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CNN International: Trump Convicted on all 24 Felony Counts in Hush Money Case; Sentencing Date Set for July 11, Appeals Expected; Swing State Voters React to Historic Trump Felony Verdict. Aired 4- 4:30a ET

Aired May 31, 2024 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT, 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This was a rigged, disgraceful trial of a very innocent man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only voice that matters is the voice of the jury and the jury has spoken.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is one step in the process. As soon as we can appeal, we will.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're targeting this man because he's about to be president again.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think everybody needs to abide by the law and if they're not going to then they should be pay the consequences.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Live from London, this is CNN NEWSROOM with Max Foster.

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, a warm welcome to our viewers joining us from around the world. I'm Max Foster. It is Friday, May the 31st, 9 a.m. here in London, 4 a.m. in New York, where Donald Trump's attorneys are vowing to appeal the historic conviction of the former and possibly future U.S. president.

After about 12 hours of deliberations over two days, a New York jury found Trump guilty on all 34 counts of falsifying business records. To conceal a hush money payment to a former adult film star in an effort to influence the 2016 election. Trump now has the distinction of being the first former U.S. president to become a convicted felon.

Sentencing is scheduled for July the 11th and for now, Trump will remain out of prison without bond. He is expected to hold a news conference outside Trump Tower later today. After leaving the courthouse, Trump recycled some familiar complaints and blasted the entire legal process.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT, 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have a country that's in big trouble, but this was a rigged decision right from day one with a conflicted judge who should have never been allowed to try this case, never. And we will fight for our constitution. This is long from over.

Thank you very much.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Let's go now to our friend, criminal defense attorney and former New York prosecutor Bernarda Villalona. Thank you so much for joining us. So first of all, your reaction to the verdict. It was a clean sweep.

BERNARDA VILLALONA, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Absolutely, it's a monumental moment. And I was outside of the courthouse when they said that a verdict was going to come in and all -- everything just went frantic. It went frantic. But when that verdict finally came in, it definitely shook the nation in the sense that I was standing there. And I just believe that first time in history, a former president is being held accountable and being found guilty for criminal acts.

But what it went to show you is that with our criminal justice system, no one is above the law.

FOSTER: He can appeal. What grounds can he appeal on? Because this idea of a liberal city, a liberal court isn't enough, is it? It has to be something specific.

VILLALONA: Exactly. So in terms of Donald Trump and his team appealing, first off, he has to be sentenced. So he can't file for an appeal until after his sentencing, until he's sentenced from Judge Merchan.

So the several grounds that Donald Trump will probably likely seek to appeal on is number one, the testimony of Stormy Daniel being allowed in, and also the extent of her testimony being allowed in, as well as the jury instructions and how the jury was instructing of having to deal with the underlying crime.

But you have to think, Max, for every objection that his attorneys made at trial, they were preserving the record, preserving the right to be able to appeal after a conviction. So for every objection that was not sustained, those are grounds that the defense team is going to seek to appeal on. But I think it's going to be highly unlikely that he will succeed on an appeal.

FOSTER: And let's talk about the sentence then. As I understand it, a prison sentence is pretty unlikely. It's more likely to be a fine. I'm just wondering how severe you think that fine could be, considering his wealth, as we understand it to be. But also the judge's response to the way that Trump has tried to undermine the system, because that will be seen as an offence in itself, wouldn't it?

VILLALONA: So in terms of the sentencing on July 11th, you have to think that Judge Merchan is going to take into account several different factors. Of course, the crime itself, the severity of the crime, he's going to take into account mitigating factors, aggravating factors. Aggravating factors in the sense of the severity of this crime, the underlying crime, that the falsification of the business records was to conceal the crime of having to deal with an election of a campaign, but also take into account Donald Trump's criminal background, but also take into account everything that he has said.

Everything that he has said during the comportment of this trial, of the judge, of witnesses, of what he said in the media, and of his actions itself.

[04:05:00]

Remember, he has also violated the gag order and how contemptuous he was to the court. So the judge will also take that into account. It's not necessarily a given that Judge Merchan wouldn't sentence him to jail because people have been sentenced to jail for falsifying business records. So it's not out of the norm if the judge were to sentence him to jail.

The minimum, it can be probation. It can be a conditional discharge. It can be house arrest. It can be community service, but it can also be a fine. And of course, the maximum will be four years incarceration on these counts. We'll just have to wait and see what happens on July 11th.

Both parties are going to argue to the judge and submit pre-sentence investigation reports and letters to the judge as to what they believe the sentence should be. But the judge is going to take also that guidance for what Alvin Bragg is going to request as a sentence for Donald Trump.

But Judge Merchan wouldn't be scared to actually sentence Donald Trump to jail because he told him he was sentenced to jail when he was violating the gag orders if you need be.

FOSTER: There'll be a press conference, as you understand it, later on today. If you were advising Donald Trump, what would you advise him not to say?

VILLALONA: Well, don't poke the bear. Don't poke the bear in the sense of poking the bear of Judge Merchan, because now you have to think that Judge Merchan has this big decision to make as to what the sentence is. And while he says, Donald Trump, that he's going to appeal, he has to still be sentenced.

And it's possible that when he does appeal, that the court of appeals is not going to stay the sentence, meaning that the sentence won't take place until after all appeals have been exhausted. So don't do that.

FOSTER: And in terms of between now and the sentencing, what restrictions are there on what he can do and say?

VILLALONA: Well, the restrictions that he had during the trial still exist in the sense that I don't believe that Judge Merchan touched anything having to deal with the gag order itself. I don't think he withdrew the gag order. But in terms of his liberty, he is still free, of course, to travel around the country, still free to attend his campaigns. He's still free to talk in the media.

But what he should be mindful of, again, is to make sure that he is not talking negatively about the judge or about still the witnesses in this case, because that can still be used against them at the time of sentencing.

FOSTER: OK, Bernarda Villalona, thank you.

Reaction from the White House has been pretty low-key. President Biden called attention to the November election with a social media post writing, the only way to keep Donald Trump out of the Oval Office is at the ballot box.

CNN's Kayla Tausche has more.

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KAYLA TAUSCHE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: As the news of the historic conviction of Donald Trump came down, Biden administration employees in the West Wing were said to be transfixed and stunned by the news, which they watched relayed on TVs mounted in the hallways of the West Wing that are constantly tuned to four concurrent cable channel. One senior administration official asked by CNN how to respond to the Trump verdict, said simply, it matters.

President Biden is traveling in Delaware and aides traveling with him declined to share additional details with CNN and the traveling pool about how President Biden learned of the historic decision, who relayed the news to him and where he was when he received it.

And there are no public events on President Biden's calendar for the following day in which he would be expected to be addressing this directly. The reporters are expected to be able to shout questions on a few separate occasions.

As for the Biden-Harris reelection campaign, they have seized the mantle on the messaging immediately following the verdict, blasting text messages, emails, tweets, asking for grassroots donations and saying convicted felon or not, Trump will be the Republican nominee for president. In one message, even suggesting that Trump could see record fundraising as a result of the conviction.

Kayla Tausche, CNN, the White House.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: The response from the Republican Party's top brass shows the hold Donald Trump still has on the GOP. Many are lining up to show their support with varying degrees of outrage and indignation.

Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell issued a statement saying, in part: These charges never should have been brought in the first place. I expect the conviction to be overturned on appeal.

Our Lauren Fox has more on how both sides of the aisle are responding.

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LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We saw a swift reaction coming from Capitol Hill, especially Republicans.

With Speaker Mike Johnson saying that this was a shameful day in American history. The Democrats cheered as they convicted the leader of the opposing party on ridiculous charges predicated on the testimony of a disbarred convicted felon.

[04:10:00]

We also heard from other members of the Republican leadership team in the House, including Tom Emmer, who wrote, quote: Democrats just pulled off the biggest sham in U.S. history. The American people won't forget the corrupt two-tiered system of justice and will issue the real verdict at the ballot box in November.

Now, over in the United States Senate, we did hear from John Cornyn. He is running to replace Mitch McConnell as Republican leader after the November election. He wrote on Twitter, quote: This verdict is a disgrace and this trial should have never happened. Now, more than ever, we need to rally around real Donald Trump, take back the White House and Senate and get this country back on track.

Now, you're seeing there a lot of similar themes, as Republicans are trying to paint this verdict as one that is political. Meanwhile, Democrats have a different approach.

You heard from Senator Whitehouse, who said on Twitter, boom, in reaction to Donald Trump's conviction. You also had Senator Chris Murphy tweeting, quote: Newsflash, it matters that the Republican nominee for president is a convicted criminal. The rule of law still matters.

So like so many issues that have come up when we are talking about Donald Trump, the former president of the United States, Republicans and Democrats deeply divided on Capitol Hill.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Democratic Congressman Adam Schiff led the first impeachment trial of Donald Trump in the U.S. Senate. Here's what he had to say about Thursday's conviction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): Well, this is someone who has escaped justice time after time after time. Someone who, because of the high threshold in the Senate requiring two thirds vote to convict, wasn't convicted in either impeachment case. Someone who was able to delay and continues to delay all of his other trials. The trial in the January 6th case delayed by the Supreme Court. The trial in the Mar-a-Lago documents case delayed by one of the Trump appointed judges. He has really played rope-a-dope in the courts and gotten away with it until today. And I do think justice has finally caught up with Donald Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Well, away from Capitol Hill, reactions are pouring in over Thursday's historic verdict, including those from voters in key battleground states. We'll have details on that.

Plus, Donald Trump is now a convicted felon, a first for a former U.S. president. How the verdict could affect his fortunes in the ongoing presidential race.

And there may be a verdict in his hush money trial, but Donald Trump is still facing very serious charges in three other criminal cases. A look at where those cases stand later this hour.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We have a Soros-backed DA and the whole thing. We didn't do a thing wrong and we'll keep fighting. We'll fight till the end and we'll win because our country's gone to hell. We don't have the same country anymore. We have a divided mess.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[04:15:03]

FOSTER: Donald Trump there vowing to fight and appeal after a New York jury found him guilty on all 34 counts in his hush money trial.

He waved to people outside Trump Tower in Manhattan on Thursday shortly after he became the first former president in U.S. history to be convicted of a felony. The jury found him guilty on all counts of falsifying business records in a hush money scheme to silence an adult film star over an alleged affair.

All part of what prosecutors say was an illegal conspiracy to undermine the integrity of the 2016 presidential election. He's also now the first major party presidential candidate to be convicted of a crime in the midst of a campaign for the White House. The judge set his sentencing date for July the 11th.

Now, earlier, Trump's defense attorney, Todd Blanche, discussed the case with CNN's Kaitlan Collins and explained why he thinks the publicity around the trial impacted the jury's decision.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TODD BLANCHE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR DONALD TRUMP: But at the end of the day, I do think it comes to something that we talk about a lot of times in our profession, where there's a bias that you have that you can't get past. I mean, you say that this is where he built his business. That's true.

Every single person on that jury knew Donald Trump, either as president, as candidate, from The Apprentice. And so I don't accept that this was a fair place to try.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Is that what you're going to -- what's your main argument going to be in your appeal?

BLANCHE: Look, I think we have -- I think there were a lot. That is certainly an argument. I think the timing of this trial was really unfair to President Trump.

There was so much publicity around the witnesses and around leading up to the trial that it just -- our system of justice isn't supposed to be a system where every person that walks in the courtroom knows about the case. I mean, and it sounds like --

COLLINS: But it's one of those cases where you can't avoid it. I mean, no matter what jurisdiction he's tried in, everyone knows it's Donald Trump.

BLANCHE: The law doesn't say, but if you can't avoid it, tough luck, right? That's not what the law says. The law says that a person is entitled to a fair trial in front of a jury of their peers.

And we just think that because of everything around the lead up to this trial, it made it very difficult for the jury to evaluate the evidence, kind of independent of what they knew coming in. And we knew that. And that's not something that we haven't -- we've been screaming that from the rooftops.

COLLINS: Let's talk about -- you said a few of your arguments on the appeal. When do you plan to file your appeal?

BLANCHE: Well, there's a lot of -- Look, this is one step in the process, right? So we have motions due in a couple of weeks in front of Judge Merchan, which we're going to vigorously fight and restate a lot of what I'm saying to you tonight and other things that happened during the trial that we think just made the trial unfair, including the testimony of Ms. Daniels. If that is not successful, then as soon as we can appeal, we will. And the process in New York is there's a sentencing and then we appeal from there.

COLLINS: District Attorney Bragg tonight did not directly say whether or not they are going to seek jail time for Donald Trump. Do you expect that he will?

BLANCHE: I have no idea. Look, there's a system in place where you rely on precedent and somebody like President Trump should never, never face a jail sentence based on this conduct. And it would just kind of confirm what we've been saying all along.

And a lot of people say that we're wrong and that we're missing key pieces. But if other 77-year-old first-time offenders would never be sent to prison for this conduct.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Well, as the verdict was read, both pro- and anti-Trump rallies popped up outside the courthouse. CNN's Shimon Prokupecz was there to hear what both sides had to say.

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SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Trump supporters and those against the former president were gathering in this park here just opposite the court as the verdict was coming down.

And obviously those who are against the former president were cheering as they were learning the verdict. And those who are supporters of the former president were all gathered here in this area. And at one point, sort of shocked and stunned at the verdict. But they say they were not surprised because he has been targeted, targeted by this district attorney, targeted by law enforcement, targeted by the court system. And so it was hard for them to accept the verdict.

Take a listen to what both sides had to say when the verdict came down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're targeting this man because he's about to be president again. There's no crime from what I can see. And I think it's going to make him more popular with the American people because they're seeing how he's been targeted.

[04:20:00]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm glad that the former president is being held accountable because it's the most important thing in a democracy is that no one is above the law, especially an ex-president.

The record is so important that he was convicted. And I'm very proud of my fellow New Yorkers for being brave enough to do the right thing.

PROKUPECZ: Both sides saying that they will be back out here for the sentencing in July. Back to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Supporters of the presidential candidate also rallied far from the courthouse. This was the scene near Trump's Florida home, Mar-a- Lago, following the conviction. All of this as the former president looks to leverage his latest setback into a campaign win.

No sooner had the verdict come down than the campaign launched a fundraising appeal. But the site may have been a victim of its own success, with a portal appearing to be offline for a while. His campaign attributed the issue to a source -- or a surge rather, of donations, claiming the website went down because so many people were moved to donate.

Well, Trump supporters appear intent on sticking with their presidential candidate, despite his conviction. A Marist poll released this week shows 67 percent of registered voters say it won't make a difference if Trump is found guilty. 17 percent of respondents will be less likely to vote for Trump if he were convicted. And 15 percent say they would actually be more likely to vote for the former president with this conviction.

But in an election this close, even a small shift in the right place could make a huge difference. Places like the battleground state of Pennsylvania.

Our Danny Freeman is in Bucks County, getting voter reaction in what could be a decisive district in President Joe Biden's home state.

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DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, as soon as we heard the news of this conviction coming down, we headed to Bucks County in Pennsylvania. It's one of the all-important suburbs of Philadelphia, the collar counties as they call it. And basically, if President Biden wants to win Pennsylvania, he needs to run up the numbers in a county like this in Bucks County.

We spoke to a number of voters, most of the folks that wanted to speak with us on camera. They were glad that former President Trump was convicted, but each of them had different perspectives on this moment in history. Take a listen to what they had to say.

JEFF GREB, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I feel like he's kind of like Teflon. There's been a lot of things attached to him that haven't really stuck, but this is one where they went through the process. You know, we have to trust the courts.

CHRISTINA JAROSZ, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I think everybody needs to abide by the law, and if they're not going to, then they should be -- pay the consequences.

CLAIRE GREEN, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I really hope that people spend time not saying whoopie or gotcha or great or entertainment, but feeling deeply saddened that they knowingly participated in a process in which we elected somebody like this.

FREEMAN: Now, I should say, we also spoke to folks who were much more supportive and sympathetic to former President Trump. I spoke to one woman who said, listen, I'm not necessarily the biggest fan of President Trump, but 34 counts seemed excessive.

So there are a lot of opinions, certainly after this decision came down from the jury, but that's a little taste of what voters in this all-important swing state and this all-important county really had to say about this outcome.

From Bucks County, Pennsylvania, Danny Freeman, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Trump's wife, Melania, and their son, Barron, were noticeably absent from the courtroom on Thursday, even though both were in New York at the time. In fact, the former first lady wasn't seen at court during the entire course of her husband's seven-week hush money trial. Sources familiar with the couple tell CNN, it's not surprising that Mrs. Trump hasn't been present in court. The former first lady also opted out of a fundraising dinner with her husband in New York City following Thursday's verdict.

Now, Trump's advisors aren't concerned the verdict will hurt him in the November election. Still ahead, more on the political impact of his felony conviction.

Plus, we'll ask a legal analyst about the mitigating factors that could help Trump ahead of sentencing.

[04:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FOSTER: Updating you on our breaking news, Donald Trump is expected to speak again about his historic conviction in the coming hours. He was found guilty on all 34 charges in his hush money trial in New York on -- well, yesterday, on Thursday, and he became the first former U.S. president with the label of a convicted felon. But in his first reaction after the trial, he said he did nothing wrong.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: This was a rigged, disgraceful trial. That the real verdict is going to be November 5th by the people. And they know what happened here, and everybody knows what happened here.

You have a Soros-backed DA, and the whole thing, we didn't do a thing wrong. I'm a very innocent man, and it's OK. I'm fighting for our country. I'm fighting for our constitution, and we'll keep fighting. We'll fight till the end and we'll win because our country's gone to hell. We don't have the same country anymore. We have a divided mess.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Trump's sentencing is set for July the 11th, just days before the Republican National Convention. That's where he's expected to take up the mantle of the party's presidential nominee. President -- Kristen Holmes has more on the political implications for Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Shortly after leaving the courthouse, after being convicted and found guilty on all 34 charges, Donald Trump announced from Trump Tower that he would be giving a press conference on Friday morning, reacting to the verdict in his criminal hush money trial.

Now, I have been told by senior advisors that Donald Trump is going to continue to use the same messaging that he has used since before the trial began, calling this a rigged election, saying that this was political persecution. Now, because of this messaging, they believe, this being his senior

campaign advisors, that this is not going to harm him in November, that instead it will energize Republicans, energize his base.

But it should be made clear that this is really uncharted territory, despite the fact that they compare this to his other legal issues, including multiple indictments, which actually helped give him a boost in both the polls and in fundraising numbers. This is an actual conviction. And recent polling showed that of people who said that they were already going to vote for Donald Trump, 7 percent said they were less likely to vote for him if he was convicted.

Now, while this is not a huge number, everything is going to count in the upcoming election. Both Biden's team and Trump's team believe that this is going to be a very narrow margin. And 7 percent is especially significant if you were talking about Donald Trump's base, because his campaign believes that Donald Trump's base always shows up to vote.

So whether or not this actually impacts what people do when they get to the ballot box remains to be seen. But we should hear, we should expect to continue to hear that messaging over and over again, trying to link this case to President Joe Biden and calling this political persecution.

Kristen Holmes, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: More analysis. We are joined by Thomas Gift, director of the Center on U.S. Politics at University College London.