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Israel Begins Ground Incursion Into Gaza after Heavy Artillery Fired At Hamas Targets; U.N. Votes For Nonbinding Resolution For Ceasefire In Gaza with 17 Countries Including U.S. And Israel Voting Against; Press Conference Held On Discovery Of Body Of Robert Card, Suspected Gunman In Maine Mass Shooting; Maine Deputy Of Public Safety Commissioner Answers Questions On Search And Discovery Of Body Of Robert Card In Overflow Trailer At Recycling Business In Maine. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired October 28, 2023 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[10:00:00]
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN ANCHOR: Hell no. And most of people that voted yes are lying, partisan hacks." Carole, a brand new survey of 5,000 people just came out that has science behind it said no. That's the sentiment of the country at large.
Right now, police are in Lewiston, Maine, and expected to share the latest developments on the Maine mass shooting. The gunman found dead last night with an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head. We're going to bring you the presser live. Our coverage continues now with Victor Blackwell and Amara Walker.
AMARA WALKER, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. It is Saturday, October 28th. I'm Amara Walker.
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Victor Blackwell. You're in the CNN Newsroom.
Any minute now we'll get an update from police on the mass shootings in Maine, 18 people were killed. We'll bring that to you as soon as it begins.
But for now, here is what we know. The accused shooter is dead. Police found his body last night not far from his workplace. Investigators said that he left a note behind that indicated that he did not expect to be alive by the time that note was found.
WALKER: The city of Lewiston can focus now on saying goodbye to those who were lost in the shootings. All 18 victims have been identified. They include a father and son shot while bowling, a married couple and members of the deaf community who were competing in a cornhole tournament.
Let's get to CNN's Shimon Prokupecz who is in Lewiston right now, where that news conference is about to begin. Shimon?
SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so we're waiting here. Any minute, we should see the police chiefs from the Lewiston Police Department, we believe, and the Lisbon Police Department, where the search has been taking place and where the suspect's, the shooter's body was found. And we hope to get an update here shortly on exactly how they discovered the body, the timeline of the events that ultimately led to discovery.
And perhaps, there are so many questions about the investigation that authorities here are not really wanting to speak about because they were concerned over the integrity of the investigation, and if there was going to be a capture and a prosecution. Understandably, they didn't want to talk a lot about the case.
So hopefully today, this morning, we will get more information. Yesterday, when police updated us here, they didn't take many questions. They just came out and told us what happened, that the discovery was made, but further details they reviewed to provide. And hopefully here shortly, we'll get those details when they walk through the doors and take the podium.
BLACKWELL: Hey, Shimon, maybe this is something that we'll have to wait for the start of the presser to get, or maybe you know the answer to it, I'm going to ask it anyway. Do we know if the area where Card's body was found had been searched before?
PROKUPECZ: Yes. I was there on Wednesday, Victor. So around 3:00 on Wednesday, we saw police activity leading up to the street into the recycling plant area where this discovery was made. We were told by the chief of police from Lisbon there, and other officers on scene, that there was a building in that area that was connected to the shooter and that there was activity there. So we assumed that there was a search, something was going on, but we couldn't get down to the street because everything was closed.
So something was going on in that area. It was a building that the police were aware of. They were aware that it was connected to the shooter, so there was certainly activity there. We were trying to get the answers to that yesterday, whether or not this area had been previously searched, because of the activity that we saw, and they refused to answer any of those questions. So maybe here this morning, I would expect that they will give us those answers.
WALKER: Yes, obviously, a lot of questions about why that location. This is a place where he was fired from. Were there any additional attack locations in his plans? We're not sure if they will address those questions, but I'm sure you will ask, Shimon.
What about this note? And again, maybe they will address this as well in the news conference, but the note that was left behind that indicated to investigators that he was going to take his own life, what was in that note that we know?
PROKUPECZ: Well, information -- my understanding is that there was information in that note relating to his personal finances and other information that he wanted family members to know about. And it was indicating that he was not expecting to survive by the time police made the discovery of the note.
[10:05:00]
And that all kind of jives with sort of the activity that we saw on Wednesday in that area that we were in, in Lisbon, because it was sometime after the discovery of this letter that we started to see this uptick in police activity in the area. So perhaps police made the discovery, had found the letter, and then maybe there was something in there that led them to the location, so it all is kind of is connected.
But the letter was talking about his personal finances, other things, information that he wanted the family, his family to have, and that he expected not to survive.
WALKER: All right, Shimon Prokupecz, thank you so much for bringing there. Of course, we will bring you that news conference when it happens live.
Let's turn now to the war in Israel, and Israeli troops have moved across the border into northern Gaza. An army spokesman confirmed, an IDF spokesperson confirms that its infantry, artillery, and other units entered Gaza last night just 12 hours after the IDF said it was expanding ground operation. The scale of this ground offensive is still unclear.
BLACKWELL: For weeks now, Israeli forces have been gathering at the border with Gaza, but when our crews went back to the staging area this morning, most of the tanks were gone. CNN's Jim Sciutto is with us from northern Israel. So Jim, is it clear what we are watching? Is this the incursion that leads to the seizure of territory that the IDF said that it would attempt?
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: We don't know, frankly, because the IDF is providing only very limited information about the scope, the number of forces inside Gaza, what period of time, and what the ultimate goal is. We're basically reporting what we can see, which was a large scale aerial operation yesterday, air strikes, artillery fire, and then a ground incursion today, which Israeli Defense Forces spokespeople have confirmed is underway.
What we are seeing in this region is deep opposition to an expansion of the ground offensive by Israeli forces inside Gaza. I had the opportunity a short time ago to speak to the foreign minister of Jordan, of course, close U.S. ally, about his reaction. Here is what Ayman Safadi had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AYMAN SAFADI, JORDANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The air campaign yesterday, a ground war is just going to make it impossible. The number of deaths, the number of casualties, it is just going to sink us deep into this abyss. And then what? Another war to be added to the many wars we've had in the region that saved no one.
(END VIDEO CLIP) SCIUTTO: Jordan sponsored a resolution at the U.N. yesterday calling for an immediate truce in Gaza. That resolution was adopted. It's a nonbinding one, and the U.S. voted against it along with Israel and some other countries. Though some European allies of the U.S. voted for it, there were a number of abstentions. I asked the Jordanian foreign minister for what the intention was of that resolution, and his reaction to those who opposed it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AYMAN SAFADI, JORDANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: I think people would have to be insane not to support what we're saying, which is let's vote for peace, let's save lives. More killing is not going to help anybody. And this is a conversation that we're having with all of our friends and partners in the region and beyond.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: You heard those very strong words, him saying it would be insane to oppose a truce right now given civilian casualties on the ground. But of course, as we've been reporting, Israeli defense forces are confirming that an expanded ground operation is indeed under way, and of course, Victor and Amara, we will bring you details as we see them.
BLACKWELL: Jim Sciutto joining us from northern Israel, thanks so much.
The IDF has been launching heavy and continuous air strikes throughout the night and into the morning. IDF reserve soldiers call it the most intense night of the bombing of the conflict so far.
WALKER: The video from Gaza City shows the level of destruction there as people are just in shock and digging through the rubble. CNN's Jeremy Diamond is joining us now from Sderot, Israel, which is along the Gaza border. Jeremy, what is the situation there?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, what we've been hearing over the last several minutes is continuous artillery fire outgoing from here towards Gaza. And we are also hearing some small arms fire coming from the direction of Gaza. If you look over my left shoulder here, actually, what you can see right now appears to be some kind of a smokescreen that is being deployed. We saw that tactic also being used by the IDF last night, as they began launching this expanded ground operation, as the IDF is calling this.
What we know, overnight we heard intense bombardment, intense artillery strikes toward the Gaza Strip, perhaps the most intense and sustained bombardment of Gaza that we have heard in the three weeks since this war began.
[10:10:11]
And today, we are getting more details about exactly what those strikes were. The IDF is saying that they carried out strikes on 150 underground targets inside of northern Gaza. They also said that they killed the commander of Hamas's naval forces. Now, today, earlier today, what we did is at daylight, we were able to drive by these various staging grounds where earlier this week, we saw hundreds of tanks, armored personnel carriers, and those D-9 bulldozers, were all stationed, ready to go, facing in the direction of Gaza.
And what we found today was very different. What we found was many of those fields that were being used as staging grounds for those armored vehicles were emptied out, partially emptied out. Trash was instead lying on the fields from those troops who had left, supposedly to go towards Gaza. We also saw logistics vehicles and armored personnel carriers, heading in the direction of Gaza, and also some tanks that were actually returning from the area of the Gaza Strip back towards those staging grounds just north of Gaza.
And so what that tells us is that this is still a very, very dynamic situation. We know from earlier today that the IDF spokesman said that fighting is ongoing inside of Gaza, which is different, of course, from what happened the previous two nights when the IDF did send tanks rolling into Gaza. What we heard the next morning was that those tanks, those troops, had returned over into Israeli territory. And so what we are seeing right now is something very different with the fighting continuing nearly 24 hours later.
WALKER: All right, Jeremy Diamond, thank you very much.
I'm joined now by editor and foreign affairs columnist for "Bloomberg" Bobby Ghosh. Hi there, Bobby. Thanks for joining us this morning. The situation in Gaza as we know, the food and fuel, if it hasn't run out, it is running very low. Right now people are sitting in the dark as we heard, communications are blacked out. This as the IDF ground forces, as we are hearing, are in Gaza right now. They entered from the north as a part of this expanded ground operation.
In terms of President Biden's unwavering public support for Israel, do you get a sense that there may be limits when there are conversations behind the scenes?
BOBBY GHOSH, EDITOR AND FOREIGN AFFAIRS COLUMNIST, "BLOOMBERG": Well, the White House has been making clear that there are limits. The White House has said openly that it is, it is trying to restrain Israel from making a full land operation, which may explain why the Israelis are describing this one not quite in those open terms. They're describing it as a slightly more, slightly heavier operation than the ones that have gone before.
The White House is also saying very clearly that there has to be humanitarian support extended to the Palestinians, particularly those who are in the southern part of Gaza, away from Gaza city and closer to the Israeli border.
The White House has been drawing its red lines very clearly. The Israelis have been quite close to those red lines and testing just how much patience the White House will have on these kinds of operations.
WALKER: Do you expect things to change when it comes to the White House's support, though, once there is a ground invasion, and, let's say, this red line, at what point do you consider them crossed?
GHOSH: Well, it's the question of when the White House decides that a red line has been crossed. We've seen this before, of course, back in the Obama administration when they drew a red line, famously, the president drew a red line in the conflict in Syria, and then allowed the line to be crossed and did nothing about it. So Biden has painted himself into a corner in the context of American politics by saying we're completely behind the Israelis no matter what.
WALKER: Bobby Ghosh, I'm so sorry, I have to cut you off. We have to go live to Maine for this news conference about the mass shooting. Let's listen in.
MIKE SAUSCHUCK, COMMISSIONER, MAINE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: -- conversation for the consideration of the four death victims and their family. Wea re requesting that the ASL interpreter is in all frames for language access here in Maine and the U.S. They are grieving and they have the right to know the latest information in ASL. Thank you for that.
All right, we do appreciate your patience and your professionalism. I know you've been with us for a few days away from your families, tucked in here in Lewiston, working with us. So we're going to go ahead and kind of focus again on the operational side of the house. It's intended that I'm your only speaker for this morning. I suppose if we do get some Q and A that somebody else, I think, can answer readily. We'll do that, and we'll do the best we can for you, and for the state of Maine, and the community here.
[10:15:04]
So I do want to start right at 7:45 last night, when Mr. Card was located deceased from a self-inflicted gunshot wound. And that did occur at the Maine Recycling Corporation, and that's at 61 Capital Ave in Lisbon. And we're going to try to put that right up here on the screen. The audio visual is a little better than the chalkboard we had on day one. So this should show a map, a Google map, location of where the Maine Recycling Corporation is located at.
And I wanted to show this, this is a primary reason that we're late, because we were trying to get this switched over from Google maps to something that you could utilize. So when you look at this, there's a triangle here, that -- stop right there. Yes, exactly. That triangle is, in fact, the Maine Recycling Corporation. And if we go down across Capital Avenue to where that circle is, that is the overflow parking location where he was found deceased in a trailer.
And I think that's important, because we were asked some good questions last night that we did not have the answers to at that point. So that particular location was cleared twice previously, and it was cleared in that triangle. It was cleared where the business is located. And that was cleared by Chief McGee and the Lisbon Police Department and individuals there earlier, and a joint, or a combination tactical team, later in the afternoon.
The owner of that facility did a great job, because he was like, this individual knows the property. He could be tucked in the back of one of these trailers, because they're full of recycled metal and all of this stuff you can crawl over the top. And we cleared the trailers. We cleared trailers that were there on that business footprint. Nobody had any idea that across the street, across Capital Avenue, there is an overflow parking lot which is the Recycling Corporation property.
So the owner was very diligent to say, did you clear those trailers? Well, what trailers are you talking about? So then the follow-up is with the tactical team commanders to say, OK, tell me exactly where you were at? And then they were doing the same thing. We were looking at our timeline, we cleared trailers, we didn't clear those, let's go back. So the Maine state police tactical team ultimately were the ones that located the body within one of those trailers.
And this is a tractor-trailer style, you picture that 18-wheeler. This is what a trailer would look like. A box trailer is where he was located, right in the back of that. Some of those trailers are locked. Some of those trailers aren't. So he was found inside one of those boxes that was unlocked from the outside and that you could probably picture that from just your experience on the street, right? You've seen those kinds of things before.
So that's where we found the body last night. A little bit of updates in that regard, we're going to be there probably through the end of the day making sure that we process that particular scene. And we'll also be at the bar and grille and the bowling alley probably through the rest of the weekend. We're currently working that now. And we will definitely be working that tomorrow. And at this point, that is heavily resourced by evidence response team members. So ET's are processing physical evidence at those locations. Again, as we've discussed, there is a reason for that. That is a lot of materials still there to work with. So we expect that we'll work through the weekend there.
I would also just tell you that the behind-the-scenes stuff is a very intensive manhunt, an incredible amount of resources invested. Once he is located last night, truth be told, we got some people some rest. Hopefully you got some sleep last night. So we sent some people home. They're back in this morning, all in, for today. We're going to send them back to get some rest tomorrow and they can see their families and be back on Monday, the entire time, to include our partners, which I am going to take more time today to make sure that I acknowledge everybody that I can so they'll be back in on Monday to continue their work, whether it is scene cleanup, the continuing to do interviews.
Overall, we received 821-ish, as of a little while ago, tips and leads, so we continue to work those. The digital tip line, that video tip line that you were so helpful in putting the information out on, ultimately we are at 197 of those leads. And that's information that was uploaded to that system. We've got about a dozen or so search warrants that are completed, so signed and impounded, impounded meaning that you wouldn't have access to them at this point.
[10:20:00]
But given the circumstances here, right, because we don't envision a trial of any sort for anybody that's involved here, the release of information, I would expect, after those affidavits, that impound is pulled. There is going to be a lot of information that is going to be there for you down the road. Again, we will try to do the best we can today now that that piece of this event is done and he's been found.
We're certainly able to answer additional questions. Everything we say can be interpreted by a suspect. They just said this about me, I'm going to do that. And again, based on the violent nature of what occurred here, the traumatic incidents that occurred here in Lewiston, we were certainly concerned right into the last second that we didn't know what this individual was going to do next, or where he was going to do it. So we need to be very cautious about that.
We also need to be very cautious when you talk about trials, what information. So mike is at the podium and he said this, and then a trial, two years later, they say, well, didn't you say this, and now you think this, because you found it in the cell phone. All of those things, we need to make sure that we are not being prejudicial for trials and for the court process.
So again, from our end, about a dozen or so of those warrants and everybody will continue to work on that. I think there's some additional information that I had mentioned I was going to speak to you about today, and that is the addition of a family assistance center. And that family assistance center is going to be located at the Lewiston Armory, 65 Central Ave right here in Lewiston, so 65 Central Ave. And that's intended to be a one-stop shop kind of thing, one central space for victims and their support persons to gather so that they don't have to make multiple stops at multiple different agencies to seek assistance.
Now, this particular location is open for individuals who were present at the shooting site. So whether you were a victim, physically stating that you were injured during this event, or you were there and traumatized, in either one of those situations, the family assistance center will be a good spot for those individuals to go.
I will say that -- this is probably again common sense, but the media will not be allowed to enter the family assistance center. We want these folks focused on healing, not am I on camera, what are people going to think, I don't want anybody to know I was there. So if you could do me a favor and help me out with that, that would be greatly appreciated.
Now, that's the Maine state police working with the Maine attorney general's office, the Red Cross, and the FBI Victim Services Division, who have been credible, and they're opening that space. That space actually opened this morning at 10:00, and they're going to be operational for the foreseeable future from 10:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m. at the Lewiston Armory at 65 Central Ave.
A separate location, or a separate site, providing mental health assistance, and that's going to be located at the Ramada Inn here in Lewiston, and that's created for the larger community. So again, as we've discussed, you have the scene, but the entire city is a scene, right? People that are traumatized, I know somebody that knows somebody that knows something, or I walked by that, I have been to that bar before, I've bowled there, that wasn't my night. But you want to talk to somebody about that, that's going to be at the Ramada Inn, so you're not specifically a victim, a specific victim of what occurred, or somebody that was present when this occurred.
And I mention that, and I mention that in this setting, because as these things involve, we will have the investigation, and now this will slowly evolve over into a wellness and resiliency conversation for the community and for the victims and others. And that's the information that we want to make sure folks are getting so that they can receive the help that they need.
I would also say once we clear these scenes, and I want to make sure I acknowledge this individual, Mike (ph) Halloran (ph), who is a retired law enforcement officer out of Mass, owns a trauma service cleanup company. And Mike (ph) gives us a shout, and says when you clear those scenes, I'm willing to come out and donate the services of my company to clean all of these crime scenes, which, as you can imagine, or probably can't imagine, is an incredibly traumatic process to begin.
So we clear the scenes, we have all of the evidence that we need, this company is going to come up, the trauma service cleanup company, with Mike (ph) Halloran (ph). They will do the cleanups and then we will release those locations back to the owners so that they're not forced to deal with that first thing when they walk back into something, their hopes and dreams, I always wanted to open a bar and they're going to be surrounded by the chaos that would have occurred that evening.
So that will be the next steps there, so that's probably early next week. I gave you a little bit of information referencing the detectives and the major crime units and all of our federal partners that are working with us there.
[10:25:04]
We will be transitioning from the current command post back to the Lewiston Police Department. As you might imagine, the parking lot was a little bit different than it was yesterday, right? So our command post, the next big step for the incident management team is to kind of demobilize. I think when these things happen, the first piece is we don't have enough people to do the work we need to do. And then the second piece is we have so many people to do the work we can do. How can we track them, how can we feed them, where are they at, and are they safe? So we're going to be fully invested in demobilization of that location and the personnel that are involved throughout today and into tomorrow.
So I do want to touch on a couple of other questions that have been asked along the way. And with clearance from our prosecutors and our detectives, we're certainly more comfortable answering now based on the current outcome of what happened last night.
So one thing, there's been a number of completely legitimate questions about a note that was found in his residence. So this is a paper style note. I'm not going to read it to you verbatim, but what it is, is, it's a note to a loved one, and it is saying that this is the passcode for my phone, this is the bank account numbers. And I wouldn't describe it as an explicit suicide note, but the tone and tenor was that the individual was not going to be around and wanted to make sure that this loved one had access to his phone and whatever was in his phone. We're working on that now, to get into the phone, that's one of those search warrants, that's one of those very specialized skillsets that our folks have, and then the bank codes to make sure that that happens.
That's not uncommon in suicide situations. You get long notes, you get very set-up scenarios, but that's something that you asked about, and I do appreciate that. And again, we can talk about that a little bit more now.
There was a firearm found in the white Subaru station wagon. That was a long gun style. I do not have the make and model. You can ask me is that an AR-15, is that this. I don't know that, but I was asked yesterday specifically, did they find a gun, did we find a gun in the car, and we did. And that was a long gun, and to my understanding that was the only firearm that was found inside the car at that time.
I would expect, again, based on the investigation and the outcome, that when these impounded affidavits are released, there will be search warrant lists and they've have all kinds of stuff, what did we find, and how many of this and how many of that. So that will be much more detailed. So did you find guns in the house? Did you find guns on him? So that is something that we've been, that we've been asked about, and I wanted to make sure that we covered that as well.
Another question that I've had some conversation around this morning, if talk about, is there a motive here, right? I think clearly, there is a mental health component to this. We still need to do some research around trying to get access to certain records and things of that nature, which again, you can probably imagine is not as simple as calling somebody and saying hey, can you send me this thing? But what I would say is that based on what I've heard through conversations this morning, I don't see, or I'm told that we don't have access to any forcibly committed for treatment information reference to Mr. Card, OK? So you can volunteer, as an example, to go to a facility and seek treatment for months on end. But if you're not forcibly committed to seek that treatment, and it's very specific to treatment, right, not forcibly taken for an evaluation, an evaluation is completely different than treatment.
So there are a lot of very specific criteria around firearms, you are a possessed person, or prohibited person, rather, and what that looks like. So in this scenario, we have not seen to this point, I have not seen to this point that Mr. Card was forcibly committed for treatment. And if that didn't happen, then the NICS check, you can go into a firearms dealer who does all of their work and the background check is not going to ping that this individual is prohibited.
And something that's incredibly important for us to say, and for me to say, and I find myself saying it on a regular basis, just because there appears to be a mental health nexus to this scenario, the vast, vast, vast majority of people, the vast majority of people with a mental health diagnosis will never hurt anybody.
[10:30:02]
They won't hurt themselves. They are not a danger to the community. Based on percentages alone, there's a bunch of folks in here that have a mental health diagnosis. I know law enforcement officers that have a mental health diagnosis. That doesn't mean they're a danger to the community. We certainly have people that reach that crisis level where that does occur, and we deal with those folks on a regular basis, sometimes through involuntarily forcible commitments, right, and sometimes not. Sometimes there's different levels of that mental health system. And that's a whole different conversation that can be quite lengthy. And I can tell you that law enforcement has been involved at this point for decades and heavily involved over the last 15 years or so.
So I think that is the information that I know I wanted to come back and give you. And I would also just say, again, that this information that we think we can give lawfully, and in truth, our subject experts around prosecutions and all of these other things, I may want to tell you something, but I can't tell you, and that's just been the nature of the beast here along the way a little bit.
I also want to mention this. This is a big deal. I was asked about cooperation of the family at one point. And this family has been incredibly cooperative with us. Truth be told, I think the first three people that called us to positively identify this individual based on the photos that were released were family members. And unfortunately, what happens in a scenario like this, is that this happens, they're connected to that family, and that family has taken a great deal of grief, to include threats, people hanging out at their houses, and saying do they know, is it their fault, are they enabling, and all of those things.
Our investigation would have been incredibly -- it would have been detrimental if they didn't come forward immediately to let us know who this individual was. And how difficult of a decision is that to make when you've lost this many people, it's not that difficult, but you can imagine, my family member was involved in that traumatic event, and I want to let people know. So they should be acknowledged in that. Again, I won't specify exactly who the family members were, but as a whole, we found them to be very, very cooperative.
I will also state that from an after-action perspective, you can imagine that all of the law enforcement officers, the various agencies involved, the rest of the public safety world, we will be having a number of after-action reports, lessons learned. We don't want this to happen to anybody ever again, but we've learned a lot as a state from other communities around the country where this has happened, other communities internationally where these things have happened, and they put out best practices and this is what has happened and what he what are we going to do next.
So I would expect those things to continue. None of the entities that are involved in that, certainly not the Department of Public Safety, our regulatory authorities, like, hey, we have authority over what happened over here and we are going to act on that. So there is a time and place for all of those things, to include a mental health system. There's a military component. There's all of those different things which has their own networks to regulate and make sure that they're checking their own processes. And I think that's rightfully so.
So I think what I want to make sure I do, and I want to make sure we switch that screen back over to that victims screen to make sure that we all remember why we're here, and why we do the work that we do. And I also want to state that, because I think when we leave here today, I'm not expecting future briefings or anything else, and I don't want to leave our partners out of this. I've discussed them every time we've talked, but if you talk about Chief McGee and the Lisbon Police Department and all of the work that they have done, the strong focus on Lisbon kind of morphed over -- or Lewiston kind of morphed over to Lisbon with the finding of the vehicle. But Chief McGee and his team and his community have really, really stepped up across the board, and they deserve a lot of credit as a strong partner in this entire thing.
And the New Hampshire state police, I can't tell you, that helicopter was floating over us very, very quickly, and there is the New Hampshire state police and tactical teams and detectives, command staff members that came to us immediately across the board.
From our federal partnerships, you know what happens in these is that everybody's got incredibly long titles that are accurate and they mean a whole lot, but when you talk about the ATF, you talk about HSI, you talk about DEA, your talk about the FBI, you talk about we're down to first name deals, right?
[10:35:06]
So you talk about Kevin and you talk about Jim and you talk about Mike, HIS, you talk about Jody. that's who we are, now, right? And it is going to be valuable in the future to have that first-name basis in case something else happens across the board. And certainly, the Maine state police as the lead major crimes and investigators on this scenario have been in the forefront of this since the very, very beginning.
And we have our elected officials here from various communities, we have IFW, my fellow commissioner, Judy Camuso is here. Let's not forget that hunting is open today. I want to make sure that we discuss that for sure. And I guess I would just close on the acknowledgment, again, of Chief St. Pierre and the work that him and his team have done. They have made their community proud. They have made the state of Maine proud. And we are lucky to have them as part of the Department of Public Safety.
So with that in mind, I'm going to try to do some Q and A. We'll see how this goes. I wrote myself a note, I'm supposed to repeat the question before I answer it, because nobody can hear it. So right here, ma'am.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I can't identify any of the victims at this point. My understanding is the last update that I received that there were three people in critical care, and I don't have any more specifics referenced to the remaining 10 in that scenario. And as you might imagine, these individuals passed away because of this crime, and these other folks have to live with it for the rest of their lives. so I'm not sure they want to be identified in a sense. We've had victims' families with media members and others parked across the street, they feel nervous, they feel scared. So we're not in a position that we're going to identify them.
And sir, right here. Yes?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I would say that the mental health aspect of this, there's a piece of that, whether it's paranoia, there's some conspiracy theorists piece THAT I think what I've read and what I've seen is that the individual felt like people were talking about him, may even appear that there were some voices in play here. And we don't believe that any of that is accurate, and I think that led them, him specifically back to those two specific locations. and it also led us, where he is going next, he used to work here, he used to be there, and what doe sthat ultimately look like. So I think that's a valid question.
Right here.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: There was an employment relationship there at some point. I don't know if he was currently employed or not. And I don't think I'm in a position to answer that. I would kind of lean towards the business owner, and he's been part of this very forthcoming, that got him, got us back to that location to check. So I don't want to speak on his behalf of exactly where Mr. Card or what his status was at the end.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I don't know that yet. And I think that comes down to the autopsy in many ways. They say, you know, he passed away of this, cause and manner of death, and then they will be able to give a range of some sort of how long he's been passed away, but I don't know how exactly tight that's going to be.
Sir, did you have a question? That was the one. All right, perfect. That's a two-fer.
Yes, ma'am?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: Yes, sure. So from a discovery standpoint, the status of the body itself, when you're talking about a few days, there's not a great deal of decomposition in that time frame. So it was a self- inflicted gunshot wound. I will tell you there was a couple of firearms found at the scene. I won't be able to tell you exactly what that was. The one picture that I saw looked like he had the same sweatshirt on that he had, the picture that we put out at the bowling alley. That appeared to be the sweatshirt that he was wearing at that time. He was found closer to the sliding door component of the trailer, so he wasn't buried back further.
When that happened, when he took his own life, I don't know the answer to that. And again, we will probably have a range-ish from the medical examiner's office, but not something I know right now.
Right here. Yes?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: Yes, super question. So again, a bit of an anomaly from the scenario, right. We have two locations, he escaped both, parked his car someplace else.
[10:40:01]
And I want that picture to stay up there, but if you look at that Google map, from the Lisbon location, but I'm going to screw up the boat launch terminology. What is that again?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's the -- River Bridge Boat Launch which it hinges the papermill trail.
SAUSCHUCK: So that trail actually runs from that boat launch all the way along the Androscoggin River, and you can see it on that Google map. So that comes all the way down along the river, and then that overflow parking lot is there, again, next to a business that he is familiar with as well. So there is a natural connection. Is that planned, is that not planned, is that a location of convenience? I don't know the answer to that. But that's kind of how that went down.
But right in the back, ma'am?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: No. No, it had not. Yes, sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you very much. You just said two firearms were found with his body. So you just kind of -- does that mean there were three firearms on his person, one found in the car and then two on his body.
SAUSCHUCK: Yes, one in the car, two on his body.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The one in the car, you said it was a long gun.
SAUSCHUCK: It was a long gun. It was a rifle of some sort. I don't know the make and manner.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I don't have that information. They're still working that scene right now, so that's not something I will clarify for now. Right here, ma'am. I'm going to kind of work my way, I'm aiming to try
to get to everybody, if everybody is cooperative, and we will try to get as many as we can.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: And I just read my note that said repeat the question, which I haven't done yet. Can you ask that one more time?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: So is there video or can we confirm that there is video of the suspect playing cornhole at the bar? No, I have not seen that. There is a lot of video yet to view from the locations as well as those 197. I don't know how often this individual frequented the bar, if there's a timestamp on when that would have occurred. I don't know the answer to that at all.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I think that there's a connection to all of those locations. I think both of those spots -- I will tell you from a community standpoint, a lot of people in this community were familiar with both spots, right? So this thing happens, and everybody's like I was there once before, my family visits that spot. So there was a lot of that that was going on, and I do believe there was a connection, as if this gentleman had been in both of those spots.
Do you want to give it another shot?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have been talking a lot about what he was doing in the hours leading up to the shootings. Did he case the locations at all? Was he driving around? Can you shed any light on that?
SAUSCHUCK: So we haven't focused a lot of time on the timeframe leading up to the crimes themselves. And no, I really can't flesh that out. I do think that what happens from here is those neighborhood canvasses, and we say OK, so this happened, we know this call came in at 6:56. We know that call came in at 7:08. Can we follow that suspect's vehicle, that white Subaru station wagon, can we track that with video in 100 different locations. I've seen those ring cams, convenience stores, someplace out front. And can we time gap that so we know exactly what happened, and then we left this location in this car. We know somehow we ended up at the boat launch. Can we try to figure out what that looks like. So I don't have any information, was he casing the place that day, or clearly, he had some knowledge of these locations previously, however.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: Of course. Yes, absolutely. That's part of that. Again, he's dead, we know where he's located at, we can start working with our victims. We can also start digging in on all of these other things.
Sir? (INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: There's none that I'm aware of. We've had people check that have told me that they haven't found those. So if they exist, I'm sure we will continue to dig and try to find them, but I haven't found them.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: So that's a pretty good hypothetical from whoever your source. We'll have to look at the actual snapshot in time. The yellow flag law in the state of Maine is very specific about an individual that is in protective custody from law enforcement to begin with.
[10:45:00]
And do we have probable cause to believe that they are in possession, they could be in possession of dangerous weapons. So if we meet those criteria, then you can take an individual in for a yellow flag assessment, a weapons restriction order assessment. And at that time, your criteria change from likelihood of a serious harm to likelihood of foreseeable harm. There is a little, it's close. I'm sorry --
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I will tell you that the weapons restriction order in Maine has been utilized 82 times to this point. It went into effect on July 1 of 2020. I know that because I've read every single one of those reports and I'm involved in that process on a regular basis. Just gave a presentation last Friday to a group of social workers to make sure that we're putting that information out there as much as humanly possible. It has been effective to this point. And it is certainly something that we're always looking at. Can we tweak it, can we make things better. But it has been utilized, and to this point it has been effective.
But ma'am, you had a question.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You talked a lot about the mental health component and part of his motivation. Is there any other aspect that you can tell us about or possible motives that led to him targeting the bowling alley and then the bar?
SAUSCHUCK: I think that what we know is we have a lot of work we have to do yet on phones and technology. Are we going to find a concrete motive that says this is what I'm going to do and this is why? At this point, we certainly know that there's a strong mental health cloud over this, what happened, the two tragic scenarios at both of those locations. We know that there is definitely a mental health nexus to that. Specifically, is there another reason? When you talk about paranoia, you're talking about individuals in crisis, there's a lot there, what was actually happening versus what they perceived to be happening. So those things are definitely on our radar.
But in the back, ma'am? Then I'm going to come up to you, sir. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- before you found the body, did you have other
leads directing to you this park area, or was it just the owner of the recycling center saying, hey? And when did he tell you guys to look in that parking lot again? And then can you also confirm that you believe he walked the trail to the parking lot from the boat ramp?
SAUSCHUCK: So the two questions there, did we have additional leads referenced to the overflow lot where he was ultimately located, and can we confirm that he walked?
Number two, we haven't found a vehicle or any other, a bicycle, there is no other information to lead us to believe that there was anything but walking down. I suppose something could happen to lead us in that direction. So whatever that is, 800 and something leads and tips. The primary reason we were back in that location is because, I will say this, from a community policing, from a relationship standpoint, the owner of a business calls his police chief and says, hey, you know, I want somebody to make sure that they're clearing that. That's good cop 101, right? To have an automatic connection with somebody in your community, that's why the additional follow-ups occurred, because we had, again, searched and documented, there's logs and all of this stuff of when we were there, who was there, what did they do, which allowed us to do the follow-up work to say, well, did we? Did you check across the street? Well, what's across the street? There's a dozen businesses that surround this thing, and nothing that says that's the recycling corporation.
So the owner was diligent, as was Chief McGee, and then passing on that information to the command post and ultimately to be checked.
So sir, right here? Yes?
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- were they used to try to pick up his scent before he was found in that trailer?
SAUSCHUCK: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What location had you lost -- so were canines used to try and pick up his scent?
SAUSCHUCK: I don't know the specific answer to that. I would think that they would be, but I don't want to guess. Canines are a standard part of, we lost somebody here, where did they go. We have tactical canines that are attached to those various teams. We have a lot of great dogs that are out there working the streets. So I don't know the answer, but I can only imagine from a best practice standpoint, sure, of course they would do that. Did you have another question?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: We have not. There has been no additional information. However, we know that there are two specific target locations. He did go one to the other. He ditched his car in a specific spot. Again, maybe we will find some additional information in one of these devices that says this is what my plan was. All we can do is look at what actually occurred. So there is nothing there, how long was it planned, what did that look like, I don't know that right now.
Ma'am, did you have a question in the back?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I just wanted to ask how exactly did he die?
[10:50:01]
SAUSCHUCK: How exactly did he die? So the question was how exactly did he pass away. That was a self-inflicted gunshot wound is the apparent reason for his death.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I won't give a specific location I don't think for today.
Ma'am, right here?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At shooting scenes, are investigators still actively collecting evidence? I know yesterday you said it could take a few more days. Any sense in what --
SAUSCHUCK: So I've heard through the weekend at both of those locations, and then we will transition over to that cleaning and some of that other information that I put out.
Sir?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I don't have the information there, because one may be a search warrant on a cell phone, right, one may be a house. And so I don't have a breakdown of exactly what warrants are going where, and what that looks like. Some of those have been served. Some of those we have. And they're kind of in the queue as a part of a punch list, this is where we're going next and this is what we're doing. Absolutely, we're still working on this.
Yes?
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: I can't speak to that specifically. I think that would speak to premeditation and something as a motive above and beyond the mental health crisis that we know exists. But all of those follow-ups continue because you have the victims themselves clearly that are passed away. But we're also talking to everybody that he ever knew, right, somebody he worked with, somebody he was in the military with, what did you know and how and all of those kinds of things. So that continues. Sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to get back to the two previously searches. First, thanks for answering all of these questions today. And I think this is important because I've spent a lot of time in Lisbon and that community - (INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: Right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I'm wondering as you sit hear today do you think if a thorough search had been done in that location, surging more resources --
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The question comes, should more resources have been surged into that area, because it seemed like this one trailer -- we didn't really see a surge of resources in that area until yesterday. There was a much bigger presence yesterday.
SAUSCHUCK: Right.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: So the question is, do we think now we should have surged additional resources to that area, either those two searches or otherwise? And I think we had a great deal of resources in play. I think we had resources all over the place, resources that maybe you saw, maybe you didn't see, 24/7, 365, out on the street. I know that Chief McGee was working with fellow chiefs to bring him additional resources. I've seen that email string, like, hey, we're trying to have two-person cars from a safety perspective, we want to make sure that we're properly staffed across the board.
Another incredibly positive aspect of this is that search that Chief McGee led was because one of his officers found an open door to that building, right. So that's what's happening. People go to bed, whether they can sleep or not, and all night long there are police officers crawling through their neighborhood, looking at these businesses, looking at their backyards, trying to make sure that everyone is safe.
So I will, for the rest of my life, be looking at this event and say, could we have done this different, could we do that different. I think we had resources in play. And our hearts go out. The reason we do this work is because of the trauma that is caused to our communities, all communities, when these things happen. So it is a completely legitimate question, but not one that I think was resource intensive for that particular area.
But sir, in the middle? Why don't you follow up. Go ahead. I'll give you that one.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: No.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: So Chief McGee led that one search. And then there was also a combined tactical team that did an additional search. But again, the reason that we were late, and we wanted to put that map
up there, is because if I told you, well, that they didn't know about the overflow location, I wanted to be able to show you why that is, right? There is a business here. You cross the road, there is this overflow parking lot that I don't think, me personally, would have actually connected that this business is connected to that, if it's all in the same lot, because these tactical team commanders, as an example, did you check trailers? And the answer is yes. We checked the trailers that were there.
[10:55:00]
And then the owner, again being diligent and knowing his property, said did you check those trailers. Which trailers? The ones across the road down here across Central Avenue. And the answer is no, we didn't go over there. That's not what we were there to do. So I think that they did their due diligence across the board. Sir, in the middle?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thanks for your time. Two things I wanted to ask you on. In terms of the note, is there a timeline of when you think that may have been written? Was it that day before he proceeded to the shootings? And then secondly on that trailer, do you think he may have been in the woods and then doubled back there, legitimately missed the first time possibly because you didn't check, but maybe he wasn't there?
SAUSCHUCK: So I think two different questions there, one referenced the timing of the note, and then how he got to that trailer, when he got to that trailer. All we can say for the note component is simply saying that we know when the initial shooting happened. I think as we try to backtrack through his day, which was an earlier question, can we identify where he was at a certain time in comparison to the shooting at 6:56, and then know in the middle, so he must have had is there at some point. Maybe there is a technically piece of this, the phone stopped moving at a certain point. Maybe there is going to be additional information there. And when he went to the trailer, how he got to the trailer, I would like to think that we're going to get some additional information there, but I haven't seen it yet. And we're going to continue to work it.
So yes, right here?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did Mr. Card have any prior interactions with law enforcement in the area in the days, the weeks, the months leading up to this tragedy?
SAUSCHUCK: Somebody has told me that there was an OUI investigation from like 2007, but I'm not going to go in depth because I don't know enough about that. I don't want to lead you astray or give you the wrong information, and that question was referenced to interaction with law enforcement as well as criminal history. Sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A question for the ATF, can you either tell us or tell the commissioner so he can tell us the make and model of each of the three firearms that were covered and whether Mr. Card obtained them illegally? SAUSCHUCK: So I think that the reality is we will have that
information as part of the search warrants, as part of the investigation. I don't have it right now. That's my failing, not the ATF's, so I won't need the ATF to tell us what the make and model is. We will go to the ATF, however, to say when were these firearms purchased and who purchased them. And we will go to that initial component. That is a standard check that law enforcement do every time that a firearm is involved in an incident or a crime firing.
(INAUDIBLE)
SAUSCHUCK: They can give you the same exact answer if you like.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you like to answer that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So as far as the firearms, as far as I don't want to misidentify models or makes, but what I can tell you, as far as the firearms that have been recovered, they do appear to be purchased by him.
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Legally purchased.
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, some days before. There have been a number of firearms that have been recovered as part of this investigation, and some of them have been purchased very recently, and some of them years and years ago.
SAUSCHUCK: Yes, sir, right here in the hat. Yes?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just a quick question. How many trailers are in that overflow lot? And do you know how many were locked and unlocked by any chance?
SAUSCHUCK: So it's 55 or 60 trailers that are parked back there. I don't know how many are locked versus how many are unlocked.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sorry, you had to go through each one of those, and how long did it take to go through --
SAUSCHUCK: So I think the reality there is that these officers in the first three trailers located him, but the tactical team ultimately located him in I think that third trailer.
Do you have a question here, ma'am?
(INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can you talk about when you searched that trailer and when you twice cleared the business --
SAUSCHUCK: So I don't know, Chief, as far as you're clearing, do you know? Do you want to step up and answer that? CHIEF RYAN MCGEE, LISBON, MAINE, POLICE: So as far as the trails, we
located the car and a perimeter was set up, as you can imagine. And I actually think it is less than a mile, five or take. But you can imagine where that business was that we spoke about tonight. That's a large industrial park. We're not talking about a small area. We're talking a large industrial park.
But I can say there was numerous resources from the state, state police, all local agencies, all the sheriff's departments across the state of Maine, federal agencies, we had helicopters in the air over that vehicle moments after I arrived, and I was the second officer on the scene. I can tell you we flooded the area with resources. Someone brought up the question about canines. One thing with canines is we don't want to hinder scents. I'm not going to get into all of the details of the investigation, but I can assure that that there were a lot of teams that searched the area. On top of -- I will add one thing.
