to one on Saturday. The defending champions are through, as a result.

Kylian Mbappe with both goals for his country. Jim, he gets the winner with just four minutes to go.

The 24-year-old now with his third goal of the tournament. That makes him co-leader in the race for the coveted Golden Boot, the tournament's top gold scorer.

I said it was thrilling Saturday at the World Cup, Jim, and I meant it.

Back to you.

ACOSTA: You really did mean it. And Mbappe, what a force he is. He is unbelievable.

Patrick Snell, thank you so much.

Coming up, she was the Oscar-winning voice behind some of the biggest hits of the 1980s. We remember Irene Cara.

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[16:49:38]

(SINGING)

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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: This just into CNN. The U.S. has provided Chevron limited authorization to continue pumping oil in Venezuela.

This follows the announcement that the Venezuelan government and the opposition group there have reached an agreement on humanitarian relief.

They say negotiations will continue to find a solution to the country's chronic, economic and political crisis, including a focus on the 2024 elections.

Finally today, Hollywood is remembering an '80s pop icon.

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(SINGING)

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ACOSTA: Irene Cara, who starred in "Fame" and sang it's Oscar-winning theme song, died today in her Florida home. Cara also starred in the 1977 musical, "Sparkle," and wrote and sang the theme song for the movie "Flashdance," starring Jennifer Beal.

[16:55:06]

Who could forget this?

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(SINGING)

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ACOSTA: That iconic song earned Cara an Oscar. Irene Cara was 63 years old.

That's the news. Reporting from Washington, I'm Jim Acosta.

Paula Reid takes over the CNN NEWSROOM live after a quick break.

Have a good night.

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