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Migrants Refuse to Move from NYC Hotel; New TikTok Savings Challenge; Run, Hide, Fight May be Out of Date; Cost of Health Care in U.S. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired January 31, 2023 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:31:53]

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Dozens of migrants at this hour are camped out on the sidewalk outside of a hotel in midtown Manhattan. They're there because they've refused officials' attempts to move them from that hotel to a larger official shelter in Brooklyn.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: And this is why. Video shows cots packed tightly together in a large shared space. Some of the migrants told CNN they are worried the Brooklyn Cruise Terminal shelter will be cold, uncomfortable and inconvenient for those who work.

CNN's Polo Sandoval is outside the Brooklyn Cruise Terminal shelter.

Polo, I wonder what you're hearing there and what are the options? I mean is the option to try to extend them in this hotel? Is that even possible?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: At this point, Jim, they say that that's absolutely not an option. And, you know, one official told me that they completely understand that many people - they basically did become very comfortable being in these kids of settings, in a hotel setting in Manhattan. It was close to any potential job opportunities. However, city officials also are very aware of their legal obligation to house families and mothers with children in those kinds of private environments, in those hotel rooms. So, the reality is, they are the ones that have to take a priority when it comes to offering those kinds of accommodations.

As for the single men, these asylum seekers, city officials maintain that this is the best they can come up with right now given what is still a very challenging and fluid situation, which is this large barracks-style housing facility.

And I spent all day yesterday speaking to these migrants outside of the Watson Hotel, many of whom say, you know what, they're going to -- they'd rather sleep on a sidewalk than come here. And it's not necessarily about comfort, it's about convenience. Many of their potential job opportunities are in Manhattan. So, being relocated to this part of Brooklyn, a cruise ship terminal that is not very easy to get to if you don't have transportation, that just presents yet another obstacle.

So, it really is a very complicated situation, not only for these adult male migrants that are being asked to relocate from Manhattan here to Brooklyn, but also for the city that's trying to keep its head above water when it comes to finding housing for well over 70,000 homeless people. This includes those chronically homeless and also the tens of thousands of recently arrived asylum seekers.

I want you to hear directly from Mayor Eric Adams as he actually visited this particular site here, trying to put any concerns among those asylum seekers at ease.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR ERIC ADAMS (D), NEW YORK CITY: I just had to come here when I started hearing all the rumors about it is too cold. My brother got on shorts. (INAUDIBLE). It's warm inside. About the food not being there. You know, healthy food is present. Even the snacks are healthy. We just need to stop the anxiety.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANDOVAL: And that was what I heard from one official is that they do believe that there was some misinformation that was circulating amongst some of the migrants, that they do have this opportunity, they do have a warm place to stay. I spoke to one individual, Erica and Jim, as they were walking out this morning. They were going to take a bus into the city to try to find employment. They told me at least they have a warm place and a roof on top of their head. But there's so many others that are so reluctant to relocate.

[09:35:00]

HILL: Polo Sandoval, appreciate the reporting. Important. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Today meetings at the Federal Reserve begin with the central bank expected to raise interest rates again tomorrow, but importantly this time by much smaller margin, a quarter of a percentage point. A lot of the raises we've seen recently have been three quarters of a percentage point. Still, another rate hike will still make borrowing, including mortgage rates, likely more expensive.

HILL: And we know it's not just the borrowing cost that folks are focused on, it's the price of everyday items, like eggs. I feel pretty confident you've likely had a conversation about egg prices in the last week or two. And that's raising concerns and questions about just what and how much Americans are saving, which brings us to the latest TikTok challenge. The 100 envelope challenge.

CNN's Christine Romans is here with me.

So, this is an effort to get people to save, which I know, Romans, having known you for almost 20 years, how important saving is to you. This may not be the best solution to your savings.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: But I'm telling you this hashtag has 150 million views. So, this is financial advice via TikTok, so I'm going to put it right there. Essentially it's 100 envelopes. And, you know, the more aesthetically pleasing and beautiful the envelopes are, because it is TikTok and social media, that's even better. You make it look pretty.

In the first day you put $1 in an envelope. The second day you put $2. The third day, $3. You go like this for 100 days and you will have actually saved $5,050, right, on the 100th day you're putting it - so, that's - that is saving money. But in 100 days a lot of people don't even make $5,000. So, you know, this is - you're putting all of your saving for the year into 100 days.

And it looks like it has results. And it is - it has inspired some people. I saw a TikTok video of one woman who did it three times. So, she saved more than $15,000 in just like six months or something.

HILL: Wow.

ROMANS: But it feels to me a little bit like a fad diet when you want to have healthy eating all the time, right, and proper nutrition and exercise. This is putting it all in one 100 day span. Remember, it's always important to be saving. If a TikTok video gets you to save a little more, especially for young people, I'm all for it, but maybe you could stretch it out over the year.

SCIUTTO: I mean there's the obvious safety problem here, it's not in a bank, right?

ROMANS: Yes.

SCIUTTO: It could be stolen. And there's not - I mean, granted, interest rates - savings interest rates are way low, but it's not earning -

ROMANS: Yes.

HILL: Put it under your mattress, Jim, it will be fine.

SCIUTTO: It's not earning interest. I mean there's a reason they say don't put it under your mattress.

But, Christine, you've written several books about money, ways to save. What are the tips you give to folks out there?

ROMANS: Well, look, I hear - I hear from a lot of the young people that the higher interest rates and the higher rent prices in particular and they think that this year they'll probably have to start paying their student loan minimums again. Like they're worried and I get it and they just say I just can't save. I'll be able to save later.

I just want everyone to remember, the younger you are, the more money you will save. If you save $5,000 a year from the age of 25 to 65, you will have a $1.2 million nest egg. You've just got to consistently and early be saving. You've got to burn less than you earn. And you have to just figure out how to live a little bit below your means, invest the - invest the difference. Don't just put it in an envelope, but really save and invest. And that's financial freedom, especially for young people who think they're just -- they can't get out under these bills.

SCIUTTO: Yes, there's automatic saving deposits I think you often hear they help, right, because you don't have to make a decision every month to put a certain amount of money into savings.

HILL: Yes.

ROMANS: Critical. They're critical. Yes.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HILL: Right. It's just like automatically you're - you know, if you -- if you have the benefit of a 401(k), automatically choosing that amount, choosing your savings. A little bit goes a long way.

Christine, thanks.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

All right, something we've been following closely, run, hide, fight. That has been law enforcement's advice for the last decade for civilians who might find themselves caught in active shooter situations. But now some security experts say it may be time to rethink that strategy. How? And what might that mean for you? We'll discuss more coming up.

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[09:43:11]

SCIUTTO: For more than a decade the FBI has urged people to run, hide and only as a last resort fight when an active shooter attacks. But with the shear number of mass shootings we've seen in this country, some security experts say it's time to change how we respond. Of course, when you look at this, Erica, what I think is they're putting an enormous onus on average people to risk their lives in these situations.

HILL: They are, but there's also renewed discussion when we look at everyday heroes like Brandon Tsay, right, the man who disarmed the Monterey Park gunman in California, and that is also giving some credence to what experts are saying needs to say.

CNN's Brynn Gingras joining us now.

So, law enforcement officials, perhaps not surprisingly, they are not necessarily united on what should be the protocol here.

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right.

SCIUTTO: Should it change or should it not. But just discussing it is sort of an important first step. GINGRAS: Exactly. And you guys hit it right on the head there, it's

not an easy conversation to have. It's not like we should be telling people that they should always fight. The point is that these -- this advice was sort of made by the FBI since Columbine. Well, a lot has happened since Columbine. They've learned from actual examples in active shooting. And so the idea here that is sort of spreading along -- among law enforcement, that's becoming louder than a whisper, is maybe we should retrain our brains, rethink of how we respond in an active shooting situation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GINGRAS (voice over): this is the moment Brandon Tsay fought back.

BRANDON TSAY: He was preparing his weapon to fire.

GINGRAS: Disarming a gunman in Monterey Park, California.

In Colorado Springs, it was an Army veteran.

RICHARD FIERRO, ARMY VETERAN: I needed to save my family.

GINGRAS: Who helped wrestle away a gun from a shooter at Club Q nightclub, saving countless lives.

James Shaw Junior disarmed an active shooter inside a Tennessee Waffle House in 2018.

JAMES SHAW JR., STOPPED ACTIVE SHOOTER IN 2018: The decision to fight was because there was nothing else - there was nothing else for me to lose in that moment.

[09:45:02]

GINGRAS: With seemingly daily mass shootings in America, more people are fighting their assailants, heroic acts that now have some in the law enforcement community opening saying --

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: The time is now to rethink how we prioritize what we're telling people who might find themselves in a mass shooting.

GINGRAS: You've probably heard these three words, run, hide, fight.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can survive a mass shooting, if you're prepared.

GINGRAS: Those tactics from the FBI are echoed to law enforcement agencies across the country. They're used to teach civilians about how to react if confronted by an active shooter. Security expert Juliette Kayyem penned in a recent article that advice may be dated.

KAYYEM: Look, run if you can, get away if you can, but what we've seen is that engagement with the shooter, trying to distract him, trying to demobilize him, trying to prevent him from reloading his gun, all of those things can help in minimizing the harm. DEPUTY MIKE FETHEROLF, FRANKLIN COUNTY, OHIO: Fifty percent of active

shooter events end before law enforcement get there. It doesn't even matter how much we train for these active events, but it matters a lot on how we train our civilians.

GINGRAS: Franklin County Sheriff's Deputy Mike Fetherolf has already adopted a different way of teaching his community on what to do in an active shooter situation.

GINGRAS (on camera): You teach avoid, deny, defend.

FETHEROLF: Correct.

GINGRAS: How is that different from run, hide, fight?

FETHEROLF: Hide, that's the big part that is different. These people go around looking for targets. And when you have a hero step up, it saves all those targets from being potential victims.

GINGRAS (voice over): Experts recognize fighting back hasn't always worked. In 2019, a North Carolina college student charged a gunman and died. A week later, a Colorado high school student met the same fate.

For Shaw, who lived when he fought back --

SHAW: Everybody's not wired like that. But if that's the only thing that you can do in that situation, that's the only thing that you can do.

KAYYEM: The more we understand what tactics of engagement do work, the more we can empower people to help and protect themselves.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: Well, Brynn, I have to ask a question here because basically they're saying charge a highly-armed individual, right, which I suppose I could see that, asking that of an adult perhaps, but of children? I mean is the advice for kids in schools to confront an adult with a gun? I mean is that -- are they going to say that to my 14, 12 and seven-year-old?

GINGRAS: Yes, look, this is why it's a very uncomfortable conversation to have, right? The whole idea, though, is to have a plan in place. It's not - we're not - they're not saying, you know, the advice is to charge someone. The advice is really to rethink what you might do in that situation. And those two examples that I gave you with Brandon Tsay and James Shaw, listen, both of them froze, which is what most people do in those situations, but then something clicked in them and they found the opportunity to go after the gunman.

That deputy actually - that deputy that I also interviewed actually said, think about it this way, if you're in an active shooter situation and 20 of you in the room have this mentality of, we can fight this person, you might have more luck disarming them than waiting for law enforcement because we've seen law enforcement cannot do their on their own, and that's the point. HILL: There's also - anecdotally, Brynn and I were just talk about

this in the break -- my 16-year-old had a lockdown drill at the high school yesterday, and we talked about it. And what he said to me is, mom, I would run. I know where the exits are. My teachers basically said, if you guys want to run now instead of hiding, that's fine.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HILL: Which brought to mind a conversation, Jim, I shared this with you, that the two of us had after Uvalde, when my son also said to me, mom, when I look at the people who are coming to schools to shoot them up, and I'm paraphrasing here, but at 15 years old he said, they've been doing the same drills I've been doing my whole life.

GINGRAS: Yes.

HILL: So, they know where to find me. So if they want to kill a lot of people, they're going under the desks, they're going in the closet. I'm not giving them that chance.

GINGRAS: Yes. And that's what law enforcement says.

HILL: They're already rethinking it as kids.

GINGRAS: Yes, they're rethinking the kids. And we've had so many examples since then, Uvalde, Parkland, where we've seen it works.

HILL: Yes.

GINGRAS: Disarming this individual, even though it is a very uncomfortable conversation or advice to give.

SCIUTTO: It's a lot to ask of a child.

GINGRAS: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Brynn Gingras, thanks very much.

Coming up next, a terrifying moment caught on tape as -- well, plus, as the U.S. spends four times the amount of -- on health care, as most other high income nations, a new report shows we're not any healthier.

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[09:53:18]

SCIUTTO: So, listen to this, the U.S. spends the most money on health care among high income countries, but still has the worst health outcomes. That's the conclusion of a new independent report. And among the countries studied, America had the highest rate of people with multiple chronic diseases.

HILL: I mean, look, sadly, this is not surprising.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HILL: CNN health reporter Jacqueline Howard joining us now.

We know the U.S. spends a lot on health care, but there is not a push for preventive care and, frankly, access to affordable health care in this country.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: Exactly, Erica. And like you said, this is not surprising because even though we spend the most, more than $10,000 per person, we don't have easy access for all Americans. Many people can't afford the medical services they may need.

And when we look at how we measure up against other high-income countries, we're spending two to three times more than South Korea, New Zealand, Japan. You see on this chart, we're an outlier. And yet we are seeing more chronic disease. We also have the highest rate of avoidable deaths.

When you look at deaths caused by assault, again, we're an outlier. We have an assault death rate that's seven times higher than most other high income countries. So that's what's eye-opening here, Jim and Erica. And, sadly, we're spending more but yet we're seeing more lives lost as well.

SCIUTTO: Yes, and this has been a consistent message for some time. Other studies have indicated the same. Do the researchers have specific recommendations to help improve the outcomes from all that money?

HOWARD: They do. One of the researchers, Munira Gunja, she says this, quote, Americans are living shorter, less healthy lives because our health system is not working as well as it could be. To catch up with other high income countries, the administration and Congress would have to expand access to health care, act aggressively to control costs, and invest in health equity and social services we know can lead to a healthier population.

[09:55:13]

So that's their takeaway message here, Jim and Erica. And we'll see what happens moving forward and how lawmakers may respond.

SCIUTTO: Yes, and it requires a lot of big policy change.

HOWARD: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Jacqueline Howard, thanks so much.

Well, nearly 1,000 flights already canceled, icy roads snarling traffic - look at this poor guy -- as the major winter storm slams much of the south and central U.S. All that just ahead.

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SCIUTTO: Top of the hour this Tuesday. I'm Jim Sciutto. HILL: And I'm Erica Hill.

Happening right now, a dangerous winter storm bringing a triple threat of ice, sleet and snow to many parts of the south and central United States.

[10:00:05]