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Lawmakers Briefed on Spy Balloon; Balloon Originally Flagged as Not Urgent; Storms Move East; Search for Survivors Grows More Desperate; Rep. Mike Quigley (D-IL) is Interviewed about the Chinese Balloon; Biden to Visit Florida. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired February 09, 2023 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:00:32]

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Good Thursday morning. I'm Erica Hill.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Jim Sciutto.

Happening right now, House lawmakers on Capitol Hill receiving a closed door, classified briefing on that Chinese surveillance balloon. This as CNN has new reporting on when U.S. officials were first warned about the threat. All of it sparking sharp criticism of defense and intelligence officials who were not immediately aware of the depth of that threat. We're going to be live on Capitol Hill with the latest.

Plus, incredible stories of survival out of Turkey, including an infant pulled from the rubble after 68 hours. Small signs of hope there in the midst of so much devastation. Rescue workers, among so many things, they're facing freezing temperatures, a lack of water and power. The death toll, just hard to imagine, now surpassing 17,000. CNN is on the scene.

HILL: And back here in the U.S., on the road again today. Cue the 2024 election music. President Biden headed to Florida, where he is expected to drive home his pledge to protect Social Security and Medicare. We have a preview of that trip just ahead.

We do want to begin this hour, though, with the latest on that Chinese spy balloon. CNN congressional correspondent Jessica Dean is on Capitol Hill, CNN national security reporter Natasha Bertrand also with us with some new reporting.

Jessica, so as we - as we are hearing, lawmakers, of course, wrapping up this classified briefing. What more do we know about what they may have learned?

JESSICA DEAN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I was just down there, Jim and Erica. I talked to Congressman Dan Crenshaw of Texas, a Republican. And I asked him what, if anything, he could share. He said he really didn't feel like he learned anything new from the briefing. He said there were some more nuances that he learned. And I asked him if it had really changed his thinking at all about any of this. And he said, no, his thinking really remains the same. But, again, that is just starting to break up, so we'll be hearing from lawmakers a little bit more. But they have been getting that briefing this morning.

They are the first of several big things happening on The Hill surrounding this whole topic. The full Senate is going to get their briefing later this morning. So, we're expecting to hear more from them once they learn more.

We're also keeping an eye on a couple of hearings that will be happening in the Senate, both in the Foreign Relations Committee and then also a subcommittee of the Appropriations Committee. They are looking both at the spy balloon itself and then also U.S./China relations. So, this is a big topic. And, of course, as you both know, lawmakers here on both sides of the aisle have wanted more information about all of this and have been talking a lot about it since it happened. So, again, this is kind of the first we're seeing of them beginning to get some of that information from the administration and from officials.

SCIUTTO: Yes, the question is, are they learning that this was more of a threat than they initially realized or communicated.

DEAN: Right.

SCIUTTO: Natasha, you have new reporting this morning on what seems to have been an early warning about the approach of this balloon. What do we know and how concerned were they at this time?

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Jim, so essentially the day before this balloon actually entered U.S. airspace over Alaska, the Defense Intelligence Agency, which is essentially the intel arm of the Pentagon, they sent what's known as a tipper (ph). Basically, just a short classified report that is disseminated across government channels and flagged that a foreign object had been detected and that it appeared to be heading towards the United States.

Now, this was not viewed as particularly urgent because, as we know now, the U.S. has surveyed a number -- surveilled a number of these balloons in the past. They understand that these are part of the surveillance program and they have never before posed a physical or military or national security threat to the United States as such. So, this report was not briefed to the highest levels of the U.S. government. That President Biden, for example, did not see it at the time.

But then what happened was, as that balloon entered U.S. airspace over Alaska, crossed into Canada, it turned a sharp turn south and it started going towards Montana. And at that point U.S. officials said, this is a little bit strange. We haven't seen this before. And, of course, Montana is home to a number of very sensitive sites.

So, that is when concern started growing. And we are told that NORAD actually did send fighter jets up to make a positive identification of this balloon to figure out whether it was indeed what they believed it was.

Of course, later on, on January 31st, President Biden was finally briefed that this balloon was over Montana.

SCIUTTO: Right.

BERTRAND: But the initial urgency was not there because they simply did not believe that this posed a threat to the United States.

SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean is there a sense now - and I suppose this is what the briefing will be focusing on in part, that this is part of something bigger and newer.

[09:05:01]

Natasha Bertrand, thanks so much. Jessica Dean, on The Hill, to you as well.

HILL: We are keeping a close watch right now on a system that is possibly responsible for spawning three tornados because it is moving east. So, take a look at some of this footage here. It was captured yesterday in a Louisiana parish that was under a tornado warning.

SCIUTTO: One of our affiliates captured -- well, what has become painfully familiar aftermath considering the power of these storms. This, what you're seeing here, happened just hours later. Officials have been surveying all that damage today.

CNN meteorologist Chad Myers joins us now.

Is there more threat from this today, Chad?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: You know, probably five times more threat yesterday than today. And we only had four tornados yesterday. So, not really the emphasis that we saw yesterday. But there will be some storms out there that could spin a lot like this. Likely an EF-1, possibly EF-2. The Weather Service will be out there later on today taking a look at what exactly happened.

These were not very strong structures in the first place here with wind reports of 18 reports of damage. They did block off some things. They did have damage on the ground. And even some of the areas in the Tangiapoa (ph) city itself, not just the parish, did receive some damage.

We've seen things kind of calm down here in the morning hours, but that's expected. We expect those big storms to fire up in the heat of the day, in the warmer part of the day. There may be even some weather across the Ohio Valley. Already seeing some wind reports from up there. Could be a little bit of lightning as well, but probably not much.

Seeing some snow on the backside, as we talk about all the time with winter-type severe weather. On the north side there's snow and on the south side there's severe weather. But high wind warnings posted here for parts of the Great Lakes, with wind gusts over 50 to 60 miles per hour.

Taking you ahead to the day. And we warm up the day. As we move into just all green, light rain, all of a sudden, by later on today we start to see some more color. And even for tomorrow we see more color. So, there's the potential for some of these storms to put down some smallish events, but we're still going to have to watch them because as we always say, guys, it only takes one in the wrong place.

HILL: Yes. All it takes is one. That's for sure.

Chad, appreciate it. Thank you.

MYERS: You bet.

HILL: For the first time since Monday's devastating earthquake, a United Nation's aid convoy has been allowed to cross from Turkey into northwestern Syria. Both countries, of course, facing a desperate race against time to find survivors. The death toll has now risen above 17,000 people.

SCIUTTO: Yes, and some of the aid, particularly to Syria, taking so long to get there. Hundreds of thousands more people homeless as a result of this quake. And the survivors, they're facing freezing cold temperatures in devastated areas. Still, there have been some small signs of hope. Incredible rescues happening days later. This one, an infant named Helen (ph), pulled from the rubble, rushed to an ambulance just yesterday.

Here's CNN chief international security correspondent Nick Paton Walsh.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Jim, Erica, startling some of the most densely populated areas in Antakya, the devastation is quite remarkable behind me here. Multiple apartment blocks have been laid down and they have, over the past hour or so, been bringing out the dead, laid in bags, some without them knowing who they belong to, and others with the words with owner written upon them and names. It is a grizzly and slow process we've been seeing happening all day.

And, in fact, there was a brief moment of hope. We saw rescue workers rush towards one building, part of a street that remarkably the basement, first and second floor have all been crushed but the buildings were still standing somehow upright. And in those crushed basement areas they found, they had hoped, an eight-year-old girl alive, yet her body was brought out, her mother there as well alive, and they discovered, as they put her in the ambulance, that she had indeed perished.

But, acute moments of hope and anxiety when voices are heard sometimes in the rubble here. This vast city, some of the areas of which some buildings are fine and upright. Others are tilting precariously at an angle. Others are utterly demolished.

And the anger here is acute. Yes, there is anger at the initial government response, the day or so in which bad weather and perhaps a lack of preparation meant they didn't get here. But a broader anger at the political culture of Turkey I heard from one women, essentially saying people make money out of construction here. It's the big business. And it's a business where there is corruption. And where clearly some buildings were built to regulation and others were not.

But it is deeply depressing in a city of this size to see the scale of this kind of ruin everywhere. Whole neighborhoods will have to be rebuilt. And we will also sadly see the death toll continue to rise.

Jim. Erica.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HILL: It really - I mean it is just devastating when you see those pictures.

[09:10:01]

Nick Paton Walsh, appreciate the reporting there.

I know so many of you want to help. And there are ways that you can help the victims of the earthquake in Turkey and Syria. Just log on to cnn.com/impact where you'll find an extensive list of vetted organizations.

A bit later this hour, President Biden taking his battle with Republicans on the road to Florida. We have more on his plan to win back blue collar voters.

SCIUTTO: Plus, a standing ovation today when the Ukrainian president, you can hear it there, spoke to European Union leaders, but will they now move on his request for fighter jets? Seems to be a question of open debate.

Later, Disney lays off 7,000 people despite making more money than expected last quarter. A look at the job market overall as new weekly unemployment figures were just released.

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SCIUTTO: Just moments ago House lawmakers wrapped up a closed door classified briefing on the Chinese surveillance balloon.

[09:15:03]

Joining me now, someone who was in the room for that briefing, Democratic Congressman Mike Quigley.

Congressman, thanks for taking the time this morning.

REP. MIKE QUIGLEY (D-IL): Good morning. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: So, first, and I understand this was classified, so I'm not asking to ask you to verge into classified territory. But in general term, does the U.S. now believe that this surveillance balloon was more advanced and more of a threat than initially thought?

QUIGLEY: Well, look, I, again, can't talk about what was discussed. Here's what I think I would take from that. I think the United States did exactly the right thing under these circumstances and would probably understand a little bit more. I think that in the final analysis, we can and will learn from this. And in the final situation, I think our country will be safer as a result.

SCIUTTO: Do you believe, or are you concerned at all, that by waiting to shoot it down until after it left U.S. -- its position over the U.S. continent that that increased the danger at all, or are you confident the U.S. was able to mitigate the threat while it remained over U.S. territory?

QUIGLEY: You know, the Pentagon was telling us that they were able to mitigate in real time as this was taking place. And I believe that that's accurate. I think the preeminent concern they had, as they expressed real time, was the safety of U.S. citizens with something this large. They described it publicly as something three times larger than a bus. Anywhere that falls with such a huge debris pile creates risk. And again, what we said previous, as this was happening, was, the fact that it was shot down over water gives you perhaps a greater opportunity to collect and maintain an intact system. And, again, we want to learn from what they were using.

SCIUTTO: There's been a lot of hard questions about whether this was deliberate on the part of the Chinese president to send this surveillance balloon on the eve of a summit with the U.S. secretary of state, a meeting with the U.S. secretary of state, that has now been scuttled. Do you believe it was deliberate?

QUIGLEY: What - what surprised me when this happens is that - and as -- as you and I talked real time, this made no sense. Most collection is covert. It's, you know, cloak and dagger, trying to keep things quiet. This was a - the equivalent of an intelligence collecting device as a brass band driving down main street. There's no way you're going to hide this.

And it comes at a time when they were certainly trying to normalize relations.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

QUIGLEY: The two presidents had met. Secretary Blinken was about to meet with his counterpart. So, I raised the question then that it didn't make sense and - and perhaps this was, you know, someone in some (INAUDIBLE) forcing the Chinese president's hand on this.

But it doesn't make any sense. I'm concerned of what it means long term, the divisions within that government. But it's certainly something to be investigated.

SCIUTTO: The U.S., as you know, flies surveillance aircraft, both crewed and uncrewed, around, not over, Chinese airspace, as the U.S. has made clear, but China has also said that it reserves the right to act in a similar way. And, by the way, there are parts of that part of the world, including over the Chinese -- the South China Sea where China claims airspace that the U.S. does not recognize.

Are you concerned about a threat to U.S. surveillance aircraft from China now? QUIGLEY: I am, and particularly because the Chinese government has been very aggressive. As you know, they're building islands to excerpt what areas that they claim that they have control over. There have been very aggressive tactics by the Chinese military toward U.S. military, and we have to be aware of that.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

QUIGLEY: So, look, this is an escalation at the worst possible time. Tensions were already high over issues like Taiwan, to TikTok, to so many other things. And we are well aware of the extraordinary aggression that China has taken.

There was a -- in Chicago, someone was sentenced in January to spying for the Chinese government. Going after our technology. So, clearly, this isn't a wakeup call. We're well aware of it. To me it is some odd situation that highlights these issues, but is still inexplicable for its timing and its manner.

SCIUTTO: Final question before we go. After this briefing, are you more concerned about the threat from this surveillance balloon and others than you were prior?

QUIGLEY: In some respects I'm equally concerned, but I'm more confident that we can address these issues. I think in the final analysis we have learned a great deal about this, and how to mitigate against this, and what kind of capabilities that do exist.

[09:20:05]

So, look, very concerned about Chinese hard surveillance and spying on our country. That's an ongoing threat. This particular incident, while deeply troubling and a violation of our sovereignty that needed to be treated as such, it may be, in the end, a gain for us, and understanding how they operate.

SCIUTTO: Congressman Mike Quigley, thanks so much for taking the time this morning.

QUIGLEY: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: All right, very soon, President Biden expected to leave the White House for Florida to tout his administration's legislative wins as he prepares to launch his likely re-election campaign.

HILL: And as he's doing that, the president is actually sharpening his message against the GOP. Here's what he told PBS "Newshour" about the Republican lawmakers who booed and heckled him during his State of the Union Address.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did you expect that kind of reaction?

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: From the folks who did it, I was. The vast majority of Republicans weren't that way. But, you know, the -- there's a -- there's still a significant element of what I call the MAGA Republicans, you know, the make America great again Republicans. And it's -- you know, I didn't - I kind of anticipated it, but there are an awful lot of -- the speaker was gracious and so was, you know -- there were a lot of the members.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: CNN's MJ Lee joining us now from the White House.

Interesting, MJ, that he referenced MAGA Republicans with Judy Woodruff, but, of course, did not reference them on Tuesday night. Many people were wondering whether he would after apparently Kevin McCarthy advised against it.

What do we expect to hear from the president today, MJ?

MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erica and Jim, we are going to see the president do a continuation of his post State of the Union travel blitz, traveling down to Florida, as you said, and will be focusing on Social Security, Medicare, and other health care issues.

You know, the issue that we are talking about here has already become such a fascinating one to watch politically as we saw Tuesday night when the president accused Republicans in that address of trying to make cuts to Medicare and Social Security. You saw how rowdy it got. Republican members heckling the president, calling him a liar.

And this issue has also become a top issue when the talks have already begun on whether to raise the debt ceiling. We know that House Speaker Kevin McCarthy, who's not even put a specific proposal on the table yet, the one thing that he has committed to is that there will not be any cuts that he would agree to on Social Security and Medicare. So, you know, White House officials are saying this is an issue that they believe is getting on the nerves of Republicans.

And just for the president's visit down to Florida today, you know, we should note, this is a very intentional choice. It is not a mistake that they are choosing a state where they really think is very ripe for this kind of White House messaging. Of course, this is a state with a lot of seniors living in it. And then it also happens to be the home state of Senator Rick Scott.

Senator Rick Scott has become sort of this favorite foe of the White House, including because he has proposed a program and an idea where all federal legislation would sunset after five years unless Congress were to reapprove it. So, in so many ways the president has been relentless in going after Senator Scott. We certainly expect that his name is going to come up, that this idea is going to come up when he travels down there today.

And just in the big picture, this isn't just about Rick Scott, right? We believe that the president believes this is going to be sort of the important political contrast that he can continue to draw between Democrats and Republicans as he prepares for this expected 2024 announcement. HILL: MJ Lee, with the latest from the White House for us. MJ, thank

you.

Joining me now, "USA Today" White House correspondent Francesca Chambers, and Washington bureau chief of "The Boston Globe," Jackie Kucinich.

Nice to see you both this morning.

If we pick up where MJ left off there, the fact that this is, as MJ pointed out, this is an intentional choice by the president to go to Florida, not just because of -- yes, there's the Rick Scott part of it all. There are a number of seniors there.

It's interesting, though, Jackie, we're also seeing him go to Florida after we saw what happened in the midterms. We know that Florida has become more and more difficult in many ways for Democrats. Does he see this Social Security issue perhaps opening the door a little bit more there?

JACKIE KUCINICH, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, "THE BOSTON GLOBE": It seems - I mean, clearly, which is why you're hearing that message from the president, from other Democrats relentlessly. And this is precisely why Mitch McConnell immediately disavowed this when Rick Scott released it before the midterm elections, because this is such an issue the Democrats really can cling onto.

And you've seen Rick Scott try to push back against this, but it's hard to do when even members of his party were walking away from this. The White House knew, when Biden said he expected the Republicans to react like they did at the State of the Union, or some Republicans, the White House was hoping that this would be their reaction.

[09:25:08]

HILL: Yes.

KUCINICH: And this was bait. I mean let's be - let's be real here. And they got what they wanted, because they knew that this would be triggers.

HILL: Yes. Yes, despite the White House saying yesterday, oh, we couldn't have scripted it better if we tried. Well, there may have been just a little bit of scripting in there, and a little bit of hope as you point out, Jackie.

KUCINICH: Right.

HILL: Francesca, you have some interesting new reporting about Biden's efforts to win back blue collar voters moving into 2024 as he's preparing for that run. How much is he changing his message?

FRANCESCA CHAMBERS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "USA TODAY": Well, we heard him in the State of the Union, and over the last couple of days, start to talk a little bit more about how these are people who feel like they were forgotten by the Democratic Party. And they've started to vote more Republican. They were traditionally Democratic voters but you saw them in 2016 vote for Donald Trump, and you saw more of them in 2020 vote for Joe Biden, but they do see this as a very important demographic group heading into that 2024 election.

And yesterday he went to Wisconsin. You saw him last week in Pennsylvania. So, he's really keying in on this specific voter group with his economic message and his State of the Union was largely focused on that economic message. So, a real key problem for them that he's trying to address.

HILL: Yes, certainly is.

As we look at Republicans, and we look towards 2024, former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley really seems to be inching towards some sort of announcement here about her own bid for the White House.

Jackie, what are her chances of securing the nomination? Donald Trump, of course, the only other Republican to officially throw his hat in the ring.

KUCINICH: You know, Erica, my crystal ball broke several years ago as it -- when it comes to 2024 predictions. But, you know, she's - she's certainly trying to harness a lane that you see several people who don't want to necessarily walk away from the former president, want to take some of his policies and repurpose them for their own run, kind of the Trump light lane. And it's going to be crowded this time. You're seeing several Republicans who we expect to run try to occupy that. She's going to have some competition here. We'll see, you know, how - how it will play out. But I am - I am out of the predictions business.

HILL: You know what works really well, a magic eight ball. I mean, I just have to say, throughout time.

KUCINICH: Right. It's true.

HILL: Yes. It's brilliant.

KUCINICH: Or (INAUDIBLE).

HILL: Sorry to put you on the spot like that, my friend.

KUCINICH: Not at all.

HILL: When we look at what could potentially be playing out on the Republican side, Francesca, if Nikki Haley, in fact, makes that announcement, let's say she's the first of more than one to challenge the former president, I would imagine, and this I feel pretty good about without a crystal ball or magic eight ball, that the Biden team is looking at this as a win for them. If there can be some sort of chaos for them, chaos in quotes, right, or more people running for the nomination on the Republican side, that helps the Democrats.

CHAMBERS: And Democrats say that they don't see a need for Joe Biden to make an announcement right now while you do have Republicans who are jockeying for this position, Nikki Haley expected to announce next week. You also have, as you were noting, current governors, former governors who are all making their decisions right now too and could also potentially get in, in the next couple months. And so as all of that's going on, on the Republican side, as you were noting, they're also waiting a little bit to see how that field shakes out and how those people might be inspiring matches with former President Donald Trump.

But I do want to make a key point on Nikki Haley and some of these other Republicans as well. They're really starting to zero in on foreign policy messages. Not just because of what happened recently with China, but she's a former U.N. ambassador. You have Kristi Noem, who's another potential candidate, coming to Washington, D.C., next week, and she will also be focused on China. So, it just shows how important foreign policy is going to be in this election and how every candidate right now is trying to figure out their positioning on it.

HILL: Francesca Chambers, Jackie Kucinich, good to see you both. Thank you.

CHAMBERS: Thanks.

KUCINICH: Thanks, Erica.

SCIUTTO: Still ahead, the Ukrainian president told European leaders this morning that he needs fighter jets to defend his country and stop Russia's invasion. Could he get them? We'll have more coming up.

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