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Griner is Released from Russia; Putin Blames Ukraine for War; A Chinese National Exposes China's Protests; Brittney Griner Traded For Arms Dealer Viktor Bout; Chinese Leader, Saudi King Sign Partnership Agreement; Celine Dion Has Rare Neurological Disorder. Aired 2-2:45a ET

Aired December 09, 2022 - 02:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[02:00:00]

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MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to all our viewers watching around the world. I'm Michael Holmes. Appreciate your company. Coming up here on "CNN Newsroom" --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Brittney will soon be back in the arms of her loved ones, and she should have been there all along.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: American basketball star Brittney Griner is on her way home after being released from a Russian penal colony as part of a prisoner swap. But some critics are slamming the deal as a big win for Russia.

Also, Vladimir Putin toasts with Russian forces carrying out his invasion of Ukraine, while also blaming Kyiv for the war.

And one man in China risks it all by tweeting out videos of protests the Chinese government does not want the world to see.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Live from CNN Center, this is "CNN Newsroom" with Michael Holmes.

HOLMES: She was arrested in Moscow for possession of cannabis oil. He is known as the merchant of death, a notorious arms dealer convicted of conspiring to kill Americans. Now, Brittney Griner and Viktor Bout are both free in a prisoner swap between Russia and the United States.

They passed briefly, as you can see there in an airport tarmac in Abu Dhabi, where the exchange took place. Griner is on her way back to the U.S. after nearly 10 months in a Russian detention. She is expected to land in San Antonio, Texas in the coming hours. U.S. President Joe Biden announcing the deal Thursday at the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BIDEN: Brittney is in good spirits. She is relieved to finally be heading home. She wrote to me back in July. She did not ask for special treatment, even though we have been working on her release from day one. She requested a simple -- quote -- "please, don't forget about me and the other American detainees."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: One of those detainees is U.S. Marine veteran Paul Whelan. He remains behind bars in Russia accused of espionage.

CNN's Kylie Atwood with more now on American efforts to secure his release and the deal for Brittney Griner.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): After nearly 10 in detention, Brittney Griner has been released from Russia. Russian state media showing her boarding a plane from an undisclosed location.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Are you ready for the flight?

BRITTNEY GRINER, AMERICAN PROFESSIONAL BASKETBALL PLAYER: Ah, yes. Yes, I'm ready.

ATWOOD (voice-over): The Biden administration bringing her home in a prisoner swap months in the making.

BIDEN: She is safe, she is on a plane, she is on her way home after months of being unjustly detained in Russia, held under intolerable circumstances.

ATWOOD (voice-over): The president and Griner's wife Cherelle speaking to Brittney, who is on her way back to the United States after being released to U.S. officials in Abu Dhabi.

CHERELLE GRINER, WIFE OF BRITTNEY GRINER: It's a happy day for me and my family, so, I'm going to smile right now.

ATWOOD (voice-over): Griner's team, the Phoenix Mercury, tweeting, no more days. She's coming home.

According to senior administration officials, the deal came together in just the last two days, when Griner was moved from the penal colony where she had been serving a nine-year sentence. The officials describing Griner as extremely upbeat and all smiles.

But Griner's release did not come cheaply. The U.S. exchanging arms trafficker Viktor Bout, the so-called merchant of death. He was serving a 25-year prison sentence in the United States for charges including conspiring to kill Americans.

Even amid joy for freeing Griner, sadness today for the family of another American who was left behind, Paul Whelan, who has been in Russian prison for almost four years. Officials from the Department of Justice expressing frustration that an earlier allowing Bout's release, which U.S. officials had proposed, included Griner and Whelan. Lawmakers also expressed apprehension about normalizing prisoner swaps.

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE): I think this is good news for Brittney, for her family. That's the risk, is that the more we engage in such exchanges, the more Americans are risk of being scooped up and held as leverage.

ATWOOD (voice-over): Whelan is serving a 16-year sentence for espionage, charges he vehemently denies. He spoke exclusively to CNN's Jennifer Hensler from a penal colony, saying he was pleased for Griner but greatly disappointed he wasn't included.

PAUL WHELAN, FORMER U.S. MARINE DETAINED IN RUSSIA (voice-over): I don't understand why I'm still sitting here. I was led to believe that things were moving in the right direction and that the governments were negotiating, and that something would happen fairly soon.

[02:05:02]

ATWOOD (voice-over): And despite the administration's earlier efforts to include Whelan in the deal, they say Russia made it clear it wasn't going to happen.

ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: They continue to insist on sham charges of espionage and are treating false case differently. This was not a choice of which American to bring home. The choice was one or none.

ATWOOD (voice-over): As the administration says they are still working on his release, Whelan begging President Biden to free him regardless of the cost.

WHELAN (voice-over): My bags are packed. I'm ready to go home. I just need an airplane to come and get me.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Kylie Atwood reporting there for us. Now, Paul Whelan's sister, Elizabeth, tells CNN she doesn't think he knows the full extent of the U.S. efforts to flee him. She says her family is always careful what they say to Whelan because they assume Russian authorities are listening. Still, Whelan says he is disappointed.

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WHELAN (voice-over): I would say that if a message could go to President Biden, that this is a precarious situation that needs to be resolved quickly. And I would hope that he and his administration would do everything they could to get me home regardless of the price they might have to pay at this point.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Paul Whelan's brother says he thinks President Biden made the right call to take the deal that was on the table.

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DAVID WHELAN, BROTHER OF PAUL WHELAN: I think to prolong the punishment of one American in a foreign hostage situation on the hope that you might be able to bring home two of them is absolutely the wrong call for the U.S. president to make.

An American in that situation who has a possibility of coming home, I think the U.S. president has to bring him home. And unfortunately, for my brother and for our family, it's not our family member, but I think from the perspective of Americans, that is the right decision.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: For more, I'd like to bring in Jonathan Franks. He worked to get the former American prisoner, Trevor Reed, released from Russia, so he knows a bit about how this all goes. He joins me from Clearwater Beach, Florida. Appreciate you joining us.

So, first of all, what do you make of the deal done for Griner and its implications? What it means for the others left behind?

JONATHAN FRANKS, FOUNDER, LUCID STRATEGIES: Thanks for having me, Michael. You know, today is a bittersweet day. I would kind of describe it as the epitome of a pyrrhic victory because we are overjoyed, all of us, the hostage family community, the hostage family campaign for the Griners, right, Cherelle is beloved in our group, but a lot of us, me included, right, because when I was saying -- trying to sell a deal for Trevor, I was trying to sell a deal for Paul, too.

So, it felt like a gut punch, right? He has now been left behind three times by two different presidents. And somebody pointed out today, I read it somewhere, that he deserves better from this government, and I agree.

HOLMES: And to that point, Paul Whelan -- he said, he told CNN, he is happy for Griner, but he also said, I don't understand why I'm still sitting here. What do you see as the answer to that question? What will the U.S. have that Russia would have accepted for Paul Whelan?

FRANKS: Well, for one thing, right, they see Paul's case very differently because of the concocted espionage narrative, right? They have made him out to be the second coming of the Rosenberg (ph). And so, it's a little hard to back off that position.

And one thing that they never do over there is look weak to their domestic constituents. And so, I think it might be a little bit of a harder sell, but we do have -- let us put it this way, there are still targets for trade in this country.

HOLMES: Yeah. As we said at the beginning, you worked on the case of American Trevor Reed. He was free. Just how complex, complicated, just plain difficult are these sorts of negotiations, particularly with the Russians? FRANKS: Oh, they are incredibly difficult. The people play hostage

diplomacy, right? The Chinese, the Venezuelans, the Iranians, the Russians, at times the Belarusians, you know, none of these places are run by stable geniuses, right? So, they are very difficult. These folks are fickle, they're easily offended and, you know, it can get pretty petty.

But, you know, I've got to say, the government negotiators, you know, once they actually get to the table, they do a great job, right? And, you know, if they really could not get Paul on this deal, they had a moral obligation to make the deal with it, and they should be commended for it.

But it doesn't mean that we have to sit here and happy that Paul is still there. And I think our goal, as the family campaign and certainly the Reed's goal as a family, is to continue to pressure on these folks so that we make sure they do, in fact, were back from Paul.

And, you know, I take, especially Secretary Blinken and, you know, the president himself, at their words that they are not going to forget, you know, that they are going to go back for Paul.

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FRANKS: I hope that's the case.

HOLMES: There's no shortage of people, particularly in the political realm, and it include some Democrats in Congress. While they are happy for Brittney Griner, they are saying deals like this, prisoner swaps, just embolden adversaries to scoop up Americans because they might get a quid pro quo for that person's release. What do you say to that?

FRANKS: So, I would ask those very same people, and I was kind of hoping and I'm kind of disappointed that it evolved into that, right? I would ask these same people who are making these claims, what's the empirical evidence? Right? There is none, right? This is a speculative (INAUDIBLE) man, right? Does it make some logical sense that perhaps doing these deals might increase hostage taking? Absolutely. But it has not.

And so, there's no empirical evidence for that yet. Even if there was, it would be immoral when our current hostages (INAUDIBLE) in a, you know, for some speculative help that we might (INAUDIBLE) hostage taking or two (ph). This is a real problem. It is happening with alarming frequency. People need to be aware of it when they leave the country.

HOLMES: Just quickly, I wonder if you had thoughts on whether Griner's profile as a sports woman impacted her importance, if that's the right word, to the Biden administration versus other cases.

FRANKS: Certainly, her prominence, you know, made this a special case, right? So -- but I've seen a lot of people, you know, who have no idea what they are talking about. You know, sort of bellyaching on social media that she got special treatment. She never got special treatment. That is just nonsense.

But because of her prominence, I have said, you know, since Trevor Reed got out, we, including Trevor, 10 Americans released in prison trade's this calendar year. And had Brittney Griner -- you know, zero of them had occurred before Brittney Griner got arrested.

So, in a sense, we are hearing (INAUDIBLE) created by Brittney. And, you know, this is all -- she has accomplished all of this without actually -- you know, while she was still in jail and unable to speak. So, I can only imagine and I can can't wait to see what she accomplishes now that she has her voice back.

HOLMES: That's a really good point. I mean, her profile really giving oxygen to the cases of other people. It's a very good point. Jonathan, we really appreciate it. Jonathan Franks, thanks so much.

FRANKS: Thank you.

HOLMES: Russian President Vladimir Putin says Ukraine has itself to blame for Moscow strikes on its energy system. Russia, of course, has been pounding that infrastructure in recent weeks, temporarily cutting power to millions of Ukrainians just as cold weather is settling in. But Mr. Putin still claims none of it is Russia's fault.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA (through translator): Right now, there has been a lot of uproar about our attacks on the energy infrastructure of our neighboring country. Yes, we are doing it, but who started it? Who hit the Crimean bridge? Who blew up the power lines from the Kerch nuclear power plant?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: For more, Salma Abdelaziz joins me now from London. It's rather extraordinary, Vladimir Putin finally speaking to these attacks on Ukraine's electrical grid, but incredibly, champagne glass in hand, blaming Ukraine. Why?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, indeed. These are very rare comments from President Putin admitting, of course, that Russia is behind the attacks on Ukraine's critical infrastructure, its power grid, it's water supplies, these very critical systems that have made millions of Ukrainians suffer, plunged them into darkness, leaving them at times without running water.

President Putin admitting he is behind that, but in it of itself is not shocking, Michael, because we do see the statements from Russia's military claiming and acknowledging that they are behind these strikes.

But what is interesting is to hear the motivation behind them from the Kremlin. Oftentimes, in the military statements, there seems to be a sort of military reason given, right, that there is a strategic drive to hit this critical infrastructure in Ukraine. But President Putin makes it sound like it is simple, it's tit-for-tat revenge. Take a listen to a bit more of his comments there, Michael.

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PUTIN (through translator): Who is it supplying water to Donetsk? Not supplying water to a city with more than a million people is an act of genocide. No one has ever said a word about that. Total silence. But as soon as we move and do something in response, they scream and shout to the whole universe. This will not interfere with our combat missions.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ABDELAZIZ: So, there he is, President Putin, listing his grievances, if you will, listing his reasons why he is attacking infrastructure inside Ukraine, why he is hitting electrical grids from the Kerch bridge blast. Remember, that happened in October, this covert operation. Ukraine has never claimed responsibility for it.

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ABDELAZIZ: But a major strike on Russia, that critical bridge that connects Russian-occupied Crimea to the rest of the region, claiming these attacks, again, on these Russian-occupied regions in the east, going on with that rhetoric about how the west only cares about Ukraine but isolates Russia.

What do we take away from this? The first thing you are going to take away from this is that President Putin is going to drill down on these attacks, these attacks that some of Ukraine's allies say could amount to war crimes because of the civilian suffering that they cause.

So, expect that that will continue to be the Kremlin strategy. But also, again, it just gives you a sense of where President Putin's head is at, right? This is not a strategic conversation that we are listening to him have here, Michael. This is really about his pride, about making sure that he hits back against what he sees as offense cost to Russia. Michael?

HOLMES: Yeah, absolutely. Good to see you, Salma. Salma Abdelaziz there in London for us.

Now, coming up here on "CNN Newsroom," the Chinese national who has become a one-man hub for collecting videos of Chinese protests and the government's crackdown in sharing them for the world to see.

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UNKNOWN: This account can document all these historical events that cannot be saved inside the country.

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HOLMES: Widespread protests gripped China in recent weeks as the public pushed back against the communist government's strict COVID policies. The video shared online is giving a rare glimpse of the harsh reality on the ground to find China's giant censorship apparatus and the so-called great firewall on the internet.

Well, the man responsible for sharing many of those videos says he has received death threats. He speaks exclusively with CNN's Selina Wang.

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SELINA WANG, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Video after video of historic anti-zero COVID protests in China, broadcast on the world's television screens, everywhere, but inside China, where authorities censored all evidence of the protests.

So, how did these images managed to get beyond China's controlled internet? Newsrooms around the world, including CNN, have been relying on information from this Twitter account. And there's only one man behind it, Li, a Chinese painter in Italy, whose identity we are hiding for security reasons.

MR. LI, OWNER OF TWITTER ACCOUNT (through translator): This account may become a symbol of Chinese people still pursuing freedom of speech. When you post something within China, it will quickly disappear. This account can document all these historical events that cannot be saved inside the country.

WANG (voice-over): This account quickly turned into one of the world's key sources for protests information. Li says he received thousands of submissions per day after demonstrations unfolded.

[02:19:58]

WANG (voice-over): Apps like Twitter, YouTube, and Instagram are banned in China. But people used virtual private networks or VPNs, which are prohibited in China, to access Twitter and send their videos to Li.

(On camera): What is the motivation behind all the work you do?

LI (through translator): It is that people inside of China climb out of the great firewall to see what is happening at this very moment.

WANG (voice-over): But that is exactly what authorities want to prevent. Here's what happens if you search for information about any of the protests on Chinese social media. You get a notice that says, sorry, no relevant results are around.

Meanwhile, on Li's Twitter account, he was rapidly uploading videos of demonstrations across China. From Urumqi (ph), Nanjing (ph), Chengdu (ph) to Shanghai, the protesters chanted for Xi Jinping to step down, calling for freedom and end to zero-COVID.

And researchers say the Chinese government is even trying to bury information about the protests from social media users abroad. Search on Twitter and Chinese characters for cities that had protests, and you get this, a flood of spam and porn advertisements. The spam campaign, researchers say, appears to be the work of Chinese authorities. Twitter did not respond to a request for comment.

(On camera): Are you worried about your own safety?

LI: (through translator): Of course, I'm very worried. I get a lot of them, harassments saying, I know who you are, where you live, and I will kill you.

WANG (voice-over): His parents frequently call him in fear, he says, and the Chinese authorities have been harassing them, too, making midnight visits to their home in China.

(On camera): What price, do you think, you have to pay for the work that you do?

LI (through translator): This account is more important than my life. I will not shut it down. I have arranged for someone else to take over if something bad happens to me. I'm mentally prepared, even if authorities won't let me see my parents again.

WANG (voice-over): Authorities in China try to keep the country in a parallel universe. But Li is playing a pivotal role in breaking that bubble. Li spends hours a day on the account, only taking breaks to feed his cat, and barely slept during the peak of protests as he sorted and verify the endless stream of video submissions, each one urgent and historic. He's doing the work that he hopes one day Chinese journalists and Chinese citizens from within China will be able to do without fear.

Selina Wang, CNN, Beijing.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Now, of course, it's not just China where there are protests challenging government authority. Protests still in Russia in opposition to the war in Ukraine, and, of course, in Iran, massive anti-government protests. What is the West, the United States, in particular, do or not do given dissent in countries which are foes?

Let's discuss all of this with Douglas London. He is a retired senior CIA operations officer and an adjunct associate professor with Georgetown University Center for Security Studies. Always good to see you, professor, as well as you are the author of "The Recruiter: Spying and the Lost Art of American Intelligence," I must mention that. Appreciate being with us.

You wrote a fascinating piece in foreign policy looking at the domestic problems in America's traditional foes, as we said, Russia, Iran, and China. You also recently wrote in "The Wall Street Journal" that -- quote -- "Every good spy knows that in chaos, there is opportunity." What are those opportunities for the U.S. with what is happening now on the streets of Iran, China, and Russia?

DOUGLAS LONDON, FORMER SENIOR CIA OPERATIONS OFFICER: Thanks, Michael. Well, happy people don't turn out on the street protesting, particularly when they know it can cost them their life. Happy people don't generally spy against their own governments, again, understating the risks. So, these are people that are angry, frustrated at (INAUDIBLE) end and looking to take control because there is a lack of control right now. Those do offer opportunities for U.S. and other western intelligence services in terms of how can that be leveraged either for information gathering or for influencing behavior of those very governments.

HOLMES: To that point, China and Iran, of course, very clearly blame the U.S. for inciting the domestic protests they face. Russia have said that for years. And there's a shortage of history of the U.S. being involved in other countries' internal affairs to push an agenda. Do you think the U.S. is perhaps involved in stoking tensions in some way or measure in the issues facing those countries?

LONDON: I think there is, you know, (INAUDIBLE) to how far the United States is involved, either overtly or covertly. Times are different than they were in the days of -- in Iran in the 50s or Chile in the 70s.

Intelligence these days is coming out rather much in the open. We see the declassified intelligence. We see messaging through actual secrets that are now being sanitized and delivered to the public.

[02:25:00]

LONDON: But secrets that do amplify some of the issues that are at the core of the challenges that I see Russia, China, and Iran facing with their own people.

So, I think there's less of the (INAUDIBLE) skullduggery and buying crowds. There could be some select opportunities. I don't think the history is done on what happened during the ending days of the Cold War in Eastern Europe and Poland, for example. But I think the United States has to look for the trajectory of what its influence does and consequences that could be worse for getting involved and for staying outside.

HOLMES: That's a very good point because I was going to quote you from your foreign policy article. You said, the unrest being manifested among U.S. adversaries poses as much risk as it does opportunity. Explain more what you mean by that. The law of unintended consequence is very much in play, I guess.

LONDON: When you light a fire, you don't necessarily know where it is going to lead. There's a difficulty in controlling such mass movements. These are popular organic movements that are evolving. They can take any sort of turns.

We've seen that happen so many times in history, certainly in the Arab spring, in Egypt, in North Africa where sometimes you would see, you know, credible movements coming out, and sometimes, those movements were hijacked by extremists on one side of the other or other fringes in society.

So, without knowing where this might end, I think there is a danger to stoking the fire too much, if you can't really leverage influence and control to get where you wanted to be. For all you know, that which grows out of it can be worse than what you have to begin with.

HOLMES: And, of course, I mean, you spent decades with the CIA. You were station chief in a couple of places. I mean, it is interesting. Is it relevant to note that over recent history -- I think it's fair to say that U.S. actions for regime change or rather interference have really ended well long-term for the U.S., let alone the country (INAUDIBLE). How much has that impact thinking in the CIA, for example, when they look at what is happening?

LONDON: Well, I like to think there are lessons learned from all of these episodes in history. But again, these are policy decisions. The CIA will execute covert action on direction of the president, but it is usually the White House that comes up with the direction in the first place because they see some opportunity there.

So, the mechanics of trying to achieve policy ends or policy preferences will often look back at what has been done before. Bob Gates wrote a famous memo in the 80s talking about the dangers of covert action only to wind at executing covert action policy in Central America against Nicaragua and (INAUDIBLE).

So, I think we would like to see the lessons of history applied, but it is not always the case.

HOLMES: Isn't that so true. It is a fascinating article, foreignpolicy.com. I urge you to read it. Retired CIA operation officer, Douglas London, good to see you. Thanks a lot.

LONDON: Thanks, Michael.

HOLMES: A notorious arms dealer, a part of that prisoner exchange for American basketball player. Still to come, we will take a closer look at Viktor Bout and why some are not happy with this deal. We will be right back.

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MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome back. To everyone watching around the world, I'm Michael Holmes. This is CNN NEWSROOM.

And let's get you up to date on our top story. This hour, we're waiting for word that American basketball star Brittney Griner has arrived back in the U.S. after nearly 10 months in Russian custody. She's actually due to land in San Antonio, Texas anytime now. Russia agreed to swap Griner for Viktor Bout who was serving a 25-year prison term in the U.S. for conspiring to kill Americans. The reputed arms dealer was known as the merchant of death. Griner was arrested in Moscow airport in February with cannabis oil in her bag. Her lawyers say it was prescribed by a doctor. Griner's wife said she's disappointed that American Paul Whelan in prison for four years in Russia was also not released.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHERELLE GRINER, BRITTNEY GRINER'S WIFE: I'm here to say this, but I will gladly speak on her behalf and say that BG and I will remain committed to the work of getting every American home including Paul, whose family is in our hearts today as we celebrate BG being home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: The man at the center of Brittney Griner's prisoner swap, as we said, nickname the merchant of death, for his role in arms dealing around the world. Viktor Bout also called everything from a bully to a family man. Brian Todd takes a closer look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): Victor Bout is believed to have cut a figure so legendary in the arms trafficking underworld that he's widely acknowledged as the inspiration for Nicolas Cage's character in the movie Lord of War.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The arms bizarre was open, guided missiles, unguided missiles, mortars, mines, armored personnel carriers, whole tank divisions.

EVELYN FARKAS, FORMER U.S. DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: He's notorious they made a movie about him, and he provided arms to all parts of the world in contravention of international law.

TODD: Now, the man nicknamed the merchant of death is back in Russia. His 25-year prison sentence cut very short in a prisoner swap for Brittney Griner. Bout always denied breaking any laws. But before being apprehended in an elaborate sting in Thailand in 2008, he was believed to have funneled weapons to war zones from Africa to Afghanistan. Douglas Farah, co-author of a book on Victor Bout says he was known as a charismatic figure, a devoted family man, but also as a bully who'd barge in on government meetings.

DOUGLAS FARAH, CO-AUTHOR, "MERCHANT OF DEATH": To look at the wars that were directly impacted by his weapons delivery. As you can see, they escalate directly in proportion to the amounts of weapons arriving. So, I would say certainly, you know, tens of thousands of people suffered if not hundreds of thousands of people because of the weapons he was able to deliver.

TODD: Former CNN Moscow bureau chief Jill Dougherty interviewed Bout in Moscow in 2002. At that time, he denied accusations that he'd sold weapons to the Taliban and al Qaeda.

JILL DOUGHERTY, FORMER CNN MOSCOW BUREAU CHIEF: Did you ever meet Osama bin Laden?

VIKTOR BOUT, ALLEGED ARMS DEALER: Unfortunately, I don't have a chance to meet them. Maybe if I vote on this position to meet them somewhere. Maybe on that period, I would decide to do something to prevent what happened.

TODD: I asked Jill if Bout struck her as fearsome.

DOUGHERTY: You know, at that point, he really didn't. He's kind of like a -- you know, a big, goofy-oofy guy. I did not get any vibes. You know, I guess you could expect somebody with the wrap like that to be kind of scary and fearsome. But he wasn't.

TODD: Western intelligence officials said there was evidence Bout shipped arms to fighters in Africa in exchange for blood diamonds. He denied it. But U.S. officials say he routinely dealt with people like ex-Liberian President and convicted warlord Charles Taylor. We interviewed a former DEA official who took part in Bout's arrest in Thailand, who says there was no weapon big or small that Viktor Bout wouldn't sell to you for the right price.

TOM PASQUARELLO, FORMER DEA REGIONAL DIRECTOR FOR SOUTHEAST ASIA: A wide variety of weapons ranging from Antonov to aircraft to air and ground missiles to AR-15s to a number of different military-grade weapons that he intended to supply to the FARC, a terrorist organization for the purpose of killing Americans.

TODD: Viktor Bout's lawyer told CNN in a statement that the prisoner swap between his client and Brittney Griner is "fair." The attorney said that since Russia's ambassador to the U.S. visited Bout in October at the prison in Marion, Illinois, where he was serving his sentence, that Bout had been very confident he would be released.

Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Chinese President Xi Jinping's visit to Saudi Arabia is already producing results. The two countries have signed a comprehensive strategic partnership agreement.

[02:35:03]

It includes plans to cooperate on the Kingdom's vision 2030 program and China's Belt and Road Initiative. The Chinese leader is meeting with other Gulf leaders over the next few days as part of the China- Arab state summit.

CNN's Beijing bureau chief Steven Jiang is following developments from the Chinese capital. Good to see you, Steven. So, what's the latest on what the two nations want from and are offering each other? How much of it is about oil?

STEVEN JIANG, CNN BEIJING BUREAU CHIEF: Oh, Michael, they have just released a lengthy joint statement after the summit really aiming to take this partnership to a new level, which has been described by Chinese officials as an epic making milestone. But when it comes to this fast-evolving and growing relationship, it's about more than oil. But at the same time, nothing matters more than oil because as the world's second-largest economy and its biggest oil importer, China obviously need reliable and diversified sources of energy. Especially at a time when Xi Jinping is trying to jumpstart this sluggish economy because of the impact of the zero-COVID policy, which is finally easing.

So, Saudi Arabia plays a crucial part in this strategy. And indeed, in recent years, they have been the biggest source of China's foreign oil until early this year when Russia started flooding the global market with cheap oil after its invasion of Ukraine to counter Western sanctions.

Now, the Saudis have since reclaimed the top spot, so they very much want to keep it that way that by ensuring China remains a loyal big customer, even when competitors are offering cheaper prices. But there are geopolitical implications here as well, with reports saying both sides already talking about pricing some of the oil transactions in the Chinese currency. So, that could obviously challenge the so-called Petrodollar system, which is critical to the U.S. dollar's position as the international reserve currency. But in a way, that very much speaks to what Xi Jinping's long-standing desire to reshape the U.S.- led world order. The Saudis are keenly aware of that and trying to adapt to that, especially at a time they seem to feel they can no longer solely rely on the U.S. as a security guarantee with a decreasing U.S. military presence in the region. So that's why in their joint statement, they talked about deepening cooperation and coordination in the field of defense.

But even more notable was the language in the Chinese readout about the summit really highlighting the Saudis' support for China's efforts in de-radicalization and also the Saudis' opposition to outside interference in China's internal affairs in the -- in the name of human rights. Those are really thinly veiled references to China's policy on Xinjiang, where of course the U.S. has accused Beijing of committing genocide against its Muslim minorities. China has long denied that but having that kind of support from the world's preeminent Muslim power, A very important for Xi Jinping as something he could certainly use, Michael.

HOLMES: Yes. Yes, quite right. Steven, thanks for the update. Steven Jiang there in Beijing for us.

Peru's Supreme Court has ordered former president Pedro Castillo to be detained for at least a week, just one day after he was forcibly removed from office.

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HOLMES: In the capital, tempers flaring on the streets for a second day as riot police faced off against a crowd of Castillo's supporters, demanding he'd be set free. Castillo is accused of rebellion for attempting to dissolve Congress in a failed bid to avoid impeachment just 18 months into his presidential term. That move promptly led to his ouster and arrest. Peru's new president, Dina Boluarte, said she won't make a decision about holding early elections until she's discussed it with other political leaders.

Now in Germany, authorities say they expect more raids and more arrests to be made in the coming days as they continue to investigate a far-right plot to overthrow the government. Police said on Thursday they've identified more than 50 suspects and they're looking into others. 25 alleged members and supporters of a far-right group were arrested in overnight raids on Wednesday. Police also confiscated weapons, ammunition, and equipment like protective vests. Officials say there's no reason to assume the extremist group is capable of challenging the government as its numbers are in the double or low triple digits but the weapons and ammunition show they are dangerous.

A quick break. When we come back on CNN NEWSROOM, her heart will go on but Celine Dion's voice, for now, will be silenced. More on the rare medical condition sidelining the popular singer from performing. That's when we come back.

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HOLMES: Music superstar Celine Dion has a rare neurological disorder but says she hopes to return to the stage eventually. Dion posted a video statement saying she's been diagnosed with the stiff-person syndrome, a severe condition that affects the nervous system and causes damaging spasms even to the vocal cords. She told her that she simply can't perform the way she's used to doing. Dion's Springs shows in 2023 will be rescheduled to 2024. Her summer shows next year will be canceled entirely.

And then they were just 8. We are hours away from the first two classes of the World Cup quarterfinals. The 2018 runner-up Croatia will be challenging top-rank Brazil. The Brazilians favored to win but the Croatians' coach says his team will not give in and has nothing to fear.

And a few hours later, the Netherlands will face off against world number one -- number three, Argentina, and of course, the mighty Leonel Messi. Both teams have had blips in Qatar and both are trying to reach the final four for the first time in eight years. We will have full coverage in "WORLD SPORT" which is next.

Thanks for spending part of your day with me. I'm Michael Holmes. My colleague Kim Brunhuber, will be back in 15 minutes after "WORLD SPORT" with more CNN NEWSROOM.

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