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Israel Attacks Lebanon And Gaza After Barrage Of Rockets Fired Across Border; After Israeli Women Killed In West Bank, Israel Increased Security; Interview With Former U.S. Ambassador To Israel Daniel Shapiro; Wall Street Journal Reporter, Evan Gershkovich, Formally Charged With Espionage In Russia; Justice Thomas Defends Gifts Of Luxury Travel; Police Make Arrests In Killings Of Three Florida Teens. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired April 07, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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JOHN KING, CNN HOST: The Justice goes on to say, "These guidelines are now being changed and it is, of course, my intent to follow this guidance in the future."

Thanks for your time in INSIDE POLITICS today. I hope you have a peaceful weekend. Abby Phillip picks up our coverage right now.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST: Hello. I'm Abby Phillip in Washington. Welcome to "CNN Newsroom".

We begin this hour in the Middle East, where both violence and tensions are escalating.

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PHILLIP: Today, Israeli forces unleashed air strikes in Southern Lebanon and Gaza. And as Israel says, it struck targets belonging to the Palestinian militant group Hamas. Israel blames Hamas for firing 34 rockets from Lebanon yesterday. And the latest barrage since the two countries were at war back in 20 -- 2006. Now, that has raised fears of an escalating conflict across the region.

And just overnight, we learned that Israel has mobilized some of its military reserves. A short time ago, Israel's defense minister ordered security bolstered across the country after two Israeli women were shot to death in the West Bank. Israel has called it an act of terror.

Let's get straight to CNN's Fred Pleitgen, who is near the Israeli- Gaza border, and Scott McLean is in Beirut, Lebanon, for us as well. But let's start with you, Fred. Fred, you did talk to the spokesman for the Israeli defense forces just this morning. What did he tell you?

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Abby. Well, first of all, the tensions here are definitely very high at the Gaza-Israel border. In fact, as we stand here, we're constantly hearing Israeli drones overhead. Obviously, monitoring very closely to see that not more rockets are fired from the territory of Gaza towards Israel.

We had that overnight where dozens of rockets were shot at Israeli territory. A lot of them were taken out by the Iron Dome air defense system, but one did land in the town of Sderot. At the same time, the Israelis, obviously, conducted their massive air strikes across Gaza where they say that they hit some tunnels and also what they call, research and development areas of Hamas, obviously, where rockets are made.

Nevertheless, the Israelis are saying that right now it's an extremely volatile situation, not just here around Gaza but, of course, up north near Lebanon as well where you all said airstrikes overnight. But the Israelis are saying they don't want further escalation. Here's what the spokesman for the IDF f told me.

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LT. COL. RICHARD HECHT, INTERNATIONAL SPOKESMAN, ISRAEL DEFENSE FORCES: We are ready for any developments. You can understand from the language of how this event is unfolding that we want to de-escalate. I mean, there's a very, very sensitive weekend ahead with Passover, Ramadan and Easter, all aligning. And we're looking for a -- hoping for a quiet weekend. Although, we had another attack the right after the prayers in Jerusalem and the Jordan Valley, but we look -- we are looking to de-escalate. And if it's quiet, it will be answered with quiet.

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PLEITGEN: So, that's the spokesman for the Israeli defense forces there telling me if there will be quiet, it will be answered with quiet. Obviously, that's something that we have seen, that tense calm throughout the entire day. Hamas, meanwhile, has condemned the Israeli military, especially for the strikes that happened on Gaza, but, of course, on Lebanon as well.

They say that in one of those strikes, civilian infrastructure was hit, including a pediatric hospital. And, of course, later in the day in the West Bank, you did have those two women being killed when their car came under fire, the Israeli defense forces says. And as you've said, Abby, the Israelis really bolstering security since then across the country, Abby.

PHILLIP: All right. Let's go straight to Scott McLean right now. Scott, you are in Lebanon. What is the mood there? I mean, the word of the of the day right now is escalation. Are they concerned about that over there?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The short answer, Abby, is yes. You heard that sentiment from the United Nations. My team here in Beirut also heard it from the Lebanese security source today who said that they are worried that this could escalate further.

That same source said that the targets that the Israelis struck in the early hours this morning in Lebanese soil were connected to Palestinian militant groups. There had been weapons there in their estimation. And of course, the Lebanese military has been working hard to try to locate some of these rockets and rocket launchers to try to prevent further escalation.

To this point, no one has actually claimed responsibility, not Hamas, not Hezbollah, though the leader of Hezbollah had previously said that violations at the al-Aqsa Mosque complex in Jerusalem could cause hell to break loose across the region. And earlier, the Lebanese foreign minister was right here in this chair expressing a very similar feeling. Listen.

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ABDALLAH RASHID BOU HABIB, LEBANESE FOREIGN MINISTER: I'm not justifying it, but I'm explaining it, that in -- what happened in Aqsa is very important. And it really -- there is a reaction from the Palestinians, that there is a feeling from the Palestinians that this shouldn't happen, that their brothers in the West Bank and Gaza should be able to go to al-Aqsa Mosque without any problems.

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MCLEAN: Now, Abby, he also expressed considerable relief that those Lebanon and Israel believes responsible are Palestinian militant groups rather than Hezbollah. Obviously, Hezbollah having any involvement in these rocket launches would really escalate the risk of this turning into something much more-full blown. Hezbollah official was quoted earlier today saying that the deterrent power balance remains in place. In other words, war between Hezbollah and Israel likely would not end well for either side. Abby.

PHILLIP: It certainly would not. Scott McLean and Fred Pleitgen, both of you, grateful to have you there.

And let's continue this discussion with Daniel Shapiro, who is a former U.S. ambassador to Israel, and also David Sanger, a CNN political and national security analyst and a reporter for "The New York Times". Thank you, gentlemen for joining us.

Ambassador Shapiro, I want to start with you and those very pointed comments from the Israeli military spokesperson who says that Israel wants this to be de-escalated. That is a clear message. But obviously the de-escalation will only happen if neither side take steps that lead to continued violence. Do you have hope that that will happen in the days to come?

DANIEL SHAPIRO, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO ISRAEL: Well, that seems, Abby, to be the attempt by the Israeli leadership to try to deescalate this. They have trained their responses on Hamas targets, both in Gaza and in Lebanon. They have said that they do not believe Hezbollah was involved in this -- the rockets fired from Lebanon. And in fact, there was a helpful statement made by the prime minister of Lebanon, criticizing those who would use Lebanese territory to get conflagration underway between Israel and Lebanon.

So, all of that suggests that there is a kind of common direction here, which is to keep the focus on Hamas to avoid this escalating into a regional conflict, which I have to say is not something that could necessarily be avoided without very close cooperation or careful actions by all of these actors because behind all of this, there is Iran. Iran is seeking to use its network of proxies in the region in Gaza, in Lebanon, in Syria to keep pressure on Israel. So, it takes a lot of care to avoid that going into the direction of a full-scale war.

PHILLIP: Yes, and David Israeli -- it's military is calling up some of its reservists at this point. Given that, along with the comments of the military spokesperson, what does it signal to you about how they are moving forward?

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: I think they're moving somewhat cautiously, as Dan suggested. They don't want to see an escalation here. The boy is coming at the most sensitive time in Israeli politics. We're just a week and a half out from the resignation of the Israeli defense minister who was parting ways with Prime Minister Netanyahu.

Now, his resignation never actually took effect, and it looks like he's there. But as it as he was in the midst of that, it was with the warning to Prime Minister Netanyahu that given the changes that the prime minister was trying to make to neutralize the Supreme Court and so forth, some reservists wouldn't show up.

So, the prime minister is also, sort of, carefully navigating this to try to show that his military is still together and that he still retains, you know, full commander authority there. So far, that's happened, too, but it's a pretty delicate moment for them.

And I think, as Dan pointed out, the presence of Iran behind this is so critical because all of these groups are obviously -- many of them are dependent on Iran. But because we have such a big agenda right now with Iran, the nuclear program, having raised further ahead and the Biden administration really struggling at this point to find any handhold they have of dealing with Iran and so far, they have not really found one.

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PHILLIP: And Ambassador Shapiro, this is potentially the worst violence that we have seen in the region since 2006. How concerned are you that this could lead to similar or more significant breakout of violence? I mean, as -- has been pointed out, this is the cost of a Holy Weekend for Christians, for Muslims, and also for Israelis as well. It's such a tense time. Are you concerned about how that will play out in the coming days?

SHAPIRO: Yes, it's always as -- a source of concern when these holidays overlap. There is additional heightened sensitivities around holy sites which can be the sparks of conflict. Of course, David mentioned the internal domestic Israeli discord between opponents of Prime Minister Netanyahu and his government trying to enact as judicial overhaul.

And it is certainly true that when Israel seems divided internally, that could tempt its enemies, Iran and various properties of Iran, who may make the mistake in believing that Israel's won't unite in response to these constant attacks. Israel, of course, has a strong U.S. support for its right of self-defense.

But again, it's effort to try to keep what happened in Jerusalem over the last couple of nights with conflicts at the holy sites, and this array of attacks from Syria, from Gaza, and from Lebanon from boiling over into something much wider and much more dangerous, suggests that they are trying very hard to get through these whole -- this period of holy days and holidays without something major getting underway.

PHILLIP: Yes, and David, before we go, these Israeli strikes in Lebanon do risk drawing in Hezbollah. And as you've noted, that Iran backed militia is heavily armed. So, is it possible to do that and not draw in Hezbollah at this point?

SANGER: It's going to be pretty hard, and that's why they need a general de-escalation. I actually think that it's conceivable that the fact that we do have these overlapping holidays, one would hope -- in celebrations, one would hope would be a diversion for a bit. But as Dan points out, you know, the scarce resource here is holy sites that all claim. And that's why these times of the year get particularly fraud.

I think that if there was a sense that Israel is at a point of weakness and distraction, the Iranians will try to exploit that. But so far, there has been no sign that the Israeli command has been weakened in any way by the internal strife that we've seen over the judicial overhaul. And it's going to be pretty important to Prime Minister Netanyahu to keep it that way. He's also, somehow, got to try to keep his coalition together. And if that looks like it's fracturing, that may also seem like a moment of weakness at some point for some of these groups, and certainly for the Iranians.

PHILLIP: Yes, certainly the political dynamics here and the military dynamics here all converging at once. Ambassador Daniel Shapiro and David Sanger, as always, thank you both very much.

And now over to Russia, where "Wall Street Journal" reporter Evan Gershkovich has been formally charged with espionage by Russian prosecutors, that's according to Russian state media. The report went on to say that Gershkovich denied the accusations against him. Russian security service said last week that it had detained the "Wall Street Journal" reporter on accusations of spying.

The White House has demanded his release from custody, as have Dow (ph) in the Senate, both Republican and Democratic law leaders there. CNN's Matthew Chance is in Moscow for us.

So, Matthew, is Gershkovich still being held without consular access, without access to American officials in Russia?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's our understanding, Abby, yes. And we've been in constant contact with the U.S. embassy here in Moscow to try and get some detail on what access they're getting. And so far, they're saying they haven't got any. And obviously, they're consistently trying to get access.

Russia has said that it will grant U.S. diplomats appropriate access to Evan Gershkovich in accordance with the Russian law. But Russian law is very opaque. It's a very long, drawn out bureaucratic process. And unfortunately for Evan and for his family, of course, who are -- I expect, waiting very anxiously for some more news about how he's doing, that consular access hasn't been forthcoming yet. I expect it will come. But the Russians will wait -- will make the U.S. diplomats wait as long as they possibly can before they allow it. Abby.

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PHILLIP: We will certainly be watching this story as it unfolds. Matthew Chance in Moscow, thank you very much for that.

And still ahead for us, the Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, he's speaking out, explaining why he didn't need to disclose luxury trips paid for by a major Republican donor.

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PHILLIP: A short time ago, Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas pushed back on criticism over gifts he'd received from a major donor to the Republican Party that he took without disclosing them. That was first reported in "ProPublica" this week. CNN Supreme Court Reporter Ariane de Vogue is joining us now with more.

So, Ariane, this is, first of all, extraordinary to even hear from Thomas on this, but what is he saying?

ARIANE DE VOGUE, CNN SUPREME COURT REPORTER: Right, it is the first time he's responded, and he rarely gives such responses.

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But he actually released a pretty lengthy statement. And basically, he said that he didn't disclose these trips because he didn't think that he had to. In this statement, he said that he and his wife, Ginni Thomas, who's a well-known conservative activist, were longtime friends with the donor Harlan Crow. And he said in the statement, early in my tenure at the court, I sought guidance from my colleagues and others in the judiciary and was advised that this sort of personal hospitality from close personal friends, who do not have business before the Court, was not reportable.

It's a key there that he said -- that do not have business before the court. He clearly wanted to get that out, that he didn't -- he felt like Crow wasn't implicated in that way. And he also said, look, the rules have changed, and we know that. In March, the administrative office of U.S. court revised its rules that would now cover such travel. And he said, going forward, he would absolutely follow the rules. But this has triggered just an enormous backlash here, mostly because Crow himself is just such a big donor. And also, that these weren't just, you know, Uber trips. These were luxury travel on private jets, private yacht, staying in private resorts in places like New Zealand and Indonesia. So, now Democrats are asking for hearings to look into this. But again, the court is in the middle of the political spotlight, and that is a place that it hates to be.

PHILLIP: It's -- it hates to be there, but recently has been there quite a lot. Ariane de Vogue, thank you very much for all of that.

So, let's continue this discussion. Joining us now is former ethics lawyer for the Bush White House, Richard Painter. He's also a professor of corporate law at the University of Minnesota. So, Richard, here's what I don't understand here, Justice Thomas, at one point had disclosed some of these types of gifts from Harlan Crow. But then he stopped doing it over the last 20 years. So, do you see his nondisclosure as illegal or unethical, just -- or that it just maybe looks bad?

RICHARD PAINTER, FORMER WHITE HOUSE ETHICS LAWYER AND PROFESSOR OF CORPORATE LAW, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA: Well, this makes no sense to me because there is a personal hospitality exception, yes. But that's a friend inviting you over for dinner at their house or a cocktail party, perhaps, to -- for a weekend stay at their house up in the Pocono Mountains or something like that.

The personal hospitality exception clearly does not include transportation on a private jet or on a yacht. This doesn't fit within the language of the exception that we had before, and we shouldn't need the administrative office of the United States Courts to have to clarify that. What we have at the Supreme Court is a culture of noncompliance. Noncompliance with basic ethics requirements, including disclosure requirements that applied not just the justices and judges, but to other singer (ph) of United States government officials.

And we have noncompliance. And then he -- the Justice says, he spoke with colleagues. We don't know which colleagues. This is the phenomena we've seen in many workplaces of colleagues covering up for colleagues. And this is just unacceptable when it comes to the --

PHILLIP: What do you --

PAINTER: -- justices of the Supreme -- make decisions that are bonding on the rest of America.

PHILLIP: Yes, I mean, on that very point, he talks about Harlan Crow as a friend, and says Harlan Crow doesn't have business before the court. Harlan Crow is not a party, as far as I know, to any particular case in front of the court. But you could make an argument that he does have an interest in how the court rules, as someone who is pretty active in the political space and has an interest in how the court leans. Does that -- is that clear in the guidance and the law as it is right now, that that might be a problem?

PAINTER: Clearly it is a problem. There's a billionaire who's donated enormous amounts of money to conservative causes, and surely is very interested in a lot of cases that come before the court, whether or not he has a direct economic interest in a party before the court is beside the point. This is why we have the disclosure rules with respect to gifts. We can't say, well, you should disclose these gifts and not those gifts because someone has a case before the court, or might be related to a party before the court. No.

We require disclosure of all free trips taken by justices. If they buy you a first-class airline ticket to the Bahamas, that has to be disclosed. They can't just get around that by saying, well, we put you on a private jet, and we're going to call that personal hospitality because the billionaire owns the jet. This is simply evasion of the basic requirements of disclosure, not that different than tax evasion. And we could maybe make an argument that you can wiggle your way around the law and it's just avoidance of the law --

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-- or maybe it's so called avoision, which is what the British economist in the 1970s called this practice of trying to work your way around the law. Manipulate the law, whether it's in taxes or anything else. And once again, this is shocking. But this type of behavior, to be engaged in by justices of the United States Supreme Court with their colleagues, just looking the other way, and apparently rubber stamping and saying it's OK.

PHILLIP: And we'll see -- this may not be the end of it. Democratic lawmakers on Capitol Hill say they are going to look into it. So, there might be more to this story in the days ahead. Richard Painter, thank you very much for joining us on that.

And still ahead, the sheriff of a small town in Florida announces the arrest of two juveniles, and a manhunt for a third after the killing of three teenagers. The latest on that case, next.

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