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Biden Meets With Mexican President & Canada PM At Summit; Nearly A Dozen Classified Docs Found In Biden's Private Office; Relentless Flooding, Mudslides, Powerful Winds Batter California. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired January 10, 2023 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MARC STEWART, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is something that is going to take weeks, even months to see the effectiveness of how it unfolds.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Okay. Marc Stewart, thanks for the reporting.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Top of the hour on CNN NEWSROOM, good to have you. I'm Victor Blackwell.

CAMEROTA: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

President Biden is in Mexico City right now at a summit with the leaders of Canada and Mexico. The record breaking surge of migrants, along with how to better secure the U.S. southern border is a major focus.

BLACKWELL: Also on the agenda: Trade, economic issues, climate change and the renewed efforts to combat the flow of illegal drugs into the U.S. from Mexico.

CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is in Mexico City. Priscilla, what are the big takeaways so far?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: Well, so far all the leaders have been reaffirming their strong relationship. But it's a rubber hits the road moment when talking about what the commitments are going to be moving forward on these range of issues and first and foremost migration.

This is an issue that all three countries have to wrestle with as there is unprecedented mass movement in the western hemisphere. And the White House has been quite clear for months now that they expect that regional partners have to work together to stem the flow of migration and issue that has become a political vulnerability for President Biden on the U.S.-Mexico border and they are rolling out new measures to that effect.

One of them is a virtual portal that would allow migrants to apply for legal pathways to the United States, Mexico or Canada or at least see what they may be eligible for, serving as, for example, a one stop shop. Then too is a center that will open up in southern Mexico in Tapachula. That's a city in southern Mexico that serves as a transit location for a lot of migrants and would also provide services.

Now, of course, all of these options have to serve and be viable for migrants. Many of whom are desperately fleeing poor conditions in their home countries. And a senior administration official I spoke with said it is an experiment and they are up against smugglers, but they think that by rolling these things out and providing accessible ways for migrants to come to the United States legally, it could work.

Now this is all going to be part of the discussions between the three leaders and we'll be expecting to hear from them later this afternoon, Victor and Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: Okay. Priscilla Alvarez, thank you.

BLACKWELL: While in Mexico, President Biden was dogged by questions about the classified documents found in his private office. So it says 10 Obama era documents were made up for a briefing material and intelligence memos.

CAMEROTA: They were related, we now know, to Iran, Ukraine and the United Kingdom.

CNN's Phil Mattingly is at the White House, CNN's Manu Raju is on Capitol Hill. So Phil, what is the White House saying about this?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Very little today. We obviously have the on the record statement from the White House Counsel's office last night detailing the timeline of when these documents were discovered, what happened after they were discovered in terms of turning them over to the National Archives, who then referred the matter to the Justice Department, which started this entire review process that's been underway.

But other than that White House officials being very close lipped and in part, that's because they want to stay away from an ongoing investigation. It's been something they've been a posture they've had for most of the last two years and that's certainly the case here.

The President hasn't weighed him when he's been asked about it several times as well. I think the reality is at this point in time, given the fact that they knew that this transpired November 2nd, it's been more than two months before this became public, there are certainly growing questions and significant growing political pressure at this point. It's going to be interesting when President Biden takes questions later tonight in Mexico City, whether or not that's a sustainable position to have. But at least at this moment, no significant responses beyond what they said last night, guys.

BLACKWELL: So Manu, House Republicans now in control there where you are. How are our lawmakers responding?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, they have a lot of question, the - today the top member of the House Intelligence Committee Chairman, Mike Turner, the incoming Republican chairman sent a letter to the Director of National Intelligence Avril Haines asking for a damage assessment. Assessment of how - what kind of documents were in possession of Biden and his private office, what kind of damage it may have or may not have done to national security so they asked for that briefing.

There's also other committee chairmen too asking questions as well, including James Comer who's the chair - Comer who's the chairman of the House Oversight Committee that has oversight over the National Archives planning to send a letter to get - try to get some more information about that - what the archives has found out as well. I asked him whether or not he plans to have a hearing go public with this at all, those decisions have not been made.

There's still questions about what else they may do. The House Republican leaders, including Kevin McCarthy, the speaker would not say whether or not it should be investigated by Capitol Hill. And today his number two, Steve Scalise, tried to compare it to the situation involving Donald Trump and the documents he had at Mar-A- Lago.

[15:05:01]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. STEVE SCALISE (R-LA): So if then-Vice President Biden took classified documents with him and held them for years and criticized president - former President Trump during that same time that he had those classified documents and only after it was uncovered did he turn them back, I wonder why the press isn't asking the same questions of him as Vice President taking classified documents that they were asking President Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Well, the White House has said very little, as Phil noted as we have been asking questions about that. But the situation is, of course, different between what happened with Donald Trump and Joe Biden. The scope of the documents, the size of the documents, and whether the two had cooperated. Trump himself facing a criminal investigation, there is instead for Joe Biden another investigation that is going but it's not criminal as far as we know.

So a lot of differences in those two situations, but nevertheless, Republicans say that the Justice Department treating the president differently for the former president.

BLACKWELL: All right. Manu, Phil, stay with us and let's bring in now Joshua Skule, former FBI Executive Assistant Director for Intelligence and currently the president of Bow Wave LLC and Brian Greer, a former CIA attorney who worked with the Justice Department on investigations involving classified information.

I want to pick up, Josh, where Manu left off. We heard the Majority Leader saying, well, why is it the press asking the same questions of Biden and the administration as they did of the former president. Just contrast start out how different these cases are as you see it?

JOSHUA SKULE, FORMER FBI EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR FOR INTELLIGENCE: Yes, Victor. I see them as different in the sense that we have the President's team finding these documents and immediately revealing that they found these documents, whereas we had a failed subpoena response and a forced search warrant done in the sense of former President Trump. Where they're similar is the - both the cavalier attitude towards the handling of classified information.

CAMEROTA: Well, Brian, that leads me to my question to you because you were also involved in the Hillary Clinton classified information issue. So how easy is this? How easy is it to walk out of some secure facility, the White House with classified documents? How often does this happen?

BRIAN GREER, FORMER CIA ATTORNEY: A situation like this doesn't happen that often but more generally speaking, mishandling of classified information does happen quite a bit every day within the federal government. It's the sad reality of the situation where people are not properly trained and proper procedures aren't in place to catch this kind of thing.

And look back now we've had the last two presidential elections, the major party candidates of both parties now have all been at one time now under investigation for mishandling classified information, put all the politics aside, there's certainly an underlying problem with how we're training folks on this.

But the one thing they do tell you when you're a government is when you do mess up, the only thing you have to do is properly record it. I certainly had some instances where I messed up on something low level, I recorded it right away, I cooperated. Nothing even went on my file because of it because I was so forthcoming about it and that is what the Biden team did and they did the right thing, and that is, obviously, what the Trump team did not do and it's why they - I think, will ultimately be in more hot water.

BLACKWELL: Brian, you said - you've told our producers that there is a danger in over criminalizing mishandling of classified information, explain that?

GREER: Yes, because of the criminal statutes that are out there that are old and quite vague, almost any mishandling case could potentially be shoehorned into a criminal investigation. But going back to my prior point, because this type of mishandling happens all the time and now it's become such a political football with all three - last presidential candidates being investigated, I do worry about - while we need to take this all seriously and it needs to be investigated, I do worry about over criminalizing it things that should ultimately be security violations sometimes.

Those should be handled typically by - if you're a federal government employee - being disciplined or fired, but launching these full investigations that become political footballs is dangerous because it can disincentivize people from serving in the federal government.

We want it - but we do want to incentivize them again to do the right thing, which is report it when it happens and not to do the wrong thing, which is to conceal and obstruct, which is what Trump did. CAMEROTA: Yes, and speaking of reporting when it happens, Phil, the White House, we believe, knew about this on November 2nd, okay? So before the midterms, they reported it, they divulged it to the National Archives, which is what they are supposed to do. They did not do so to the public. I can understand why they wouldn't was there an obligation to do that before the midterms?

MATTINGLY: I heard from Republicans on Capitol Hill questioning given the proximity to the midterm elections if politics played some role in it. To some extent from what I've heard is this was related to fact that there was going to be an ongoing review.

[15:10:02]

This had been referred to the Justice Department, Attorney General Merrick Garland had advised or had asked the U.S. attorney in Illinois to start reviewing this process. And that was going to be a process that would be underway for several months. And that was a large part of why there was nothing publicly said, but I think this is an element of this.

So long as White House officials stick to the idea that they're only going to have the statement from the Counsel's Office, which was detailed in its timeline, was detailed in its breakdown of what actually transpired on November 2nd and the day after, it still leaves questions unanswered. And so long as they keep this pasture, these questions remain unanswered and that means they're going to be keep - we're going to keep asking them and certainly lawmakers are going to be asking them as well.

BLACKWELL: Manu, as we've said, according to Jamie Gangel's reporting, U.S. Intelligence memos, briefing materials, they cover topics including Ukraine, Iran, the U.S., are House Republicans interested? Is there some relevance to the content of these documents or simply their existence, the discovery gives them everything they need?

RAJU: Well, the fact - both really, Victor, than - but expect this to be an area of focus going forward, especially how the Justice Department handled this. Just in a matter of moments, the House is going to vote to create a new select subcommittee on the House, overall House Judiciary Committee. The chairman of that committee likely to be Jim Jordan who's also the chairman of the full committee.

I asked him about this yesterday. He didn't want to discuss whether he would probe this issue specifically, but they plan to look more broadly into the Justice Department, into ongoing investigations of the Justice Department has on individual citizens, including Donald Trump who is expected to be part of that probe.

So depending on how they handle - the Justice Department handles the Donald Trump investigation, how they handle this Biden probe which is different, not criminal, but different, but has - related in dealing with classified documents, expect Republicans to heavily scrutinize the handling of both situations. And if they're handled differently, expect a lot of pushback from the Republicans who wield subpoena power, plan to haul up key members of the Justice Department potentially even Merrick Garland himself as they plan to press forward with questions and hope to get answers to those questions, guys.

CAMEROTA: So Joshua, let's talk about what happens now with this, because the - John Lausch, the Trump appointed attorney who was tasked with reviewing these classified documents that President Biden's office had did so. He's finished his review. He's handed it over to the Department of Justice. How big of a problem is this now for Attorney General Merrick Garland that he was already investigating Donald Trump for this same thing and now can he say, well, not as bad with Vice President Biden?

SKULE: Well, I think this is a challenge for the Attorney General. Let me first speak about John Lausch. I work with John Lausch and I know his character is beyond reproach. So I know the investigation was thorough. So I think the Attorney General will have to evaluate where was their intent.

What we saw with it with the President was that the intent was that we found this mishandling and we immediately notified the authorities as required. We found with former President Trump was there was a failure to comply with the subpoena, which then forced the execution of a search warrant.

So I think the Attorney General will have to really evaluate the intent, as well as who had access and what was that information used for if either party was aware of the access points of that.

BLACKWELL: Brian for you, an element, an angle of that same question, does the existence of one investigation influence the treatment of the other?

GREER: I mean, in reality it shouldn't, but the practical reality is it will, politically speaking, because of the political sensitivities. But I do think from a criminal law perspective, in terms of the Department Justice precedents, as well, they are, at least based on what we know so far, very distinguishable cases where the Biden case is not one that would normally rise to the level of even criminal investigation where - but the Trump case as we've talked about, they're all the aggravating factors, most notably, is the obstruction element that make a difference.

And I think if one potential impact this could be maybe the Justice Department zeroes in on that obstruction charge and focuses on that and considers dropping charges under the espionage related to the documents themselves, but we'll see.

CAMEROTA: Okay, gentlemen: Phil Mattingly, Manu Raju, Joshua Skule and Brian Greer, thank you very much for all the expertise.

Okay. So right now President Biden is meeting with president - Mexican President, Lopez Obrador and Canadian Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau. So you can see them sitting there with their delegations. They have a lot to discuss front and center, the migrant surge at the U.S.-Mexico border. Also we're told on the agenda: trade, economic issues combating the flow of illegal drugs from Mexico into the U.S. and climate change.

[15:14:59]

Speaking of which, the danger is not over in California, severe storms have caused significant flooding and mudslides across the state. Mass evacuations and rescues are underway right now, so we're going to take you there live.

BLACKWELL: Also, the Seattle Public School System is suing the biggest social media companies accusing them of harming students' mental health. What the district wants to change, next.

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[15:19:28]

CAMEROTA: Right now, a powerful storm continues to pummel California with more heavy rain and dangerous flooding. The onslaught of severe weather is now blamed for 16 deaths statewide, 34 million people are under flood watches as this system pushes South. Heavy rain in central California drenched communities that left homes and cars underwater, thousands were forced to evacuate yesterday as downpours unleashed these torrential flooding. The rain turned the roads and creeks into raging rivers.

[15:20:00]

BLACKWELL: Crews responded to hundreds of emergency calls, first responders rushed to rescue people trapped in rising water. Heavy rain caused this massive tree, look at this, to come crashing down in Santa Cruz. Good news here, no one was injured. But officials say downed trees are responsible for at least two of the 16 deaths across the state.

Let's bring in now CNN's Mike Valerio. He's in Montecito. Mike, what do you see?

MIKE VALERIO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Victor, thankfully we're seeing these water levels start to come down in our backdrop. This is the same San Ysidro Creek that we saw on Ellen DeGeneres's Insta video that are resting a series of images of the creek very much raging and out of control, so thankfully, again, as water levels are coming down.

But we wanted to show you guys over my right hand shoulder if we can pan ever so delicately, so we do not lose our shot here. This is a boulder collection system that was built five years ago after the devastating landslides. And what you see are metal spikes in the ground about six feet tall and boulders caught by these barriers, so they do not fall into the riverbed and into these neighborhoods behind our camera.

As we zoom in, you can see a second and a third barrier with less and less of those black poles visible. Neighbors have told us that, hey, that shows that our neighborhoods are being protected. These boulders have been brought down by recent rain events and we are so glad this is here. Victor and Alisyn, we ran into a traveler who's trying to navigate around these mud filled roads to get back home north, listen to what he told us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CALLUM DUNN, SAN LUIS OBISPO RESIDENT: We were hoping to drive up north today, but yes, I guess there's much of flooding, a bunch of mudslides, so, yes, I don't want to get around, get back up north. We're going to have to go inland, get on the five and head on all the way back. It's about a six hour drive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VALERIO: And all of this water drains into the Pacific Ocean, but before it gets there it hits PCH, the Pacific Coast Highway, Route 101. One of the most beautiful drives in all of America, but that is shut down because these waterways have been raging since yesterday afternoon. Right now they're starting to come down. But the hope is that 101 will reopen in the coming days. We have a reprieve from the rain right now, but it only really lasts until Saturday.

This is one of four, Victor and Alisyn, atmospheric river events between now and next Thursday. Guys, I'll send it back to you.

CAMEROTA: It's nice that it looks sunny there at the moment for a little reprieve and we hope that it can clear out before the next one hits. Mike Valerio, thanks for walking us through all of that.

BLACKWELL: Officials on California Central Coast have now resumed the search for a five year old boy who was last seen during the worst of the storm. Authorities say that Kyle Doan was swept away in floodwaters near a river in San Luis Obispo County. Crews were forced to suspend the search for the boy yesterday after they say conditions in the area became unsafe.

Joining me now is Tom Swanson. He's the Assistant Chief of the CAL FIRE in San Luis Obispo.

Chief, thank you for your time.

Let's start with the search for this five-year-old boy, Kyle Doan. Do you have a pretty defined area that you're searching for him? What can you tell us about this search to bring him to his mother?

TOM SWANSON, ASSISTANT CHIEF, CAL FIRE SAN LUIS OBISPO: Yes, a call came in to us shortly before eight o'clock yesterday morning. We did a full swift water rescue response including over six fire engines, hand crews, we're able to incorporate an aerial search with a helicopter later on. The five-year-old boy was swept out of a truck, got stuck in a - stranded a little water crossing that was - water levels came up extremely fast and search still continues for the missing five-year- old.

The mother in the vehicle was fortunately rescued shortly after the vehicle did become stranded. And we currently have search teams out there combing the shorelines and in the water with a dive team on standby.

BLACKWELL: There were two deaths yesterday related to the storm and your county, can you tell us the circumstances surrounding those and does that number still hold?

SWANSON: Yes. We have two confirmed fatalities in San Luis Obispo County one which occurred a vehicle that tried to make it through a flooded roadway. The water was coming up. This was in the Avila Beach area, just south of San Luis Obispo and the woman became trapped in the vehicle, and then the other one occurred in Morro Bay in a boat- related incident in the harbor.

BLACKWELL: Yes. I mean, these often in natural disasters, people come out. They want to see what's happening. But in this case, the water came so quickly that people could not get out of the way of it. It rushed in so rapidly.

[15:25:01]

I checked an affiliate's maps of road closures there and there are so many across the county. Just give us an idea broadly as we show more of the video of the damage how bad it is there.

SWANSON: It rained so hard yesterday morning before daybreak. The water levels continue to rise throughout the day yesterday as we had multiple rescues and resources were spread then. Bridges were being compromised that we - where impassable trees were blocking access and egress to residences that we had to gain access to were stranded vehicles and there's only some other windows where we could work a helicopter in to get these people extracted from vehicles that were stranded on a bridge or on a closed off road.

So we just tell people just use extreme caution. With heavy rainfall, the water rises quicker than you may be able to escape.

BLACKWELL: Are there still rescues happening this afternoon?

SWANSON: We have a break in the weather window right now, which fortunately has landed itself in a positive way to our continued search for the missing five-year-old boy, that is just north of Paso Robles in and around the Salinas River Basin and where the point last scene was.

BLACKWELL: All right. Chief Tom Swanson, thank you for your time. Thank you for the work that you're doing and stay safe.

SWANSON: Thank you very much.

CAMEROTA: We have some new developments in the search for the missing Massachusetts woman. Investigators are now testing items they collected from the trash. We have the details of those next.

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