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How GOP Primary Has Changed in Iowa, NH; South Korea Orders Evacuation of Yeonpyeong Island; Pro-Iran Commander Killed in Baghdad; Hamas-Run Health Ministry: 22,000 Killed in Gaza since October 7th; Trump Businesses Made Millions from Foreign Governments; Loud Condemnation Over Calls to Resettle Palestinians; Former Olympic Sprinter Oscar Pistorius to be Released. Aired 12-12:45a ET

Aired January 05, 2024 - 00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN ANCHOR: Ron DeSantis, Nikki Haley, much better news. Trump, though, still ahead.

[00:00:04]

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, Trump still ahead and DeSantis is really now all-in on Iowa. Why is it that Trump is not doing quite as well in New Hampshire as he is in Iowa?

ENTEN: I think that this will sort of give you the answer right here. All right. Moderate share of the GOP primary electorate. This is the group that Donald Trump does worse with. It is the group that Nikki Haley does best with.

In New Hampshire, moderates make up 50 percent of the electorate. That's higher than national, and look at Iowa. They only make up 17 percent of the electorate.

So the fact is Nikki Haley is putting a lot of eggs in that New Hampshire basket, because she knows the electorate in New Hampshire is far friendlier to her than the electorate in New Hampshire. And it's less friendly to Donald Trump.

PHILLIP: OK. So the sequence of these contests matter because of momentum, so Trump being far ahead in Iowa, what is the significance of that for the trajectory of this race?

ENTEN: What is the significance? So let's take a little look through history. Polled 45 percent or greater in Iowa at this point.

Walter Mondale, he won the Democratic primary in 1984. George W. Bush, Republican, won the Republican primary, won the caucuses in 2000. Al Gore, same deal on the Democratic side in 2000.

Hillary Clinton, the same deal in 2016. She won Iowa. She then went on to win the nomination.

Now, we don't know what's going to happen with Donald Trump at this particular point, but this is, of course, a good signal for Trump going back through history. Of course, Abby, we pointed out he's not nearly as strong in New

Hampshire. Right? Nikki Haley is wondering, Hey, maybe I can break through there.

Well, take a look here. National GOP frontrunners who won Iowa, which Donald Trump looks pretty strong at this point, but then went on to lose New Hampshire? Bob Dole in '96, George W. Bush in 2000.

What do these two fellows have in common, besides just being pretty good-looking guys? They both won the nomination.

So the fact is, Donald Trump at this particular point is in a very strong position in Iowa, and because he's in a strong position nationally, I'm not quite sure that what happens in the Granite State matters. But hey, history is made to be broken.

PHILLIP: Well, we should also note, I mean, this was also the last time that Iowa decided, effectively, the Republican nomination. So anything can happen.

ENTEN: This is true. That's true. Iowa has picked the Republican side twice. It was these two guys.

PHILLIP: These two times.

ENTEN: It was these two times. So --

PHILLIP: You're looking at them, right?

ENTEN: You're looking at them. You're looking at them.

PHILLIP: Harry Enten, thank you very much, as always -- Laura.

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR: Well, joining me now is former Wisconsin governor, Scott--

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello and welcome, everyone. I'm Michael Holmes. Appreciate the company.

Coming up here on CNN NEWSROOM, the actions of Iran and its proxies in the Middle East increasing fears of wider conflict in the region.

Israel vowing to bring, quote, "fundamental change" on its border with Lebanon as the IDF and Hezbollah exchange fire.

And the Blade Runner, Oscar Pistorius, set to be freed from the South African jail 11 years after killing his girlfriend.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

HOLMES: But we do begin with breaking news from South Korea, where we're hearing the military has ordered the evacuation of an entire island due to provocations from North Korea.

Let's get right to CNN's Marc Stewart, who is standing by live in Seoul. What more can you tell us about what's been happening, Marc? MARC STEWART, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via phone): Hi there,

Michael.

We have now confirmed that North Korea had fired more than 200 rounds into what's called the Maritime Buffer Zone. Two hundred rounds of artillery into this buffer zone.

As you mentioned, it's near an island. There's a series of islands on the West coast of Korea, and there is concern because this is a time when we have seen very high relations between these two countries.

Now, we are also reporting that whatever was shot, this artillery, it fell in a border area known as the Northern limit line, meaning it did not necessarily enter South Korean property, if you well.

No one has been hurt. There's been no report of any damages. But according to South Korean military officials, this is a violation of an inter-Korean military agreement that was signed last year.

In fact, they are calling this, quote, "a provocative act" going on to say it threatens the peace and heightened tensions on the Korean Peninsula.

North Korea has done something like this before. It was in late 2022, when we saw multiple rounds shot into this -- into this buffer zone.

As far as additional response in North Korea, we know the military is tracking and monitoring all of this and will, quote, "take action" corresponding to North Korea's provocations.

Michael, it was just this past weekend that North Korean officials said they would try to launch additional spy satellites into space to help with this long-range missile program.

[00:05:09]

So this happening just days into this new year is again more evidence that tensions between the North and the South are very high.

HOLMES: And Marc, North Korea usually does things like this as a message or a response. Do we know what that might be?

STEWART (via phone): Well, we have heard a lot of back and forth between North and South Korea. You know, right now, North Korea had perceived this relationship between the United States and South Korea very negatively, because there has been recent talks between these two nations that perhaps that could be at play.

Also, it's not unusual, as we have seen, for Kim Jong-un to just want to flex his military muscle and to try to stay relevant.

HOLMES: All right. Marc Stewart there in Seoul with the very latest. We'll check back in with you as more information comes in.

All right. Moving on, U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken is about to begin his fourth trip to the Middle East, since October 7th Hamas attack on Israel.

And his mission seems to be getting more complicated by the day. Among his top priorities, as he visits eight countries across the region, is to keep the war between Israel and Hamas from spreading as fears grow that Iran and its proxies are getting more involved.

And now, ISIS has claimed responsibility for a pair of bombings in Southern Iran that has killed more than 80 people. Tensions also flaring between Israel and Lebanon, where a senior Hamas commander was killed on Tuesday.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says he is committed to, in his words, bringing fundamental change so Israelis can live in peace along that border.

In the Red Sea, Houthi rebels backed by Iran have launched another attack on commercial shipping lanes. The U.S. Navy says the unmanned surface drone exploded without causing damage to any ships or injuring any crews.

The U.S. is fighting back against pro-Iranian proxies in the region, as well. A militia source says a top commander and his assistant were killed in a strike in Baghdad.

CNN's Oren Liebermann with more from the Pentagon.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A U.S. strike in Iraq, second in a little more than a week, killing the commander of a pro-Iran militia, Harakat al-Nujaba, one U.S. official saying the target, known as Abu Taqwa, had U.S. blood on his hands.

MAJ. PATRICK RYDER, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: Abu Taqwa was actively involved in planning and carrying out attacks against American personnel.

LIEBERMANN (voice-over): The attack comes amid fears of an escalation in the Middle East, far beyond the borders of the Gaza Strip, where the war between Israel and Hamas is nearing the three-month mark.

The U.S. has tried to separate the war in Gaza from the rest of the region, but the fighting has burst through political borders.

An Israeli strike in Beirut killed Saleh al-Arouri, one of Hamas's top leaders. Lebanese officials warning the attack threatens to spark a wider conflict in a region already on edge.

U.S. forces have come under attack approximately 118 times in Iraq and Syria since mid-October. Hezbollah in Lebanon has launched repeated missile and drone strikes on Israel, a key U.S. ally in the Middle East.

And the Houthis in Yemen have fired on international shipping lanes in the Red Sea, with calls growing for a U.S. response. JOHN KIRBY, U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL SPOKESPERSON: We don't

telegraph our punches one way or another. But we take these attacks very, very seriously, the impact that they're having on international commerce, and -- and free shipping. And we're going to keep doing what we need to do to protect our interests.

LIEBERMANN (voice-over): The common thread here is Iran, which backs these groups. With U.S. Navy forces in the Eastern Mediterranean Sea, and in the Red Sea to protect international shipping lanes, the U.S. has tried to send a message of deterrence, carrying out strikes in Iraq and Syria.

But the attacks across the region have persisted, the Pentagon once again laying out an open-ended threat of force.

RYDER: We maintain the inherent right of self-defense and will continue to take necessary actions to protect our personnel.

LIEBERMANN (voice-over): But in a region where one conflict is already raging, U.S. Officials are grappling with how to respond to widespread attacks by Iranian proxies, without sparking a broader war in the Middle East.

Oren Liebermann, CNN, at the Pentagon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Joining us now is Colin Clarke, director of policy and research with the Soufan Group and author of "After the Caliphate: The Islamic State and the Future of the Terrorist Diaspora."

Thanks so much for being with us.

If this, indeed, was ISIS, as the group claims it was, what do you think would have been the motivation to strike this way, attack that particular target at this particular time?

COLIN CLARKE, DIRECTOR OF POLICY AND RESEARCH, SOUFAN GROUP: Well, all signs are that it was indeed the Islamic State, and this is consonant with ISIS's ideology, which is highly sectarian in nature.

[00:10:08]

A large part of their recruitment and propaganda is based on attacking Shia, who they often call raffida (ph), or apostates. And so this is a power play in Iran, to go after the most prominent Shia symbol in the region. And it's one that ISIS hopes will galvanize followers and potentially bring new recruits into the organization.

HOLMES: What does the attack suggest about the -- the strength and the capability of ISIS Right now that they could operate like this inside of Iranian territory? Is this evidence of a resurgence for ISIS?

CLARKE: Well, it could be. We could be on -- you know, exactly on the heels of that. I think it also says something about Iran's capabilities, because

Iranian security services are likely overstretched, given all the activities in the region where they're managing forces in Gaza, Lebanon, Iraq, Syria, et cetera.

So their bandwidth is stretched, and this is a clear example that they're -- they're more vulnerable domestically, or at home, than they've been in a long time.

HOLMES: What do we know about the broader range of ISIS, after of course, it was largely brokered by the U.S. coalition in Iraq years ago? What do we know about what they want now?

CLARKE: Well, they'd like to catalyze some momentum. They'd like to bring more recruits into the organization. They'd like to get back into the headlines on the front pages of every newspaper, and in the heads of policy makers in the West.

There was a time at their peak when ISIS was ubiquitous. They're up- tempo in terms of launching attacks. It seemed like it was near daily, including in the West.

And so they're not going to ever get back to that place, but they'd like to get back to a place where they're able to conduct attacks, they're able to increase their operational and their organizational capabilities.

HOLMES: Looking further afield now, there are, of course, fears of a broader regional conflict. You know, Israel's war on Hamas in Gaza, the simmering conflict on Israel's border with Lebanon and Hezbollah, the Houthi attacks in the Red Sea, Israel's strike in Beirut.

What role could ISIS play in all of that, and how do you evaluate the risk of a wider conflict regionally?

CLARKE: Well, ISIS Is just another wildcard in what's an already chaotic and complex regional confirmation. As you mentioned, there is numerous hotspots around the Middle East. The United States is weighing several options about, you know, how they're going to approach this conflict, supporting the Israelis but also getting into the mix themselves by attacking targets in Iraq, and potentially soon, targets in Yemen with -- with the Houthis.

You know, their attacks against commercial shipping need to be stopped. So ISIS can play a spoiler role, it can really just add to the anarchy that we've seen unfold since October 7th.

HOLMES: Are you worried about a wider conflict with all of those other factors? Not specifically involving ISIS. And also, I wanted to ask you what do you see as the U.S. positioning on all of these aspects of regional tension? The U.S., of course, has been engaging with militias in Iraq, as well, on top of everything else.

CLARKE: Well, I'm more worried today than I was even just a couple of weeks ago. Because a lot of the things, especially at the Soufan Group and the Soufan Center that we've been writing about have come to fruition, particularly the Northern border between Israel and Lebanon and what's been happening with Hezbollah.

I think that's the biggest concern that I have. If Lebanese Hezbollah enters the fray with force, this is a world-class terrorist organization with extremely high-end sophisticated capabilities.

But you're right, looming in the background is the U.S. versus Iran, and if that comes to a head, we're looking at a region-wide war. You know, I wouldn't go so far as to say World War III. But we're talking about some really serious conflict that would drag in multiple states, multiple non-state actors. It would tank the global economy. It really would be the worst-case scenario heading into 2024.

HOLMES: Yes, yes. A lot of factors at play. Colin Clarke there with the Soufan Group. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.

CLARKE: Thank you.

HOLMES: More now on the fighting along Israel's Northern border with Lebanon. The Israel Defense Forces says it struck several targets in Southern Lebanon and near the border on Thursday after detecting a number of launches from the area.

The IDF says the targets included a Hezbollah observation post and what it calls terrorist cells and infrastructure.

This coming as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu met in Tel Aviv with a special envoy of U.S. President Joe Biden. Mr. Netanyahu told Amos Hochstein that Israel is committed to bringing about, quote, "fundamental change" on its border with Lebanon.

[00:15:08]

The Israeli defense minister told the envoy there is only a short window of time for diplomatic solutions, but Israel needs a -- quoting here again -- "new security reality" in the area.

Meanwhile, the head of the U.N. peacekeeping forces in Lebanon met with the country's officials. He warned that escalating hostilities could have, quote, "devastating consequences."

And the IDF issued a new series of evacuation orders for Palestinians in parts of central Gaza on Thursday many civilians say they are too exhausted to play again. And even if they could, there's nowhere safe to go.

One Palestinian man told CNN, this is not life; it's humiliation. CNN's Jeremy Diamond with more. And a warning: his report contains graphic images.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The lifeless body of yet another child, carefully pried from the rubble. Gaza civil defense says this is the aftermath of an Israeli air strike in Deir al-Balah, a city where tens of thousands are seeking shelter, heading evacuation orders like this one, dropped by the Israeli military. ABDUL RAHMAN, INTERNALLY DISPLACED : There is no place to stay safety

in this area. There is no water. There is no electricity. We are just surrounded by all the war. And they bomb and attack us without any alarm.

DIAMOND (voice-over): It's not just Deir al-Balah. Several cities where civilians have been told to flee have been hit in recent days, including this camp for displaced Palestinians in the Southern city of Rafah, where the Hamas-controlled government media office says Israel has struck six locations over the last three days.

At El-Nasr Hospital, the dead lay waiting. After an Israeli airstrike killed 14 people, including nine children, according to the Hamas- controlled Ministry of Health.

MAHMOUD SALEH, UNCLE OF ONE OF THE DEAD (through translator): Where is international law? There is no law. They killed children. Children there are getting shelled as they are sleeping. They are bombing them, killing them, with what blood? What blood?

DIAMOND (voice-over): Even the emblem of the Palestine Red Crescent society is no shield. The group's headquarters in Khan Younis struck for the second time just this week, killing one and wounding six.

The IDF told CNN it was reviewing the previous strike and held a, quote, "operational debrief" to draw immediate lessons. Amid the strikes, some are once again on the move. Mattresses and blankets carried however they can.

FULLA QADOUHA, INTERNALLY DISPLACED PERSON IN DEIR EL-BALAH (through translator): My House is gone. The Houses of my sisters are also gone. I'd rather go back home and live in a tent, then live in here.

DIAMOND (voice-over): For many, that exhausting, elusive search for safety is over.

ABU ADNAN, INTERNALLY DISPLACED PERSON IN DEIR EL-BALAH (through translator): I tried to go back home twice, but my children pulled me back. There are no toilets, no food, no water, no clothes. With all this, I prefer to go back home and die with dignity than dying this way.

DIAMOND (voice-over): That pursuit of dignity is all that remains.

Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tel Aviv.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Russia is reportedly reaching out to allies to expand its stockpile of missiles. And according to Washington, two countries are eager to help. We'll have that when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[00:20:53] HOLMES: The U.S. says Russia is working with Iran and North Korea to

restock its ballistic missile last month. The news coming as Moscow's has been ramping up its strikes on Ukraine.

Washington believes Russia is moving ahead with talks to acquire Iranian close-range ballistic missiles. And the White House says Moscow is likely already making use of ballistic missiles and launches it received from North Korea.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIRBY: The United States is concerned that Russia negotiations to acquire close-range ballistic missiles from Iran are actively advanced. Reassess that Russia intends to purchase missile systems from Iran. So in response to Russia's activities with Iran and North Korea, we are taking a range of steps with our allies and our partners.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Now, as Russia works to replenish its missile stocks, Ukraine is moving to line up more troops. A new mobilization law has made its way to a parliamentary committee Thursday, where lawmakers began debate.

The proposed changes include lowering the conscription age and introducing mandatory basic training.

Ukraine's military has recently requested up to half a million more troops as the country faces a protracted conflict with Russia. The proposals would have to be approved by the full parliament before being signed into law by President Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

Now, a new report from U.S. House Democrats say foreign governments spent millions of dollars at Donald Trump's businesses and properties while he was in office. Trump, of course, did not step away from his business holdings before assuming the presidency, meaning he could still profit with little transparency.

CNN's Jessica Schneider with details.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These papers are just some of the many documents that I've signed, turning over complete and total control to my sons.

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: At the start of Donald Trump's presidency, he promised to hand over control of his companies to his two sons, but he refused to divest his assets, and he retained ownership.

Now, a report released by House Democrats reveals how Trump and his victims have raked in at least $7.8 millions from foreign governments during his time in the White House. REP. JAMIE RASKIN (D-MD): He not only lined his own pockets, but he

repeatedly sold out the American public interest in favor of the interests of these foreign governments.

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Congressman Jamie Raskin led the investigation, finding that the Chinese government and its state- controlled entities spent more than $5.5 million to stay at Trump properties, including Trump Tower in New York City and the Trump international hotels in Washington D.C. and Las Vegas.

Other countries handing over hundreds of thousands to Trump's businesses: Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait and India.

RASKIN: By defying the Constitution, he basically fulfilled the founders worst fears, which is that the president, in order to line is some pockets, would sell out the American interests in favor of particular foreign governments looking for policy favors for the president, and that's exactly what happened.

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): The Emoluments Clause of the Constitution forbids a president from accepting "any present, emolument of any kind whatever, from any king, prince or foreign state."

For years, Democrats have alleged that foreign governments were buying favor with the Trump administration.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe this is not only wrong and immoral but illegal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President.

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): The new report points to Trump declining to impose sanctions on the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China for allegedly helping North Korea evade U.S. sanctions, after the state- owned bank leased property at Trump Tower.

And the Trump administration's $100 billion arms deal with Saudi Arabia in May 2017, around the same time the country spent about $600,000 at Trump-owned properties.

Trump's team denies any wrongdoing. They point to the Trump Organization donating about $450,000 in estimated profits from foreign governments to the U.S. Treasury, and Trump himself refusing to accept a paycheck during his time as president.

[00:25:03]

TRUMP: It's a lot of -- a lot of money I would have given away. Like I gave away my salary.

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Eric Trump responding, "There is no president in United States history who was tougher on China than Donald Trump, a president who introduced billions and billions of dollars' worth of tariffs on their goods and services."

Meanwhile, Republicans continue to make the so far unproven allegations that President Biden has benefited from his son's business dealings in China and Ukraine.

But in response to the report about Trump's businesses, Republican House Oversight Chair James Comer, who is leading the investigation into the Bidens, saying, "It's beyond parody that Democrats continue their obsession with former President Trump. Former President Trump as has legitimate businesses, but the Bidens do not."

SCHNEIDER: And congressional Democrats are releasing this report now, because they want people to be aware of Trump's business entanglements with foreign governments going into 2024.

And Congressman Raskin tells me he's working on legislation that would mandate reporting to Congress for any president or official who takes in foreign money, and working on a way to develop a way for Congress to approve or deny those payments.

Jessica Schneider, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Another possible setback for Donald Trump's road to reclaim the White House, voters' groups in Illinois and Massachusetts, have filed motions to remove him from that 2024 election ballots in their states. They cite his role in the January 6th attack, and the insurrectionist ban in the U.S. Constitution's 14th Amendment.

It's unclear how, and when, these new challenges will be adjudicated. They do come as the U.S. Supreme Court is widely expected to review a state court ruling in Colorado. A decision in that case could settle his eligibility for the entire nation.

Now, CNN hosted back-to-back town halls with two leading U.S. Republican presidential candidates: Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, and former South Carolina Governor Nikki Haley. Both took shots at the former president, with DeSantis making the case that a Trump candidacy is baked (ph) for the Democrats.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The Democrats want Trump to be the candidate. They are going to talk about all the legal stuff, January 6th. That will be what the election will be about.

You don't want it to be a referendum on Trump and the past. You want it to be a referendum on Biden's failures, on our positive vision for this country. I offer that.

And oh, by the way, you need somebody that can serve two terms. You're going to go in there as a lame duck president, even if you could get elected? I don't think that that's how it works there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Now Haley, who served as Trump's ambassador to the United Nations, condemned her former boss's relationships with dictators and U.S. adversaries. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIKKI HALEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So you may have had a good four years, but look at what we're paying for now. As of now, in a couple years, we'll be paying more money in interest payments than we are in our defense budget.

You know who notices that? Russia, China, and Iran. That's what happens there.

The second thing is you look at how he deals with dictators. I think it's completely wrong. He praised China's President Xi a dozen times after China gave us COVID. You don't do that.

He congratulated them on the 70th anniversary of the Communist Party. We don't do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Now, another batch of documents in the 2015 civil lawsuit connected to the late accused sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein were released on Thursday.

Now, this time, 19 documents revealed more information about the late financier and his former girlfriend. Among the new developments, an Epstein accuser saying former President Bill Clinton pressured "Vanity Fair" magazine not to write stories about Epstein.

Clinton has previously denied allegations of wrongdoing with Epstein, and his spokesman told CNN that they had no new comment.

And "Vanity Fair's" former editor says that Clinton's alleged request, quote, "categorically did not happen."

In another document, a Palm Beach detective says he spoke to approximately 30 girls about being recruited by Epstein's girlfriend to perform massages and work at Epstein's home.

Still to come here on the program, controversial calls from far-right Israeli officials to relocate Palestinians from Gaza. We'll have the latest reaction to the controversy, when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Want to update you on our breaking news, the evacuation of a South Korean island due to what Seoul's military calls provocations from North Korea.

The Yeonpyeong Island is not far from the North Korean border. And the South Korean military says the North fired more than 200 artillery rounds off its West coast near that island that fell within the maritime buffer zone.

We're told no one was hurt, but the incident clearly raising tensions. We'll bring you more information as we get it. Outrage is growing over remarks from far-right Israeli government

ministers, pushing for Palestinians to be resettled outside Gaza. U.N. human rights chief Volker Turk posted online that he was, quote, "very disturbed" by high-level Israeli official statements on plans to transfer civilians from Gaza to third countries.

He added that the majority of those displaced in Gaza by the war have the right to return home, and forcibly transferring them would be forbidden under international law.

Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich on the right there of your screen and boasted that the removal of Gazans could pave the way for Israelis to, quote, "make the desert blue." But later clarified that he envisioned any transfers of Gaza residents happening on a voluntary basis.

Other Israeli politicians and commentators have made similar comments.

All right. I want to bring in Steven Cook, who's the senior fellow for Middle East studies at the Council on Foreign Relations. And thanks for making the time.

I mean, you can't dismiss those proposing this idea as just fringe voices. I mean, the ministers of finance and national security are important positions. How concerning is it that these thoughts are being voiced at that level?

STEVEN COOK, SENIOR FELLOW FOR MIDDLE EAST STUDIES, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Well, of course, it's concerning, because essentially, what these ministers are talking about is ethnic cleansing of the Gaza Strip.

And given the fact that the Israelis are engaged in this total war and the Prime Minister Netanyahu is essentially politically dependent upon people like Bezalel Smotrich and Itamar Ben-Gvir, it's certainly something that everybody needs to take very, very seriously.

HOLMES: Now, most Gazans, of course, are descendants of people already forcibly displaced in what Palestinians call the Nakba catastrophe in 1948. How incendiary is even the notion of another displacement? I mean, what would such a plan, if it develops, whether it's, quote, "voluntary" or not, mean in an historical context?

COOK: Well, already the images of Palestinians being displaced from Northern Gaza into Southern Gaza and people living in dire conditions evokes the memories of the establishment of the state of Israel, which led to the displacement of millions of Palestinians.

So it is something that the Palestinians continue to believe to be something that is continuing. And I think the best evidence that you have that -- that the Nakba continues is not just what's happening in the Gaza Strip, but as well as what's happening in the West Bank where both the constituents of both Smotrich and Itamar Ben-Gvir are using the war as an excuse to take matters into their own hands and commit violence against the Palestinians, in order to push them off their own land. [00:35:14]

HOLMES: Yes. And many Palestinian families, in fact, small villages are being pushed out by settlers.

The Israeli government says, you know, these are just people talking, and some officials say nothing is being planned on any official level, but is it notable that the prime minister, Netanyahu, has not specifically rejected the comments from his own ministers? Should he?

COOK: He absolutely should reject those comments.

And in the past when both of those ministers have spoken out in controversial ways, the prime minister has, in fact, essentially taken them to task publicly.

And as you point out, it's notable he has not done that in this situation. It is primarily because he is dependent upon them for his political future.

Without this government, you wouldn't have Netanyahu in power, and since these two ministers are pillars of those governments, of this government, Netanyahu is clearly not as in control as his title as prime minister would suggest.

HOLMES: And that's a really important point, isn't it? I mean, what does it say about Netanyahu's deals with these fringe parties to get him to power and now needing them to stay in government? I mean, has he legitimized extremists?

COOK: He absolutely has alluded to legitimize the extremists. This is the most reactionary government in Israel's history.

And by bringing them into government, by allowing them to express these kinds of extreme views, views that can only be described as Jewish supremacy, has certainly legitimized it. There is a constituency for it in Israel. It's relatively small, but right now because they're in the government and Netanyahu is dependent upon them, they tend to carry more weight than the numbers would suggest.

HOLMES: And I want to ask you this, too, before we go. How does the makeup of the Netanyahu government -- I mean, Smotrich, Ben-Gvir and others, as part of that government -- impact the now fanciful notion of a Palestinian state one day in the future?

COOK: Well, these people certainly reject the idea of the Palestinian state. But I should also point out that Netanyahu does, as well. He did utter the words "Palestinian state" in 2009 but under only very, very heavy pressure from then-President Barack Obama.

HOLMES: Steven Cook, really appreciate you making the time. It's an important issue. Thanks so much.

COOK: Thank you.

HOLMES: All right, the convicted murderer Oscar Pistorius is set to be released soon from prison in South Africa. Still to come, the latest on the former Paralympics track star who killed his girlfriend more than a decade ago.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Emergency crews have rescued a survivor from the wreckage days after a massive earthquake ravaged Western Japan. The 80-year-old woman was pulled from the rubble of a collapsed house in Wajima late on Thursday afternoon.

Emergency personnel are racing to find any more survivors following Monday's 7.5-magnitude quake. Officials say at least 92 people are dead. Hundreds remain missing.

Former Olympic and Paralympic sprinter and convicted murderer, Oscar Pistorius, is set to be released from prison in South Africa in coming hours. He was granted parole back in November, nearly 11 years after killing his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp.

Pistorius is expected to leave the prison near Pretoria in a few hours. These are, in fact, live pictures from there. The country's corrections department says he will remain under its supervision until his sentence ends in 2029.

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CNN's David McKenzie takes a look back at the case.

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DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Back in 2012, this was Oscar Pistorius, our world-class athlete and role model, overcoming incredible odds.

His legs amputated below the knee at 11 months because of a birth defect. The Blade Runner competing at the able-bodied London Olympics in 2012.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's done magnificently well, and I think everybody is proud of him.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): Months later, Oscar Pistorius's global fame became a sordid global notoriety.

REEVA STEINKAMP, GIRLFRIEND OF PISTORIUS: Happy birthday. This is shooting with the same cover (ph) (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

MCKENZIE (voice-over): On Valentine's Day 2013, he killed his up-and- coming model girlfriend, Reeva Steinkamp. Shooting four times through the locked bathroom door.

The police finding him bloodied and in shock. Pistorius said it was an accident, and he thought Reeva was an intruder.

The state charged him with premeditated murder, his trial a riveting courtroom drama followed by millions. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would go back. I used to say, when you got up,

you had an argument. That's why she ran away screaming.

OSCAR PISTORIUS, CONVICTED OF MURDER: She wasn't breathing.

BARRY ROUX, PISTORIUS'S LAWYER: Is the state saying that, within two minutes, on the state's version, on a shooting, or five minutes in our version, in a traumatized state of mind he worked out this grand scheme? It doesn't make sense.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): The defense claimed Pistorius was a vulnerable, now broken man who deserved leniency.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He suffers from an anxiety disorder. We know that the uncontested evidence was that whenever he stands, his balance is seriously compromised, and without anything he would not be able to defend himself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You killed a person. That's what you didn't, isn't it?

PISTORIUS: I made a mistake.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You killed Reeva Steenkamp. That's what you did.

BARRY STEENKAMP, REEVA STEENKAMP'S FATHER: I would never wish that on any human being. Finding that, finding out what happened. It devastated us.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): After a nearly 50-day trial, stretched over seven months --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The accused is found not guilty and is discharged. Instead, he's found guilty of culpable homicide.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): Pistorius placed in a private sale in this prison's medical wing, released after just a year. One-sixth of his sentence to his uncle's mansion and a house arrest.

But Pistorius's legal woes didn't end there. On appeal, his conviction converted to murder. He was sent back to prison, his sentencing for murder then extended at the same appeals court.

Reeva's family saying she could now rest in peace. Oscar Pistorius, for years in the public eye, for the right and very wrong reasons faded from public view. Until now.

David McKenzie, CNN, Johannesburg.

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HOLMES: I'm Michael Holmes. Thanks for spending part of your day with me. I'll be back at the top of the hour with more CNN NEWSROOM. WORLD SPORT, though, after the break.

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