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More Than 6,000 Dead As Rescuers Dig Through Debris For Survivors; U.S. Analyzing Debris Recovered From Suspected Spy Balloon; President Biden To Test Reelection Message In State Of The Union Address Tonight; House Questions Aviation Officials And Leaders After String Of Issues; Interview With Pete Buttigieg. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired February 07, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:37]

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR: Hello. I'm Abby Phillip in Washington.

Right now, a desperate search for life, a race against time and an escalating death toll in Turkey and Syria. 41 hours have now passed since a powerful 7.8 magnitude earthquake devastated the region. And experts say the critical window to find people alive in this rubble is now closing.

More than 6300 people have died in this tragedy. And the scope of the destruction is must terrifying. Take a look at these buildings. They among thousands that have collapsed but amid grave discoveries there is still hope that keeps crews going.

This little girl was rescued earlier today after being trapped for more than a day.

CNN's Nick Paton Walsh just filed this report from the region.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR (on camera): Here in Kahramanmaras, the town closest to the epicenter, there are two simultaneous rescue separations going on as light begins to draw in. In there, a 64-year-old woman. Her son heard her voice, he says, this morning. And he thinks she's in fact still lying in the bed where she was when the earthquake struck but they're patiently digging in there, taking a pillow for comfort.

I think you can see over here some emerged, just being retrieved from the wreckage. A scene constantly unfolding around us here because there is a desperate local need for more government help and they're doing a lot of this themselves.

The second rescue attempt that's happening is just up there, a 12- year-old boy has been found healthy in the rubble. And the rescuers are having to dig their way in slowly down towards. But let me just show you while we still have light here. Quite how far the devastation is. Very few of the apartment blocks in this area are standing. A building over there seems to have basically split and fallen in two. And here excavators and bare hands in turn being used to try and get

to anybody who might still be alive because the hours are running short, the light is running out. It is bitterly cold. And you can see everywhere fires people have already lit to try and keep themselves warm in these conditions. They will just get worse as were the chances of them being able to pull their loved ones out.

But it's startling to see people who were living here, quite in peace, just over 24 hours ago. Now one man I just spoke to, a testament to how people having to deal with their tragedies very much themselves, actually showed me the feet of his relative, whose body still trapped in the rubble. They tried to give it some dignity by covering it with a blanket. But stories like that, across the wreckage here.

Just a small attempt there by some people to get under the wreckage and try and help somebody, it seems. Extraordinary bravery and persistence despite the lack of resources they all have around here. But just you get a feeling of quite how devastating that earthquake, probably the worst for about 100 years to hit Turkey or the region, the full force of it, taken by this part of this town here, utterly startling devastation.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIP: Incredible devastation. And it is really impossible to put into words the level of despair. But this picture really shows it. It is a father holding the hand of his 15-year-old daughter as her body lays trapped beneath that rubble. Unfortunately, sadly, she did not survive. But nightfall has now set in bringing even more challenges.

Becky Anderson is now joining us live from the scene where she's been all day.

Becky, where do things stand right now?

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Yes, and those challenges you're talking about are well and sort of shown here at this site. We've been here for about four or five hours between this site here and one about 50 yards up, which is a live search and rescue site at the moment.

[13:05:08]

Abby, this one has actually stopped for the time being. I'll tell you why. The building behind me, and I'm just going to get Charbell (PH) to show you here, was a seven-story building. It has now collapsed to four. So three of those stories are completely devastated.

And as we understand it, there are or were some 24 people in this building, four, a 3-year-old, a 7-year-old, and two adults, were pulled out alive earlier on today. But the search and rescue had been going on here until just about an hour ago to try and retrieve those who were still unaccounted for. But they had to stop because they are now too concerned about this building here. They believe it is about to collapse. And they've been moving us slowly, even as I was waiting to talk to

you, away from the building because it's really in danger of collapsing even further. And that is one of the challenges that these teams are facing at this point.

As Nick rightly pointed out, you know, the search and rescue goes on. And that while where there is a will, there is a way, of course. And we are seeing people still being pulled out alive. But as the hours go on, and we're into the 41st, 42nd hour at this point, and in these bitterly cold conditions, sadly, that hope is running out somewhat.

They just turned the lights off around us here which suggests to me that they have a real significant concern about the building. So I'm just going to walk away and get Charbell (PH) to walk with me so just to ensure that we are safe. Bu yes, I mean, it's heartbreaking, and the rescue that we've been watching just up the road -- and Charbell, if you just want to open up.

If you can see the crane up there, the petrol station and the crane, Abby, in the dark, that is a live search and rescue going on as I said. And unfortunately they just pulled out another person who didn't survive that. But they are still hearing voices on that side. And while they hear voices, they are just going to continue with the search and rescues.

And it isn't as of yet a recovery situation, but given the conditions here, it's likely that this will become recovery at some are point very, very soon -- Abby.

PHILLIP: Yes, and Becky, I hope that you and your team continue to stay safe. The danger is not entirely over, as you raised those concerns about these buildings that are still unstable.

Becky Anderson, thank you so much. And continue to stay safe over there.

And the earthquake victims in Turkey and Syria are facing a nightmare, but you can help. You can go to CNN.com/impact to find out how you can do something for those victims as well.

And now on to the suspected spy balloon or what's left of it. China says that the debris belongs to Beijing and not the United States, even though they violated U.S. airspace. Officials are now analyzing the wreckage that's been fished from the Atlantic Ocean just off of the South Carolina coast but China has hinted that it wants this debris back.

CNN's Carlos Suarez is in North Myrtle Beach for us.

Carlos, what is the latest on the search that the crews have been undergoing for the last couple of days now? What's been recovered?

CARLOS SUAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so, Abby, we know that some of this debris has already been turned over to the FBI up in Virginia. The military earlier today put out several photos showing just some of the debris that's already been located a few miles off the coast of South Carolina.

Now we are about 21 miles north of the main debris search site at an area that has become quite clear is being secured, is being prepared for the possibility that what is still out there at sea will most likely be brought to this location.

We're talking about a boat ramp and a parking lot that the Navy has been using for the last three days to preposition a lot of their equipment, a lot of their personnel. Earlier today, this morning, we saw them bring out four boats that eventually made their way toward that search site. The crews they all had some pretty heavy equipment as well as some oxygen tanks.

Now, in that actual debris site that's about a half-hour drive from where we are, we're told that crews there are using underwater equipment to scan the bottom of the ocean there to get a clearer picture of all of the debris that still remains. They want to get a good sense of what is out there, before they start the difficult process of getting all of that debris up on to a vessel that will either bring it to this location, we believe, or they might go ahead and just take it up to Quantico up in Virginia, where the FBI and other agencies are no doubt going to analyze every single piece of debris associated with this balloon -- Abby.

PHILLIP: Carlos Suarez, thank you very much for that report.

[13:10:03]

Now, back here in Washington, it's a big night for President Biden. In just a few hours he's going to head to Capitol Hill and deliver his second State of the Union address as president but it will be his first since Republicans took control of the House of Representatives.

Biden's agenda, popularity and his potential 2024 run, all hang in the balance as he addresses Americans tonight. Last year, we should note, nearly 39 million people tuned in. So a massive audience for him.

CNN's chief White House correspondent Phil Mattingly is joining us now from the White House.

So, Phil, so much is riding on this speech. President Biden ever, you know, a meticulous preparer for speeches like this. What are you hearing about what he's doing back in the White House?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, actually stayed at Camp David a couple hours longer than anybody expected him to. Yesterday, throughout the day today, hasn't had any public events. He's been working through last-minute edits, expected to go through a full rundown -- run-through of the remarks with his staff before he heads over to the Capitol tonight.

Look, I think you really hit on a hey point here, and that's the number of people that are watching this. Obviously the in-person audience is 535 members of Congress, the Cabinet, top military officials. The real audience, the audience that the president wants to connect with here both in laying out what he's believes he's accomplished over those first two years in office, particularly on the legislative wins that he's had, but also laying out what he thinks he can accomplish going forward, and where the progress has been and where the job is not done, and why he believes, not just in the next two years, but perhaps the next six years, he's the one to be able to complete that job.

Now, look, this will certainly be a speech that includes policy proposals. We can pull a couple of them up right now, talking about making permanent the Child Tax Credit, passing a law to ban certain junk fees. Really critical issues that the president has talked about in the past that probably don't have much of a bipartisan path forward.

If you look at who will be joining the first lady to view the State of the Union address, you get another view into some of the critical components of the president's speech. Obviously the mother and stepfather of Tyre Nichols as the president will address police reform in his speech. The Ukrainian ambassador who attended last year as well, essential component of the foreign policy elements of the president's speech.

The hero in California in one of the latest mass shootings as gun control or the idea of banning assault weapons will be in the president's speech again. But I think it's more about the broader message here. And that, while the thematic consistency will certainly be there, the president attempting to connect about what's been done, what's happening right now, and what's possible going forward, it's the messages we're familiar with, Abby, but I think the broader country, those 30 plus million people I think the president wants to reach tonight, particularly as we wait for a potential reelection announcement in the weeks ahead.

PHILLIP: Yes. I mean, often on any given year, the State of the Union has one of the biggest audiences the president will have, certainly as we approach a presidential cycle.

Phil, thank you so much for all of that.

And let's keep the conversation going now with Geoff Duncan, the former Republican lieutenant governor of Georgia, and Nayyera Haq, the former White House senior director under President Obama.

So, Nayyera, I wanted to ask you, I mean, Phil was just talking about this balance between the accomplishments, the progress, and what is left to be done. How do you think President Biden is going to tackle that?

NAYYERA HAQ, FORMER WHITE HOUSE SENIOR DIRECTOR, 2014-2016: Well, he's certainly going to tout the fact that he is coming into the State of the Union address with a record strong economy, unemployment low across all indicators and for all demographics, but he still has some work that has not been done. He had promised coming in that he would pay particular attention to the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act.

Just two weeks ago we saw another black man killed at the hands of police. And we once again saw two black senators, Tim Scott the Republican, Cory Booker the Democrat, talking about the need for comprehensive police reform but they have that sticking point, qualified immunity, that Republicans still haven't been able to move passed.

So how is he going to be Biden the uniter, the one who will lead the country forward, the one who has strong relationships with Republicans in the past, while also being a president who can help us heal from racial trauma and division?

PHILLIP: And Geoff, you know, Speaker McCarthy will be sitting behind President Biden. That's going to be a major difference from the previous years. He is in my sense under pressure taking adversarial tone with Biden. I'm curious about what you think we can expect from the kind of tone of the room, the optics of it all. We've seen in past years some members getting up and screaming from the audience. What are you expecting in terms of just the demeanor of Republicans in that room?

GEOFF DUNCAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, it's going to be interesting to watch how President Biden disguises the fact that this is probably one of the most important campaign speeches he's ever given in his life. I mean, the one thing Democrats and Republicans are united on is they don't want Joe Biden to be the Democratic nominee. And I think it's going to be interesting to see how he plays up his wins and his losses.

You know, there's a huge divide between -- I keep hearing a lot of Democrats talk about the wins and the successes of Joe Biden. Those to main street America feel like D.C. wins.

[13:15:03]

They don't feel like wins at their jobs, in their communities, at their kitchen table, their retirements, their -- you know, whether or not they're going to lose their jobs, their house prices. So it's going to be interesting. It will feel like a campaign event in my opinion, in listening to President Biden talk.

PHILLIP: And Nayyera, I mean, to Geoff's point tonight, the president is probably going to tout the economy. There have been some seemingly conflicting, you know, messages coming from it. But the new polling shows just 41 percent of Americans say that they're not as well off as they were before Biden was president. And only 16 percent say that they are better off. So unemployment is down, jobs are up. But are you worried that the Biden's victory tone on those metrics will not address what you're seeing in those poll numbers?

HAQ: And also the idea that people are worried about the price of eggs. Right? It's no longer about gas prices, it's about household goods and the fact that the dollar just doesn't simply go as far as it used to. And that people feel that when they do their weekly grocery shopping. That's going to be the challenge that he has managed to so far navigate by his tone, by his compassion, and the personality that he's able to bring to the table and connect with the American public.

That's it's not about the numbers, it's about the delivery at that point. And he has also tied that to that broader sense of stability. That coming into this administration it felt like there was chaos. We have now dealt with pandemic issues, we have come out a potential recession, mitigated for that. So what's next? Right? Are we out of this threat to democracy? Is there going to be accountability for an insurrection that we all saw unfold.

This is part of the legacy of the Biden administration that he's going to be teeing up for the next two years.

PHILLIP: And, all right, Geoff, you rightly pointed out this could be really a dry run, right, for President Biden's 2024 run. Right now his standing with voters is not great. His approval numbers are still kind of low 40s but it just strikes me, this is sort of the narrative that we had going into the midterm elections and Democrats kind of overperformed. So is there a risk here that Republicans could be underestimating Biden at this point in his presidency?

DUNCAN: Certainly there always is. And I think Americans on both sides of the aisle, all sides of this situation are going to be watching two things to President Biden's performance tonight. The performance of what does he actually say. That seems to be pretty predictable, right? I think he's going to talk about his legislative wins, he's going to talk about some of the successes. He's going to maybe take a trip down some fool's gold and talk about how the economy has completely recovered.

But the most important part, I think most Americans are going to be watching, is how does he actually perform? Right? Does he walk up to that stage and does he act like a bold confident, young, acting 80- year-old commander in chief? Or is he a weak, tired, worn-out 80-year- old want to be commander-in-chief? I think that's what America is going to be watching tonight.

PHILLIP: You make a good point. I mean, how he delivers this speech is going to be critically important tonight, and we will all be watching.

Geoff Duncan and Nayyera Haq, thank you both very much.

And you can join me and our entire team tonight for a live coverage of President Biden's State of the Union address led by Anderson Cooper and Jake Tapper. It all starts at 8:00 p.m. Eastern Time right here on CNN.

And right now, lawmakers are grilling top transportation and safety officials on the recent air travel chaos. What is being done to prevent another meltdown at the airport. We'll ask transportation secretary Pete Buttigieg up next.

Plus, living nearing a toxic smoldering derailed train just got a little less terrifying for an Ohio community. Why the threat of a deadly explosion is now, thankfully, off of the table..

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:22:50] PHILLIP: Happening right now, top aviation officials are testifying over on Capitol Hill. This is all prompted by a string of serious air traffic issues recently, including an FAA computer outage that caused a nationwide ground stop, Southwest holiday meltdown and two near collisions.

CNN's aviation correspondent Pete Muntean is joining us.

Pete, so what are you learning from this, obviously, very timely hearing, given all of the things that have been going on in terms of aviation recently?

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Super timely, Abby. And the fact that this is happening right on the heels of this near collision on the runway at Austin International Airport on Saturday, when two commercial airliners almost landed on top of each other. This is the issue that keeps coming up during this hearing. And what's so interesting is that we heard from NTSB chair Jennifer Homendy, she says this could have been so close to a yesterday.

Yesterday she told me that these two planes came within 100 feet of each other. But she just testified that there's a similarity between this latest case and the incident of three weeks ago when two planes almost hit each other on the runway at JFK, an American airlines flight pulled out in front of a Delta flight and was taking off.

The issue in both of these Chair Homendy says is that the cockpit voice recorder times out after two hours leaving investigators without some critical clues that they need in order to piece these two instances together. The NTSB wants that up to 25 hours as a regulation by the FAA but it is not active just yet.

I want you to listen to NTSB chair Jennifer Homendy as he describes how critical this would be.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENNIFER HOMENDY, NTSB CHAIR: The data isn't available to our investigators due to the current time limitation. We've recommend the that the FAA require new and existing aircraft have 24-hour recorders. The ability to have accident data from cockpit audio as well as image recorders is critical.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MUNTEAN: The NTSB chair adds this one big thing, that FedEx crew that almost landed on top of the Southwest plane that was leaving Austin, she said they went around unprompted. She says that very well could have saved 130 lives -- Abby.

[13:25:14]

PHILLIP: Wow, that is really terrifying. Pete Muntean, thank you so much.

And here to discuss this and more is Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg.

Secretary Buttigieg, thank you for joining us. And Secretary --

PETE BUTTIGIEG, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: Good to be with you. Thanks for having me.

PHILLIP: As Pete just laid out, what just happened in this near collision in Austin, a similar thing happened in JFK. Safety is supposed to be, you know, the crown jewel of the U.S. air transportation system. What's being done to prevent these things from happening? And as you heard Pete say, there's not a recommendation that these cockpit voice recorders be left open basically for 25 hours. Is that going to happen, in your view?

BUTTIGIEG: So it's certainly something that I'm asking FAA to look at, especially knowing that the technologies have evolved since that cockpit voice recorder first became something that was required and standardized on aircraft. Both we and the NTSB need good data to be able to understand what is happening in these situations and piece together sometimes split-second decisions and the different concerns that play out over those scenarios.

We have an extraordinary record of safety in our skies. Most years, even in a country that will see more than 100 people die on our roadways every single day. Something else we're very focused on dealing with. A typical number for passenger airline deaths in many recent years is zero. It takes a lot of work to keep it that way. And we need to make sure that we continue advancing, as we see more and more demand, more and more complexity. More and more technology coming into the national airspace.

It's one of the reasons why this year is going to be an especially important year for us to be working with Congress. FAA is coming up for reauthorization. It means there's going to be an opportunity to make sure we have the funding, the people, the organization, the budgeting that is needed to accelerate the kind of modernization that has been under way for a very long time, and frankly needs to be accelerated. And to make sure that we're staying ahead of some of the things that could impact safety in the future.

PHILLIP: And speaking of the FAA, the FAA doesn't have a permanent administrator right now that President Biden's nominee Philip Washington hasn't even received a confirmation hearing on Capitol Hill. With all of this going on, are you confident that he will be confirmed for that post?

BUTTIGIEG: We are very eager to see Phil Washington confirmed. He's a terrific leader, not just in terms of his direct aviation experience running the Denver Airport, but having the kind of experience that I think really fits the needs of the FAA at this moment which is understanding how to work in large complex public sector agencies and guide them forward.

As you mentioned, the president first nominated him for this very important role in July of last year. He was renominated for the new year. We are hopeful of a Senate hearing and a favorable Senate vote very soon. The acting administrator and the team at FAA are working very hard and doing phenomenal work. There's no substitute in any part of the federal government for having a confirmed leader in place. And that's exactly what we need to get to with Phil Washington.

PHILLIP: And just switching gears here a little bit to the suspected Chinese spy balloon. It was a recent bright spot for the FAA in coordination with other agencies on this. But I want to ask you about this other incident that was revealed where another balloon traversed the U.S. airspace in the Biden administration. I'm wondering was that detected in real time? And are you and the administration confident that these vulnerabilities and how we monitor our airspace have now been rectified?

BUTTIGIEG: So the part that I can speak to is the relationship between the FAA and our national security teams including the military and the Pentagon. And there was a great example of that in the coordination that went on, to make sure that as this incursion and eventual shootdown took place that there was no damage and no risk to aviation. Remember, this is not just an issue being concerned about any risk to life and property on the ground. But also anything in between.

The very high altitude that this balloon was flying at and all of the commercial aviation and general aviation activities that were going on between the ground and that high altitude because of course anything that was -- that was falling, would fall through that airspace. It's one of the reasons why there was the close coordination set-up from early in the process. And then ultimately that led to the decision to close, or set up ground stops at three of the airports nearest that location where the shootdown ultimately took place.

It did lead to about, I believe, about 55 flights being delayed. But ultimately, that our most important goal, which, of course, is safety.