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Five Ex-Officers Charged With Murder In Death Of Tyre Nichols; Steve Mulroy, Shelby County D.A., Discusses 5 Officers Charged In Death Of Tyre Nichols; Pence Classified Documents Included Briefing Memos For Foreign Trips; Meta To Restore Trump's Facebook & Instagram Accounts After Ban; Memphis Officials Give Update On Tyre Nichols Investigation. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired January 26, 2023 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAVAUGHN WELLS, TYRE NICHOLS' MOTHER: My son -- nobody's perfect, OK? Nobody. But he was damn near. OK?

(APPLAUSE)

RAVAUGHN WELLS: He had my name tattooed on his arm. That made me proud, because most kids don't put their mom's name.

(LAUGHTER)

RAVAUGHN WELLS: But he did.

My son was a beautiful soul.

RODNEY WELLS, TYRE NICHOLS' STEPFATHER: All I know is my son was a great, great kid. He didn't deserve what he got. Now what he deserves is justice.

ANTONIO ROMANUCCI, ATTORNEY FOR FAMILY OF TYRE NICHOLS: He was a human pinata for those police officers. It was an unadulterated, unabashed non-stop beating.

PAMELA MOSES, MEMPHIS BLM FOUNDER & ACTIVIST: And I want you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) and it could have been your son, and it could have been you --

(GAVAL)

MOSES: Don't you gavel me, because I am here the tell you they can speak without the microphone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: The community outrage here in Memphis over the police beating and eventual death of 29-year-old Tyre Nichols here on January 3rd.

And the parents are speaking out about their son, telling the world really what he is like, and what they are feeling now.

We are awaiting, I should say, the Shelby County district attorney to come and speak to us.

And as a matter of fact, he is here.

And we will talk to him about exactly what this means, and the charges mean for the officers and exactly what he is expected to announce coming up in a few minutes here at 2:00 p.m. Central time here in Memphis, Tennessee.

But Shelby County come on in, sir. Thank you. Good to see you.

(CROSSTALK)

Shelby County District Attorney Steve Mulroy.

We appreciate your joining us here on CNN.

We have gotten word and also confirmation from the attorney and the court records that the officers have been charged. Can you speak to us about the charges?

And the family wanted first-degree murder charges. That does not appear to be the case.

STEVE MULROY, SHELBY COUNTY, TN, DISTRICT ATTORNEY: Right. So there are charges. I will be announcing them at the press conference in a few minutes. And I would rather not go into too much detail.

But that is the case, there are charges and the grand jury returned indictments. And we will announce all of the details in a few minutes.

LEMON: So all five officers, we are getting confirmation that they have surrendered, is that correct?

MULROY: Yes.

LEMON: All five officers have surrendered.

There are, for some of the charges, some face different charges or the same charges, but different counts or more counts than others. Can you explain that to us, and why is that?

MULROY: Well, I really can't confirm that is the case.

LEMON: You can't confirm that is the case? This is possibly a mistake?

MULROY: I think that might be.

LEMON: OK. I want to go over the charges, I want to ask you about. And you can respond what you want.

MULROY: OK.

LEMON: Second-degree murder, aggravated assault, two charges of aggravated kidnapping. What is that? That seems unusual, aggravated kidnapping?

MULROY: Yes. And I will go over this at the press conference.

But aggravated kidnapping, as a general matter, is anytime you unlawfully restrain someone's liberty or confine them. And the aggravated part of it is either you're in possession of a deadly weapon at the time, or you cause physical injury at the time.

Then is that, even in an officer-involved situation, at some point, the detention, which might have started out as a lawful one, becomes an unlawful one.

And then that person is unlawfully confined and that is kidnapping. And if either bodily injury ensues or weapons are involved, then it's aggravated kidnapping.

LEMON: Two charges of official misconduct, one charge of official oppression. What is that?

MULROY: Official misconduct is whenever an official intentionally exercises authority that is unauthorized by law in the performance of their official duties.

And there's another part of that same statute, it says, if you are under a duty imposed by law to do something, and you don't, then through your inaction, you are also engaged in that same offense.

So, law enforcement officials who are on duty have an affirmative obligation to prevent unlawful detention and unlawful injuries as well as it's unlawful to do it actively as well.

LEMON: I have covered this year -- and you can see Shimon and Sara over there -- and we have covered a number of these stories sadly.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: At this point, to see officers charged with second-degree murder, aggravated assault, that is highly unusual. And as I said, the family wanted first-degree murder, but second-degree murder, that's serious stuff.

Why? Does that speak to what is in the video? Go on.

MULROY: Well, it does, indeed, Don. You are right. This is serious business. These are extremely serious charges.

And you are correct to saying that these are more serious than the typical officer-involved fatality case. But I think that after everyone sees the video, there's not going to be a question about the charges.

LEMON: Several things, pointed that I wanted to make sure and I wrote them down.

Do you anticipate charges against more people? Because there are fire department individuals involved in this. [14:35:01]

MULROY: So actually, that is something that I will be handling at the press conference.

But I'll say this, that the investigation is ongoing and the fact that there are certain charges announced today does not preclude more charges made later on.

LEMON: So, let's talk about the video. Is it body cam video or from a stationary position? What is it?

MULROY: Both.

LEMON: Both. How many different sources of video do you have?

MULROY: Multiple sources of video.

And I think that it is fair to say that when the public release occurs, and I think that it is going to be soon, and people will be able to see the entire incident from beginning to end, including the first encounter and then the second encounter in which the serious injuries occurred.

LEMON: How much is there, and how long are the videos?

MULROY: I think that what is going to be released -- and this is really a question better directed to the city of Memphis. But my understanding is that when the city of Memphis releases the video, it is somewhere in the neighborhood of an hour.

LEMON: An hour of video?

MULROY: Yes.

LEMON: So will it be redacted or edited in any way?

MULROY: Yes, yes, there have to be redactions, Don, to protect the privacy of any civilians, individuals who were not on-duty city employees that were involved.

So you may see a face blurred. Someone mentions a phone number, you may see, you may hear bleeps. But the redactions will be limited and only directed towards protecting the privacy of third parties.

LEMON: I have a source who said, close to the investigations, that the video is going to be released tomorrow, and there are negotiations between your office and the Memphis Police Department to make sure that you have this all in order, and that you want to coordinate it.

MULROY: Again, information that I think will be best discussed at the press conference.

But I can definitely say that we have been in constant consultation between our office and the city of Memphis, and that the release of the video will occur relatively soon after the conclusion of my press conference with the formal announcement of the charges.

LEMON: Why is it taking so long?

MULROY: We wanted to make sure that the video did not going compromise the investigation.

If you're going to be interviewing suspects, you do not want them to the video and then possibly tailor their statements to the video.

You want them speaking to law enforcement without knowledge of what we've got.

Similarly, you don't want non-suspect witnesses to start testifying about what they remember seeing on TV as opposed to what they witnessed with their own eyes.

That's no unusual. That's not typical of this case. It's just the general rule.

LEMON: Yes. And one of the producers is speaking to me.

Can you repeat that so I can ask the district attorney while he is here?

Any other -- oh, yes. Yes.

That is not related to the video, but I wanted to ask anyway. Will there be other charges on top of this, and can the charges escalate?

MULROY: Well, so, both with respect to other charges against the persons who have already been charged or charges against other persons, that is always an option, and that can always happen later on.

But I will say this. The investigation is ongoing. Nothing that we have done today precludes any further charges.

LEMON: Nothing today precludes any further charges.

Why haven't we learned the names of the fire department folks and who they are? Why is that?

MULROY: That is a good question. I think that's better directed to the city of Memphis. We are not charging them today so we are only talking about the people who have been charged today.

LEMON: Thank you.

MULROY: Thank you.

LEMON: And we know that you have to go in and do the press conference. And we appreciate you coming in. We'll learn in the coming hour.

MULROY: Thank you.

LEMON: We really appreciate you joining us. Again, Victor, there you go. You heard from the Shelby County district attorney, Mulroy, here.

Again, it's very cold out here so I am tearing up here, because it is freezing cold out here.

But there you go. You're going to see what happens in moments when the official announcement here of the charges.

But he gave us good information of why they are charging, and what we will see on the video, and that video being released, he said, very, very soon.

And according to my sources, the video is supposed to be released tomorrow. They're trying to coordinate that with the district attorney's office and with the police department.

And also, he gave us information regarding the other two people who are involved in this from the fire department, why haven't they been named and charged and what is their involvement in this as well -- Victor?

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Fascinating interview. A lot of clarity there on those charges.

I know you had a conversation with Elie about that aggravated charge. We now understand why that is included on the list of these officers, the former officers now.

Don, we will get right back to you.

And of course, we will be bringing that news conference with the D.A. at the top of the hour.

Back with us now, CNN senior law enforcement analyst, Charles Ramey, and CNN senior legal analyst, Elie Honig.

Elie, I'll come straight to you on what you heard there, what stands out from the D.A.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, the big news is they have brought very serious charges here, second-degree murder charges.

Just to reiterate, there a first-degree murder charge available under the Tennessee law. The D.A. chose not to bring that. The family apparently wanted that.

What differentiates that is first-degree murder under Tennessee law is premeditated. And second-degree murder, which is charges, shows a knowing murder.

[14:40:00]

Again, I think it's really significant that the D.A. has brought murder charges as opposed to lower charges of voluntary or involuntary manslaughter. The other interesting thing, and we have clarity on the kidnapping

charges, which is to restrict a person's movement in a way that could, where there's a weapon involved or they sustained bodily injury --

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: No longer have freedom of movement anymore because they're being held.

HONIG: Exactly. And what makes it aggravated is there's a weapon and/or injury involved.

And the D.A. explained to Don a little more detail about the official misconduct and official oppression, as it is called in Tennessee law, charges.

These are the flipsides of the same coin. Official misconduct means you are a public official, a police officer or anything else, and you violate your duty in a criminal way. And oppression refers to the inaction.

And we don't know the facts, but we have seen other cases like this where some of the police officers were charged not necessarily for what they did, but for a failure to render aid.

There's five officers charged here. If it turns out that one or two of them did not physically assault the individual, but failed to render aid, that is where that charge of official oppression comes in.

BLACKWELL: The D.A. did not want to step on his own announcement, so there's not the full narrative of what happened on January 10th, but giving some clarity of the charges and the timeline.

What did you take away from Don's interview?

CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, multiple video available, both the body-worn cameras and some stationary cameras.

And so, approximately one hour worth of video. Probably a lot of inaction in that hour period of time. And so eventually it is going to be edited down to show exactly what took place in terms of the force and that sort of thing.

They have a strong case here. A lot of evidence. And I can just tell from the way that everyone is talking about this that it is something that really is -- it is pretty severe in terms of the actions of the police officers.

So we will be seeing the video ourselves pretty soon. I imagine that they were waiting to get everything in line, the charges, you know, the firing of the officers first, the charges, all of that sort of thing.

Don had asked me earlier about if it would make a difference if the officers were black and the suspect is black. I think that if anything makes a difference in terms of the public's

reaction to this is the swiftness in which the officials are dealing with this, both the firing, the charging, and everything that is going on right now.

If it does make a difference, it is because of that.

BLACKWELL: This incident was on January 7th, and Nichols died on January 10th from the injuries related.

Last question to you, Elie. What is your expectation on bail for these officers?

HONIG: This is a big question for the prosecutors today. Will they agree to let these police officers out on bail pending trial, which is months away, or will they seek to have these police officers locked up pending trial?

I will tell you, it varies by jurisdiction, but typically, in a second-degree murder, in a knowing murder type case or the equivalent, you would seek to have them locked up.

That is a difficult decision that the D.A. is going to have to make.

BLACKWELL: Elie and Chief, thank you, both.

FBI Director Chris Wray did not mince words today when address the recent classified documents controversies, warning that those with access need to be more conscious of the rules. We'll have more on this ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:47:40]

BLACKWELL: Well, now to a CNN exclusive. Some of the classified documents found in the Indiana home of former Vice President Mike Pence were briefing memos meant to prepare him for foreign trips.

CNN's Evan Perez has been following the developments.

So what more do we know about the documents found at Pence's home?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Victor, what we know is these documents are of a lower classification in comparison to what we've seen in the Biden investigation, the investigation of classified documents that were found at the home and of the private office of President Biden.

And of course, the hundreds of classified documents that were found in Mar-a-Lago at the home of former President Trump.

We know that the documents were described as briefing memos before the vice president was meeting foreign officials on foreign trips. And so that is a very common thing that would be prepared for him. BLACKWELL: Do we know, after this news conference, if there will be

another special counsel for these documents found at the vice president's home?

PEREZ: We don't know yet, right, Victor? But it does raise an important big question for the Justice Department and the attorney general, Merrick Garland.

He hasn't said so far what he plans to do. But talking to people at the Justice Department, you get the sense they view this case of former Vice President Pence a lot differently.

Because it doesn't raise the same conflict of interest concerns that former President Trump and, of course, Joe Biden raises for -- for the attorney general and the department.

Vice President Pence has not said that he's going to run for office at this point.

So at this point, at least, the Justice Department I think is viewing this in a different -- from a different lens.

And so we'll see whether there are more documents found or additional information that comes forward that forces their hand on this -- Victor?

BLACKWELL: Evan Perez for us in Washington. Thank you, Evan.

PEREZ: Thank you.

[14:49:32]

BLACKWELL: President Biden is speaking right now after a better-than- expected GDP report, and some promising jobs data. We're monitoring it for you. We'll bring you that live. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: Just in time for his third White House run, former President Trump is now allowed back on Facebook and back on Instagram. He was banned more than two years ago for inciting violence on January 6th.

CNN's Donie O'Sullivan is watching this for us.

So why did they make this decision?

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: As you mentioned, he was banned from Facebook and Twitter at the time. There was a fear he would insight further violence.

Facebook has said all along, Meta has said all along that after two years they would consider putting him back on the platform.

Now they said how they would decide to do that is to kind of take the mood, the pulse of the nation, and they determined, they said they believe the threat of further violence in this country has receded.

Which, you know, I think folks could argue with that. But they said they no longer see a threat there posed by Trump.

[14:55:00]

And they also make the point that, look, this is going to be a campaign for 2024. The public should be able to hear from him, good, bad, and ugly.

They say they're going to have some more guardrails in place, that he could get kicked off again.

But one of the kind of weird parts of all of this is he is allowed to still lie about the 2020 election.

BLACKWELL: OK.

O'SULLIVAN: But he's not allowed to lie about the 2024 election.

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: Well, that makes it all better.

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: It's all good now.

O'SULLIVAN: So you see what I'm saying? He's still undermining the election integrity and whatnot.

But look, as he imagined, partisan sides of this, and people are saying it's good he's back. It's not good.

I think the ACLU came out with an important statement, saying, look, we have many issues with Trump, but META made the right decision here, he should be back on, people should hear from him.

BLACKWELL: We'll see if he actually uses the platforms. He's allowed back on Twitter, but he hasn't tweeted since Elon Musk ended that suspension.

O'SULLIVAN: Yes.

BLACKWELL: Donie O'Sullivan, thanks for that reporting.

Any minute now, the Shelby County D.A. will give an update on the Tyre Nichols case. We'll bring that to you live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: We're back now live in Memphis as we await the press conference from the Shelby County district attorney, Steve Mulroy.

Let's listen in now.

OK. OK. So listen. Just to be really honest with you, we're out in the field. I can't see the pictures. We don't know what's going on.

I'm told there's a podium there, and we are awaiting his arrival, and other officials who will speak to that.

Meantime, let's bring in my colleague here, Sara Sidner, who has been covering this story.

So, Sara, we are waiting here. We saw the D.A. came out moments ago and really explain what is going to happen, what he's going to announce, and gave us sort of the pre-press conference here.

SARA SIDNER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I do want to mention because the --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: We'll go back.

[14:59:43]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- Tyre Nichols and former MPD officers.

Immediately upon learning about this, D.A. Mulroy, Shelby County district attorney, Steve Mulroy, enlisted the assistance of the TBI to determine if excessive force had been used.

And since then, the D.A.'s office has worked with TBI, and we will continue to do so.

Today, you will hear from D.A. Mulroy, along with the director of TBI, David Ralph.