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Rep. Jesus G. "Chuy" Garcia (D-IL) Is Interviewed About Midair Collision Investigation Intensifying; Deadly Air Crash Devastates Figure Skating Community. Aired 11-11:30a ET
Aired January 31, 2025 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good Friday morning. You are live the CNN Newsroom. I'm Pamela Brown in Washington. And we begin this hour with breaking news. Minutes ago, CNN confirmed that the FAA has indefinitely shut down the low altitude helicopter corridor that was in use at the time of Wednesday's midair collision that killed 67 people. CNN has exclusively obtained two videos that show the crash from angles we had not seen before. They're right here on your screen. You see the Army Black Hawk helicopter on the left, apparently flying right into the path of the American Airlines plane. And here's another video capturing the moment before the impact. The helicopter is traveling over the Potomac River as the plane makes its descent to Reagan National Airport.
And some experts are wondering if the army pilot was confused by the other bright lights and didn't see the approaching plane, perhaps confusing it with another plane. Also this morning, "The New York Times" is reporting that the Black Hawk may have strayed off course. Quote, the military helicopter appears to have been flying too high and outside its approved flight path at the time of the crash, according to four people briefed on the matter but not authorized to speak publicly, end quote.
NTSB investigators have recovered both the voice and data recorders from Flight 5342 and hope to have a preliminary report ready within the next 30 days. CNN's Rene Marsh is at Reagan National. Rene, what are we learning about this FAA action to close the helicopter corridor?
RENE MARSH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Pamela. That is the latest development here as this investigation is -- is underway. And this is quite a significant move, the first significant aviation safety move since this midair collision outside of Reagan National Airspace -- Airport concerning the airspace surrounding the airport. Now this airspace that has been shut down by the FAA is used not only by commercial airliners coming and going from this airport, but also military aircraft as well as law enforcement aircraft.
But in light of that midair collision, the FAA has made the determination to close traffic to anything except for those commercial aircraft. And you talked about this other new reporting that I'm sure investigators are also going to be looking into, which is whether or not this helicopter left the -- the proper altitude that it should have been. And if this deviation away from the altitude that it should have been at, this Black Hawk, is actually confirmed, it -- it would certainly mean that the pilot of that Black Hawk was not following flight regulations at that time because these helicopters are supposed to be flying at very specific altitude, 200 feet or -- or less.
And so that is certainly something that investigators will be zeroing in on when they re -- retrieve the black box from the Black Hawk helicopter. That has not been retrieved yet. But they have retrieved the black boxes from the commercial passenger plane. They are already starting work on that. It is in their labs. They have opened it. And they've begun -- begun the process of re -- reviewing the data from those black boxes.
We know that investigators say that they are confident based on the condition of the black boxes from the commercial passenger plane that they will be able to get data from it. Also, the NTSB is tapping into their expertise across the country. We got word today that they have tapped one of their members from Alaska. They have flown that individual in. He is a former pilot of a Black Hawk helicopter. So tapping into his expertise on that. And of course, another crucial part of this investigation, Pamela, is going to be the air traffic controllers. We do know that the NTSB at this hour, they have not yet had interviews with the air traffic controller. So that is soon to come. Pamela?
BROWN: And there was this near miss the day before the collision between an airplane and helicopter. Tell us about that.
MARSH: Right. Just further highlighting the complicated airspace that is the airspace around Reagan National Airport. It was just the day before this midair collision that another passenger plane coming in for landing had to actually abort landing because another helicopter had come too close into its path. We have the sound from the air traffic control for that incident. Let's take a listen.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At this time, there's a helicopter over Georgetown northbound 300 feet.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had an RA, Brickyard 4514 is going around.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We had an RA with a helicopter traffic below us.
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MARSH: So clearly with this, you know, the incident that is being investigated today, you have that previous incident. It is -- it has clearly become evident to investigators that this complicated airspace, something needed to be done more immediately even though this investigation is ongoing. And Pamela, again, that headline today, the FAA shutting down this airspace around Reagan National Airport to those military helicopters.
BROWN: Yes, that's a big development. Rene Marsh, thank you.
And our next guest is a former air traffic controller who personally shut down New York City's airspace on 9/11. And he may have been the first person to realize America was under attack that day. Michael McCormick joins us now. Thanks for your time. So as a former air traffic controller, what was your immediate reaction when you learned about this crash and subsequently as more evidence is coming in to process?
MICHAEL MCCORMICK, FORMER FAA AIR TRAFFIC MANAGER: Pamela, just like the rest of the country, I was absolutely shocked when I learned that this air collision, especially with the loss of life on board both aircraft, this is not something that we would expect to see within the air traffic control community. And my thoughts and prayers go out to the families of the passengers and crew on board both aircraft and also to the aircraft controllers at Washington National. I'm sure having a very difficult time right now.
BROWN: I -- I just -- I -- my heart feels for them because and I think about that moment when the collision happened and then the air traffic controller had to see the collision and then immediately pivot and deal with all the other planes coming in and redirecting them to the other airports in the area. I mean, talk about true professionalism. But you have to wonder what they're thinking, how -- how they're feeling right now.
According to "The New York Times," audio recordings reveal that the passenger jet had originally cleared -- was originally cleared by the control tower for one, runway and then was -- was cleared for another runway. What is your assessment of that and just the timing here of the communication with the helicopter pilot just around 13 seconds before the collision happened. MCCORMICK: That is not an unusual maneuver for Washington National Airport. The main runway is what the aircraft was initially sequenced for. The controller made the decision to circle the aircraft to Runway 33 and that allows the tower to be able to get more departures off of the main primary runway while the aircraft was circling to land on the secondary runway. Unfortunately, because of that maneuver, it put American right into the flight path of the helicopter.
BROWN: And a source tells CNN that one controller was working two positions at the time of the crash. I think that for the layperson, you're like, oh my gosh. What? They were working two positions covering the helicopters and planes. But apparently that's common practice. Should it no longer be common practice?
MCCORMICK: It is -- it is a common practice in all air traffic control facilities that you open and close positions based upon the volume and complexity at any given time. That provides maximum flexibility to handle what's going on in a control tower or angular air traffic control facility. In this instance, it was actually a good thing because now you have one controller who's actually talking to and controlling both of the aircraft.
Otherwise, if it was a separate controller, then the two controllers would have to constantly coordinate back and forth about what is happening and what they're choosing to do.
BROWN: Just, you know, just taking a step back, I -- I often think about how stressful that job is to be an air traffic controller. Just bring us into what it's like to be one and sort of the -- the -- the daily stress and the pressure that you're under. I mean, you know, I -- I can't even imagine what they're feeling right now. And you heard President Trump talking about it yesterday. Not to make this political, but he's blaming DEI policies without having the evidence to support that. And I -- I just want you to tell us from your experience what it's like.
MCCORMICK: I believe the air traffic control profession is what is known as a meritocracy. And that is only the best can go through the rigorous selection program, the screening program, and then one to five-year training program prior to receiving their certification. So having gone through that, we are very proud to have professionals who are competent and dedicated to providing the safest service in the world.
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And as a controller, I think there -- I think there's nothing more gratifying, more fulfilling than being able to provide that service to our country. And -- and there is no stress. When you enjoy your profession, you do not feel stressed. You deal with the responsibilities. You compartmentalize, as in the case of when this accident occurred, the controller immediately moved to where the priorities were, that is aircraft control.
BROWN: It's just remarkable. It really is. Michael McCormick, thank you.
MCCORMICK: Thank you, Pamela.
BROWN: Let's continue this conversation. Joining us now is Congressman Jesus "Chuy" Garcia. He is an Illinois Democrat on the Transportation Committee and the Aviation Subcommittee. Congressman, thank you for joining us. First of all, what have you learned?
REP. JESUS G. "CHUY" GARCIA (D-IL): Thank you so much.
BROWN: Thank you. What have you learned about how this collision happened?
GARCIA: Well, first of all, I, too, want to express the sympathies to the victims, their families and loved ones during this very difficult time. And what should have been a routine landing turned into a national tragedy. Of course, leaders should bring us together during tragic times. The comments made by President Trump are really unfortunate, divisive and most insulting. We have been told that some of the things that have already been covered, that the flight recorders have been found, that they appear to be in good condition, and of course that NTSB, the FAA, with the Army's cooperation, will head up an investigation into what may have been behind this terrible tragedy.
But, you know, it's a -- it -- it really is disgusting, of course, that there is this type of rhetoric by our highest elected leader in the country. But it is straight out of the Trump playbook. He's exploiting disaster to continue to spread racist lies and divisiveness across the country simply to score political points with his base. We need to be patient. NTSB has a good record in terms of delivering the types of data and information that we need.
You know, last year, Pamela, we passed in the Transportation Infrastructure Committee Legislation, the 2024 FAA Reauthorization Bill, which includes A.D. measures to enhance safety for air travel across the country. And I also want to underscore that since 2012, there have only been three fatalities related to air travel. And in 12 of the last 14 years, we've made tremendous strides. When you compare that to the prior decade where there were about 140 fatalities. So we have made progress, and that's why we ought to be calm and take time to mourn the great loss that families have experienced.
BROWN: Absolutely. Sixty-seven families are grieving today with the nation. I mean, I think we're all grieving. It's just unimaginable, this tragedy. It is true that -- that air travel is still overwhelmingly safe, right? And that's important to note. But it's also true that near misses are on the rise, including the day before this happened, there was a near miss between a helicopter and a plane.
You mentioned the FAA Reauthorization Bill and you supported this bill, which also added more long distance flights in and out of DCA. As you know, there were some of your colleagues who were against that because they said this airspace is too crowded already. We shouldn't be adding more flights. Do you think that -- that was the wrong move in hindsight?
GARCIA: Well, I'm not going to get out in front of the NTSB. I voted against the measure to increase flights. But we don't know what occurred and whether it was human error that caused this flight or other factors. That is what we will learn. And once we have the facts and recommendations, our subcommittee on aviation will be prepared to act and then to act as the full committee as well with legislation, if those are the recommendations to enhance safety. But your point about near misses, yes, that is on the rise.
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It has to do with historical staffing patterns and shortages that have occurred. It could be one more reason to think about expanding the pool of qualified people who can be air traffic controllers. Air traffic controllers, as my senator from Illinois, Tammy Duckworth, who has flown these helicopters and is very familiar with the Black Hawk helicopter, has said that President Trump insulted all of the men and women who risked their lives to provide invaluable services to keep our country safe and that the training that air traffic controllers have to endure is among the best anywhere in the world. Still, there may be something to learn from this investigation, and we will be prepared to act.
BROWN: So in light of that, what is your reaction to the FAA and definitely suspending those helicopter routes in that area near Reagan National Airport?
GARCIA: Well, I think it's probably a practical measure to take that area, that airport and the airspace around it is very, very busy. I have a small airport in Chicago in my district, Midway Airport, that's also a small airport with plenty of traffic and residential areas immediately around the periphery of that small airport. But we've got a great record. This has more complexity, the D.C. Airport in its surroundings. So taking a closer look at that makes a lot of sense. I think taking this measure is very practical.
BROWN: All right. Congressman Garcia, thank you very much.
And still ahead this hour, we are learning new heartbreaking details about the people on that American Airlines flight, many of them so young and just beginning to shape their lives. We'll share the story of a family of four who were on board, their two young daughters budding figure skaters. Stay with us.
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BROWN: In Northern Virginia, a community is mourning a beloved family of four killed in the air crash near Washington, D.C. Peter and Donna Livingston, along with their daughters, 14-year-old Everly and 11- year-old Olivia, were on their way home from the U.S. Figure Skating Championships. The girl's Instagram handle was Ice Skating Sisters. A family friend tells CNN they were talented and super bubbly and remembered the Livingstons as loving and filled with big personalities.
And the National Association of Biology Teachers says that it is devastated after learning its president-elect, Lindsey Fields, was aboard that flight. The group calls Fields death, quote, a tremendous loss. CNN's Eva McKend joins us now. And you've learned a little bit more about two other teen skaters involved in their crash -- in this crash, Spencer Lane and Gina Hahn.
EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Pam, we are getting to learn more about these disciplined and dedicated young athletes from the Skating Club of Boston. Hahn and her mother were killed along with Spencer and his mother, Christine Lane. And when the community was just hearing about this, just processing this and what this all meant for all of them, they described it as like having your heart starting to explode out of your chest. Just the immeasurable level of grief here. Spencer is being remembered for being a force of nature who had his eye on the Olympics.
And then you also think about the parents, right. Being a parent of a student athlete, you're also very dedicated. You're going to all of those practices and with your child every step of the way. So this community is being hit very, very hard. We're going to take a listen now to the executive director from the Skating Club of Boston.
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DOUG ZEGHIBE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, SKATING CLUB OF BOSTON: We watched Gina just grow up here from just a tiny little tyke into this amazingly mature 13-year-old. And we talk a lot about the athletes, but I think we're going to miss their moms as much. Just really good people.
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MCKEND: So the World Figure Skating Championships is going to take place in March in Boston this year, Pam. So that, of course, is going to have a much different feel to it with all of this -- this loss. The context of that event is going to be very different.
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BROWN: Yes. Just a massive void now due to the -- to these lives cut way too short. Thank you, Eva McKend. We'll be right back.
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BROWN: And new this morning, CNN has learned that the FAA has closed helicopter routes near Reagan National Airport indefinitely. The low altitude corridor was in use at the time of Wednesday's midair collision that killed 67 people. And "The New York Times" cites four sources and reporting that the Army Black Hawk helicopter may have been flying too high and strayed from its approved path. We have also learned that there was a close call the day before the collision. A flight approaching Reagan National aborted its first landing after a helicopter flew near its path.
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Now, it's worth noting that the FAA had multiple vacancies at the time of the crash. Mike Whitaker, the FAA administrator under President Biden, stepped down last week.