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Biden Visits Ukraine; Alexander Vindman is Interviewed about Biden's Visit to Ukraine; Ron Brownstein is Interviewed about Biden's Trip to Ukraine; Carter Receiving Hospice Care; Zelenskyy Spoke to Biden on Weapons. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired February 20, 2023 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Good Monday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

A significant day in Ukraine and Europe as the U.S. president, Joe Biden, makes a surprise visit to the war-torn capital of Kyiv as air raid sirens sounded around him.

Walking side by side there in the capital with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, President Biden, with this visit, sending a strong message to Ukraine and to Russia. It is his first trip to the country since Russia invaded Ukraine nearly a year ago.

CNN has learned the president made the final decision only on Friday to make the unannounced visit. This after multiple invitations from Zelenskyy. This morning, the Ukrainian president says that Biden's visit leaves Ukraine, quote, closer to victory, calling it the most important visit to his country in the history of U.S./Ukraine relations.

During a news conference, President Biden announced a fresh swath of sanctions against Russia, as well as pledging another half billion dollars in military aid, including weapons to Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: One year later, Kyiv stands, and Ukraine stands, democracy stands. The Americans stands with you. Freedom is priceless. It's worth fighting for as long as it takes. And that's how long we're going to be with you, Mr. President, for as long as it takes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: As long as it takes. A frequent refrain from U.S. officials, including the president.

CNN anchor Kaitlan Collins, she's in Warsaw, Poland, just across the border from Ukraine. CNN chief international correspondent Clarissa Ward, she is in that square where Biden and Zelenskyy walked in Kyiv, Ukraine.

Kaitlan, let's begin with you.

Biden has now left Kyiv. This trip, understandably, shrouded in secrecy given the security concerns. Walk us through the decision making and the security measures put in place for this.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, we believe he's on the train back, but we won't get the full details until he is safely out of Ukraine and then the White House says they'll let us know everything that went into this behind the scenes.

But what we do know now is that this was a trip that was months in the making but the final call was not made to actually have President Biden go to Ukraine until he was huddling in the Oval Office with his aides on Friday. And they made a decision. They weighed the concerns here. Obviously, the dangers of having a president go into an active war zone where there is no U.S. military presence. I can't remember, in recent memory, Jim, I don't know if you can either, of when that has actually happened. And so they did decide it was a manageable risk. They had President Biden go and go into Ukraine as he had those few precious hours on the ground with President Zelenskyy. And the White House said that he saw the emphasis of that and that he only had so much time with him.

And so they did notify the Russians, we are told, in the hours before President Biden actually showed up in Ukraine. They did not want there to be any kind of miscommunication. They called it a deconfliction to make sure that, obviously, his safety could be part of that consideration as he was traveling there.

He was there for a few hours on the ground. He announced a new half a billion dollars in aid that's going to go to Ukraine. A lot of it is similar to what we've seen them send before when it comes to artillery and howitzer. You did not hear those long-range missiles that President Zelenskyy has asked for, or the F-16 fighter jets that he and his aides have said they do believe that they need as we turn into this next phase of the war. That is still going to be a conversation that President Biden will be having when he's on the ground here in Poland, which has been a vocal advocate for Ukraine. And so just notable in and of itself, though, this is President Biden's eighth time in Ukraine, obviously his first as president and his first since Russia invaded nearly a year ago, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Well, to your point, Kaitlan, U.S. presidents have visited war zones before. Iraq, Afghanistan. This one's different. The U.S. is not at war there. The U.S. does not have full control over the security on the ground. Quite a risk. I'm sure the security measures put in place, notable.

Kaitlan, thanks so much.

Clarissa, you were able to see there in the capital, Kyiv, Biden meet with Zelenskyy this morning. I wonder, what is the reception in Ukraine to this? Boost to moral? How significant for Ukrainians?

[09:05:00] CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it's definitely significant. There has been a lot of excitement across the city. This city was pretty much brought to a standstill in terms of traffic this morning. Large parts of the center cut off to vehicles entirely. But the only thing you saw on social media were essentially messages of excitement that President Biden was finally making this trip. We heard President Zelenskyy come out and say with this visit or with this conversation with President Biden, Ukraine is now one step closer to victory.

And as you just heard there with Kaitlan, I mean this is something that took a lot of planning. They were standing right where I am here in the central square. That's St. Michael's Church. This is the square. It's a vast, open area. Not an easy thing to secure. You can see perhaps in the background, those are some Russian tanks that have been destroyed by Ukrainian forces. And beyond that, you can see the hotel where some of our live shot positions are. This is what we look at.

Well, this morning, we had multiple visits from security officers saying, basically, you cannot be near those windows. You cannot film anything from those windows. At one point they even asked us to shut the curtain. That is how much intensity there was around the security situation.

When President Biden and Zelenskyy came out of the church, they followed behind two soldiers carrying wreaths. And you can see over here, you can also see there's a lot of journalists here. It's been a very big day for international journalists from all over the world. But you can see here the U.S. wreath that was laid here at the wall of fallen defenders. Those who have been killed in the Russia/Ukraine war.

After that, President Zelenskyy and President Biden embraced warmly and then President Biden got into his motorcade, which was a large size motorcade, at least a dozen vehicles, and left from that direction there.

What was interesting, Jim, is that this whole thing didn't last -- this part of it, at least, didn't last more than ten minutes. They were inside the church for five minutes, air raid sirens started going off. Again, that's a pretty regular almost daily occurrence here in Kyiv. But it does take on an added level of importance when the U.S. president is visiting.

Then they had about five minutes out here on the square laying that wreath before they moved on. But certainly the overwhelming response from people we've spoken to has been, to quote one woman, wow, amazing, the big boss came here.

SCIUTTO: Yes. That's interesting, Clarissa, watching you there with those faces behind. I remember on previous visits there they would have pictures of those who were killed in the Maidan protests in 2014. That death toll, those pictures numbering in the dozens. Of course now, a year into this war, the number of Ukrainian dead numbering in the thousands. All those faces. Clarissa Ward in Kyiv, thanks so much.

Joining me now to discuss, retired Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman. He's former European affairs director for the National Security Council. Also, I should note, born in Kyiv, Ukraine, himself before immigrating here, becoming a U.S. citizen and joining the U.S. military.

Lieutenant Colonel, good to have you on this morning. I wonder, as you see the U.S. president walk the streets of Kyiv during wartime, air raid sirens -- signaling sounding behind him, what is the significance of this in your view to Ukraine?

LT. COL. ALEXANDER VINDMAN (RET.), FORMER EUROPEAN AFFAIRS DIRECTOR, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL: I'm proud of the president for visiting. This is probably the most important visit that a president has paid to Ukraine, the fifth visit of a president since the independence in 1991. Bill Clinton visited three times. George Bush visited once. Actually days before the fated (ph) NATO Bucharest summit in which we offered Ukraine the inevitable joining NATO but without any specific dates, kind of (INAUDIBLE) some of these events that have unfolded since.

This is a very, very important visit. This is a demonstration that the president of the United States is still the leader of the free world, defending democracies against tyranny. And this is a strong signal to Putin, especially that President Putin was informed of this visit ahead of time that the U.S. will be there. I would almost argue that this probably, you know, several hours that the president was in Kyiv, were maybe the safest hours in Kyiv since the start of this war. The Russians were not going to launch an attack and threaten the president of the United States, especially when they were warned ahead of time. So, it's a very good demonstration of support and strength. And I'm glad he did it.

SCIUTTO: Yes, Jake Sullivan noted to reporters that the U.S. did message this to Russia in advance, a few hours in advance, for deconfliction to, in effect, make sure they didn't launch missiles while the U.S. president was there.

I wonder what you believe Putin is thinking right now as he watches this. Things are not going well for the Russian military in the east, even as they're willing to sacrifice troops by the thousands, it seems, on that front line there. Do you think he's scared that he's losing this war?

VINDMAN: I think that doubt has to start creeping into his mind. Putin's calculation thus far has been that, you know, the longer he goes, the more he stands the chance of waiting out the west.

[09:10:07]

And that in a direct contest between Russia and Ukraine, that Russia has a lot more resources. The country of 140 million people, large industrial base. That is not the message he's getting. The message is that the west will be -- the U.S. will be with Ukraine for the long haul.

In this kind of scenario, there's really no chance that Putin could win. He had his surprise strikes in the opening days of the war. He got as much territory as he could collect. And then everything since then has been a setback. So now within a contest of Ukraine supported by the U.S., he's bound to lose.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

Let me ask you this. Secretary Blinken, over the weekend, while in Munich, said in a number of interviews that the U.S. is now concerned that China is considering sending lethal aid to Russia to help in its war against Ukraine. They have not done so in the first year of the war. This would be a notable change. How significant would it be if China were to provide such lethal aid, and would that make an impact? Might it lengthen the war in your view?

VINDMAN: Absolutely. I think the fact is that this is going to steadily slide into a proxy war, supported by the largest economies in the world. And that could make Ukraine a perpetual land of war with battles on going for years. I don't know if China is going to do this -- make this step, public step, because then it would make this bilateral relationship between U.S. and China that much more difficult and further isolate China. I think that's a -- that would be a major change in policy, but it's a risk the longer this war continues. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Final question for you. You, of course, served in the Trump administration, became a target of the former president. Would a President Trump have made this trip to Kyiv to support Ukraine?

VINDMAN: Absolutely not. The president -- President Trump made one trip to I think Iraq, and it was in late 2018. He did so kind of on the heels of some other incidents where he had to show some strength and muscularity. There's no chance that Trump would have had the fortitude to travel to a war zone where he risks his own skin. And, for that matter, he wouldn't be interested in provoking Putin. He wanted to curry favor with Putin.

So, no, it's a pretty far-fetched notion that Trump would have made anything of this sort. As a matter of fact, we probably would have been in a situation where, you know, Trump would be denouncing NATO, a backbone of support to Ukraine. So, fortunately, we have President Biden in the seat and leading.

SCIUTTO: John Bolton has said, Trump's former national security adviser, that Trump in a second term might have pulled U.S. out of NATO.

Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman, we appreciate having you on this morning.

VINDMAN: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Joining us now, senior editor of "The Atlantic," and CNN's senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein. Ron, there, of course, is a message to Putin. There's a message to the

Ukrainians. I wonder what the significance of this visit is in your view here at home. Political message here. You still have broad public support for U.S. support for Ukraine, though it's dimmed a bit. Is this intended in part to shore up that public support?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I think so.

Look, first of all, for President Biden, Ukraine, in many ways, is the counterpoint to Afghanistan, right? Afghanistan was chaotic, uncoordinated, abrupt. In Ukraine, he has been much closer to what he promised voters in 2020, kind of the steady, senior statesman, unifying the western alliance against a global threat. And today was perhaps the most dramatic way to underscore that.

And, yes, by being there and by making so clear the U.S. commitment in what Colonel Vindman points out is - it threatens to become a proxy war between the force of democracy and forces of autocracy around the world, I think he does draw a line in the sand that makes it tougher for Republicans to pursue what many of them have said they want to pursue, which is reducing and rolling back the U.S. commitment here.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Prior to the midterm elections, I spoke to Republican lawmakers who support U.S. support for Ukraine who said they were concerned that a Republican majority, particularly in the House, might endanger that support or put some sort of limits on it. I wonder, our Phil Mattingly was saying in the last hour that the Republicans in positions of power that matter, they're still quite strong in their support for Ukraine. Do you see the next two years as one where it will be more difficult for the U.S. to send aid, military assistance, financial aid?

BROWNSTEIN: I do think it will be more difficult. I mean Kevin McCarthy, the speaker, has talked about not giving a blank check. And we have seen that his general strategy, broadly speaking across the range of issues, has been pretty much to give the right of his - of his conference what they want and expect the center, the more moderate members - members of more moderate districts to fall in line.

I do think there are enough in that camp that it's going to be hard for the critics to significantly roll back the aid.

[09:15:03]

But I think there's going to be a different tone from -- clearly from the Republicans in Congress than we've seen from President Biden and the Democrats.

SCIUTTO: Ron Brownstein, good to have you on.

BROWNSTEIN: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: And we will have much more coverage of the president's visit to Ukraine ahead, including a live report from Moscow, as the Kremlin reacts to Biden's visit, his show of support for Ukraine. Plus, an update on the health of former President Jimmy Carter, who

has now decided to spend the time he has remaining with loved ones in his home in Plains, Georgia, opting for hospice care.

And later, Michigan State students return to class today as state lawmakers introduce new gun control measures there. I'm going to speak with the majority leader of Michigan's senate who has a child right now at MSU.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: This morning, in the tiny town of Plains, Georgia, people embracing former President Jimmy Carter in love and prayer.

[09:20:01]

The 98-year-old former president is now at home in hospice care after facing a series of health scares in recent years, including cancer battles and a 2019 surgery to remove pressure on his brain.

CNN's Eva McKend, she's live in Plains, Georgia, this morning.

Eva, I wonder what the sense is there. He's 98 years old. Already the oldest living former president. What's the outlook?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER: Well, good morning to you, Jim.

At this time, no updates on former President Carter's health.

So, what we learned over the weekend, that he is receiving hospice care here in his hometown of Plains, Georgia. That holds.

What I can tell you is about the community response. The very first thing that we saw, Jim, as we were driving into Plains yesterday was a man on a stepladder painting -- repainting this giant peanut statue. This was a prop that was part of Carter's 1976 presidential campaign. As many folks know, clearly Carter, the former president, but he was also a peanut farmer. And really he just is revered in this community.

We are a stone's throw away of where he went to school. Here on main street, not far down, is a train depot that also served as the site of his headquarters in the 1970s. So, people here deeply proud of the 39th president, but they also view him as their neighbor, a neighbor they are praying for at this time.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL DOMINICK, PLAINS, GEORGIA, RESIDENT: Mr. Jimmy, I mean, he's - he's what Plains is.

I was always fascinated by how he could remember people's names from 30 and 40 years back, and what those people did for trade and even what they're doing now today. (END VIDEO CLIP)

MCKEND: So Michael Dominick, who you heard from there, he described himself and the Carters as believers, and gave me a sense that that is what they are leaning on at this difficult time, Jim, their faith.

SCIUTTO: They call him Mr. Jimmy there. Eva McKend, thanks so much.

Well, still ahead, we now know the U.S. gave Russia a heads up about President Biden's surprise visit to Ukraine, that's known as deconfliction, to help ensure his safety there. What is Vladimir Putin's reaction to this trip? We're going to go live to Moscow, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Putin thought Ukraine was weak and the west was divided. As you know, Mr. President, I said to you at the beginning, he's counting on us not sticking together.

He thought he could outlast us. I don't think he's thinking that right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:27:11]

SCIUTTO: During President Biden's surprise visit to Kyiv this morning, he pledged another half billion dollars in U.S. military assistance to Ukraine, including weapons. President Zelenskyy says the two even discussed providing his country with more advanced weaponry that could bolster their fight and their interest in coming offensives -- counteroffensives against Russia.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRESIDENT VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINE (through translator): The results of this visit will surely be seen and will surely have a reflection on the battlefield and in liberating our territories. We've also talked about long-range weapons and the weapons that may still be supplied to Ukraine, even though it wasn't supplied before.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: CNN's Alex Marquardt is in Kyiv, Ukraine, this morning.

And, Alex, we frequently seen this phenomenon going back to the start of the war a year ago, that the U.S. and the west sends a certain category or categories of weapons and then the focus goes to what's the next category now that that kind of shiny object are F-16s. But I wonder, were there substantive discussions during this visit to Ukraine about increasing the range of weapons that the U.S. and NATO will send there?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: I think this is one of the more interesting points or parts of this visit, Jim. Zelenskyy spoke today about negotiations. We heard a lot of niceties between the two men. There's clearly genuine respect and admiration and thanks for what the Americans are contributing to Ukraine. But at the same time, what we have seen out of the announcements made today doesn't necessarily move that ball forward in terms of the military aid that is being offered to Ukraine.

In the past month, we've seen larger military aid packages in the multibillions of dollars with new systems, like striker armored vehicles, Bradley fighting vehicles. Today's, Jim, was half a billion, not a poultry amount by any stretch, but it is smaller than what we've seen earlier this year. And there's nothing new in this package, howitzers, more artillery ammunition but not those long-range rockets that Ukraine has been asking for, for months now, nor, of course, these fighter jets, which is really the biggest ticket item on that priority list from the Ukrainians. So that really is, Jim, a sticking point.

So, if you read between the lines, that is still very much a conversation that is ongoing between the Zelenskyy and Biden administrations. The Ukrainians saying, of course, there are all these Russian targets that are much farther away from our troops that we cannot hit right now that we need to hit that are out of range. The Biden administration saying, essentially, we understand that. You can hit most of the targets with what we're giving you, but we are also afraid of escalating the fight, of providing something that the Russians see as too provocative.

[09:29:56]

So, at the same time of this -- as this highly symbolic, unprecedented presidential trip took place here in Kyiv.