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Zelenskyy At WH For First Foreign Trip Since Russia's Invasion; Biden Admin Asks Supreme Court To End Title 42, With A Delay; Mayor Oscar Leeser (D-TX, El Paso) Discusses About Title 42's End And Migrants At The Border. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired December 21, 2022 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: We've gotten some highlights during those hearings over the summer and even a hearing and a summary of the report that they released earlier this week, we want to see how they expand on that.

One thing that we do know will be new are transcripts that they're going to release of interviews that they've conducted behind closed doors with witnesses. They've conducted nearly a thousand or approximately a thousand different interviews, some with very senior former Trump administration officials and people in the former president's orbit.

This - Victor, this is the next stage of this investigation. The Committee's work is done. It's expected that the Committee will ultimately be dissolved when Republicans take over the chamber next year and now these transcripts are really going to be a key piece of evidence in the hands not only of prosecutors, but also defense attorneys, journalists and historians.

As CNN has learned that Special Counsel Jack Smith has actually sent a letter to the Committee asking for all the evidence that is collected. The Committee has been sharing some of that. And going forward, even Trump's attorneys, they want to see these transcripts too.

Now, as I said they conducted approximately a thousand interviews. They will release hundreds of transcripts and it's going to be really interesting Victor to see which ones get released.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: All right. We're all standing by. Paula, thank you.

Top of the hour on CNN NEWSROOM. Good to have you. I'm Victor Blackwell.

Right now, President Biden and Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy are meeting at the White House. Now, this is President Zelenskyy's his first overseas trip since Russia invaded Ukraine more than 300 days ago. Zelenskyy said that he made the trip to thank the American people and to thank President Biden and Congress for helping Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE: Thank you so much for the invitation. I really wanted to come earlier. Mr. President knows about it, but I couldn't do it because the situation was so difficult. And now, if I've come - I came - I mean, that we controlled the situation and because of support - and, first of all, because of your support.

And I really - I understand that we have very important topics, and we'll discuss them everything - so many challenges in Ukraine, in Europe, in the world and from energy to the situation on the battlefield.

But I - first of all, I really - all my appreciation from my heart, from the hearts of Ukrainians - all Ukrainians.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Well, just ahead of his arrival, the Biden administration announced an additional $1.8 billion aid package that includes a long sought after Patriot defense systems and precision bomb kits. CNN's Jessica Dean is with us now.

So Zelenskyy is going to address a joint meeting of Congress tonight, just ahead of a political shift in Congress. What are we expecting to hear from President Zelenskyy?

JESSICA DEAN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Victor, this evening, we're expecting to hear more of what we just heard from him in the Oval Office thanking the President, the American people, Congress for their support of Ukraine in what has almost been the last year. We're getting right up on the one year anniversary of this war in Ukraine.

But we also expect to see him trying to bolster support for Ukraine's efforts. You just laid it out, there is a changing tide here on the Hill, of course. The House is about to be taken over by Republicans in the next Congress and there have been some Republicans, especially House Republicans that have indicated they are not willing to just blindly sign checks to send over in Ukraine funding and that is a bit of a departure as to where the Hill has been, where Congress has been and its support of Ukraine over the last some 300 days.

So we certainly think that he will be speaking to that audience as well and this comes as this war moves into the winter season, Of course, Western Europe especially reliant on Russian oil. There's just a lot of dynamics at play here. And one additional one, of course, is as Zelenskyy will be speaking, the Senate is seeking to pass this massive funding bill for the next year with $45 billion included for Ukraine within that bill that would then pass through the Senate and go to the House.

So there are so many dynamics at play, as this historic moment happens just several days before the Christmas holiday, before so many of these lawmakers head home for the holidays. So it's quite a busy day here on the Hill. Victor, what we do expect this sense of history tonight as Zelenskyy addresses this joint meeting of Congress and it is interesting too. One last thing to note, Pelosi is sending out a note last night to House members really trying to get them all to be in the chamber for what she called a special night for democracy. It will also be interesting to see how many senators are there if they're voting at the time, there had been hoped they might be able to be done and have left town but it looks like they will still be here when he speaks later tonight, Victor.

BLACKWELL: We know some of them are trying to beat the weather that may challenge travel as well. So Jessica Dean there on Capitol Hill, thank you. Now as we mentioned, this new aid package for Ukraine that President Biden is expected to unveil today will include a Patriot missile system. Now this system has been a long standing request of Ukrainians to fend off Russian air attacks.

[15:05:03]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're going to continue to strengthen Ukraine's ability to defend itself, particularly air defense. And that's why we're going to be providing Ukraine with a Patriot missile battery and training your forces to be able to accurately use it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: CNN's Oren Liebermann is live at the Pentagon. Oren, explain why this is the system that is so important to the Ukrainians. They've been asking for this for so long.

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: It's not just the capability behind the Patriot missile system, it's also the symbolism behind handing over Ukraine the most advanced, the most capable U.S. missile defense system. Patriots will be the first long range system for aerial defense handed over to Ukraine. Ukraine has already shown very good use of some of the shorter range systems.

For example, the NASAMS which is more of a medium range envelope and then there are shorter range stingers as well. They've used those very effectively and other systems to counter these Russian barrages that we've seen. But they have always looked for and requested for months now, the longer range capability of the Patriot missile, capable of shooting down ballistic missiles, drones, even aircraft that are arranged simply beyond what they have now and that's one of the reasons this is so important.

Is it in and of itself a game changer? Does it make Ukraine win this war? No. But it adds to Ukraine's aerial defense capabilities. And that, as we've seen with these Russian barrages, is absolutely critical.

The other reason this is important, it's not just the capability of the Patriot, though that is incredibly significant. It is the symbolism behind it, a statement, a definitive statement from the Biden administration that it will continue to support Ukraine, not only with capabilities, but backing it and making sure allies as well are providing the weapons and the capabilities needed for Ukraine to keep up the momentum it has on the battlefield, Victor.

BLACKWELL: Oren Liebermann at the Pentagon. Thank you, Oren.

Joining me now former U.S. Ambassador to NATO and President of the Chicago Council on Global Affairs, Ivo Daalder; also CNN's Clarissa Ward and CNN Military Analyst Col. Cedric Leighton.

Clarissa, let me start with you. Over the last 300 days, we've seen the former British Prime Minister, we've seen the leaders of Italy, and Germany, and France all traveled to Kyiv. But the first trip that President Zelenskyy makes outside of his country, he comes to the United States, and thanks the president for leading the rest of the world. The significance of this trip and making Washington the first visit.

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The significance of leaving Ukraine in and of itself is huge, Victor. This is a bold move. President Zelenskyy is someone who likes to make bold moves. Just yesterday, he was on the frontline city in eastern Ukraine and Bakhmut. Today, he has left the country for the first time since the invasion to go to Washington.

And as you say, it's no accident that this was his first choice in terms of the country that he wanted to visit. It is incredibly important for him to underscore, as you heard, in his brief remarks with the President, his gratitude and the appreciation of the Ukrainian people.

But also, it's critical to really shore up and rally support for the future, because President Zelenskyy understands that while Ukraine has made formidable and really unexpected triumphs on the battlefield, there are still many challenges ahead. It is a freezing cold winter in Ukraine. Russia is bombarding the critical civilian infrastructure there. There are many parts of the country where brutal fighting continues, where a sort of war of attrition or a grinding stalemate prevails.

And Zelenskyy knows that he is going to have to push hard to get even more weapons and even more support, if he wants to be able to kind of push this over the edge, so to speak. And he also knows that's going to be a challenge that there are changes happening next month in Congress and so that's why he's there to deliver that message, not just to President Biden, not just to the House and the Senate, but also, I think, to the American people to make that appeal on a personal level.

And in doing so, by the way, he is also sending a very bold message to the West in terms of look, we are united, we are staying the course here and also to President Putin who just earlier this week left the country to visit Belarus. And what a stark contrast that is, Victor, to see President Putin sitting there in freezing cold Minsk with Alexander Lukashenko, who's widely called Europe's last dictator and today you have Zelenskyy making this bold journey, visiting President Biden at the White House, and really a moment that does feel historic, Victor.

BLACKWELL: Col. Leighton, as we've reported here and the President said this Patriot missile system will be headed to Ukraine, it will take a lot to train the Ukrainians to use it. Is this about the attacks on the infrastructure as we go into the winter or is this about something broader than that?

[15:10:02]

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, it's definitely broader than that, Victor. And yes, it is about the infrastructure attacks. However, it also shows that the Ukrainians are going to be getting a capability that is far more extensive than what they had when it comes to high altitude targets.

BLACKWELL: Mm-hm.

LEIGHTON: This means that they can go after aircraft that they haven't been able to go after before who - that are flying at higher altitudes and also cruise missiles. Those are two of the major components that become part of what we would call an integrated air defense system. And that's what we're actually building with the U.S. and NATO was helping to build in Ukraine is that kind of an air defense system which will then give them a much better ability to shoot down cruise missiles, drones and, of course, aircraft.

BLACKWELL: The U.S. resisted this for months, should they have handed this over or given the support before now?

LEIGHTON: In retrospect, you have to say yes. But, of course, we don't really know how, we didn't know at the time how good the Ukrainians would be at fighting this. And you don't want to throw something into the mix when it's going to be lost.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

LEIGHTON: But the Ukrainians have certainly proven that they can not only win, but they can hold on to the things that we give them.

BLACKWELL: Mr. Ambassador, we saw President Biden and President Zelenskyy together in the Oval Office just a few minutes ago. They will be back at 4:30 Eastern to take questions from the press. Take us inside the rooms and the conversations that are happening now. What are they discussing? What does each side wants to know from the other?

IVO DAALDER, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO NATO: Well, they're going to be discussing the course of the war. I mean. This is the first time that the President that the both presidents are meeting in person since the war has started. They, of course, talked a lot on the phone and on VTC, video conferencing equipment, but this is different.

And they really want to take the measure of each other in some sense. The degree to which the President Biden is committed to continuing to support and the extent of that support, that he personally through Congress and the American people will deliver to Zelenskyy and the President will want to know what are in some ways Zelenskyy's goals here, what is - what are we trying to do and can we make sure that we are aligned in not only today with - and yesterday, which we have so far, but also tomorrow.

Clearly, the - Zelenskyy wants to do whatever he can to liberate his own territory, not only the territory that has been taken since the war started on February 24th, but in the eight years prior to that when Russia first invaded Ukraine, and the President Biden will want to see whether President Zelenskyy understands that there is a limit to what the United States can do, because we don't want - we cannot be moved into this war directly militarily that there's something - some limit to what we can do in terms of the support we're giving.

And that ultimately, we also want to find a way for Ukraine to succeed without necessarily leading to an escalation to the use of nuclear weapons on Russia. So this is kind of the conversation that we are having on shows like this that we're having in, within the administration. That conversation is now taking place between the two presidents in the Oval.

BLACKWELL: The picture, Clarissa, we just had up of the two presidents there, President Biden dressed in coat and tie, and President Zelenskyy there dressed like a military leader, the way we've seen him over the last 300 days of this war. He mentioned he was in Bakhmut yesterday and brought that across for military merit to the President.

What does it mean to the Ukrainian people to see their president here in Washington with President Biden?

WARD: I think actually, it genuinely means quite a lot, Victor. Both in the sense that Ukrainians are very keen to ensure that Americans understand how deeply grateful they are for all the support that they have had, and for the leadership of the U.S., because while this is a broader coalition of countries that are helping Ukraine and has really allowed them to have so many successes, there is no question that in the view of most Ukrainians, it is President Biden's leadership that has really kind of facilitated that support.

They also want, I think, to convey not just gratitude, but kind of a plea. Please don't forget about us. We understand that you have a lot of your own domestic political and economic issues that you're focused and fixated and understandably distracted by. But really, the Ukrainians want to ensure that they don't get forgotten because they understand that President Putin here is playing the long game, essentially, Victor.

He is hoping that Russia can show that it has a higher pain threshold than the West does that it is willing to suffer more for longer than Ukraine supporters will be.

[15:14:56]

And so I thought it was very interesting that on the day that President Zelenskyy goes to visit the White House, we also heard from President Putin and his defense minister making all sorts of declarations about how much more they're going to spend on the military, how they're going to beef up the size of the forces, how they're going to work on more hypersonic and intercontinental ballistic missiles, things of this nature really underscoring that they are in this for the long haul.

And so Ukrainians want to make sure that their president does whatever he can to persuade America's leadership and also the American people, that they really need to be in it in terms of their support for Ukraine as well. That, of course, remains an open question.

And as you heard, just now from the Ambassador, real questions about how does this end, to what extent does the U.S. go, there will definitely be some tough conversations had behind closed doors, even if in front of the cameras, you will see a lot of displays of solidarity, unity and partnership going forward.

BLACKWELL: And we'll see that solidarity unity and partnership I assume in the next hour when President Biden and President Zelenskyy take questions from the media. Clarissa Ward, Col. Leighton, Ambassador Daalder, thank you.

So as the Supreme Court weighs the controversial Trump era border restriction Title 42 cities along the southern border continue to face a major humanitarian crisis. The mayor of El Paso, Texas joins me next.

Plus, it's crunch time on Capitol Hill, Congress still has to vote to keep the government open before Friday's deadline. Can they get it done before lawmakers leave for Christmas?

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[15:20:52]

BLACKWELL: This is the scene of the southern border, razor wire, military blockades, families huddled around fires as frigid weather moves in. Title 42 was set to end this week, but the pandemic era order that was used to block migrants at the border is now in limbo after the Supreme Court has put a pause on it until at least Monday. And now the Biden administration is asking the court to let the policy expire, but not for at least another week.

Let's discuss now with El Paso mayor, Oscar Leeser. Mr. Mayor, thank you. How many people can you take in realistically as we watch those pictures? I'm thinking about how many thousands have been moving through over the past week, you've opened schools to take them in, what's your capacity?

MAYOR OSCAR LEESER, (D) EL PASO, TEXAS: Well, we have been having about average about 2,500 a day right now and so we're - we want to sure that people are not sleeping outside in the streets. So we've opened up two schools that had been closed, we've worked with the local school district and we're also opening up our civic center.

The federal government, called the Red Cross in and we did end up - they got here on Monday and they do have tent cots, they have blankets, they'll have jackets and they'll help us with medical and food. So it's been really important that we continue to work with the state and federal government.

BLACKWELL: Now, as it relates to working with the federal government, the administration is asked to hold off on the end of Title 42 until the 27th. Are you aware of what's supposed to change dramatically between today and six days from now?

LEESER: Victor, one thing that is really important to our community that whether it's lifted or not, we want to be prepared. One of the things that we've learned is that you need to prepare for the unknown and that's what we're doing today. By opening up the schools, opening up the shelters, working with the county, the county in the city, the state senator and our Congresswoman, we've all been working together as one. And it's actually been a really strong team to make sure that we have the proper support.

BLACKWELL: Okay. So what I hear you saying is that you are getting ready with state lawmakers and your member of Congress. I've not heard you discuss what the cooperation is with the administration. And again, have they relayed any information to you about, let's say, this holds off until the 27th, what will look different there along the border almost a week from today than it does right now as it relates to resources.

LEESER: They have, the federal government has been really good at working with us and they've given us $8 million up front to continue to make sure it doesn't come out of the tax, local taxpayers' money, so they've been working close with us.

Now, what to expect between now and the 27th, like I said, that's the unknown, but I can tell you that the numbers are starting to continue to increase. So we want to make sure as the numbers increase, and the weather continues to get colder, that we have people off the street, and we have people that have a bed and a warm blanket and warm meal.

So that's one of the things that's been really important to our community and even the citizens of El Paso have been going down in working - in helping the people that come across.

BLACKWELL: You say that the administration has given you $8 million to make sure that this support doesn't come out of the money from local taxpayers there. I wonder your reaction to what we've learned about what's described as a sizeable chunk of the $800 million in the new funding bill, a large portion of that will go to New York to deal with migrants coming in, your reaction, you're getting $8 million, they're getting a big piece of $800 million.

LEESER: And that's something that, again, we're continuing to work with the state and the federal government. But there's no doubt exactly what you're saying right now. It's a band aid on a federal issue that the federal immigration system is broken, and we need to turn around and we need to work to fix it. And it's bigger, it's not an El Paso problem, it's really, it's a problem that it's for the, all of the United States, but now it's even become bigger than United States. I think the U.S. needs to get involved and we need to talk to countries all around our area.

[15:25:02]

Because right now everything you see today and all that money you see coming in, it's really a temporary band aid of a problem that's been a long time coming and it's, again, the federal immigration system is no doubt broken.

BLACKWELL: Yes, everyone on - every angle of this is there's a need to be some comprehensive immigration reform, but it never seems to come to fruition. One more for you here, you've expressed some concerns about the barbed wire fencing put up by the Texas governor there along your border there, there in El Paso. What Gov. Abbott says is that this is the beginning of a blockade that is being built. Your thoughts on this not only staying but being expanded?

LEESER: Well, the information we've received that it started as a training exercise for DPS, the National Guard, and they continue to reach out to the asylum seekers and tell them that about every 10 minutes, they seem to go out there and talk to them and say, hey, if you go in through the bridges, the port of entry that you can come in through that way.

Now, they did tell us that the exercise will - they don't know when it will finish, but one thing that we all talk about that we need to always continue to be prepared for the unknown. Now, I don't - I can tell you that we will continue to work with all our partners, that's one thing that we need to continue to do that. And you're right, the optics are not the optics that we like. And one of the things should you know about the community of El Paso, we're a very caring community.

BLACKWELL: Mayor Oscar Leeser, thank you.

So the Senate is racing to pass this massive $1.7 trillion government funding bill in part to beat the winter storm that's coming.

CNN's Manu Raju is on Capitol Hill. So what's the latest on timing on this package vote?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that is really the big question on Capitol Hill. We do expect that this bill will eventually become law, the question is when. Even though this bill was unveiled just yesterday morning, it was 1:20 in the morning, it was drafted by only a handful of members, it's - it encompasses $1.7 trillion in federal spending, encompasses more than 4,100 pages.

It is still expected to pass the Senate as soon as today. Now the question is when, because all 100 senators need to agree on the scheduling of a vote. If not, one senator can object, it could delay things. Right now, they're negotiating an amendment package give Senator some votes, those amendments are almost certainly going to fail and then move on to the final package.

Now, this all comes amid divide within the GOP over how to move forward. The House Republican Leader Kevin McCarthy has urged the Senate Republicans not to pass this bill, saying his hand will be strengthened in the new Congress when he's in the majority. Senate Republicans don't agree with them. Many of them say he would have a harder time moving forward in a narrow Republican majority and they are pressing ahead, including with the support of Republican Leader Mitch McConnell.

Now, earlier today, Kevin McCarthy came over to the House Senate side of the Capitol and met with GOP senators in a lunch to discuss the way forward.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... bill, if they vote for this (inaudible) ...

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): I don't (inaudible) my people can stop anything in the House. One thing I think is we should work together and I think in 13 days we'd have a stronger hand with Republicans having the gavel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So - but this lunch was not contentious, I'm told. He did not urge Republican senators to vote against this bill only making his points made here. One senator told me it was a middle of the road approach. But you're right, Victor, this snowstorm could determine a lot and whether they can get this done adding a lot of urgency for senators to pass it today and potentially in the House tomorrow.

BLACKWELL: A lot to navigate over the next 24 to 48 hours, Manu Raju for us there on Capitol Hill. Thank you, Manu.

So this storm, the bomb cyclone, arctic blast, they're bringing some bone chilling temperatures from coast to coast more than 90 million people across nearly every state are under snow and ice alerts. How cities are preparing for these cold temperatures. That's next.

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