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Biden: Soon: Garland To Give Remarks On Jackson, MS Water Crisis; Police: Suspect Posed As 17-Year-Old Before Killing Teen's Family; Israel's Netanyahu: Trump Dinner With Holocaust Denier Was "Mistake". Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired November 30, 2022 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MAX FOSTER, CNN ROYAL CORRESPONDENT: They said this person has resigned her honorary role and they are investigating. Prince William who's just landed here in Boston also said that there's no place for racism in society and that this person was right to step down immediately. So a big controversy blowing up in London and it's reflecting frankly on this visit on the first day.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: All right. Max Foster, thank you.

Top of the hour on CNN NEWSROOM, I'm Victor Blackwell.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: And I'm Alisyn Camerota. A short time from now, Attorney General Merrick Garland will speak about the verdict in the trial of five members of the far-right Oath Keepers militia group. Yesterday, a jury convicted the group's leader and an associate of seditious conspiracy for their roles in the January 6th Capitol riot. Other defendants were convicted of a number of other crimes.

BLACKWELL: Garland will also talk about the latest efforts to ensure safe drinking water in Jackson, Mississippi. Today, the DOJ announced a proposal to stabilize the city's troubled water system. CNN's Paula Reid is with us now. What more should we expect, Paula?

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Victor, this is going to be a chance for the usually reserved Attorney General to do a bit of a victory lap for these two unusual and significant victories for the justice department over the past 24 hours.

The first, of course, being this conviction for Oath Keepers' leader Stewart Rhodes and his subordinate, Kelly Meggs, both convicted of seditious conspiracy. The most serious charge brought so far in any of the 900 cases related to the capital attack. This was such a victory for the Justice Department, because this was the first time that a jury had heard the evidence and concluded that the violence that day was not a spontaneous a disruption, but the product of an organized conspiracy.

The other thing that the attorney general would like to talk about is an agreement reached with the city of Jackson, Mississippi. They have agreed to appoint a third-party to oversee the city's handling of its drinking water after flooding this summer left many of the cities' 150,000 residents mostly black people without proper drinking water. They've also issued a complaint. They have filed a complaint against the city over its handling of drinking water. These are the two things that the Attorney General wants to talk about, but there's a lot of other things to ask him about, including the newly appointed special counsel Jack Smith. This is the first time he's taking questions since that appointment.

So our Evan Perez and our other colleagues will likely have a lot of other things they want to get him to try to talk about.

CAMEROTA: Okay. We'll be watching. Paula Reid, thank you very much.

Joining us now we have CNN Legal Analyst and former Federal Prosecutor Elliot Williams.

Elliot, great to see you. So these Oath Keepers, there are the ringleaders and then there are their lieutenants, they've been convicted of a series of things, including seditious conspiracy, which rarely happens maybe once this century or hasn't happened for a century. It carries a 20 year maximum sentence, how long in prison do you think these guys are going to get?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Oh, goodness, I can't tell you that, Alisyn, only on - and it's not because I'm being coy and cute here. No, it's just that'll be a complicated formula based on a number of factors. There's the federal sentencing guidelines that set a range for every defendant based on the crime that they've been convicted of. And the range - assigning a sentence will depend on, number one, what kind of weapons were used, what's the person's criminal history, what's their personal history, have they accepted responsibility, have they admitted that they did, they acknowledged that what they did was wrong and do on.

Then prosecutors will make a recommendation, the defense will make a recommendation and the judge will sentence. They're not going to get 20 years. That's highly unlikely for anyone to ever get the statutory maximum, but they're going to jail for a long time.

BLACKWELL: You've got two convictions here from the DOJ but also three acquittals. Is there any lesson here that they can take away from these decisions?

WILLIAMS: Look, every prosecutor had their heart broken by juries before. I know, I certainly have on cases that they thought they would have won. I think the lesson for the public is that the jurors who heard this case took it very seriously. And they went through and did not convict every defendant of every crime, didn't acquit every defendant of every crime, and some defendants were convicted of some and not of other charges.

That is a sign that they were going through this and very seriously assessing the proof and facts as to each individual charge, that frankly is the way the system should work, so that's the big takeaway here, Victor.

CAMEROTA: Okay. So speaking of criminal charges, we've just learned that this week on Friday, members of the January 6 Committee, the House Committee will be meeting to discuss criminal referrals if they're going to make any. So from the evidence that you've seen if you were on that committee would - who would be, if anyone, referred for criminal charges?

WILLIAMS: Look, I think what's behind the question is should they refer the former president of the United States for criminal charges.

[15:05:04]

And certainly they have a case for doing, so at a minimum on obstruction of justice.

Now, people are talking about charging the former president with sedition and so on and I just think that's highly unlikely. But as we've seen, both in the context of the January 6 Committee, and the Justice Department's investigation, obstruction of justice is a very likely possibility here.

Now, look, if I were on the Committee, I would certainly move forward with a criminal referral here. As a former prosecutor, what I say to you, Alisyn, is they just doesn't matter, because the Justice Department doesn't have to honor a criminal referral in the first place.

So to some extent, it's an academic exercise, but it's an important statement for Congress to make that they believe that a crime was committed and I think they probably will go ahead with doing that.

BLACKWELL: So the South Carolina Supreme Court has now determined that Mark Meadows, former Trump chief of staff for the White House will have to testify before the grand jury in Georgia investigating efforts to overturn the election. They determined that we have reviewed the arguments raised by appellant and find them to be manifestly without merit.

But this is the South Carolina Supreme Court, why is it there and what are they considering that impacts that Georgia grand jury?

WILLIAMS: Yes. Here's how it goes, because Mark Meadows is based in South Carolina. And on this one, Victor, it's important to just take a step back and forget that this is Mark Meadows, forget the name Donald Trump and just look at the simple question. You have an individual who was subpoenaed in a court in Georgia, he happens to be a member of Congress and the question is, does the Constitution shield him in some way from having to come in - or pardon me - the White House chief of staff having to come in and answer questions. That is a very straightforward legal question and he has to submit to the process of the courts.

Now, look, if there are individual questions or matters that he has privileges to assert with respect to his attorneys or the president, by all means he can do that on a case by case or question by question basis. But this whole big - I think we talk about it like it's some hard, complicated legal question, but it's very straightforward and every court that's looked at it has said, look, you got to go in and testify and it looks like he's going to.

BLACKWELL: All right. Elliot Williams, thank you. Of course, we're standing by to hear from the Attorney General in just a few minutes.

WILLIAMS: Thanks, Victor.

CAMEROTA: So election officials in Georgia are expecting another day of record early voting turnout in the Senate run off there between Democratic incumbent senator Raphael Warnock and Republican challenger Herschel Walker.

BLACKWELL: Officials predicts more than 1 million votes will be cast in total by days' end and the polls just opened up this past weekend. CNN's Eva McKend is in Atlanta tracking the Walker and Warnock campaigns. Let's start though with this turnout, what are you seeing?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER: Well, Victor, it is really remarkable and it indicates that people are engaged and really, it's hard not to be in Georgia. You turn on your radio, you turn on the television and you hear both of these candidates making their case here. You sort of can't escape the runoff in Georgia.

More than 830,000 Georgians have voted so far. That is between early in-person voting and absentee ballots. And what's really interesting is the demographics of this. So we are seeing an impressive showing among younger voters, 50 or younger account for a quarter of the vote so far.

So this means that you can't count out college students, young voters, typically - sometimes people do, they talk about them as unreliable. But that is not the case here. That is perhaps why we have seen Sen. Warnock show up on so many college campuses talking to students.

CAMEROTA: And also, Eva, Herschel Walker is now having to respond to questions about his residency. What's the issue?

MCKEND: Well, CNN's KFILE discovered audio of Walker at a campaign event earlier this year, telling students that he was living in Texas when he decided to run for Senate here in Georgia. This is on top of KFILE discovering that he was getting - that he is getting these tax breaks aimed for a primary residence in Texas while running for Senate here.

But Alisyn, I think what is more troubling than this really is the inaccessibility of the candidate. Herschel Walker is running for high office here, right, the upper chamber of Congress and we can't even really ask him any substantive policy questions. He has not taken questions from the media in more than a month. I tried to do so this week at a campaign event with no success.

And so, yes, there are these residency questions, he should answer for those. But he should also I have to speak on a number of policy matters, as well. For instance, my colleague, Dianne Gallagher, was able to ask Sen. Warnock this week about Title 42. He has taken different positions on that. May be not a question that Sen. Warnock would love to get, but at least we were able to ask him that question. We have not been able to do the same with Herschel Walker, Victor, Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: So - yes, so interesting, Eva.

[15:10:00]

I mean, basically, if voters care about policy, they're not getting the answers from Herschel Walker. Eva McKend, thank you very much for the reporting.

BLACKWELL: America now has the first black leader of a major political party in Congress. Today, House Democrats elected New York Congressman Hakeem Jeffries Minority Leader in the new Congress. Republicans will have the majority.

Jeffries ran unopposed. After the vote, he thanked past party leaders for his historic ascension.

BLACKWELL: Jeffries is 52 years old and he called for more bipartisanship.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): We look forward to finding opportunities to partner with the other side of the aisle and work with them whenever possible, but we will also push back against extremism whenever necessary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Representatives Katherine Clark and Pete Aguilar won the other positions in party leadership. Jeffries' predecessor, current House Speaker Nancy Pelosi was voted in as Speaker America last night.

And House today passed legislation that brings Congress one step closer to averting a nationwide rail strike. This vote was 290 to 137. These eight Democrats voted against it. President Biden said a strike would put the economy at risk.

BLACKWELL: One analysis found it would cost the U.S. billion dollars in the first week alone. Democratic senators believe the measure has support in the Senate. The House also approved the provision adding paid sick leave to the bill but it's unclear if that addition has support in the Senate.

There are new developments today in that investigation into a triple homicide at home in California after police say a teenage girl was deceived by an online predator. Today, her family is pleading with other parents to use their pain as a cautionary tale. Authorities believe 28-year-old Austin Lee Edwards killed the girl's mother and grandparents, set their home on fire after he posed as a 17-year-old boy online and developed a relationship with a 15 year old girl.

CAMEROTA: Police say they're still processing both a physical crime scene and a digital paper trail. But we do know this, that this suspect was recently hired by Virginia Sheriff's office after working as a state trooper there. He was caught after driving to the girl's home in California when a neighbor called in to report his license plate. Hours later he died in a shootout with police.

CNN's Josh Campbell has been following this story for us. So Josh, it was so generous of this grieving family to try to warn other families, what did they say?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. They are devastated. They've obviously lost three family members brutally murdered in this attack, a 15-year-old minor who survived who's suffering significant mental and emotional injuries. But we heard from family members a short time ago and they say that they don't want this to happen to other family members out there.

And this all stemmed from this online scheme called catfishing. It's when someone pretends to be another person, that is what appears to have happened in this case according to police, where this 28 year old former police officer from Virginia was in contact with this 15 year old minor. He was pretending to be a 17-year-old male according to police.

He drives from the Commonwealth of Virginia here to California, makes contact with this minor. It was actually a neighbor that called 911 to report that this minor was being taken to a vehicle in a suspicious manner. Police were able to track down that car. They engaged in an altercation. The suspect is shot and killed the minor is rescued.

But authorities found a gruesome scene at the home of that minor, her grandparents were killed as well as her mother and this is why the family members are saying that parents need to take a greater interest in what their kids are doing online. They need to understand what platforms they're on, to whom they're communicating, because again, this appears to have been started from this online scheme.

Family members also having harsh words for the suspect in this case, they are baffled, they're perplexed how someone who was sworn to enforce the law would break the law in such a brutal manner. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHELLE BLANDIN, SISTER AND DAUGHTER OF HOMICIDE VICTIMS: This was an adult that traveled across the country to kidnap a 15-year-old girl, my niece, our niece, our family member with the idea to kidnap her and killing devastate our family. He took an oath to protect and yet he failed to do so. Instead he preyed on the most vulnerable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMPBELL: Now, I talked to the detectives a short time ago here at the Riverside Police Department. They're still working this investigation. They have the physical crime scene at the residence but they're also poring over a trove of online evidence, they're calling the digital crime scene, they're trying to get to the bottom of how this relationship began, how long this online relationship took place and just as important, are there other potential victims out there? Other minors that this now deceased shot and killed in this police encounter former police officer may have been in contact with. [15:15:04]

Again, this is something that we've seen so many times in covering these cases where you have minors who are targeted by people. This one obviously ending in horrific tragedy, guys.

BLACKWELL: Yes. Josh Campbell for us there in Riverside, thank you.

CAMEROTA: And this just in to CNN, the Department of Homeland Security renewing its warning of terrorism threats from lone wolves. We have the details next.

BLACKWELL: And a potential breakthrough in the search for treatment of Alzheimer's. A new experimental drug is the first to show signs of slowing cognitive decline, details ahead.

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[15:19:54]

CAMEROTA: The Department of Homeland Security has renewed a nationwide bulletin, warning that people motivated by various ideological beliefs and personal grievances posed a lethal danger to the U.S.

BLACKWELL: The Bulletin cites recent threats against members of the Jewish community and the attack on the LGBTQ community in Colorado as examples of the ways bad actors are inclined to violence.

CAMEROTA: Incoming Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said former President Trump made a "mistake" when he chose to dine with Nick Fuentes. Trump, as you know, hosted the white supremacist and Holocaust denier along with the rapper Ye at his Mar-A-Lago resort last week. Trump later said he did not know who Fuentes was before the meeting.

BLACKWELL: All right. Let's discuss now with President of the Zionist Organization of America, Morton Klein, and Republican strategist, John Brabender. He was also a media consultant to Trump's 2020 campaign. Also CNN Political Commentator, Ashley Allison. She worked for President Biden's 2020 campaign. Good to have all of you.

Morton, let me start with you. You've told The New York Times that this last episode with Fuentes for dinner at Mar-A-Lago scared you that this mainstreaming of Jew hater scares you. Does this mark the end of your support for Donald Trump?

MORTON KLEIN, PRESIDENT, ZIONIST ORGANIZATION OF AMERICA: Well, Donald Trump was the greatest friend for Israel in the White House ever. He moved the embassy to Jerusalem. He stopped all aids to the Palestinians as long as they pay Arabs to murder Jews. He recognized Jews' right to live in the West Bank. And, of course, he did the Abraham Accords, making peace with UAE, Bahrain, Morocco and Sudan.

So he's one of the greatest friends, that doesn't change. But having dinner with Kanye West, who publicly called for the death to all Jews, praised Hitler and Farrakhan, and Nick Fuentes, who's a Holocaust denier saying, forgive me, I urinate on your Jewish Torah, Jews serve the devil.

All we've asked President Trump is to repudiate these remarks as despicable and they have no place in America. That's all he has to do. And to this point here, he has not done so because by not doing so, it legitimizes and mainstreams this sort of extraordinary Jew hatred in America. And when you have a situation of enormous rise in anti- Semitism and attacks on Jews, it's especially important for President Trump to publicly repudiate these remarks.

BLACKWELL: But Morton, he's had a week to do that and you say he loves Jews, he loves Israel, what do you glean from his refusal to condemn Nick Fuentes and Kanye West comments?

KLEIN: This has been his nature. He refuses to ever express regret for a mistake he makes. I don't know why he continues to do that. But let me say something interesting. When President Biden publicly praised a member of Congress who's a Jew hater, Rashida Tlaib - Rashida Tlaib called Israeli racist Nazi state, end all relations to Israel, don't give Israel money and Biden called her a passionate intellect that God thanks for being a fighter. Praise, an overt anti- Semite with real power and nobody said a word about that, so ...

CAMEROTA: I don't know about that ...

KLEIN: ... we have to understand that ...

CAMEROTA: Yes.

KLEIN: ... both sides have benefit (inaudible) ...

CAMEROTA: I hear you, Morton. I understand, understand the both sides stuff, but I think the Democrats have come out and even denounced people in their own party many times and vociferously when there's anti-Semitism. But I just want our viewers to know something that Victor you've been pointing out.

He's not just an anti-Semite, this guy, Fuentes. He's vile on many different levels. He's also a racist. He's also a misogynist. Here are just some of his hits. As we know, he's a Holocaust denier. He's called rape "not a big deal." He said segregation was better for African-Americans. They had to drink out of a different water fountain big effing deal. He has said women should not vote or hold jobs. He's also joked that women should be kept in line by giving them a vicious backhanded slap across the face. And so given all that, John, I mean, I know that you were helpful to Donald Trump in 2020 campaign, would you still support him in 2024?

JOHN BRABENDER, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Yes. Well, let me be clear on a couple of things. First, I was there and I know the staff well, I worked a little bit with the president. I never once saw anything that was anti-racist or was racist or anti-Semitic in any way. If I had, I would have left the campaign.

In looking at this latest episode, I think the big disappointment for me and a lot of Republicans is, all right, let's take the president at his word that he didn't know who this individual was. Why not use this as a great moment to speak into our universal belief that anybody who is anti-Semitic or racist that we are going to oppose loudly and we're going to be united in that fight?

CAMEROTA: Right. Why isn't he doing that?

BRABENDER: Instead, he use this as an excuse that he didn't know who he was.

[15:25:02]

That's fine only if you're willing to come out and get on the record about what you believe.

CAMEROTA: Yes. So has he lost your support?

BRABENDER: Well, look, it depends what happens in the next few days, in the next few weeks, I think the president has an opportunity to do here. I still think if Donald Trump would have been reelected, we would have a better economy, we wouldn't have fentanyl coming up killing 70,000 Americans every year, we - that Putin probably would have thought second without into Ukraine.

CAMEROTA: I guess, I mean, there was definitely fentanyl problem before 2020.

BRABENDER: But I do think this has hurt him politically, especially when you see how many Republican leaders have come out ...

CAMEROTA: Right.

BRABENDER: ... and asked him to apologize and so forth. I think this has made his second chance of being reelected president much more difficult.

BLACKWELL: He maybe has another week, maybe another month, it sounds like people are holding Kyrie Irving to a higher standard than they are a former president and a candidate for president in 2024. Ashley, let me come to you, does this spate - the spate of disavow from so many people sound any different to you than it did after Access Hollywood or Charlottesville or January 6th, so the long list of times we've heard Republicans say this is a bridge too far and then come back to Trump for their own political self preservation.

ASHLEY ALLISON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It does feel very similar and I think, unfortunately, we will probably can - see this continue. I think you can tell a lot about someone by the company they keep. If you don't know who someone is, and you're having a conversation, and then you hear, I'm sure, once they said some really important things, in that dinner, the next immediate step is not, I didn't know who they were, it is I do not agree with that individual. I will never meet with that individual again and I condemn the things that they said and that's not what Trump is doing.

And I think anyone who is giving him a pass in this moment or frankly has given him a pass many, many times before while he was president and before he was president for saying heinous things, that's unacceptable to me. And I question why they are doing it and, again, I always say it is putting the politics over the people and what is right and just in this country. And I think people are playing both sides of the fence still because they just don't know if this is going to be the thing that gets Trump to go away.

CAMEROTA: Ashley Allison, John Brabender, Morton Klein, we really appreciate your perspectives, thank you.

BLACKWELL: Any moment now, Attorney General Merrick Garland will address the Oath Keepers' convictions. We'll bring that to you live when it happens. Stay with us.

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