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Trump Addresses World Leaders At Davos Economic Forum; Trump's Refugee Ban Leaves At Least 2,000 Afghans In Limbo; ICC Seeks Arrest Warrants For Two Taliban Leaders; Trump Moves To Declassify Files On JFK, RFK & MLK Assassinations. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired January 23, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:37]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington. Thanks so much for joining me today on CNN NEWSROOM.

And let's get right to the news.

In a wide-ranging speech, classic Trump style, the president addressed business and world leaders for the first time since returning to office. Trump, who spoke remotely to the World Economic Forum in Switzerland known as Davos, vowed to pressure OPEC to cut oil prices, falsely claimed he can force interest rates to go down, and threaten countries to bring their business to America, or pay a heavy price. The president also held back no punches when speaking about the Biden administration, calling it an inept group of people all in front of Americas adversaries and allies.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: President Biden totally lost control of what was going on in our country. My message to every business in the world is very simple, come make your product in America and we will give you among the lowest taxes of any nation on earth. From the standpoint of America, the E.U. treats us very, very unfairly, very badly. I really would like to be able to meet with president Putin soon and get that war ended. And that's not from the standpoint of economy or anything else. It's from the standpoint of millions of lives are being wasted.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Of course, we should remind the president that Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022.

CNN business editor at large Richard Quest is in Davos.

A lot from this speech stood out to me, and I'm sure to you as well, his claim that he could demand that interest rates simply go down now, doubling and a half his demand of NATO allies in terms of their defense spending from 2 percent to 5 percent, but and clearly doubling down on tariffs. I just wonder, how did leaders there respond to this?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR AT LARGE: With something approaching worry, concern, and does he really mean it? The general mantra at this year's Davos about Donald Trump, Jim, is it's a -- it's a -- it's a -- it's a phrase everybody can use and it's a safe harbor phrase. It is his bark is worse than his bite. Let's see what he does. Let's chill on tariffs.

Well, what he did today was he threw down the gantlet. He basically said I'm going to do this. Now, we know that a lot of it will never get done. We realize that those tariffs may never fully get implemented or that 5 percent is a number picked out of the air, but the damage has already been done. The disruption is underway. The uncertainty has been created. And in that environment, and he started the debate. It's a bit I know you're going to be talking later.

It's a bit like the birthright constitutional argument in the U.S. that a judge has just ruled against. It doesn't matter. The judge rules, it doesn't matter, it's not possible. It's now on the agenda, 5 percent is a number that people are talking about for NATO.

SCIUTTO: I wonder what they base their sense that his bark is worse than his bite given. I mean, for instance, if you look at his domestic moves here, he pardoned January 6th rioters who attacked police officers. And you may remember prior to that, there were some who said, well, he's not going to go that far. He is going quite far on all these moves and promises or threats, even domestically and internationally.

So I wonder where world leaders, business leaders there get their confidence that this is just bluster.

QUEST: I think part of that is wishful thinking. Part of it is based on precedent from what they saw in the first Trump administration. But I also think you're spot on. I think that they have not factored in that there that the president has come into power knowing how to pull all the levers of power and being willing to do the unthinkable just to get the process begun.

And so, I mean, because what's happening, Jim, is the abnormal is being normalized. So it's okay to threaten Canada and Mexico, two close allies, or Denmark over Greenland. And if we say it often enough, well, it becomes the received wisdom that this is the policy. That's what we saw.

Again, by the way, I counted it up. There were about 15 to 18 topics raised in today's speech. It was a fuselage of this -- this -- this -- this -- this that left everybody just sort of wondering what they, what they'd heard and what could they believe and what could they not take away from it.

[15:05:13]

Now we will wait to see. But I have every confidence that most of what he's promised to do, he will in some shape or form, begin the process.

SCIUTTO: I think folks should be prepared for that at a very minimum.

Richard Quest, good to have you there. I look forward to hearing more about your conversations on the sidelines. Thanks so much for joining.

QUEST: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, the administration is moving quickly on its immigration agenda with a slew of executive orders effectively closing the country to migrants and asylum seekers alike. One of those executive orders could leave thousands of Afghan refugees in limbo now, individuals, we should note, already approved through the vetting process, many of them men and women who risked their lives to help the U.S. during the war in Afghanistan, whose lives are now in danger.

The order, which labels the admission of refugees as, quote, detrimental to the interests of the United States, suspends the refugee admissions program for at least 90 days. Question then, will it get extended again?

To discuss this and more, I'm joined now by Congressman Seth Moulton. He's a Democrat from Massachusetts, a veteran of the Iraq war and a member of the House Armed Services Committee.

Congressman, thanks so much for taking the time.

REP. SETH MOULTON (D-MA): Jim, good to see you.

SCIUTTO So this is a quite a move by the president given, as you know, that there is broad bipartisan support for particularly these Afghan veterans who fought alongside U.S. forces, face genuine risk from the Taliban, risk to their lives, that they are being halted now.

Can you help explain to our viewers what the impact of this is given -- given especially how long this process is and how long these people had to wait to get where they are now?

MOULTON: Yeah. And let me begin, Jim, by just making your point again, which is that this is a bipartisan issue, even in this very hyperpartisan time in American politics, Democrats and Republicans want to support refugees who are legal immigrants there. They're the ones we want to come to the United States.

And in this case, they're our allies. They're our friends there. They're the people who fought alongside us on the ground in Afghanistan, who risked their lives not just for Afghanistan, but for the United States of America. And when the troops went there, as I did in Iraq, and asked these Afghans to work with us, we promised them we would get them out.

So this is dangerous, not just for these Afghans who could well be hunted down by the Taliban. It's dangerous for troops. American troops in future conflicts, because when we go somewhere else and ask for local help, people might say, we can't trust you. We can't trust you, America.

And, Jim, I might not be standing here today if not for some of the translators that I depended on for my life to help protect my platoon that constantly fed us information, interpreted events, gave us intelligence. They're critical in these fights, and we're really risking American lives by this, too.

The administration says this is temporary, that this is just for 90 days. Do you believe that, given how blanket this new president's view is of the entire asylum process?

MOULTON: No, I don't believe it for a second. And that's one of the fundamental problems with what President Trump is doing, is he's just putting these blanket orders out, that part of his immigration agenda has already been declared unconstitutional against the very constitution that he swore to protect and defend just a few days ago.

And as a result, it's creating chaos. Some of his hiring freezes, for example, are cutting off the V.A. from just being able to hire nurses to take care of veterans like myself, who count on the V.A. for our health care. What Trump is doing with these blanket orders is pursuing a political agenda at the expense of people who just count on the government. He's creating chaos, and that's not good for anybody.

SCIUTTO: Your former fellow congressman, Republican Mike Waltz, was, as you know, a supporter of bringing Afghan allies home after the U.S. withdrawal. He's now, of course, Trumps national security advisor. Do you see him as a channel to convince the president otherwise?

MOULTON: I certainly hope so. And I know Mike personally enough as a fellow veteran, not just a fellow congressman, to know that he supports bringing these Afghan heroes to the United States. But the problem for him is that he works in the Trump administration, where dissent is not allowed. It's not encouraged. And so, he's got to be careful when he disagrees with the boss.

It's -- Jim, it's the complete opposite of what great leaders do. You know, Doris Kearns Goodwin wrote the book "Team of Rivals" about how Lincoln wanted people in the room who would debate and disagree with him, because that achieves the best policy.

[15:10:05]

Trump wants conformists. It's like -- it's like Vladimir Putin, who only surrounds himself with people who tell him good news, or Xi Jinping. And in China, it's really like an authoritarian regime. And that's the difficult position that Mike Waltz is in right now.

SCIUTTO: Yeah, yeah. I mean, listen, people say that one reason Putin made the decision to go into to Ukraine and thought he was going to win quickly was because his commanders weren't sending accurate information up the chain to him. They were too scared to.

Just in the last few minutes, the nomination for Pete Hegseth, Pete Hegseth for defense secretary advanced in the Senate. As it turned out, just two Republican senators voted no, Collins and Murkowski. You're, of course, on the Senate Armed Services committee.

Do you really believe he is qualified to lead the Defense Department?

MOULTON: Just on the House Armed Services Committee, so I don't get to vote on this. SCIUTTO: Sorry.

MOULTON: But I -- let me just say this, Jim, I know a lot of Republicans who know the truth, that he's not a good person, he's not reliable, he's not trustworthy, and he knows nothing about this job. He is by no means someone who is qualified to be confirmed for the defense secretary.

But the problem is, these Republicans are all scared of Trump. So great praise to Collins and Murkowski for having the simple political courage to vote the truth, because a lot of Republicans will not.

SCIUTTO: Yesterday, Republicans in Congress invited Stewart Rhodes, who's the founder of the Oath Keepers, to Capitol Hill for meetings. Rhodes, as you know, was sentenced to 18 years for seditious conspiracy for planning his role in planning the January 6th attack on the Capitol.

You know as well as I do that Republican lawmakers were just as concerned for their safety and their staff safety as Democratic lawmakers were on that day and were also hiding in their offices, and many of them publicly condemned the attack in the days and weeks after. And only since then has the politics changed.

Tell us about the consequences of this of Congress welcoming those who attacked the Capitol in -- back into the Capitol today?

MOULTON: Well, let's be clear. It's not Congress. It's a few hypocritical Republicans who want to entertain people who assault cops, criminals who belong in prison. And not long ago, the Republican Party was the party of law and order, the party that was upholding our basic American values, one of which is that nobody is above the law.

But that's not the party of Trump. Trump thinks that he is above the law. He thinks that he and his friends can do whatever the hell they want. And all these Republicans are just blindly following him because they're more concerned about their political futures than about doing the right thing for our country. It's sad.

SCIUTTO: On another topic, before we go, the war in Ukraine. At Davos, President Trump said today that, quote, efforts to secure a peace settlement between Russia and Ukraine are now underway. Do you trust President Trump to push for a settlement that is fair to Ukraine, and that protects Ukraine's sovereignty and safety from a further invasion down the line? MOULTON: No, because the last time President Trump was in a

conversation like this, he said he trusted Vladimir Putin more than our own intelligence agencies. So Trump is just not a trustworthy person. And that's not a partisan comment. That's just a statement of fact.

And anyone who supports Ukraine, anyone who supports freedom fighters over Vladimir Putin's rule of aggression and oppression, know that we can't trust Trump to actually carry this negotiation fairly.

SCIUTTO: Congressman Seth Moulton, thanks so much for joining us today and sharing your views.

MOULTON: Good to see you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Well, this just in to CNN. The Senate has now voted to confirm John Ratcliffe by a vote of 74 to 25 as CIA director, giving Donald Trump now his second confirmed cabinet member. And as we just reported, Pete Hegseth's nomination to lead the department of defense is advancing towards a final confirmation vote. Republican Senators Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins joined Democratic lawmakers opposing the nomination. However, he does appear to have the votes to move forward.

Lauren Fox joins me from outside Senator Murkowski's office on Capitol Hill.

Ultimately, despite her wide ranging statement opposing his nomination, is he all but confirmed at this point?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. I mean, obviously the Senate still has to finish a series of procedural votes. But what we saw today is that the large majority of Senate Republicans moved forward with advancing Pete Hegseth's nomination. Now, I do think it is really notable that two women who are in the United States Senate in the Republican conference, Senator Lisa Murkowski, a Republican from the state of Alaska who has broken with Trump before, as well as Senator Susan Collins of the state of Maine, both decided that they would vote against moving forward with this nomination.

[15:15:16]

And, you know, both of their statements were really wide-ranging. Senator Collins really focused more on the fact that she said she still had deep concerns about what Hegseth had said in the past about women serving in combat roles in the military and what he tried to say in his hearing. She said that that continued to be something that gave her pause. Meanwhile, Senator Lisa Murkowski argued that she just did not believe that Hegseth was qualified for the job. And she said there were also questions about his personal life that gave her pause here.

She said, quote: Above all, I believe that character is the defining trait required of the secretary of defense and must be prioritized without compromise. The leader of the department of defense must demonstrate and model the standards of behavior and character we expect for all service members and Mr. Hegseth nomination to the role poses significant concerns that I cannot overlook. Given the global security environment we're operating in, it's critical that we confirm a secretary of defense. However, I regret that I am unable to support Mr. Hegseth.

Now, we should note that Hegseth has denied any excessive drinking problem. He also has denied other allegations against him. But we should also note that it is significant that these two Republican women decided not to advance his nomination, knowing probably that this was going to still go forward, because, as we saw when Senator Joni Ernst, initially, after her very first meeting with Hegseth, expressed any kind of concern, she really faced an onslaught of backlash from, you know, Donald Trump supporters on the Internet and in social media.

I think it's going to be really interesting to see what the impact is on these two senators after they voted against advancing this.

SCIUTTO: That's been the norm, right? If you stray from the herd, you get punished publicly and perhaps even with a primary.

Lauren Fox on the Hill, thanks so much. And we'll be right back with more.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:20:16]

SCIUTTO: Within hours of his release from prison, his freedom granted by President Donald Trump, Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio is now vowing revenge.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ENRIQUE TARRIO, PROUD BOYS LEADER: The people who did this, they need to feel the heat. They need to be put behind bars and they need to be prosecuted. They pardoned the J6 committee, fine. In this country, our case proves that you can be imprisoned for anything.

They need to be in prison. We need to find and put them behind bars for what they did. They need to pay for what they did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: As for Stewart Rhodes, the leader of the Oath Keepers group, he got an invite to the Capitol from lawmakers, Republican lawmakers, where he said he has no regrets for urging his followers to storm the capitol. Four years ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: So bottom line, no regrets?

STEWART RHODES, LEADER OF THE OATH KEEPERS: Well, I don't regret standing up for my country. I don't regret calling out the election as what it was which was stolen, illegal and unconstitutional. We violated many, many state election laws.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: That's not true. We should state that. Tarrio and Rhodes were each sentenced to roughly 20 years in prison for what's known as seditious conspiracy.

Both key organizers of that violent attack coordinating members' trips to Washington, encouraging them to show up armed and in tactical gear, and framing their protest as an act of war.

In the four years since January 6th, both groups have lost influence, but could Trump's pardons, the releases from prison prompt a revival for right wing militia organizations?

Joining me now, Cynthia Miller-Idriss. She's the director of the polarization and extremism research lab at American University, where she tracks extremist groups.

Thanks. Thanks so much for coming.

CYNTHIA MILLER-IDRISS, director, AU POLARIZATION AND EXTREMISM RESEARCH & INNOVATION LAB: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: So four years ago, they helped organize a violent attack on the Capitol, including quite violent attacks on officers of the law. They were sentenced to prison. They were -- they were indicted, sentenced to prison, juries found them guilty. And now president has pardoned them.

What is the message to extremist groups that they're now not just free, but celebrated?

MILLER-IDRISS: I mean, commuting the sentences of 14 extremists and extremist group leaders who were found guilty of what is almost the most serious crime. And it's one step shy of treason, really. It sends a very strong message that political violence is acceptable if it's in support of President Trump. It sends a message that that the -- that the January 6th actions were somehow legitimate, that that they're now vindicated.

SCIUTTO: And that -- that's a -- that's a form of violence that it's okay to use in this country, I suppose.

MILLER-IDRISS: Absolutely. It sends a message that political violence itself is acceptable and even celebrated or valorized. And I will say like to some extent, I think it's fueling also some backlash, as I saw today on social media from the left saying, well, you know, you're going to have to meet it with the same kind of violence, right? And so, you end up in this cycle of outrage that can fuel political violence on both sides.

SCIUTTO: What does this mean for recruitment for groups like this?

MILLER-IDRISS: Well, after the convictions, we saw these groups go a little bit quieter for some time. I mean, there's some signs of life still, but they were thankfully a little bit fragmented, a little bit quieter. And I think for sure we're now seeing this celebratory vindication, a real valorization of what they had done, a sense that they have no regrets. And so we would expect that to lead to a boost in recruitment.

SCIUTTO: For a long time, the FBI, as you know better than me, has identified domestic extremism as the greatest terrorism threat in this country. And of course, there is still an ongoing international terrorism threat. We've seen that.

But for folks watching, should they be concerned that this might provoke more attacks and that we would see not just attacks on the Capitol, but other politically motivated acts of violence? MILLER-IDRISS: Yeah, I think, you know, its important to note that

that first acknowledgment, which came very late in this country, that domestic violent extremism is the most pressing and lethal threat. That was the word of the -- of the Department of Homeland Security under the Trump administration, right? That happened in October of 2020, that that acknowledgment came several years after the data pointed in that direction.

So, you know, I think for sure, we know that that remains the most pressing and lethal threat. And this sends an extra boost to the anti- government side of that, the unlawful militia side of it, the anti- government side. And we're still also seeing other, you know, we saw the KKK paper flying across Kentucky. I think it was this week, you know, so -- in the anti-immigrant space.

And so, it's not like other parts of the domestic violent extremism spectrum have gone quiet. So, yes, I would be a little worried.

[15:25:01]

SCIUTTO: The Biden administration, of course, had a strategy to combat domestic terrorism, which you had some criticisms of. However, I wonder, will this administration have a strategy to combat violent extremism if they deem it to be on their side?

MILLER-IDRISS: Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's -- it's a really good question. The Biden administration did release the first ever national strategy to counter and prevent domestic terrorism. I -- there were parts of that, I think that took a huge leap forward at identifying a public health approach as important. For example, early upstream prevention, but still very security focused -- law enforcement focus.

I think what were seeing right now is the decimation of the FBI, too, the threats against the FBI, the very people who are supposed to be infiltrating and breaking up plots from groups like this.

So, you know, if there is a strategy coming, I hope that its one that that recognizes what the evidence shows about what's effective, which is not cutting the resources on the prevention side.

SCIUTTO: There are violent far right extremist groups in a number of countries around the world. And we've seen a political element of this as well, the rise of far right parties in a number of countries. Look at Germany, look at the UK and elsewhere in France.

So who is doing countering violent extremism well, today?

MILLER-IDRISS: Yeah, a really good question. The country that puts the most money into it is Germany. Billions of euro, right, because of their history. Yeah, exactly, and they -- and Norway also does a lot of preventative work that comes out through multiple agencies. It's one of the things that the U.S. has never done well, including in this new strategy, is, is really broadened the resources.

So we still see it as a security problem, not an education one. You have programs in other countries in New Zealand, for example, that are looking at it through a lens of equity, and that's going to be very difficult to ever see that happen here at this point. So I think we see it as a more holistic thing in Canada, in Germany, in Norway and New Zealand, places that have had repeated terrible terrorist attacks, as we have had.

In the U.S., we still tend to see it as a you know what, I have constantly heard senior officials in also -- under the Biden administration say that it's not their job to prevent someone from becoming radicalized. It's their job to prevent a radicalized person from picking up a gun. I think that's a mistake. It's shortsighted.

SCIUTTO: Tell me, disinformation is so its alive and well in this country. I mean, we look at the number of people who believe, as you heard there, that the 2020 election was stolen and now you have a rewriting of the history of January 6th, a quite successful rewriting of the history of that for a large portion, a significant portion of this country.

How important is the disinformation piece in terms of providing, you know, kind of the kindling for this fire?

MILLER-IDRISS: Well, the disinformation piece and the flip side of that, which is a real lack of media literacy or digital literacy, of people's ability to be skeptical of the content that they consume and to make a good evaluation about whether something is true or not, has also been hurt by the decimation of legacy media, the attacks on journalists, the attacks on expertise, the attacks on what counts as knowledge, right, the undermining of so people don't have a sense anymore of how to tell what's true or false. They're just persuaded often by what they run across on their feeds.

And that's a crisis that is, that has many layers for public health, that has for national security. So I would say, you know, we're not getting out of this anytime soon. And the fact that we will now probably never in our lifetimes have a shared narrative, a common narrative of what happened on January 6th or what happened in the 2020 election. Despite the facts, right?

SCIUTTO: Yeah.

MILLER-IDRISS: Is going to fuel this further. And, you know, when you look at the fact that were three years into being on a global list of backsliding democracies, the average number of years to get off, that is nine years. We have to kind of get -- get cracking on it a little bit.

SCIUTTO: Well, for sure. Cynthia Miller-Idriss, thanks so much for helping us understand this.

MILLER-IDRISS: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Well, President Trump is taking a dizzying amount of action since he was inaugurated.

CNN's John King traveled to New England last week ahead of the inauguration to speak with Trump voters about the promises that they are hoping the new president keeps.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Daybreak on the Atlantic. It's playtime for a pod of dolphins and another subfreezing day at the office for Andrew Konchek. These trips can last up to 12 days. Joe Biden was president when we left Provincetown Harbor. Donald Trump will be back in the White House the next time Konchek and his colleagues head out.

ANDREW KONCHEK, NEW HAMPSHIRE VOTER: Saw you'd stand here like this, see.

KING: Konchek is just as he was when we first met 16 months ago and promised him we'd spend a day out here. He wishes Trump would bite his tongue sometimes, wishes he would let women settle the abortion debate, wishes he would acknowledge the climate crisis that makes this grueling work even more unpredictable.

But Trump got his vote in the New Hampshire primary and again in November because he promises to close the border.

[15:30:06]

Most of all though, because Trump opposes offshore wind farms, Konchek believes will destroy New England fisheries, destroy his way of life.

KONCHEK: The hundreds of miles that they're going to put in the ocean here in the Gulf of Maine, we wouldn't be able to fish it. So I would be out of a job.

KING: Trump's blue collar appeal extends to the Massachusetts mainland, one of the bluest places on the presidential map. This is Boston where Vice President Harris won 77 percent of the vote, but Trump share jumped from 15 percent in 2020 to 20 percent this time, and he won two precincts in the city's Dorchester neighborhood. That's my home, one at this firefighter's union hall, the other at this public library.

DON LOPEZ, MASSACHUSETTS VOTER: This neighborhood is pretty blue, pretty Democrat. Well, Massachusetts, you are in Massachusetts. It's a Democratic state.

KING: And yet, this precinct voted for Donald Trump.

LOPEZ: This did?

KING: Yes.

LOPEZ: I didn't know that.

KING: Don Lopez inherited this Dorchester flower shop from his father.

LOPEZ: This is where we make everything.

KING: And he is now handing it off to his sons. A little nervous talking politics because it could hurt business.

KING: Take me inside your decision in the last election.

LOPEZ: I'd rather not.

(LAUGHTER)

KING: Why not?

LOPEZ: I'm here as a small businessman, trying to be -- make everybody happy with flowers.

(LAUGHTER)

KING: But talk policy and it's an easy code to crack.

LOPEZ: We have the border, they're spending money in Washington like this, going out -- going out of style. The country has -- needs to go in another direction. So I feel that's why people are voting Republican because they're a little fed up.

KING: The Erie Pub is a Dorchester landmark. Cops, firefighters, plumbers and electricians fill these stools. John Stenson's dad bought the place 60 years ago.

JOHN STENSON, MASSACHUSETTS VOTER: They are, first of all, Irish, many of them. Secondly, basically blue collar workers, union officials, union workers, your everyday people that make up a neighborhood.

KING: What was the vote split here among your regulars?

STENSON: Among my regulars, they probably were in favor of Trump. They're probably 60/40.

KING: Sixty-forty?

STENSON: Yeah.

KING: When Trump won two precincts in Boston and they were right here. That surprise you?

STENSON: No, because I'm here every day and I hear the conversation.

KING: What were people talking about?

STENSON: Oh, well, immigration and cost of living at the top, absolutely the top.

KING: John was behind the bar when Ronald Reagan stopped by four decades ago to tip a pint in a place where many Kennedy Democrats became Reagan Democrats. Bill Clinton stopped by a decade later to say he was a different kind of Democrat, not as liberal.

STENSON: Most Democrats are working-class people and if they feel like there's a man there that kind of represents them, they can vote for him. Whether it's there's an R or a D next to his name, and I think they saw that with Reagan and I think they saw it again with Trump.

KING: Now the test is keeping promises.

STENSON: Between what they're paying at the grocery store and how they feel about what he has done with the border in six months, I think that will give you your opinion.

KING: Andrew Konchek agrees it is prove-it time. His wishlist begins with those wind farms and the border.

KONCHEK: He doesn't think before he talks sometimes.

KING: But you trust him.

KONCHEK: For the most part, yes.

KING: So what's the test?

KONCHEK: When he gets in office, then you get to see what he actually does and if he's going to do everything that he says that he's going to do.

KING: Already though, his mood is better.

(LAUGHTER)

KONCHEK: It's got to make good news if he gets bit.

KING: The fishing fleet keeps shrinking. The list of rules keeps growing. But Konchek sees Trump as his blue collar hope, his best shot to keep working the water.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: Coming up, the International Criminal Court is seeking arrest warrants now for Taliban leaders for the crime of persecuting Afghan women and girls. We'll have more coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:37:26]

SCIUTTO: The world still hears our call for equality and justice. Those are the words of one Afghan activist welcoming the International Criminal Court's action against the Taliban. The ICC says it is seeking arrest warrants for two Taliban officials on the grounds of alleged gender-based crimes. The ICC prosecutor says there is reason to believe that two top officials are criminally responsible for persecuting Afghan women and girls, and others the Taliban sees as not conforming to their extreme beliefs.

CNN's Salma Abdelaziz reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It gives us hope that our voices are not forgotten. That's what one woman inside Afghanistan told me after the ICC said that it is seeking arrest warrants for the supreme leader of the Taliban and the chief justice of the group for alleged gender-based crimes that could amount to crimes against humanity.

Now, since the Taliban takeover of Afghanistan, the group has slowly but surely been erasing women and girls from public life. Girls can't go to university, can't go to secondary school, can't step out of their homes without a full veil, can't even sing in public. In fact, the latest edict from the Taliban says that women should not be seen from windows.

Now, this is still one step away from an official arrest warrant from the Hague based court. That would have to be approved by a judge, the chief prosecutor of the ICC also indicated that he may pursue arrest warrants for other Taliban officials.

Human Rights Watch, which has closely been following these violations against women and girls in Afghanistan, welcomed the news and said they hope that it leads to concrete action on the ground.

Salma Abdelaziz, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: Our thanks to Salma there.

Joining me now to discuss, Adela Raz, who was the first female Afghanistan ambassador to the U.S., served as the Afghanistan ambassador prior.

Thanks so much for taking the time.

ADELA RAZ, FORMER AFGHAN AMBASSADOR TO U.S.: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: So ICC investigators found reasonable grounds to believe that these two Taliban leaders, quote, bear criminal responsibility for the crime against humanity, of persecution on gender grounds. Malala Yousafzai has said the Taliban is imposing what she called gender apartheid in Afghanistan.

I wonder what you believe the impact is of these ICC warrants here.

[15:40:03]

Do you believe that they put any pressure on the Taliban?

RAZ: Thank you, first of all, for covering this very critical news for women. This definitely will create the pressure. And it will be also a very genuine response from the international community and especially the justice system that's built for protection of women's rights and human rights. In the case of Afghanistan and the protection of rights of Afghan women, it's one of those cases.

So the creating such precedents will not be so only critical for Afghanistan, but it will be also really important overall, globally, where we are, where we see women's rights regression everywhere, especially in the case of Afghanistan, this is a clear gender apartheid case right now where women are because of their gender, they are prevented from just having regular life and living as, as a regular human beings and their basic rights of what a country and a society should give them and grant them.

And you mentioned that earlier. It's the access to education. This is access to work. This is access to economic resources. This is access to health. And it's a country with close to half of the population being women, that this decision is truly an important decision.

SCIUTTO: On education, I know from my own travel there that post U.S. invasion that allowing girls to go to school was one of the most popular changes, not just for women, by the way, for men -- many Afghan men as well, that their daughters could go to school.

Let me ask you this, though, because the ICC has issued a number of arrest warrants, including for the Israeli prime minister for alleged war crimes in Gaza. But the U.S., of course, who had a long military presence in Afghanistan, is not a party to the ICC. And let's be frank, a lot of countries do not uniformly enforce ICC warrants, including against the Israeli prime minister.

Does that undermine the power of these warrants and these prosecutions?

RAZ: Well, with the legal and the justice system, and especially with the international legal system, as you may know, it's a very lengthy process. It often takes a long time. And there are to be very critical. There are very limited in few cases that you could put could put finger and say those were really successful cases and justice were exercised.

But in the case of Afghanistan, interestingly enough, and the message that we received from the international community in the sense this is this really shows and expresses the unity out there and, of course, how its going to be implemented. And will this be ever implemented? These are all long term and questionable paths that we still do not know. But for essence of it, just having that case and at the highest level, having the supreme leader named, and the chief justice, that really is a critical step forward.

But it doesn't mean this will end and it should end here. This is a path carved towards hopefully preserving the international law and international justice system and for the protection of Afghan women and hopefully for the protection of women's rights globally as well.

SCIUTTO: Before we go, can you help describe to our viewers how Afghan women respond to this? Do clearly they are frustrated? Do they find ways to try to, for instance, educate girls in private, or are they are they able to defy the Taliban? Because we know the Taliban reacts with violence when its orders are not followed.

RAZ: True, true. Look, for the first time when Taliban came to Afghanistan, I was in Afghanistan. And I myself could not go to school for five years. So the degradation and the darkness of the moment when you are prevented from a window of hope because in a, in a, in a society where usually women are pushed back, education is your hope to a brighter future. And when that's taken away, its almost your hope is taken away.

But with Afghan women, despite this, usually, often it hurts me when I say even the word resilience because resilience really comes out of no other choice. But it really is part of the great essence of, of the strength of Afghan women and especially those who are inside the country. So everybody, everybody is trying to find any mean and way to resist and stand against this.

And that means still finding small hopes of virtual education, which at this time it's very limited. It's really, really limited. But it's -- it's still out there. And you also saw a strong example that the first citizens that came on the streets and demonstrated against Taliban's ruling and were the Afghan women. And even today they do the same and ways possible with a lot of time it creates risks for their life.

And for a lot of us, we really wish to not see that risk being there. But it happens. So it's a -- it's a resistance in any way possible. They're trying to do and this decision itself is a -- it's a -- when it's practiced and when it's exercised, it's going to be extremely important. But by its own way, it's an important gesture that comes from the International Criminal Court, from the ICC. And we really hope that it will be implemented.

SCIUTTO: Adela Raz, thanks so much for helping us better understand the plight of women in Afghanistan today.

RAZ: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, in news here in the U.S., President Trump has -- Trump has just signed a series of new executive orders, including one to declassify documents regarding the assassinations of John F. Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy and Martin Luther King, Jr.

Let's listen in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Are you all set?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.

TRUMP: Okay. Very good.

We've signed some executive orders. They were very important in just about every case, and it will go through the first one. Please.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you want to?

DAVID SACKS, A.I. AND CRYPTO CZAR: Yeah.

Mr. President, this is an executive order on crypto. We're going to be. Oh, sorry. We're doing it. Sorry. This is an executive order on A.I.

We're forming -- we're -- we're basically announcing the administration's policy to make America the world capital in artificial intelligence and to dominate and to lead the world in A.I.

TRUMP: Do you want to say your name? Your full name?

SACKS: Yeah, David Sacks, A.I. and crypto czar.

TRUMP: David is one of the greatest in the world at A.I., most respected, probably there is.

So that should take us to the forefront, right?

SACKS: Absolutely. We got to win.

TRUMP: Okay? Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, sir.

TRUMP: And this David is.

SACKS: Yeah. This is the crypto E.O. We're going to be forming an internal working group to make crypto, to make America the world capital in crypto under your leadership.

TRUMP: Which is really going up, right?

SACKS: Absolutely.

TRUMP: All right, David, that's for you.

SACKS: Thank you, sir.

TRUMP: You find them exciting. They might not be excited, but they're going to make a lot of money for the country.

SACKS: Thank you, sir.

TRUMP: And so is David. You have to check him out. There's nobody like this guy. They said, how did you get David Sacks? How did you do that?

And he's -- he's doing it for the country more than anything else. So we appreciate it. David, thank you very much.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is an executive order establishing a presidential commission, an advisory commission on science and technology.

TRUMP: Good.

Do you want to explain that a little bit?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The basic idea is to get together top people from government, the private sector, technology industry. As well as educational institutions to make sure that America maintains its leadership position with respect to science and technology development in the years ahead good.

TRUMP: That's great.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Next, sir, we have a presidential memorandum encouraging departments and agencies in your government, including the Department of the Interior, to promote federal recognition of the Lumbee tribe of North Carolina.

TRUMP: I love the Lumbee Tribe. So this is their first big step, right?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This would be a huge step for them.

TRUMP: Yeah, they were with me all the way. They were great, North Carolina Lumbee Tribe.

Okay. We'll send -- you'll send them a copy of that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.

TRUMP: They were great. Okay?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you'd like, I could get them that pen, sir, as well.

TRUMP: Yeah, let's do that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Next, we have a set of pardons for peaceful pro- life protesters who were prosecuted by the Biden administration for exercising their First Amendment, right?

TRUMP: Do you know how many?

[15:50:02]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe it's 23, sir.

TRUMP: Twenty-three people were prosecuted. They should not have been prosecuted. Many of them are elderly people.

They should not have been prosecuted. This is a great honor to sign this. They'll be very happy. So they're all in prison now?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some are. Some are out of custody.

TRUMP: It's ridiculous.

Okay?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lastly, sir, we have an executive order ordering the declassification of files relating to the assassinations of President John F. Kennedy. Senator Robert F. Kennedy, and the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

TRUMP: That's a big one, huh? A lot of people are waiting for this for a long -- for years, for decades. And everything will be revealed. Okay?

Give that to RFK, Jr.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.

TRUMP: Okay.

Okay. Thank you very much.

REPORTER: Mr. President -- Mr. President, Mr. President, a U.S. judge temporarily blocks the birthright citizenship order. Do you have any reaction?

TRUMP: No. Obviously, we'll appeal it. They put it before a certain judge in Seattle, I guess, right? And there's no surprises with that judge.

REPORTER: Mr. President, Senators Collins and Murkowski have now said they will vote against Pete Hegseth. Are you worried about his confirmation and your reaction?

TRUMP: And no surprises there. It's too bad. You know, it's the way -- the way it is. Too bad.

REPORTER: And when would you adjourn Congress to make recess appointments, Mr. President?

TRUMP: Well, I'd take a look at that. I listened to John Thune. He's doing a fantastic job. We're moving along. The Democrats are trying to delay government, as they always do. They can't help themselves. Even John Ratcliffe, who's very, very strong, very popular and liked by the Democrats, I guess he get's a lot of Democrat votes. That's taken a long time and it shouldn't be taken a long time.

They're maxing everything out so they can delay everything as much as possible.

REPORTER: Senator Thune support an effort to use recess appointments, if you choose to do that?

TRUMP: I'd be willing to use recess appointments. It's up to John, and. We'll see. And John Thune is a great guy, great senator. He knows his stuff inside out and backwards.

But I would use recess appointments if he wants to do that. Absolutely.

REPORTER: Mr. President --

TRUMP: The Democrats are just delaying. They always delay.

REPORTER: Mr. President, you spoke with the Saudi crown prince yesterday.

TRUMP: Who?

REPORTER: The Saudi crown prince.

TRUMP: Yes.

REPORTER: How was the call?

TRUMP: Great.

REPORTER: And $600 million -- billion dollars they can invest?

TRUMP: Six hundred. I'll ask them for a trillion.

REPORTER: You said you can ask for a trillion. Will Saudi Arabia be the first foreign country you will visit since they invested that much?

TRUMP: Well, if they do that, I would. Yeah, I would be glad to do that. I did it, as you know, four years ago we did $450 billion, meaning the money all goes to American companies. And they purchase jets and they purchase computers and everything else. And we did $450 billion. And I guess were at 600, 650.

REPORTER: Mr. President.

TRUMP: I'll see if I can talk him into it.

(CROSSTALK)

REPORTER: Middle East again, you showed great confidence in Steve Witkoff. Why you said that you doubt that the ceasefire in Gaza will hold? Since the have praised his.

TRUMP: Well, no, I think he's great. But it's a very tricky place. It's a very tricky and well see. And if it if something does happen, they will not be happy.

REPORTER: Sir, follow up on that one. In terms of Steve Witkoff, are you going to put him in charge of Iran's strategy? And do you want him talking directly with the Iranians?

TRUMP: No, but he's certainly somebody I would use. He's done a fantastic job. He's a great negotiator. He's a very good person, great. A very popular person gets along with people.

I have great negotiators. They -- they have no personality whatsoever. And then I have some that do. Steve has a wonderful way about him and people like him. And even in this case, both sides like him. And he was able to make a deal. That deal would have never been made without Steve.

The Biden people couldn't make the deal. They were working on it for a year and a half. They couldn't make a deal, and we got it done, prior to the inauguration. We said it has to be before the inauguration.

I mean, the deal should hold, but if it doesn't hold, there'll be a lot of problems. REPORTER: This is relating to your A.I. EO. Just hours after you made

that big Stargate announcement, Elon Musk tweeted that they don't actually have the money.

[15:55:06]

Is that true?

TRUMP: I don't know if they do, but, you know, they're putting up the money. The government is not putting up anything. They're putting up money. They're very rich people. So I hope they do.

And -- I mean, Elon doesn't like one of those people. So --

REPORTER: Are you worried that A.I. is going to replace many American jobs? Does that worry you?

TRUMP: No, no, its going to create tremendous numbers of jobs. It's going to also create a lot of benefits medically for cancer research and other things. It's going to have a huge positive impact.

And, you know, we want to be ahead of China. We're right now way ahead of China. David Sacks is one of the all time experts. You know that people are amazed that he -- you just met him. I don't know if he's still here. There he is.

But -- but one of the most respected people in that world, it's a world, that's a whole different world. And we're ahead of China now because of what I'm doing. And I think it's going to be very successful.

(CROSSTALK)

REPORTER: You just asked the Davos forum again that NATO countries should spend --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: President Trump there signing a number of executive orders, one of which will declassify information intelligence regarding the assassinations of John F. Kennedy Jr., Robert F. Kennedy and Martin Luther King, Jr.

The president, also responding to questions there regarding Elon Musk's criticism of his A.I. plan, that some of the backers don't have the money. He says. He explained that by saying Elon Musk does not like one of the people involved in that plan.

We'll continue to follow the news. Thanks so much for joining me today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington.

"QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is up next.