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House Committee Prepares to Release Trump Tax Returns; Study Shows Women are Better Empathizers Than Men; Sentencing for Man Convicted of Conspiring to Kidnap Michigan Governor. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired December 27, 2022 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[10:30:00]

JESSICA DEAN, CNN ANCHOR: As soon as today, the House Ways and Means Committee could release former President Donald Trump's tax history. The committee said it would release those full records after Christmas. But last week, we learned Trump did not pay any federal income tax in the last year of his presidency.

CNN Congressional Correspondent Lauren Fox is on Capitol Hill for us this morning. Lauren, you've been following every twist and turn in all of this. Is there any indication we could see those records today?

[10:35:00]

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jessica, they don't have much time left to release this information, and that's because Republicans are going to take the House of Representatives in just a matter of days. So, if it's not today, it does need to be sometime in the upcoming days, likely this week.

But here's what's holding them up. Because they need to release these tax returns without any personal information of the former president, they've had to do heavy redactions on a lot of these documents. And that's taking a little more time than maybe some had expected. What could we learn from these tax returns?

One thing that we're going to look for is that it's not just about the tax returns themselves, but it's also about the fact that they are going to releasing other documents potentially related to audits or any other work files that the IRS had on these tax returns. So, that is going to be something that could be a treasure trove of information how the IRS looked at the former president's tax returns, Jessica.

So, a lot of information we are waiting for up here on Capitol Hill today. Will it come today? I think that's the big question, but it does have to come very soon, Jessica.

DEAN: When they release it, we know you'll be on it. Congressional Correspondent Lauren Fox for us, thanks so much.

And for more now on this, let's bring in former Federal Prosecutor Paul Rosenzweig. Paul, good morning, great to see you.

I'm curious, from what you've seen from Trump's taxes thus far, and we're still waiting for the full thing, as Lauren just outlined, do you believe there was any wrongdoing here?

PAUL ROSENZWEIG, FORMER SENIOR COUNSEL FOR WHITEWATER INVESTIGATIONS: That's really too early to say. What we do know is that the New York district attorney was actively investigating that very question, and Mr. Bright closed down that investigation.

It's possible that the tax information that is released may restart that investigation, but I actually have to think that he had it already before he closed down the investigation. To not have gotten it before closing the investigation would have been irresponsible.

So, it seems likely that even though there are indications of financial structuring that are beyond the capabilities of most ordinary people, that the responsible authorities have already kind of taken a pass on this.

DEAN: Yes, that's an interesting point. Also, do you think that these tax returns could complicate any of the other investigations then that are swirling around the former president? We've got maybe from the January 6th committee or either the DOJ's investigation into those Mar-a-Lago documents.

ROSENZWEIG: It's hard to see how they would be relevant to either of those two investigations. They might complicate it only in the sense of contributing to the idea that Trump is under siege and that would be both politically bad for President Trump and politically possibly quite good for him. But as a legal matter, I think they're probably not relevant.

DEAN: Let's turn to the January 6th front for a second. How quickly do you see the committee handing over its evidence to Special Counsel Jack Smith, who's at DOJ?

ROSENZWEIG: Well, your reporter just talked about the need for speed because of the change of control with respect to Donald Trump's tax returns. The same thing applies to the committee. They go out of existence on January 3rd. So, anything they're going to do has to be done by January 2nd, at midnight, right?

DEAN: Right. And it's now, what, December 27th. So, time is ticking.

ROSENZWEIG: Right.

DEAN: Do you see any indictments on the horizon for Trump and his allies?

ROSENZWEIG: Well, that, too, is difficult to say. Jack Smith and Merrick Garland have been playing their cards quite close to the vest. But the political calendar is inexorable. The passage of time doesn't stop. If the Department of Justice is going to act, it probably has to act in the first, maybe the second quarter of 2023, in order to avoid interfering with the election of 2024 too much. So, I suspect that any decision, yes or no, will be taken before June 30th of the coming year.

DEAN: As with much of life, timing, very important here.

Paul Rosenzweig, thanks so much for your expertise. We sure do appreciate it.

ROSENZWEIG: Thanks for having me.

DEAN: Let's turn to Arizona. Democratic Governor-Elect Katie Hobbs and Maricopa County are seeking to sanction defeated candidate Kari Lake after her attempts to overturn the election. On Saturday, a judge rejected the Republican candidate's lawsuit that aimed to challenge her defeat, concluding there was not clear or convincing evidence of misconduct. Last month, Lake lost to Hobbes by about 17,000 votes.

Still to come this morning, one of the men found guilty of conspiring to kidnap Michigan's governor is being sentenced today. The prison sentence he could face, that's next.

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[10:40:00]

DEAN: A new study puts science behind something we all might have guessed, women are much better than men at empathizing with other people. Maybe you wouldn't have guessed it. I don't know.

CNN Senior Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen has been digging through the data from the University of Cambridge. Elizabeth what did researchers find here?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: So, my team, we thought this was pretty obvious, but it was really interesting to see what these researchers did. So, what they did was they actually showed people pictures of eyes, just eyes. That's it. And they asked the person, is this person frustrated, are they annoyed, are they happy, are they agitated, and you had to guess.

[10:45:06]

And there were apparently right and wrong answers, and they gave people scores for how well they could discern emotion from the eyes.

And here are the results. They did this for folks from various countries. In 36 countries, women scored significantly better than men. In 21 countries, it was about the same. In zero countries were the men better, and this was true across many languages and across age span of like 16 to 70.

So, it's really interesting that people's abilities to basically read eyes differs by gender. There's a lot of theories as to why that is, sort of women's biological roles versus men's biological roles, the environment, the world we live be in. But what's interesting is that it cut across so many different cultures. Jessica?

DEAN: Yes. That's what's so fascinating about it is that this isn't just in the U.S. or in one particular country, this was in multiple countries. I think it's also -- worth talking about why empathy is such an important trait, right? Like why are they even researching empathy to begin with?

COHEN: So, empathy is important especially when you start thinking about people where there are psychiatric or psychological issues. For example, people with autism miss cues. And so you can learn something from a study like this when you think about treating people with autism, about how they're missing those cues.

Empathy is important when you're trying to just sort of go about your life, when you're working with your family, with colleagues, reading people, reading what other people want and solving problems together, empathy plays such a huge role, Jessica.

DEAN: Yes. It is a key part of relationships. All right, Elizabeth Cohen, thanks so much.

Now, to an amazing story of kindness and empathy, you could say. A couple in New York opening their home to a South Korean tour group over the weekend after their bus got stuck in the snow near Buffalo.

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ALEXANDER CAMPAGNA, HOSTED SOUTH KOREAN TOURISTS DURING BUFFALO BLIZZARD: Early on when our guests entered our house, there was the belief that maybe this storm was about to blow over and they would just jump back on their vehicle and got on their way towards Niagara Falls, which is, in the best weather, about a 30-minute drive from our home. So, with the blizzard, it may as well have been in another galaxy.

So, once they kind of came in the house and saw that they might be here for a while, I pulled out from our freezer all of our frozen chicken and a large pork shoulder that I had purchased on special a couple weeks ago, and all of a sudden that food came in extremely handy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Wow, what a story there. The couple say they hope to visit their guests in South Korea one day. Nice to see that.

Right now, one of the men found guilty of conspiring kidnap Michigan's governor is being sentenced. We're going to have details from inside the courtroom, that's next.

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[10:50:00]

DEAN: Happening right now, one of the men found guilty in a plot to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer in 2020 is being sentenced. Adam Fox could get a maximum of life in prison for the kidnapping conspiracy. An accomplice who was also found guilty will face a judge tomorrow. CNN Correspondent Jean Casarez is joining me now with more. Jean, walk us through the charges here and what possible sentence he might face.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, let me tell you what is happening right now because they're virtually concluding. This sentencing hearing is in federal court, it is in Michigan. The judge is speaking right now and describing how his sentence is going to be, what it is going to be based on.

We don't know the sentencing but I want to tell you what he just said because this is -- the kidnapping, the conspiracy to kidnap the governor of Michigan, and that is what this is all about. And Adam Fox is the convicted defendant that is awaiting his sentencing. He's in that courtroom. He chose to not speak as the federal prosecutor was arguing. He said, look at the way he's smirking at me right now.

But the judge said that this is extremely serious and the sentence that he is about to pronounce must be sufficient but it must be a necessary sentence. It is extremely serious. The public must understand there must be deterrence in this sentence, he said, so people throughout the country cannot believe that they can do this, that they can recruit and get weapons and have training to kidnap a public official.

He went on to say that there is emotional baggage that the governor of Michigan is going to carry with her forever because of this, and there is emotional baggage that others in public office will carry forever and it needs to be a forceful sentence. But he also said that a life sentence is too much. So, let's see what he does.

But one more thing, let's look at the charges he was convicted of so you see what they are, kidnapping conspiracy and conspiracy to use weapons of mass destruction. Now, here is what's going to hurt Adam Fox. There are enhancements that the government proved, the judge believes, leadership -- was the leader in recruitment and gathering money and having meetings and having training, that there was a terrorism enhancement in all of this and an official victim enhancement that the governor of Michigan, although not a federal official, she was a governor of one of our states, and that allows for an enhancement of this sentence.

[10:55:11]

Jessica?

DEAN: All right. So, this is happening right now. Jean Carasez, we know you'll been monitoring what the actual outcome is. Thanks for laying it all for us.

CASAREZ: Thank you.

DEAN: And I want to say thank you for joining us today. I'm Jessica Dean.

At This Hour starts right after a quick break.

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