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Concerns Wildfires Will Grow As Strong Winds Pick Up; California Homeowners Facing Insurance Crisis During Wildfires; Special Counsel Jack Smith Resigns From Justice Department; ATF Taking Lead In Determining Origin Of Palisades Fire; Biden Signs Major Disaster Declaration For California Fires; California Gov Orders Investigation Into Issue With Hydrants During Fires; Judge Slams Giuliani, Holds Him In Contempt. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired January 11, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:43]

ANNOUNCER: This CNN Breaking News.

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: You are in the CNN NEWSROOM, and I'm Jessica Dean in New York.

They are the most destructive wildfires in the history of Los Angeles, America's second largest city. And right now there is, quote, "very significant concern" the deadly fires will continue to grow tonight.

We know 11 people have lost their lives and officials expect that number to rise as cadaver dogs are being sent into the ashes to search for remains. FEMA has received more than 16,000 applications for assistance as residents who have lost everything are in desperate need of clothing, water, food, baby formula.

More than 100,000 residents are under evacuation orders. That number could also rise, and this comes as the coastal Palisades Fire is now threatening to move further east toward Bel Air and Brentwood. That's near the Getty center and UCLA.

California's Department of Forestry saying that more than 38,000 acres have been scorched, with more than 12,000 structures simply destroyed.

New today, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms and Explosives is taking the lead on determining the origin and the cause of the Palisades Fire.

And CNN has team coverage for you. CNN's Stephanie Elam is in L.A.'s Brentwood neighborhood. Anchor Erin Burnett is in the Pacific Palisades.

Let's start first with Erin.

Erin, I know you've been on the ground now for a couple of days. We're coming to you as this fire is threatening to move ever more eastward and toward more homes, more people's lives. What are you seeing?

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Jessica, you know, I mean, it is incredible the devastation that already is everywhere. Massive devastation. Thousands of people desperately trying to get back into areas that have been completely razed and destroyed, just to even have a glimpse of their homes, forced to leave with nothing. But at this hour, the great fear is that this fire, which is only about 8 percent or 9 percent contained and, you know, we can see even on streets here, you still see parts picking up on the ridges, the fire.

And I know Stephanie is seeing that in the distance in Brentwood as well, but that the winds are going to pick up potentially to hurricane force over these next hours and that that fire is going to spread. It is already the most devastating in Los Angeles history and could get unbearably worse. They have surged in nearly 4,000 extra firefighters just in these past hours to try to establish basically what's called a frontline.

When they say contained, Jessica, they don't mean that they've actually put the fire out. They mean that they have contained it or cordoned it off into a certain area. This Palisades Fire, which is the greatest threat that they say they face right now, is only about 8 percent or 9 percent contained and is threatening some of the most densely populated areas of L.A., including Brentwood and Encino, other areas that they think that that could spread to.

So that is the great fear that they have right now. They've been surging firefighting assets in there. Large DC-10s, C-130s, up to 5,000 or more gallons of fire retardant that they will basically drop at one point.

So you have this moment, Jessica, where you have an urgent, ongoing situation, a sense of anxiety and dread as evacuation orders will hit your phone for people. That is happening at the same time that they have already been hit by such devastating loss. A 9/11 like moment for America's second largest city. Sort of a sense of trauma, shock and devastation on the faces of everyone.

I went up in the air in a helicopter. I know we'll talk about that later, but the pilot had -- was flying over, you know, I got engaged here. And look, it's completely razed down. You mentioned that Getty Center. It is still standing. One of the most important art museums in America. Still standing. Next to it everything is razed. But all those areas under threat and had been under evacuation order in recent hours, Jessica, so simultaneously already devastation and tragedy for so many and this impending sense that much more is still to come.

Back to you.

DEAN: Yes. That's what's so striking about this, Erin, is that there is so much devastation already, and yet it is not over. It's still actively happening. And I know where you are in the Palisades neighborhood, people have been trying to get back in, see if anything is left. Just decades of memories gone.

[16:05:02]

What are you hearing from people who are trying to get back into their homes? BURNETT: There's these long lines, Jessica. It's really hard to see

when you drive into these neighborhoods. We have seen National Guard as well as LAPD. They are blocking off because you still have active fires up here. It is dangerous. It is also toxic air. And they will line up cars as well as there'll be, you know, a gaggle of people, sometimes 10, 20 or 30 people who come up on foot who are just desperately trying to get in to see what's left of their homes. And of course, nothing is left, but it's a home and it's a life. And people just want to be able to see it.

So that is one thing that's happening. And also the speed with which the fire moved. I mean, down the hill over the ridge, when it moved down quickly, people were in those moments essentially making their own decisions on when to evacuate as flames would rush down. They had no time. So they left, Jessica, with whatever they could. Sometimes it was passports, sometimes maybe one photo album, whatever, if they had a suitcase already packed.

But one family today that I saw, they are alive. They are out. They can't find a place to stay. They don't have anywhere to go. But their child, they were trying to have him go to a soccer game. And I know this sounds mundane, but this is life, right? This is the daily life. This is what defines a life. And they -- he couldn't go because he didn't have cleats and he didn't have clothes. He didn't have his jersey. They didn't even have underwear.

So people are literally left with nothing. And that barely even starting to comprehend what that means in their own lives. Even as flames are still spreading. So when they're lining up, and I know you're going to talk to Stephanie Elam in a moment in Brentwood near here, but they are lining up amidst this, underneath this giant red cloud of smoke and flame that is nearby, threatening the towns just next door to the Palisades -- Jessica.

DEAN: Yes, it is so devastating. And you talk about that little boy in soccer. I mean, you multiply that thousands and thousands of times, and that's what these people are facing.

BURNETT: Yes.

DEAN: It's so widespread. OK, Erin, thank you so much. I really appreciate that.

Let's bring in Stephanie Elam. As Erin mentioned, she is in L.A.'s Brentwood neighborhood. This is now to the east. This is the eastern flank of this fire as it moves eastward through Los Angeles.

Stephanie, tell us what you're seeing. I know a lot of eyes are on this because just the potential for more destruction is high.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And, Jessica, what you're seeing, maybe you can tell it on me, but the wind gusts just started to pick up right now. What we've seen out here in the last hour is that the wind has shifted directions here. You can see behind me. I'll move out the way so I can get a shot of that. That dark cloud means it's just found some fresh fuel. It just got darker. So there's something down there that is burning.

Those firefighters that are there in the area, I talked to them in front in that house. Those are firefighters from Utah that drove here a couple of nights ago. Oh, here we come. It looks like a spotter is coming through right now. And so they're guarding the back of those houses right there that are up against the canyon.

People move here because they like the interface with nature. But this is also the downside of that. Right? So the winds are picking up. That is blowing to a westerly direction. But then this big plume seems to be going southerly. So it's just the winds are changing everything. And so they're having to adapt. So while the fire retardant drops and the water drops were coming from the north, they've now switched and they've been flying in over us and then dropping.

The precision with which they are able to make these drops is incredible. Even with the winds, they are able to maneuver around power lines to get in there, get very low, drop the fire retardant or their water, and then get back up and get out the way and come back up over the mountain. It is spectacular to watch and it is crucial in firefighting because each time, like a C-130 from Cal Fire comes by, that's 4,000 gallons of fire retardant that is dropping.

It's somewhere between 702,000 gallons that those helicopters are dropping each time of water when they're coming through here. I talked to a couple of Los Angeles police officers, and they told me that they do believe most everyone here has left this area, which is good news because we've heard in some places where people aren't. But look at this. I know when people think of forests, they don't think of forest like this, but this is the idea of how California does forests, at least down in Southern California.

It's a lot of scrub brush. And we've had two wet winters. And that has allowed the scrub brush to build up. And that is just kindling. So if you look there in the distance at that fire there, you see how big those flames are even though we're on the other side of this canyon, they are just tearing through and using that to grow into these big flames. And that is what they are working to try to tamp down, stop those flames from growing.

And with this wind coming, they don't want any of those little embers to blow up, get caught up into the roofs of homes and trees and start bigger fires.

[16:10:03]

This is the ultimate concern here, and that's why they care so much about it, especially since all of this kindling now is super, super dry.

Here we go. I think a spotter is going to come through. I'll get out of the way so you can see it. But this is super dry. After two wet seasons it all grew up. And then for about almost I think about nine months now, we haven't had any real accountability or actionable rain. And so all of this is super dry. That's why this is so intense. And it's also really just bizarre because it's January. We don't normally get this kind of situation in this time of the year.

All new circumstances, all of this, Jessica, part of us having to deal with the effects of climate change and how things are not happening the way they used to, say, when I was a kid. It's just very different. And this is why it's precarious for all these people who now live up against this wildland interface.

DEAN: Yes, it's just as you're describing it, just a perfect storm for absolute catastrophe, which is what we are seeing play out. And yet when you see those planes flying over and we know the firefighters who are working, they're just heroes that are racing in to try to save everything and everyone they can in these horrible conditions.

The other thing, Stephanie, I know you live in L.A. It's your home. I think sometimes people don't think about L.A. is so spread out, but all the little hamlets, all the little neighborhoods are actually quite tight. A lot of people in L.A. really do know their neighbors, and they do know their community. And so I would imagine you're talking to people in your own community, and it really drives, you know, drives this, that it's just -- it's impacting just these huge swaths of people who live and work and raise their kids and their families in these areas that are just getting wiped out.

ELAM: Yes, it's one of these events that everyone in Los Angeles County is impacted. Even if you're not worried about your home burning down because everyone knows somebody who is going through that. Kids at school, they have friends who've lost -- their classmates have lost their homes. Right? They have teachers that may have lost their homes. You know, people who are from work. Everyone here knows it.

And also throughout a lot of L.A. County, you can smell the smoke. The air quality is so bad that even far away from the flames, you see people wearing masks, something people became used to during the COVID emergency. But now they're doing it because the air quality is so bad. So everyone here is impacted. And sometimes you have these moments where you see the best of humanity come out. So people are checking on their neighbors. They're reaching out and helping each other.

The number of people who are texting people, they don't know how spread out L.A. is, but they're texting me like, are you OK? Where's your home? Are you fine? People continue to do that. So, you know, it's similar to like, you know, I worked across the street from the World Trade Center on 9/11 in New York City. It's similar to that environment where people are looking to help one another through this time because this event here is going to change Los Angeles forever, and it's going to change Angelenos.

And there's no way around that. This is going to live in the collective psyche of the people who live here now.

DEAN: Yes, and I think that's so important for everyone out there to remember. This changes L.A. forever, and we are watching it happen before our very eyes.

Stephanie Elam, thank you so much for that reporting. And find out how you can help the wildfire victims in the Los Angeles

area. You can go to CNN.com/Impact. You can also text Wildfires to 707070 to donate.

Still ahead, we've got much more coverage on the four active wildfires swallowing up entire communities in America's second largest city. We're going to talk to a woman who lost her home in the Palisades fire after being denied fire insurance.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:17:54]

DEAN: Today Los Angeles Mayor Karen Bass urged residents living in vulnerable areas to follow all the evacuation orders, while the strong Santa Ana Winds that fuel these fires, destroying homes and businesses, are expected to flare up again.

Meteorologist Chad Myers is in the CNN Weather Center looking at these conditions.

And Chad, these winds, the Santa Anas, are what's driving so much of this. Walk us through what you're watching, what you're seeing.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Really it's the setup that we've had all week, Jessica. High pressure, let's call it north of Las Vegas, because you know where that is. And then a low pressure near Baja, California. And because those two were so strong but oppositely opposed, the wind came through the canyons. And that's how we got here. This is how any Santa Ana happens.

But the fact that this was an 85 to 100-mile-per-hour Santa Ana Wind event means that the high was too high and the low was too low, and that pressure just ripped right through those canyons and right over the mountains. So we are in the 10 to 15-mile-per-hour range right now, but by 4:00, 5:00 local time, those numbers are probably going to be 20 to 30 miles per hour and then by overnight tonight, we could go all the way to 40.

So this is the issue we're talking about. This is the issue we're having is that the wind is going to continue to go up and then go down again Sunday night, but back up again Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. So there's an awful lot going on here. We have more days of this to come. This isn't over. There's no rain in the forecast. The drought continues.

DEAN: Yes. And it's that you mentioned the drought. How dry has it been in the L.A. area?

MYERS: You know, we should have four inches of rainfall right now by the time we're talking about the water year starting last year, going to the middle of when it stops raining. So there should be four inches on the ground. There's been less than 100th of an inch in most spots, less than a 10th in every spot. So it rained a lot right where Stephanie Elam was. Within five miles of that location, I was standing in a flash flood 10 months ago.

[16:20:01]

Flash flooding right there. Water coming down the canyons. That was the end of the rain. It never rained again. The things died, the grasses dried out, and now those grasses are on fire. Because we had so much rain we had everything growing. And then it stopped raining and it all died.

DEAN: And then we have the issue of the air quality, which is not only impacting those directly in the line of the fire, but really throughout the entire area.

MYERS: Right. And with the wind shifting directions, here's what the smoke is going to look like. It actually is going to get significantly better. Now it's going to blow all of that smoke back into the Pacific, which we want. For the past couple of days. We had some swirling winds here in the valley, and we've had an inversion, which is just like taking the lid of your pot, on your stove and putting a lid on all of the steam stays in.

Well, we had a lid on top of our atmosphere and all of the smoke stayed down there at the surface. And it's not a camp fire. This does not smell like you're burning a nice little piece of pine or some little thing in your fireplace. These are -- I saw a break shop go up so we have brake fluid burning. You have brakes themselves burning. I saw, you know, even your LP is made from petroleum.

The old 45, your old LP, all these things that are coming out of these burning, incinerating buildings. This is what the toxic soup they're talking about. This is not just being able to say, oh, the wind is coming my way from my campfire, I'm going to stand over here and let the wind go that way. They cannot get out of the way. This is just stuck right there in the L.A. valley.

DEAN: And it is so dangerous.

Chad Myers, thank you so much for walking us through that.

Let's take a look at some live aerials of the Palisades Fire that's now threatening even more homes as it moves farther east there in Los Angeles, the estimated economic cost of these wildfires standing now at close to $50 billion. That's according to JPMorgan Chase. And for many people they simply don't have insurance that's going to cover their losses here.

According to recent data, insurance companies declined to renew policies for 2.8 million homeowners in California between 2020 and 2022, and that includes more than 500,000 homes in Los Angeles County.

Joining us now, someone who, unfortunately and tragically, is having to live this out in her own life. Peggy Holter was denied private insurance coverage on the contents of her condo. She just lost her home in that Palisades Fire.

Peggy, hi. Thank you for being here. I am so sorry for what you're going through.

PEGGY HOLTER, LOST HOME IN PALISADES FIRE: Thank you. It's just been difficult. Part of the problem was that we thought, I thought that my place would never burn because I sat -- it was right underneath the reservoir. And every chopper that wanted to fill up with water had to go there and pretty much fly over my bedroom. And this didn't happen this time. And we discovered the day later that the reservoir was dry. So on top of all of the other problems, there was no water to put it out.

DEAN: It is just -- I can't begin to comprehend what it's like to lose all of your things, your memories, your sense of place, your home. How are you processing this? And I think you're staying with your son, is that right?

HOLTER: That's correct. I'm grateful because on the next night after -- we were evacuated, we looked across and there was my son's whole street and the area was lit up in the Sunset Fire, which fortunately they put out very quickly. So for a moment we thought there was no place at all to go.

DEAN: It's just -- and I think for so many people, you know this, they don't have any place to go right now. And that's already on top of a housing shortage that is acute there in Los Angeles.

Walk us through just the logistics of all of this. I know you -- did you previously have insurance in place. Why was it not renewed? Help people understand what that experience has been like.

HOLTER: Well, as a condo, you have a condo insurance policy which covers, you know, all of the units from the outside and the common property which we had and then about two years ago, it was stopped and we didn't know what to do. But then we all got individual insurance policies, and then beginning of this year, we finally got a California fair plan insurance policy. And then we had to get new policies to cover our stuff inside.

And the insurance company told me that my roof was no good and therefore they denied me. But you know, my roof is the same as every other house in the condo.

[16:25:05]

And yes, they need to be replaced. But the fact is, I have no insurance whatsoever on the inside of my house.

DEAN: And so what do you do now?

HOLTER: I don't know. I guess we'll wait and see how many -- how much money there is from the state. And I don't know, I just don't know.

DEAN: It's just -- I can't -- I know that this has to feel like some horrible dream. I mean, to your point, the reservoir was right behind you. You never, you know, you just never thought this would be you.

HOLTER: Exactly. And, you know, there have been little fires in the Palisades where I live, but they were always put out very promptly. And this was -- we were -- we started to evacuate down Palisades Drive and we got halfway down and there was just cars all the way up. So we turned around. We were quite lucky that we were allowed to turn around because a lot of the people is those who've been following this know that this where Sunset and Palisades drive come together. There were cars, thousands of cars, hundreds of cars, whatever, stacked up that people had to abandon.

DEAN: And Peggy, one of the things I've just been struck by here on the East Coast is just the amount of people who know someone who've been affected, are trying to help them, or trying to check in on them. Just people. I've just seen a lot of neighbors and friends trying to help their neighbors and friends. Has that been something you've seen or experienced?

HOLTER: That's true. I have got -- I've heard from people that from all my life, from grade school, from high school, from college, from all the stories that I've done. It's been really reassuring but ultimately you have to do it yourself. That's the thing.

DEAN: And so now you say you'll wait and you'll see just kind of how this all shakes out with what kind of -- the payments might look like from the state, from FEMA. Are you confident you can get back on your feet?

HOLTER: Well, I kind of have to, don't I? You know? I mean, you have to be confident and you have to try. And I have, you know, two wonderful children. And I think that they will be helpful and it will be terrific, you know, no matter what. I know that I'm supposed to be safe, but I'm trying to be sort of, I don't know, not sad.

DEAN: Well, I think it's OK to be sad in this situation. Do you worry at all about the insurance piece of it all just more broadly. I think there are going to be a lot of people in your shoes.

HOLTER: Yes, well, in our case, there are 36 units in the complex, and we were insured for $20 million. Now, you figure out that that's most of those condos have sold for a million three in the last year. So that's not anywhere near a million three. And that would be if you wanted to take your money out. And I don't think you can unless everybody does.

And so, yes, I don't know exactly what I'm going to do so I'm just going to wait and figure it out as it happens.

DEAN: Yes. Well, we wish you --

HOLTER: But I think I'm fortunate, as I do have a son, the house.

DEAN: Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm so glad you can be with him.

Peggy, thank you so much. We really -- we wish you all the best. And we hope for much better times. But thank you for joining us.

HOLTER: You're welcome. Thank you for having me. DEAN: Still ahead, crews working around the clock to contain the

wildfires, threatening tens of thousands of additional homes in Los Angeles County. We're now learning the ATF will take the lead in trying to figure out what was the cause of the Pacific Palisades fire. We're going to have an update for you on that ahead.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:33:18]

DEAN: Breaking news tonight out of Washington, D.C., where Special Counsel Jack Smith has resigned from the Justice Department.

This latest development comes amid a legal fight to prevent Attorney General Merrick Garland from releasing the special counsel's report into Donald Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election.

Our Evan Perez is joining us by phone.

Evan, what more can you tell us about this?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (VIA TELEPHONE): Well, Fred (sic), we had anticipated that Jack Smith would be leaving soon. Obviously, he was going to -- he had previously said he was going to leave before the president-elect takes office on January 20th. And we knew the office was winding down, shutting down essentially.

So this notice that he resigned, effective yesterday, came as a footnote in this filing that the Justice Department put into the federal court in Fort Pierce, the one who Judge Cannon, Aileen Cannon, who has been seeing the -- overseeing the classified documents investigation.

And so she has a three-day hold right now prohibiting the department from releasing the Jack Smith report on these two investigations. That hold, by the way, Jessica, is expiring tomorrow or Monday morning, depending on when you count the -- the days, right, from the day that she issued it.

So we're waiting to see whether either she or the appeals court in Atlanta rules again in the -- sometime between tomorrow or Monday that allows the Justice Department to release at least one of those two reports, the one on January 6th. And then the classified documents report would remain on under wraps while that continues.

[16:34:59]

But look, it's -- it's been a long fight. And right up to the final days before Donald Trump takes office, the -- the legal fighting is continuing -- Jessica?

DEAN: It certainly is. And as you mentioned, we'll -- we'll wait to see what the next piece of this is. While we have you, I also want to talk about our breaking news, Evan, because we're learning the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms is leading the investigation into the Palisades Fire.

And tell us more about what you're learning on that front as they begin their investigation.

PEREZ: Yes. Well, what we're told is that the ATF has had some -- some of its experts, it's fire experts on the scene assisting. And so what this formally does is it puts the ATF as the lead agency for one of those five fires that is that is burning down there in southern California.

This is the Palisades Fire, the fire that really was one of the most explosive, one of the most destructive, basically wiping out almost all of the Pacific Palisades the town.

And so what the ATF will do is, you know, we know that they have some experts from its National Response Team, the, the NRT, that, for instance, Jessica worked on the Maui Fire. They helped investigate the origins of that fire. And so they are expected to join in in this investigation in Los Angeles.

Now, you know, obviously, the -- the fact that the law enforcement is involved doesn't mean that they've determined something -- you know, a crime has been committed.

They're -- they're there to see whether, for instance, if there was some kind of natural cause, lightning, which is on -- we don't think that's what it is right now. But it could be power line failures, it could be arson. All of those things will be a part of this investigation by the ATF.

They're really good at their jobs. And I've seen them work different scenes before. And so I think the people there will at least maybe get some answers as to how this tragedy unfolded -- Jessica?

DEAN: Yes, I think people would love some answers about this.

Evan Perez, thank you so much for that reporting. We appreciate it.

President Biden remains in contact with local leaders, including California Governor Gavin Newsom and Los Angeles Mayor Karen Bass, as these wildfires continue to spread.

CNN's Julia Benbrook is joining us from the White House.

Julia, what more can you tell us about the federal government and President Biden and their relationship with what's going on in California right now?

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: President Joe Biden continues to be briefed by senior staff about the ongoing efforts to suppress those wildfires in Los Angeles, as well as how the federal government is assisting in those efforts. There was a briefing yesterday at the White House that both California

Governor Gavin Newsom and Los Angeles Mayor Karen Bass took part in virtually.

And during that, Biden said that his team will continue 24/7 to work with state and local officials. But Jessica, he's making this promise with just over a week left in office.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're going to make sure California has every possible resource to fight these fires and help survivors.

This is not going to be over, even when all the fires are out. It's just going to be the beginning. And the change in insurance policy in California for these modest homes, as well as these very expensive homes and businesses.

So we're going to be around a long while to go to help the federal government and the mayor as well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BENBROOK: And Biden says that his team has been briefing the incoming administration that they know all of the steps that this administration is taking.

The president has directed the federal government to cover 100 percent of the state's cost in this initial response. That's for the first 180 days.

And FEMA has started their Critical Needs Assistance Program. That's an initial one-time payment of $770 for initial needs like prescriptions, water, gas, formula, things like that.

The administration is also making air tankers and firefighting helicopters available as well.

And then just within the last hour, Governor Newsom announced that he is doubling the amount of California National Guardsmen that are on the ground. That's going to bring it to more than 1,500 servicemembers, helping out with this directly.

And Newsom added that he is grateful for their continued bravery and commitment to the service to others -- Jessica?

DEAN: Julia Benbrook, at the White House, thank you for that update.

Still ahead, what went wrong? We're going to look into the multiple factors that have contributed to these fires becoming so destructive.

[16:39:43]

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DEAN: California Governor Gavin Newsom ordered an independent investigation into what went wrong with fire hydrants, as several fires exploded and overwhelmed firefighters and communities within L.A. County.

CNN's Nick Watt investigated the biggest factors that may have affected that response. Here's what he found.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Did it really have to be this bad?

No one was caught unawares here. Strong Santa Ana winds were forecast, and after months without significant rain, bone dry vegetation was obviously primed to burn.

Number one, were there enough boots on the ground to fight the flames? Easy answer, no.

ANTHONY MARRONE, CHIEF, LOS ANGELES COUNTY FIRE DEPARTMENT: We don't have enough fire personnel in L.A. County between all of the departments to handle this.

WATT: In a memo two years ago, L.A. City's Fire Chief Kristin Crowley said more staff were needed with increased risk due to climate change and increased construction in danger zones.

Just last month, Chief Crowley told Mayor Karen Bass that "eliminating some civilian positions and cutting $7 million from firefighters' overtime severely limited the departments capacity to prepare for, train for and respond to large scale emergencies."

[16:45:14]

Clearing brush, which is basically fuel, is crucial and mandatory. Chief Crowley says budget cuts mean they couldn't inspect to make sure the clearing was actually happening.

MAYOR KAREN BASS (D-LOS ANGELES): There were no reductions that were made that would have impacted the situation that we were dealing with over the last couple of days.

WATT: Number two, was there enough water to fight the flames? Again, easy answer. No.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

LOS ANGELES COUNTY DISPATCH: Multiple homes threatened. I need about two or three water tenders in there were some engines. We got dry hydrants.

(END AUDIO FEED)

WATT: Three huge water tanks help boost pressure in the hydrants around here but --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were not able to fill the tanks fast enough.

WATT: Because demand was overwhelming and the Palisades is at the end of the city water system with narrower pipes with reduced flow.

Some hydrants ran dry at absolutely critical moments, like 3:00 am Wednesday.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

LOS ANGELES COUNTY DISPATCH: We've lost most of the hydrant pressure.

(END AUDIO FEED)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Why was there no water in the hydrants, Governor?

GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): It's all literally --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Is it going to be different next time?

NEWSOM: It has to be.

WATT: But experts tell CNN there's not a city water system in the world that could have flawlessly handled this.

JONATHAN PARFREY, FORMER COMMISSIONER, LOS ANGELES DEPARTMENT OF WATER & POWER: Now that we're in the 21st century, I think we have a new climate and we need to rethink our infrastructure.

WATT: Number three, are building codes to blame. Yes and no.

Anything built after 2008 is subject to some of the strictest fireproofing codes in the country. But only about 5 percent of structures around here were built after 2010, according to Cal Fire. And those codes generally do not require retrofitting.

So the new mall and Palisades Village is OK and the 100-year-old mall just across the road is gone. And acres of devastation with the odd new build home still standing.

Number four, power line problems. Six years ago, the devastating Woolsey Fire just east of here was lit, like many wildfires, by sparks from above ground power lines in a Santa Ana wind.

PARFREY: You could have 80-mile-an-hour winds but, if there's no spark, there's no fire.

WATT: We don't know what ignited this week's fires but, according to Whisker Labs, there were multiple power line faults and sparks around the Palisades, Eaton and Hurst fires in the hours before they broke out. If power lines are below ground, they cannot start fires. The town of

Paradise, destroyed in 2018 by fire, right now rebuilding with the power lines underground.

Now this was, as some officials say, a perfect storm. The high winds meant they couldn't fight this fire from the air for those first crucial hours. And in terrain like this, without air assets, you have a hand tied behind your back.

BASS: Rest assured, we will absolutely do an evaluation to look at what worked, what didn't work, and to correct or to hold accountable anybody, department, individual, et cetera.

WATT (on camera): So California's governor, Gavin Newsom, has ordered investigations into why the water ran dry in the hydrants here in Pacific Palisades, right at a very crucial time.

More interestingly, perhaps is L.A. city's fire chief, Chief Crowley, has said categorically now, on our air, that the budget cuts to her department absolutely had an impact on their ability to fight these fires.

One example she gave, they don't have enough mechanics to repair the 100 or so pieces of equipment that are currently in the shop that they could have used for this.

Nick Watt. CNN, Pacific Palisades, California.

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DEAN: Still ahead, a judge rips into Rudy Giuliani, calling his conduct, quote, "outrageous and shameful" as she holds him in contempt in connection to a defamation lawsuit over the 2020 election. What's next for the disgraced former mayor?

[16:49:26]

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DEAN: A federal judge is holding Rudy Giuliani in contempt of court after calling his conduct "outrageous and shameful."

Giuliani has now been held in contempt twice for his actions relating to the 2020 election defamation case involving two Georgia election workers.

The judge, also slamming the former Trump lawyer for continuing to portray himself as a victim in this case and not responding to previous court orders.

CNN's Katelyn Polantz has details.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN CRIME & JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Rudy Giuliani was held in contempt of court for the second time in one week. This time, because he was not stopping, spreading lies about the 2020 election.

What has happened to Giuliani in court in Washington, D.C., is that a year ago, a jury found that he had defamed two Georgia election workers for repeating the false statement that they had stolen votes against Donald Trump in the 2020 election. That was false. And he was found to need to pay them $150 million for defamation.

After that, five and a half months later, he went on his broadcast this past November and kept repeating the things that he said about them. Essentially, the same lies about the 2020 election, saying them again.

And so what happened in court was that Giuliani had to appear and the judge had to put in place some sort of punishment so that he wouldn't continue to do this.

[16:55:03]

What she decided -- this is Judge Beryl Howell of the D.C. district court. She decided that he would have to swear to the court within 10 days that he acknowledges the facts, the true facts about the 2020 election, that it was not stolen.

And that he has reviewed a great deal of the record investigations, even about what happened in Georgia, finding that there weren't votes that they were -- that were stolen.

And if he doesn't do that, he's going to be fined $200 a day. And if he continues to violate court orders, he could eventually, at some point, be put into jail.

What Judge Beryl Howell told him in the court hearing -- took about three hours to get through all of the proceedings. He even took the stand for a brief period of time.

She told him that his behavior toward these two women, Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss, was outrageous and shameful. And it took real chutzpah for Giuliani to continue to play the victim in this court case, where he was so clearly in the wrong.

He did, though, say he was 80 years old. And at one point, his attorney pointed out that he actually believes these falsehoods, that he continues to claim about the 2020 election.

But now there's more court orders in place to get him to stop.

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DEAN: Katelyn Polantz, for us in Washington, thank you for that reporting.

Coming up, the fuel for these devastating fires is expected to ramp up yet again when winds likely intensify. Firefighters racing to save communities still at risk. Our live coverage continues.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

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