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Trump Tries to Stop Pence Testimony; Food Stamp Benefits Cut; Four Americans Kidnapped in Mexico; Southwest Jet Fills With Smoke After Bird Strike; Another Norfolk Southern Trail Derails in Ohio. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired March 06, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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JILL BIDEN, FIRST LADY: It's ridiculous.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Would your husband ever take one of those?

BIDEN: I mean, we haven't even discussed -- we would never even discuss something like that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Hear what else the first lady, Jill Biden, has to say about the president's last two years of his term and the possibility of a run for a second term. "CNN PRIMETIME: Jill Biden Abroad" begins tonight 9:00 p.m. Eastern.

Thanks for your time today on INSIDE POLITICS. We will see you tomorrow.

Abby Phillip up our coverage right now.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST: Hello. I'm Abby Phillip in Washington. Good to have you with us today.

Happening right now, the NTSB investigators are on the scene in Ohio after another Norfolk Southern train wrecked in the state. The Ohio EPA says that there were no hazardous materials released in that wreck after 28 train cars derailed in Springfield on Saturday. It downed power lines, knocking out power to some residents and prompting shelter-in-place orders for residents.

It comes just a month after the Norfolk Southern train crash in East Palestine, Ohio. And crews there are still working to remove that contaminated soil and liquid from the site.

CNN's Jason Carroll is in Springfield now.

So, Jason, what are you learning about this latest crash?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the NTSB, as you say, is here. They're planning to hold a briefing just about two hours from now, Abby, at 3:00.

So, hopefully, at that point, we will get some more guidance in terms -- perhaps in terms of what exactly happened here. We can tell you, in terms of this latest derailment, it occurred on Saturday just at about 3:00. There was a man there who caught it on his cell phone just as these trains were tipping off the tracks. In all, 28 trains out of 200 cars derailed.

But, again, we are being told that there was not a release of any hazardous materials. There were some cars, though, carrying some hazardous materials such as propane and ethanol. But those cars were not involved in the derailment.

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CHARLES PATTERSON, CLARK COUNTY, OHIO, HEALTH COMMISSIONER: Technicians will continue to be on site to ensure that there isn't any contamination that has been missed. There have been multiple sweeps by multiple teams of technicians, hazmat and Ohio EPA, to ensure that there is -- There aren't any chemicals president in the soil, air or water that would harm the public Here IN Clark County.

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CARROLL: And, Abby, Norfolk Southern, for its part, continues to say that safety is their number one priority.

But that's a tough sell to many of the folks here in Ohio still reeling from what happened there in East Palestine, the cleanup effort there still under way. Lots of folks there still wondering if their water is safe, if their soil is safe, so a lot of unanswered questions there still -- Abby.

PHILLIP: Yes, and there are a lot of these derailments that happen all the time, but people are clearly on edge right now after what happened in East Palestine.

And on that East Palestine derailment, Norfolk Southern is announcing that they will reform its hot bearing detectors after the NTSB's preliminary report into the accident. So what more can you tell us about how that could have helped prevent this derailment?

CARROLL: Right.

Norfolk Southern, for its part, taking somewhat of a proactive approach here with this six-point plan. It has mainly to do with these hot bearings, which, of course, was part of the reason why we saw what happened in East Palestine. You will remember there was a wheel bearing that had overheated.

A sensor had detected there in East Palestine, but then what had happened was the crew was not alerted in time. And so what has happened here is, Norfolk Southern has come up with this six-point plan to enhance the system, which includes -- I'm going to read some of it to you here -- updating the detectors' ability to catch overheated bearings, to do that more effectively. Another point that they're going to do is review their standards and

practices for using hot bearing detectors. And, three, Abby, what they're going to be doing is adding 13 new acoustic detectors, which apparently are able to spot a problem of a visual -- that a visual inspection cannot, so some of the things that they are adding here to try to improve their system.

But I have to tell you very quickly, one of the things that the critics say is one simple thing that you can do is add more crews to some of these trains. Remember what happened in East Palestine. You had three crew members there for a train that stretched more than a mile-long -- Abby.

PHILLIP: Yes, and this is just the beginning of the NTSB's look at what happened there and potential consequences for Norfolk Southern as well.

Jason Carroll, thank you very much.

And another major transportation incident over the weekend, this time in the air.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Cover your nose and face, please, and remain seated, please.

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PHILLIP: You saw there that's a Southwest Airlines flight from Cuba to Florida that filled with smoke after a bird strike. It had to turn around and make an emergency landing back in Havana.

CNN's Carlos Suarez is in Miami.

So, Carlos, was anyone hurt in that incident? And what is Southwest saying?

CARLOS SUAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Abby, so no one on board that plane was hurt.

And the airline is trying to figure out whether or not the plane suffered engine failure because of that bird strike. The cell phone video that you're taking a look there captures all of that smoke that filled the cabin of that Southwest 737 flight that took off from Havana's International Airport to Fort Lauderdale on Sunday.

Now, according to the airline, shortly after takeoff, the pilot there reported a bird strike. It appears that one bird hit the plains engine, it caught fire. And another bird hit the plane's nose.

As a result of what happened, that plane was turned around. It was able to make a safe emergency landing back in Havana. And we're told that, by the time that aircraft landed, firefighters were already on the runway, they were able to put out that fire, and everyone that was on board that plane was able to get off safely.

It appears that a good number of folks were able to get onto another flight late last night. And we're told it appears at least that the majority -- or the remaining group of passengers that were on that plane were able to get on another flight back to Florida.

But, again, the good news in this most recent incident is no one on board this plane was hurt. And Southwest is still trying to figure out whether or not, because that engine caught fire, the extent of that damage, whether or not that plane suffered any engine failure -- Abby.

PHILLIP: All right. All right, Carlos Suarez, thank you for that report.

And four U.S. citizens are now missing after they were kidnapped in Mexico on Friday. And now a source tells CNN it may all have been a mistake. The FBI is saying that the victims were abducted by an unidentified gunman shortly after driving into Mexico in the border town of Matamoros.

Now, a U.S. official tells CNN that the Americans were not the intended targets, and that they were there for medical procedures. So, this morning, the U.S. ambassador to Mexico confirmed that one Mexican citizen, an innocent bystander, was killed in this incident.

Let's bring in former FBI supervisory special agent Peter Licata.

So, Peter, when you hear that they're -- these individuals were basically accidentally targeted in this attack, they were not the intended victims, what does that indicate to you?

PETER LICATA, FORMER FBI SUPERVISORY SPECIAL AGENT: It's somewhat frightening, right, Abby?

So, obviously, it was a case of mistaken identity for this cartel or for this criminal organization in Mexico along the border. And I'm sure the U.S. government, via the FBI and the legal attache's office in Mexico City and Department of State have done what we call due diligence on some background on who these individuals were.

So they have run them through -- these American citizens through numerous indices. And there's apparently no record of past or ongoing criminal activity, which then takes them out of that -- out of that realm.

And then more investigation leads to why were they there, and, apparently, it was for some medical treatment.

PHILLIP: So, the FBI is now offering a $50,000 reward for information about this.

We don't know the identities of these Americans. We actually don't even know their condition, whether they are alive or not at this point. Do you think that, given that this was clearly -- they were not apparently the people who were targeted here, that that increases the likelihood that they could be returned safely in this environment? LICATA: Well, you hope so, right?

So now, if you put yourself in the mind of the criminal act, and so now they're in a panic mode, perhaps, so they have to figure out what they want to do, how they're going to potentially expose or not expose themselves to their whereabouts in order to have these individuals released.

They obviously have no valuables on them. There's no narcotics. There's nothing they can really hold against them if they thought they were a rival cartel or somebody that was shepherding narcotics or illegal substances or contraband across the border near Brownsville, Texas.

So these are things that this criminal organization is going to have to try to figure out very quickly before, one would hope, the arm of the Mexican federal government moves in on them.

PHILLIP: And this is happening in a Mexican state that has a Level 4 do not travel advisory from the United States due to crime, organized crime, and kidnappings. There's been an ongoing back-and-forth with the cartels in that area.

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I'm a little bit at a loss for why any Americans would be sort of driving in there, even for medical procedures. But what kind of activity must be happening there to kind of give this level of caution put out there by the U.S. State Department to just tell everyone, please do not go there?

LICATA: Right.

That's a hard one to answer. So, the State Department's advisory is obviously correct, right, kidnappings and violence against American citizens crossing the border for whatever reason, legitimate or not.

Here's the deal. Americans tend not to abide by these warnings. Some people don't even know they exist on the State Department Web site. They just drive or go wherever they need to, to get what it is they want, whether it's for tourism, whatever -- whatever the travel is for.

I advise folks, no matter where they're traveling, even if it's to Western Europe, London, Paris, Spain, somewhere allegedly safe. You always carry multiple passports, you fill out what we call an electronic country clearance with the State Department.

So, this way, the State Department knows who you are, why you're -- what country you're traveling in, what your itinerary is, and why you're safe. And by no means that's some reason for the State Department to monitor activities, because, trust me, they're not. It's in case something like this happens or even something more benign, like a natural disaster, bad weather, a storm, a hurricane, an earthquake.

They can identify what American citizens are there and potentially reach out to you or your family for notification.

PHILLIP: Yes, I mean, that's such good advice, especially in a situation like this. It's very scary, obviously, for these individuals. And, hopefully, they're safe.

Peter Licata, thank you very much for all of that.

And to Southern California now, where there are still some people trapped by walls of snow. A series of winter storms has left people stuck in their homes, unable to dig their way out. More than 170 people were rescued over the weekend.

CNN's Camila Bernal is joining us live from Crestline, California, one of the hard-hit communities dealing with these wild winter storms.

So, Camila, update us on the situation there. I see a lot of activity going on behind you.

CAMILA BERNAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is essentially the place where people can come for donations.

And I will tell you that I have been speaking to a lot of residents here, ones that are trapped and others that can actually come down to this area for the donations. They're frustrated. They're extremely upset. But they are also thankful for these donations, I want to show you what's going on here.

The shovels are almost out. That is the last shovel left. But they are also giving out food. One of the biggest concerns that I have heard from a lot of people is food for their pets. And that's what they have here. They also have formula for babies and diapers.

This is what these people need, desperately need, after being stuck in their homes for more than 10 days. And I have been talking to them. And one man told me: "Look, I have lost 12 pounds over the last couple of days, because it has been so difficult for me."

Many of them are doing everything they can to even just get down here to get supplies and to get food. And the ones that are further up the mountain, well, they can't even get here. And so that's where it becomes a little bit more dangerous, where people are saying, look, I can't even make it down there because there's still so much snow blocking their driveways, blocking access to the main roads.

And authorities are saying that they were able to get to about 80 percent in terms of cleanup of the roads, the county roads. But what they're saying is that it is very difficult to get to the side streets. And that's exactly the access that a lot of these residents need.

And that is why they're calling on authorities to do more, because they feel like they have been forgotten. It has been people in tears and people who say we desperately need more help, authorities apologizing and saying that they're doing everything they can and that there is progress, but that people will have to continue to wait -- Abby. PHILLIP: Hopefully, that help comes soon.

Camila Bernal, thank you very much.

And former President Trump is trying to stop another witness from testifying against him. This time, it's Mike Pence. But can he do that? We will discuss.

Plus, Russia could be about to take a Ukrainian city for the first time in eight months. what the fall of Bakhmut could mean for Putin's war.

And Chris Rock finally clapping back a year after Will Smith slapped him at the Oscars, and Rock did not pull any punches.

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PHILLIP: Food banks are bracing now that a hunger program that was put in place during the pandemic has ended. It guaranteed all recipients at least $95 extra in benefits every month. And that cash made the difference in terms of whether families were able to put food on the table or not.

And, according to the latest federal figures, more than 42 million Americans received food stamps as of November.

CNN's Gabe Cohen is joining us with the details on this.

So, Gabe, this is coming as grocery prices are soaring. There's high inflation, obviously. How much of a difference did this extra almost 100 bucks make for these families?

GABE COHEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, Abby, I have heard from parents, I have heard from seniors that said this money meant eating multiple meals in a day . It meant making sure that their kids didn't go to bed hungry.

The Urban Institute says those benefits lifted 4.2 million people out of poverty in 2021 and even lowered child poverty by 14 percent, significant impacts. And, look, they were always expected to expire, but it's coming at this really difficult time for families, with inflation and high food costs still squeezing their budgets.

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And the concern now is that this is just going to drive the U.S. closer to a hunger cliff. And food banks are likely going to be that first line of defense in the weeks and months ahead, and they are already seeing signs that food insecurity is exploding and that it may get worse.

I have spoken to food banks across the country from Arizona, to Ohio, Texas, Pennsylvania. And, Abby, many of them are seeing record demand right now, more families showing up for help than ever before, even more so than at the peak of the pandemic. And, in many cases, these pantries are now having to ration food to make sure there's enough to go around.

And, this weekend, "The Washington Post" published a piece showing a mile-long line and a three-hour wait at a food bank in Kentucky where people are struggling. Take a listen to what was happening there.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: when the SNAP benefits ended, it was like our line doubled the next giveaway.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come on up a little bit. Here you go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know what time it is now -- 4:06. Hot dog. I didn't know it had been that long.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But I have sat longer. If it wasn't for this play here, I wouldn't be a doing. With it, I can eat one meal a day. Without it, I would eat a meal probably every two, three days.

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COHEN: And that is the story that we're hearing over and over again.

Now, Feeding America says three-quarters of their food banks have seen a rise in demand because of this program's end. In some cases, it's 20 percent more people coming in for help. They are over budget. They are dipping into reserves. And it's going to be tough for food banks to even help the number of people they are currently serving, Abby, let alone if more people start coming in.

PHILLIP: It's hard to imagine that this is happening here in the United States of America, but it is.

Gabe Cohen, thank you for that report.

The special counsel probe into Donald Trump's effort to overturn the 2020 election is ramping up now. And the former president is using his go-to legal argument to try to block more testimony. This time, Trump wants a federal judge to stop former Vice President Mike Pence from testifying, again, citing executive privilege.

Now, already, Pence is arguing that he shouldn't have to testify because of the Constitution's Speech and Debate Clause.

And here to discuss all of this is CNN legal analyst Jennifer Rodgers.

So, Jen, this has been an ongoing argument. Trump has tried to use executive privilege before. It has failed. But this case does concern his discussions potentially with his own vice president. So, do you expect that the courts will treat this differently?

JENNIFER RODGERS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Abby, his go-to argument is right. We have heard this so many times before.

He will not win this legal battle. Executive privilege will fall in the face of the DOJ's need for testimony here.

There's a Supreme Court case squarely on point, United States vs. Nixon, which says -- and it's exactly the same facts as we have here -- in a criminal investigation, when the government can demonstrate a need for the testimony, which they can here because there were conversations that took place where only Trump and Pence were present, so Pence is the only witness who can testify about them -- then executive privilege will not stop that testimony from being obtained and coming in.

So it's -- there's precedent right there. The question is, the other go-to thing that the former president does, of course, is to appeal everything as far as it can go. So, even though it's a fairly easy answer on the law, it will take time for the courts to get through if he continues to appeal all the way to the Supreme Court, which we probably should expect him to do.

PHILLIP: Yes, I think we should.

And part -- that is part of the strategy to sort of draw this out. But the vice president, former Vice President Mike Pence, he's also fighting the subpoena in court, but on a different basis. He's referring to the Speech and Debate Clause because he, as vice president, presides over the Senate in that -- on that particular day on January 6.

So how long do you think it would take to sort out these two concurrent issues? And is there actually a conflict here, potentially, between Trump claiming executive privilege on the one hand and Pence claiming the Speech and Debate Clause on the other?

RODGERS: Well, they will have to sort out both of them, the courts.

And if Trump files a separate lawsuit, then they will proceed separately, although I think they will end up in the same place, which is the Supreme Court.

I mean, Pence's claim at least is different. We haven't heard it before. And it will take more time to resolve, I think, because the courts have not considered this exact question before. I think, ultimately, he loses this one too, and he will be forced to testify, at least in some part. It's possible that he wouldn't have to testify about the actual act of presiding over the Senate when the votes were confirmed.

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But that's not what the DOJ wants anyway. They want conversations with Trump before that happened. So, I think ultimately he will have to testify in the way that they want him to. But, because this is an issue that has not yet been resolved by courts, it's going to take a little bit longer.

PHILLIP: All right, Jen Rodgers, thank you very much for all of that legal analysis.

And this just into CNN: The FAA is now investigating a collision between two United Airlines planes at Boston Logan Airport. We will have the details next.

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