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Will Kevin McCarthy Become Next House Speaker?; Idaho Murder Suspect Expected to Waive Extradition; New York Police Officers Attacked. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired January 02, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MI): I'm an ordinary person. I have got an extraordinary job. I have served in extraordinary times. I'm a mom. I'm a daughter. I'm an average person who's trying to serve my state.

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JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Go inside the rise and fall of a political firebrand The CNN original series "Giuliani: What happened to America's Mayor?" you can see it right here Sunday at 9:00 p.m.

Thanks for your time today on INSIDE POLITICS.

Abby Phillip takes over right now.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST: A very happy Monday afternoon to you. I'm Abby Phillip in Washington.

And it's already a busy start to 2023. Right now, the man charged with killing four Idaho college students is planning to waive extradition. What more we're learning about him.

Plus, tens of thousands of people are now paying their respects in person to former Pope Benedict and soccer legend Pele, two men who meant so much to so many.

But we begin with the New Year's Eve machete attack on three New York City police officers. Sources now telling CNN the teen was on a terror watch list.

CNN's Gloria Pazmino is in Times Square.

Gloria, what more are we learning this hour?

GLORIA PAZMINO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Abby.

We have been learning more about the suspect, Trevor Bickford, 19 years old, who traveled here from Wells, Maine, to attack these police officers on New Year's Eve, not far from here in Times Square, as thousands of people were pouring into the area to watch the New Year's Eve ball drop celebration. We have also just heard from police officials who told me Trevor

Bickford has been officially charged with two counts of attempted murder of a police officer and two counts of attempted assault. Trevor Bickford remains in the hospital under police guard.

And I should also point out that he has not yet been charged with any federal crimes. That remains an option. We have heard from law enforcement sources who tell us that the U.S. attorney of New York in the Southern District was weighing whether or not to charge Bickford with any federal offenses.

Now, more about what we know of the suspect. We know that he traveled here on Saturday on an Amtrak train and traveled here to the area on New Year's Eve. He was carrying a backpack which included in its content a handwritten diary where he wrote about his desire to travel to Afghanistan to join the Taliban and his willingness to die for his religion.

Now, as we know from the investigation and what police tell us, he approached one of the security checkpoints around the perimeter here of Times Square. That's where he approached the police officers, striking them on the head with a machete. He struck a second officer. A third officer fired his weapon, injuring a Bickford in the shoulder, and he continues to recover in the hospital.

We're awaiting to learn more about the possible motivation, what exactly drove Beckford -- Bickford, I should say, to do this, and what more we can learn about why this happened -- Abby.

PHILLIP: And, Gloria, what is the latest on the condition of those officers that were injured in this attack?

PAZMINO: Yes, three police officers, Abby, including a police rookie who had just graduated from the police academy last week.

Mayor Eric Adams extremely emotional when he spoke about those three officers the night of the attack. He commended their actions for the way that they responded. He highlighted the fact that they were able to secure the area and ensure that everybody was going through that security checkpoint, despite the fact that they had just been under attack by this man.

So, those three officers have been released from the hospital. They are all at home recovering -- Abby.

PHILLIP: And that is the good news and all of this.

Gloria Pazmino, thank you so much for that report.

And let's discuss this down with Jonathan Wackrow. He's a CNN law enforcement analyst.

Jonathan, you're -- we're hearing now the latest news, two counts of attempted murder of a police officer and two counts of attempted assault, terrorism charges not included in those charges. Do you think that that will be forthcoming and why, so far, was that

not included in the charges that we are now hearing about?

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, listen, the charges that the suspect faces are significant.

Any time that you attack law enforcement officers, there needs to be consequences. But the broader theme here is, is there a nexus to terrorism? And investigator -- that's what investigators are looking for right now.

Was this act that was carried out on New Year's Eve in Times Square, was this in furtherance of some sort of ideology, and was his actions connected to some sort of foreign terror group?

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How are they going to do that? Right now, they're going through every aspect of the suspect's life, all of his connections, everything that they know about him from the digital standpoint, who has been talking to online, digital conversations, and then, really, what did the previous 48, 72 hours look like before this attack, when he traveled from Wells, Maine, to New York City? Who did he have contact with during that time that he was in the city?

So I think really the question is, was this attack inspired by some sort of ideology or was it directed by this extremist ideology that he has written about both in his diary and online?

PHILLIP: Yes, I mean, I think that's really the central question here.

I mean, the suspect was, according to our reporting, interviewed by FBI agents in mid-December. His family was so concerned, they reached out to law enforcement. He was on a terror watch list. Does it matter whether or not he was directed by foreign entities, terrorist entities? Or is it sufficient that he himself says that he wanted to do it, allegedly, in furtherance of his religion or inspired by these ideologies?

WACKROW: Well, there's a couple of things here.

First, I just want to take one step back and just talk about the alerting by the suspect's own mother and grandmother to the Wells Police Department, raising concern about this individual back in mid- December.

This goes back to that thing that we always say, see something, say something, raise concern. The thing that investigators and specifically the FBI are going to be focused on right now is, what changed? What changed from the moment that they interviewed him in mid-December to Saturday night? Was there more self-radicalization, like diving into different types of propaganda?

Or was he directed? Again, don't want to speculate one side or the other, but that's what they're going to be focused on right now. PHILLIP: Did anyone drop the ball here? He was flagged, as you

mentioned, but he was still able to travel from Maine to New York to carry out this attack.

WACKROW: Yes, I think there might be a little bit of a misnomer here when you're placed on the FBI watch list.

The FBI watch list is actually run by an entity called the Terrorist Screening Center of the FBI. And it's really a centralized repository of individuals who have been involved in terrorism or related activities.

Now, the kind of bucket his quest to seek participation in Taliban -- with the Taliban and posting all of this stuff online is the related activity side of things, but what it doesn't do is, it doesn't restrict your travel around the United States, right? He didn't commit a crime yet. But he was of concern.

His own parent -- I mean, his own mother raised the concern about him to law enforcement again. So there's different aspects of why he was placed on that on that watch list, but the restriction -- there's no restriction traveling on trains, driving in cars, going state to state.

It really raises -- it's a tracking mechanism that allows law enforcement to understand the movements of people both out -- coming in and out of the country and in other investigative techniques.

PHILLIP: I wonder, when you think about the weapon that was used here, a machete, it was not a firearm, which I think, if you think about it, probably saved a lot of people who were about innocent bystanders. Those officers are now going home.

What does it say to you that this was the weapon of choice for this individual?

WACKROW: Well, listen, I mean, I think, in terms of, like, thinking about the ease of use, right?

If I do not know how to procure a firearm and use a firearm, a machete, a sharp-edged weapon is something that's readily available, easy to get, easy to conceal. I mean, think about it. He was walking around New York City for a few days. Did he have this on him at all times?

I think this really highlights the danger to the general public that individuals who harbor these extremist beliefs and ideologies, the threat that they face to the general public.

What I want to know is, why was this location chosen? Why was that specific checkpoint? Of any other location, why that moment in time did the suspect launch the attack against these three officers?

Thankfully, they will be OK. They're recovering. And their quick action really prevented this from becoming a much worse situation than it actually was. But there's a lot of questions that remain unanswered at this time. And I think that the -- as the investigation moves forward, we will garner more information as to really what the motivation was here.

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PHILLIP: And the suspect did not die in this attack. He's still alive, and hopefully will be able to provide some answers to those questions.

Jonathan Wackrow, thank you so much for joining us.

And now on to the case of these four college students who were killed in Idaho. The suspect was arrested on Friday in Pennsylvania, and is expected to waive extradition at his court -- or court appearance tomorrow. That's according to his attorney.

CNN's Veronica Miracle is in Moscow, Idaho. And we're also learning that the family of the suspect, Bryan Kohberger, is planning to attend this extradition hearing.

Veronica, what more can you tell us?

VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Abby, that's exactly what we're hearing.

The public defender also releasing a statement from his family on behalf of them -- on behalf of them, saying that they're expressing their deepest sadness. They're also talking about how they are praying for those four families, those -- who have lost their loved ones, but they're also saying that they are supporting their son and brother.

And they want to see this process play out in the court system before they make any assumptions about what exactly happened. And what happened here, exactly what the motive is, and if there's any kind of connection between Bryan Kohberger, the suspect and those victims, well, that is information that we are told is in the probable cause affidavit.

And that's where we should learn more information, but that document remains sealed until Kohberger comes back to the state of Idaho. That's state law. And so he has his extradition hearing tomorrow. As you have said, his attorney has mentioned that he plans to waive extradition, so he could be back in the state of Idaho as early as tomorrow.

It could take a couple of days. I asked the Moscow police chief exactly what that process is, how long it takes. And he says, for security purposes, they're not going to be revealing that information. But the Moscow police chief is keeping the tip line open, because they want to learn more about Bryan Kohberger.

Yes, they have made an arrest, but they are seeking a conviction. And they want to know if anybody in this area or even across the country has come in contact with him, even all the way back to his childhood. They're trying to paint a picture of who this person is. Here's what he had to say. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES FRY, MOSCOW, IDAHO, POLICE CHIEF: Now we're at a new point. Now we know who we're looking at. We want information on that individual. We want that updated information, so that we can start building that picture now.

Every tip matters. Everything, every piece matters. So we just want our community and the nation to continue to send us that.

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MIRACLE: And, Abby, within one hour of that press conference ending on Friday where they announced the arrest, the Moscow police chief says they received 400 calls about Bryan Kohberger -- Abby.

PHILLIP: Veronica Miracle, thank you for that report.

And a deadly storm that drenched California on New Year's Eve is now headed east. Heavy rains knocked out power to thousands in Northern California, forcing several major highways to shut down and stranding drivers. Two people, unfortunately, died in that storm. And now more than 15 million people from the West Coast all the way to Wisconsin are under winter weather alerts.

CNN's Tom Sater is tracking all of this and that storm for us.

Tom, this is becoming a triple threat storm system.

TOM SATER, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Abby, it's been a terrible week-and-a- half in the U.S., I mean, the deadly cold, the arctic flash, windchills minus 60, 70, the horrific scenes in Buffalo, and then we had the tornado outbreak to the south.

You're right. The latest in a series of storms into California which gave Oakland their wettest day in history Saturday, just under five inches, dropped as much as nine. So we have seen the water rescues. There is some snow with this, but significant icing it's going to set up. It's going to drop one to two feet of snowfall.

So look at the warnings. You will see them here in pink, the advisories in purple. This is an ice storm warning to cover several states from Southern Minnesota back into Eastern Nebraska, significant, widespread icing, a quarter-of-an-inch to a half-an-inch. That's going to knock out power to possibly tens of thousands.

Then you toss the snow just above that, this is one to two feet. And that's from areas, you see it from Kansas all the way up in toward the Great Lakes. So this event is winter on the north. And, again, we have the tornado outbreaks that are possible this afternoon, Texarkana up toward the Memphis area. Tomorrow, it slides a little bit more in the South Gulf Coastal states.

But it's going to be these supercells tonight that will not only give us a flash flood threat, but the tornado outbreak. And sunset is at 5:21. So everyone in this region really needs to have their cell phone set on the advisories and their notifications, because, again, Abby, it looks like we could have an outbreak not just tonight overnight, but into tomorrow afternoon as well.

The hits just keep coming.

PHILLIP: Yes, it really does keep coming. Thank you, Tom Sater, for all of that.

And he still doesn't have the votes. Just hours before the new Congress, Kevin McCarthy's Republican opponents are vowing to block his bid for the speaker of the House. We will discuss that.

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Plus, Jeremy Renner is in critical condition, but stable, after a snowplow accident. And the latest on the film star's condition is next.

And Elon Musk just hit a new milestone, and it's not a good one.

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PHILLIP: All right, tomorrow, the new Republican-led House will be sworn in, and its first accomplishment could be a political shocker, one not seen in 100 years.

And that's thanks to a feud within the GOP over the next House speaker. The math is pretty simple. There are 222 House Republicans, and Leader Kevin McCarthy will need 218 of them to back him. That means he can lose four, just four, and still become speaker.

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But, right now, he's lost five. And at least nine others may not back him. If they aren't bluffing, tomorrow could be the first time in a century that the House has failed to elect a speaker on that first ballot.

CNN's Melanie Zanona has spent the weekend tracking all of these developments.

Melanie, where do things stand for Kevin McCarthy right now?

MELANIE ZANONA, CNN CAPITOL HILL REPORTER: Well, Abby, the math problem for Kevin McCarthy is only getting worse, not better.

And that's despite the fact that he has made a number of key concessions to his critics, including making it easier to topple the sitting speaker at any given moment. He got on a conference call last night, where he walked through a number of these changes that he is now supporting.

But on the call, he could not answer whether or not this would be enough to win him the speakership votes, despite the fact that a number of lawmakers who are frustrated by these concessions pressed him on and asked, is this going to be enough? If we support this, will you get 218? And he could not respond.

And then I think, very tellingly, not long after that call, a group of nine lawmakers put out a letter saying they are still not satisfied with these concessions. They want them to go further.

And then, today, two of the hard-liners, Bob Good and Ralph Norman, both said they are still planning to vote against McCarthy on the floor tomorrow. So, at this point, Abby, McCarthy can either try to make more concessions and more promises to try to win over these remaining holdouts, or he can just go to the floor and dare everyone to vote against him.

PHILLIP: Yes, it seems like that's where we're headed with all this.

Melanie, stay with us here.

Let's bring in CNN political analyst and White House correspondent for "PBS NewsHour" Laura Barron-Lopez.

Laura, I mean, the next question is, what does tomorrow look like? These Republicans got concessions from McCarthy. They're still holding out. And McCarthy has said he is not going to drop out after that first ballot. So, what can people expect?

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, we could very well see this -- multiple ballots on the floor.

Representative Bob Good that Melanie mentioned said today on FOX that he thinks they're going to be 10 or 15 on that first ballot that do not vote for McCarthy. And then, after that, potentially, he said a more, an alternate that people really could get behind would emerge.

But it's really difficult to see McCarthy getting the votes on the first ballot, but on the second ballot, or on the third -- how chaotic it's going to be on the floor, it's really impossible to tell right now.

I also think that it's striking that, as everyone is preparing for this potentially messy, chaotic vote, President Joe Biden is preparing this week to head to Kentucky and appear alongside Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, trying to really strike this contrast and show that, as House GOP leadership is having this messy rise to power, that he is working with Republicans on the other side.

PHILLIP: Yes, I mean, it is a contrast that really rights itself.

Melanie, I mean, to that point, a lot of Republican frustration about the chaos going in to the first day of their leadership in the House. And the fact that this could even go to a second ballot, even if McCarthy gets there, that seems to be a clear sign of weakness for him.

Can he be counted on to get the votes, just a majority, that he needs in order to govern?

ZANONA: Abby, I think if Kevin McCarthy is able to become speaker, he is going to be the weakest speaker in recent memory.

He's already given away a number of concessions, negotiated away much of his power. And, most importantly, as I mentioned earlier, he gave his critics this tool that will enable them to call for a vote at any given moment to essentially fire him.

And they are going to use that over his head any time that he doesn't do what they like. And you think about all of these issues coming down the pike that he's going to have to deal with in terms of government funding, the debt ceiling, a whole litany of things where there's going to be clashes between the conservative wing and the moderate wing.

Kevin McCarthy is going to be at the front and center at the middle of it all. It's going to be very, very difficult for him or really anyone who becomes speaker to govern over this four-seat margin that Republicans have the House and these emboldened conservative critics.

PHILLIP: And a divided Republican majority is perhaps politically beneficial to Democrats, Laura, but what about the country? I mean, what is the outlook for getting anything done in this Congress?

BARRON-LOPEZ: Well, of course, those big -- any big wish list item from Democrats is unlikely to happen. And the White House is very well aware of that.

But where this really could potentially impact Americans is the debt ceiling, is government funding. And, of course, if the country were to default on its debt, that has real life implications for Americans, especially if Republicans, House Republicans, do what they have at times forecasted that they might do, which is hold the debt ceiling hostage in order to get cuts to Social Security and other social benefits that a lot of Americans enjoy right now.

So that is where it could actually impact people on these must-pass bills that fund the government and impact the debt ceiling.

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PHILLIP: And, Melanie, as Laura said, Bob Good this morning said that he believes that there is an alternative that will emerge after that first vote.

What's the chatter on the Hill? Do you have any idea who that might be? I know people have thrown out the name of Steve Scalise, who's kind of pushed that to the side for now. But what are you hearing?

ZANONA: So, as we first reported at CNN, some of these hard-liners did approach both Steve Scalise and Jim Jordan about whether they would be willing to jump into the race.

Both of them said, no, that they're not going to challenge McCarthy outright. But in talking to other Republicans, the conventional wisdom right now is that, if Kevin McCarthy drops out and is no longer in the race, that Steve Scalise would make a play for it and that he would be the automatic front-runner. He's very conservative. He's very popular in the conference. He's McCarthy's top deputy here.

He already has a political operation and a vote-counting operation behind him. But he has been very, very quiet and very careful to not come out and look like he's trying to angle for the job. He knows that he can't. He's out there publicly supporting McCarthy. And he will not challenge McCarthy.

However, like I said, if McCarthy drops out, I think all bets are off.

PHILLIP: Yes, I mean, if McCarthy drops out, it's a totally different ball game.

But to quote Kevin McCarthy, who just spoke to reporters a couple of minutes ago, if he told us what was going to happen, it would take all the excitement away from what's going to go on tomorrow.

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PHILLIP: We will all be waiting with bated breath.

Melanie Zanona and Laura Barron-Lopez, thank you both very much.

And coming up next: a new drop of January 6 interview transcripts and text messages, what they reveal about who was in charge of Donald Trump's efforts to challenge the 2020 election results.

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