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Dual Rulings On Abortion Pill; Vice President Kamala Harris Meets With Expelled Tennessee Dems; Violence Escalates In Middle East; Planned Chinese Military Exercises Underway Around Taiwan; U.S. Investigates Leak Of Classified Documents; Russia To Deploy Tactical Nukes To Belarus. Aired 5-6a ET
Aired April 08, 2023 - 05:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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PAULA NEWTON, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): And a warm welcome to our viewers watching here in the United States and all around the world. I'm Paula Newton.
Ahead right here on CNN NEWSROOM, rulings by two U.S. federal judges illustrate what health care for women now looks like without the protections of Roe v. Wade.
Fallout from the move by Tennessee Republicans to expel two Democratic lawmakers from the state house. Hear what their supporters are planning to do next.
And a show of force on all sides of Taiwan. See how Beijing is responding, as officials from Taipei and Washington grow ever closer.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): Live from CNN Center, this is CNN NEWSROOM with Paula Newton.
NEWTON: So the abortion rights debate is once again front and center here in the United States. This time, a fight is brewing over access to medication abortion pills after federal courts issued conflicting rulings just minutes apart.
The Justice Department and a drug manufacturer have already filed an appeal to reverse the decision that seeks to block the drugs. Rosa Flores breaks down the two abortion rulings for us and their possible impact.
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ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: There are two conflicting orders on abortion that is causing a lot of confusion in the United States. First, there's one out of the state of Texas. A federal judge suspended the FDA approval of an abortion pill called mifepristone.
Now a federal judge out of the state of Washington also issued an order but ordering that that drug stay on the shelves of at least 12 liberal states. Now because these are two conflicting orders by two federal judges in the United States, legal experts say that this is likely to land in the hands of the United States Supreme Court.
Now let me get you up to speed about what we're talking about here. Mifepristone is an abortion drug. It was approved by the FDA back in 2000, so it's been on the shelves for decades. It is the most common way to terminate a pregnancy in the United States.
It has been used by more than 5 million women, is considered safe and effective. And medical groups say that the risk of death is quote non existent. Now the plaintiffs were asking this judge in Texas to completely take this medication off the shelves.
Who were the plaintiffs?
The plaintiffs are a coalition of anti abortion groups.
Who is the judge?
The judge is a man by the name of Matthew Kacsmaryk. He was appointed by president Donald Trump and before rising to the federal bench, he worked for a religious right law firm on anti abortion advocacy.
Now the hearing for this particular case was a preliminary injunction hearing that happened last month. It lasted for about four hours. And on Friday, Kacsmaryk issued this ruling, suspending the FDA approval of mifepristone.
But this judge also paused the ruling for seven days, saying that this will give time for the United States Department of Justice to appeal the order -- Rosa Flores, CNN, Houston.
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NEWTON: The Food and Drug Administration said in a statement that mifepristone was approved more than 20 years ago and is, quote, "safe and effective for its indicated use."
One OB-GYN doctor told CNN the fallout from the decision is going to be a lot wider than people believe.
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DR. JENNIFER CONTINENT, STANFORD UNIVERSITY: The majority of abortions in clinics in the U.S. are medication abortion, which means that this affects so many people.
And even beyond medication abortion, people forget that this medication is used for other aspects of reproductive health care. And it's used oftentimes, you know, for reasons like inducing a second trimester or later loss with a very wanted pregnancy. So the fallout is really a lot wider than people realize.
(END VIDEO CLIP) NEWTON: So it was no accident that the case wound up in the hands of this judge. It was, in fact, by design. Take a listen to CNN legal analyst Elliot Williams.
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ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: There are 93 federal districts across the United States of America. And typically, when a party files, you know, there might be 10 or 15 or however many judges in a district.
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WILLIAMS: And you're rolling the dice on which judge will ultimately hear and get to decide on a case, through a quirk of how courts are apportioned across the country.
But particularly in this portion of Texas, this judge was the one judge in the one court that could have gotten this case.
It was a deliberate, clearly, a deliberate choice on the part of the parties here to seek out this judge, quite possibly the most favorable judge on this issue, given sort of prior history and background there are.
So there is no question that not just forum shopping in the sense of well, I'd like to file this in the Southern United States or you know, in the Northeastern United States, where I might have a better chance of winning but specifically seeking out one particular judge and trying to engineer an outcome.
This was in many respects, sort of a policy decision in search of a court to help effectuate it.
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NEWTON: Vice President Kamala Harris made a last minute trip to Nashville, Tennessee, Friday, a day after two Black Democratic state lawmakers were expelled for protesting for gun reform while on the statehouse floor.
And the white colleague, you see her there on the right, was threatened with expulsion but spared. The vice president met with all three while advocating for stricter gun control measures. She addressed the issue while speaking at a local university. Listen.
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KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It wasn't about the three of these leaders; it was about who they were representing. It's about whose voices they were channeling. Understand that.
And is that not what a democracy allows?
A democracy says you don't silence the people. You do not stifle the people. You don't turn off their microphones when they are speaking about being the voice of life and liberty.
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NEWTON: CNN's Gary Tuchman is in Nashville and has more on the protests that followed and whether Justin Jones and Justin Pearson might soon be back in the legislature.
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GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): New energy at the Tennessee state capitol after a day of protests, debate and consequential votes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, Mr.. Speaker. The House stands in recess until 5:00 pm on Monday, April 10th, 2023.
TUCHMAN: Two Democratic legislators had just been expelled from the Tennessee House of Representatives by Republican supermajority.
In the hallways of the state capital in Nashville, demonstrators yelling and crying, with some staging a die-in in protest.
As legislators filed out of the House chambers, a chaotic scene. Tennessee state troopers standing between them and demonstrators, yelling was loud but all stayed peaceful.
And then out came the representatives who had been the subject of the expulsion discussions. Justin Pearson on the left, Gloria Johnson in the middle, Justin Jones on the right.
The two men expelled, the woman surviving by one vote. They were punished by Republicans for their demonstration on the House floor last week, calling for gun reform, walking up to the well of the chamber and protesting, following the horrific school shooting in Nashville last month.
DEMONSTRATORS: No action, no peace. No action, no peace. No action, no peace.
TUCHMAN: Republicans saying their behavior was disorderly and as a result, they made the decision to kick the two men out of the legislature.
So what does the woman who survived have to say about that?
GLORIA JOHNSON (D), TENNESSEE STATE HOUSE: I think it's pretty clear. I'm a 60-year-old white woman and they are too young Black men.
TUCHMAN: The chairman of the Tennessee Black Caucus is Sam McKenzie.
SAM MCKENZIE (D), TENNESSEE BLACK CAUCUS OF STATE LEGISLATORS CHAIR: The world saw the optics. I don't have to say a word about the fact that our two young African American brothers were unfairly prosecuted. Information, evidence introduced inappropriately but they handled themselves like true champions.
TUCHMAN: Republicans deny a racism allegation, some saying that Gloria Johnson was not leading the protest effort last week.
One Republican leader told us further investigation taking into the ethics committee, a lesser punishment was not something his party wanted to do.
JEREMY FAISON, TENNESSEE HOUSE REPUBLICAN CAUCUS CHAIRMAN: This group, my caucus, which is the supermajority, there are 75 of us said no, that is not. We don't want to go to the ethics route. We don't want them censured. We want them expelled.
TUCHMAN: But one of those expelled representatives stands by what he and his two Democratic colleagues did, saying they were not being allowed to talk about what they feel needed to be talked about, gun reform.
JUSTIN JONES (D), EXPELLED TENNESSEE STATE REPRESENTATIVE: We have been expelled for standing with our constituents but I have no regrets. I will continue to speak up for District 52 and for Tennesseans who are demanding change.
TUCHMAN: Notably, both expelled legislators could be back in office and soon their county commissions will appoint temporary representatives prior to the next election and they are permitted to select the two men who were expelled.
When the Tennessee state House of Representatives reconvenes on Monday, there are expected to be protesters where we're standing, showing their support for the two legislators who were expelled --
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TUCHMAN: -- and the one who was almost expelled.
And those three, Justin Jones, Justin Pearson and Gloria Johnson, it's anticipated they will be here, too -- Gary Tuchman, CNN, in Nashville.
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NEWTON: As you just heard, Tennessee Republicans have rejected allegations that their decision to expel Pearson and Jones but not Gloria Johnson was racist. Listen to what Bryan Richey, a GOP state lawmaker, had to say about that.
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BRYAN RICHEY, (R) TENNESSEE STATE REPRESENTATIVE: It was two energetic, youthful males that were a little bit more animated while they were up there. And Ms. Gloria Johnson, Representative Johnson, stood there.
She -- when the -- they played the video, it clearly showed her standing there not doing as much and I think that swayed other members to not vote for her. And that's why she's still there.
Had nothing to do with the color of their skin. I respect all three of them and their constituents that voted for them, I felt that they should stay.
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NEWTON: Israeli authorities have mobilized reserve units after reporting two deadly terror attacks on Friday, the latest acts of violence in a week of heightened tensions in Tel Aviv.
Police say a car hit a crowd of tourists before flipping over on a beachfront walkway. An Italian citizen was killed and seven other people were wounded. Police killed the driver.
Here's how witnesses described the deadly scene.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were right across the street.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) yes, right across the street, maybe 100 meters over.
QUESTION: And what did you see?
How do --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What our --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We heard --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- we heard gunfire. We saw shots and then we saw people sprinting across the street. And then we heard sirens. And we decided it was time to get out of here.
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NEWTON: And earlier on Friday, a separate shooting attack in the occupied West Bank left two women dead.
Authorities say the victims were British Israeli sisters and that their mother was seriously wounded in the attack. We want to get more and all of this now from CNN's Salma Abdelaziz in Jerusalem.
I mean, both chilling terror attacks there and obviously everyone still with quite a bit of unease about where this conflict is going next. It seems that we have some measure of calm at the moment.
But what more are you hearing?
SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, Paula, but they're still really all across this region a sense of fear and worry in what is supposed to be a weekend.
There is a weekend of religious observation for all three faiths. You have Passover, Ramadan and Easter all converging at once. And it comes after three days of escalating violence across the region.
It all really began on Wednesday when Israeli police raided Al-Aqsa mosque, of course, one of the holiest sites in Islam, very inflammatory images of Israeli police beating people inside with batons, with the butt of their rifles, that were spread across the region.
Condemnation poured in as well as rockets in response, coming from Gaza, of course, Hamas controlled Gaza, and from southern Lebanon. The barrage coming from southern Lebanon was the largest seen since the war in 2006.
Israeli authorities blamed Hamas from operating from inside southern Lebanon and prime minister Netanyahu vowed to retaliate. We saw these tit-for-tat responses, the Israeli military think that it did strike sites in both of those locations in southern Lebanon and in Gaza.
It seemed to be a very measured response, very measured actions on both sides. But that all really spiraled yesterday with these two separate terror attacks, the first in the morning in the occupied West Bank.
A shooting attack described as a terror incident by Israeli authorities that left two sisters, a 16 year old and a 20 year old, they were dual nationals, British Israeli nationals, those two sisters killed in that attack and their mother seriously wounded.
And then into the evening in Tel Aviv, this very shocking, chilling attack that you mentioned on the -- on the promenade in Tel Aviv, the beachfront, very busy, popular area.
Again it's Passover so you can expect families, friends gathered there that evening. That's when Israeli police say this terror attack took place, the perpetrator right driving, ramming their car into pedestrians.
All of the victims were tourists. One of the victims killed an Italian national; one person killed and some of those wounded still remain in hospital and recovering. As you mentioned this morning, things are calm.
But all of those factors, Paula, that have led to this latest escalation of violence from the rhetoric coming from Hamas and Hezbollah to the Israeli military being on high alert, to the religious holidays ongoing, all of those factors are in place.
And that's why there's fears that the cycle of violence could escalate.
NEWTON: And this obviously comes after very tumultuous times in Israel and some very violent months, even before this happened. Salma, thanks for the update, appreciate it.
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NEWTON: The violence on Friday happened after, as Salma's just saying, after Israel struck Palestinian militant targets in southern Lebanon. Israeli forces say it was in response to rocket attacks fired from the area. CNN's Scott McLean is in Lebanon. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: No one has claimed responsibility yet for the barrage of rockets fired from Lebanese territory toward Israel on Thursday, not Hamas, not Hezbollah.
Though previously the leader of Hezbollah, Hassan Nasrallah, has said that violations at the Al-Aqsa mosque complex could cause hell to break loose across the region. Earlier, the Lebanese foreign minister expressed a very similar feeling. Listen.
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ABDALLAH RASHID BOUHABIB, LEBANESE FOREIGN AFFAIRS MINISTER: I'm not justifying it but I'm explaining it, that in what happened in Al-Aqsa is very important. And it's really there is a reaction from the Palestinians that there is a feeling from the Palestinians that this shouldn't happen, that their brothers in the West Bank and Gaza should be able to go to Al-Aqsa mosque without any problems.
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MCLEAN: The minister also expressed relief that this was carried out by what he described as Palestinian militant groups rather than Hezbollah, which would have carried a much higher risk of escalation.
That risk of escalation, there have been concerns about it expressed by the United Nations, by a Lebanese security source who spoke to my team earlier, saying that some of the targets that Israel was aiming at actually were militant targets, actually were weapons.
But the foreign minister insists that the work of his government has lessened the risk of that though he concedes that given the complexities of his country and of the region, he is relying on Hezbollah to tell those militant groups and the United States to tell Israel not to escalate things further.
This is essentially a game of telephone with potentially very dire real-life consequences -- Scott McLean, CNN, Beirut.
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NEWTON: Northern Ireland is on high alert ahead of the 25th anniversary of the Good Friday Agreement. A look at the legacy of that landmark deal that ended decades of sectarian violence known as The Troubles.
Plus the American journalist detained in Russia is now formally charged with espionage. What it means for the case against Evan Gershkovich as he denies allegations of spying.
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NEWTON: Pope Francis is expected to lead Easter vigil service later today. That's after a last minute change of plans on Good Friday. The pope was wheeled into St. Peter's Basilica and remain seated during prayer services. You see him there.
But he missed the traditional Way of the Cross procession at Rome's Colosseum and that was due to cold weather. Now the pontiff has been struggling with his health. The 86 year old was released from a Rome hospital just last Saturday after a bout of bronchitis.
U.S. President Biden will travel to Belfast on Tuesday to mark the 25th anniversary of the Good Friday Agreement. And that's the peace deal that brought an end finally to decades of sectarian violence. It established a power sharing government.
Northern Ireland comprised of (sic) both Unionists and Republicans, although Stormont has been in a state of collapse amid Brexit. Ahead of that anniversary, though, police are on high alert, deploying, quote, "significant forces" this Easter weekend.
And they're warning of possible disorder, even terrorist activity from dissident Republicans. A top officer says these measures haven't been necessary for years. Our Nic Robertson has more now from Belfast on the legacy of a Good Friday Agreement.
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NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: I think it really depends on who you speak to about how much the Good Friday Agreement has delivered over the past quarter century.
But the one thing that everyone would agree on here is it brought peace, it brought safety, it brought the knowledge that you could go out shopping in the central Belfast with your family and not be caught up in an explosion.
More 3,500 people were killed during those three decades known as The Troubles. So yes, Northern Ireland has moved on and, yes, you can look around, see the development, see the development here in the city center, see the new businesses, the new hotels, all those sorts of things that come with an improvement in the economy.
But there are other areas where people will tell you, particularly the younger generation, have been telling us that they feel that the Good Friday Agreement hasn't delivered enough, not really, on their expectations, that you really can't have a good conversation between, let's say, the pro-British and the pro-Irish communities about the identity of Northern Ireland and the people who live here.
And what happens next, there's a movement for United Ireland. There's a strong movement to remain part of the United Kingdom. So all of these areas don't get very much discussion.
There's a political stasis here between the major political parties and that's bringing some economic issues. But really it's that big issue, Good Friday Agreement brought peace but it sort of held that. There isn't a pathway forward. There isn't a way forward to what comes next.
And that's something you hear a lot of from the younger generation -- Nic Robertson, CNN, Belfast.
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NEWTON: China says it is sending a message to Taiwan as it conducts three days of military exercises on all sides of the island.
Taiwan says at least eight Chinese ships and 42 aircraft have been detected in the strait. This follows the Taiwanese leader's 10 day trip to Central America and the United States, which Beijing denounced as a provocation.
Tsai did not mention the Chinese drills when she met with a visiting delegation of U.S. lawmakers today. CNN's Will Ripley is in Taipei and has our report.
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WILL RIPLEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's not entirely unexpected that, just after Taiwan president Tsai Ing-wen arrived back from the United States and Central America, that 10 day diplomatic trip --
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RIPLEY: -- which included that transit stop in California and that meeting with the U.S. House Speaker Kevin McCarthy, which infuriated China, that this would be happening.
The PLA Eastern Theater Command announcing United Sharp Sword, these military drills starting on Saturday, saying they're going to end on Monday, of combat ready patrols and exercises in and around the Taiwan Strait, to the north, south and east of Taiwan, both the sea and the airspace, as planned, the PLA says.
They put on a quote, saying that, "This is a serious warning against the Taiwan separatist forces' collusion with external forces," a reference to the U.S., "and a necessary move to defend national sovereignty and territorial integrity."
Dozens of PLA warplanes were also spotted in and around Taiwan's Air Defense Identification Zone beginning on Saturday morning. Now Taiwan's defense ministry of course they have -- they're monitoring this. They're on high alert if you will. But their statement seems to downplay the significance of this Sharp Sword exercise by China.
This is what the statement reads, in part, "In recent years, the Chinese Communist Party has continued to send aircraft and ships to harass the region, which has threatened the regional situation.
"It even used President Tsai's visit and transit to the United States as an excuse to conduct military exercises, which has seriously damaged regional peace, stability and security."
So here in Taipei, this act, that they believe is an attempt to intimidate them, they say will not cause Taiwan to react in a way that will escalate this situation. It seems to be China, you know, doing all of this, angry about President Tsai's transit through the United States.
Meanwhile President Tsai didn't even mention the military drills when she made comments on Saturday because she's meeting with yet another bipartisan group of U.S. lawmakers, including some of the men and women in Congress who will be making a decision about whether to sell Taiwan even more defensive weapons to defend against a potential Chinese invasion -- Will Ripley, CNN, Taipei.
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NEWTON: The ordeal is over for a group of Ukrainian children, allegedly deported by Russia. We will show you the moment when they finally make it back to Ukraine.
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NEWTON: And welcome back to our viewers here in the United States and all around the world. I'm Paula Newton and you are watching CNN NEWSROOM.
Russia has now formally charged "The Wall Street Journal" reporter Evan Gershkovich with espionage. Russian authorities detained the American journalist last week, accusing him of spying, which he denies. Matthew Chance reports on where the case against him goes from here.
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MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: In some ways, it's just a legal formality. The authorities here in Russia have 10 days to formally charge a suspect before they have to let them go.
And it's exactly 10 days since Evan Gershkovich was arrested in the city of Yekaterinburg on suspicion of espionage. And so these very big, slow wheels of bureaucracy in Russia are turning.
And of course, it dashes any hopes that the Russians might change their mind, might think twice and might set Evan Gershkovich, "The Wall Street Journal" reporter, free. Certainly that's been the call of his newspaper.
They've issued a statement over the course of the past few hours, saying they categorically rejects as false the espionage charges against their reporter and they're calling them unjustified and again calling for his immediate release. In fact, that's incredibly unlikely to happen.
Gershkovich has been remanded in the Lefortovo prison in Moscow until May the 29th while the authorities build their case. It could be extended even longer than that, if the authorities decide they want more time.
And of course, when this trial eventually starts -- and that could be months away -- and reaches its conclusion, there's a 99 percent chance if statistics are anything to go by in Russia, there will be a conviction, which means that Evan Gershkovich will be facing a possible sentence of 20 years in prison.
It's only after that process is over that there's a possibility of some sort of deal with the United States. In the past, there have been prisoner swaps. I think the expectation, at least the hope is, that something can be arranged to set Evan Gershkovich free as well -- Matthew Chance, CNN, Moscow.
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NEWTON: Some U.S. military secrets about Ukraine were apparently posted online for anyone to see, included in what appears to be classified documents that started showing up on social media at least a month ago.
The U.S. Justice Department is now investigating how they leaked out. And as Natasha Bertrand reports, there are many key questions still unanswered.
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NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: The Pentagon says it is investigating reports of social media posts that appeared to show classified information about U.S. and NATO assessments of Ukraine's military capabilities.
Now it is unclear how these documents appeared online, how long they have been online and, crucially, when the U.S. actually became aware of these documents that have been circulating on Twitter and Telegram.
But we are told from sources that these documents do appear to be largely authentic. They are part of a daily slide deck that is created by Pentagon officials to brief senior officials on the situation in Ukraine.
But there's an important caveat to that, which is that officials say that at least some of these documents appear to have been doctored. One of those documents shows that it has been doctored to show that the Russian casualty rate is actually far lower than the U.S. has actually assessed it to be.
And that suggests to U.S. officials that someone with an incentive to convey that the Russian killed in action rate is far lower than what the U.S. has assessed it to be actually doctored that document. So there are a lot of -- there are a lot of -- there's a lot of
caution being expressed here by U.S. officials when -- with regard to how the U.S. and the public writ large to treat these documents.
But look, the Pentagon and U.S. officials are fairly very concerned as a whole about the fact that documents that do appear to have legitimately classified information about Ukrainian training and equipment appear -- have appeared online just ahead of a very crucial Ukrainian counter offensive.
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BERTRAND: Now the Ukrainians are projecting calm about the situation with a senior Ukrainian official in the president's office saying that they believe that this is just part of a Russian disinformation operation. And that the leaked documents do not actually show anything particularly sensitive about Ukraine's military plans.
But the Pentagon taking a really close look at this and it remains to be seen what comes out of their review -- Natasha Bertrand, CNN, at the Pentagon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Ukrainian artillery is fighting to keep Russian troops at bay as they press ahead with their offensive in the east.
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NEWTON (voice-over): Ukraine says Russia launched more than 40 attacks across the eastern front lines in the past 24 hours. Officials say Russian forces are still trying to take full control of Bakhmut.
The Ukrainian general staff says their forces are still fending off Russian assaults. But British military intelligence says Russians have regained some momentum in Bakhmut and they've likely reached the city's center.
Meantime, more than 30 Ukrainian children are back home after their alleged illegal deportation by Russia. They crossed the border on Friday after spending months in Russia and occupied Crimea, according to humanitarian group Save Ukraine.
It says some of the children were released after their mothers went to Russia to track them down. Those women also had the power of attorney to bring back the rest of the children.
Ukraine says more than 16,000 children have been illegally deported by Russia, which led to an international arrest warrant against president Vladimir Putin. Russia denies any wrongdoing.
We'll now take you to a region considered one of Ukraine's success stories in this war. Russian troops were pushed out of the northeastern Kharkiv region last fall, which marked a major victory for Ukraine. Now Ukrainian troops there are playing defense and waiting for their next move. CNN's Ben Wedeman is there. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Zhenya prepares his 50 caliber machine gun, he didn't fire this time but he needs to be always on alert. Russian forces are nearby. This position on the northern edge of the Kharkiv region hasn't seen much action of late but the men here have seen plenty elsewhere.
In January, Zhenya was in a front line foxhole in Donbas.
From early in the morning they would shell us with artillery and right afterwards their infantry would try to take our positions, he recalls, you could see them.
Much of the area south of here saw vicious combat. Last September, Ukrainian forces routed the Russians for much of the Kharkiv region. Before retreating, they toppled this Soviet era communications tower, scorched Earth their tactic of choice.
This position man by the 209th battalion of Ukrainian armies 113th brigade is holding steady, defense not offense is the order of the day.
Oleksi was a nuclear physicist before picking up a gun.
OLEKSI, UKRAINIAN ARMY: We have enough ammunition. We have enough weapon and different armor, equipment. But in small for defense, weapons for the counter attack, it will be better because we sooner free our land.
WEDEMAN (voice-over): The weapons they have are hardly the latest. The troops showed us a Swedish made recoilless rocket launcher dating back to 1978. They defend their position with other decades old methods.
WEDEMAN: Beyond this razor wire just on the other side are landmines. Fortunately, this area is relatively quiet.
WEDEMAN (voice-over): Which is a welcome respite for these battle scarred troops.
It was a nightmare how Yevgeny describes the battle in the dead of winter and Donbas all remember it for the rest of my life.
Fifty-two-year-old Vitali served with Russians in the Soviet Army. This war has severed old ties. We ate from the same pot, he says, reminiscing of his days as a young recruit. That was then, this is now after so many battles they prepare for the next -- Ben Wedeman, CNN, in the northern Kharkiv region.
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NEWTON: Vladimir Putin's decision, meantime, to send nuclear weapons to Belarus has the West deeply concerned over what he may do next.
Coming up we'll speak with a veteran arms control expert about how the U.S. and the West should respond to Russia's nuclear threats.
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NEWTON: Russia's war in Ukraine and the fears of its spreading beyond its borders are real. But we are also seeing how the conflict is having an impact felt in diplomacy as well and that can be just as worrisome.
Take, for instance, the New START agreement between the U.S. and Russia. Now START stands for Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty and is the only agreement left regulating the world's two largest nuclear arsenals. Think of that.
But last week, Washington told Moscow it will stop exchanging some data on its nuclear forces just as the Kremlin said it would do. Meanwhile, Belarus is potentially being pulled even more into Russia's orbit.
Last month, Russian president Vladimir Putin announced he planned to deploy tactical nuclear weapons to his neighbor. Remember, he staged part of his February 2022 invasion into Ukraine from Belarus. So it is worth noting here that, so far, there is no indication such weapons are being deployed.
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NEWTON: Joining me now is Rose Gottemoeller, a former Undersecretary of State for Arms Control and International Security at the U.S. State Department. She was Washington's chief negotiator of the New START treaty. She is the former deputy secretary general of NATO and is currently a lecturer at Stanford University.
And we can think of no one better to talk to us about this right now, especially as you have been writing. Just try and again insert yourself into the conversation of where we go now and why, because so many people have been alarmed by Vladimir Putin's comments.
And I want to get first to the threat that he has now put on the table, that tactical nuclear weapons, he may put them in Belarus. I want to be clear. These are short range weapons to be used on battlefields; they are not strategic nukes. That are a tool of mass destruction.
But on those technical, nuclear tactical part, nuclear weapons.
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NEWTON: Putin says, there's nothing unusual about this. He says, look, the U.S. has been doing this for years.
Is he right?
ROSE GOTTEMOELLER, FORMER UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE FOR ARMS CONTROL AND INTERNATIONAL SECURITY, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: Well, the United States does have an extended deterrence presence in NATO Europe.
For many, many years, the NATO European countries have deployed some nuclear weapons that the United States maintains its control over.
Interestingly enough, the USSR was very keen to have this arrangement laid down during the negotiation of the nonproliferation treaty in the 1960s precisely because it didn't want NATO nuclear countries to have their very own nuclear weapons. They didn't want to Germany in particular to acquire nuclear weapons.
NEWTON: But given those tactical nukes, I mean there's no control -- arms control agreements around those. There are, in fact, secretive arsenals.
How dangerous do you think they are in this context now with Russia invading Ukraine?
GOTTEMOELLER: Well, it's important for one thing to note that Russia already has nuclear weapons close to the borders of Ukraine and close to the borders of NATO. There is a central storage facility for Russian nuclear weapons at Belgorod within a few kilometers of the Ukrainian border.
And NATO countries have long suspected that the Russians either have deployed or easily can deploy nuclear weapons in Kaliningrad, which is their little enclave there on the borders with Poland and Lithuania, really right in the center of NATO Europe.
And so I think that, in some ways, this is not qualitatively new. There are already Russian tactical nuclear weapons close to the borders of NATO and close to the borders of Ukraine.
But on the other hand, we do know that Putin has worked very closely with Lukashenko to turn Belarus into a launch pad for Russian military operations and this aggression against Ukraine.
So there is a concern here that now we have yet another launch pad in this case for a nuclear threat against Ukraine and against NATO.
NEWTON: And given what you've devoted your life's work to and being that chief negotiator on New START, it is a bit of a mess right now and that does involve nuclear weapons that are an existential threat. You argue the United States needs to do more in this contentious era of U.S.-Russia relations.
What do you think specifically they should be doing right now?
GOTTEMOELLER: Let me say first of all that I think that Biden administration has done a great job staring down Vladimir Putin and all his nuclear saber rattling. The president has been very open and out there with a clear deterrence message, that any use of nuclear weapons by the Russian Federation will be a terrible result for Russia.
And really very clear in his message about the willingness to deter and defend NATO allies. And I think that that is -- has been very important. NATO also, together with the United States, has continued to exercise and train nuclear forces and that, too, conveys a deterrence message.
So I think the Biden administration has done a good job so far. But in this fraught period, when the Kremlin never ceases to rattle the nuclear saber, I think the United States has a special responsibility as one of the two biggest nuclear states -- of course, Russia being the other one -- to try to, in every way, avoid the potential for nuclear escalation and nuclear catastrophe.
So for that reason, I'm urging that the United States should look for more ways to communicate with Russia, with the Kremlin at every level, starting at technical levels, starting at low levels and then doing our best as we can to reach that man in the Kremlin, Vladimir Putin.
NEWTON: And I've only got 30 seconds left. But look, you argue, that's our best shot at deterrence, sitting down and delivering those messages clearly at the negotiating table.
GOTTEMOELLER: Absolutely. It's not only about negotiating in some namby-pamby way; it's about -- it's about delivering clear deterrence messages. And that is something we can really do forcefully at the negotiating table.
NEWTON: OK, Rose Gottemoeller. Thank you so much. Really appreciate your expertise on this topic.
GOTTEMOELLER: Thank you.
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NEWTON: OK, a terrifying moment in Augusta, Georgia, huge trees, look at that, come crashing down at the Masters, forcing golf's first major of the year to suspend play. Now no one was injured. "CNN SPORT's" anchor Andy Scholes will join us to explain just ahead.
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NEWTON: And thank you for watching for viewers in North America. "CNN THIS MORNING" is next for the rest of the world it's "THE NEXT FRONTIER."
