Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Source Says, Biden Told Staff Saturday Night of Son's Pardon; Trump's Pick for FBI Chief Peddles Conspiracies, Election Lies; Syria Intensifies Attacks After Rebel Groups Take Key City. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired December 02, 2024 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:00:00]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump's pick for FBI director, new reporting this hour on Kash Patel from his plans to dismantle the bureau to going after journalists to writing children's books about, quote, King Donald. Patel is not shy about sharing his extreme views.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR NOMINEE: You now see that Mark Milley is what I call the kraken of the swamp. He makes Nancy Pelosi look like a goldfish when it comes to political swamp monsters.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Plus, flag planting and fights tarnish a weekend of college football rivalries, the costly backlash this morning.

And the nation's most famous address, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, right here in Washington, decked out for the holidays. I'll speak to the farmer behind this year's official White House Christmas tree.

Good morning, I'm Jim Acosta in Washington. You are live in the CNN Newsroom.

We begin with a new CNN reporting into President Biden's decision to pardon his son, Hunter. In a statement the president blasted Hunter's conviction, saying his political opponents targeted his son. Hunter Biden faced sentencing this month after pleading guilty to federal tax charges and his earlier conviction of federal gun crimes.

CNN's Arlette Saenz is traveling with the president, joins us now with her new reporting. Arlette, what are you learning?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim. President Biden issued this full and unconditional pardon of his son, Hunter Biden, which really marked a stunning reversal after Biden and his senior team had said for months that the president would not make this move. It also comes as Biden has staked so much of his political career on trying to maintain the independence of the judicial system. Now, President Biden came to this decision as he huddled with his family in Nantucket, Massachusetts, over the Thanksgiving holiday. I'm told that the president began informing his senior staff that he had made this decision on Saturday evening. He called up a meeting with them, some attending in person, others by phone when he arrived back at the White House to lay out his decision. And in that meeting, he also told his team that he wanted to prepare a statement to release on Sunday.

The next morning, the team huddled together to iron out those final details. And, ultimately, the president released a statement saying that he made this decision as a father. He has long believed that Republicans have maligned unfairly his son, Hunter Biden. And in his statement, he said that he believes that these charges that were brought against Hunter Biden simply were made because he is the president's son.

The president, in his statement last night, said, quote, here's the truth. I believe in the justice system, that as I have wrestled with this, I also believe raw politics has infected this process, and it led to a miscarriage of justice. And once I made this decision this weekend, there was no sense in delaying it further. I hope that Americans will understand why a father and a president would come to this decision.

Now, this statement makes no mention of his reversal. You'll remember back in June, both before and after Hunter Biden was found guilty of those felony gun charges, the president emphatically said that he would not pardon him. Of course, he has now completely reversed course and is moving forward with that full pardon for his only living son.

ACOSTA: All right. Arlette Saenz live for us in Angola, thank you so much.

In the meantime, we're learning more about President-elect Donald Trump's pick to replace FBI Director Christopher Wray with one of his most ardent supporters. Kash Patel is a MAGA loyalist known for his extreme rhetoric. He's worked as a public defender and a federal prosecutor in the Justice Department's National Security Division. But Patel almost certainly will face an explosive confirmation battle in the Senate. He's vowed to take on the deep state, as he calls it, and says a Trump Department of Justice would come after members of the media.

According to the New York Times, Patel's controversial track record includes being accused of nearly botching a high-stakes hostage rescue, wanting to shut down FBI headquarters in Washington, exaggerating his role in the Benghazi investigation, pushing Trump's Russia hoax as it's called narrative and promoting lies about fraud in the 2020 election.

Here is Kash Patel in his own words.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PATEL: They are creating a two-tier system of justice. That is the theme we have to run on to destroy.

They have bifurcated the system of justice in this country to weaponize it against people who pull the levers on voting day a certain way.

You now see that Mark Milley is what I call the kraken of the swamp. He makes Nancy Pelosi look like a goldfish when it comes to political swamp monsters.

[10:05:01]

I think what so many of these guys did, whether it's, you know, Brennan, Clapper, Comey, McCabe, Strzok, Barr, Haspel, Esper, what have you, I think there's a lot of rule and law breaking, and I don't know that it ever gets to the level of treason singularly with any of them, but what you have is a buildup of so many actions by the deep state that it becomes borderline treasonous to allow those people and their activities in a collective fashion to ever be applied to the United States.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: Meanwhile, Patel is also the author of a children's book series called, The Plot Against the King. Yes, this is real. It tells the tale of Kash, the distinguished discoverer, and, quote, King Donald, referring to Donald Trump.

Let's talk more about this. Joining me now is Democratic Congressman Gerry Connolly of Virginia. He's also on the House Foreign Affairs and Oversight Committees. Congressman, thank you so much for being with us.

First of all, your reaction -- yes, your reaction to Kash Patel as the possible head of the FBI.

REP. GERRY CONNOLLY (D-VA): I think it's one of the most dangerous appointments Trump has made to date. This man is delusional, invoking words like treason for people who served in the Justice Department or throughout law enforcement and this and the previous administration is very dangerous rhetoric. And he has no business getting anywhere near the office of director of FBI.

ACOSTA: And, Congressman, I mean, one of the reasons why we wanted to talk to you is because there are a lot of FBI agents and employees who live in your congressional district. So, you certainly have a stake in all of this, but, you know, as you know, some Republican lawmakers have voiced concerns but many of them enthusiastically back this pick of Kash Patel. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Do you have any reservations about Kash Patel serving in that role?

REP. MIKE LAWLER (R-NY): No. Donald Trump campaigned on reforming the FBI and the Department of Justice. So, I don't know why any of this is frankly surprising to people.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): I think Kash Patel is a very strong nominee to take on the partisan corruption in the FBI.

SEN. BILL HAGERTY (R-TN): There are serious problems that the FBI, the American public knows it, they expect to see sweeping change, and Kash Patel is just the type of person to do it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And, Congressman, one of the complaints that you hear from Republicans is that the Justice Department was weaponized under President Biden. Obviously, that's a lot of hyperbole, but are you concerned about the FBI being weaponized by the incoming Trump administration of Kash Patel's in charge there?

CONNOLLY: Absolutely. I think this is classic projection. When the Republicans warn about weaponization, they're actually warning us about their weapon. There's no evidence the FBI was weaponized under Biden. As a matter of fact, what's ironic about this is the FBI, anyone who knows the FBI, is a very conservative culture. Probably a majority of FBI agents voted Republican.

This is not some bastion of liberal, you know, haven protecting progressive and liberal voices in our government in a deep state fashion, quite the opposite. And it is destructive in the extreme to talk about, let's prosecute the prosecutors, let's investigate the investigators, to dismantle the premier law enforcement agency of the United States government. This is a really dangerous moment for our government and for the rule of law in America.

ACOSTA: And, Congressman, I mean, Trump wants to replace the current FBI director, Christopher Wray, who he appointed, and he appointed Chris Wray as the FBI director after he fired James Comey. What is this doing to the Federal Bureau of Investigation? And, I guess, what are your concerns about the long term health of the agency?

CONNOLLY: The whole point of a ten-year tenure after J. Edgar Hoover back in the Nixon years was to insulate the FBI director from the whoop and whoop of partisan politics and that there'd be sort of an overlap between administrations for an FBI director. To interrupt that for the second time, Trump having fired James Comey and now wanting to fire Christopher Wray, I think really is very disruptive to the orderly management of the FBI and to jurisprudence in America.

People have to be able to rely on the FBI for being a neutral source of investigation and of jurisprudence in America.

[10:10:04]

And I just think all of this upends that. And Americans really need to be very careful about supporting these kinds of appointments and the disruption they're going to lead to.

ACOSTA: And, Congressman, I have to ask you about the other big news of the morning, President Biden pardoning his son, Hunter, something that he said over and he would not do, something that the White House said over and over he would not do. What is your response to that?

CONNOLLY: I have a mixed response as a father myself. And as someone who knows Joe Biden, I can sympathize with his perspective that his son was, you know, subject to vigilante justice. I certainly witnessed that in Republican depositions of Hunter Biden and his attorney. But having said that, what other father in America has the power to pardon his son or daughter if they're convicted of a crime?

I really think we have to revisit the pardon power in the Constitution, and at the very least, I think, we've got to circumscribe it so that you don't get to pardon relatives, even if you believe passionately they're innocent or that their cause is just.

We just saw Donald Trump not only pardon, in his previous administration, his son-in-law's father, but now appoint him to be ambassador to France. This is an abuse of power, and I think it needs to be corrected.

ACOSTA: And so I guess if you had the opportunity to do it, and I suppose you don't because as a member of Congress, Congress can't block pardons, but, I mean, should Congress have the ability to block pardons? I mean, what possible reforms could come into play here to stop future presidents from doing this? As you know, presidents have pardoned relatives before.

CONNOLLY: Yes. Bill Clinton did, for example. I think we're probably going to have to amend the Constitution because the pardon power is so sweeping. We're going to have this, you know, kind of enumerate its limits, if there are going to be limits. I believe there should be. I don't believe the pardon power should be as broad as it is, and we can clearly see how it can be used and abused even with, you know, righteous cause. No other parent in America has the power to pardon their son or daughter for a crime.

ACOSTA: All right. Democratic Congressman Gerry Connolly of Northern Virginia, I understand you're battling cancer and just wanted to say it's great to see you doing so well. Thanks very much for your time.

CONNOLLY: Thank you. It's going well.

ACOSTA: All right. I really appreciate it.

All right, coming up, Donald Trump is slamming Joe Biden's pardon of his son, Hunter. We'll continue the conversation, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:00]

ACOSTA: President Biden's pardon for his son, Hunter, has outraged Republicans, including Donald Trump. The president-elect took to Truth Social to slam the decision, calling it a miscarriage of justice.

Let's discuss with CNN Political Commentators Maria Cardona and Shermichael Singleton. Shermichael, I mean, what do you make of -- I mean, Gerry Connolly was saying earlier, Democrat, Northern Virginia, that, you know, maybe the president should not have pardoned his own son, that perhaps this was not using the pardon power appropriately, but at the same time, when, you know, you can relate to a father wanting to do this for his son. What are your thoughts?

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I agree with the, Congressman, and I even said, I think on your show several months ago, that I was a bit dismayed when the White House continued to say that the president wouldn't pardon his son. I just thought it was odd. I mean, going all the way back to 2022, they were saying this.

The problem, however, with this, though, from my perspective, I get the reasoning why. My issue, Jim, is the constant -- well, President Biden is the moral arbiter, the ethical arbiter of maintaining our institutions. He respects the rule of law. And the president suddenly decided, well, maybe the rule of law applies for the most part, but not as it pertains to my son. And so there's a bit of a double standard.

I think a lot of voters out there look at this as, well, wait a minute here. Constantly, we were told that Donald Trump didn't respect anything, didn't respect institutions, didn't respect any of these things. And Joe Biden was the one who was different, was better, was going to bring us back to normalcy. And yet the president decided, well, screw those things, I'm only going to care about what's in the interest of my family. And that's my personal issue. I get it, but I just think it smells of a double standard.

ACOSTA: Maria, what do you think?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think that the president is doing what any father would do. And I think anyone who looks at this and, you know, looks at what they have gone through, looks at what Hunter Biden was accused of doing, and if his last name had not been Biden, he would not have been prosecuted for this at all.

So, I understand the president when he says that. I kind of wish that he had been so definitive early on saying, I will not pardon my son.

ACOSTA: And the press secretary as well.

CARDONA: Right, exactly. Because then this is where you get the blowback.

But to say that doing this, he doesn't respect institutions, that's -- I completely disagree with that. This is an institution. This is the law. He's not breaking the law by doing this.

ACOSTA: Yes. And, Shermichael, I mean, I think you and I've had this conversation about whether Hunter Biden shouldn't even been charged on these gun charges in the first place.

SINGLETON: As a big gun guy, I did not agree with the charges. And I even cited an example of an African-American guy, I think, in Louisiana or Mississippi, who was charged, went to prison, and the circuit court ultimately overturned that charge.

So, again, I get it, but for the president to say, I respect the rule of law, whatever occurs, I'm going to accept it, to suddenly come and say, well, I no longer accept it because I think there was a witch hunt against my son.

[10:20:00]

Well when Donald Trump used that language, Democrats, and I understand the political reasons why, will say this is why this guy should not be brought back to --

ACOSTA: But isn't there also this feeling, Shermichael, that the reason why they -- you know, the Justice Department was going after Hunter Biden was to sort of, you know, allay these concerns that the Department of Justice was being weaponized to go after Donald Trump? I mean, wasn't there that as well that was a part of the discussion?

SINGLETON: I mean, it's the president's DOJ. And I just find it hard to believe that the president is --

ACOSTA: I mean, it's kind of hard to say is the Justice Department didn't weaponize when Hunter Biden is being put through the ringer?

SINGLETON: Well, when I read the president's language saying that they're going after his son because his last name is Biden, well, I can point examples as it pertains to that gun charge in Delaware, where other individuals also had to deal with it. Again, I don't support it. So, I just think the president is incorrect in his argument.

ACOSTA: I do want to bring this up. Trump is also, asking about this, put this up on screen, what he called the January 6th hostages. I mean, does the pardon given by Joe to Hunter include the J6 hostages? First of all, I mean, for the love of God, can we stop calling them hostages? I mean, honestly, that is maybe one of the biggest lies other than the 2020 election stuff. I mean, let's just say that. Let's just put that out there.

CARDONA: They're not hostages.

ACOSTA: How can you complain about pardons -- how can anybody complain about pardons if Donald Trump is about to come into office and pardon the people who attacked the Capitol on January 6th? I have to assume that there are a lot of Americans out there, when they hear this, it just makes their blood boil.

CARDONA: And I think that's where a lot of the Democrats who look at this are saying, look, let's look at what the reality is here. Look at what the incoming president-elect has said he's going to do, is going to do. Look at all of the people that he has nominated, my goodness, and look at their backgrounds. And then to compare that, with Hunter Biden, I think a lot of Democrats and, frankly, I think a lot of independents are celebrating the fact that Joe Biden is pardoning his son for what he went through because the January 6 hostages, which Donald Trump has already said he's going to pardon, you just cannot compare the two.

SINGLETON: I think the American people had the opportunity to assess how significant this was to them, and they ultimately still decided to elect the former president, now president-elect.

ACOSTA: Do you think people voted to pardon the January 6th attackers?

SINGLETON: Jim, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that Donald Trump has made this argument throughout his campaign who he was going to pardon. And I'm simply saying the American people were well aware of that, and they still voted for the president-elect. So, I'm not sure what significance is weighed on their minds when compared to other issues.

CARDONA: That doesn't mean that it should be taken as a consideration.

SINGLETON: I do think, however, though, when you are attempting to draw this moral contrast between President Biden and President-elect Trump, that President Biden is somehow morally superior because he respects institutions and the rule of law after years of saying, I would not pardon my son to ultimately doing it, that's the issue. I think people do understand pardoning your son. I think people get it. The constant line, that's the problem.

ACOSTA: Yes. I mean, to me, you know, I get what you're saying, Shermichael, but at the same time, I just find it a bit rich to complain about Joe Biden pardoning his son, Hunter, which I mean, a lot of people would say, anybody would pardon their own son. And yet you're talking -- you're even contemplating pardoning people who attacked police officers and busted into the Capitol and did what they did on January six, and you could say, well, that was all sorted out in the election.

CARDONA: Right.

ACOSTA: It's just I think it's -- I think if and when Trump does this after coming into office, I'm not sure people are fully prepared for the consequences of that and what that's going to mean for the country.

CARDONA: And I think that is what people are going to find out, unfortunately. Because everything that Trump has said, and you're right, people understood this, but even according to you all, and according to all the exit data, people voted for Donald Trump because of the price of eggs, right? It wasn't because of this.

And so when people understand that this comes with, all the promises that Donald Trump made on the economy, which, by the way, I don't think he's going to be able to keep, then I think people are going to understand just how dangerous the president-elect is.

ACOSTA: And I want -- I got to wrap it up, but I also wonder what the congressman was saying at the end of the previous segment is if the pardon power is simply too sweeping in this country and maybe there are some reforms that are needed so you can't just willy-nilly pardon relatives and, you know, people who commit crimes on your behalf.

SINGLETON: I mean, again, I think most people would say if it were my child, I was in a similar situation, I would probably do the same. That's not my critique, Jim. My critique is, and we talked about this, why not say, I don't know what I'm going to do yet. I'm not going to put my thumb on the scale of justice. I'll wait until --

ACOSTA: Correct. That was a mistake.

SINGLETON: He didn't do that. And that's the problem for me, morally and ethically. You said you were going to do one thing and you decided not to. I get the reason behind why, but don't lie to the American people.

[10:25:00]

CARDONA: But then even now -- right. That's right. But even now, you look at, again, everyone who Donald Trump is nominating and you got to say there is no comparison here.

ACOSTA: Yes. All right, guys, thanks a lot, great discussion.

CARDONA: Thanks Jim.

ACOSTA: I wish we could keep going.

Coming up, tempers flare, flags planted, and now six-figure fines are coming after fists were flying in college football. I did that alliteration just fine. All right, we'll discuss, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Now to the Middle East. The Syrian military is intensifying its attacks against rebel groups. It's retaliation after a rebel coalition captured Syria's second largest city.

[10:30:02]

Video shows chaos in Aleppo as people scramble in the moments just before an explosion. Just a warning, the video you're about to watch is graphic.