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A Second Norfolk Train Derails in Ohio; Clash Between Police and Protesters at Future Atlanta Training Site; President Biden Attends Bloody Sunday; Trump Wins CPAC, Blast Biden and Some Republicans; 10 Million People in the U.S. Under Winter Weather; Bakhmut Close to be Conquered. Aired 2-3a ET

Aired March 06, 2023 - 02:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN HOST: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us here in the United States and all around the world. I'm Rosemary Church. Just ahead here on "CNN Newsroom," Norfolk Southern getting slammed again, after another train derailed in Ohio. What we know about that second train and what it was carrying.

An active GOP, likely presidential candidate, speaking from Maryland to California, nailing the talking points, but refusing to target Trump. But is that a winning strategy? We'll ask our senior political analyst.

Plus, the battle for Bakhmut and what it could mean for the war in Ukraine if the city falls to the Russians.

Good to have you with us. With the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board is sending investigators to Ohio a little more than 24 hours after another Norfolk Southern freight train derailed. It was the second derailment by that company in that state in a little over a month after the toxic crash in East Palestine. CNN's Polo Sandoval has the latest.

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the general manager of Norfolk Southern, the owner and operator of the train involved in Saturday's derailment saying that there were hazardous materials being transported on this train, including ethanol and propane, but they were not on the train cars that actually left the tracks on Saturday.

A total of 20 out of the 212 train cars actually left the tracks as this train was heading from northern Ohio down to Birmingham, Alabama. Authorities really shift a lot of their focus on four tanker train cars, two of them were hauling what's being described as diesel exhaust fluid while the other two were hauling water soluble solutions that's often used to treat wastewater. Common industrial solutions as they described them.

However, authorities saying that those train cars did not experience any sort of spillage. So, the head of the EPA in the state of Ohio said that there was no chemical release into the air, into the water, into the soil. So now, a lot of the focus will certainly be on a massive cleanup process that is underway there in Springfield, Ohio. And also, on the investigation as they try to find out exactly what led to this derailment, just a little over a month after the toxic tragedy that took place in East Palestine, Ohio with the same rail company, in the same state.

However, at this point of the investigation, certainly nothing to lead investigators to believe that they could potentially be linked, but certainly a reminder that these kinds of derailments are happening according to the Federal Railroad Administration, roughly 1,000 derailments happening in the U.S. per year. Polo Sandoval, CNN, New York.

CHURCH: Here in Georgia, more than 30 people were detained after chaos erupted at the site of Atlanta's proposed public safety training center also known as Cop City. Police say a group of violent agitators used the cover of a peaceful protest to conduct a coordinated attack on construction equipment and police officers.

They say the agitators threw large rocks, Molotov cocktails, and fireworks at authorities, but none of them were injured in the incident. The police chief says those detained will face appropriate charges. CNN's Isabella Rosales has details.

ISABELLA ROSALES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): All of this comes off of the week of action, which started just yesterday by organizers here, really, activists who call themselves Defender the Forest, with seven days of events designed to draw attention to the Stop Cop City Movement. So, a protest, a rally. They've done guided tours, a portion of the nearby forest area, where activists have been really camping out for over a year in protest of this project that they have dubbed "Cop City."

Back in 2021, Atlanta City council, they authorized a plan to build a giant state of the art training center, $90 million for the city's police and fire department, 85-acre complex that would be one of the largest in the U.S. with classrooms (inaudible) city, a driving force (ph), a shooting range. But activists have called this an urban warfare training center.

CHURCH: U.S. President Joe Biden is warning that a fundamental aspect of democracy is under threat.

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On Sunday, he used a momentous anniversary to renew a call we first heard on the campaign trail. But as CNN Arlette Saenz report, a Republican-led House may make that goal difficult to reach.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: President Biden used the anniversary of Bloody Sunday, a historic moment in civil rights history to renew his call for voting rights legislation. The president traveled here Sunday to commemorate the 58th anniversary of Bloody Sunday in Selma, Alabama, talking about that moment where those 600 people marched across the Edmund Pettus Bridge in advancement of voting rights, but were severely beaten by many white police officers. Now, the president said that this is a moment in history that must not

be erased and that people must learn both the good and the bad of American history. And the president once again pushed for voting rights legislation, something that he promised during his 2020 presidential campaign, but is yet to come to fruition since he has been in the White House. Take a listen to what he's had to say.

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JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Selma is a reckoning, the right to vote, the right to vote to have your vote counted, is the threshold of democracy and liberty. With it, anything is possible. Without it, without that right, nothing is possible. And this fundamental right remains under assault. A conservative Supreme Court has gutted the Voting Rights Act over the years.

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SAENZ: So, far two pieces of legislation have floundered up on Capitol Hill. Democrats were unable to get something across the finish line as they controlled both chambers of the capitol, and now with House Republicans in control on the House side, it makes that work that much more difficult. There is many activists who become frustrated with the White House and with members on Capitol Hill for their inability to get new voting rights protections enshrined into law.

So, the president once again making his case that voting rights need to be advanced in this country. While he gave that speech, he also marched across that bridge, that 600 activists marched across just 58 years ago. A poignant moment, a reminder of the history of Selma, Alabama in the civil rights movement.

The president while he was here also talked about the tornado that ripped through this community back in January and said that there still is more work to be done for this community to recover, but his main focus here was trying to shine a spotlight on voting rights at a moment where legislation is stalled up in Congress. Arlette Saenz, CNN, Selma, Alabama.

CHURCH: One prominent Republican as announced he won't run for president next year. Former Maryland Governor Larry Hogan said Sunday he will not compete in the Republican primary. He said he is worried his candidacy in a crowded field could help former President Donald Trump win the nomination.

But one current Republican governor is widely expected to run in 2024 race. That's Florida Governor Ron DeSantis. On Sunday, he visited California where he spoke with the Reagan Presidential Library. There he claimed Florida has been an influx or has seen an influx of residents from Democratic strongholds casting Florida's approach to governance under his leadership as superior to left wing states.

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RON DESANTIS, GOVERNOR OF FLORIDA: We've witnessed a great American exodus from states governed by leftist politicians imposing leftist ideology and delivering poor results. And you've seen massive gains in states like Florida who are governing according to the tried-and-true principles that President Reagan held dear.

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CHURCH: Ron Brownstein is a CNN senior political analyst and senior editor for "The Atlantic." He joins me now from Los Angeles. Ron, great to have you with us.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hi, Rosemary.

CHURCH: So, at the CPAC gathering, Donald Trump attacked President Biden and many Republicans vowing retribution against Democrats and establishments Republicans. And what became very clear at that gathering is that Trump remains king for now at least, and that is reflected in polls showing him far ahead of the field, although Ron DeSantis has a chance of threatening Trump's position perhaps, but only if it becomes a two-man race. Where do you see the Republican nomination for the presidential race going from here?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, it's interesting because as you point out, Donald Trump has re-established a lead in polling. There had been more polls showing DeSantis ahead including some of the key states Like New Hampshire in the last few weeks. But Trump showed over the weekend, I think, both his strengths and his limitations.

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I mean, the strength is that he has an iron grip on a portion of the party particularly the most conservative elements of the party and particularly voters without a college degree in the Republican Party.

Now, compared to 2016 though, his ceiling does look lower and his reach looks more narrow. In 2016, he pretty much appealed across the ideological spectrum. There wasn't much difference in his support between the most conservative voters and more moderate centrist voters, but as you saw at CPAC the kind of message that he's giving right now is pretty much confining him to the most militant conservative voters in the party, predominantly.

And so, there is room, there's a room among white collar, somewhat more moderate, economically focused audience, or simply more pragmatic Republican audience that worries about Trump's ability to win. The question, as in 2016, has always been, can anyone unify the part of the party dubious of Trump as effectively as Trump can unify the part of the party that is attracted to him.

CHURCH: Right. And of course, former Vice President Mike Pence twice declined to support Trump if he becomes the GOP nominee saying he thinks there'll be better choices. He's hoping he'll be one of them of course. We're seeing these widening divisions (inaudible we, within the Republican Party.

BRWONSTEIN: Yeah. CHURCH: And that was made very clear at the CPAC meeting where DeSantis, Pence and others decided not to attend, leaving mostly strong Trump supporters in attendance there. What does that reveal in terms of who is brave enough to take on Trump at this juncture at least, and who chooses to hide and perhaps wait this out?

BROWNSTEIN: So far, the answer is no one is brave enough really to take him on directly. It's understandable that the candidates stayed away from CPAC itself. The institution has lost luster with the allegations of sexual misconduct against its director by -- or allegations by another Republican, and also (inaudible) it has effectively become a Trump subsidiary.

So, it wasn't that big a deal that they stayed away. The bigger deal is that they -- no one yet in the Republican field is willing to make a direct case against Donald Trump. And I think if anything of the last few weeks have showed us is that despite everything that has happened, January 6th, the threat of indictment, the losses in 2022 of so many candidates that he handpicked for the GOP, he still has the biggest piece of the party.

He is still the biggest figure in the party. And what that means is if you're going to beat him, you're going to have to give voters a very clear and persuasive reason why they should pick you and not him. Whether it's Mike Pompeo or Nikki Haley at CPAC or the others, no one really has been willing to do that.

They've only -- they've only gone as far as pretty veiled euphemisms. You know, generational change, you know, hints that electability. Someone sooner or later is going to have to make a stronger case against Trump if they want to keep him from being the GOP nominee again.

CHURCH: Right. And what about President Joe Biden's apparent plans to run in 2024? If that happens, how would he likely go up against Trump again or alternatively, against DeSantis, if the governor defeats Trump for the nomination?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, look, '22 showed you one path for Biden to win, which is that an unusually really, almost an unprecedentedly large number of voters who said they are unhappy with his performance and/or unhappy with the economy, voting for Democrats anyway because they thought the Republican alternative was too extreme and too tied to Trump.

So, there is that possibility of being able to mobilize a winning coalition not so much an affirmative support of, you know, your record that in fear of what this modern Republican Party will mean to your rights or values and to democracy itself.

I think Biden's vision of how he wins is that that fear turns out the core Democratic base of young people, voters of color, and college educated white voters, all of them primarily situated in our largest metro areas.

And then Biden himself, through his focus on kitchen table economics, you know, the blue collar blueprint to rebuild America, defending Social Security and Medicare, cutting down the prices of drugs like insulin, that through all of those efforts he can pick up a few points on the other side of the ledger, among culturally conservative, blue- collar, older non-urban voters, who will be attracted to a Trumpian cultural message, but might find -- might believe Biden's argument that he is looking out for them economically.

It's almost like a division of responsibility for mobilizing the Democratic base, which may not be his forte, but trying to cut into that economically strained, culturally conservative constituency, that has moved so sharply towards the GOP in Trump era, that seems to be where Biden is focusing his efforts.

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CHURCH: Ron Brownstein, always a pleasure to have you with us and to share in your analysis. Appreciate it.

BROWNSTEIN: Thanks for having me.

CHURCH: Bombshell reporting in "The New York Times" about Fox News and the panic that erupted at the network after Joe Biden won the 2020 presidential election. Fox was the first to call Arizona for Biden with the state effectively clearing his path to White House victory. Immediately after doing so, top network executives feared losing their audience to far-right competitors.

"New York Times" reporter Peter Baker says, his paper obtained a recording of an extraordinary Zoom call among top network brass days after the election. He quotes Fox CEO Suzanne Scott as saying this. "Listen, it's one of the sad realities. If we hadn't called Arizona, those three or four days following Election Day, our ratings would've been bigger. The mystery would've still been hanging out there."

And those comments from Scott are not the only ones raising eyebrows. CNN senior media reporter, Oliver Darcy, spoke earlier with Jim Acosta about some of the other starting revolutions.

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OLIVER DARCY, CNN SENIOR MEDIA REPORTER: In the past couple of weeks, we've seen a lot of details about how Sean Hannity, Tucker Carlson, some of these people were reacting after the election in the wake when viewers are upset. But you don't necessarily expect to see that perhaps from the people who are supposed to be leading the so-called news division over at Fox.

And in this report, you see some, you know, some evidence that these people were also concerned about the feelings of individuals -- Trump voters who are watching the network. In one e-mail that "The New York Times" obtained from Bret Baier who is the chief Washington anchor over at Fox News and the face really of election night over there, I want to read to you what he said.

He wrote Jay Wallace, the president over at Fox, and he said about the Arizona call, "It's hurting us. The sooner we pull it even if it gives us major egg, and put it back in his column, the better we are, in my opinion."

So, you have Brett Baier talking about putting Arizona in the Trump column, of course, it never was in the Trump column because Biden ultimately won that state. Just because he said in another part of this report that it was hurting the viewers feelings. He said it was -- it became really hurtful having to take this viewer feedback as the face of the network.

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CHURCH: Perhaps not surprisingly in light of the fallout, despite being the first to call Arizona for Biden, Fox was the last network to declare him the winner of the election.

Well, snow is still falling in California where some cities could see more than three feet of fresh powder over the next 24 hours. It's creating bigger problems for residents trapped in their homes with few supplies for the freezing weather. Derek Hayes sent CNN these videos of the huge snow banks near his southern California home. He says that while he and his neighbors are used to preparing for the elements, they can only do so much.

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DEREK HAYES, CEDAR GLEN, CALIFORNIA RESIDENT: We are snowed in. We're having to snowshoe out of our road here to get groceries, to get supplies and to check on our neighbors. There is a lot of, you know, elderly and disabled people in the area that need help as well and we're doing what we can to check on them, but we have limited resources ourselves.

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CHURCH: And this video comes from Crestline, California where the snow banks moved by snow plows are about 10 feet wide and blocking driveways. Anita Hodson who shot this video says she's been trapped in her home for 11 days. But thankfully, has not lost power.

Well, more than 10 million people are under winter weather alerts from the west coast through the mid-western U.S. right now. The winter storm system is expected to reach the Great Lakes area in the coming hours with up to eight inches of snow possible in parts of Michigan by Tuesday. High winds are also in the forecast in some cities.

And still to come, a situation very much like hell. We are hearing from Ukrainian forces in the eastern city of Bakhmut where there's been no end to the fierce fighting.

And oceans cover more than half the surface of the planet, but they've gone largely unregulated until now. A historic treaty aims to protect marine life and the waters in which they live. We'll have details for you on the other side of the break. Stay with us.

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[02:20:00] CHURCH: Ukrainian forces say they are still holding on to a key highway in Bakhmut amid a fierce battle for control of the city on the eastern front lines. Officials are dismissing speculation of a possible Ukrainian withdrawal. But one soldier describes a difficult situation inside Bakhmut where Russia's assault continues to cause destruction and losses for Ukraine.

Evacuation efforts have also slowed, at least 4,000 civilians remain in the city. But officials say at least 5 to 10 residents are leaving daily. CNN's Scott McLean is following developments. He joins us now live from London. Good morning to you, Scott. So, what more are you learning about this desperate fight for Bakhmut?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Rosemary. Look, last week, all of the signs were pointing to the fact that the Ukrainians may in fact be forced to withdraw from Bakhmut. You have the head of the Wagner Private Military Company saying that, look, the (inaudible) were tightening and that the city was or that the town was almost surrounded, something that the Ukrainians obviously disputed.

But the Russians have taken out a key bridge that cut off one of Ukrainians last remaining supply routes. You had the Ukrainian reconnaissance unit being ordered to withdraw from the town. And even Ukrainian officials weren't ruling out the possibility. But now, just a few days later, the situation looks much different.

One commander on the ground, he spoke to CNN, said that, yeah, the situation in Bakhmut is, quote, "like hell," in his words.

[02:25:00]

But he says that the situation has stabilized and that tactically things are the same. Meaning that the Ukrainians continue to fight and continue to hold that frontline.

He also says that a key highway connecting Bakhmut to the next town to the west remains in Ukrainian hands. That's important to getting supplies in and out. In fact, he said that there is not only no withdrawal talks at this point. He said that they are actually bringing in more Ukrainian troops to the front lines to try to really shore up their positions and try to make sure the town is held.

The Ukrainians acknowledged that look, the Russians have had some success on the margins, on the outskirts of town, but say that the river that bisects Bakhmut has not been crossed and that the town center remains in Ukrainian hands.

As you mentioned, a soldier in the town, who also has been speaking to CNN said that, look, the Russians are causing a lot of destruction. They're causing a lot of losses. But he also said that it wouldn't take that much extra help for the Ukrainians to actually be able to push back the Russians for quite a long time.

And last night, President Zelenskyy made special mention of not only the soldiers fighting in Bakhmut, but along the eastern front line. Listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE (through translation): I think everyone whose lives saves the life of Ukraine, I would like to pay special tribute to the bravery, strength, and resilience of the soldiers fighting in Donbas. This is one of the hardest battles, painful and difficult.

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MCLEAN: And you know, one of the advantages that the Ukrainians have had for months and months as they've been able to hold Bakhmut is that the town itself is heavily fortified. Not only by the Ukrainian army, but also naturally. There's plenty of natural barriers that make it difficult for the Russians to actually penetrate.

But over the weekend, the former head of the British Army said that, look, well that may be true, Bakhmut doesn't have all that much strategic value in that it makes complete sense in his view for the Ukrainians to withdraw to a more defensible line. But so far, no signs of that at this point, Rosemary?

CHURCH: All right, Scott McLean, many thanks for that live report. Appreciate it.

Well, the FBI is asking the public for information after four U.S. citizens were kidnapped in Mexico. It happened on Friday in the town of Matamoros in Tamaulipas state. An FBI press release says the four Americans had just entered the town while driving a white minivan with North Carolina plates when an unidentified gunmen fired at the passengers.

Armed men then took them away in another vehicle. The U.S. consulate general has previously listed Tamaulipas as a level four, no, do not travel area.

Well, still ahead, some migrants are getting out of Tunisia as quickly as they can. We will explain why many are blaming the exodus on the country's president.

Plus, one month after the deadly earthquake in Turkey and Syria, a look back at the damage and how survivors are trying to move forward.

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CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone. Well, some migrants in Tunisia are getting out of the country as quickly as they can. Many are returning to places like Guinea because they no longer feel safe in Tunisia. That is after the president there made offensive remarks against migrants that many consider racist.

And CNN's Larry Madowo is live for us in Nairobi. He joins us now. So, Larry, what more are you learning about these racist comments and of course, the backlash they're causing in Tunisia? LARRY MADOWO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Rosemary, Tunisia has become not just hostile to black African migrants, it's become hostile in some cases. There's been reported instances of stabbings and evictions and racist attacks. And this all follows the comments by President Kais Saied who said who said that the presence of these black Sub-Saharan Africans in Tunisia was part of a criminal plan to change the demographic makeup of the country.

This echoes what is called the great replacement theory. It's popular within right-wing groups in Europe and North America. And it's been criticized as a racist dog whistle because there are only about 20,000 Black Sub-Saharan Africans in Tunisia out of a population of 12 million. But now because of how bad it's gotten, some African countries are pulling out their citizens.

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MADOWO (voice over): An unexpected return home. Hundreds of people arrive in Mali from Tunisia where they say it's no longer safe for them.

ABRAMANE DOUMBIA, STUDENT (through translator): I didn't go out anymore. I stayed in my house. I didn't go to school anymore. I was locked up at home.

MADOWO: Almost two weeks ago, Tunisian President Kais Saied sparked a backlash against migrants with his controversial remarks, saying illegal immigration from Sub-Saharan Africa was the conspiracy to change the racial makeup of Tunisia. Saied also blamed illegal migrants for crime in the country and ordered security forces to crack down on them. Migrants with and without papers say they now live in fear in Tunisia.

The incendiary remarks resulting in evictions, firings, and even attacks on some migrants. Many say they want to leave the country lining up at their embassies for repatriation rather than face prejudice or worse if they stay.

WILFRID BADIA, IVONIAN IN TUNISIA (through translator): Landlords are kicking us out. We are beaten and mistreated. For more security we prefer to come to our embassy to register to return to Ivory Coast.

MADOWO: Saied has since denied his comments were racist, saying legal migrants have nothing to fear, but reiterated his belief that illegal immigrants are causing the downfall of the country.

KAIS SAIED, PRESIDENT OF TUNISIA (through translator): This is a matter for the state. It must take its responsibilities. There is no question of allowing anyone in an illegal situation to stay in Tunisia. There is a state and institutions.

MADOWO: Saied's remarks are causing shockwaves across the continent, the African Union calling them racist and shocking. Countries like Ivory Coast, Mali, Guinea and Gabon are now working to help the citizens leave the country. But some migrants say they've got nothing to go back to in their home countries. Even though some are living rough on the streets, after they say mobs ransack their homes, fueled by the President's words.

NATASHA, SIERRA LEONEAN LIVING IN TUNISIA: We need help. We need help from all over the world. Because we are really suffering here, Things are not really useful. You can see the place that we are sleeping. This is not the place you want to sleep. We are suffering.

MADOWO: Tunisia is home to about 20,000 migrants from Sub-0aharan Africa. The country has visa free travel for many African countries and has become a transit point for many illegal migrants trying to cross to Europe.

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It's also a country sliding away from democracy to one-man rule. In 2021, Saied suspended Parliament making way for a new constitution that took away many of the government's checks and balances consolidating power with himself. On Sunday, Tunisian demonstrators gathered in the capital Tunis, despite a ban on the rally to protest against the president and the recent arrests of opposition leaders.

A crackdown on critics and a purge of migrants signs Tunisia time as a democracy may be ticking away.

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MADOWO: Tunisia has always been welcoming to black African migrants and guests. I've been on holiday in Tunisia and I never felt any overt racism. But that all appears to have changed in recent days. You've seen these messages on social media, for instance, that calling African -- black Africans invaders and some of these really incendiary saying they're criminals. They're raping a woman, eating cats and dogs and saying they should go back where they came from, Rosemary.

So that is the impact of President's Saied's comments on the general population.

CHURCH: That is a real worry. Larry Madowo joining us live from Nairobi. Many thanks.

One month since a deadly earthquake rocked parts of Turkey and Syria recovery has been slow but it's ongoing. Officials say the disaster has killed more than 51,000 people in both countries. One aid group has described the damage as extraordinary. More than 5700 buildings were destroyed in Turkey alone, with police carrying out dozens of arrests over shoddy or alleged shoddy construction.

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has promised new homes for those who have been displaced. He is up for reelection this year. And in the coming hours the opposition is expected to reveal his challenger in the race.

A fire has ripped through a refugee camp in Bangladesh. Coming up. Details on the blaze that destroyed the homes of thousands of Rohingya refugees. Back with that in just a moment.

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CHURCH: After fleeing violence in Myanmar, thousands of people are now homeless again after a fire ripped through a Rohingya refugee camp in Bangladesh. The fire gutted around 2000 huts in Cox's Bazar on Sunday. Refugee volunteers trained in firefighting eventually gained control of the flames. Around 12,000 people have been displaced.

The station manager involved in Greece's deadly train collision is now in police custody. The 59-year-old was detained after Sunday's court appearance on charges connected to last week's head on crash between a passenger train and a freight train. At least 57 people were killed. It came as police once again clashed with protesters. This time outside the Parliament building in Athens. They use tear gas on demonstrators angry over the collision and the country's poor railway safety.

The crash is believed to have happened because one of the train drivers received instructions to ignore a red light.

I'm Rosemary Church. For our international viewers, World Sport is coming up next. And for our viewers here in North America, I'll be back with more CNN NEWSROOM in just a moment. Do stay with us.

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