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CNN International: First Flight Arrives At Heathrow After Fire Triggers Major Shutdown; Federal Judge And Trump Administration Face Off Over Deportation Flights To El Salvador; Trump, Musk At Pentagon To Talk Costs, Not China War Plan. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired March 21, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CHRISTINA MACFARLANE, CNN HOST: Hello and welcome. I'm Christina Macfarlane in London.

MAX FOSTER, CNN HOST: I'm Max Foster at London's Heathrow airport, where the lights are back on.

We can say, thankfully, a lot of travelers around the world will be very pleased to see that. We say were due to come here, and it just didn't happen today because of a simple power outage taking out one of Europe's biggest airports in the last hour.

The first plane actually landed here. It was empty. It's going to pick up passengers. It's a repatriation flight trying to get the priority passengers out of the country, long haul flights, and it's not very many of them, but they do hope to get a full schedule running up tomorrow. That was about 18 hours after the fire at the substation knocked out the power and took out an entire airport.

Heathrow says it hopes to have that operation up and running tomorrow, but there's going to be a huge backlog and this situation is expected to affect more than 1,300 flights in the coming days.

Anna, to say flights are taking off doesn't mean the problem is over, right?

ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: No, the disruption is going to last for many, many days because flights, planes are all in the wrong places. Crews are on the wrong shifts and passengers have already missed all their flights, and there's going to be a huge backlog. I think for many days.

It was interesting to see the flight landing all the way from Gatwick, Gatwick to Heathrow, not the hugest --

FOSTER: People were virtually cheering.

STEWART: It was very exciting, but we are expecting actually this evening, eight long haul flights from British airways to take off going to places like Singapore, Buenos Aires. So we might see them. Were looking at terminal two, though I'm not sure which terminal they're going to be taking off from.

FOSTER: In terms of what happened here, it's quite simple to explain which is it remarkable.

STEWART: It's simpler than we thought it would be.

Earlier in the day, we knew there was a fire at a electrical substation. What wasn't clear was why there were no backups. We have heard from the CEO of Heathrow airport. And this is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THOMAS WOLDBYE, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, HEATHROW AIRPORT: This is unprecedented. It's never happened before. And that's why I'm saying it has been a major incident.

Of course, everybody has been shocked, but all our procedures have been working the way they should. I hope people appreciate that we do not close down the airport unless we have severe safety concerns. That's why we do it. And that's what has happened today. We have been working tirelessly to get the operation back into running. And that's what's now happening.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: He seemed pretty relaxed, considering the chaos that his airport caused.

STEWART: And he said everything worked the way it should. I think there will be a lot of people that are wondering whether this is really the way things should have worked. Yes. There was a fire outside of Heathrow airports control at an electrical substation, but the backup to that substation failed.

Then there were two other substations that can were told power Heathrow airport. But it's not a simple case of switching on a switch. You can't just divert that power. Now, whether there are better redundancies at other airports around the world, I don't know.

But I know there's a lot of criticism, not least actually from the director general of IATA who questioned just this.

FOSTER: Yeah. And Mary Schiavo was saying because of power outages in the U.S., it's now a legal requirement for airports to have a proper backup system. So over there, it's very much seen as the airports issue. But this chief executive suggesting it's an external problem that he couldn't control. And some people suggesting that's just about liability.

STEWART: It could well be. And there's going to be a lot of sort of legal questions, I imagine, after all this.

FOSTER: Because people need to be compensated.

STEWART: It's going to cost a lot of money for airlines, but also for passengers who will be out of pocket trying to figure out how to get home. You know, some people will be told, yes, don't worry, well get you on a flight in 2 or 3 days time. But what if they need to get somewhere that day? Then they're looking at rebooking a flight with very little capacity and spending a lot of money.

FOSTER: And just -- just explain to us how the you know, its a very tight system. Flights are very organized and planes are very organized. And right now, they're not organized. And that's going to take a while to sort out.

STEWART: There's a lot to sort out. I think one of the key problems actually, was the sort of 100-plus planes that were in the air when Heathrow, Heathrow airport decided to close. Now they were already on their way to Heathrow. A lot of them were large body aircraft. They're long haul planes.

Heathrow, of course, is a hub. It's not just where people come to visit London. This is a hub to connect, you know, Asia to the U.S. now, lots of those planes went to other U.K. airports like Gatwick, but some went to places in Europe, Spain, France. So they're all in the wrong places and the crews are all on the wrong shifts and passengers are pretty disgruntled.

[15:05:04]

FOSTER: A lot of people talking about the fire, not so much talking about what caused the fire, because people are assuming this was some sort of accident. But at the same time, counter-terror police are actually leading the investigation.

STEWART: So we were told earlier this morning by the energy secretary of the U.K. that it didn't appear there was any foul play involved. But then we were told that counterterrorism police will be leading this investigation. And you have to question, you know, this is critical infrastructure we're talking about. The disruption we have seen has been huge.

So that investigation will be underway. I think everyone will be keen to know what was the cause of the fire, but separately, why there isn't a better backup system here at Heathrow Airport.

FOSTER: Are you concerned about just the fact that this vulnerability has been exposed, not to the system, but, you know, people will be concerned that now you can take out an airport, you know, you know, it could be a target, is what I'm saying. And I know that's something that we shouldn't be speculating about, but people are talking about it.

STEWART: I don't think you would ever have crossed our minds that something as simple as a very localized fire could take out a whole airport for 24 hours, which would impact hundreds of thousands of people, countless airlines, airports all over the world costing hundreds of millions of pounds.

This is huge, and it's really reducing down to one simple fire. So yes, there will be lots of questions. And of course, early this morning before any of the comments, people did wonder, could this be hybrid warfare?

FOSTER: Yeah. STEWART: Could this have been a target?

At the moment, we're told, there's no signs of there being foul play, but an investigation will be ongoing.

FOSTER: Yeah, absolutely. We'll bring you all the updates as we get them. But the good news is we have seen planes moving here at Heathrow, certainly not Europe's busiest airport today.

We'll be back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FOSTER: The second plane we've seen land here at Heathrow Airport tonight as it gears up to restart flights after a day of not really chaos because the whole airport was closed down.

[15:10:03]

But some chaotic questions about exactly how it had to close down. So there will be a few long haul flights tonight, trying to get people home, and then its going to the big job tomorrow will be getting the proper schedule up and running again so people can get back to where they plan to be today. But they couldn't get there because this major European airport was utterly shut down because of a fire at one single power substation.

Now have a look at these images, because these really say it all. This is a very important airport. And this was Heathrow Airport.

It was a week ago. It shows you how busy it can be. It handles about 1,300 combined takeoffs and landings a day. This was Heathrow today.

What a difference for an airport that is by far the busiest in the U.K., one of the busiest in the world. And it plugs into all the other hubs. So it's really important to the world.

The images came to us from flightradar24.

Ian Petchenik is the communications director. I mean, this is something we really don't see very often. Is it?

IAN PETCHENIK, COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, FLIGHTRADAR24: Absolutely not. No, this is not quite unprecedented, but it's -- it's certainly very rare.

FOSTER: Just explain to us what happens when an airport gets closed down, when flights are mid-flight.

PETCHENIK: Well, in this particular case, we had 120 or so flights that needed to find someplace else to go. The lucky flights were the ones that were nearest London at the time that the airport closed, so they were able to divert to places like Gatwick or Manchester, a little bit further afield in Birmingham.

But the -- the real tricky part was figuring out what to do for flights that are 12 to 15 hours long, that are only 3 or 4 hours into their flight. So we saw a lot of aircraft return to their origin, a lot of the aircraft coming out of the U.S., Canada, as well as from -- from East Asia, where those aircraft just turned around and went back to where they started from.

FOSTER: We're just looking at an aircraft that's just come in here, a British airways plane just explain what these planes are. They're -- they're empty, aren't they? And then they're just planning to get the people out.

PETCHENIK: Correct. As of right now, they're -- they're just moving metal, basically getting aircraft back into position so that they can begin operating flights out of Heathrow later this evening and then hopefully operating close to normal schedule tomorrow.

FOSTER: In terms of the schedule tomorrow, the airport being quite confident that there's going to be a full schedule. But that doesn't mean the airport is running normally, right?

PETCHENIK: No, you still have roughly double the number of people that would normally pass through Heathrow needing to get somewhere, and that's going to create a lot of headaches as people that were on flights are supposed to be on flights today, basically moved to the back of the line. As far as cancellations go and trying to rebook.

So those folks are going to be trying to get to wherever they need to be, as well as the people who were booked on tomorrow's flights.

FOSTER: What do you make of the fact that this one transformer took out an entire airport, and all the backups didn't work?

PETCHENIK: I think that there's going to be a thorough investigation to understand what happened and why, why the airport was -- was brought offline.

FOSTER: Yeah. I mean, it's a big investigation, isn't it? And there's a lot of money involved because I've heard the word liability spoken about a lot today as well.

Really appreciate you joining us, Ian, from Flight Radar.

Back to you, Chrissy, as the airport seems to be gearing up again.

MACFARLANE: Good to see, Max. Thank you.

Now, a critical hearing is underway in the legal showdown between the Trump administration and a federal judge over the deportation of hundreds from the U.S. to El Salvador. The judge kicked off the hearing, telling the DOJ -- DOJ attorney, quote, the government had to -- had used intemperate and disrespectful language that he's never seen from the United States.

The two sides are face to face for the first time since President Trump called for the impeachment of Judge James Boasberg. The judge wants to hear from an official -- official involved in the cabinet level discussions over the decision to try to invoke what's known as the state secrets privilege. Trump officials argue the flights were carried out under the centuries old Alien Enemies Act.

It's used the wartime act to rapidly deport migrants without due process under immigration law. Well, speaking earlier in the Oval Office, President Trump was asked about the scope of his deportation efforts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Mr. President, do you think you have the authority, the power to round up people, deport them, and then you're under no obligation to a court to show the evidence against them?

[15:15:03]

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, that's what the law says, and that's what our country needs, because we were -- unfortunately, they allowed millions of people to come into our country. And you can't stop that with a judge sitting behind a bench that has no idea what goes on, who happens to be a radical left lunatic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACFARLANE: Well, it's worth noting that Judge Boasberg was appointed to the federal branch by President George W. Bush.

CNN's Kara Scannell is joining us from New York.

And it sounds like the judge here has come out fighting in this hearing. What more are you hearing?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. The judge is on the bench for now, about 45 minutes. But he began this hearing by setting this tone and criticizing the Department of Justice attorneys for the language that they have used in the legal briefs, calling it intemperate and disrespectful and saying he had never seen that before from the Justice Department. Then he switched gears and was asking the attorney for DOJ, who was at the hearing last weekend when the judge issued the order from the bench saying to stop the planes as they were leaving, taking off and leaving with these non-U.S. citizens, that the government believes were Venezuelans.

He asked the prosecutor what his understanding was of the judge's order at that time, because the judge is trying to get at, you know, was it clear to the prosecutor that he wanted these planes stopped? And the attorney for the Justice Department said he understood that the judge's order from the bench was binding, and that it was effective at that time.

But he said he couldn't speak to any conversations he had with his clients, who are the executive branch, the president and his representatives, because he said those were covered by attorney client privilege. But the judge there really trying to get on the record that the attorney in the room for the Justice Department understood that his order to stop the flights were was effective at the moment that the judge said it last weekend. Of course, there's been some questions from the White House about

whether that order was actually not in effect until it was a written order some time later, because underlying this whole argument is the judge is trying to understand whether the Justice Department and the president had violated his court order to stop those flights.

Then the judge also was asking additional questions to the prosecutor saying, you know, why were people rushed onto these planes once the proclamation was issued, saying, it seems that they knew it was a problem and they were trying to get these planes off the ground before anyone could challenge it.

Now, the rest of this hearing now in the in the past 20 or 30 minutes or so, has really been focused on the nuts and bolts of how could someone, if they were swept up by the homeland security agents because they were believed to be members of this gang or believed to be non- U.S. citizens who were Venezuelans? How could they even challenge these petitions, given the way that this all played out?

And the lawyers are going back and forth there over what the proper channel and the rights to do that are, because as the petitioners in this case, the lawyers representing some of these individuals, they have said they aren't members of the gang. They have tattoos that have been misinterpreted, but yet now they are currently in a prison in El Salvador, as this challenge is playing out.

So, you know, these discussions are still underway before the judge, but the judge certainly setting a tone here, really wanting to make it clear to the Justice Department attorneys that he thinks that their language has been disrespectful and really getting on the record here, that the prosecutor in the room representing the government did understand at that time last week that his order to stop the planes was effective, the moment that the judge said it, Chrissy.

MACFARLANE: Yeah, the judge finally, by the sounds of it, getting some detail on those questions that he has been asking of the Trump administration now for some time. And we know this, this, this the hearing was meant to focus on the central decision over whether the White House can continue to use this -- this 18th century law.

And, you know, the outcome of that is hugely consequential for Donald Trump potentially expanding his executive authority.

SCANNELL: Right. And the judge here saying he wants to make clear that it's not just limited to the handful of petitioners that are represented in this lawsuit, but it's to any of the individuals that Trump has deported to El Salvador under this Alien Enemies Act currently, but potentially using this act in the future.

And the underlying argument here, the petitioners have said that this act was reserved for wartime. It's only been used three times the war of 1812, World War One and World War II. And the U.S. is not in a declared war right now. The gang that the president and the executive branch is focused on is not a government agency. And so they're saying it's misapplied. And so for that reason alone, that this deportation, as it's played out, should not have occurred, and that individuals should have a right to challenge this. The U.S. has immigration laws and that those should have been in place.

The lawyers for the government here pushing back on that, saying that the judge doesn't have any grounds here or jurisdiction to second- guess the president's executive authority, particularly as it relates to national security.

[15:20:07]

You know, this is still playing out right now. It's unclear if the judge is going to rule from the bench here, or if its something that hell take under consideration, but it could definitely have some sweeping implications of the U.S. immigration strategy.

MACFARLANE: Yeah, we will continue to watch it closely with you there for us. Kara Scannell, thank you for now.

And as his Department of Government efficiency considers the possibility of major military cuts, Elon Musk paid a visit to the Pentagon today. Musk met with top U.S. military officials following an invitation from Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth. Prior to that meeting, "The New York Times" reported Musk was being briefed on the U.S. military's plans for a potential war with China.

But the president and his defense secretary pushed back on that report. Here's what they told reporters later in the Oval Office.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I don't want other people seeing anybody, seeing potential war with China. We don't want to have a potential war with China. But I can tell you if we did, we're very well-equipped to handle it. But I don't want to show that to anybody. But certainly you wouldn't show it to a businessman who is helping us so much. He's a great patriot. He's taken -- he's paying a big price for helping us cut costs, and he's doing a great job. He's finding tremendous waste, fraud and abuse.

PETE HEGSETH, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: We welcomed him today to the pentagon to talk about DOGE, to talk about efficiencies, to talk about innovations. It was a great informal conversation.

The rest of that reporting was fake. There was no war plans. There was no Chinese war plans. There was no secret plans. That's not what we were doing at the Pentagon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACFARLANE: Let's turn to CNN's Jeff Zeleny, who's with us now live from the White House.

So the Trump administration there emphatically pushing back on claims that this briefing had anything to do with China. And yet questions are still lingering here about Musk's conflicts of interest with the Defense Department.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF U.S. NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, there is no question that one of the biggest examples of the conflicts of interest that we've seen play out occurred today, because Elon Musk is not only a senior advisor to the president and the leader of the Department of Government Efficiency, but he's also one of the biggest defense contractors the United States has. He has, you know, tons of business before the United States government.

So that clearly was a conflict walking in the door to the Pentagon, regardless of if there was a China briefing or not. There is some -- some evidence to make clear that the briefing purpose was changed after that reporting in "The New York Times" and "The Wall Street Journal" about this China war briefing.

The president, you know, a -- essentially pushing back on all this, saying that Musk would not even want to have this type of briefing because he does have business before China. But really just saying those words out loud pointed out the fact that there is an inherent conflict of interest here.

What is less clear is exactly what trims and cuts and reshaping, if you will, of the Pentagon and the Defense Department that the Trump administration is planning virtually every corner of the federal government has been sized up and sized down, if you will, by the Musk group, the Defense Department, which represents the biggest amount of discretionary spending, has largely been off limits until now. So we shall see what comes from that meeting.

But if there is true reform in the minds of this administration, or to try and shave off some spending, you cannot do that without looking at the Defense Department as well.

Kind of ironic though. The whole reason the president and the defense secretary were in the oval office today, they were announcing a new major program with Boeing, a new fighter jet program, which would not be going until the 2030s. And that could be some $50 billion.

So even as there's talks of cutting more spending, also, as always, on the minds of the president and his advisers here, Christina.

MACFARLANE: Yeah, important to point to make, Jeff Zeleny from the White House, thank you.

ZELENY: Sure.

MACFARLANE: All right. Still to come, another check in our top story, the shutdown at Heathrow airport and how it has stranded passengers on all corners of the globe.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:28:01]

FOSTER: Back to our top story here at Heathrow airport. The busiest airport in Europe, trying to crank up and get going again by daylight. We have seen a few planes arriving here. This is part of the process to try to get all the planes back in the positions they should have been in when the airport was closed down. Thousands of flights have been affected today, canceled all over the

globe, and the ripple effects will be felt for days as we try to deal with the backlog here and also just get those planes back into the right positions. Counter-terrorism police actually investigating this fire, although there's no suggestion yet that there was anything criminal that happened here.

With more on how the days events unfolded and caused this absolute chaos, Anna Stewart.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEWART (voice-over): Flames leaping into the air over this West London electrical substation overnight, the fire taking out all the power for the local area and for the U.K.'s busiest airport.

By mid-morning, the blaze was under control, but London Heathrow announced a complete shutdown. Airplanes grounded on the tarmac and many passengers in the U.K. and around the world left stranded, waiting for answers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kind of unbelievable. Just kind of like, what the hell? Because this whole trip has been a little bit of a. Lets just say bad luck.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've called delta and all the lines are busy, so they're not answering. I just called American Express travel to see if they can help. I'm waiting.

STEWART: With an average of 1,300 flights a day and serving as a major hub for transatlantic travel, there has already been global disruption. Many flights which were already en route to Heathrow, were turned around mid-air. Others kept waiting for hours, only to be told they couldn't fly.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A couple hours ago. Right as we were about to leave Newfoundland, we were rerouted back to Minneapolis.

[15:30:06]

STEWART: Counter-terrorism police have been called in to lead the investigation into the fire.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's no suggestion that there is foul play --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just a catastrophic accident is what we're looking at.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is the -- I mean, the conversation I've had is with the national grid, the chief executive of the national grid. And certainly that's what he said to me.

STEWART: The knock on effects of this incident could take days to resolve.

PETCHENIK: Airlines like B.A. are going to take probably a few days, maybe even a week to recover, depending on how long the problems at Heathrow last and how quickly they can get aircraft and crews and passengers back into position.

STEWART: Meaning thousands more passengers are headed for delays.

Anna Stewart, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Our very -- Richard Quest was caught up in all of this. He's obviously flying around all the time.

Richard, you're in Sao Paulo, I gather.

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Yeah, I am indeed stranded here in Sao Paulo. There are worse places to be stranded. My flight, we boarded. We waited, we had coffee, we gossiped, we chit chatted. And then they threw us off the plane.

No, we were disembarked, got our bags back. And I'm hopeful that my flight to London will leave tonight. At 24 hours later.

I'm sorry for those people who were meant to be flying tonight to London because their plane never arrived, of course. And those knock on effects will just keep going for days and days and days as planes are put into the right places. And depending on the airline, if you're a Virgin, Atlantic or B.A., then, of course, it's your main hub and you have great difficulty.

If you're Lufthansa, there are problems because you have such a large number of Heathrow flights. United Airlines slightly less so because you're all going sort of U.S., U.K. and they're overnighting. And if Heathrow is open tomorrow, then that should be considerably easier.

But let's not be -- let's not beat around the bush here. This is a fiasco for Heathrow airport that it should fall over, even allowing for the awfulness of this particular fire is one of the questions that's going to be answered.

It's embarrassing. It shouldn't have happened. And as one CEO -- airline CEO said to me, Max, it's amateurish.

FOSTER: Let's hear from the head of British Airways, because obviously he's been affected more than any other airline here at Heathrow.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN DOYLE, CEO, BRITISH AIRWAYS: This is an unprecedented situation and we have not seen a closure of Heathrow on this scale for many years. Unfortunately, it will have a huge impact on all of our customers flying with us over the coming days.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: There have been some complaints. I have to say, Richard as well. We've been hearing about British airways and how they've been coping with this, but they've been faced and thrown into a completely near unprecedented situation, haven't they?

I mean, give us a sense of how all the other airlines are viewing this right now, according to your contacts.

QUEST: Yeah. Well, look, I've got huge sympathy for B.A. No airline, no airline can stomach. And withstand and stay standing tall if their main hub is actually basically, the network is destroyed.

Look at Delta. What happened in the U.S., it's happened with all the big airlines. So I have huge sympathy with Sean on this particular one as he tries to rework out what's gone wrong. Where can he get it?

Look, let's take tonight for example. So tonight at Heathrow, all the usual flights that leave at night are the big long haul ones, Johannesburg, Cape Town, Buenos Aires. So they're going to try and get those out. But my standby or replacement flight from here tomorrow has already been canceled. B.A. is in an impossible position as its trying to deal with this. It's like its just difficult.

So what can they all do about it? I think one of the things they're going to be very angry about, and in fact, I don't think I know, is that they are being required by law to pay for people's hotels and not compensation. This is extraordinary circumstances.

But hotels for meals, for phone calls, even for those passengers' days out. And I think the airline industry in the U.K. and in Europe is feeling that once again, they get the tough side of the stick when it comes to actually having to pay the bill.

FOSTER: Because the airlines are under so much pressure, were hearing from passengers who can't get hold of them. What's your advice to those people? Should they just go ahead and book and expect to get their money back later? I mean, what's your advice to people stuck out there?

QUEST: Yeah.

[15:35:01]

My advice is deeply unpopular. It really is, because you've gone to a travel agent. You've gone to the airline. You've done everything you should.

My advice is you're on your own. You have to make your own arrangements and sweep up the mess like the -- the horse's cart afterwards.

A good example, last night we disembarked. I looked at the -- the line to get my little taxi voucher and my hotel voucher. It was from here to beyond those trees. I just thought to hell with it. CNN's going to have to pay the bill or ill have to pay something or whatever.

I went -- went online, booked a hotel, got a cab, and I've been here at the Grand Hyatt for -- for all -- all day. You're on your own, Max.

And to a large extent, you've got to rely on UK 261 or EU 261. You've got to rely on travel insurance. Yes, that old fashioned word, travel insurance. Have a 365 day a year policy.

But my unpopular, unpleasant advice: you're on your own. Make the best of it because nobody else is going to be able to help you like you'll help yourself.

FOSTER: Okay, Richard, I mean, it is harsh advice, but it is the reality tonight as people are stuck around the world because of a simple fire on one transformer in a power plant here in London, and the backup simply didn't work.

We'll be back in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MACFARLANE: Israel's defense minister is instructing his forces to seize more territory in Gaza and evacuate its residents until all Hamas hostages are released. Israel Katz says until then, the IDF will intensify its airstrikes and ground operations in the enclave, warning the seizures could be permanent.

The Palestinian health ministry reports more than 500 people have been killed this week alone. The overall death toll in Gaza since the war began in October of 2023 is now nearing 50,000.

[15:40:16]

Meanwhile, Israelis took cover as air raid sirens blared into the night sky on Thursday. The Israeli military says it intercepted one rocket fired from Hamas towards Tel Aviv, while two others fell into an open area in.

Well, in Jerusalem, protesters calling for Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's resignation scuffled with police outside his home. Demonstrators tried to get through the police barriers, some of them holding signs saying "time to overthrow the dictator".

This comes as Netanyahu's government voted to dismiss the head of Shin Bet, the country's internal security service.

CNN's Jeremy Diamond has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: The reasons for the firing of the Shin Bet director depend on who you ask. The Israeli prime minister and his allies have insisted that it is because the Shin Bet director lost the confidence of the prime minister, that the prime minister no longer trusts him.

And but -- but Shin Bet head Ronen Bar and critics of the Israeli prime minister have offered an entirely different narrative, which is that the Israeli prime minister has sought to dismiss him in particular because the Shin Bet is now investigating Netanyahu's closest aides over alleged ties to Qatar, accusations that they -- that some of those aides inappropriately lobbied on behalf of Qatar, including receiving payments from the Qatari government. Netanyahu has insisted that that investigation was only opened after

Netanyahu began to lose confidence in Bar, and effectively suggesting that this is a form of blackmail by the head of the Shin Bet. But it is important to note how incredibly unprecedented this current crisis is in the Israeli government. The Shin Bet has -- has never been dismissed before, and the attorney general of Israel has said that the way in which he was dismissed was simply not legal.

And now, we have this injunction by the Supreme Court until at least a hearing can be held. Certainly something to watch as this develops, as it is causing enormous tensions within Israeli society.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MACFARLANE: Well, earlier I spoke to Alon Pinkas, the former Israeli consul general in New York. He told me these recent events served to help Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's political agenda.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALON PINKAS, FORMER ISRAEL CONSUL GENERAL IN NEW YORK: Each is targeted to each is intended rather to distract from the other. And they do come together into a bigger picture. And that is Mr. Netanyahu's alternative narrative on what happened, what transpired on October 7th, 2023, and what led to that?

In his mind, only a perpetual war, which he extended repeatedly and unnecessarily for 15 months and now resumed it for no reason whatsoever, only a perpetual war distances him away from those events.

And the head of the Shin Bet, Mr. Ronen Bar, the Shin Bet is the equivalent, the rough equivalent of the FBI in the U.S. or MI-6 in Britain, just for our viewer's better understanding.

His dismissal is -- is for a variety of reasons. Number one, Mr. Bar saw Mr. Netanyahu's abysmal performance on October 7th.

Number two Mr. Bar issued or at least partially issued, an internal Shin Bet and internal general security service inquiry into what had happened on October 7th. And there is scathing criticism of Mr. Netanyahu in it that obviously a naturally riled Mister -- and angered Mr. Netanyahu.

The third perhaps most important thing is that by law, the Israeli Shin Bet, the Israeli general security service, is also entrusted and empowered and authorized to safeguard democracy. And Mr. Netanyahu at this point, is also relaunching a constitutional coup. And so firing, Mr. Bar answers all of the above checklist in Mr. Netanyahu's politically motivated agenda.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACFARLANE: Now, former Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout has praised U.S. President Donald Trump in an interview with CNN. Known to his accusers as the "Merchant of Death", Bout was in a U.S. jail for ten years before being exchanged in a prisoner swap in 2022. Our Fred Pleitgen spoke to him in Moscow.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VIKTOR BOUT, FORMER RUSSIAN ARMS DEALER: You know who I am.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I know exactly who you are. That's why I'm asking you.

[15:45:00]

That's Viktor Bout. He's the former Russian arms dealer who some have called the merchant of death.

Now, I bumped into him at a press event here in Moscow, and he gave me his take on the Trump administration and its Russia policy. I'll show you that in a minute. But first, here's a quick recap.

Bout served about ten years in a U.S. jail until he was exchanged for U.S. basketball star Brittney Griner in 2022 and a swap that was overseen by the Biden administration. Now he's a former Soviet military officer, and he was actually serving a 25-year sentence on charges that included conspiring to kill Americans. Bout always maintained his innocence of all the charges.

Do you think that Donald Trump understands Russia better than Joe Biden did?

BOUT: I don't think it's a mere factor of understanding. It's Trump representing, you know, the American people who said enough is enough, who wont really change. That's why he was elected, you know, and the Biden administration was just, you know, in bed with all this, you know, neo cons, you know, warmongers and the global elites who just tried to stage a World War III.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MACFARLANE: Well, turning back to the United States now, and in another blow to President Donald Trump's crackdown on immigration, a judge is blocking his administration from deporting a Georgetown University researcher who has been accused of spreading Hamas propaganda.

CNN's Tom Foreman has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A flurry of men in black masks brandishing weapons, grabbing a Georgetown University fellow as he returned home at night. That is how a lawyer describes the arrest of Dr. Badar Khan Suri by ICE agents. Never mind that a letter from a school official says, "We are not aware of him engaging in any illegal activity."

The Trump administration insists Suri, now being held more than 1,000 miles away in Louisiana, was actively spreading Hamas propaganda and promoting antisemitism, with close connections to a known or suspected terrorist.

It fits neatly into claims by Secretary of State Marco Rubio that academics legally in the country can be legally booted out.

MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE: This is not about free speech. This is about people that don't have a right to be in the United States to begin with. No one has a right to a student visa. No one has a right to a green card, by the way.

FOREMAN: Those comments came amid questions about Mahmoud Khalil, a Columbia University graduate, Palestinian rights activist, and permanent U.S. resident.

Khalil says immigration agents locked him up for exercising free speech in protest about the Israel-Hamas war.

CNN has now obtained images of the fliers that a White House official says is the Hamas propaganda distributed by the group organized by Khalil, a claim Khalil's lawyer denies.

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We have a zero- tolerance policy for siding with terrorists, period.

FOREMAN: And there is the case at Brown University of Dr. Rasha Alawieh, deported to her native Lebanon after the White House learned she attended the funeral of a slain leader of another U.S.-declared terrorist group, Hezbollah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're going to keep this press conference on topic.

FOREMAN: Administration officials are answering few questions about this case or the others, no matter how hard reporters press.

But online, the White House mocked the doctor from Brown, in keeping with the stance the president long had during his campaign.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will revoke the student visas of radical, anti-American, and antisemitic foreigners at our colleges and universities. And we will send them straight back home. They go back home. Enjoy your life.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOREMAN (on camera): The White House is clearly trying to move fast and send a message with these actions. But now the courts are beginning to step in and suggest the actions of some of these people may be protected and no cause for them being pushed out of the country.

Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

MACFARLANE: All right. Still to come, well be back at Heathrow once again with Max Foster as the airports slowly comes back to life.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:51:43]

FOSTER: Just receiving a statement from the metropolitan police. Their counterterrorism police have actually been investigating what caused a fire here at Heathrow, which closed the entire airport down. And what they're saying is they are continuing to work alongside colleagues in the area, particularly the fire service, of course, who had to solve this fire problem. They're working on the investigation, but they're saying at this stage there remains no indication of any -- any foul play. They are asking anyone with information that could assist with this investigation, though, to get in touch with them.

The fire brigade, therefore, are taking this forward as an investigation as to what might have gone wrong with this power plant, which caught fire and the backup didn't work. So therefore the entire airport had to be closed down.

People were stuck on flights in the air when they were diverted away from Heathrow because there was an emergency response. They couldn't have any planes landing. So there were huge cancellations all over the world.

We can speak to one of the people affected.

Abdy Yeganeh is a diplomat stranded in Washington at Dulles Airport.

I believe, Abdy, what's your story?

ABDY YEGANEH, FORMER BRITISH DIPLOMAT: Hi there. Hi, max. Thanks for -- thanks for the time.

Yeah. So I was en route yesterday back from -- from -- from Dulles back to London. And about three hours in the flight, we just had an announcement that the planes going to turn around because of an incident at London Heathrow. Information was a bit vague at -- at that moment, but we all, of course, tried to log it on our phones to check what was on -- on the news, to see what was happening.

And then about three hours out and then three hours back, we landed back in Dulles around about 4:00 in the morning.

FOSTER: What were the airline staff telling you?

YEGANEH: It was all very vague. Obviously, I think they were the staff on the plane and the staff at the airport were trying their best, but I think they had about as least amount of information as the passengers had. You know, I think they were trying their best, but the only advice that they had was, you know, gave us a piece of paper and told us to, you know, go find yourself a hotel and stay tuned to hear any updates from -- from British airways.

So it was a bit of a lackluster response. And what was perhaps fairly clear and obvious, obvious, that maybe the processes were in place to deal with such a scenario.

FOSTER: A lot of people were saying they weren't getting updates, so how were you chasing them up?

YEGANEH: Yeah, so I think this was one of the -- the great frustrations that many customers had. So, you know, you go online and the online message was, you know, to call to rebook and then you try to call British Airways telephone services. And it would just hang up because they were clearly overwhelmed with what was happening.

So you're kind of like going round in circles. But bear in mind, obviously, when I landed back in Dulles, it was around about 4:00 in the morning. So my first priority was, okay, I need to find a hotel room because, you know, the -- that was left to us to sort out. So once I had managed to find a room, I was just going round in circles between B.A. online, B.A. phone services.

[15:55:06]

And to be honest, what I actually did was I started reaching out on social media, seeing what other airline passengers were dealing with. So I spoke to, you know, someone who was stranded in Abu Dhabi. There was also someone at LAX in California, and their advice was, go to the airport and go -- to the counters and, you know, try your charm and luck there.

And that's precisely what I've done. So I'm now back in Dulles and I'm just behind a camera. You can't see a there's a huge long queue all at the B.A. desk, all probably trying to do what I'm about to go and do.

FOSTER: Okay, well, you're on your charm offensive, so good luck to you. I'm glad you're okay though.

Lots of people in a much more difficult position, I think, Chrissy, they had to get to places and they're really stuck.

MACFARLANE: Yeah, my heart really goes out to Abdy and all of those stranded, perhaps watching our show, Max around the globe tonight. There really is it feels like there's not much that can be done, although I think the best takeaway I have is travel insurance, as Quest said earlier.

Max, I think that concludes your plane spotting for tonight.

Thank you for joining us here on CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Christina Macfarlane.

FOSTER: I'm Max Foster. And not many planes leaving. They were meant to be leaving in the evening. But you know, who knows what's going to happen tomorrow? We'll be back later.