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Biden Campaign Acknowledges Michigan Protest Vote; Supreme Court Hears Argument On Trump-Era Bump Stock Ban; Pope Francis Back At Vatican After Hospital Visit. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired February 28, 2024 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:00]

REP. ERIC SWALWELL (D-CA): And I use the word secondhand embarrassment because that's what we witnessed in there is they're so desperate to humiliate the president that they started asking the president's son personal details about a divorce that happened almost 10 years ago. That's where this has been reduced too. And they're doing all this, by the way, when we're just days away from the government shutting down, we're critically, critically in need of funding for Ukraine, the humanitarian crisis over in the Middle East, and more security and a broader immigration plan in this country.

They're wasting time squandering an opportunity to do that because they've never accepted Joe Biden as the president. And now, in this last Hail Mary effort, they're going to try and pull off something. I promise you. Pass this prologue. It's not going to work.

REP. JAMIE RASKIN (D-MD): All right, let's go back to the oversight side, to Dan Goldman.

REP. DAN GOLDMAN (D-NY): Sure. I'll be brief. I want to be very clear, the first hour of this much-anticipated testimony was the nail in the coffin to what is a complete bogus and sham impeachment inquiry. Not only did they -- were they unable to show any connection between Hunter Biden's business and President Biden, but Hunter Biden gave very detailed and clear explanations as to what his arm's length business transactions were with private parties in foreign countries who are investors and businesspeople like many people would have.

He went through a laundry list of board seats and jobs that he has had over his 30-year career after he left Yale Law School, and he withstood some inappropriate attacks even in the first hour. So, it is not simply there's no connection to the president, which we've known all along, and which was made clear again, but there is a very understandable coherent business explanation for every single thing that they asked for. And now, that all of this China stuff or Romania or Kazakhstan is clearly, clearly baseless and bogus. The only thing that the Republicans have left are these Burisma allegations, which we now know --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. We're going to continue to monitor what these Democrats are saying emerging during this break in this deposition involving Hunter Biden up on Capitol Hill. We'll stay on top of this important story today. You've heard strong words coming from these Democrats.

We'll take a quick break. Much more of our news right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:37:17]

BLITZER: The Biden campaign is now acknowledging that the Michigan protest vote cost the -- cost of president 13 percent of the Democratic electric -- electorate yesterday was significant. In a statement, a senior Biden advisor now says the president "shares the goal of many of the folks who voted uncommitted." More than 100,000 people did so in Tuesday's primary, largely to protest the president's handling of the Israel-Hamas war, the support for Israel that could spell trouble potentially come November if the margin is tight in Michigan.

Let's discuss what's going on with CNN Political Commentators Karen Finney and Geoff Duncan. Geoff is also -- was also the Republican Lieutenant Governor of Georgia. Karen, let me start with you.

KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes.

BLITZER: In recent primaries in Michigan, about 20,000 people voted uncommitted. Uncommitted, 19,000 in 2022, 21,600 in 2016, 20,833 in 2012. Yesterday, 101,000 people in Michigan voted uncommitted.

And presumably, many of them voting uncommitted because they don't like President Biden's support for Israel in the war with Hamas. How significant potentially, is that looking ahead to November?

FINNEY: Well, I think it's a couple of factors we have to look at. Number one, so that's about 13 percent. In 2012 with President Obama, it was about 11 percent. And Obama was obviously able to close that gap and -- when handling 2012.

So, the question is, will President Biden do the work he needs to do to get back and to gain the support of those uncommitted voters? And it was interesting yesterday listening to them say that for them, they're not protesting President Biden himself, but they're concerned about the Palestinian people. They want a ceasefire.

Hopefully, as the president has said, that will happen soon. And we can move to a position where we are helping to rebuild and helping to bring peace in the region.

But just very quickly. I think the second thing that was interesting, out of yesterday, about 26 percent or so, maybe 30 percent voted for Nikki Haley. And she didn't do anything. So, that also tells you there is a percentage of voters in Michigan that they're not voting for Donald Trump, and they are also available to President Biden in the fall.

BLITZER: Michigan, as you know, Geoff is a key battleground state right now. Your home state of Georgia is a key battleground state. Pennsylvania. Wisconsin. How do you see this unfolding as far as the Democrats are concerned and the Republicans?

GEOFF DUNCAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, in a normal election like this or primary, you focus on these top-line numbers, these larger winning margins. But instead, we're all focused on kind of this pent-up heartburn or protest vote. For Donald Trump, it's about character. For Joe Biden, it's about policy.

And so, it's probably easier for Joe Biden to fix the policies if he's willing to make those adjustments around immigration, around the Palestinians, and inflation and all those other policy issues.

[11:40:10]

These character issues embedded in Donald Trump. He's not going to get rid of 91 indictments. He's got -- not going to get rid of sexual assault charges. He's not going to get rid of what seems to be pending bankruptcies or fiscal problems. And so, that's woven into who he is.

And I think there's real problems for the Republican Party. I've been saying this for a long time. We have a math problem.

We can't convince the suburbs that Donald Trump is worthy of their vote. We just can't. And we've seen that election cycle after election cycle. We certainly saw that play out in Georgia, with elections like Herschel Walker's.

FINNEY: Yes.

BLITZER: Do you --

FINNEY: Yes -- no, I agree. And I do think that if you look at -- both men have challenges. But as Greg was saying -- I'm sorry, as Geoff was saying --

DUNCAN: We're the G.

FINNEY: We're the G. Sorry. G-Man -- was saying that is a problem with Donald Trump. And as these cases unfold, there's more that we could learn that will further damage the sort of character piece.

And despite what Trump is saying about policy, he's got some policy issues as well. He has said that he is open to a 15-week abortion ban. That is a ban and we saw that fell in Virginia. That's going to be a problem in the election in the fall.

BLITZER: What did -- what can President Biden do between now and November to shore up --

FINNEY: Yes.

BLITZER: -- that support in the key battleground state like Michigan?

FINNEY: He's got to go there. He's got to go there and talk to people. And it doesn't have to be public. It doesn't have to be a big press event. But you know, he is such -- he has such empathy and warmth. And I think people, they're feeling pain.

I mean, we're -- you know, we Debbie Dingell talked about the fact that so many of the people that we're talking about in Michigan, they have family members in the Gaza Strip, who they can't get out, who are you know, harmed in some way. And so, I think going there and hearing directly from -- don't send more advisors. You go. You hear from people.

And I think the more he is out and about and talking with people, they're going to feel heard. And that is critical in this election.

BLITZER: As you know, Geoff, Nikki Haley, despite losing again to Trump in Michigan yesterday, she's valuing -- she's going to continue and continue and continue. Listen to what she told our Dana Bash last night. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIKKI HALEY, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are in all the Super Tuesday states now. That's what this is all about is making sure that we hit every state and letting them know --

DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR & CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: So, yes?

HALEY: Look, there is a voice out there for you. There is a way out. Yes, we are fighting through. Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: What do you think?

DUNCAN: Well, I think it's important for Nikki Haley to stay in this race as long as she possibly can. We need a counterweight to Donald Trump as Republicans, right? Money is typically the reason why folks get out of races and she's not in any jeopardy of running out of money. In fact, she's out raising Donald Trump at this point, and not spending any of it on her own legal defense funds like Donald Trump is.

The age issues also out there. I mean, they're both elderly individuals, Biden and Trump. And so, making sure we have somebody in there to be able to be a counterweight.

And then the realities. The realities are Donald Trump cannot win this race. He just can't. And we have to wake up to reality as Republicans.

BLITZER: Guys, thank you very, very much. Geoff Duncan and Karen Finney, appreciate it very much. Happening now. The U.S. Supreme Court is hearing arguments at a major gun case. We have details.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:47:30] BLITZER: Happening right now. Arguments are underway before the U.S. Supreme Court as the nine justices tried to settle a question. Did the government go too far on bump stocks for guns? You might recall that the 2017 Las Vegas shooter used a bump stock to basically turn a semi- automatic weapon into a machine gun. He killed dozens of people from a 32nd-floor sniper's perch in the deadliest mass shooting in modern U.S. history. Now, a gun rights group wants the justices to decide if the Trump administration went too far when it banned the device back in 2018.

CNN Justice Correspondent Jessica Schneider is with me here. We're watching all of this unfold, Jessica. This is not a Second Amendment case. What's the argument from the plaintiffs?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. This is really a case, Wolf, without statutory interpretation. And that's what the justices have been trying to grapple with. For just about the past 90 minutes, the plaintiffs here are arguing that bump stocks don't fall within the meaning of a statute first enacted in 1930 that was intended and did effectively ban machine guns.

It's interesting. This statute actually was targeted at gangsters like Al Capone when they were increasingly using machine guns back at the turn of the 20th Century. So, it's this statute that the ATF relied on to ban bump stocks in 2018.

This law actually defines machine guns as a weapon. And this is crucial. That fire is more than one round with a single function of a trigger.

So, ATF is interpreting this to say that even with bump stocks, you're still only pulling the trigger once. But the plaintiffs have stepped in to say, wait a second here, it's not just about pulling the trigger when you use a bump stock. You also have to apply this forward pressure on the weapons. So, there's an extra step involved. And they're saying because of that, it doesn't fall under this statute.

So, that's what the justices are grappling with. They're also asking the question, Wolf, why didn't Congress make this more explicit? Isn't this up to Congress to ban bump stocks? Here's the back and forth.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

NEIL GORSUCH, SUPREME COURT ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: I can certainly understand why these items should be made illegal. But we're dealing with a statute that was enacted in the 1930s. And through many administrations, the government took the position that these bump stocks are not machine guns.

BRIAN FLETCHER, U.S. PRINCIPAL DEPUTY SOLICITOR GENERAL: After the Las Vegas shooting, the deadliest shooting in our nation's history, I think it would have been irresponsible for the ATF not to take another closer look at this prior interpretation, which was reflected in a handful of classification letters and to look at the problem more carefully. And having done that, I think it would have been irresponsible if the ATF concluded, as it did, that these devices are prohibited under the best reading of the statute for the ATF not to fix.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

[11:50:13]

SCHNEIDER: So, at this point, we're still -- we're really just trying to read the tea leaves here to see how the justices might roll. It does seem like a majority, potentially of the Conservatives are looking at this possibility that they might say that the ATF didn't have the authority to enact this rule to ban bump stocks. We're still looking carefully at the Chief Justice, John Roberts, also Amy Coney Barrett. But it's quite possible that even though bump stocks have been banned since 2018 if the Supreme Court says the ATF didn't have the authority, that they would no longer be banned whenever they issue some ruling.

BLITZER: Yes, a significant case before the Supreme Court right now. You'll stay on top of it.

SCHNEIDER: Yes.

BLITZER: And we'll get back to you. Thanks very much. Jessica Schneider reporting.

Other important news we're following. Pope Francis is back at the Vatican after a visit to the hospital today. We'll go live to Rome with the latest developments on his health. That's next.

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[11:55:10]

BLITZER: Pope Francis is now back at the Vatican after he was taken to a hospital earlier today for tests. CNN's Ben Wedeman is joining us live from Rome right now. Ben, what are we learning about the pope's health?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we know even from the pope himself who today before a general audience at the Vatican said he had a slight cold and that he has been under the weather now for almost a week. But today, he was taken to the Gemelli hospital in the Tiber Island for what the Vatican described as some diagnostic tests. Now, he was only there for about an hour and then returned to the Vatican. And we've heard since that he's going to be beaded Saturday with German Chancellor Olaf Scholz.

However, his health has not been good recently. Last Saturday, he canceled all audiences because of what was described as a slight flu. And on Monday, again, he canceled all audiences The Vatican Press Office said it was because of flu-like symptoms, but they added not a fever.

But going back over the last year, he's had several visits to the hospital. In March, he was hospitalized with lung inflammation. In June, he had abdominal surgery. In November, he had to cancel a visit to Dubai due to what the Vatican says was the -- was flu and a lung inflammation.

And keep in mind. Going back to his teenage years, he had part of -- one of his lungs removed. So, this pope who's 87 years old continues to be active but continues to -- it appears he's slowing down because of these illnesses that he is encountering ever more frequently, Wolf.

BLITZER: We, of course, wish him a speedy recovery. Ben Wedeman in Rome, thank you very much. And to our viewers. Thanks very much for watching.

I'm Wolf Blitzer. I'll be back later tonight at 6:00 p.m. Eastern in the "SITUATION ROOM." I'll be back right here tomorrow morning at 11:00 a.m. Eastern.

Stay with CNN. "INSIDE POLITICS" with Dana Bash starts right after a short break.

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