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Russian Strikes Hit Multiple Ukraine Cities; Stocks Continue Selloff; Heavy Snow to Hit Northeast; Ethics Panel Ruling for Giuliani; Casey Jordan is Interviewed about the Idaho Murders. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired December 16, 2022 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Noting that emergency repair equipment from the U.S. and the west has now arrived there.

CNN's senior international correspondent Will Ripley joins us now from Kyiv.

Will, I wonder, tell us what the situation is like there today.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Jim, the city military administration here in Kyiv says that this capital city of Ukraine has survived one of the most massive missile attacks it has faced since the beginning of the full scale war. They say that Russia fired around 40 missiles and they say Ukrainian air defense shot down 37 of them here in Kyiv, although we did hear some explosions when we were outside, getting ready to go on the road earlier today, the air ride sirens went off. CNN staffers living closer to the scenes of those explosions also say they heard the sound of Ukrainian air defense shooting down presumably dozens of missiles that were headed towards the Ukrainian capital.

Now, we are not allowed to go to the actual scene of these attacks because the targets, we believe, are civilian power infrastructure, power stations and whatnot. But I'm standing here in the square, and you can see behind me some of the destroyed military vehicles from the beginning of this war that is going on almost ten months.

Now, this means that undoubtedly there are millions of people across Ukraine, because these missile strikes didn't just target Kyiv, millions of people who have once again been plunged into the dark and the cold. There are actually entire cities, including Kharkiv, that at one point where reported to be entirely without power. That's also the situation down in Kherson, where they've been the target of constant shelling in recent days.

There have been huge explosions reported in Russia opened territories to the east in Donetsk as well. But as far as these missile attacks go, not only hitting Kyiv, but also to the south, in Odessa, to the north, in Sumi (ph) and Kharkiv, and the Ukrainians are certainly worried about the well-being of their children. It was in recent days that UNICEF put out a report saying that the physical and mental health of nearly every single Ukrainian child is at risk, at desperate risk, because of this constant Russian bombardment.

Jim.

SCIUTTO: It's no accident. That's Russia trying to inflict suffering on the Ukrainian people.

Will Ripley, thanks so much.

Well, right now, a quick look at Wall Street. Markets opening down. The Dow down now just around 200 points. This comes a day after sharp declines yesterday. The Dow lost some 765 points, the S&P down 2.5 percent at the close. The Nasdaq also sinking more than 3 percent.

CNN chief business correspondent Christine Romans joins me now.

Christine, we have you on virtually every day. It looks like the markets don't like the combination of data they're seeing, which is, one, slowing, say, retail sales, signs of a slowing economy.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

SCIUTTO: But also the Fed saying, you know what, we're not done with interest rate rises. I mean are there worries here about a hard landing?

ROMANS: Yes. I mean, look, we are in a huge transition here, right. And the Fed has been jacking up interest rates, seven this year, and that is something that has weighed on the stock market all year, to be fair. And we're looking into next year. We know the Fed is saying they expect half a percentage point growth. I mean, basically, near a stall in the U.S. economy for next year and the unemployment rate to rise to 4.6 percent.

Jim, can I put this in perspective because, as you know, I like to kind of step back and take the big picture. It's been a tough month, down about 4 percent for the major stock averages this month. But when you look at -- for the year, we're on track for more than 18 percent down on the S&P 500. That would reverse a 26 percent gain last year.

Just look at the last three years, three very big years of gains over the past five years, the S&P 500 is up 45 percent. That's great. This year you're giving a big chunk of that back because of this new reality, the Fed is trying to choke off inflation without tilting the U.S. economy into recession. And we don't know if that's going to happen. And, as you know, uncertainty is the kryptonite to investors. And so that has been a real tough sell for the stock market.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ROMANS: So that's what we're dealing with here.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, when you talk to folks on Wall Street, the Fed missed inflation last year.

ROMANS: Yes. SCIUTTO: They were slow to get on this. In fact, they denied it was

happening. By the way, the view on Wall Street is a lot of cheap money for too long.

When you speak to folks, are you worried - are they worried that the Fed is now going too hard on interest rates, right? You know, to sort of like make up for it all, I suppose.

ROMANS: And, yes, you've heard that from some folks who - there are still others who say the Fed has gone - has been just too late and we don't know how this is going to play out next year. There are those who say, OK, now that's a lot of medicine. That's going to come - it's a wall of tightening that's going to hit sometime next year just as the economy is slowing. That's one of the reasons you have those calls for a recession sometime next year.

Jim, no one knows what's going to happen. There's no playbook for this.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ROMANS: We have low unemployment, a consumer still relatively strong. We were concerned about that most recent November retail sales number.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ROMANS: But, overall, we're in better shape today than 2008-2009. There's just -- anything could happen next year, quite honestly.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

ROMANS: So that's -- that's why stock investors are concerned. They like certainty. We don't have certainty.

SCIUTTO: And they've been swinging, too, because they were - they were up a lot for a few weeks there as folks thought that a soft landing was coming. They don't know.

ROMANS: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Christine Romans, you'll know first. I'm confident of that.

[09:35:01]

Thanks for joining us this morning.

ROMANS: Have a good weekend.

SCIUTTO: Still ahead, could Rudy Giuliani's work to overturn the 2020 election get him disbarred? Details from a disciplinary hearing that could make that a reality.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Seven states across the eastern U.S. are now under winter storm warnings heading into the weekend. The powerful system that spawned tornadoes across the south is threatening to bring ice and snowstorms from the Appalachians to New England.

[09:40:03]

CNN meteorologist Chad Myers is in the weather center.

So, Chad, I'm feeling it. It's been mostly rain here in D.C., though we haven't seen ice. There's a lot of worry about it. They salted all the roads, but that didn't happen. Do we expect it to be worse up north?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Well, the ice is gone. This is now a rain or a snow event. There's not much mix in between. But it's hard to believe, Jim, that we were talking about 60 inches of snow in Soda Springs, California, on Monday. And this same storm hasn't left the United States yet. And we are going to see significant snow across the northeast.

Winter storm warnings, as you said. Great snow to go play in, I guess, if you can get there and do it safely. But hour after hour, continuous snowfall coming down across parts of interior New England and upstate New York. And eventually even Buffalo gets to pick up a little bit of -- especially south towns -- will pick up some of this lake-effect snow as the cold air rushes in behind it. But just inches and inches in. Some spots feet of snow will be coming down across parts of (INAUDIBLE), Killington and some of those places where you can actually go play until the snow.

But behind it, much colder air. In Chicago, Cleveland, hey, you don't like the 20s and the 30s, don't go to Minneapolis on Thursday, it never gets above zero for the high temperature. That's how cold this air mass is, Jim.

SCIUTTO: That's cold.

MYERS: Yes, it is, even for there.

SCIUTTO: Chad Myers, thanks so much.

I would have taken the snow over like just like a drenching 12 hours.

MYERS: Right.

SCIUTTO: Twelve hours of rain is what we got. But, you know, maybe we'll get some later in the season. Always good to have you on.

MYERS: Good to see you.

SCIUTTO: Well, three would be domestic terrorists will now spend years in prison after they were found guilty in a 2020 plot to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer. Pete Musico and Paul Bellar must serve a minimum of 12 years and seven years respectively for providing material support for a terrorist act, as well as other charges. The alleged commander of the group, Joseph Morrison, will serve a minimum of 11 years in prison. Governor Whitmer said the sentencing sends, quote, a powerful signal. A story we followed for some time. Well, today, another story, Rudy Giuliani potentially one step closer

to losing his law license. A three-member attorney disciplinary board in Washington, D.C. said Thursday that Giuliani should be liable for professional sanctions. This after making repeated false election fraud claims while representing the former president, Trump, his campaign in 2020, as well as his efforts to overturn the election. That ruling is nonbinding, but a significant step that could eventually lead to Giuliani being disbarred. The ethics charges are focused on a lawsuit by the Trump campaign in Pennsylvania that sought to throw out hundreds of thousands of votes in the state.

Joining me now to discuss, Elie Honig, former assistant U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York.

Elie, good to have you on.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hey, Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, this took place, of course, January 6th. I mean we're coming up on two years now. And it was very public, his comments in court and elsewhere. It seems like a slow process to get to where we are, but is that normal, one, and what do you expect the final outcome to be here?

HONIG: It is normal, Jim. These processes to potentially disbar a lawyer just tend to take time. Lawyers move slowly. There may be a little bit of a glass house effect there too where lawyers are wondering, gee, where do we draw the line here and might I ever cross that line.

Rudy Giuliani has already had his law license suspended in New York for essentially lying to court. It's not final yet. And now things seem to be at least heading that direction with respect to his D.C. law license as well.

And the gist of this is this, Jim. As a lawyer, you're allowed to make creative arguments, novel arguments, creative arguments, even losing arguments. But what you cannot do is go into a court and lie and give facts that you claim are facts that are utterly false.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HONIG: And that's the essence of the charges against Rudy here.

SCIUTTO: We'll see what the outcome is.

Another big thing we're watching, the January 6th committee says that it will now release its report on Monday. As you know, and we've discussed many times on this broadcast, you have the January 6th investigative track. That's coming to an end here. You have the DOJ investigative track, and that's still very much going on.

What do you expect to be the outcome of the committee's report and does the evidence they gathered at all influence or could be used, you know, accessed for the DOJ's own investigation? HONIG: Yes, Jim, so I see this as a handoff of sorts from the January

6th committee over to DOJ, over to prosecutors. Look, the committee has done its job. They're just about out of business. Next week will be their final act. They've done really a remarkable job, I think, of uncovering facts that we did not know before about the attack.

Now, that's all they can do for the most part is make recommendations. And if there's to be real consequences, then it's got to come from DOJ. Now, will it influence prosecutors? I don't think politically the fact that the January 6th committee is apparently going to make referrals, I don't think that will influence prosecutors.

[09:45:00]

It should not. But the substance will. The evidence will. We will read that report. You can bet DOJ will read that report.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HONIG: And all the evidence in there is fair game for prosecutors to use.

SCIUTTO: Final question is timing. The former president has already announced his candidacy for 2024. We expect the sitting president, perhaps, to announce next year. We're into the 2024 presidential election campaign here. What kind of time pressure, if any, does that put on the DOJ to come to the decision on whether it's going to indict perhaps a candidate for public office here?

HONIG: The reality is there's immense time pressure, Jim. And you know I've been critical of DOJ for, in my view, taking too long to get to the point where they're really aiming at the power sources. Now, it's clear they've gotten there over the past several months. I do think that the introduction of Jack Smith as special counsel has made a difference, even in the three and a half weeks or so since he took over, you can see that the pace has remained fast, has even accelerated in some respects. He is a former federal prosecutor who practiced in Brooklyn, practiced down in D.C. So, the indicators I'm seeing are that Jack Smith understands that there's a real imperative here, Jim. As you say, the closer we get to the 2024 election, the more fraught this gets. Time is of the essence.

SCIUTTO: Elie Honig, thanks so much, as always.

HONIG: Thanks, Jim. All right.

SCIUTTO: Well, Republican Congressman Adam Kinzinger rang some alarm bells in his last speech on the House floor. He used his farewell address to slam members of his own party, saying that many of them had embraced lies and deceit when faced with false claims about the 2020 election.

Here's just part of what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) REP. ADAM KINZINGER (R-IL): Had I known that standing up for truth would cost me my job, friendships, and even my personal security, I would, without hesitation, do it all over again. I can rest easy at night knowing that I fulfilled my oath to the office. I know many in this institution cannot do the same.

Unfortunately, we now live in a world where lies trump truth, where democracy is being challenged by authoritarianism. If we, America's elected leaders, do not search within ourselves for a way out, I fear that this great experiment will fall into the ash heap of history.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: He's, of course, not alone in that view. In his own party, Kinzinger will play a role in the final hearing of the January 6th committee on Monday. And CNN's special coverage of that hearing, when we expect to see this report, will begin at noon.

Still ahead, police in Moscow, Idaho, say they have now identified a pattern in an onslaught of tips about those four murdered college students. Why they are now urgently seeking that white Hyundai Elantra we've talked about before and how they will sift through some 22,000 matching vehicles. That's coming up.

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[09:52:21]

SCIUTTO: Police in Moscow, Idaho, now say they're combing through some 22,000 registered white Hyundai Elantras, like the one you see here. Why? Well, they say a car just like that may be connected to the brutal murders of those four University of Idaho college students.

Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAPTAIN ROGER LANIER, MOSCOW, IDAHO POLICE DEPARTMENT: Through our tips, through our leads, some of the evidence that came in, we start to identify patterns. And like we said earlier, we are confident that the occupant or occupants of that vehicle have information that's critical to this investigation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now, criminologist, behavioral analyst and attorney Dr. Casey Jordan.

Good to have you on this morning.

DR. CASEY JORDAN, CRIMINOLOGIST: Good morning, Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, that's interesting. It's the first time we've heard police say they've discovered a pattern which they find impactful. You've noted that as well because it's the first time you've heard them use those terms. Why is that significant to you? What do you think it means?

JORDAN: Identifying patterns and also hearing in the same sentence that they're confident and that the information is critical is the first thing we've heard in a month that gives us hope that they might be closing in on a person of interest. So, the patterns -- and they mentioned two things, of course, that the tips from people are helping and they have been working tirelessly to check out all of the doorbell camera footage, security footage and other technology. You know, things like cell phone pings, license plate readers, if they use that technology. They are what we call triangulating, getting consistencies to hone in on this white Honda Elantra.

SCIUTTO: Hyundai.

JORDAN: Hyundai Elantra. The problem is, nationwide there are 22,000 of them.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: So now the need to (INAUDIBLE) here.

SCIUTTO: But that's nationwide. OK, this is Idaho. It's a northwestern part of the country. I mean do they have ways to zero in on this? And I wonder, those doorbell cameras, CCTV cameras, et cetera, they could be pretty high resolution. Can they capture other indicators from that car, including a license plate or other marks, et cetera, that might also help narrow it down?

JORDAN: Well, I think if they had the license plate number, they would have released that immediately (INAUDIBLE) asking for help.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: But we have to keep in mind that out of the 22,000 there - just - just, Jim, they're going to start with all the parking permits that have been issued to students and employees and vendors and commuters. And there's a lot of them. Let's see if there's any Hyundai Elantras.

But the key is, you don't just start with (INAUDIBLE) the vicinity because so many students come from neighboring states.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: And many of these students are coming in a car that belongs to their parents. It's not registered to them. But if you get a parking (INAUDIBLE) vehicle information.

[09:55:02]

And, again, I know it's rural and they don't have things (INAUDIBLE) common as we do on the East Coast, like license plates readers and things like easy pass tolls. (INAUDIBLE) all of the electronic evidence that could just narrow it down.

SCIUTTO: Yes. JORDAN: (INAUDIBLE) are appealing to the public, Jim. They want to know. And they're -- do you know somebody with a white Hyundai (INAUDIBLE) been in the area November 13th.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: That's going to help a lot.

SCIUTTO: Yes, and, you know, maybe - maybe you just have the color of the license plate and that gives you a state indicator. Lots of ways they could go.

Just very quickly, police initially said they believe this killing was targeted. You've said before that might not be the case. Have you seen anything that reinforces your read either way?

JORDAN: Statistically it would make sense that the killer was in the inner circle of the crime (INAUDIBLE). However, after a month, there would be -- they would have narrowed down (INAUDIBLE) that would be obvious. Somebody like a stalker. Somebody who had a vendetta against one of the students.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: They have been working tirelessly on this. And just the nature of the killing, it's something so (INAUDIBLE) see it very often at all. You know, we think of people like Ted Bundy and BTK and (INAUDIBLE) and Joseph Duncan. These are outliers.

The nature of this killing really does indicate that (INAUDIBLE) somebody in the inner circle or we would have found them by now.

SCIUTTO: I see.

JORDAN: So, as time goes on, we expand the suspect pool and think, really, maybe this is a potential serial killer, someone who's done it before, somebody who might do it again. And then we have to think a little more nationwide, which is why they're saying it could be a 22,000 white Hyundai Elantras out there.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JORDAN: Don't - don't just rule it out because you don't live in Idaho.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

Casey Jordan, we'll keep watching. Thanks so much.

JORDAN: Good to be here, Jim.

SCIUTTO: This morning, CNN on both sides of the southern border as migrants cross the river from Mexico, some of them now sleeping on the streets of El Paso with nowhere else to go. We're going to take you to the border live.

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