Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Chaos in Congress as House GOP Breaks Down Over Speaker Vote; Biden, Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY) to Tout Infrastructure Law in Kentucky; Uncle Says, Damar Hamlin Had to Be Resuscitated Twice. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired January 04, 2023 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And San Francisco had its second wettest day.

[10:00:01]

I know that this make you think we're done with the drought. That's not the case. This is a lot of water happening at one time and we still have a long way to go before we fix that problem. Jim and Erica?

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, that is for sure. Stephanie Elam, I appreciate it and appreciate you braving the elements, my friend. Thank you.

Top of the hour here. Thanks for spending part of your day with us. I'm Erica Hill.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Jim Sciutto.

This hour, uncertainty reigns on Capitol Hill. At noon, the new Republican-controlled House reconvenes following a first day where the presumptive frontrunner for speaker, Kevin McCarthy, was rejected actually three times in three different votes by members of his own party. One of his allies has told CNN he has about 24 hours to figure this out. We are now learning he has now asked five colleagues to lead negotiation efforts with those no votes. There are 20 of them now. We are live on Capitol Hill with all the fast-moving developments.

HILL: Also keeping a close watch on the latest developments of Buffalo Bills star Damar Hamlin. He does remain sedated at this hour on a ventilator, we're told, after experiencing cardiac arrest during that Monday night football game. His uncle telling CNN Hamlin actually had to be resuscitated twice. We're going to speak with a young athlete who survived a similar experience, as wells as the trainer who saved him.

SCIUTTO: We're also going to be live in Moscow, Idaho, as the suspect charged with first-degree murder in the deaths of four Idaho college students, could be extradited as soon as today. We just learned last hour that he has left that facility in Pennsylvania where he was.

We do want to begin though on Capitol Hill with CNN's Manu Raju. Manu, it's happening by the minute now on the Hill. Do we know where negotiations stand? Do we know if they're going to reconvene today or maybe punt again?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that is actually the big question of the hour, whether or not they'll actually come back at noon and have that fourth ballot vote. This is a very tricky proposition for Kevin McCarthy and his allies. The concern right now among McCarthy supporters is that the opposition could grow to McCarthy in that fourth ballot. If that were to happen, that can probably be very, very problematic for his efforts to ultimately get to the 218 votes.

So, that is why behind the scenes over the last 24 hours, there have been serious negotiations between a handful of key emissaries to Kevin McCarthy, as well as some of those detractors. Of course, 20 Republicans voted against him in the last round of balloting. He can only afford to lose four Republican votes in order to become elected the next speaker of the House.

So, right now, those emissaries of McCarthy are trying to get a sense of what those dissidents want, put together some sort of offer, present it to other Republicans within the conference, see if that passes muster, which is why it is very possible Republicans may try to adjourn as soon as they get in at noon, delay the proceedings maybe by a few hours, maybe by a day, we'll see what they decide to do. But that is the current discussion right now.

Now, there's also a warning among some of the more moderate members, including Congressman Dusty Johnson of South Dakota, who I just talked to about some of the concessions that Kevin McCarthy is talking about. The trick for the challenging, balancing act for McCarthy is that if he goes too far to the right, he may lose the middle.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. DUSTY JOHNSON (R-SD): There are still a number of things that I think Kevin McCarthy could do to increase trust and I think to make it more likely that he would become speaker. Now, that being said, Kevin McCarthy can't go somewhere that the conference isn't willing to go. He, I think, is firmly aware of the fact you are not going to have 10 percent of the conference dictate all of the terms of engagement and the rules to the other 90 percent. That being said, there are reasonable people who I think are trying to find common ground.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: And that is the real challenge going forward. Because even if McCarthy somehow does not emerge as the speaker candidate, steps aside and a new candidate emerges, that person would have to provide concessions to the right but also concessions to the middle of the conference. Which is why at the moment, really the only option for McCarthy and his allies is try to push ahead, somehow forge together enough votes to get to 218.

And McCarthy making clear last night and afterwards he's not going anywhere. He says he plan to say vote ballot after ballot ultimately to get there, but he needs to keep the support to get there, not to see opposition grow. And until they elect a speaker, the House cannot act. It's in a state of complete paralysis. They must elect a speaker before they can organize it all. So, this is why this moment so critical for Kevin McCarthy, the House, and the Republican Party. HILL: And critical for the country as well, right? Because as you

point out, Manu, this complete paralysis, nothing happens. I appreciate it, as always.

And as we watch this bitter fight on Capitol Hill, President Biden is set to leave for Kentucky right now, where he will be spending part of the day with none other than Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell.

[10:05:02]

SCIUTTO: Bipartisan happens. Bipartisanship happens, imagine that. He's headed to McConnell's home state, the president, to promote the benefits of that bipartisan infrastructure deal.

Let's bring in CNN's M.J. Lee. She is live at the White House. I mean, it's remarkable to see this, right? I mean, you have very public divisions inside the Republican Party in the House, and here you have the top Republican and the president standing out there and saying, hey, you know, we can actually work together. Tell us the importance of all of this.

M.J. LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Jim and Erica, I don't think they're going to quite hear White House officials say this out loud, but I do think the White House, in general, is pretty content to let all of this drama unfold among House Republicans.

And imagine the split day screen that we're going to see today, right? On the one hand, on Capitol Hill, we have this drama and infighting that is unfolding among House Republicans, and President Biden is taking off now actually right behind me to head to Kentucky where he is going to be touting this bipartisan infrastructure bill that he signed into law back in 2021 and will be joined by Republican-elected officials, including, of course, Mitch McConnell.

And, actually, a number of reporters just tried to ask him to weigh in on the House speaker's race. And he said, look, it is not my place to weigh in on the ins and outs of the race, but it's basically not a good look was the message that we got from the president.

Now, I do want to just set the scene for you a little bit in terms of this bridge that he is visiting. This is the Brent Spence Bridge, which that connects Cincinnati, Ohio, and Covington, Kentucky, which is where the president is headed.

And it has become this sort of politically famous bridge. Past presidents, congressional leaders have promised that they want to fix this bridge because officials say it carries basically double the traffic that it is meant to support. And now, what the president gets to do today when he goes to Kentucky is say, look, $2 billion from that infrastructure law is going to go towards upgrading that bridge and a number of other bridges as well.

So, again, just keep an eye on that contrast here, what is going on in Washington, D.C. today, and then what the president is doing as he launches into basically the second half of his first term. He's making it very clear that even with the new Congress, and with Congress now being divided, yes, he wants to continue to try to work with Republicans.

SCIUTTO: M.J. Lee at the White House, thanks so much.

Joining us now to discuss what's going to happen now, Jackie Kucinich, Washington Bureau Chief for the Boston Globe, and Errol Louis, Political Anchor for Spectrum News. Good to have you both on this morning.

Jackie, folks are trying to find a path forward. One of them is Republican Congressman Don Bacon, a McCarthy supporter. Here's what he told us last hour. I want to get your sense of this. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. DON BACON (R-NE): I encourage him to continue. But he may also have to start looking across the aisle to determine if there could be some compromises made on committee ratios and things like that, because if the small handful refuse to be part of the team, you cannot let them hold you hostage, and that's what they're doing right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: He's talking about Kevin McCarthy. And he said preliminary talks are actually underway with Democrats on this, granted a farfetched kind of path here. But, listen, I mean, this is all about surprises we're seeing every day. Is that a potential way out?

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: There is no incentive for Democrats to help Kevin McCarthy right now. I mean, if you looked at that floor yesterday, other than the frustration you started seeing in kind of the latter part of the day, Democrats were having the time of their lives. They just lost the majority and yet they're watching the Republicans. The only lever of government that they control completely twists in the wind and not get their acts together.

So, I would say that is probably -- you're not going to have Democrats bailing out Kevin McCarthy, particularly at this juncture, when they don't know what his fate is going to be at this point. We're just not there yet. I would be shocked. But, you know what? As we always saying, stranger things have happened.

HILL: This is true. In terms of motivation, it's interesting if we put this in the context of motivation, we also heard from Don Bacon last hour talking about how this has to be team, you heard a little bit of that there, that this group, right, they are not team players. But to be honest, Errol, this isn't about being on the team for this group, right, that maybe holding this vote, I mean, what is their motivation to blink first? They're already getting everything that they asked for if McCarthy is speaker, but, ultimately, what they want is they kind of want to disrupt the government. They don't like the way it functions. So, this is fine.

ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: They're certainly on the team. It's just that team doesn't involve actually running the government. They're in a movement. And that movement will give them accolades and pats on the back for stopping the functioning of government, for drawing this out.

[10:10:00]

So, if they push this to five ballots, six ballots, ten ballots, that will help them with fundraising, that will help them get speaking engagements, that will help them get book deals and media appearances. That's what they're looking to do. And that's the dilemma that we now find ourselves in that people not interested in running the government are controlling whether we can actually operate Congress.

SCIUTTO: To that point --

KUCINICH: If I could just add, Jim, I think the things I'm hearing from sources, what I'm hearing from sources, the concern I'm hearing from sources outside the actual House chamber is that you are going to see the moderate Republicans, the Republicans that are backing Kevin McCarthy blink first. Because as this stretches out, as they're not able to start setting up the government, those are the people that are going to start wavering as opposed to the incentive structure Errol just described for the holdouts.

SCIUTTO: So, to that point then, Errol, at some point presumably they're going to get to a speaker, many hasn't seen who that is, what does it mean for the future of this Congress, right? Because this is not the only decision they've got to make, right? They're going to have to make a whole hosts of decisions, including basic stuff like funding the government. Is this going to be a functioning Congress?

LOUIS: I can see that there could very well be a lot of chaos, Jim. Because one of the key points that Kevin McCarthy apparently already compromised on was allowing for the so-called motion to vacate, which would allow any five members or possibly even any one member of the Republican conference to put us right back where we are today with a new vote for a new speaker. And that does not speak well to their ability to get things done.

And one thing to keep in mind, just like we saw with M.J. Lee, when federal projects come through, hundreds of billions of dollars, there has to be coordination at the local level, with state government, county government, local government, and it's the job of members of Congress to sort of see that through and make sure that it happens. So, there are some real consequences here. This is not just a political fight. This is going to really will hit for real people if it goes on much longer.

SCIUTTO: Great point.

HILL: Jackie, real quickly, as we look at where we stand here, we did hear that Kevin McCarthy has now empowered five lawmakers to start talking with, I believe, it was the rebels, as they put it out there. Is that going to do anything at this point?

KUCINICH: So, it's hard to say, Erica, honestly. Because as Errol pointed out, the incentive structure is not there for them to waver. That said, perhaps some of these members have better relationships with some of the holdouts. So, maybe you see some wavering here and there. There's something floated about voting present, and that would allow McCarthy an easier path to the speakership. But, honestly, they are really stuck right now. So, they are throwing everything at this to try to shake loose at least a couple of these holdouts.

HILL: It would be interesting to see too, Don Bacon told Jim just a short time ago, he does believe that they try to give back some of these concessions since not following through on their end of their deal, interesting to see if we see that happen. Jackie, Errol, always good to see you both. Thank you.

LOUIS: Thanks.

KUCINICH: Thanks.

SCIUTTO: Of course, we'll stay on this developing story on Capitol Hill, bring you updates from the negotiations as we get them, if we get them. But up next, we'll speak live with a young athlete, and you're really going to want to hear this story. It's a young athlete who survived an incident, which may be quite similar to what Damar Hamlin is going through. What saved his life, it's a remarkable story and what his road to recovery was like.

HILL: Also, any moment now, really, the suspect in the murder of four college students could be extradited back to Idaho. We'll take a closer look at his behavior in court, also behind bars. What does that tell us? We'll speak with a criminologist, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:00]

SCIUTTO: President Biden on his way to Kentucky to visit one of the sites that's going to be impacted by the bipartisan infrastructure deal, speaking just moments ago about ongoing negotiations on Capitol Hill over the speaker and more, have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Mr. President what do you make of the fight for speaker right now?

JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT: With regard to the fight over speaker, I -- that's not my problem. I just think it's a little embarrassing that it's taking so long and the way they're dealing with one another. And the rest of the world is looking. They are looking at if we get our act together. But what I am focused on is getting things done.

And one of the reasons I'm going to Kentucky and Ohio today is to demonstrate that we get things done. We've passed an enormous bill bipartisanly, and it works, and we're starting off with the first major initiative. We're announcing today just a billion dollars. This is -- we can't be the number one economy in the world unless we are number one infrastructure in the world. REPORTER: What's your priority in Congress?

BIDEN: (INAUDIBLE).

REPORTER: And why is it so important to go to Kentucky today?

BIDEN: Why is it so important?

REPORTER: Yes.

BIDEN: We worked like hell to get the most significant infrastructure bill in our history of the United States since Eisenhower's interstate highway system. Look, I think our administration has begun to move the economy and we're investing in America again. We're the leading economy in the world. How can you remain the leading economy in the world without having the greatest infrastructure in the world? And it's just beginning.

REPORTER: And how worried would you be if the stalemate in the House goes on after today about the ability of Congress and you to govern?

[10:20:06]

BIDEN: Well, not me, it's Congress to govern.

REPORTER: Pope Benedict, what does Pope Benedict mean to you as a Catholic?

BIDEN: (INAUDIBLE).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: President Biden speaking there, as we mentioned, on his way to Kentucky, noting the importance, in his view, of the bipartisan infrastructure bill. He's visiting a key bridge there that is going to be repaired as a result of the funding, also commenting on the ongoing battle over speaker, which, of course, we're covering. And we'll have more when we get right back.

HILL: We are. There is plenty to continue covering there. You're right.

Also ahead, we'll speak live with a young athlete who survived an incident very similar to what Damar Hamlin suffered on Monday night. We'll take a look at what and who saved him and that road to recovery, what was it like for him. Stick around.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:25:00]

SCIUTTO: Well, a story here we've been following closely, I'm sure you as well. We're learning new details about the condition of Buffalo Bills Safety Damar Hamlin, who went into cardiac arrest during Monday night's football game. His uncle says that Hamlin actually had to be resuscitated not just on the field but a second time after he arrived at the hospital. He remains in critical condition there this morning. And they put him on his stomach to take some pressure off his lungs. It's interesting, Erica, that struck me, because I remember during the COVID pandemic, they would do that with a lot of patients who were going through recovery.

HILL: That's right, relieving some of that pressure.

Also overnight, we have seen such an outpouring of support, more of it in evidence at Niagara Falls, there you see it, lit up blue in honor of Damar Hamlin. Fans, by the way, have now donated more than $6 million to the GoFundMe for Hamlin's annual toy drive.

CNN Sports Anchor Coy Wire joining us live this morning from Buffalo. Coy, I know you've been talking with the team, you've been in touch with the NFL. What more are you learning this morning?

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Well, the Bills said they are going to try to get back to work today, of course, Erica and Jim, with heavy hearts. They will hold meetings. There will only be a walkthrough today, when typically this would be one of the most intense practices of the week. The team will not have any media availability either. They are still processing everything that's going on as their teammate fights for his life in the hospital.

But I do want to point out something powerful beyond measure that happened Monday night during that Bills-Bengals game, the decision to stop the game in progress represents this paradigm shift perhaps that we're seeing within the NFL in regard to player health and safety. No longer are we living in the barbaric days of looking at players as these disposable, replaceable pieces of meat. Ten years ago, five years ago, even a year ago, that game may not have stopped on Monday night. Coaches would have said, all right, fellows, buckle up, get back out there. It's time to focus, time to lock in and play on.

So, we can't overstate how impactful it was for head coaches Sean McDermott of the Buffalo Bills, Zach Taylor of the Cincinnati Bengals, the league commissioner, Roger Goodell, all those decision-makers, to make that decision to stop that game. And the players are recognizing the power in that moment as well. Here is Bills Lineman Dion Dawkins, what he had to tell us about that moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DION DAWKINS, OFFENSIVEL TACKLE, BUFFALO BILLS: I'm truly blessed that we didn't have to keep playing.

The fact that we didn't have to go back, like out there on that field and play, it just shows that there is care. And that's all that we could ever ask for, is that, you know, we get treated as people, because, you know, like most people just treat us as athletes and as superstars, and as some -- and some people like celebrities, but in that moment, they treated us like people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WIRE: Erica and Jim, I spoke with a high-ranking official within the organization late last night after a long day meetings, and they broke down crying, sobbing because of the heaviness of this situation. It has only compounded everything else the city has been through, from the senseless, racist mass shooting, to the blizzard that took the lives of dozens of people here, and the bills have always been a guiding light and a source hope for this city during tough times. It has just been a lot.

HILL: Yes, that is understandable. Coy, I really appreciate it and it's good to have you here. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, listen, sports is one thing, life is another. I want to turn now to two people who came out on the other side of an equally shocking, frightening situation, and who may be able to provide some hope for Hamlin's family and friends.

Peter Laake collapsed on the field during a high school lacrosse game. It's shocking to see this. He takes a hit with a ball on the field. We'll play this here with that warning in mind, and collapsed. Imagine his parents seeing that. Well, fortunately, his school's head athletic trainer, Jeremy Parr, he was right there with life-saving equipment, he was able administer within minutes. Thankfully, Peter is back on the field again, and the join me now from Towson, Maryland, where their school, Loyola Blakefield, is located. Peter, Jeremy, great to have you on this morning.

JEREMY PARR, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF ATHLETICS AND HEAD ATHLETIC TRAINER, LOYOLA BLAKEFIELD: Thank you.

[10:30:00]

Thanks for inviting us.

SCIUTTO: So, Peter, for folks at home not familiar with your story, I wonder if you could just say briefly how this happened.