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Indiana Murder Trial Begins; Trump Under Fire Over 'Enemy Within' Threats; FOX News Writers Worked With Trump on Charity Dinner Jokes. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired October 18, 2024 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:31:33]

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: Donald Trump making a rare in-studio appearance on "FOX & Friends" this morning.

Sitting there in the couch surrounded by the co-hosts, the former president took the opportunity to slam Vice President Kamala Harris, and also to push back on her recent comments calling him unhinged and unstable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (R) AND CURRENT U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: These people are misinformation people. They will say, let's go out with this one. They have tried many different things.

They tried, he's a dictator. He's going to take over the whole world. It doesn't seem to be working. I am the most stable human being.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: CNN media correspondent Hadas Gold back with me now? Also with the CNN media analyst Sara Fischer.

Good to see the both of you.

He also made this, what I thought was a really interesting admission in that interview this morning, talking specifically about his jokes last night at the dinner. Here we go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your material was real funny. Who wrote it? Who helped you with it?

TRUMP: Well, I have had a lot of people helping, a lot of people, a couple of people from FOX. Actually, I shouldn't say that, but they wrote some jokes. And for the most part, I didn't like any of them.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP) HILL: Didn't like them, but he took them. The fact that he had some

folks from FOX help him write those jokes, Hadas, that seems unusual.

HADAS GOLD, CNN MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Yes, very unusual and absolutely incredible that he would just be saying this on air and that the co- hosts are sort of laughing along, saying, yes, sure, that's fine.

I mean, listen, we all know that a lot of FOX News hosts and on-air personalities are very outwardly in favor of former President Donald Trump. They want him to win. But to hear him come out and say, yes, I had some people from FOX help me write these jokes.

I have asked FOX News for a comment about this. Who were these people? We want to know who they were. Did they actually help? Is this allowed? Is this encouraged?

Because I can tell you that, at CNN, I'm pretty sure we would not be allowed to help a politician write their jokes for a dinner like this. Now, this is not the first time we have actually seen FOX News personalities helping Donald Trump outwardly.

If you remember, in 2018, ahead of the midterms, Sean Hannity actually went on stage during a rally that Donald Trump was hosting ahead of the midterms, and that caused a lot of drama around that as well. So we're still reporting this out, trying to figure out exactly how these jokes were written, who from FOX may have helped him, and is this actually true?

HILL: Yes, it is really something.

I was also struck. Donald Trump has canceled a fair number of planned interviews, as we understand it. This week alone, we're hearing about CNBC, also a separate interview that was supposed to happen with NBC, and then this morning Politico reporting that there were conversations for the former president to sit down for an interview with The Shade Room, but that producers were told Trump was -- quote -- "exhausted" and refusing some interviews.

His advisers had said at the time that that could change. Trump's team is pushing back, one of his spokespeople who was not involved in these conversations saying he's not exhausted, this isn't true.

But having read that this morning, Sara, and then to see him pop up actually sitting on the couch, he calls in a lot, but to see him sitting on the couch in that very friendly environment, I just found it to be interesting timing.

SARA FISCHER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST: Yes, well, he goes where he's comfortable, right? And it's less energy where you're comfortable.

I also think in the final throes of the campaign, the biggest focus is getting your message out to those undecided voters in swing states. And so when you think about some of the cancellations, CNBC, for example, you're reaching a business audience that's mostly coastal elites, you can see why they would not want to necessarily go out of their way to schedule that and pencil that one in. I think Donald Trump brings energy to the places where he knows that

he's going to have an easy interview. And that's another part of this.

[11:35:03]

Now, The Shade Room is interesting because they have a very large young African-American audience that's actually critical for Donald Trump in these final days and weeks leading up to the election. And so when Politico reported that Donald Trump was exhausted, I thought, OK, that makes sense for this particular interview.

That's not necessarily a strategic thing to be missing something like that. But I would expect him to continue to show up in places where he feels like he has a really safe crowd. Again, last night, at the Al Smith dinner, he sounded so comfortable making jokes. That's where he's going to end up a lot for the next two weeks.

HILL: Yes, I was struck too. I mean, there were a number of moments in watching him this morning when he was on FOX, but he said twice that he thought the network should not air negative ads.

And then at the end of the interview, he said he was going to go straight to Rupert Murdoch. And here's what he said he was going to tell him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I can't talk to anybody else. But don't put on negative commercials for 21 days. Don't put them. And don't put on their, their horrible people that come and lie. I'm going to say, Rupert, please do it this way.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.

TRUMP: And then we're going to have a victory.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: I mean, Hadas, I guess we get to the point where there's sort of like nothing really shocks you anymore, but always saying the quiet part out loud. Sometimes, you just still -- you do pause for a moment.

GOLD: Yes, I mean, he also called out FOX chief Suzanne Scott by name on TRUTH Social earlier, essentially saying the same thing, because I think, in his mind, FOX News needs to be 100 percent behind him all the time.

He sees that as his ultimate safe space, where he has the support, where his supporters are watching as well. And so he sees it as traitorous almost if FOX News is doing anything that is against him, if it has any sort of contributor like Jessica Tarlov or any sort of on-air person who might be speaking out against him.

He sees that and saying, this is my home. This is my home base. Why are you doing such a thing, as even the basic tenants of journalism? So, kind of incredible, though, just to see him saying all of this just out loud, not only talking about going straight to Rupert Murdoch, but also talking about how FOX staffers may have helped him.

Again, turn the tables just a bit and imagine if this was happening with Vice President Kamala Harris talking about NBC or something like that. There would be a huge absolute meltdown by a lot of people, especially on the right.

HILL: Listen, there's never a shortage for things for us to discuss. That's for sure.

Hadas Gold, Sara Fischer, nice to see you both. Thank you.

Just ahead: Vice President Harris slamming Trump's threats to use the military against those who he calls the enemy within if he becomes president. But is that even possible? We're going to fact-check those claims.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:42:42]

HILL: Just over two weeks or so to go until Election Day, and Vice President Harris is really sharpening her attacks on the former president, using his words to make her case that Trump is unfit to return to the White House.

And that includes Trump's increasing threats against his political opponents.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He who has vowed, if reelected, he will be a dictator on day one...

(BOOING)

HARRIS: ... that he will weaponize the Department of Justice against his political and enemies, he who calls Americans who disagree with him the enemy from within and -- yes, and says that, if reelected, he would use the military to go after them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: So, just a reminder, here are some of those comments that he has made.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I think the bigger problem is the enemy from within, and it should be very easily handled by -- if necessary, by National Guard or, if really necessary, by the military, because they can't let that happen.

It is the enemy from within, and they're very dangerous. They're Marxists and communists and fascists and they're sick.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: So it raises an important question. Could Donald Trump actually use military forces to quash an enemy from within were he back in the White House?

So we wanted to step back. We want to just take a facts-first approach to this.

And joining me now, CNN law enforcement contributor Steve Moore and CNN legal analyst Carrie Cordero.

Good to see both of you, as always.

So, Carrie, let's start here. There's -- yes, there's the political argument. Yes, there's a lot of rhetoric. Would a president actually have that kind of authority? He has suggested that he could use both the National Guard and the U.S. military to go after Americans who don't support him.

CARRIE CORDERO, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So let's start, Erica, with what the law provides.

First of all, there is a general presumption against using National Guard or the military for anything that's law enforcement-related. So there are laws that are against that, and so there's only exceptional circumstances where, when there is a credible reason for them to be used in domestic law enforcement, they can be used.

Second, National Guard, in particular, has various legal authorities that it can be used under. Generally, it's under the authority of governors. There are certain circumstances when a president can authorize them to act. But, again, those are things that other presidents have used, for example, assistance in natural disasters, sometimes border protraction.

But there's a legal framework under what those things are authorized. What the former president appears to be talking about is something that would be a corruption of the use of the National Guard or the military. When we talk about something that sounds like going after political opponents, those would be unlawful directions and so it would require a corruption throughout the leadership of all of those organizations from the secretary of defense on down in order for something like that to be effectuated.

[11:45:00]

HILL: And, see, when comments like these are made from a presidential candidate, not a fringe group or some lone wolf comment on social media, how does that change the approach from a law enforcement perspective?

STEVE MOORE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CONTRIBUTOR: It doesn't change it at all. I mean, you can say a lot of things on the campaign trail. Imagine

somebody saying something on the campaign trail that will never happen or is actually impossible. And our Constitution, our laws prohibit the use of the military against civilians.

It's just -- it's in the Posse Comitatus Act. It is rigidly enforced. I have been in situations where we have dealt with the National Guard during the L.A. riots, for instance, when there was what would be called a widespread insurrection or a riot. They were called in, but by the California governor.

The president cannot, cannot, under the law, call up the military to deal with the U.S. civilians.

HILL: Hey, but just to follow on that in terms of, given these comments, given what we saw in 2020 and early 2021, Steve, how do you think some of these comments are impacting different law enforcement agencies from the local and federal level in terms of how they're preparing for potential violence on or around Election Day?

MOORE: I would tell, Erica, that they're not impacting them any more than the circumstances themselves.

In the FBI, we would hear -- I mean, you try to insulate yourself from the political world. And so the president can say certain things. It might be a situation where that would influence you to believe that maybe there was going to be some violence on one side or the other because of those comments.

But what they say, you look at it only as a cause and effect.

HILL: OK.

MOORE: What could his statements do for the civilians who hear it?

(CROSSTALK)

HILL: Oh, go ahead, Carrie.

CORDERO: I would also add, Erica, there is one very specific thing that the federal government law enforcement is doing in particular with respect to January -- the upcoming January 6 of 2025, which is that it has now been designated a national special security event, so that the Secret Service and the Department of Homeland Security will be in charge of devising a security plan just in case there is violence or potential violence to protect against surrounding that event.

HILL: Carrie Cordero, Steve Moore, great to have you both here this morning. Thank you.

When we come back, opening statements begin today for the man accused of killing two Indiana teens, as the judge sets some special guidelines for the trial itself.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:52:10]

HILL: Jurors are set to hear opening statements in a case that has drawn national attention for years now.

Richard Allen is accused of killing two teenage girls in 2017, 13- year-old Abigail Williams and 14-year-old Liberty German. But it wasn't until five years later that authorities arrested and charged Allen.

CNN's Jean Casarez has been following this for us.

So, Jean, bring us up to speed here, if you would.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is a very complicated case.

It's opening statements that are beginning today after seven years since 2017 when Abigail Williams, Liberty German, they had an afternoon free, no school, so a relative dropped them off at the Monon trails in Delphi, Indiana.

Delphi, Indiana is a very small town. They don't know what crime is. Less than 3,000 people. Everybody knows everybody. But the girls were on a bridge. And we want to show a picture because the cell phone from one of the girls captured a man who appeared to be on the bridge with them. And it's believed a short time later that they were murdered.

There's audio that was released on this picture that says -- the man says: "Guys, down the hill."

There's much more to this video, and that jury should be shown that. But their bodies were found down the hill the next day. They had been stabbed. But was Richard Allen's DNA, the person charged now, on or near the bodies?

I spoke to a detective very close after this happened before a gag order, and I assumed there was a sexual assault. And he said to me at the time, "Don't make assumptions there was a sexual assault."

So that is a big question we need to look for in opening statements. Now, Richard Allen admitted that he was there that day on the Monon trails, but he said he didn't do this. He worked at the local CVS and the family members actually said that he helped print pictures for the families for the funerals free of charge at the CVS.

Now, the prosecution is saying he confessed over 60 times once he was arrested and in jail to prison guards, to family members, to friends. That's coming into this trial. But the defense is pushing back, saying, wait a minute, he was in solitary confinement for years. And he started wetting his legal documents and eating them.

And that's when he started to confess. They're going to really push back on that. But the prosecution is also saying that there was a bullet close to the bodies, an unspent bullet. So it hadn't been shot at all,but that that bullet, they say, was traced to a pistol that they later found at his home.

Defense is pushing back on that too. But one last thing. I think the elephant in the room, which the judge is not going to allow into the trial, but everybody knows about, the prosecutors originally went down the pathway of the "Odinist Nordic religion" -- quote, unquote -- because there are Odinists in that community. And they stopped.

[11:55:14]

They didn't do any more on it, but the defense expert of ritualistic killings said in a hearing that the bodies were positioned in a certain way, there were twigs on the bodies in a certain way, blood was smeared on a tree close to the bodies, and this actually was a killing and it was a ritualistic killing.

HILL: Wow.

(CROSSTALK)

CASAREZ: Judge says, can't come before the jury.

HILL: That is a lot.

Jean, really appreciate it. Thank you. You will be watching for those developments.

Thank you so much for joining me today in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Erica Hill.

Dana Bash is up next, her exclusive interview with senior Kamala Harris campaign adviser David Plus -- Plouffe, rather -- ahead on "INSIDE POLITICS."