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U.S. Officials Warn Against Invasion Of Rafah As Israel Presses Ahead; IDF Orders Residents To Leave Northern Gaza; Top Progressive Faces Tough Primary After Criticizing Israel; Vladimir Putin Replaces Defense Minister Shoigu In Surprise Move; Behind Trump's Fiery Immigration Rhetoric Is A Radical Agenda; Prince Harry And Meghan Wrap Up Nigeria Trip. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired May 12, 2024 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:59:57]

JESSICA DEAN, CNN ANCHOR: The Israeli military now targeting northern and Central Gaza as well as Eastern Rafah in an effort to prevent what it says are Hamas' attempt at regrouping. The Hamas-controlled Ministry of Health saying 63 people have died in the last 24 hours putting the death toll to more than 35,000 since the war began seven months ago. CNN cannot independently verify those numbers.

All of this just days after President Biden warned Israel against an invasion of Rafah, threatening to withhold offensive weapons from its ally.

CNN senior White House reporter Kevin Liptak is traveling with President Biden. He joins us now from Delaware.

And Kevin, top White House officials are now doubling down on the president's ultimatum. We heard from them this morning. What else are they saying?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, you continue to hear the White House and administration officials warning against a ground invasion of Rafah and they're really channeling President Biden's view that U.S. weapons should not be used to support a mission that in their estimation is ill-advised and very, very bloody.

Those concerns were conveyed earlier today in a phone call between the U.S. National Security adviser Jake Sullivan and his counterpart in Israel. And I think this phone call is significant. It's the first time that we've seen a call like this announced between the White House and the government of Israel since President Biden delivered that ultimatum and CNN that he would not provide certain weapons systems to Israel if a ground invasion moves forward.

The White House says in that call Sullivan and his counterpart discussed alternatives to a ground invasion of Rafah. And the White House says that the Israeli national security adviser did say that these concerns were being taken into account. But at the end of the day, the concerns that the White House has about an invasion of Rafah are nothing new. The president has been raising them with the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu going back months, going back to February.

That has not necessarily deterred Netanyahu from pressing forward. He has said that a ground invasion of Rafah is necessary to completely eliminate Hamas. When you hear from American officials today, that is completely at odds with what they are saying. We heard from the American Secretary of State Antony Blinken, who said that a ground invasion of Rafah could lead to a Hamas insurgency.

Listen to more of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE: The president has been clear for some time that we couldn't and would not support a major military operation in Rafah. Now, at the same time, we share Israel's objective in making sure that Hamas cannot govern Gaza anymore, that it'd be demilitarized, that Israel get its leaders. We continue to support that. But there's a better way of achieving that than going headlong into Rafah.

That's what we're talking about with Israel now. We have a better way of doing it. We're engaged in conversations with them about that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LIPTAK: Now Blinken also said today that the U.S. believes Israel has killed more civilians in this conflict than members of Hamas. He also said the U.S. hasn't seen a plan from Israel about security and governance in Gaza once this war ends. So really taken all together some of the sharpest criticism that we've seen from the Biden administration directed towards Israel since the start of this conflict. And I think it really shows you that this relationship and this war are really reaching an inflection point -- Jessica.

DEAN: All right, Kevin Liptak traveling with the president in Delaware this weekend. Thanks so much for that reporting.

And more families in northern Gaza are packing up and leaving, following orders given by Israeli defense forces. On Saturday, residents of several neighborhoods were told to leave immediately and head toward shelters west of Gaza City. IDF fighter jets had been striking what they called military targets across Jabalya and conducting military operations in nearby neighborhoods.

One father of three says Israeli forces were dropping leaflets, warning they will invade the north.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): There is no safe place. It's been the same story the seven ordinary times we've moved. There is no safe place. Wherever we go, there's bombardment. There was bombardment at the Indonesian hospital and the doctors and medics were forced out. I had to leave like everyone else. I don't know what to say. Is this a life? Death is more honorable than this humiliation. UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Last night was intense.

Artillery, F-16. There were injured and murders. It was a horrible night. And we woke up to the same thing, smoke bombs, sound bombs, and F-16s. We were displaced multiple times. This is the 10th time. I don't know what to say. Other countries should support us and have a ceasefire. It's enough.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: I'm joined now by former State Department Middle East negotiator, Aaron David Miller, and CNN military analysts and retired U.S. army commanding general, Lieutenant General Mark Hertling.

Good to have both of you here.

Aaron, let's start first with you. Based on Kevin's reporting from just a few moments ago, the U.S. is continuing to warn Israel against this invasion, this full-scale invasion in Rafah, predicting that such an operation would likely lead to widespread civilian casualties.

[18:05:08]

They think it will spark a Hamas insurgency and create a power vacuum that Hamas would likely try to fill later. Do you think this administration is correct in that assessment?

AARON DAVID MILLER, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT MIDDLE EAST NEGOTIATOR: I think the assessment is correct. I'm not sure we're reaching an inflection point in U.S.-Israel relationship.

You know, Jessica, with respect to red lines, when it comes to the U.S.-Israeli relationship, red lines have a way of turning pink. And I think the question is whether or not the Netanyahu government is going to try to find a way without violating the president's own red line and/or whether the administration not looking for sustainable breach with Israel, they need a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas.

That's the only way the Biden administration is going to begin to get out of the strategic cul-de-sac that they're now in. So they can't fundamentally break with the government. They're going to have to continue to cooperate. The question is how much are they prepared to accept with respect to impending, looming Israeli operations, not only in Eastern Rafah, now in the south? How much farther will the Israelis go and with how much intensity?

DEAN: And General Hertling, I want to play a clip -- there it is. I'm going to play a clip from Secretary of State Antony Blinken. He talked a little bit about the U.S. withholding that bomb shipment to Israel. So let's listen in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLINKEN: At present the only thing that we've delayed and are holding back are these high payload bombs because we're in an ongoing conversation with Israel, given the impact that those weapons can have when they're used in densely populated areas, including an area like Rafah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So you still might deliver them?

BLINKEN: So we're in an active conversation with Israel about that. We have real concerns about the way they're used. We believe two things. One, you have to have a clear, credible plan to protect civilians, which we haven't seen. Second, we also need to see a plan for what happens after this conflict in Gaza is over, and we still haven't seen that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Do you agree with him?

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I absolutely do, Jessica. What we're talking about is warfare. And anytime you have any kind of combat like that, it not only has to have a kinetic and state, what is going to happen, what are you trying to do in terms of your military strategy, but that has to be linked to some kind of political strategy. What does the area look like when this is all over?

And that is what President Biden has been attempting to get Mr. Netanyahu to do for the last six months. Tell us how this ends. What happens when the fighting stopped? I think they've been very empathetic -- the administration has been very empathetic to the Israelis understanding that they're going after a terrorist organization that has embedded itself underground in this area of operation.

But what they haven't been able to glean from the Israelis is what is this going to look like after you kill all the Hamas soldiers, and instead, over the last several months, it's taken a turn where as Mr. Blinken just said it is creating more problems than it's solving. Not only from the standpoint of what's going on in Gaza, but Israel's reputation on the world stage. And of course the U.S. reputation in terms of supplying arms to Israel that may be using them in inappropriate ways.

A 2,000-pound bomb in an area that has a lot of civilians and a lot of infrastructure, going after small terrorist targets is not the way to approach a counterterrorism operation.

DEAN: And Aaron, if Israel does indeed move forward with this full- scale invasion, what do you think that means for the dozens of hostages, including five Americans that are still being held in Gaza?

MILLER: Look, the hostage situation is that most urgent, not an Israeli, but you look at the families and you look at the abuse particularly that the women are probably undergoing. You already have 31 hostages who probably no longer alive, maybe more. Their bodies taken, either they're killed on October 7th, their bodies taken to trade back to Gaza, or they died in captivity. Every day that goes by the mental, physical condition of these hostages becomes more vulnerable.

The problem for the Israelis, of course, and Hamas understands this is, is that Hamas is not going to trade and return all of these hostages, except for a comprehensive cessation of hostilities and an end to the war. And that's why destroying Hamas on one hand and redeeming the hostages on the other are probably fundamentally incompatible goals.

General Hertling was absolutely right. Military strategy, powers, the instrument to achieve a set of realistic and effective objectives, and there's been absolutely no planning on the Israeli side.

[18:10:06]

What they're likely to see ultimately is Hamas as an insurgency either through intimidation or co-optation, being able to influence Palestinian national politics. There'll be no Palestinian government in Gaza to speak of and no heir of state involvement because the Israelis are very hesitant with holding about basically agreeing to a political horizon. So right now, the Biden administration is in a box.

One last point, the Biden administration is in a much greater (INAUDIBLE) than either Hamas or Israel is to fundamentally end this conflict. That's I think part of the problem.

DEAN: And General Hertling, so we know some Republicans have been very vocal in their criticism of the Biden administration's moves right now, especially with withholding those bombs, saying the U.S. is abandoning a key ally. The administration saying a line has to be drawn with these civilian casualties and points out over and over again that the flow of those defensive weapons is absolutely going to continue.

How do you see that situation?

HERTLING: That's fascinating, Jessica. It's an interesting conundrum because many of the Republicans that are saying that are the same Republicans who held up aid to Israel and Ukraine for over seven months. And now, because they're seeing the administration use the delivery of that aid to try and persuade the Israeli government and not create a humanitarian disaster, it just seems counterintuitive to me that these are the same individuals who held aid against -- who held the delivery of aid for both Ukraine and Israel over the last half a year.

DEAN: And just before I let you go, I did want to get your thoughts on Russian President Vladimir Putin's decision to replace the defense minister with a civilian due to what the Kremlin called the need for innovation. What are you -- what do you think about this?

HERTLING: Yes, the person we're talking about, the current defense minister, Shoigu, is likely going to be replaced by a guy named Andrei Belousov. He's a first deputy prime minister. He's a -- his background is in economics and not defense, and it's likely a reflection of Putin's trust in him and the need for a better internal management within the Ministry of Defense. Additionally, Shoigu has been the minister of defense for the last 12 years.

I think the biggest -- you know, it's a normal shakeup within the ministry of Russia. And for anyone who watches Russia, they know this happens all the time. But what's going to be interesting is what generals are then going to fall that used to be Shoigu associates and I'm speaking specifically of the chief of the Russian forces and that's General Gerasimov. He's likely to be gone, too, soon.

So it is certainly a shakeup. They have not been very successful in this war and it's Putin's way of saying, we have to make some changes in the running of the department and the management of the Ministry of Defense. It's also probably tied to what's going on truthfully in Georgia as well. Russia is now trying to get a little bit more trigger happy, let's call it that, in terms of supporting the opposition to the government in Georgia.

So you're seeing Russia being stretched in many different directions and they knew they need different management.

DEAN: All right. Mark Hertling, Aaron David Miller, our thanks to both of you.

HERTLING: Pleasure, Jessica. Thank you.

MILLER: Nice to be here.

DEAN: Israel's war with Hamas has left Democrats divided over how to address that conflict. Now, Israel's critics in Congress are feeling the political ramifications. We're going to explain ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:18:21]

DEAN: Growing divisions among Democrats over Israel's war in Gaza could cost one of its most outspoken critics his seat in Congress. Congressman Jamaal Bowman of New York facing a heated challenge from a fellow Democrat over criticism he's prioritized his progressive politics over what his district wants. That race is shaping up to be what could be this year's most competitive House Democratic primary.

And joining us now to talk about his reporting and insights into this, CNN senior reporter Isaac Dovere.

Isaac, great to have you.

EDWARD-ISAAC DOVERE, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Good to be here.

DEAN: Tell us a little bit. You dove into this race. What did you find? Lay it out for us.

DOVERE: Well, look, Jamaal Bowman was elected in 2020 in a primary against a guy named Eliot Engel, who had been in office for a very long time. And what Bowman said is that Engel was too focused on Washington and not on his district. I in fact one time knocked on Eliot Engel's door in the middle of a time when he said that he was in his district and turned out he was at his home in Maryland. But Bowman in the time since he won the primary that year has really

distinguished himself as one of the most outspoken progressives in Washington. Very much in the news for a lot of things, including shouting matches sometimes on the steps of the Capitol with Republicans, but also when it comes to the issue of what to do with the Israel and Gaza war, taking a stance that is so much seen as anti- Israel that the group J Street, a left-leaning pro-Israel group, but very much not where, for example, AIPAC is, withdrew its endorsement saying that he had singled Israel out.

And in his district which runs from the North Bronx into Westchester, that has been a real problem for him and it looks like he -- the challenge that he's gotten this year might, as you say, be the most intense primary a House Democrat faces this year because in that district there's a lot of feeling like they want more pro-Israel, at least evenhanded support from Bowman.

[18:20:10]

DEAN: And even within the Democratic Party, it's no secret, you've done reporting on this. There's been a lot of reporting on how -- what a wedge that issue, that particular issue, Israel-Hamas war, has driven into the Democratic Party. Democratic congressman, former House majority leader, Steny Hoyer, told CNN this this week. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. STENY HOYER (D-MD): Well, you know my position on Israel. It's very strong and I regret that there are members who are in effect I think reflecting the views of Hamas, which are to kill Jews and to eliminate Israel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Now Hoyer is an ally of the pro-Israel organization, AIPAC, and AIPAC has been very involved in a lot of these primaries like Bowman's, helping fund candidates against them. How are they affecting Bowman's race specifically?

DOVERE: Yes, and it should be noted, when Hoyer speaking there, he wasn't singling out Bowman or any other member directly.

DEAN: Right. Yes.

DOVERE: But that quote is among the things that's in our story about what's going on in Washington and in the wider political world about this issue and how Israel is being litigated. But for AIPAC, look, they are going to spend millions of dollars in this primary. They are spending they say about 100 million nationwide and a variety of primaries, but, importantly, they are not the only organization that is very much aligned against Bowman at this point.

I talked to local legislators who say that Bowman has not been connecting with lots of areas in the community, but specifically the Jewish community as well as a number of groups, some of them Jewish groups, some of them black groups, as saying that they just have been really unsatisfied with the kind of priorities that Bowman has put on things and that that has come to a head with where things were and have continued to be since October 7th but that they were looking to defeat him already by October 6th, probably.

DEAN: Yes. And it's interesting to see how this plays out district by district because similarly in Pennsylvania was able to win her primary in a similar situation pretty easily. So we will see how this plays out.

Isaac Dovere, thanks so much for that reporting. We appreciate it.

DOVERE: Thank you.

DEAN: And let's talk about this more with Republican strategist and former White House spokesperson during the George W. Bush administration, Pete Seat, and Democratic strategist and former special assistant to President Biden, Meghan Hays.

Good to see both of you.

Meghan, first to you. President Biden has always been very confident in his foreign policy skills. He's maintained his support for Israel since October 7th. We are starting to see shifts in the White House's policy, especially when it comes to this potential invasion in Rafah. I know you've been in the room with him for years.

Walk us through how he processes information like this? How he might have arrived at the decision to withhold those bombs in this instance?

MEGHAN HAYS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Look, I think he's thinking about, is this actually going or giving them these bombs actually going to get the hostages back and get a ceasefire, and then work towards a two-state solution and actually peace at the end of the day. And I think that, you know, just like Secretary Blinken was saying earlier today on many channels, this does not accomplish that. This accomplishes mass casualties in Rafah.

So they're withholding -- they're not withholding all of the weapons. They're withholding a small portion of very, very catastrophic bombs to achieve, to get Israel to give them a plan of how they're going to go into Rafah to actually eliminate Hamas. I think the president probably looked at this holistically and thought, how can I save the most civilian lives moving forward while still giving Israel what they need to protect themselves.

DEAN: And Pete, Republicans clearly on the attack over the president's decision over these bombs. Is this an issue they think can persuade voters and move the needle for them in November?

PETE SEAT, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Absolutely. Because President Biden is making foreign policy decisions based purely on politics and even beyond that, he's allowing college students protesting on their campuses to write America's foreign policy. He's allowing these students who are protesting to decide that we should not stand as closely as we have in the past with our ally Israel, our staunchest ally in the Middle East. And so not every American has been in the room as my Democratic

counterpart has been. But as we're looking at this from the outside, we see a president who's putting politics ahead of national security and ahead of the interests of our ally, as they fight a terrorist organization in Hamas.

DEAN: So, Meghan, I'm just curious if you have a response to that, how the president can come back? What Pete just laid out there, that this criticism that it looks political.

HAYS: I mean, I fundamentally disagree. I mean, he is trying to save more lives. There are millions of people who are in Rafah, civilians, women and children.

[18:25:01]

Yes, there are Hamas and we are giving them weapons to fight. The president has asked for a roadmap of how they're going to go into Rafah and not kill innocent civilians. I don't think that most Americans want innocent civilians today, and I don't think that anybody wants us to abandon Israel, which the president has made very clear that he is not abandoning Israel. He's giving them weapons.

He's literally holding 2,000-pound bombs, which are catastrophic in the terms of civilian casualties. So I would just, you know, tell folks that this is not -- that he is not abandoning Israel. He is trying to make the best decision to move forward in a humanitarian effort while still giving Israel what they need to protect themselves and to eradicate Hamas.

DEAN: Pete, I want to ask you about something that President Trump said about Jewish voters earlier this week. Jewish voters who are supporting Biden. We can listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Biden is doing with respect to Israel is disgraceful. If any Jewish person voted for Joe Biden, they should be ashamed of themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Why does Trump think that's an effective pitch?

SEAT: He thinks it's an effective pitch because there are Jewish Democrats, and we've seen this reported, who are wavering on their support of President Biden. They do not see him supporting Israel. This is a wedge that Joe Biden has driven into the Democratic Party. And he's right now siding, as I said, with those college students, because he believes that they are more important to his electoral prospects.

I wouldn't necessarily use the language that president, former president Trump is using to make this point. But he's making an important point. The point being Jewish Democrats who have long stood with the Democratic Party are having second thoughts about it based on how Joe Biden is handling this situation.

DEAN: And Meghan, I want to let you respond to that before we go.

HAYS: Yes. I just think that's an extremely patronizing comment. It's just (INAUDIBLE) but what do you expect from President Trump? I mean, he's also the same person that called neo-Nazis that were marching in Charlottesville very you fine people. So, you know, he does what's best politically for him in this instance. I just -- it's incredibly patronizing I think to any electorate, but I wouldn't expect much different.

DEAN: All right. Pete Seat and Meghan Hays, we will leave it there, but I appreciate your time this afternoon. Thanks so much.

And major military shakeup in Russia as Vladimir Putin replaces his longtime defense minister with a civilian. Why the Kremlin says the move has to happen as Russia's war with Ukraine continues.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:32:01]

DEAN: Russian president Vladimir Putin is shaking up his cabinet just days after being sworn in to office for a fifth term. Putin replacing his defense minister Shoigu who has held that position for more than a decade, but who's also come under fire for a lack of results on the battlefield in Ukraine.

CNN contributor and former Moscow bureau chief Jill Dougherty joins us now.

And Jill, how surprised are you by this move?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, you know, there have been rumors that this would happen and don't forget, when Putin came back into office again he -- everybody formally gives their -- say that they're leaving the government and then he reappoints. So there were rumors that this would happen with Shoigu.

But I think what's important is to remember that, you know, it's not really the defense minister per say, who runs the battlefield. It's really the chief of the general staff. And that's General Gerasimov, and he's going to stay at least for the time being. But Shoigu will be moving over and he'll be heading the Security Council, which is important, but it is a shakeup.

DEAN: And this new appointee, his background is in economics. How do you think that translates into this new position? I know you're -- I hear what you're saying that they may -- you know, he's going to have other people that are helping very specifically on the battlefield. But how do you think his background will play into all of this?

DOUGHERTY: I think it does make sense because this person, Andre Belousov actually is an economist and he's kind of a technocrat. And that's kind of what they need right now because the entire Russian economy has become militarized. So how this monstrous military and the budget for the military fit into the entire picture of the economy is really, really important. So this guy comes in and, again, I think it does make sense in that way that he will try to coordinate all of it.

He's not going to be doing, you know, where is the next battle and where did the tanks go. He's really the money man and the money man is really important right now.

DEAN: And just this week, CNN reported Western intelligence believe Russia is seeking to exploit what it considers to be a window of opportunity in Ukraine as Ukraine is waiting for this new aid to arrive from us, from our allies. Belousov has his work cut out for him if he's to sustain this ramp-up of air and other attacks before new weapons and ammunition makes its way into Ukraine.

DOUGHERTY: Yes, I mean, he has to now make sure that the defense industrial complex provides what the military need and don't forget, they can't do as much as they need. So that's why they're getting drones from Iran. They're getting ammunition and weapons, especially ammunition, from the North Koreans.

[18:35:01]

But that's it. He's really going to have to be the supply guy for the military and then the general. And remember, you know, this General Gerasimov who's the chief of the general staff, isn't particular particularly popular right now and has made a lot of mistakes. So we'll see the other shoe may not have fallen here because he's staying, Gerasimov is staying, but we don't know for how long.

DEAN: Exactly. And I want to look a little further into the future. Putin set to go to China to meet with the Chinese president. What's at stake there? How closely will the U.S. be watching that?

DOUGHERTY: Very closely, because after all Russia and China are coordinating. They are allies right now. The -- obviously the Chinese are playing it very carefully. They don't completely come on board in supporting Putin, in what he is doing. I think on certain level, they are somewhat nervous about what is going on in Ukraine, but they do support in many ways. Putin and certainly economically. And that's important. So that interplay is very, very important for the United States to watch carefully.

DEAN: Jill Dougherty, always good to see you. Thanks so much.

DOUGHERTY: Sure.

DEAN: Still ahead, implementation is everything. How Stephen Miller, called the most dangerous person in Trump's inner circle, plans to turn Trump's hardline rhetoric on immigration into action.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:41:20]

DEAN: Tonight mass arrest, detention, and deportation. Trump's already extreme immigration policies if elected president are now bigger, bolder, and, in his words, going to be a bloodbath.

CNN's Phil Mattingly reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRUMP: I don't know if you call them people. In some cases, they're not people in my opinion.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The predictable and according to critics justified frenzy over rhetoric like that from former President Trump has obscured a crucial reality. Beneath Trump's bombast sits an expansive and largely unprecedented swath of immigration policy.

It's an agenda that marks a dramatic shift from Trump's 2016 candidacy, which was driven by similarly dark rhetoric, but little in the form of tangible planning.

TRUMP: They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists.

MATTINGLY: Where the red meat for the base is actually underpinned by a flurry of actions Trump and his advisers say they can launch without Congress as soon as day one of a second term. Trump's ambitions are expansive, according to campaign officials and key outside advisers.

STEPHEN MILLER, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO PRESIDENT TRUMP: It's a feat similar current size and scale to the other great American projects that have been undertaken. You know, for example, the Transcontinental Railroad or digging the Panama Canal.

MATTINGLY: And the plans, many of them, tethered to decades-old statutes are neither subtle nor secret. Mass arrests, detention, and deportation, plans to reshape the agencies responsible for the border and re-implement and then expand on that first term immigration agenda.

Stephen Miller is credited as the architect of the most extreme policies from Trump's time in the Oval Office. He's working closely with the former president to draft their plans for a potential second term.

MILLER: And I'll be blunt, conservatives will need to have the stomach for it.

MATTINGLY: Yet it's Trump's rhetoric --

TRUMP: That it's going to be a bloodbath for the country. That'll be the least of it.

MATTINGLY: And the record of the first term plans many rejected by the courts and Congress has had the effect of overshadowing a very different moment, one in which Trump would re-enter the West Wing with policies ready to deploy, surrounded by advisers committed to doing just that.

Miller is not a part of the official campaign but is widely expected to serve as Trump's point person on the issue. On its face, it's a simplistic two-point plan.

MILLER: The simple part is seal the border, deport all the illegals.

MATTINGLY: But their plans are actually far from modest.

MILLER: It's a series of interlocking domestic and foreign policies to accomplish this goal.

MATTINGLY: One Democratic lawmaker told CNN, the widely held view of Miller among critics is that he's, quote, "The most dangerous person in Trump's inner circle. Why? Because he has an encyclopedic knowledge of how things actually work," the lawmaker said.

Now, unlike the early stages of Trump's first term, Miller is far from alone. A constellation of well-funded outside groups have formed with the aim of turning Trump's desires into tangible policy. One of those groups is housed in the conservative Heritage Foundation. And while it's not officially tied to the campaign, and at times has gotten crosswise with Trump's political advisers, their detailed policy playbook sets a marker for the goals of Trump's allies.

Project 2025, as it's called, echoes many of Trump's key talking points. It details logistics for detaining and deporting millions of suspected illegal immigrants.

TRUMP: We'll carry out the largest domestic deportation operation in American history.

MATTINGLY: The border wall, of course, features as a centerpiece.

TRUMP: We will seal it up and we will expand the wall.

MATTINGLY: As do other policies familiar from Trump's first term.

TRUMP: I will immediately reinstate and expand the wildly successful Trump travel ban.

MATTINGLY: To curb the legal immigration into the country, Project 2025 proposes limiting visa admissions, carrying out workplace raids, minimizing refugee admissions, and raising the bar for asylum seekers fleeing unsafe conditions.

[16:45:10]

It's an agenda as ambitious as it is unapologetically radical.

MILLER: It will be an all of nation, all of government, state, local, and federal effort.

MATTINGLY: One that includes the U.S. Military. MILLER: You deputize the National Guard to carry out immigration

enforcement, and then you also deploy the military to the southern border.

MATTINGLY: Campaign rhetoric, especially from Trump, is often dismissed as little more than words. This time, on this issue, advisers emphasize, it is different.

MILLER: If you're going to be successful as a conservative you have to learn to be loathed by the right people.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DEAN: Phil Mattingly, thanks so much for that reporting.

Ahead, how the Democratic senator set to go on trial for corruption this week plans to fight those charges and try to keep his seat.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:50:42]

DEAN: This weekend, Prince Harry and Meghan are in Nigeria as part of their tour of the Invictus Games, games founded by Prince Harry. the Duke and Duchess of Sussex met with local dignitaries, wounded soldiers, and charity groups while there.

CNN Lagos producer Stephanie Busari has the latest.

STEPHANIE BUSARI, CNN LAGOS PRODUCER: Jessica, it's the third day of Prince Harry and Meghan's visit to Nigeria. And they've really been given the red carpet treatment out here. They visit moved on Sunday to Lagos, the economic capital, where Meghan received Mother's Day wishes. They visited a school to see the work of Giants of Africa, a charity founded to by NBA star Masai Ujiri, and that helps under- privileged children.

Meghan and Harry also announced a partnership between the Archewell Foundation and Giants of Africa to empower young people through sports particularly basketball. They also mingled with wheelchair basketball players and the event ended with Prince Harry scoring a shot, cheered on by the excited kids.

This visit to Niger has been special for Meghan in particular, because she's been on a journey of discovery to learn more about her Nigerian heritage. She has previously shared that she found out she's 43 percent Nigerian after a gene test. And she described Nigeria as, quote, "her home and her country," and shared at a women's leadership event how meaningful it was to learn about her roots especially as an African-American.

During their Lagos visit, Harry and Meghan also met with the Lagos governor and held a private fundraiser to raise money with state-of- the-art Invictus Center -- Jessica.

DEAN: Stephanie Busari, thanks so much for that report. The corruption trial of Democratic Senator Bob Menendez of New Jersey

is set to start tomorrow. Prosecutor saying Menendez and his wife Nadine used his position as chairman of the powerful Senate Foreign Relations Committee to help associates in New Jersey, as well as the governments of Egypt and Qatar. In return prosecutors say they received items like what you're seeing here, hundreds of thousands of dollars, a Mercedes Benz and gold bars. The couple has pleaded not guilty and are being tried separately.

Our Manu Raju caught Senator Menendez in the halls of Congress ahead of the trial.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANU RAJU, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Senator, your trial starts next week. If you're convicted, will you resign?

SEN. BOB MENENDEZ (D-NJ): Really?

RAJU: If you're convicted, will you resign?

MENENDEZ: Really?

RAJU: Any thoughts about the trial as we head into next week?

MENENDEZ: I'm looking forward in proving my innocence. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Menendez has already stood trial in another corruption case that was back in 2017. It ended in a mistrial with the jury deadlocked. Now, like then, Menendez has refused to step down, even as some fellow Democrats have pushed him to.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): Did anyone wish Menendez good luck for next week, for that sleaze ball?

RAJU: What if he is acquitted and runs for reelection?

FETTERMAN: I guess we'll see. But what's clearly happened he got lucky the last trial. He won't be around much longer. I thought that would be my bet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Jury selection is set to begin tomorrow. That trial is expected to last several weeks.

On tonight's episode of the CNN Original Series, "HOW IT REALLY HAPPENED," we look at the shocking shooting death of Reeva Steenkamp at the hands of Olympic superstar and convicted murderer Oscar Pistorius. What really happened on Valentine's Day 2013? Was it a terrible accident or murder.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The main investigating officer testified that the neighbors had heard terrible screams before the gunshots.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I woke up from a woman's terrible screams. It was bloodcurdling screams. It leads you cold.

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The state believed that that meant that Oscar Pistorius would have known that Reeva Steenkamp was there possibly hiding in that bathroom cubicle, and that there was some type of heated argument going on just before the shooting occurred.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They said that Oscar had picked up his gun. He had walked about seven meters to a bathroom where his girlfriend was locked inside and he had shot four bullets through there as she was hit three times.

[18:55:02]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oscar denied the charges that this was murder of any kind.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The defense provided an extremely thorough affidavit from Mr. Pistorius, explaining his version of what happened that night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Be sure to watch the CNN Original Series, "HOW IT REALLY HAPPENED: OSCAR PISTORIUS, THE BLADE RUNNER," airing tonight at 9:00 Eastern and Pacific, right here on CNN.

Still to come, former president Donald Trump is due back in a New York courtroom tomorrow for what could be the final week of the prosecution's case in that trial with Trump's once loyal lieutenant turned enemy Michael Cohen scheduled to take the stand.

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