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New Evidence Expected in Trump January 6 Case; Sheriff Accused of Killing Judge Makes Court Appearance; Interview With Fmr. Gov. Pat McCrory (R-NC); Ukrainian President Delivers Address to United Nations. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired September 25, 2024 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:00]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: You're a parent. I'm a parent.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Yes.

ACOSTA: I mean, this issue of brain injuries in sports, in football, it's a frightening issue.

BROWN: It is a frightening issue.

ACOSTA: Yes.

BROWN: I was just talking to my husband about it, as we have little kids now, but you think about when they get in middle school, high school, if they want to play football, and there's so much we still have to learn that this series is shining a spotlight on about CTE, the degenerative brain disease, and what that can do to the brain, the repeated hits to the brain.

So I think this is actually really important, an important series to watch, and also just, as he pointed out, all the layers as it pertained to Aaron Hernandez, not just CTE, but all the other issues, the abuse. And I think there's a lot to learn from this, so I'm looking forward to seeing it.

ACOSTA: Absolutely, no question about it, and important for parents to watch.

BROWN: Yes, for sure.

ACOSTA: And I know you have little ones, and you just want to do everything you can to protect those little ones as much as possible.

BROWN: You absolutely do, for sure.

ACOSTA: Yes.

BROWN: I have to -- I don't think I'm going to be letting them play football in middle school.

ACOSTA: Yes. BROWN: I will put that at least. High school, I don't know either. We

will see what happens.

ACOSTA: Exactly.

BROWN: All right, Jim Acosta, thanks so much.

ACOSTA: Good to see you.

BROWN: I will take it from here.

Good morning, everyone. You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Pamela Brown in New York.

And we have a new news this morning, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy delivering an impassioned plea at the United Nations General Assembly just moments ago here on CNN. We heard him rally global support for Ukraine more than 2.5 years after Russia invaded his country and launched a war.

Zelenskyy brought a chilling warning, that Russia is planning attacks on nuclear power plants in Ukraine. Here's a bit of his message to world leaders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: Recently, I received yet another alarming report from our intelligence. Now Putin does seem to be planning attacks on our nuclear power plants and the infrastructure, aiming to disconnect the plants from the power grid.

With the help of satellites, by the way, ladies and gentlemen, by the way, satellites of other countries, Russia is getting images and detailed information about the infrastructure of our nuclear power plants. But what does this really threaten?

Any missile or drone strike, any critical incident in the energy system could lead to a nuclear disaster. A day like that must never come.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: CNN's Alex Marquardt joins us now.

Alex, what is the reaction to Zelenskyy's warning of a possible nuclear crisis?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Pamela, clearly, it's designed to get the world's attention. I mean, there are a few words like nuclear disaster that do just that.

I thought it was actually quite interesting that he's trying to bring the world in part by saying it is through Western satellite image companies that Russia essentially knows how to target these nuclear power plants. Of course, we are extremely reliant on these satellite image companies to understand what is going on in this conflict. But Zelenskyy kicked off his speech by saying one of the most alarming

alerts that he had gotten was in March, so just a few days -- March of 2022, so just a few days after the war began, that Russia was targeting the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant. That is the biggest nuclear power plant in Europe.

And it is now under the control of the Russian forces. So he has been sounding the nuclear alarm for quite some time, but now he is really ratcheting that up. And now that we are 2.5 years into this war, Zelenskyy is trying to make sure that the world continues to stand with him, that he continues to get the support that he needs to fight against Russia.

And the way that he's doing that here in New York, and I imagine he will do it again tomorrow when he meets with the president in Washington, D.C., is warning of this winter coming and one in which Russia will weaponize winter by targeting not just all of their -- Ukraine's energy infrastructure, but targeting the nuclear energy infrastructure.

He said that some 80 percent of Ukrainian energy had been taken offline. All of the thermal power plants had been taken offline. And now he's saying, very worryingly, that they will be going -- that Russia will be going after the nuclear facilities in Ukraine this winter -- Pamela.

BROWN: All right, Alex, thanks so much.

And President Zelenskyy was not only addressing world leaders in New York, but also his war-weary nation back home. So let's get the view from there.

Let's bring in CNN's Fred Pleitgen in the capital of Kyiv.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Pamela.

Well, it certainly was a key speech by Ukraine's president there in front of the U.N. General Assembly. Volodymyr Zelenskyy, one of his main points was essentially that the war in Ukraine, Russia's full-on invasion of Ukraine, is a threat not just to Ukraine, but to the entire world.

One of the things, for instance, that he did is he accused the Russians of planning to attack Ukrainian nuclear facilities, which he says would be devastating to the country's energy infrastructure, but, of course, would also be a big threat to countries not just in Europe, but possibly also countries around the world.

[11:05:00]

One of the things that he did after that is, he prodded what he's been doing for quite a long time, and that is what he calls his plan for a just peace. Now, all of that revolves around Ukraine's territorial integrity, about getting Russian forces out of Ukraine, and coming to some sort of peace agreement that sticks, not one that's a temporary cease-fire, but one that will hold for a very long time.

Obviously, that's something that he's been trying to put in place, and for which, of course, he also needs the support of his Western allies, first and foremost, the United States. And we have to keep in mind that the speech that Volodymyr Zelenskyy gave today comes in this very key week for Ukraine and for the Ukrainian president.

He's, of course, set to meet with President Biden tomorrow to try and then sell President Biden what he calls his plan for victory, which has several points that are extremely important to the Ukrainians. One of them, of course, is their incursion into Russian territory.

But the Ukrainians will also most probably be asking for substantially more weapons from the United States and one of the things that's also key, to be allowed to use those weapons to hit deep inside Russian territory. One of the things that we have heard again and again from Ukrainians here on the ground is they believe that is key if they are to remain in the fight and try and also push the Russians back, Pamela.

BROWN: All right, Fred Pleitgen, thank you so much.

And now let's go to CNN military analyst and retired Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton.

So, Colonel, first of all, what is your take on Zelenskyy's warning that Russia is planning attacks on nuclear plants? How serious is this?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, it's extremely serious, Pamela. And it's one of the things that you have to look at.

The Russians have clearly targeted the energy infrastructure. And as President Zelenskyy mentioned, and Fred mentioned in his reporting, they have basically taken out all of the thermal plants. And, in Ukraine, as in a lot of former Soviet states, they have thermal power as being one of the key energy sources.

And it protects them especially in wintertime, providing heat to a large portion of the population. So you have 80 percent of the energy grid that is already decimated. And if the nuclear -- remainder of the nuclear power plants, there should be three remaining in Ukraine right now, if they are targeted, that would basically almost shut down the entire Ukrainian energy grid completely.

And that, of course, would be a disaster not only for the Ukrainians, but it would have potential problems that would spill over into other parts of Eastern Europe.

BROWN: Yes, and just to take a step back here, Cedric, you have the ongoing war with Ukraine, and then you have this widening conflict in the Middle East, Israel out today saying it has struck 280 targets in Lebanon as it intercepted a ballistic missile in Tel Aviv.

How much is this conflict ramping up in this moment we're in? LEIGHTON: Well, I think it's ramping up quite a bit, Pamela.

And when you look at the use of a ballistic missile on the part of Hezbollah, it was a signal that they could go into an area as far south as Tel Aviv, target ostensibly the Mossad, the Israeli intelligence service. That missile was shot down, but if they use more of them, if they try to overwhelm the Israeli missile defense systems, that could provide for a significant problem for the Israelis.

And it could also mean a widening of the conflict. The Israelis have also moved their forces into the northern part of the country, poised potentially to enter Lebanon, which would mean entering territory that's controlled by Hezbollah.

So this war is kind of -- in the Middle East is kind of at one of those points where it could go either way. Either there's a de- escalation or there's an escalation. And right now, we're at that fork in the road, and that is something that could have an impact not only on what happens in the Middle East, but potentially also what happens in Ukraine, because all of these events are ultimately tied together.

BROWN: Just very quickly to follow up, do you see this as a war between Israel and Hezbollah right now?Because both sides have tried to avoid calling it that.

LEIGHTON: Yes, it's basically kind of a low simmer, but it has the potential to become a war. I wouldn't call it a war yet, but it is definitely there. Certainly, if you're on the ground, it looks like a war, it feels like a war, it smells like a war, and that's what people on the ground will see.

But from a states perspective, a geostrategic perspective, we're probably not quite there yet.

BROWN: All right, Colonel Cedric Leighton, thanks so much.

And coming up: Mark Robinson's campaign is collapsing after CNN's report on his past incendiary comments, but, today, he is in charge of North Carolina. We're going to explain up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:14:18]

BROWN: Well, the Republican candidate at the center of a nationwide scandal is in charge of North Carolina today.

Right now, Lieutenant Governor Mark Robinson is acting governor, while Roy Cooper is out of the state. Last week, CNN uncovered dozens of disturbing comments that Robinson made on a pornography site a decade ago. And a new report by CNN's KFILE shows Republicans and conservative groups are trying to distance themselves now by either canceling events with Robinson or deleting anything online that shows an association with him.

Donald Trump endorsed Robinson, but he hasn't addressed the scandal. The former president will be campaigning in the state today.

And joining us now is former North Carolina Republican Governor Pat McCrory.

[11:15:03]

And we should note you have been saying for a long time that Robinson should not be running for governor, He shouldn't be getting this. You must be feeling a little bit like I told you so in this moment.

But I do wonder, we still haven't heard Donald Trump or his running mate, J.D. Vance, condemn Robinson's comments and retract the endorsement they gave him. Is it a mistake to say silent?

FMR. GOV. PAT MCCRORY (R-NC): Well, the fact of the matter is, for the past, almost a month-and-a-half, the Donald Trump campaign has been avoiding him and not letting him on the stage, until about two weeks ago, when Robinson kind of bullied his way up to the stage when sheriffs were invited.

So he was kind of forced to shake his hand. So I got a feeling about a month ago the Trump campaign was finding out that there could be some dirty laundry on Robinson. But the fact of the matter is, for over two years, most of us knew this was a ticking time bomb.

In fact, Michael Whatley, who's now chairman of the national Republican Party, was chairman of the North Carolina Republican Party, and he probably should have given the president fair warning that this guy could be a future dangerous advocate for President Trump during his campaign.

BROWN: Yes, because what you just said raises the question, why would Trump then endorse him if, as you said, he knew a while back he was a -- quote -- "ticking time bomb."

And just to follow up on my initial question, do you think now that Trump should come out and condemn him or retract his endorsement?

MCCRORY: Well, everyone's running from him. And I think it's a matter of time before even more information comes out.

That's what the rumor mill is still saying here. And I think it's just a matter of time before everyone scatters. In fact, his campaign staff has basically already resigned. The RGA, the Republican Governors Association, is not going to be spending any more money on this guy. He's dead in the water here in North Carolina.

And it's a sad commentary. But he -- you got to understand, he was so popular with the base. I saw him speak. He was the most effective, dynamic, dangerous speaker I have ever seen in my political career. And he was very popular. He was so effective that he did commercials for U.S. Senate candidates, negative ad against me for Senator Ted Budd.

But now even Senator Budd, to his credit and Thom Tillis, are saying you better prove that -- your innocence if you continue to plan to be in this race.

BROWN: Yes, they're saying show me the evidence that this is wrong. And you have to wonder how all of this will impact Donald Trump. I mean, he's in North Carolina for a second time in just a few days, right?

I mean, that's no coincidence, given everything going on there on the ground and how tight this election could be, especially as it pertains to North Carolina, which is always close. How worried should his campaign be that the Robinson scandal will hurt him in this election?

MCCRORY: Well, I know firsthand that, when elections are close to North Carolina, every vote counts. I lost my reelection for governor by 10,000 votes out of 4.6 million.

And this could make a difference. It only takes a few people going, I might not vote at all because of Robinson or I might change all the way and just vote Democrat. So there's a worry.

So Trump and J.D. Vance and the vice president are out here every day and have been. North Carolina really has always been in play. In fact, I just had someone knock on my door for the Trump campaign and hand me a flier saying, vote early, which is a big change in the Trump campaign strategy.

So their forces are on the ground and so are the Harris forces. So North Carolina could be the state that decides the presidential election.

BROWN: But how likely would it be, though, that the Robinson scandal could directly cost Trump the state of North Carolina, in your view?

MCCRORY: It could happen.

But North Carolina has a tradition of ticket-splitting between the president races and statewide races. And I wouldn't be surprised if that ticket-splitting continues. But, again, if it just impacts 5,000 or 10,000 votes, that could make a difference in all the electoral votes for either Harris or for former President Trump.

BROWN: All right, former North Carolina Governor Pat McCrory, thank you so much.

MCCRORY: Thank you very much.

BROWN: And still to come: the sheriff accused of shooting and killing a Kentucky judge in his chambers making his first court appearance. What we're learning about a possible motive -- up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:24:20]

BROWN: Well, just moments ago, the Kentucky sheriff accused of shooting and killing a judge last week in his chambers made his first court appearance. That arraignment hearing took place more than 100 miles from where that shooting happened because the courthouse where it should have been heard is still an active crime scene.

CNN's Ryan Young joins us now.

What's the latest, Ryan?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we just finished watching this go down here.

It's a lot of conversation about how this is going to move forward. We were also surprised that Stines, the former sheriff, decided to plead not guilty in this case, we know that shooting happening in the judge's chambers, Kevin Mullins' chambers just last week. There was some sort of argument inside the chambers. Shots were fired and the sheriff turned himself in a short time after that shooting.

[11:25:00]

As you can see in this video, as he's talking to the judge, there's a lot of conversation about, could he afford legal representation? Because, obviously, this is a capital murder case. He was saying he couldn't. He makes about $115,000 a year. His house is worth $45,000, but, obviously, this sheriff is going to lose his job now that he's accused of murder.

So what we learned is October 1 will be the first time we will have that preliminary hearing. We did not learn anything about motive today or any of the reasons why this is -- why this started. There have been so many rumors about why the shooting took place, but, so far, Pam, we did not get any of the details today in terms of this investigation.

BROWN: Yes, and still a mystery as to a possible motive, right?

YOUNG: Oh, absolutely. When you think about the two top law enforcement officials, for such a small community, and this community went on lockdown. People were shocked by this. There's such an interconnection between all the people who were involved.

In fact, the sheriff used to be the bailiff for the judge.

BROWN: Wow.

YOUNG: So, when you put all this together, how personal was this shooting? What happened behind the scenes? Looks like we will have to wait until October 1 before learning more of those details as the state comes in and gets involved in this investigation.

BROWN: All right, Ryan, thanks so much.

YOUNG: Absolutely.

BROWN: Well, hundreds of pages of new evidence against Donald Trump are expected to be filed this week, as special counsel Jack Smith pursues a criminal case against the former president over January 6 and alleged efforts to subvert the 2020 election.

Phone calls and interactions between Trump and Mike Pence could be included in the filings, in which Trump allegedly pressured his vice president into helping overturn the election results.

Joining us now to discuss, CNN senior legal analyst Elie Honig.

Hi, Elie. Great to see you.

So this brief is due by tomorrow. It would make public the evidence before trial. What new information could we learn from it that's not already up there?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Pam, that's a big question. We're all waiting for that brief to drop at some point tomorrow.

So Jack Smith has given us some hints of what type of new evidence he's going to file. The reason he's putting in this motion tomorrow is to try to defend his indictment and argue that Donald Trump is not immune from the allegations that remain in the indictment.

And to that end, Jack Smith has said there will be evidence that goes beyond what he has already put in the record. So I think we're looking for new information, perhaps, about things that Mike Pence, as you said, perhaps Mark Meadows has told grand juries or has told prosecutors behind closed doors.

Now, we have a broad sense from the January 6 Committee and from some of Jack Smith's prior filings. But, tomorrow, I think we could see firsthand documents showing verbatim what people like Mike Pence and Mark Meadows said about what Donald Trump did before and during January 6.

BROWN: So then how unusual is it for Judge Tanya Chutkan to even approve a filing request like this?

HONIG: So the ordinary page limit on a filing like this is 45 pages.

Jack Smith, though, earlier in the week said, Judge, I would like your special permission to file a longer brief, specifically 180 pages, which is four times as long. Donald Trump's team objected. They said, Your Honor, this is going to hurt us in the upcoming election. Judge Chutkan: Not my job.

And she granted Jack Smith permission to file the oversized brief. So this brief, according to Jack Smith, is going to be 180 pages, plus an appendix. So heaven knows how long this will be. It is unusual to ask for an oversized brief. And here we are going to see a very oversized brief.

BROWN: We certainly are.

And looking ahead, if a judge deems the communications between Trump and Pence to be -- quote -- "official acts" and therefore immune to prosecution as laid out by the Supreme Court, would that make the case dead on arrival or is there still enough meat on the bones without that, you think?

HONIG: So if Judge Chutkan decides that the conversations between Donald Trump and Mike Pence, Donald Trump's pressure campaign, trying to get Mike Pence to throw out the electoral votes, if she decides that that's immune and therefore out of the case, there's a very fair question that you raise, which is there even enough left for this indictment to proceed?

It may be that, if you pull that out of the indictment, there's just not enough left for it to stand on and it may get dismissed. Also important to note, whatever Judge Chutkan ends up ruling about that, about the admissibility of the Mike Pence evidence, that's going to be appealed.

Donald Trump's team will get to appeal that or whoever loses gets to appeal that to the D.C. Court of Appeals. And then maybe this could make a second trip back up to the Supreme Court. They specifically contemplated that in their immunity ruling. They said, hey, this may end up back before us before trial.

BROWN: And just to like take a step back here, I always like to do that. We get into the nitty-gritty and the -- I mean, this is all happening so close to the election with the Republican presidential candidate and a former president.

I mean, we have never seen anything like this before, have we?

HONIG: Yes.

Here we have a brief that is going to land tomorrow that is probably going to give us very important new information about things that Donald Trump did and said with respect to his chief of staff, Mark Meadows, with respect to his vice president, Mike Pence, back before January 6, 2021.

And here we are, what, six weeks away from the next election. Donald Trump's team actually complains. They say, this violates DOJ policy, which says you're not supposed to do something too close to an election that might impact that election.