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Harris, Trump Focus on Swing States with 17 Days to Go; Donald Trump to Speak in Latrobe, Pennsylvania; Early In-Person Voting Begins Today in Nevada; Trump Holds Campaign Rally in Battleground PA; Judge Unseals Heavily Redacted Evidence Against Trump; Sources: Liam Payne's Body to be Delivered to His Family When Clinical Tests are Completed. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired October 19, 2024 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:31]

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Jessica Dean in Washington.

Seventeen days and counting, and the world's political eyes are focused on the critical swing states that will decide likely who wins the White House.

Kamala Harris is set to speak shortly at a rally in Atlanta. She's going to be joined on stage by music superstar, Usher. More than a million people in Georgia have already cast their ballots just days after early voting got underway in that state with a record smashing turnout.

So far, 11 million Americans nationwide have already voted. Eva McKend is in Atlanta. She's joining us now live.

Eva, what are we expecting from tonight?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Jess, what we're hearing from the Vice President is her increasingly using the former president's own words and actions against him, pointing, for example, to how he talks about fellow Americans as the enemy from within, or the comments he made about being the father of IVF when he, of course, was responsible for elevating the three Supreme Court justices that ultimately led to the reversal of Roe versus Wade.

And it's all an effort to characterize the former president as unstable and unhinged. You hear Senator Jon Ossoff on stage right now, the Georgia senator, he just said that Trump is unfit for the presidency, that this is not about party loyalty.

Take a listen to how the vice president speaks about this as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS (D), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: He's becoming increasingly unstable and unhinged, and it requires that response. I think the American people are seeing it, witnessing it in real time, and we must take note of the fact that this is an individual who wants to be president of the United States, and I think the American people deserve better than someone who actually seems to be unstable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCKEND: And Jess, when you speak to Democrats here, they tell me that here in tossup Georgia, it is all about boosting the energy and engagement on the ground. That's why the big message here tonight Georgia votes early. They're trying to lean on folks to get out and vote right now if they can.

DEAN: Yes, and Eva, we mentioned Usher is going to be there tonight. Lizzo, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton -- these are all people we have seen out on the trail campaigning either with Kamala Harris, for Kamala Harris. She's got a lot of support, but what does the campaign actually think that can do?

MCKEND: So, Jess, this is a perennial conversation in Democratic circles: Do the celebrity endorsements really help? I can tell you, even though the former -- even though Republicans go after Democrats for these celebrity endorsements, kind of make fun of it, you best believe that if they had that kind of A-list star power behind them, and Usher, for example, to be a campaign surrogate, they would be using him if they could. Because, listen, the fact of the matter is, there are so many voters that are just not paying attention to politics.

And when you have these big names out here calling attention to the election, you may pick up people that otherwise might not be engaged. So that is the theory of the case from Democrats and why they're leaning on people like Usher and Lizzo to elevate Vice President Harris.

DEAN: All right, Eva McKend there at the rally in Atlanta. Thank you so much for that reporting.

I want to go now to Pennsylvania. Donald Trump is holding his own rally in the swing state of Pennsylvania. Earlier, he urged Detroit supporters to vote early, even though he and other Republicans have repeatedly and falsely claimed that early voting is rife with fraud.

Steve Contorno is on the trail in Latrobe outside Pittsburgh. He's joining us now live.

And Steve, it is -- it is quite interesting to see Trump and other Republicans make the turn on early voting, mail-in voting when they attacked it and attacked it and attacked it in 2020. What more can we expect to hear from them tonight?

STEVE CONTORNO, CNN REPORTER: Well, he's going to set the stakes for this election for the voters and his supporters in this critical battleground state. I'm looking through the excerpts of his speech that we just received, and it's quite dramatic what he says the stakes of this election are.

He says this election is a choice between whether we will have four more years of failure and disaster, or whether we will begin the four greatest years in the history of our country. He was saying "Your vote will decide whether we give up on America or whether we save America."

And he also says, "One hundred years from now, the presidential election of 2024 will be looked upon as America's greatest victory."

[18:05:06 ]

So clearly playing into the drama and the stakes of this election. He has also recently been pushing back against Vice President Harris' assertion that he is running out of steam as we head into the final weeks of this race. Take a listen to what he had to say yesterday in Detroit.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: What event have I canceled? I haven't canceled. She doesn't go to any events. She's a loser. She doesn't go to any events. She didn't even show up for the Catholics last night at the hotel. It was insulting.

They -- all they are, are soundbites.

I've gone 48 days now without a rest, and I've got that loser who doesn't have the energy of a rabbit.

Tell me when you've seen me take even a little bit of a rest. Not only am I not -- I'm not even tired, I'm really exhilarated. You know why? We're killing her in the polls.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CONTORNO: Lashing out there, as you can see, Jessica, in sort of in a similar manner that he did when she insinuated that his crowd sizes were not as large as his, clearly getting under his skin there with that line of attack.

Interesting to see how he responds to it today. There's a pretty decent crowd behind me ready for him to speak, although I will say that I've been to many Trump events over the past few months, and this one had a little bit of lower energy coming into Trump's remarks.

Obviously it's getting loud in here now, because he's just about to take the stage. We'll have to see how they respond to the former president. It's a critical part of a battleground state. He's in Western Pennsylvania, just outside of Pittsburgh and Westmoreland County. This is a county he won by two to one margin four years ago. And Jessica, he's going to need that kind of support from it once again if he's going to win this state.

DEAN: All right, Steve Contorno there in Latrobe, Pennsylvania, laying out the stakes for President Trump in Pennsylvania and Latrobe specifically, we're going to keep our eye on that rally. Thank you so much for that.

In the meantime, Georgia began early voting this past Tuesday, and already more than 1.2 million Georgians have cast their votes in the battleground state. I want to go to CNN's Rafael Romo, who joins us from a polling site in Lawrenceville, and here we are on a Saturday. Rafael, what kind of turnout have you been seeing?

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it has been quite steady, Jessica.

Right now, not too many voters right here, but in the mid-afternoon hours, the line extended all the way out and Jessica, some voters have been standing in line for over at hour polling states, not only here in Gwinnett County and other locations across the state of Georgia.

Gwinnett County is not only the most ethnically diverse in the entire state of Georgia, but it's also had great population growth in the last few years, surpassing the one million mark over the summer.

President Biden, let's remember carried Gwinnett County in 2020. It is in counties like this one, in battleground states like Georgia, where the 2024 election may be decided. People are very motivated.

By Friday, voters, as you mentioned before, had already cast more than a million ballots here in Georgia since early voting started Tuesday. Some poll workers say they had never seen this level of interest from voters and are working extra hard to make sure the process runs smoothly, given the unprecedented number of people voting early. This is what one of them had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANITA REDD, GWINNETT COUNTY POLL MANAGER: Yesterday was the highest voter count I've ever had in my career with elections. I work my legs off. We had over 1,200 voters here in 12 hours.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: Jessica, we also spoke with a family of five -- imagine this composed -- by two grandparents, two parents and their college age daughter, who came to this polling station to vote together.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDHU JOSEPH, GWINNETT COUNTY EARLY VOTER: Just civic duty, and I think everyone as a citizen, should come and vote, and just look at the economy, how it was the prior years, and then see what it can do better by voting for the right candidates. So that's the reason why we were here today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: So again, Jessica, already 1.2 million people have cast their ballots. It hasn't even been a week since early voting started. Now, back to you.

DEAN: Yes. Those record numbers, all right, Rafael Romo for us in Georgia, thank you so much.

I want to go to Nevada now, another swing state. This one saw early voting beginning today, and joining us now is Nevada Secretary of State, Francisco Aguilar, Mr. Secretary. Thank you so much for being here. We appreciate it.

FRANCISCO AGUILAR, NEVADA SECRETARY OF STATE: Thank you for having me. Excited to be here.

DEAN: First just tell us how it's going so far. What are you seeing? What kind of volume are you seeing? And are you seeing any issues?

AGUILAR: We're seeing a lot of great enthusiasm. We were out visiting polling locations this morning, one in Chinatown and the excitement, the enthusiasm to vote was really exciting to see.

What was really cool to see is we've been working really hard to ensure our language access programs were strong and ready to go. We saw them in motion. We saw the interpreters communicating with our AAPI community. It was a great thing.

[18:10:18]

DEAN: And you guys are expecting a high volume of mail-in and absentee voting. Current state law allows ballots to be counted if they received up to four business days past Election Day. We know the RNC has appealed before the Ninth US Circuit Court of Appeals disputing that law because they claim Democratic candidates are more likely to prevail with mail-in ballots counted after Election Day. Where do you see that lawsuit? And how do you think the court is going to rule?

AGUILAR: Look, this has been in existence since the legislature implemented it in '21. We've been working this way both over my previous colleague, who was Republican. We are continuing the same processes, the same rules that we had in '22 and 2020 and we're moving forward as if they are going to exist by the time the election occurs.

DEAN: And I am curious, too, how early voting is, specifically to your state, where we know a lot of voters in that state are in the hospitality industry. They work kind of different hours than a normal nine to five job. How does that impact kind of where you see the numbers in terms of voting day of versus early voting, versus mail-in voting?

AGUILAR: Right. Turnout so far has been about 28,000 across the state. We know that in 2020, that was about 39,000. We're seeing great momentum, but we understand in person voting is very different with our mail-in process.

Nevada runs some of those safe, secure, and accessible elections. Just because they're accessible doesn't mean they aren't safe and secure.

The accessibility piece is really important, and understanding the use and adoption of mail ballots by our working community, especially those in the gaming industry, is really high.

So seeing the turnout numbers so far and understanding that does not include mail ballots or our digital e-system, we know that Nevadans are excited and motivated to get to the polls.

DEAN: And how long do you think it will ultimately take to count the ballots there? Do you think there could be any sort of delay? Obviously, you don't have a crystal ball for something that would come up, but I'm also thinking about any plans for misinformation -- to combat misinformation, if there is a delay, if there are things that crop up.

AGUILAR: You know, when I ran in '22 I had to wait till Saturday after the Tuesday election to find out that I won. Knowing that information, reviewing our statutes here in Nevada, we have been working extremely hard the last 18 to 20 months to look at our processes, to look at our systems, and to allow the counties to start counting and processing votes, so when election night comes and the last voter votes in Nevada, we are able to release a substantial amount of results for the general public to make the decisions they need to make about races.

DEAN: All right, Nevada Secretary of State Francisco Aguilar, thanks so much for your time.

AGUILAR: Thank you for having me.

DEAN: When we come back, US officials are investigating what they call a "deeply concerning leak" of highly classified documents detailing Israel's plan to attack Iran, plus the death of Hamas' leader Yahya Sinwar is prompting cautious optimism from the White House about a road to peace in the Middle East. We will have more on that. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:17:59]

DEAN: "Deeply concerning," that's how US officials are describing the leak of highly classified intelligence documents detailing Israel's preparations for an attack on Iran. AXIOS was the first to report on that leak, and CNN's Natasha Bertrand is joining us now live with more.

Natasha, I know you've been talking to sources as well. What are you learning?

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jessica, we have managed to confirm that these two documents that were leaked on Telegram on Friday do appear to be authentic, and they are highly classified documents that suggest that the US has been essentially spying on Israel's plans to retaliate against Iran for that massive missile barrage that Iran inflicted on them on October 1st. And these documents are marked "Top Secret."

They also have markings suggesting that the only entities that should be viewing these documents are the US and some of its closest allies, the Five Eyes partnership. And so this is obviously very concerning to US officials. And while we are not going to quote from these documents or share them directly, we can outline them broadly.

One of them, for example, which is sourced to the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency, discusses Israel's movement of certain munitions in order to prepare for a possible strike on Iran. Another document, which is sourced to the National Security Agency, discusses the Israeli Air Force's preparations and exercises for a strike, including information about the Israeli Air Force's use of air to surface missiles.

And so this is obviously going to cause some consternation, to say the least, in Israel itself. And of course, it comes in a very delicate moment between the US and Israel, and it really reveals, I think, something interesting, which is that for all of the United States' efforts to get information directly from Israel, and you know, intelligence about what they're planning to actually do in Iran, and having all of these conversations, they're still collecting intelligence on them and doing surveillance on their activities, so that the US, of course, can get its own understanding of what might transpire.

[18:20:07]

And so for now, what we're hearing from US officials is that they're not going to confirm the authenticity of these documents for now, when we reached out for official comment, but we are told that one of the main focuses of the investigation at this point is just determining who had access to these documents to begin with -- Jessica.

DEAN: All right, Natasha Bertrand with the latest reporting on that. Thank you so much.

And with the killing of Hamas leader, Yahya Sinwar comes renewed hope in Washington for an end of the war in Gaza, but President Biden acknowledge Sinwar's death won't be an immediate resolution to that situation.

Julia Benbrook is joining us now from Washington.

Julia, what is the White House saying?

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's a lot of uncertainty following the Hamas leader's death, but the Biden administration continues to try and be optimistic that there could be an opening for a resolve to this conflict.

For months now, frustrated American officials who want to see an end to the war in Gaza have quietly expressed that this is a scenario that could loosen the deadlocked ceasefire talks.

Now whether or not that's going to happen remains to be seen. Hamas has said that they're not releasing the hostages unless Israel ends the war, fully withdraws from Gaza and releases Palestinian prisoners.

Meanwhile, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has vowed to continue fighting unless all of the hostages are released. The Biden administration knows that Sinwar's death, they acknowledge that his death is not going to be an immediate solution to this situation, but like I said, they continue to express cautious hope.

DEAN: All right, Julia Benbrook for us in Washington. Thank you so much for that. Still ahead, with a race so close, one key voting group could be key to winning the White House, and it's been a weak spot for Kamala Harris' coalition, a weak spot that Donald Trump is trying to use to tip the scales.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:26:22]

DEAN: Both former President Trump and Vice President Harris have been crisscrossing Michigan in the final weeks leading to Election Day. Early voting began today in Detroit, with other parts of the state set to follow in the coming days.

In Michigan, so far, just over a million absentee ballots have come in. That does not include early in person voting.

Joining us now to talk more about this, CNN senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein.

Ron, we're starting to see people going to the polls. We've seen record turnout in Georgia so far. Michigan, Nevada, starting early voting. What do you make of the turnout so far?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I actually saw people voting today, early voting in Detroit on the first day.

Look, it is difficult. I mean, I know people try to read the tea leaves of which party has an advantage based on the early voting returns. I know there are people who analyze it. It's really hard to know whether you are getting new voters or just kind of cannibalizing your election day eventual voters.

The one thing I think that is clear is that when Biden was still in the race against Trump, there were serious people saying to me that turnout could be down to as low as 140 to 145 million after 160 million in 2020, the highest turnout rate since before women had the right to vote.

Now I think the indications are we may not get all the way back to 160, but we are looking at another high turnout election in which the swing states might be decided by even smaller margins than they were last time.

DEAN: It is. It is like the craziest thing to think about, too, because it's so many people voting, and yet the margins continue likely to be so, so small.

In your latest piece for "The Atlantic," you argue that working class White women. I'm sorry this is for CNN -- working class White women could be a decisive group in this race. Tell us more about why.

BROWNSTEIN: Well, look, I mean, you know, we are seeing an enormous gender gap in most polls in this race, with Harris, having a really formidable position among lots of different groups of women -- college educated White women, who tend to be the most probably pro-choice segment of the electorate and also prioritize that issue more. Very likely, she has a very good chance of running even better among them than Biden did in 2020.

Black women, maybe some small erosion around inflation. In the end, maybe not. Maybe she's over 90 percent among them. Latinas also potentially some small erosion among them around inflation, but again, a very strong performance, probably likely in the mid-60s. Somewhere, single women, younger women, enormous gender gap among younger women, the one kind of loose spot in the wall of this formidable wall of support among women are those working class White women.

Democrats don't have to win them. They don't really.

Bill Clinton is the only one in 1996 who has won most of them since the 1980 election, but they do have to run competitively among them, particularly in those former blue wall states of Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, which I think from the calendar you can get the sense that they are where Harris sees her path.

And so holding at least somewhere in the low to mid 40s among them is absolutely critical for her. You continue to see her pound these states with messages and appearances. Liz Cheney on Monday and another appeal to previously Republican voting women, and most of these women, as I said, have voted Republican. They don't like the economic outcomes they've gotten under Biden, but they also don't like Trump, they don't like the way -- his language, the kind of belligerence, and they are a truly conflicted group.

DEAN: So interesting. We are looking at live video, Ron of former President Trump who is in Latrobe, Pennsylvania. He is talking, I believe right now about his closing message which has been on a lot of ads about transgender people. I want to dip into and we will just listen if you don't mind to hang on with us for a moment.

[18:30:21]

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I said to my son, Don, he knows a lot about guns. And Eric knows - they're great shots, they really are. I said, what kind of a gun is that. They said, Dad, you don't even want to know. They are serious guns. We got more guys, and every one of them is like central casting too. Holy shit. I'm looking - they look like Arnold Palmer. They look like Arnold. Can't look better than Arnold.

But with your support, we'll bring back our nation's strength, dominance, prosperity and pride. We're going to do it. This will be America's new golden age. One hundred years from now the presidential election of 2024 will be looked upon as America's greatest victory. I hope that's true. Because we've been through so much together and the finish line is finally in sight.

After four horrendous years, Kamala Harris can't say one thing that she'd do differently, right? You heard that. If you vote for me, I will end inflation. I will bring jobs back to our country. We'll flood our shores with companies and jobs. We'll seal our borders immediately and we'll let people in.

You know, we had the safest border in the history of our country. Hold it. Put up that - my favorite sign of all time, put up my favorite graph, I have to use it, my favorite graph. So the red arrow on the bottom, that's the lowest number of illegal immigrants to come into this country. And by the way, we want people to come into the country, but they have to come in legally, just so we understand, right? She's going, yes.

We want them. We need them. We're going to need them because we're going to have so many companies come in just through adjustments in tariffs and taxes. They're going to be - come pouring into our country and they're going to stay here because we're going to protect them with tariffs.

The word tariff is the most beautiful word in the dictionary. More beautiful than love, more beautiful than respect - no less beautiful than religion. I don't want to get into that argument, but the word tariff is the most beautiful word in the dictionary, remember that. It's going to make our country rich.

And our politicians were too stupid for so many years or something else was going on. He goes crooked. That could be, because it's so simple to understand. But look at that. So that's the - that was the day I left office, that lower red arrow. That's the lowest point. And look what happened to our country after that. Look at that.

DEAN: All right. You're listening there to former President Donald Trump, who is speaking at a rally in Latrobe, Pennsylvania. We've got Ron Brownstein here with us.

Ron, interesting - a couple notes there that I just kind of want to get your thoughts on, first of all, he talks about tariffs being the most beautiful word in the dictionary. But a number of economists have said that if they - if he goes forward with this plan on tariffs, that it could really sink the U.S. economy.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes. Also confused Arnold Palmer and Arnold Schwarzenegger ...

DEAN: Yes.

BROWNSTEIN: ... there, kind of continuing the pattern of, you know, his own verbal missteps, which have become much, much more common in this campaign than in his earlier campaigns.

Yes. In fact, you know, a number of Wall Street economic analysis, Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan, Moody's have concluded that the combination of the tariffs, the across the board tariffs of 10 percent on everything and 60 percent or more on China. He's been talking about even larger figures lately. The combination of Trump's across the board tariffs and his mass deportation, which could remove something like 15 percent of construction workers and one in 12 service workers and manufacturing workers, that those two policies combined could reignite inflation, slow down the economy and cause the Fed to raise interest rates, again, which would have a lot of impact on the home industry, as well as facing the, you know, the increased cost of materials from the tariffs.

I mean, the problem Democrats have had making an issue of this is that the lived experience of people is the opposite, right? I mean, people have a sense that they had more money in their pocket at the end of the week under Trump, that groceries, and gas and housing wasn't as expensive in the first years of the Trump presidency.

And that remains, you know, that remains a huge hurdle for Harris, you know, as it was for Biden.

[18:35:03]

I mean, ultimately the fundamentals do apply. I mean, there's a great deal of resistance to Trump, personally, the way he is closing this campaign with his kind of, you know, a blast force message on immigration appeals to his base. It does worry some of those suburban moderates, but the challenge for the Democrats is that the retrospective job approval for Trump's years in office is rising in both state and national polls to a point where in many of them, it is higher than it ever was when he was president.

And what that says to me is that they are judging him now through the lens primarily of what they didn't like about Biden's results, which are largely inflation and the border. And between now and November, and I think you see a clear recalibration by Harris over the last week, she has to remind people that there was more that went to the Trump presidency than lower prices for eggs.

There was a reason his approval rating never reached 50 percent when voters were actually living through the economy that was there under him. And to the extent, that has faded from view. It is a significant reason why his position has improved since the debate, which reminded people of all of the things they didn't like about him when he was the president.

DEAN: Yes. Hence the reason we've seen her really going after him in a much more sharper way about how unstable he is. That's what I think. We do need to go. I have one quick question for you, though.

BROWNSTEIN: (INAUDIBLE) ...

DEAN: You heard him mentioned that Harris, in these interviews, has had a hard time saying anything she would do differently than Biden. And in fact, in "The View," couldn't come up with anything. She later went on to say maybe she'd put a Republican in her cabinet. How harmful is that for her?

BROWNSTEIN: Right. Yes. Look, I think it is harmful. I mean, most - you know, people do not want a continuation of the Biden administration. Most people - more people say the Biden policies had hurt than helped them. The opposite is true for Trump. You know, it would seem it would be possible to say where I have differed from him, I'm going to keep private, because that's what a vice president does. But looking forward, I have different experiences. I am a different person. I will have different priorities. She's kind of said the second half, but didn't really do the first half. And I think that was something that, you know, takes her in the wrong direction at a time when, you know, the fundamental things, she is still facing the fundamental gravity that when you have an incumbent president whose approval rating is in the low 40s, his party has a hard time holding the White House. She's levitating above that both because she seems to embody change, obviously, as a younger woman of color and also because people are - you know, there's a lot of people who are reluctant to put Trump back in the White House. But those fundamentals, that gravity does ultimately pull on this race.

DEAN: All right. Ron Brownstein as always, thank you so much.

BROWNSTEIN: Thanks for having me.

DEAN: Still to come, what we are learning from nearly 2,000 pages of documents detailing the evidence Special Counsel Jack Smith plans to use in the election subversion case against Donald Trump. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:42:22]

DEAN: A huge trove of documents has been unsealed in the 2020 election subversion case against former President Donald Trump, giving us a glimpse into the evidence of Special Counsel Jack Smith's case. CNN's Katelyn Polantz breaks down what this could mean for the prosecution.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: The federal court in Washington on Friday released nearly 2,000 pages of evidence in the 2020 election case against Donald Trump. But much of it looks like this, blank or sealed, redacted. That's because this evidence is backing up what the Justice Department says a trial court must look at that would be shown to jurors at a trial to try and prove Donald Trump was conspiring against the federal government as a candidate for office, not as the president.

So at this point in time, we've heard the narrative from the Justice Department. They've written that and they've described what Trump was doing and the evidence that they've gathered. But now, as on Friday, the Justice Department has this evidence put into the court record in largely these blank pages, these sealed records.

There are some things in this evidence that we can see, that we know the Justice Department wants to rely on for their case that's already been public. Things like Donald Trump's tweets, speeches and transcripts of speeches he was giving after the 2020 election, saying he didn't believe that he had lost, even though the Justice Department says he knew very clearly that he had.

There are other things like Mike Pence's book that is also in this court record that we can see publicly, photocopied pages of Pence's book where things that Trump was saying to him that he wrote about as when he was - during the vice presidency that are highlighted by the prosecutors. All of this is going to be looked at by the trial judge as she considers whether this case can move on to trial. It also is very likely to be looked at by appeals courts in the future, again, to determine whether Trump can go to trial or whether he has protection because of the presidency.

But his team has been digging in. They do not like the fact that any of this has been released in court at this time, especially before the election. They claim it's election interference, which the judge says it absolutely not - is not. It's litigation. But they also are trying to build a record to say this judge has just not handled things appropriately. Whether that is going to be an argument that goes far in the appellate courts, we will have to see. But it's very likely this case is going to go back to the Supreme Court before a trial is even on the calendar. Katelyn Polantz, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Katelyn, thank you.

[18:45:01]

And joining us now is former federal prosecutor, Alyse Adamson.

Alyse, thanks so much for being here.

ALYSE ADAMSON, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Thanks so much for having me, Jessica.

DEAN: Yes. As Katelyn just reported, there was so much redacted from these documents. She held up, it looked - it said "sealed" and it was blank. What is the value in releasing them?

ADAMSON: Yes, that's a really good question, Jessica. I think it's more a question of procedure than it is of value here. I think what people need to understand is that most of the time criminal cases are public once they're filed. And so within the ordinary course, when the parties file documents, they're going to be public on the public docket.

However, there are instances such as these where the information is so sensitive that the court decides that some of it needs to be redacted. So I think what we saw here was just a case kind of advancing within the ordinary course. And then, of course, Judge Chutkan rightly withheld or kept redacted large swaths of these documents, which we believe to be grand jury material, sensitive witness interviews. And so while it's wholly unsatisfying to us as members of the public, I think that this is just a very ordinary thing that happens in criminal cases.

DEAN: And on knowing all of that, what stood out to you or did anything surprise you as you went through this?

ADAMSON: Yes, Jessica, I think what was surprising to me was the lack of surprise, right? And I say that because the former president's team fought this very hard. They fought the initial brief that Jack Smith filed on October 2nd. They filed the unsealing of these appendices. There were four volumes, nearly 1,900 pages. So we all expected to see something, but there was no bombshell. It was all really just context to what we had seen in the October 2nd filing.

Of course, there were some tidbits. There was a handwritten note that demonstrated the urging of Mike Pence to reject the certifications. There was also this previously unknown interview with a White House employee that gave us some insight into how the former president reacted when he found out about the riot. Apparently, he asked for a television and then was given a Diet Coke just to watch it unfold. So I thought that was interesting.

But I think the most damning evidence was included in that October 2nd filing.

DEAN: Mm-hmm. And so now Judge Chutkan will consider all of these documents as she determines whether this case can move to trial. How do you see this proceeding?

ADAMSON: Yes, I think that Jack Smith and his team did a phenomenal job in briefing the issues here. Remember, Judge Chutkan needs to make immunity determinations, decide whether or not the evidence that Jack Smith is relying on will be admissible at trial, whether it conforms to the immunity ruling, that landmark decision that the Supreme Court handed down on July 1st.

Remember, Jack Smith has issued a superseding indictment. And then within this - within his October 2nd filing, he positioned a lot of the argument as these are all private acts. The conduct here is private. It was Donald Trump acting as a political candidate and not as president. And for those acts that could be considered official acts, well, those are only presumptive immunity there and they will rebut those presumptions.

And so Judge Chutkan is going to meticulously go through all of the allegations, go through all of this evidence. And remember, while this evidence is redacted for us, the parties have full view. Judge Chutkan is reading it all. So she will make those determinations. I personally believe that there are - there is enough evidence to support the continuation of this case and Judge Chutkan will ultimately find that it can go forward.

DEAN: All right. Alyse Adamson, thank you so much for your analysis there. We appreciate it.

ADAMSON: Thanks so much for having me, Jessica.

DEAN: Mm-hmm. We'll be right back.

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[18:53:44]

DEAN: New tonight, CNN has learned the body of Liam Payne will not be delivered to his family until authorities finish running their clinical tests. The British musician, formerly of the group One Direction, died Wednesday in Buenos Aires. Investigators say he fell from the third floor of his hotel, but they're still trying to figure out how that happened. Authorities expect to get the results of those tests next week, though it could happen sooner.

Both candidates are hitting the trail hard, particularly in the handful of swing states that will determine who wins the White House. And Americans are coming out to vote in droves even before the big day with early voting records absolutely being smashed. You're in the CNN Newsroom.

And don't forget, there is a brand new episode of "Have I Got News for You" tonight. This week's guest will be comedian Alex Edelman and political commentator Sam Seder. Here's a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROY WOOD JR., HOST, HAVE I GOT NEWS FOR YOU: Trump's opponent, Kamala Harris, sat down for an interview on Fox News with someone who was definitely not voting for her and it got a little testy, which exchange prompted this gesture from Bret Baier?

SAM SEDER, COMMENTATOR AND HOST: It's when she spoke.

AMBER RUFFIN, HOST, HAVE I GOT NEWS FOR YOU: I think he was reaching for a high five. He's just a well-meaning guy enjoying himself with his friend, Kamala Harris.

[18:55:03]

SEDER: Well, there was the famous thing where he played the wrong clip of Trump saying something horrible, and then she said, with all due respect, and then he was like, I don't respect. Is that right?

WOOD JR: Wait, so any time she spoke, the hand went up?

SEDER: Yes.

WOOD JR: Just - Amber, say something, like, just show me.

SEDER: So, Amber, I - oh - oh, that is effective. Oh - oh.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: A new episode of "Have I Got News for You" airs tonight at 9 PM Eastern and Pacific right here on CNN.

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