Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
Macron: Sending Troops To Ukraine Cannot Be Ruled Out; Biden: Hopefully For Ceasefire In Gaza By Monday; Gaza Residents Please For Food, Clean Drinking Water; Gaza Residents Plead for Food, Clean Drinking Water; Air Force Member Who Set Self on Fire in Protest Identified; U.S. Supreme Court Weighs First Amendment Cases; Florida's Book Bans. Aired 1-2a ET
Aired February 27, 2024 - 01:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[01:00:29]
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: Coming up this hour on CNN.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
EMMANUEL MACRON, PRESIDENT OF FRANCE: There is no consensus today to send ground truth nothing should be rolled out.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: The French President goes. They're opening the door to a possible troop deployment to Ukraine.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF USA: We're close. We're close to not done yet.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: The U.S. President believes within a week a deal should be in place between Israel and Hamas for a weeks-long ceasefire in Gaza, as well as the release of hostages.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (voiceover): There is no food to feed my children, nor there is any bread.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Nor is there water or housing and medical care, or teachers or classrooms or schools or home. Life now for almost every child in Gaza.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Live from Atlanta. This is CNN Newsroom with John Vause. VAUSE: The French President Emmanuel Macron has publicly raised the possibility of sending troops to Ukraine, and with U.S. military assistance, still stalled in Congress are going to urge Western leaders to increase their military aid. During a hastily convened summit in Paris. We're going to also warn NATO they face a very real risk of a Russian attack within the next few years. But although Macron says a new coalition will soon be working to supply Ukraine with medium and long-range missiles.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MACRON (voiceover): There is consensus today to send ground troops in an official endorsed or sanctioned matter. But in dynamic terms, nothing should be ruled out. We would do whatever it takes to ensure that Russia cannot win this war.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: And Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelensky is warning without U.S. military assistance. Millions of Ukrainians will be killed by Russian forces. CNNs Kaitlin Collins spoke with Zelensky about the state of the war.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAITLIN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: You've said that you're not in a stalemate, you don't believe Ukraine at a stalemate. Realistically, what does victory look like for you?
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, UKRAIN PRESIDENT: We don't want any frozen conflicts that it feels we have it by the Minsk agreement. We had it after two zero 14 When they occupied our Crimea part of east of our country. And we don't believe all our society. We don't trust any frozen documents, any frozen conflicts, any just you know papers about ceasefire and we understand that Putin will never -- Putin will never keep his word. It means that what we need to push the army out of our territory if we will control our borders, it means for us, of course, peace and the ending of the war. And it's not enough, really it's not enough, were important things. It's not to give Putin possibility to come back.
And in any frozen conflicts, he will come back to destroy us and occupied us. That's true. And we don't want to check it. The second time after Minsk agreement, after Normandy Format, so everything was so old that documents failed. So that's mean that with Putin, you can trust him. That's why we don't need any frozen conflict.
COLLINS: So you don't trust anything that his name is on? You did say today as far as military plans that your new commander-in-chief is drawing up a clear-cut plan you said. Are there two different plans one for if USAID happens and one if it if it doesn't happen?
ZELENSKY: Yes, it means that if we have munition or not if we count on our partners or where the count on on us. So that is defending plan or defending with some steps forward with comprehensive.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Joining me now from Los Angeles is CNN, Pittsburgh and European Affairs commentator, Dominic Thomas. Thanks for being with us, Dom.
DOMINIC THOMAS, CNN EUROPEAN AFFAIRS COMMENTATOR: Thank you so much for having me on, John.
VAUSE: Okay. So after opening the door to this idea of trips to Ukraine, Macron went on to make this point. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MACRON (voice-over): The people that said never ever today were the same ones who said never ever planes, never ever long-range missiles, never ever trucks. They said all that two years ago, a lot around this table said that we will offer helmets and sleeping bags. And now they're saying we need to do more to get missiles and tanks. We have to be humble and realize that we have always been six to eight months late.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[01:05:06]
VAUSE: It's a good point. He's right. Germany is now one of the biggest donors to Ukraine but when Russia invaded two years ago, (inaudible) shipment of helmets. So if every country has started at their current levels, this war would have probably been over a long time ago. The question is, why would Macron raise this publicly? Why now? How serious are those discussions been? How far along is this? And is this an attempt to sort of get away from impair the public?
THOMAS: Well, John, I mean, all of those points are now relevant. I mean, for two years, we've been talking about this conflict about the Russian invasion. And the red line at the very beginning, was precisely the quest of the level of involvement and support, and particularly the red line around having troops on the ground, simply mentioning that today as a possibility is therefore a very significant departure from that earlier position.
Now, I think one of the interesting things to look at is the sort of the context and the timing of this. I mean, for Emmanuel Macron, whenever he's on the foreign stage, dealing with foreign policy and detracting from domestic policy, he thrives. And I think in this particular context, particularly around Russia and Ukraine, he does especially well because the public support is there for him. So it's strategic. But it also comes on the heels of ever-increasing uncertainty around the outcome of the presidential election, and the conflict in Congress and the lack of support at that level. And I think a concerted effort to demonstrate that Europe on this question of further engagement and involvement is united.
The specifics are to be ironed out that when it comes to sort of logistical movement to tricks on the ground, this is a very significant step in that direction. And just simply bringing it into the public space, John, shows the conversations have started in that particular realm.
VAUSE: Well, you raise the situation in the United States with assistance from for Ukraine, rather, still stuck in Congress because of Republicans. The reality for Europe, though, is this to fully replace U.S. military assistance in 2024, Europe would have to double its current level and pace of armed assistance. So is that politically possible? Right now in Europe, governments are cutting public spending, especially in France, where farmers have been protesting for months and no small part because of cheaper imports from Ukraine, which is benefiting from favorable trade terms from the EU. Is there a political will there across Europe to go that far, at least in terms of military assistance?
THOMAS: Yes. It's complicated. Because of course, we know that this, you're not just Europe. But the European Union is a vast organization. Achieving consensus is complicated, but time and time again, the European Union has proved that they are able to come together and to resist attempts by Putin to polarize these different partners. You're absolutely right, that within the domestic realm, cost of living crises, and so on and so forth are extremely relevant here. But I think that there is, on the one hand, this sort of ambiguous situation of sort of fatigue with support for Ukraine. But I think there's also tremendous concern because of the uncertainty in the public realm, in the media, and in discussions around this. And when this happens, the role of leaders is, therefore to demonstrate strength and solidarity, at least with words.
But you're absolutely right to point out that the practicalities of it. The dollars and cents are potentially issues in what are already fragile economies moving forward. And I think that in some contexts, the will for increased political conflict, tension, and engagement is problematic. But I do think that people on the ground in Europe recognize that the Russian threat is very real. And that's why we've seen countries such as the Estonian Prime Minister, the foreign secretary for Lithuania, speak so vociferously in terms of the importance of countering Russia here, because it's right there on their backdoor, John.
VAUSE: There's also this immediate challenge of making and shipping the weapons which Ukraine needs the most. On that, heres the Dutch Prime Minister.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARK RUTTEI, DUTCH PRIME MINISTER: I think there was a great sense of urgency, particularly for the short term of ammunition, and on-air defense, but also for the somewhat more longer term, the production of more defense equipment for Ukraine, the necessity to work on cyber, but also to shore up the security situation, for example, in countries like Moldova.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Which goes to your earlier point about your concern in Europe. But you know, this shortage of lack of production capacity for ammunition, especially artillery, that became a major issue within the first six months of the war, why are they still talking about it now?
THOMAS: Yes. Well, because John, I think that you know, and, you know, the reality is that for so many countries, in Europe sort of engaging in conflict in this particular way, is a new, more recent phenomenon than we see these depleted resources. And so it undermines the narrative of strength, which is important at the level of words. But when we actually see on the ground the sort of the lack of coordination dwindling resources in certain areas unfortunately it points to and undermines the fact that the military strength is perhaps not there, John. And that there the will to invest in this and to develop this is one that is a long term, a long term strategy.
And so I think it raises and draws attention, increasing attention to the fact that this is really the level of rhetoric that that the European Union is speaking here, John.
[01:10:35]
VAUSE: Dominic, thank you for the insight. Thank you for the analysis. Good to have you with us. Good to see you as well.
THOMAS: Thank you so much.
VAUSE: And Sweden's NATO membership is our orbit official. After the Hungarian parliament voted in favor of Sweden joining the defence Alliance. Hungary along with Turkey had delayed the approval process more than a year. Turkey's parliament approved speed and speed last month in return for USF sixteenths. Hungary's nationalist Prime Minister Viktor Orban was won over after striking a defense agreement with Sweden. Russia's war in Ukraine led Sweden to end 200 years of neutrality.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ULF KRISTERSSON (voice-over): As far as Russia is concerned, the only thing we can safely expect is that they do not like Sweden becoming a NATO member. And they didn't like Finland becoming a NATO member either. The whole purpose was to emphasize that a country like Ukraine would not be allowed to choose its own path.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: One of the legacies of Annie's closest aides claims the Kremlin killed the opposition leader to sabotage a prisoner exchange, which would have included two U.S. citizens. In the video statement, Maria Pevchikh says a final deal was close, which Alexi Navalny and the Americans released in return for Vadim Krasikov, a Russian Hitman serving life in a German prison. The Covenant denies any such agreement was in the works or any involvement in Navalny's death. Well, according to Pevchikh, the idea of Alexina Barney being set free was simply too much for the Russian president. CNN's Matthew Chance as details reporting in now from Moscow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MATTHEW CHANCES (voice-over): Mourners still paying their respects at makeshift memorials across Russia. But now another unexpected twist in Alexie Navalny's tragic saga. According to his close aide, negotiations for the release of the Russian opposition leader, were reaching a conclusion. He was poised to be swapped says his team, before he suddenly died.
MARIA PEVCHIKH (voice-over): Navalny should have been free in the coming days because we achieved a decision on his exchange. I received confirmation that negotiations were underway, and we're at the final stage on the evening of February 15. On February 16, Alexei was killed.
CHANCE (voice-over): The Kremlin tells CNN it has no knowledge of any deal and had nothing to do with his death. But Navalny's team insists the Russian opposition figure was killed to prevent him from being swamped.
CHANCE: You can see if it goes convictions in there. Hi. Matthew from CNN.
CHANCE (voice-over): Swapped along with U.S. citizens in Russian jails, lLike Wall Street Journal reporter Evan Gershkovich accused of espionage. Former U.S. Marine Paul Whelan serving 16 years for spying. The U.S. says both are unlawfully detained and has been negotiating for their release including early talks on Navalny one Western official tells CNN. But the Kremlin has regularly hinted it wants back this man, a former FSB agent Vadim Krasikov, serving a life sentence in Germany for killing a Chechen dissident.
Navalny's team accuses the Kremlin of simply taking the opposition leader off the negotiating table by killing him. Allegations the Kremlin denies.
Pevchikh (voice-over): It was clearly communicated to Putin that the only way to get Krasikov is to exchange him for Navalny. Hold on, thought Putin, I can't tolerate Navalny being free. And since they're willing to exchange Krasikov in principle, then I just need to get rid of the bargaining chip.
CHANCE: No person, in other words, no problem. That kind of ruthlessness that saw Alexei Navalny poisoned with the nerve agent Novichok in 2020. Recovering only to be arrested and imprisoned on his return to Russia the following year. After news of his unexplained death, hundreds of mourners were detained while laying flowers. Now Navalny's team says a public farewell potential flash will be held at the end of this week.
In death, as in life, it seems Alexei Navalny continues to challenge the Kremlin's power. Matthew Chance, CNN, Moscow.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[01:15:10]
VAUSE: U.S. President Joe Biden is aiming to have a deal in place for a ceasefire in Gaza which includes the release of hostages by this coming Monday. Biden spoke well on an ice cream outing with comedian Seth Meyers in New York.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BIDEN: Well, I hope by the beginning of the weekend, I mean, the end of the weekend. At least my National Security Adviser tells me that we're close. We're close is not done yet. And my hope is by next Monday, we'll have a ceasefire.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: But sources tell CNN Hamas has backdoors some key demands and the ongoing hostage and ceasefire talks. Details are from CNN, Alex Marquardt.
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Some progress does appear to have been made in recent talks to reach a deal to exchange Israeli hostages for Palestinian prisoners as well as a truce if only temporary in the Gaza Strip. Negotiators met again on Monday in the Qatari capital Doha to discuss technical more specific aspects of broader topics that had been raised during a meeting on Friday in Paris with the CIA director, his Egyptian and Israeli counterparts, and the Qatari Prime Minister.
That meeting according to the White House yielded an understanding on the broad contours of a potential deal. Talks did appear to have stalled recently after Israel called a Hamas counterproposal delusional. Now two sources told me that Hamas has softened and backed off some of their key demands to get this agreement in place. Notably, they have reduced the number of Palestinian prisoners they are demanding be released from Israeli prisons, that's for the first phase of a deal. They have also dropped stipulations that the Israeli military leave Gaza and that Israel agree to an end to the war.
Now those were all part of an earlier Hamas proposal. This does not mean that Hamas no longer wants that to happen. There is an expectation that during the ceasefire of that first phase, discussions would continue and tackle more sensitive and complex issues like IDF soldiers who were being held hostage by Hamas and other groups. Palestinian prisoners who have significant prison sentences and those questions about an end to the war.
Now Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has made clear that regardless of a hostage GOP intends for the Israeli army to carry out a ground offensive in Rafah in southern Gaza. Sources familiar with the hostage negotiations warn that even with signs of progress, the talks remain fragile and fluid. One thing does appear clear that the Biden ministration would like to see a hostage deal in place by the start of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, which begins on March 10. Alex Marquardt, CNN, Washington.
VAUSE: The Palestinian Authority Prime Minister, along with his entire government have submitted their resignations, which is opening the door for a potential national unity government, which could --could include Hamas.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) MOHAMMED SHTAYYEH (voice-over): This decision is made in light of the
political security and economic developments related to the aggression against our people in Gaza. The unprecedented escalation in the West Bank and Jerusalem. The challenges confronting our people, our Palestinian cause, and our political system from a severe and unprecedented onslaught, including genocide attempts, forced displacement starvation in Gaza.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: The Palestinian Authority governments limited parts of the occupied West Bank, but was forced out of Gaza after Hamas seized power in 2007. Western countries want to reform Palestinian authority to control both the West Bank and Gaza once the war with Israel with us is over. But the Israelis have rejected any notion of the Palestinian Authority returning to Gaza in any form.
When we come back, farmers across Europe are protesting government policies which are keeping the price of produce low and the cost of farming continues to rise details and their divots in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[01:21:26]
VAUSE: Farmers across Europe are again on the streets out protesting government economic and regulatory policies, which are aimed at reducing food prices but come at a time when fuel and other farming costs are rising. Now they're demanding lawmakers take action to address their concerns. CNN's Clare Sebastian has details.
CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Anger piercing through the streets of Europe's diplomatic hub. Farmers across the continent traveling to the European Union headquarters in Brussels on Monday, as agriculture ministers meet to discuss Europe's farming crisis. Police meeting the protesters with water cannons as patients begins to wear thin. For weeks, farmers in over a dozen countries have been disrupting highways, border checkpoints, and city centers in uproar over unfair competition from outside the EU and what they dubbed as restrictive environmental policies. This is in part a consequence of EU leaders waiving duties on Ukrainian food imports, following Russia's full-scale invasion in 2022.
Over the weekend, farmers in Poland who have been blocking Ukrainian border checkpoints destroyed 160 tons of Ukrainian grains spilling corn across train tracks and move Ukrainian officials described as vandalism.
Meanwhile, in Spain, convoys of tractors continue to clog Madrid. While in France, motorways hidden the truckloads of hay union leaders calling for more noise.
FRANCIS AMBROGIO, SECRETARY GENERAL, FDSEA AGRICULTURE UNION (voice- over): In any case, we have to keep up the pressure. Because I have the impression that we're going to be hearing a lot of speeches. But we want action facts and today we're not making any progress.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): Back in Brussels and acknowledgment, Russia stands to benefit here.
DAVID CLARIVAL, BELGIAN DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER (voice-over): There are also aspects of the market which are important. And we see that the grains market is collapsing. The prices are going down. This is a dirty game which Russia is putting in place to put pressure on Ukraine, but also on the single market. We are in a global geopolitical context and we have to keep all these aspects in mind.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): The response to these protests a test for European unity, as anger continues to grow louder. Clare Sebastian, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Still ahead here on CNN Newsroom. This is what desperation looks like in Gaza. Dozens maybe hundreds of people waiting on shore for that boat packed with AirDrop supplies to make it back to the beach. They are starving. They're hungry and they are desperate. When we come back also why Democratic voters in a pivotal battleground state are putting President Biden on notice.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[01:26:40]
VAUSE: Welcome back, I'm John Vause, you're watching CNN Newsroom. The Palestine Red Crescent Society has suspended or coordinated medical missions in Gaza for 48 hours over lack of safety for its staff, wounded, and the sick. They claim they've been repeatedly targeted by the Israeli military. Despite prior coordination. CNN has reached out to the IDF for comment.
UN says aid deliveries to Gaza are down 50% this month compared to January and the UN chief is warning and Israeli offensive on the southern city of Rafah would be the final nail in the coffin of the UN aid operations.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANTONIIO GUTERRES, U.N. SECRETARY-GENERAL: Humanitarian aid is still completely insufficient. Rafah is the core of the military operation and owner is the backbone of that effort. And all about the Israeli offensive on the city would not only be terrifying for more than a million Palestinian civilians sheltering there. It would put the final nail in the coffin of our aid programs.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: So they're drilling supply of humanitarian aid into Gaza. Jordan and France carried out the largest aid drop AirDrop by air over the siege territory. The Jordanian armed forces say they made for aerial aid drops on Monday in collaboration with the French sending relief and food items, including ready-to-eat meals of high nutritional value. One journalist tells CNN he saw four planes the first for air drop went into the sea while the remaining three were dropped in southwestern areas of the territory.
More now from CNN's Jeremy Diamondm, reporting in from Tel Aviv.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND (voice-over): Today, Gaza's humanitarian crisis looks like this. Palestinians desperate for food paddling and swimming out to sea. After at least one plane air-dropping aid appeared to miss its target, sending pallets of food crashing into the sea.
In central and southern Gaza, hundreds crowding the beaches to try and secure their piece of the rations. But this is the other side of desperation. Groups of men wielding whips and baths, steering crowds away from their precious cargo, months of hunger and war triggering fights for survival when there is not enough for everyone. This is what they are fighting over ration packs a lifeline for the lucky few.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (voice-over): I was lucky and able to get one of these aids. What about all those other people who were not able to get this? Look, this one didn't get any. And this one didn't get any.
DIAMOND (voice-over): But so much more is needed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): I'm asking from the Arab nations, we are thankful for the aid for the parachutes, but we need more and we need it distributed in a better way. This will not stop our hunger. We don't need a capsule. Because when we eat this, we will eat it. And that's it. It's finished.
DIAMOND (voice-over): But no Where are people more desperate for food aid than in northern Gaza? Where women and children wait in long lines for what now passes for food. A cloudy soup mixture made with dirty water and whatever greens can be found.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): There was no food or drinking water, no flour or anything. There was no cooking oil, not even drinking water. That better than this.
DIAMOND (voice-over): Humanitarian aid deliveries this month dropped by half compared to January according to the United Nations Relief Agency.
[01:29:35]
It's blamed Israeli military operations and the collapse of civil order in Gaza.
In northern Gaza, aid groups suspending aid delivery amid looting and attacks on aid trucks leaving many with few options to stay alive.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are eating animal feed against our will, but have to eat it.
DIAMOND: Without food or clean water, their voices are all they have left.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The suffering of Gaza is extremely difficult. Where are the authorities? Where is the government. Israel made us hungry and our government made us hungry and people are stealing.
Shame on you Arabs. Where are you?
DIAMOND: But after nearly five months of war, is the world listening?
Jeremy Diamond, CNN -- Tel Aviv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: Janti Soeripto is the president and CEO of Save the Children. She is with us this hour from New York. Thank you for taking the time to speak with us. Appreciate it
JANTI SOERIPTO, PRESIDENT/CEO, SAVE THE CHILDREN: Thank you, John.
VAUSE: Ok. So here's what life is like right now in Gaza. We'll hear first from a mother in Gaza City. Her name is Umm al-Ameer Shamalkh, and then we'll hear from Jihad al-Najjar (ph), who is in northern Gaza. Here they are.
UMM AL-AMEER SHAMALKH, GAZA RESIDENT: There's no food to feed my children, nor there is any bread. We came to the point where we are eating tree leaves. We are eating the food of this donkey.
JIHAD AL-NAJJAR, GAZA RESIDENT: All of northern Gaza is starving. There is no shelter, no drink, no food. There is nothing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: It seems there'll be less than nothing according to the U.N. Aid deliveries in February are half of what they were last month, which was a fraction of what is needed.
So Palestinians, especially in Gaza, are resilient people, kids are used to hardship, but nothing like this. And the fear is that now it could get a lot worse if that Israeli offensive on Rafah goes ahead.
Describe what worst looks like.
SOERIPTO: Yes. Thanks, John. And it's almost inconceivable. Last month, I didn't think worse was actually possible, but clearly it is.
You'll remember there's now 1.4 million people in Rafah, which is a smallish city housing 300,000 people before.
Now there's three times as many. There are essentially tents and people everywhere on every single street road. There are people sheltering under tarp, or in a tent perhaps or in a makeshift whatever shelter.
And there is essentially -- this is the last line, Rafah. There is nowhere to go. People can't leave. People can't go back to the north. They're still fighting there. They're probably not allowed to cross the Wadi Gaza in the middle.
And as we heard there is no food, no -- none of anything anywhere in the north anyway, aside from a lot of unexploded ordnances.
So it is really you know, quite it bears no thinking what would happen if there will be an incursion now into Rafah where people are completely stuck, essentially locked up with nowhere to go. And because people are so close together, it is inconceivable that you would go in there with a lot of bombs and shelling and violence. Because children will absolutely be -- bear the brunt of that violence.
VAUSE: It is such a difficult situation to even think of the words to ever describe what is possible there because there's so much that's already happened. So yes, it is unthinkable.
This is from an opinion piece by -- for CNN, rather by UNICEF CEO, Catherine Russell.
"At least 90 percent of Gaza's children under the age of five are affected by one or more infectious diseases and that 70 percent had had diarrhea in the past two weeks.
At least 17,000 children in Gaza are now unaccompanied or had become separated from their families."
In other words, they're now orphaned. Said parents are dead. Now, this is the view from above Khan Yunis, which is a little bit north of Rafah. And you know, as you can see, as the shot slowly moves in, as it gets closer and closer and closer as you look at that, you see people are just going about their daily lives. They're living life and this is what life is now like for more than a million-and-a-half Palestinians.
This is reality. They're cramped into these tent cities everywhere. And they're living in close quarters. It's perfect for the spread of disease to say the least. In many ways, are you surprised that the disease has not spread faster and worse than it already has?
SOERIPTO: To some extent, yes. I mean, it's also fair to say that it's hard to really get a full picture of all the numbers, the diseases, you know. There is no opportunity to test people (INAUDIBLE) for a lot of things.
[01:34:50]
SOERIPTO: But yes. Also don't forget there is -- it's very hard to get clean water in Gaza. It was hard to get clean -- the water situation before the conflict wasn't great. Since October 7, its been completely dismal. Water plants -- desalination plants are not working. Water comes in literally in drips and drabs in bottled water in the trucks. If they come in, which is -- and there's not enough of that happening either. So no clean water.
I think -- what is it -- one shower for every thousand people or so. So people -- there's no way to do proper hygiene. So yes, it is not surprising that many, many children present with diarrhea. And that is -- infectious diseases will spread.
VAUSE: In terms of man-made disaster, which this is, it could end tomorrow. Either Hamas could stop using the population in Gaza as human shields or the Israeli government could decide to stop killing children.
Is there anything comparable to what's happening in Gaza right now and the outsize impact it's having on children.
SOERIPTO: You're absolutely right and both things need to happen, and it can't happen soon enough.
No. I have never seen anything like this man-made at this scale that has such an impact on children and civilians, writ large. And neither have the many, many humanitarians who make this their life's work either. It is unprecedented.
(CROSSTALKING)
VAUSE: Yes. It's tragic. It's unprecedented. And it defies words in so many ways.
Thank you for being with us. Appreciate it.
SOERIPTO: Thank you for having us.
Mourners gathered outside the Israeli embassy in Washington Monday to remember Aaron Bushnell, the U.S. Airforce airman, who lit himself on fire there Sunday. Bushnell was recorded on video saying he would no longer be complicit in genocide and his suffering was minimal compared to the plight of Palestinians in Gaza. He then lit himself on fire and later died from his injuries.
This is now raising questions about how widespread those feelings could be within the U.S. military.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- concerns that this might indicate that there's a deeper issue. Maybe U.S. military being -- military personnel being concerned about how weapons and support for Israel are being used on civilians in Gaza.
MAJ. GEN. PAT RYDER, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: Well look, from a Department of Defense standpoint, since Hamas' brutal attacks on October 7, we've been focused on the four key areas that the secretary set out from the onset. That's protecting U.S. forces and citizens in the region, supporting Israel's inherent right to defend itself from terrorist attacks, working closely with Israel to support and secure the release of hostages from Hamas, and ensuring that the crisis, the conflict between Hamas and Israel, doesn't escalate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: According to the Pentagon, Bushnell was a cyber defense operations specialist and worked in military intelligence. President Joe Biden's support for Israel in the war with Hamas is triggering backlash in a key swing-state that helped him get elected in 2020. Arab and Muslim democrats in Michigan are threatening to launch a protest vote of sorts come Tuesday's primary.
Details now from CNN's Jeff Zeleny.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF U.S. NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: President Biden's biggest challenge so far in this election year is shaping up on Tuesday in Michigan, not from a primary opponent, but from a policy position. Specifically, his handling of Israel's war in Gaza.
There is a movement, a grassroots movement underway called Listen to Michigan, where organizers are encouraging voters to vote "uncommitted" on their ballots Tuesday, to send a message to the White House and indeed to the president to call for a ceasefire.
This is simply a protest vote so this has big implications for the president's strength going into, of course, the general election.
Now there is no doubt that the president will win the primary on Tuesday in Michigan. But the question is, what will that level of uncommitted support be.
You can simply check uncommitted on the ballot. That's what the organizers are urging them to do, trying to get the White House to pay attention to other deeply-held views on the administration's handling of the war in Gaza.
Now of course, the Arab American and Muslim American population in Michigan is significant, particularly right outside Detroit in Dearborn. Some 146,000 voters participated in 2020. Of course, the president's margin of victory in Michigan back in 2020 was about the same, about 150,000. That's why this coalition is so important.
So again, it's not the outcome of the race on Tuesday. It's testing the president's level of support and it's a warning sign for the president for November. Jeff Zeleny, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Still to come on CNN, social media and free speech, the U.S. Supreme Court hearing arguments from two states which claim some platforms are censoring conservative viewpoints and why the government should act to protect free speech.
[01:39:43]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAUSE: What began as a conservative conspiracy theory is now before the U.S. Supreme Court hearing argument that could dramatically reshape social media. Texas and Florida say sites like Facebook, Instagram, and X, formerly known as Twitter, should not be allowed to remove or demote content which they deemed objectionable.
The case revolves around the claim that conservative opinions are often censored which the plaintiffs say violates their First Amendment right to free speech.
Tech companies state content moderation, which Republicans say is code words for censorship helps them remove hate speech and election misinformation. Restricting it, they say, will infringe their First Amendment rights.
Here's Florida's solicitor general.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY WHITAKER, FLORIDA SOLICITOR GENERAL: Internet platforms today control the way millions of Americans communicate with each other and with the world.
The platforms achieved that success by marketing themselves as neutral forums for free speech. Now that they host the communications of billions of users, they sing a very different tune.
They now say that they are in fact editors of their users' speech rather like a newspaper. They contend that they possess a broad First Amendment right to censor anything they host on their sites, even when doing so contradicts their own representations to consumers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: With us now from Minneapolis is David Schultz, an expert in many aspects of U.S. law, including constitutional law. Professor Schultz, thank you for being with us.
DAVID SCHULTZ, U.S. LAW EXPERT: My pleasure. Thank you for having me today.
VAUSE: Ok. So these two state laws which are currently being challenged before the U.S. Supreme Court were born sort of a Republican conspiracy theory, a few beers (ph) back that big tech was somehow censoring conservative viewpoints by banning users like Donald Trump or removing conservative posts for violation of the platform guidelines. The state laws would prevent that from happening so with more, here's Paul Clement representing the social media companies. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL CLEMENT, LAWYER FOR SOCIAL MEDIA COMPANIES: Florida's effort to level the playing field and to fight the perceived bias of big tech violates the First Amendment several times over.
It interferes with editorial discretion. It compel speech. It discriminates on the basis of content, speaker, and viewpoint.
And it does all this in the name of promoting free speech, but loses sight of the first-principle of the First Amendment, which is it only applies to state action.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: So it's one of the major issues here is if social media companies are like newspapers, which have a legal right to control what they do and what they do not publish or as the states are arguing, they're more like common carriers, a phone company like Western Union. They have no control over the message which is delivered.
SCHULTZ: No, you're absolutely correct. And this is part of the crux of the debate here, because if they were a common carrier they have to let everybody in, have to let everybody speak and the social media companies have no control over anything that's going on.
On the other hand, I think this is the argument that the tech companies, the social media companies are making.
[01:44:49]
SCHULTZ: And it's an important point here to point out here is that the First Amendment was adopted to prevent the government from being able to regulate speech. It does not extend to private actors.
Are private actors entitled to speak or not speak as the way they wish to? Yes, they can. And the same thing here with these -- with these tech companies. They are private entities, they are not arms of the government. Do they have a right to just basically say this is how we want to exercise our editorial discretion, our content discretion.
That's I think what the arguments being made by the tech companies, by Clement.
VAUSE: Ok. So listening to the questions from the court, it seems they're leaning against the argument from Texas and Florida that the government must intervene to protect free speech.
So with more on that, here's Chief Justice John Roberts.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN ROBERTS, CHIEF JUSTICE, SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES: Counsel, you began by saying the platforms they want to keep out this person and that person on the basis of race or sex and then you said that's not the First Amendment.
Well, the First Amendment doesn't apply to them. First Amendment restricts what the government can do. What the governments doing here is saying, you must do this, you must carry these people. Youve got to explain if you don't. That's not the First Amendment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: So to your point just earlier. But this point about the First Amendment only applying to what the government can and cannot do, how is it actually being applied in this case here? SCHULTZ: Well, first up, what's happening here in some sense, there's
a whole let's say, lineage of court cases that are called compelled speech, or what the court has said is that the right to free speech also involves the right not to speak and not to be required to speak about things you don't want to talk about.
And what the Texas and Florida laws are saying, this is the argument being made by justice -- Chief Justice John Roberts, is saying, you two states are requiring a private actor, a private person or entity, to speak or to force them to speak or carry speech against their will. And his argument as he was laying it out here today, was to say that's completely contrary to what the First Amendment is supposed to be about. And that the government cannot compel us to speak when we don't want to speak.
VAUSE: And one issue here is just how far reaching these two laws are in Texas and Florida relates potentially. And that's a point not lost on Justice Sotomayor. Here she is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUSTICE SONIA SOTOMAYOR, SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is so, so broad. It's covering almost everything but the one thing I know about the internet is that it's variety, variety is infinite.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: So if these laws in Texas and Florida are allowed to stand, what does that then mean for moderating the crazy, the hate and the harmful online?
SCHULTZ: Well, if they're allowed to stand at this point, it's going to force literally everything to be out there. And there's going to be no control whatsoever regarding what's going to be posted on the social media.
And this becomes important because if they're now forced to basically cover everything, it also potentially puts them, that is the social media companies, on the hook.
So if for example somebody posts something that's, let's say, racist or inflammatory and something happens as a result of it. This opens them up also to some kind of significant liability or a lawsuit perhaps maybe aiding and abetting, we don't know. But it certainly puts them in a position where it's going to be difficult.
Now, the flip side of this is that if the social media companies win what's the check at the point. And what I'm hoping that the Supreme Court decision does is to provide a parameter a let's say, a first parameter, First Amendment parameter that decides what's the permissible scope of regulation.
Because I think most of us would also want to say that at some point we need to figure out how to come up with some type of acceptable parameters in terms of addressing problems of hate speech or racist speech. So I think that what the court needs to do here is to figure out how
to thread that needle.
VAUSE: It will be a difficult ruling. I imagine just listening to those arguments --
SCHULTZ: Yes.
VAUSE: -- and thinking about it. It's kind of mind-boggling in the extreme.
Professor Schultz, Thank you so much, sir. We appreciate your time.
SCHULTZ: My pleasure. Thank you for having me
VAUSE: Still to come here on CNN NEWSROOM, for Florida's governor, it seemed like a good idea at the time. How could anyone ever foresee banning books would get out of hand?
[01:49:10]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAUSE: Australian police are investigating an assault complaint against Taylor Swift's father. Ben McDonald told CNN he learned the pop superstar was on a yacht after her final show in Sydney Monday.
He said once Swift left the boat a security guard forced an umbrella into his face, and then Swift's dad punched him.
A spokesperson for Swift says threats had been made against a member of her stuff. McDonald denies that claim, calling Swift's entourage aggressive and unprofessional.
In the U.S. state of Florida, some librarians now draw pants and shirts on nude characters just to keep the children's stories on the shelves.
And among the more than 1,000 books which have been recalled by one county, that includes dictionaries, there's more and more conservative parents push back on anything they consider pornographic. Even the state's Republican governor admits the law -- the law he championed on banning books kind of out of control.
CNN's Carlos Suarez has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CARLOS SUAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: At a school district meeting in Indian River County, Florida --
JENNIFER PIPPIN, MOMS FOR LIBERTY: Throughout this entire book, there is pictures of people having sex and they're nude.
It says, I quote -- SUAREZ: Jennifer Pippin, read from a book she says doesn't belong in public schools. Her objection was the only item before a committee of parents and educators who will decide whether the book is removed. No one spoke in favor of keeping the book. The committee decides in April.
A prolific book challenger, Pippin heads the county's conservative parental rights group, Moms for Liberty. She knows the process well.
PIPPIN: We need to remove these materials because they are prohibited per all the laws and statutes.
SUAREZ: How many total number of books have you challenged yourself.
PIPPIN: Myself here in Indian River County, 242.
SUAREZ: Out of these, a couple of titles stand out, the literary classic "In the Night Kitchen" by Maurice Sendak and a newer book, "Unicorns are the Worst" about a grumpy goblin. Both have illustrations of characters without clothes.
Pippin challenged both books under a Florida education law, which allows for the removal of a public-school library book that depicts or describes a sexual conduct.
In her formal objection, Pippin said the images were pornographic, but in our interview, she walked back that claim.
SUAREZ: What's pornographic about them?
PIPPIN: So they're not pornographic. They contain nudity.
SUAREZ: But nudity alone is not harmful to minors according to Florida law, the content would have to appeal to a prurient interest, be patently offensive or without literary or artistic value.
I keep going back to nudity that is harmful to children. And so a goblin's backside on the face of it to me doesn't seem like it is harmful to children.
PIPPIN: Absolutely. So again, you and I can agree on that, but some other parents may not agree.
SUAREZ: Pippin told the district to remove the books or draw on clothing using permanent markers to cover up the nudity. So school librarians drew shorts, overalls, and shirts on the illustrations.
To see these drawings you think that genuinely could adversely affect a child who otherwise may not know what the backside of a goblin looks like or ever thought.
PIPPIN: Sure. So if a child is possibly maybe being raped by an adult and maybe that the seeing the nudity in itself, maybe just not the backside, but seeing something nude could, you know, be detrimental to them. SUAREZ: From her home office in Orlando, Stephana Ferrell couldn't believe it. She's part of the Florida Freedom to Read Project, an organization that tracks thousands of books being challenged in the state.
STEPHANA FERRELL, FLORIDA FREEDOM TO READ PROJECT: I have an eight- year-old, as soon as we heard that "Unicorns are the Worst", had a drawing, was getting drawn on, my son wanted to read it. And so we read through the book and he said to me, mom, she took out the funny part. Why would they do that?
SUAREZ: Ferrell said covering up the images is censorship. The publisher of "Unicorns are the Worst" agrees, telling CNN quote, "There should be no place for this type of literary vandalism in our schools and libraries.
[01:54:48]
FERRELL: These things are happening because the law is broad and the rules are punitive and people are scared. And we're -- we've lost track of good judgment and common sense.
SUAREZ: School libraries across Florida have removed more than 1,400 titles during the 2022-2023 school year, according to writer advocacy group Pen America.
Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who signed the law making all of this possible, now admits some book objections have gone too far. He wants state lawmakers to limit the challenges.
GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL): If you're somebody WHO doesn't have a kid in school and you're going to object to 100 books, no, I don't think that that's appropriate.
SUAREZ: Under a proposal moving in the state legislature, school districts would be able to fine individuals $100 for a book challenge after they've unsuccessfully objected to five books.
Lawmakers are also looking whether to limit challenges from people who don't have children at the school where the book is located.
Jennifer Pippin told us she challenged "Unicorns are the Worst", the book with the naked goblin on behalf of a grandparent.
Carlos Suarez, CNN -- Miami.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: A new project from renowned author Margaret Atwood has hit the shelves "14 Days" is a collaborative novel of stories from the early days of the COVID-19 pandemic.
(INAUDIBLE) is the cast of characters trapped in a New York apartment building during 14 days of lockdown. Each chapter is written by a different author, including John Grisham, (INAUDIBLE) Stein, Andy Cruz (ph) and Atwood herself. The twist lies in that the writers' identities are only revealed at
the end of each story. The book's co-author tells CNN Atwood was instrumental in lining up such a big cast of authors to take part in the novel.
Runaway train -- a freight train in India, somehow traveled for 74 kilometers before it was stopped. It was on the run for one-and-a-half hours before workers actually managed to use the emergency brakes by putting stones on the tracks.
No one was injured in the incident. Officials say four people have been suspended and an investigation is underway.
Thank you for watching. I'm John Vause.
Please stay with us. CNN NEWSROOM continues with my friend and colleague Rosemary Church, after a short break.
See you back here tomorrow.
[01:56:56]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
