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California Higher Education Offers Preview For The Nation On Radical Diversity; Biden Slams Decision Rejecting Debt Relief Plan; Trump Pressured Then-Arizona Governor Doug Ducey To Overturn 2020 Election Results; Trump Holds First Rally After Federal Indictment; Worker: "Employers Think We're Not Essential Anymore"; Court Docs Reveal New Claim Against "Rust" Armorer. Aired 12-1p ET

Aired July 01, 2023 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Westley Zhou will soon be applying for medical school. He still believes affirmative action doesn't help him. It does see the impact beyond his own academic life.

[12:00:08]

WESTLY ZHOU, JUNIOR, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA, LOS ANGELES: I will say this, right? Affirmative action does harm Asian Americans, but without it, it will harm all the minorities in the United States. So that's where I stand right now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LAH (on camera): After three decades without affirmative action, the University of California system still believes that affirmative action is the way to go.

The UC system filed an amicus brief with the Supreme Court. The justices though deciding that the rest of the country should follow California on this issue.

Kyung Lah, CNN, Los Angeles.

SARA SIDNER, CNN HOST: Hey there, thank you so much for joining me on this July 4th holiday weekend. I'm Sara Sidner, in for Fredricka Whitfield.

We begin this hour with the fallout and reaction from several historic and controversial Supreme Court rulings that will have a broad impact across the country.

The nation's highest court sorted off this week by gutting affirmative action in college admissions. By a 6-3 conservative majority vote, the Supreme Court ruled that colleges and universities can no longer take race into consideration as a basis for admission.

The conservative court dropped two more landmark rulings on Friday. In one monumental case, the court said, with a Christian web designer in Colorado who refuses to create web sites to celebrate same sex weddings out of her First Amendment rights. The court also blocked President Biden's student loan forgiveness plan. He rejected the plan aim to forgive up to $20,000 in relief to millions of Americans.

In response, President Biden is now laying out a new plan to help those struggling with their loan debt.

For more on all of that, let's bring in CNN White House reporter Priscilla Alvarez. Priscilla, we know that there is a plan B when it comes to some of these rulings, particularly the student loan debt ruling by the Biden administration. What do you know?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: There is, Sara. But there is no question that it is still a major blow for President Biden to have lost this case before the Supreme Court on what has been a signature issue dating back to his presidential campaign.

Now, President Biden laid out his plan B in remarks just yesterday.

But what we don't quite know is whether it's going to have the same breadth and scope as his previous plan had, had. So, just a few bullet points here, it will reduce levels for income-driven repayment plan from 10 percent to five percent. President really touting that in his remarks yesterday.

We'll also have the Department of Education create a temporary 12- month on ramp repayment program when the debt payments restart.

Now, both of these will take months -- will take months, not days. And so, the problem that the administration faces, what the White House was trying to relay is that they had discussions about this, there was always talks about what could happen if it did get struck down.

But putting all of that into place now takes time. And so, that is something that the president and the White House is getting questions on, and we'll have to work through moving forward with the administration, and particularly the education department.

Now, when asked whether the president gave false hope to millions of people who were hoping for student debt relief, here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I didn't give any false hope. The question was whether or not I would do even more than was requested. What I did I thought was appropriate and was able to be done and would get done. I didn't give borrowers false hope. But the Republicans snatched away the hope that they were given. And it's real. Real hope.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ALVAREZ: You heard him there, say Republicans snatched away. Which really tells us that this is going to be an issue in the 2024 campaign. That has been sort of the through line over the course of the last few days is that Republicans are at fault here, especially when it comes to student debt relief from taking that away.

And so, this is not only a signature issue for the administration, it's also a political one. And right there, you're hearing from the president, just how that might be used in the months to come as they try to roll out those Plan Bs for many people who are seeking relief. Sara?

SIDNER: Priscilla Alvarez, always good to see you. Thank you so much.

We are also following new developments in Donald Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election. A source telling CNN that after the 2020 election, former President Trump called then-Arizona governor, Doug Ducey, in an attempt to pressure him to overturn the state's presidential election results.

That source who is familiar with the call says the former president claimed that if enough fraudulent votes were found, it would overcome his narrow loss in the state. From also repeatedly pressure then-Vice President Mike Pence to help him find evidence of fraud and overturn the election results.

[12:05:04]

Pence spoke to Ducey multiple times about the election, though sources say he did not pressure governor, as he was requested by Donald Trump.

This is a story that was first reported by The Washington Post, CNN has confirmed it.

Leigh Ann Caldwell is one of the reporters who co-wrote that initial article. She is also the Early 202 co-author and a Washington Post live anchor.

Leigh Ann, thank you so much for spending this holiday weekend with us. A really important story. Tell us more about what your team learned about Trump and his allies' efforts to overturn Arizona's election results. This case going deeper than a lot of people knew.

LEIGH ANN CALDWELL, POLITICAL REPORTER, WASHINGTON POST: Well, Sara, let's look at what we did know before. We knew that when the Governor Ducey was certifying the election results in Arizona, that Donald -- he was calling Donald or Donald Trump was calling his cell phone at that time.

We do know that Ducey and Donald Trump spoke at some point. But what we didn't know and what we just reported this morning, is the contents of that call. And it sounds very familiar to this is a call that happened in Georgia, where Donald Trump called Governor Ducey and asked him to find or to find enough votes on the 10,000 or so vote deficit that Donald Trump had that would overturn the election.

We also learned that Donald Trump put Mike Pence on the case. Had Mike Pence called Governor Ducey, who he was close friends within, had a very long relationship with multiple times to check in to see if Ducey had found anything. And now what we know is that Ducey repeatedly told Pence and the first time Donald Trump in that first call that he had searched high and low, his state investigators and officials had tried to find widespread illegal voting activity, and they just didn't find any, Sara.

SIDNER: Yes, this -- we're talking about the Georgia election. And we heard that phone call from the Secretary of State Raffensperger, where he was called by Donald Trump asking for those votes. And now we're hearing that this happened with the governor of Arizona.

your reporting also says that Ducey told a donor he was surprised that special counsel Jack Smith's team had not asked about the phone calls with Trump and Pence as part of their investigation. Could that now change now that your reporting is out there?

CALDWELL: It could very well change and we'll see if that does. We do know that special prosecutor's office Jack Smith, he interviewed Raffensperger very recently. And so, they are moving along in this investigation.

But what we had reported is that in a conversation with a Republican donor earlier this year, Doug Ducey suggested or surprise, the fact that Jack Smith's office had not yet reached out to him, because of this phone call with Trump, and the other phone calls that people in the administration, including Mike Pence, had.

I want to be clear that Mike Pence was not pressuring Doug Ducey, but he was calling on Trump's orders to check in. And so, it very well could change. We'll see what happens with the special counsel's investigation. And it seems to be very widespread, very large.

We do know that they have reached out to some people in Arizona. We do know that the then-Speaker of the House, Rusty Bowers, he testified before the January 6 select committee about the pressure that he was under.

But now, perhaps, the Special Counsel's Office will maybe reach out to the then-Governor Doug Ducey.

SIDNER: Sounds like someone they probably should reach out to we would not be surprised if that happens very quickly. Ducey -- let's talk a little bit about the political implications of this, because Ducey was considered a person that may be a 2024 candidate for the Senate in Arizona.

Now, here he is clashing with Donald Trump and the base still very much with Donald Trump. So, how has this impacted Ducey's political future, now that he's out of office?

CALDWELL: Sara, it's such an important point that you brought up, because the fact that this call and the details of this call were not widely known until now is quite extraordinary.

And that is because Doug Ducey did not want it known. Doug Ducey was feeling an immense amount of pressure not only from the Trump administration, but also from Republicans, the Trump MAGA base in Arizona to do something.

And so, Doug Ducey, his term ended, he is no longer governor. And yes, there were a lot -- a lot of talk that he would perhaps run for Senate.

[12:10:00]

But his base cratered. His base of support cratered in Arizona after he refused to overturn the election or to continue with this lie, or to be -- go along with a lie that Trump did, in fact, win Arizona.

And so, now, he is no longer in office. He is starting a new organization about democracy. But the thing is that Trump -- Ducey did not want a public fight with Trump. And that is one of the reasons why this has flown under the radar. Sara.

SIDNER: Yes, it just shows you the Republican Party is still very much the party of Donald Trump.

Leigh Ann Caldwell, thank you so much for coming on. And thank you for your reporting.

All right. For more on what this could mean for the former president, let's bring in Jeffrey Jacobovitz, who is an adjunct law professor at American University, and a criminal defense attorney.

All right. It's unclear right now with Special Counsel Jack Smith's office has contacted Doug Ducey, the former Arizona governor, about these phone calls that reveal he was pressured.

The Washington Post, as you heard reported -- reports that he also asked witnesses about Trump's calls with the governor. So, what questions do you think -- first of all, do you think the Special Counsel is going to go after Doug Ducey now to try to get his statement as a witness?

JEFFREY JACOBOVITZ, ADJUNCT LAW PROFESSOR, AMERICAN UNIVERSITY: Well, Sara, that's a very good question. You have to remember, recently, Jack Smith has gotten the cooperation of very senior Trump officials during the election. And so, he could be learning new information now.

And the other person who would be very interested would be, Fani Willis. Because, remember, Georgia and Arizona if there were an attorney general's investigation of both pardon proof that somebody has convicted.

And Fani Willis appears to be ready, and soon will be bringing an indictment. And if she does, that kind of information could be admissible in a Georgia trial, depending on what she charges.

And Arizona may not be the only state also in addition to Georgia. So, I think there is new information coming out. Jack Smith has been proceeding very vigorously now.

And it doesn't mean that since he hasn't contacted Ducey recently, he won't do it in the future. SIDNER: Right. All right. So, the Washington Post is reporting that these phone calls were not -- were not recorded, unlike the Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, who did record the phone call because he had said he was concerned about what this meant.

And if he, he didn't want to be called a liar, basically. So, he recorded this to show people what was going on. And it's very obvious what happened in that call. What happens with this particular former governor? Could he be exposed to potential legal trouble because of these conversations?

JACOBOVITZ: Well, the conversations alone would not expose him to legal trouble. He didn't agree to do something illegally. And remember, Jack Smith called Mike Pence to testify. And he recently obtained that testimony.

And so, it could be he learned about Ducey very recently, because if Trump that asked Pence to call Ducey, then, that's information that Jack Smith would learn.

And so, we don't know what Pence told Ducey. So, this information is percolating right now. And it could lead to something in the future. And there could be a state investigation, like there is in Georgia.

SIDNER: We know that a -- his former attorney -- Trump's former attorney, Rudy Giuliani, his personal attorney, testified. You just talked about Pence testifying. There have been a lot of people close to him.

I do want to ask about a campaign official Mike Roman, he is now cooperating with the special counsels' 2020 election interference probe.

Sources are telling CNN at this point that investigators are honing in on efforts to put forward alternate slates of electors in seven states. Those seven states that Trump lost.

How helpful is it for prosecutors to have somebody like Mike Roman, as they try to build this case out?

JACOBOVITZ: Well, depending on what he testified to and what he says. It would be very helpful. And, in fact, having somebody that senior and inside the room when decisions are being made, and seeing who's making the decisions, and who's pushing the communications to the various ledge of fake electors would be from a legal point of view, very impactful, and very important.

SIDNER: Jeffrey Jacobovitz, a very good conversation with you. We have just gotten in a statement from Governor -- former Governor Ducey, and I'm just going to read it to you all now. Because it's important to get an idea and to get everybody's take on this.

OK, here is what the statement for Ducey says. It says, "This is nothing more than a copy and paste of a compilation of articles from the past two years disguised as something new."

[12:15:01]

We're talking about the reporting from The Post and elsewhere.

And relying on shaky and questionable sourcing. Ducey spokesman -- person has put this out, his name is Daniel Scarpinato. He says, "Frankly, nothing here is new nor is it news to anyone following this issue the last two years Governor Ducey defended the results of Arizona's 2020 election, he certified the election, and he made it clear that the certification provided a trigger for credible complaints backed by evidence to be brought forward. None were ever brought forward. The Governor stands by his action to certify the election and considers the issue to be in the rear-view mirror. It's time to move on."

So, that is your statement from the governor. The time to move on quote. They are interesting because a lot of people have said that to Donald Trump himself. So, we will see what happens if he is contacted by the special counsel, who is looking into the shenanigans by Donald Trump and those around him to try to overturn the 2020 election.

All right. Moving on to this, former President Trump is holding his first campaign rally since his indictment. It's happening today in Pickens, South Carolina.

CNN reporter Alayna Treene is there.

Alayna, set the scene for us. I see that the crowd has already gathered.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Yes, they have been here. Many have been here since very early this morning. I was told some people came around 2:00 a.m., others even arrived last night.

And I apologize, it's very loud behind me. As you can see, it's typical of Donald Trump's rallies. He tries to make them like a rock concerts. There is hundreds, if not thousands of people here in this very small town of Pickens, South Carolina.

But I want to point out the significance of this rally for Donald Trump. It is his first since he was indicted in the federal investigation run by Jack Smith. And I think that he's going to have a lot of criticism about that investigation today, I'm told. And also, he has a lot of his other supporters here.

He's had Congressman -- or Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene was here. She was railing against those charges as well. And we just had Lindsey Graham. Senator Lindsey Graham speak just before this, also, discussing some of that case.

And so, a lot of people eager here to see him, hear from him for the first time since he was indicted. Sara.

SIDNER: Alayna, thank you so much. I know it's very loud out there.

Thanks for putting up with all of us. Coming up, workers in several major hotel chains are set to strike right in the middle of this summer travel season. Latest on those negotiations coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:21:52]

SIDNER: Triple digit temperatures and severe storms are threatening to wreck holiday weekend plans for millions of Americans traveling.

CNN meteorologist Allison Chinchar is here with the very latest. Allison, we're looking at that map. Doesn't look too terrible yet. But where are we expected to see this dangerous weather?

ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Right. I think the key thing, Sara, is that a lot of it really hasn't yet developed or really started to take shape. And that will continue to happen as we go into the afternoon and evening hours.

Now, we do have this cluster right here kind of sliding through areas of Dayton and Cincinnati, Ohio. A new cluster starting to form now in western Tennessee. That's going to continue to push east. And then, this other one that's about to make its way towards Dallas.

More and more of these showers and thunderstorms will continue to develop this afternoon and into the evening hours and they have the potential to become strong if not severe, producing damaging winds, large hail, and even the potential for some tornadoes.

You're talking cities like St. Louis, Nashville, Atlanta, even stretching over towards Washington, D.C. You also have that secondary area located across portions of western Texas.

Now, the first wave is ongoing right now. Once we get into the afternoon, a lot more of the showers and thunderstorms really begin to take shape. By tomorrow, that first section begins to spread farther east into the mid-Atlantic and the Northeast.

But we also have some stronger thunderstorms that are expected to develop across the southeastern U.S.

So, a lot going on here. So, if you have some travel plans, do keep in mind that you may encounter some delays, whether that is in the air or on the ground.

Heat is another big story. Now, for areas of the southeast, this is where we're going to start to see some improvements over the next couple of days.

Out to the West, it's going to be the opposite story. But let's begin in the southeast. This is a heat index forecast. Again, you'll notice the heat index going to still feel like it's triple digits today, getting back down to only double digits for those feels like temperatures in Dallas the next few days. New Orleans and Mobile, it's a little bit more of a delayed impact. But we will start to see those temp -- those numbers begin to drop back over the coming days.

Out to the west, it's the opposite. The numbers are going to continue to go up. Take Salt Lake for example. 93 for the high today, up to 98 on Monday.

Palm Springs topping out at 116. Phoenix around 115. Even Las Vegas getting well into the triple digits.

The thing about Las Vegas is yesterday, they just hit their very first triple digit temperature. This is very late in the season for them. In fact, tying their latest date of June 30th set back in 1965.

And unfortunately, Sara, it's going to stay hot the rest of the week.

SIDNER: Well, it is summer. Let's just hope it doesn't ruin people's plans.

Allison Chinchar, thank you so much for your reports.

A union representing thousands of hotel employees in Southern California set to go on strike today. It comes as part of a push for higher wages, as many workers say they're priced out of the cities where they work.

The union says 53 percent of members in Los Angeles and Orange County have either moved in the past five years or will move in the very near future because of soaring housing costs.

CNN national correspondent Camila Bernal is joining me now from Los Angeles, for more on these details.

Camila, this is a -- this is a big problem for very expensive cities, like New York, like Los Angeles.

[12:25:09]

How big of an impact could this strike have?

CAMILA BERNAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Sara. It's a significant impact, because we're talking about 15,000 workers in 65 different hotels throughout Los Angeles and Orange County.

And what I'm being told is that they could walk out at any moment. We are waiting for details from the union to figure out exactly what is going to happen over the weekend.

But as of now, what they're saying is, hold on, it could happen at any moment. And these are, essentially, the people that greet you at the hotels, the front desk people -- really, everyone that sort of behind the scenes that are cleaning and cooking for the hotel guests.

And so, it is going to make a difference and an impact at these hotels. What these workers are asking for is an increase in wages and in pensions. They're specifically asking for a $5 an hour increase.

They're also asking for safer workloads. They're also demanding better health care benefits. And there is this idea that they want to create a housing fund.

And it's because of what you were mentioning, Sara, the fact that a lot of these workers say they can't even live in Los Angeles because it is so expensive.

Many of these workers having to drive two, three hours to get to their jobs. And so, what the union is saying is that this is not something that these workers should be dealing with. They should be able to afford to live in these areas.

Here is what one of those union members had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LUCERO RAMIREZ, HOTEL WORKER: During the pandemic, we were called essential workers. Now, there is no pandemic, employers think we are not essential anymore, and they think they can run without us, but we all know that's not true.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERNAL: And a person familiar with hotel management plans has said that they offered $2.50 an hour. That increase. And of course, we are waiting for both sides to either confirm or deny these numbers to see exactly where they are in terms of those negotiations.

But we do expect these hotels to stay open. There is this notion on the side of the hotels that it really is the responsibility of city leaders here in Los Angeles to work on affordability and the fact that people should live where they work.

And again, this is the Fourth of July holiday weekend, and there is a sold-out anime convention. So, we're waiting to see how much of an impact this will have. But it could definitely be significant. Sara.

SIDNER: It could be huge. Camila Bernal, thank you so much.

Coming up, a damning new report from the state department on the failures of the Afghanistan withdrawal. What we are learning about the chaos surrounding the U.S. exit.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:32:03]

SIDNER: A new report details the failings of the deadly and extremely chaotic U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan. It concludes that the Biden and Trump administrations were both to blame. CNN's senior national security correspondent Kylie Atwood has our details. KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: The report

paints a flawed picture of both the Biden administration and the Trump administration's ability to prepare for the withdrawal from Afghanistan. Saying that in both administrations there was insufficient senior level consideration of worst case scenarios and how quickly those might follow, and also gets into specifics surrounding processes that weren't effectively put in place to deal withdrawal as it was actually unfolding.

For example, saying that the non-combatant evacuation operation which the Department of Defense stood up, didn't have a lead at the State Department to coordinate with them, and there wasn't a single person on the 7th floor here at the State Department, which is where the Secretary of State sits coordinating on this crisis scenario. It also paints a picture of, you know, the challenges that this presented for the Afghans on the ground because there weren't decisions made in advance about where those Afghans that the U.S. was going to help evacuate from the country were actually going to go.

Now, this is a long anticipated report. The U.S. withdrew from Afghanistan almost two years ago. The report was done more than a year ago. There was a classified version of it shared with Congress a few months ago. But just now, we have received this unclassified version. And there's some criticism, some questions about the administration trying to bury this story, which is a dark mark on their foreign policy record. A senior State Department official wouldn't discuss questions related to the process of when this was released.

Kylie Atwood, CNN, the State Department.

SIDNER: All right, so it blames both administrations for failures. But this just in, the Taliban, we're just getting this from them now in control of Afghanistan, once again is reacting to the State Department in a tweet to that report, Afghanistan's Minister of Foreign Affairs released a statement saying that they consider remarks by U.S. President Biden about non-existence of armed groups in Afghanistan as acknowledgment of reality and refuting the recent report by U.N. sanctions monitoring teams alleging the presence and operation of over 20 armed groups in Afghanistan.

It goes on to say, the Islamic Emirate maintains the policy of not allowing anyone to use the soil of Afghanistan to harm others. Our actions in this regard, they say, are not due to the request or support of anyone, including America. There are plenty of people in Afghanistan that will refute that, but that is their statement at this hour. All right, let's talk more about this report. I want to bring in retired Lieutenant General Mark Hertling. He is the former commanding general for the U.S. Army Europe and 7th army. A key part of this report says it largely boils down to a failure to consider a worst case scenario.

[12:35:10]

Do you think that this is a -- this report is fair? We saw what happened. It unraveled in a way that was extremely chaotic and there was loss of life. What do you think about this report, first and foremost? And thank you, by the way, so much for coming in on this holiday weekend.

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: It's great to be with you, Sara, and thanks for the question. One of the things is, yes, I did read the report. It is, in my opinion, very fair. It's also very harsh. You learn the most from some of the harshest reporting and some of the after actions that are conducted by government agencies.

The key piece to remember is this was a mix of administrations and a mix of different personalities in a mix of organizations, the Defense Department, the State Department, USAID, and others. It came about through some dealings early in the Trump administration with the Taliban and without the Afghan government. And then it was put to end by the Biden administration in a very rushed way.

So, yes, there's some definitely a requirement to share some of the faults associated with what appeared to be a chaotic withdrawal. But truthfully, Sara, in my view, I stand by the fact that so many people were pulled out of Afghanistan, not all the right people, but it was a masterful execution of a non-combatant evacuation operations given the constraints that the government's put on it and the lack of effectiveness of an incoming Taliban and an outgoing government of Afghanistan.

SIDNER: Yes, the chaos was all around. I want to turn now to the war in Ukraine. We continue to see reports that the counterinsurgents, the counterattack, is really not making the gains that were expected, particularly, you know, the Western companies -- countries watching this. What do you think about that? Why aren't Ukrainians able to get more traction, especially since, as you know, Russia is going through this turmoil of leadership, wondering whether some of their generals were coming up against Putin and were trying to revolt.

HERTLING: Sara, I'm going to be one of the ones that refute the premise that the counter offensive is not going well. Having done these kind of operations and having seen them being conducted in training exercises under, you know, pseudo conditions, what Ukraine is attempting to do right now on a large scale with a counteroffensive across a 600 kilometer area of operations on multiple axes, I think, truthfully, I'm going to say this publicly, I think it's going well.

It is going well from the standpoint that the Ukrainian forces are continuing to probe. They have not committed the forces that have been trained in the west, the brigades that have been trained in the west to any major offensive operations. So what Ukraine's forces are still continuing to do is to find the weak spots in the Russian defensive belt, the four belts that they have created over the last seven months.

That's a very difficult mission. The fact that, you know, Russia has had almost a half year to establish a complex obstacle belt with backing and kill zones of Russian forces that have been moving around because of some of the dysfunction inside the Russian army causes Ukraine to take it more slowly to find where the holes are, to find the best place and time for the attack.

So for anyone in the west who's saying this is going too slow, my response to that is you ought to try it sometimes, because it's a lot harder than it looks. I contend that the Ukrainian forces are doing a very good job under a large front with forces that they haven't yet committed yet, they're trying to find holes.

SIDNER: Well, yes, to be fair, U.S. Intelligence said that this was all going to end in three days, and with Russia the victor, and that certainly has not happened. Zelenskyy also fired back after hearing some of that reporting, saying, this is not a Hollywood movie, guys. Like, we are fighting for our country and our lives, and this is what combat looks like. It is hard. It is minute by minute, day by day. It is a terrible dogfight.

All right, we learned this week that the CIA director paid a visit to President Zelenskyy during a recent visit to Ukraine. How important it is it that U.S. Intelligence is going into Ukraine? I mean, why would the CIA director need to go there in person?

HERTLING: I think that's just a fantastic move by Director Burns. He has maintained close contact with the administration in Kyiv, a good idea. There have been repeated inferences, and I would say they are all true, that the United States and the Western partners of NATO have continued to provide the Ukrainian armed forces with very good operational and tactical intelligence, the intelligence of the battlefield.

[12:40:12]

I think Director Burns is rightly positioned to provide some more information on what the intelligence community at the higher level, the agencies like CIA, DIA, NSA are finding out of about the intent of Russia as they go into the future. What is happening inside the Kremlin with the government? What is happening inside the Russian military forces in the MOD with Minister Shoigu, General Gerasimov and some of his subordinate generals? How is those -- how are those fractures affecting what's going on potentially on the battlefield? And how will that relate to the kind of operation on tactical intelligence that General Zalewski, who you just quoted, needs for continuation of a successful fight?

So what we're seeing, Sara, and it's fascinating to me that it's going relatively well, is a combination of strategic, operational and tactical intelligence being fed to the Ukrainian forces about what is going on in Russia. And I'm sure they have their own means of gathering that intelligence. This is just all contributing to it.

SIDNER: This is the art of war. This is the art part of the art of war. General Mark Hertling, always a pleasure to see you. Thank you so much.

HERTLING: Good, my friend.

SIDNER: Coming up, the armorer, who was on the set of the deadly "Rust" shooting, is now being accused of handing off cocaine to someone to avoid legal trouble for having the illegal substance after the tragic accident. More on that and the repercussions next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:45:50]

SIDNER: There are new developments in the "Rust" movie set shooting. A motion filed by prosecutors this week claims that an unnamed witness said the film's armorer, Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, transferred a small bag of cocaine after returning from a police interview.

The witness alleges that exchange happened the same day as the fatal shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. I'm joined now by Misty Marris for her legal perspective. She's a defense attorney and a trial attorney. All right, so we just heard this comes after prosecutors charged her with tampering with evidence in this case. What could this mean for her case going forward?

MISTY MARRIS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So, Sara, this is really relevant to the involuntary manslaughter charges. I say that because we know that this charge is based off transferring cocaine on the set that day. That's the allegation by the prosecutors. We're not seeing a charge for possession of the cocaine or use of the cocaine. We're seeing a tampering charge. Now, remember, she's charged with involuntary manslaughter.

That means that she knew of a risk on that set that day and ignored the risk. That's what prosecutors have to prove. So we've seen that the prosecutors intend to show that she was hung over on that day. And now with this new tampering charge, they're going to be talking about her state of mind. She's transferring this cocaine because she does not want to be caught with it. So it's more relevant to the involuntary manslaughter standard than the actual tampering charge. It's part of the bigger picture and ultimately proving their case.

SIDNER: Now, her attorney, you know, to be fair to her, calls these charges character assassination. But does that really matter that term? It's not a legal term. And does it matter in this case?

MARRIS: Correct, Sara, you make a great point. So, of course her lawyers are going to contest this. First of all, this investigation has been going on for 20 months, and her defense attorneys, very rightfully, I'm a defense attorney myself, are not accustomed to surprise. You know, the courtroom isn't like the movies. There is no surprise there. The prosecutors are required to turn over evidence.

So what her attorneys are arguing is that this is really speaking to improper character evidence as opposed to evidence that would be relevant to the charges. So really, whether or not it is a viable charge is going to depend on the strength and veracity of the witness that prosecutors intend to produce. So it's a little premature to say whether or not this is really some sort of striking new claim or whether or not the defense has an argument that perhaps it should even be excluded, they will need the underlying information before they can make that point.

SIDNER: It's a little bit more, it seems, you're saying, for the court of public opinion, not necessarily for what actually happens in court. You know, these are new charges that have been brought up against her, including the first one, which is a manslaughter charge, as you mentioned. How does this affect Alec Baldwin? Because those charges, the manslaughter charges, were dropped against him. Could this mean that there could be more charges coming if the prosecutors see fit?

MARRIS: So you make a great point, because those charges were dismissed without prejudice, and without prejudice means that they can always be resurrected should there be evidence that supports bringing a charge. So as far as Alec Baldwin is concerned, right now, he's in the clear. I would expect him to be on the prosecutor's witness list for this trial because, of course, he is a critical person in the context of what happened on that day.

And, in fact, would it beneficial for the prosecutors to talk about how Hannah Gutierrez-Reed and what her role was on that set? Remember, he was also a producer and not just an actor who was ultimately holding the gun that caused this tragic accident. So I do think that he could potentially strike up a non-prosecution deal before taking the witness stand. As an attorney, that's what I would be seeking.

[12:50:07]

And if the prosecutors do believe that his testimony is critical, you could see that in writing, which would preclude charges against him. But right now, if there were to be new evidence, he could ultimately be charged. And remember, there's another person here, David Halls, who did plead guilty, who I would expect to testified at the trial as well.

SIDNER: Misty Marris, girl, you broke it all down for us. And I really appreciate you coming on the show on this holiday weekend. Thank you so much.

MARRIS: Sara, always great to see you.

SIDNER: All right, still ahead, speaking of the holiday weekend, it's kicking off with millions of travelers hitting the roads and the airports. More on what is happening and if you need to be prepared for delays in cancellation.

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[12:55:14]

SIDNER: Walgreens is planning to close 150 stores across the United States and 300 additional locations in the U.K. by the end of August 2024. CFO James Kehoe said the closures are part of cost cutting efforts. The pharmacy chain reported lower earnings compared to the same quarter last year and falling share prices. They're also facing lower consumer spending and a big drop in demand for things like COVID vaccines. It's shaping up moving on to be a very busy holiday weekend.

AAA is predicting record breaking numbers of travelers for the 4 July. More than 50 million people are expected to travel over 50 miles this weekend and we are already, I am sorry to report, seeing disruptions making a mess of some holiday plans. So far today, more than 2,300 flights have been delayed and more than 100 have been canceled. CNN's July 4th special by the way, where you can stay home and relax and not worry about all of that.

We've got an all-star lineup for you. Celebrate with spectacular fireworks and the biggest musical performances around. Watch CNN's, The Fourth in America live on, of course. July 4th at 7:00 p.m. right here on CNN. We are back after just a quick break.

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