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Former President Jimmy Carter Receiving Hospice Care At Home; Secretary Of State Blinken Meets With Chinese Counterpart; Zelenskyy: There Is No Alternative To Ukrainian Victory; Ohio Residents Demand Answers After Toxic Leak from Train Wreck; Students Denounce Bullying After Teen Dies By Suicide In NJ; Search-And-Rescue Efforts Ongoing In Turkey, Days After Quake; Actor Jeremy Renner's Co-Stars Say He's A "Fighter" & There's "No Stopping Him". Aired 5-6p ET

Aired February 18, 2023 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[17:00:17]

SARA SIDNER, CNN HOST: I'm Sara Sidner in New York. Jim Acosta has the day off. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

We begin this hour with breaking news. Former President Jimmy Carter is receiving hospice care at his home in Plains, Georgia. Sources tell CNN President Biden is staying in close contact with the Carter family.

Let's go now to CNN's Jeff Zeleny in Washington. Jeff, what more have you learned since we've just heard this not too long ago.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Sara, we are learning this this afternoon and the Carter Center advised something that we had not known, that the former President Jimmy has had a brief series of hospital stays.

He made the decision to spend his final days to enter hospice care in Plains, Georgia. That is really so extraordinary because that, of course, is where the former president has spent his entire life with the exception, of course, of his four years here in Washington at the White House as well as his military service as a young man. He went home to Plains, Georgia in his post-presidency, and that's where he's been ever since. With Rosalynn, his wife at his side for more than 75 -- 77 years of marriage or so.

So the family is saying that he is going to be in hospice care. And we are also learning just a short time ago, we heard from his grandson, a former Georgia state senator, a gubernatorial candidate, who is basically in the family business in Georgia, Jason Carter.

And he said he visited with his grandparents yesterday in Plains. And he tweets this. He said, "I saw both of my grandparents yesterday. They're at peace, and as always, their home is full of love. Thank you for all of your kind words."

So Sara, as I'm talking to former advisers to the Carter family, they're really keeping a close hold on his exact health condition. And instead, they are choosing to talk about his life, talk about really his extraordinary legacy from peanut farmer to the presidency.

And it was really, you know, the post presidency, the last half century nearly of his work that has been so extraordinary. And he's been a Sunday schoolteacher. He's had a parade of people we're seeing right here now, his Plains, Georgia church. He's greeting visitors. So this is something he always did. If he was on an airplane, he was known to be shaking hands with passengers up and down the aisle. He taught Sunday school. He built homes with the Habitat for Humanity, particularly in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. I certainly remember that as well.

So clearly now, President Biden, I'm told, has been advised of this, and he is in close contact as well. And some interesting history between those men as well. President Biden paid a visit to the Carters on the 100th day of his presidency back in 2021. And then-Senator Joe Biden was the first senator to endorse the Carter presidential bid, back in 1976. So they have a long history there.

I'm told the White House is in close contact. They share some actual former advisers. Anita Dunn, a top adviser to this president was a young adviser to Jimmy Carter.

So all thoughts here in Washington and at the White House are with the Carters. But for now, he has chosen to remain in Plains, Georgia which really is the epicenter of his life, his legacy that will be felt certainly around the world, Sara.

SIDNER: I have to say, I met him when I was in college. I know many of you have met and talked to him. He was gracious, he was kind.

ZELENY: Right. For sure.

SIDNER: He was giving. It was remarkable to be able to sort of be in his presence because of all the things he's done, not just being the president. Really it's the post presidency work.

ZELENY: Indeed.

SIDNER: I know lots of prayers are out there for him and his family. Jeff Zeleny, you're always great. Thank you so much for joining us.

ZELENY: Sure.

SIDNER: Let's turn to Kai Bird, author of "the Outlier: the unfinished presidency of Jimmy Carter". Kye, when was the last time that you were able to see and speak with the former president and how was he doing at that time?

[17:04:59]

KAI BIRD, AUTHOR: You know, the last time I saw President Carter was in July of 2021 at his 75th wedding anniversary, which was a gala event in Plains, where he invited 350 colleagues and friends and politicians like Nancy Pelosi and Bill Clinton. And you know, he had just had a fall that week a few days earlier.

Gashed his forehead, had many stitches, but he was determined to make the event, and he sat there in a wheelchair, and greeted each and every one of us, and spent a few words -- a few minutes talking to everyone. He just has an amazing stamina and love of life. He's an incredible force of nature.

SIDNER: Yes, I think that's a really good way to put it. He's an incredible force of nature but he does it with such kindness and compassion. It really is remarkable.

A little bit about his sort of family history. I understand that pancreatic cancer ended up killing many of his close relatives, but not Mr. Carter. How do you think all of this has impacted his life, having seen others go through cancer and dying from it?

BURR: Yes, you know, all of -- his father, Ms. Lilian his mother, all his siblings including Billy Carter, they all died of pancreatic cancer. It was rather unusual, so unusual that the national health institute made a study of the family to figure out what was going on.

But he escaped this cancer and has led a very vigorous life. He did come down with melanoma in 2015 just as I was beginning my biography, "The Outlier" on him.

And he had this, if you recall, he had this amazing press conference live at the Carter Center, where he got up on stage, and gave the news very calmly, rationally, said that he had brain cancer, melanoma that had spread from his liver, and he probably had just a few weeks to live.

Well, of course we all know he then got immune therapy and survived and beat the cancer. He is a survivor. So --

SIDNER: He's a remarkable person. Would you agree with a lot of the assessment, you know, he's still here with us. He's still living, he has been through -- I don't know how many different things that for many people has been the end for them, but he has survived it.

75 years of marriage, as you mentioned, and that was in 2021, did you say?

BURR: Right. So that was 18 months ago.

SIDNER: Would you -- and we're looking at pictures, I think, of his family, which is quite large. And they're all laughing, and they're all sharing time together.

But I do want to ask you about -- a little bit about him and post presidency because most people when they think of Jimmy Carter, he was a one-term president, which in the political world is not necessarily the most successful presidency.

But in the life afterwards, he's done remarkable things that have impacted people's lives. Can you talk a little bit about that. BURR: Oh, absolutely, you know, I argue in my biography that actually

his presidency, his four years was quite successful. He accomplished quite a bit.

But I also wrote that he sort of tongue in cheek was the only president who used the White House as a stepping-stone to greater things. And it's true, you know, he had a remarkable ex-presidency. Just a continuation of his presidency in many ways, doing good works.

So, you know, he often joked that at the Carter Center that he wanted to live longer than the last guinea worm, and the Carter Center has spent decades now, wiping out millions of cases of guinea worm disease which a terrible affliction, and they're now, I think, in 2022, there were only 13 cases in human beings of guinea worm disease so he's almost made it.

Kai Bird, thank you so much for sharing your insights. You're the author of "The Outlier: The Unfinished Presidency of Jimmy Carter" and you said something that I think is going to stick with people which is he used the presidency as a stepping-stone for greater things. And indeed he did. I appreciate your time Kai.

BIRD: Thank you.

SIDNER: We have more news developing at this hour. Secretary of State Antony Blinken met a short while ago with China's top diplomat. It's the first meeting between senior officials since tensions spiked after the U.S. shot down a suspected Chinese spy balloon, that was over U.S. soil.

Minutes ago, the Chinese diplomat said the U.S. must repair the damaged relationship after the balloon incident.

[17:09:59]

CNN international editor, Nic Robertson is at the Munich security conference where the diplomats met and he has the latest for us.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Sara, there have been a lot of uncertainty and speculation whether this high stakes meeting between Secretary of State Antony Blinken and his Chinese counterpart foreign minister Wang Yi would actually take place. We now know some of the details of the conversation.

The Secretary of State telling Wang Yi, directly that this was a violation of U.S. airspace and international law that this balloon, this Chinese balloon should fly across the United States. He also warned China about increasing and the risk of it increasing its support for Russia and also spoke about the importance of peace and stability around Taiwan.

And this comes on a day when the United States has been telling its allies and partners here in Europe that it is concerned that it sees disturbing trend lines that China is, in fact, increasing its support for Russia, that it is potentially walking up to a line -- a threshold line, if you will, of moving towards giving Russia lethal military aid for its war in Ukraine.

That's a concern. That was shared with European allies and partners. The concern for the United States is that the Chinese are trying to sort of sell themselves as peacemakers in a situation right now while at the same time, beginning to consider a move closer to giving that military support.

I spoke on that particular issue with Ursula Von Der Leyen, the European Commission President, a very senior and prominent European diplomat. She said that there was concern about China, and whether or not it was going to increase support for Russia. They were watching closely.

But at the moment, she said, it's an open question. And on that issue, this was something Secretary Blinken, very clear with his Chinese counter part of the consequences of ramping up support for Russia in its war, military support, Sara.

SIDNER: Our thanks there to Nic Robertson.

Meanwhile, intense fighting rages in Ukraine as Russian forces try to make advances in the south and the east. And Ukraine's president is pleading for urgency from the U.S. and its allies when it comes to getting more weapons into the country.

CNN's senior national security correspondent, Alex Marquardt is in Kyiv with more.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Sara, as Russia struggles to make any real gains on the ground, they do continue to assault Ukraine from the skies, yet another wave of missiles fired at Ukraine today. At least four cruise missiles, the Ukrainian air force says fired from the Black Sea, at least two of them were intercepted but there were two explosions in a southwestern city, including against a military facility.

That was one of ten regions, according to President Zelenskyy that has been attacked in the past day. President Zelenskyy also speaking to leaders at the Munich security conference. Reminding them that it's not just about their commitment of weapons to Ukraine. But the speed with which they arrive here.

Take a listen to a bit more of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: We need to hurry up. We need the speed of our agreements, Speed of our delivery to strengthen our speed of decisions to limit Russian potential. There is no alternative to speed because it is the speed that the life depends on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARQUARDT: That plea for those weapons to arrive here in Ukraine faster coming at the same time we are starting to see the beginning of a new Russian offensive. It is not going well so far, a top State Department official saying what they are seeing is very pathetic.

One place, where Russia really is trying to push forward and has been for the past several months is in the eastern city of Bakhmut. Fierce fighting there, so fierce that all sides acknowledge that it is what they call a meat grinder. Ukrainian forces facing off against Russian forces from the Wagner private mercenary group. So mercenaries as well as convicts.

There is a new White House assessment about the severe toll that that fight has taken on Wagner, some 30,000 casualties they say, including 9,000 dead. The U.S. is hoping that the Ukraine will soon shift its focus from Bakhmut, which is seen as symbolic but not very strategic to a new counter offensive in the southern part of the country. That counter offensive would be made up at least in part with newly-trained troops that have come out of a new U.S. training program at a base in Germany, its second phase has just gotten underway. That training focusing on teaching new tactics with combined arms as well as maneuvers that the U.S. believes will be crucial in clawing back territory from Russia, Sara.

[17:14:59]

SIDNER: Alex Marquardt, our thanks to you.

People who live near the site of that toxic train wreck in Ohio are meeting today with the head of Norfolk Southern Railroad. The latest on that, next on CNN NEWSROOM.

And later, emotional testimony about school bullying and the death of a teenager after she was attacked by four classmates.

Plus, new incredible rescues from the earthquake in Turkey.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

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SIDNER: The CEO of Norfolk Southern Rail company in East Palestine, Ohio today, is meeting with residents and rail workers there. One of its freight trains derailed in the town two weeks ago sending toxic chemicals into the air, water and soil.

[17:19:51]

SIDNER: Norfolk Southern tweeted it will stay as long as it takes to help East Palestine recover, but some people who returned to their homes are reporting rashes, sore throats and headaches which they fear are linked to the chemical spill.

CNN's Polo Sandoval is tracking developments for us. Polo, what is the latest on this what we know so far.

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey Sara. So we know that Allen Shaw, the CEO of Norfolk Southern is back in the community of East Palestine again. He visited that community last week. But officials saying basically continuing with that message to the community that they are continuing to work with local officials as this massive clean up effort continues underway.

And you mentioned the tweet from the company earlier today, basically reemphasizing their commitment they say to be in it for the long run, that they don't plan to go anywhere and even offering some free and available air quality tests for the residents there.

But look, when you hear from the residents in that community that have already been through so much since the events of that day back on February 3rd, that company has a very long way to go when it comes to restoring the confidence in people for them to be able to actually keep them safe in the community. That's because of what you just mentioned a short while ago, receiving reports from several residents that they are beginning to experience things like coughing, some rashes, headaches, nausea.

And they are worried, again they are worried that this could potentially be linked to that train chemical spill from just weeks ago. In response to that local, state, federal officials expected to send in medical personnel. Experts in toxicology to set up these clinics to be able to speak to some of these individuals and provide perhaps examinations, for example and what is perhaps the most the valuable asset of all which is information.

Many of these residents feel that they have not been provided with all the information that they need to make a wise decision in terms of whether or not to return home which by the way, remember, they were given the all clear days ago to actually return, this after local officials said multiple tests revealed no elevated qualities of any sort of -- quantities, I should say of any harmful chemicals in the water or in the air.

But again, as we said, they still have a very long way to go in terms of feeling safe in their community. And as we heard an environmental expert say earlier today, Sara, the clean up, the recovery it's not a sprint. It's certainly going to be a marathon.

SIDNER: Polo Sandoval, always appreciate it. Thank you.

SANDOVAL: Thanks Sara.

SIDNER: So how much of a risk do these chemicals pose to people of East Palestine and the areas around it?

CNN's chief climate correspondent Bill Weir joins me now to talk about this.

Bill, what's your biggest worry here? You have covered environmental issues all across the United States the world. What do you think?

BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: Well, I tell you, when you look at the pictures from a couple of weeks ago when they were intentionally flaming off that vinyl chloride, it looked like the end of the world. And it's a miracle no one died like another Norfolk southern crash about 18 years ago in South Carolina, killed nine people with ammonia gas. It's a miracle nobody is hospitalized now and you've got to empathize

with what they've been through in addition to the rashes and all of that. They've got property values to worry about, their clothes and their -- maybe their inventory in their stores are contaminated -- all of that.

But this really strikes me as the first big toxic spill of the age of toxic politics. And as much as Governor Mike DeWine tries to manage this and calm fears and say we have tested the water so much, the air is ok. You can go back to your homes. Even his own like state senators in his own party are going on the media saying I don't believe him, because I get a sore throat.

And so after, you know, the COVID debate around masks and vaccinations, and after honestly generations of pollution in the Ohio River water shed, you know, mining and agricultural (INAUDIBLE) that's been ignored by folks, you know, the folks who have to deal with it and the Appalachians being ignored, so I can't blame them for not knowing who to believe right now.

And then Donald Trump is going to go down there this week. They have found, you know, the Biden EPA has a punching bag here, the slow footed response from Michael Regan. That's going to only muddy it further, I think.

And we have to remind folks that President Trump rolled back over a hundred environmental protection laws, rolled back train safety laws right now, and if anything, you know, silver lining can come of this, is the scrutiny around how much, how vulnerable our clean air and water can be.

And folks who are living near beautiful rivers with railroad crossings may think about them differently in a new way.

SIDNER: Yes. It's interesting that you say that because, you know, when you throw stones and live in a glass house, that can usually end poorly.

The Trump administration rolled back a ton of rules that the EPA had in place when it comes to clean water, for example, and clean air. Some politicians in the so called Rust Belt have opposed, though, they themselves strong environmental protections.

[17:24:55]

SIDNER: Some of that has to do with the economy and trying to get people to work on certain things, like coal. But is that changing or might it because of something like this?

WEIR: Well, you never know. I mean if it takes something like this to galvanize lawmakers around clean water, fantastic. J.D. Vance was, you know, on Twitter using a stick to stir up these chemical blooms, and fantastic if they want to make the investments.

You know, when I was a little boy, when I was my son's age, Ohio River would routinely just ignite and burst into flames they were so polluted and that's people seeing that, inspired the Clean Air and Water Acts and you can swim in the Ohio River and Cincinnati and people drink out of it after it's treated.

The water shed, those upland creeks there that are near the coal mines, that's a whole different story. That's a big clean up project.

But hopefully yes, and you know, there's examples like this. This one has really caught the attention thankfully for folks in East Palestine. There are examples of this really all over the country every week in some way.

SIDNER: Yes. And they don't give as much attention because something like this grabs your attention because there was a fire ball, there was a crash, there was something that people are like what is going on.

This is really unearthing other issues. There's another environmental threat that I know you are well aware of, the underground fire that's been burning at an Alabama land fill since late November, since late November.

And you know, shame on us a little bit for not covering that and talking more about that. An EPA contractor has been working to smother that fire at the Moody Landfill with dirt for the past month. I mean how big of a threat does this pose folks there.

WEIR: It's horrible. It's a bright example of environmental injustice. It's supposed to be a landfill for organic material -- leaves, tree branches, but it's unregulated. Nobody watches it. So it's full of car tires, and roof shingles and it's set on fire and the company in charge threw up their hands and like we don't know how to put this thing out. It took until January before the governor of Alabama declared a state of emergency. And so then that got the wheels started. So the EPA has to figure out how much it's going to cost. It's about almost over $200 million to smother it out.

But again, you know, thankfully folks at CNN.com have done some reporting. We were headed down there. And if that thing still keeps going, we're going down there as well.

SIDNER: Bill, get down there.

(CROSSTALK)

WEIR: We live in a country with cancer alleys near petrochemical plant and endangered rivers and if there's any silver lining from this horror show, it's a renewed sense of wait a minute, what is in my air and water in my own backyard.

SIDNER: Yes. I know there's a lot of work being done from the EPA on to try and deal with this issue. But it is a wide one, and Bill, you are on it, and I would love to see you down there in Alabama telling that story.

Thank you so much for joining us today on this one.

WEIR: You got it.

SIDNER: All right. High school students who lost a classmate after an attack in school testify about the terrible impact of bullying. That important story is next on CNN NEWSROOM.

[17:28:06]

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[17:32:23]

SIDNER: A Mississippi man is facing first-degree murder charges after a mass shooting Friday that killed six people. The Tate County sheriff says Richard Dale Crum fatally shot his ex-wife and other members of the family at four separation locations.

President Biden issued a statement saying, in part, "We are 48 days into the year and our nation has already suffered at least 73 mass shootings. Thoughts and prayers aren't enough. Gun violence is an epidemic and Congress must act now.

Now to emotional testimony from current and former students at a New Jersey school board meeting sharing their own struggles with bullying and being threatened in high school.

This comes after a teenage girl named Adriana died by suicide days after being attacked by four classmates.

The video of the beating went viral and has sparked both outrage and calls for officials to step up oversight and rethink how they deal with bullies.

CNN's Athena Jones has more from New York.

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ATHENA JONES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This was a powerful school board meeting in Bayville, New Jersey, coming after a 14-year-old girl died by suicide following a bullying incident at the school that was posted and shared online.

Hundreds of people attended this meeting, which the school board president said was meant to begin the process of healing at the school.

The school Board of Education president told parents and students in attendance that the board offered their "most sincere, deepest sympathies to the family of our student, Adriana Kuch."

That's the student who took her own life after experiencing this bullying incident.

Current and former students and their parents spoke about bullying that was not properly addressed at the school.

They shared emotional testimony about how these incidents, their experiences being bullied made them feel.

They talked about being called names. They talked about being jumped in the hallways, due to their sexual orientation.

One student talked about photos being taken of them and posted on social media.

Here's some of what the students had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED STUDENT: I'm here because I've been bullied every single day since I've been at this school, since the 7th grade. People in this room have even made fun of me, and I don't even know why you're here. I have been called slurs, had stuff thrown at me.

UNIDENTIFIED PARENT: Why did it have to take a student taking her own life for us to hit rock bottom? It should have never gone there. Rock bottom should have been the first time a student was bullied and it should have been taken care of from that point on.

[17:35:00]

We should be teaching our children tolerance and love and respect for everybody's differences. But, no, you all sit there silent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JONES: And some students spoke about how being bullied affected them emotionally and psychologically, some describing acts of self-harm.

Including one student who talked about cutting herself, another contemplating suicide. One saying that she goes home scared and feeling threatened every day.

And these students pleading with the school to do something about their treatment.

Parents also speaking up. One father saying, "We, the parents, have committed to keeping the spotlight on you" -- the administrators -- "for as long as possible until the situation is handled to our liking and/or we have removed you from your temporary seat of power."

The former superintendent resigned after an uproar after this suicide.

The new acting superintendent is looking into a handful of initiatives, including retaining an outside party to examine the district's policies and response to crises and creating a focus group of teachers and parents to handle the issues.

Athena Jones, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SIDNER: It's such an important issue that Athena brings to us. I don't know any other way to say, stop it, what is going on? It has now been nearly two weeks since the massive earthquake hit

Turkey and Syria, and people are still being found alive in the rubble. We'll have the story, next.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

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[17:42:36]

SIDNER: Tonight, with the death toll in Turkey and Syria at more than 46,000 people, there are now just under 100 search-and-rescue missions that are currently going on.

While those efforts are winding down, more people are being pulled from the rubble alive.

CNN's Nada Bashir is in Istanbul with the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NADA BASHIR, CNN INTERNATIONAL REPORTER: Sara, two weeks since the outbreak struck, all survivors are still being pulled from the rubble. Those remarkable rescues continuing through Saturday.

But the death toll is also still rising, topping 40,000 in Turkey. And among them, Christine Atsu (ph), who was found dead under the rubble of a destroyed building in Antalya, according to his agent.

The window for finding survivors is, of course, closing, with less than 200 search-and-rescue operations currently ongoing. The focus now shifting to the humanitarian response effort, with thousands left homeless and in need of urgent support.

The United Nations meanwhile is appealing for $1 billion in aid to support the relief efforts over the next three months. U.N. Secretary General Antonio Guterres saying now is the time for the world to stand behind Turkey.

But beyond the humanitarian response efforts, the Turkish government also faces significant infrastructure challenges. More than 90,000 buildings have been identified as either collapsed or in need of immediate demolition.

And then there's the question of accountability. Turkish authorities say they have arrested 120 out of 400 identified suspects currently under investigation of allegations of construction negligence.

And while the government has made clear its commitment to rebuilding the affected areas within a year, there is a growing sense of frustration and even anger here in Turkey, with many now questioning whether enough was done by the government to prepare for a catastrophe of this scale -- Sara?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SIDNER: That was our Nada Bashir. Thank you to her.

As you heard from Nada, there are growing questions about whether human negligence may have added to this catastrophe in a serious way, with many wondering, why their buildings, some just a few years old, seemed to collapse so easily.

Let's discuss this now with Ron Hamburger. He is a structural engineer specializing in earthquake resistance design and analysis.

Thank you so much for joining our show today.

RON HAMBURGER, STRUCTURAL ENGINEER: Good afternoon.

SIDNER: I was on the ground actually just about 16 or 17 hours ago in Turkey and am just back. I noticed a lot of what I can only call dust, that some of the buildings just crumbled.

There were tiny little pieces of concrete. It wasn't even concrete slabs. It has turned to, I don't know any other way to say it, but dust.

And we're looking at a picture from Hatay -- that's where I was -- and you can see some of that there.

What does that mean? Does that mean there's a problem with the concrete or is this just a bad earthquake or something else?

HAMBURGER: While it's possible that the concrete wasn't adequately strong, that's likely not the case.

When concrete buildings collapse, the energy associated with all of that weight falling from many stories up to the ground breaks up the concrete just like a jackhammer would.

And we've seen this many times. In fact, if your viewers can recall what happened in New York on 9/11, 2021, the concrete from those buildings that collapsed also turned to dust.

SIDNER: Can you tell me what you think about this catastrophe? And there is a lot of talk -- I mean, people are being arrested for bad building practices. Do you think that that is some of the issue here?

There are 46,000 plus people now confirmed dead, and I noticed a lot of the buildings had pancaked. It wasn't that they were just slightly damaged. It was that they had, you know, one floor had fallen on top of the other in a pancake style. I think that's what you engineers call it anyway.

Can you give us a sense of whether the building had a real impact here?

HAMBURGER: Yes, so the type of construction that they used in Turkey, in fact, throughout much of the world, uses reinforced concrete frames with end fill masonry, basically concrete blocks, bricks and stones forming the walls between the beams and columns that make up the frame.

[17:45:02]

That type of structure is very susceptible to pancake-type collapses. It is not a common form of construction in the United States. In fact, it is prohibited by our building codes in areas where we anticipate having strong earthquakes.

That type of construction, when it collapses in that pancake-type collapse is very deadly. It doesn't leave much space for victims to be trapped in and survive, and very difficult to remove the debris.

SIDNER: I think what you're saying here, and correct me if I'm wrong, is that building codes matter. Especially in a place where you have these massive earthquakes or even the possibility of these earthquakes.

I have lived quite some time in Los Angeles where they're constantly reinforcing different buildings that are an older build.

We heard that they should change their codes in 1999 after a terrible and deadly earthquake in Turkey then.

But we've also heard that those changes in codes were lifted by the current regime there, by the current president there at some point to try to get things going, the economy, to get things built faster.

You know, is this something that we could see in the United States, in a place like Los Angeles or the bay area or Washington State where these earthquakes are numerous, and a big one, as has been predicted, is coming?

HAMBURGER: Well, fortunately, in the United States we don't see the types of corruption that you see in other areas of the world.

City governments in Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle, Salt Lake, and other cities that have a significant earthquake risk in the United States, are very rigorous in their enforcement of the building codes.

And we don't see officials lifting building code requirements for the sake of economic prosperity in the United States. So we're very fortunate about that.

SIDNER: And I do, lastly ,just sort of want to ask you about your thoughts when you look at this.

I mean, just tearing these buildings down, I mean, how long might this take?

There are thousands of buildings that are uninhabitable. And there are thousands more that have completely pancaked, that are just a complete mess or at least hundreds like that.

What do you think about the rebuilding time here?

HAMBURGER: Well, it's an incredible tragedy. It will take years to rebuild. Probably a decade or longer.

Many of the cities that have been affected by this earthquake may not be viable in the future. People may just move elsewhere because they have to find shelter, to find places to work.

If the government does rebuild the cities, they will likely never return to their former level of prosperity.

We saw this in New Orleans after the hurricane 20 years ago. New Orleans lost half its population. And that still has not come back.

So when a major disaster like that occurs, it takes decades for recovery.

SIDNER: Wow.

Ron Hamburger, thank you so much.

Having been on the ground there, I think your words are important to anyone who is in the position of building and of putting rules in place for those buildings, especially in earthquake zones.

I appreciate your time.

HAMBURGER: You're welcome.

SIDNER: Some of Actor Jeremy Renner's co-stars are opening up about his recovery after that terrible accident. Hear what they're saying, coming up next on CNN NEWSROOM.

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[17:53:16]

SIDNER: Actor Jeremy Renner is recovering from a terrible snowplow accident that broke more than 30 bones in his body. As he heals, season two of his TV crime thriller "Mayor of Kingstown" is airing weekly right now.

CNN's Chloe Melas joins us now.

Chloe, it's good to see you.

You spoke to some of Renner's co-stars about his recovery. We heard some of the 911 video -- sorry, audio from that, which was chilling.

What did they tell you after you were able to speak to some of his buddies?

CHLOE MELAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT REPORTER: Sara, first off, so good to see you, too. And I got -- I'm glad you're back safe from being overseas.

You know, look, it is amazing that Jeremy Renner is alive.

And I spoke to his co-stars from "Mayor of Kingstown," like you said. Some of them actually having visited him, Taylor Handley, while Hugh Dylan spoke to him on the phone really shortly after the accident happened.

Take a listen.

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HUGH DILLION, ACTOR: I heard from him 24 hours after the accident. And he's just -- he's on the road to recovery. He's a fighter. And he's -- you know, he's just so funny in the midst of this tragedy. He just wants to put you at ease.

TAYLOR HANDLEY, ACTOR: Nothing's slowing him down. He's from Modesto where they raise USC fighters and lumberjacks. The man has got -- superhuman blood in him. He's just -- there's no stopping him.

We could keep going on about it, but you know, he's on the road to recovery. And he's healing just exponentially every day.

TOBI BAMEFA, ACTOR: When I heard, I was terrified to be honest. I was worried for his wellbeing. Because this was a very serious incident. It's good to see that he's on the mend. Yes, we're praying for a -- praying for a strong comeback for him.

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[17:55:12]

MELAS: Sara, so these are his co-stars, like I said, from "Mayor of Kingstown," on Paramount Plus, airing every Sunday night.

They said that -- especially Hugh Dylan, said he was just talking to the co-creator of the show, Tyler Sheridan, who you know also created "Yellowstone," and they're already talking about a season three.

There is no season three without Jeremy Renner. They all believe that he is going to be back better than ever.

And they say they've seen it firsthand. He is making great progress. Thankfully.

SIDNER: It's really good to hear. But 30 broken bones -- it was a horrible accident. And I'm glad that his co-stars are happy to see him.

Thank you so much, Chloe.

MELAS: Thank you.

SIDNER: We are working breaking news for you tonight. A statement announcing that former President Jimmy Carter is receiving hospice care at his home in Plains, Georgia.

We'll have more live on that coming up next on CNN NEWSROOM.

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