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Ukraine Reels from Latest Russian Strikes as Trump Pleads Putin to Stop; Vatican Prepares for Pope Francis' Funeral; China Apparently Rolls Back Tariffs on U.S.-Made Semiconductors; Canadian Voters React on Relationship with the United States. Aired 3-4a ET

Aired April 25, 2025 - 03:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[03:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KIM BRUNHUBER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to all of you watching us around the world. I'm Kim Brunhuber. This is "CNN Newsroom."

New Russian airstrikes pound Kyiv just as the U.S. doubles down on its calls for peace between Ukraine and Russia.

Live pictures from the Vatican as thousands pass by the open coffin of Pope Francis to say their final goodbyes.

And China appears to roll back some retaliatory tariffs on certain products made in the U.S., what this means for the trade war.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Live from Atlanta, this is "CNN Newsroom" with Kim Brunhuber.

BRUNHUBER: U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff will be in Moscow on Friday for expected peace talks with Russian leader Vladimir Putin. And that's happening as Ukraine's capital is reeling from its deadliest day in months following a barrage of Russian strikes on Thursday.

Officials say at least 12 people were killed and 90 others wounded when Russian drones and missiles pounded targets across Kyiv. Hours later, U.S. President Donald Trump made it clear he's not happy, urging the Russian leader on social media to stop the attacks and agree to a peace deal.

The U.S. President says he believes both Kyiv and Moscow still want peace, but he offered a surprising answer when asked what concessions Russia is ready to make. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: What concessions has Russia offered up thus far to get to the point where you're closer to peace?

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: Stopping the war. Stopping taking the whole country. Pretty big concession. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: CNN's Chief International Security Correspondent Nick Paton-Walsh has more from London.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Trump's post on social media the second time in a matter of hours. He's addressed the urgent need for the White House, under their own deadlines here, to get some kind of peace in Ukraine.

Appears to be as upset by the timing of Russia's very barbaric assault against Ukraine overnight than he is indeed with the act, pleading in quite familiar terms to Vladimir to stop.

Now, of course, just hours earlier, he had called Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy inflammatory for his remarks, suggesting that he wasn't willing for Ukraine to recognize occupied Crimea as part of Russian territory. Trump in the same post saying that in fact they may not even need Ukraine to do that.

This may, it seems, be something the United States offers to do unilaterally to sweeten a peace deal for Russia.

But yet again we see Russia showing its intent to attack Ukraine, 70 missiles used here and perhaps the intensity of these strikes aimed to expose, poke holes in Ukraine's air defenses, beleaguered as they are with President Zelenskyy in the past, having said that they are urgently in need of the Patriot interceptor missiles that can stop Russian ballistic missile attacks.

But a real sense of urgency over this peace deal and Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy during a trip to South Africa, which he cut short to deal with the strikes on Kyiv and Ukraine, saying that after Wednesday's meeting in London, which had been downgraded from Secretary of State level to mere U.S., European and Ukrainian officials, that in fact a document had been placed on President Trump's desk with a kind of ameliorated or altered suggestion of a peace deal.

I presume that will form part of U.S. envoy Stephen Witkoff's trip to Moscow on Friday, something he will then present to Russian officials. It is clear that Trump, according to a European official I spoke to once apiece within his first hundred days in office, that does appear to be something elusive at this stage, but things are moving quickly as indeed is the pressure mounting on Ukraine to make concessions, things that frankly appear impossible for Zelenskyy indeed to accept, indeed for also many of his European allies as well.

But an intensity here to reach some kind of conclusion, really accelerated by the demands domestically of the White House for some element of success in their foreign policy initiatives with those they're negotiating with keener for a slower result, Ukraine for one, more in its favor and perhaps for Russia keen to drag their feet as long as they can.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: And I'm joined now by Steven Erlanger, who's the Chief Diplomatic Correspondent for the "New York Times" and he's joining us from Berlin. Good to see you again.

So President Trump's post on social media, "Vladimir, stop," not exactly the most forceful pushback from the White House. It's even become a meme now. So it's not likely that Vladimir will stop, is it?

[03:05:05]

STEVEN ERLANGER, CHIEF DIPLOMATIC CORRESPONDENT, "NEW YORK TIMES": No, Trump likes these slightly childish things that he does. I mean, and Putin is trying to put pressure on Ukraine.

He's also putting pressure on Trump. I mean, the problem with Trump's great desire is he's really eager to have a win and his staff is eager to have a win. And they're much more eager to have a ceasefire than Putin is or even Ukraine under these circumstances.

The deal the Americans are proposing, it's vague and a sort of framework deal, but it isn't quite as unfair to Ukraine as some people think. I believe it does have some real concession sops to Russia. And of course, the territorial compromise is very hard for Ukraine, but that's reality biting.

BRUNHUBER: Yes. Now, President Trump sort of issuing sort of a new reality, I guess, claiming that Russia's big concession was not taking all of Ukraine. I mean, that seems like an unusual way to see things, to say the least.

ERLANGER: Well, it's very unusual and it's also wrong because Russia has been prevented from taking all of Ukraine by the bravery of Ukrainians with the help of their allies, which have included certainly in the past, the United States. So, the Ukraine has 900,000 people serving in its military. It's not a pushover.

Russia thought it would take Ukraine in three or four days. It's been three years. They've lost nearly a million troops by death and by wounding.

So, it's pretty stagnant right now, the front line. So, I think when Trump says that, it gives you an indication of what he actually thinks about the war and how wrong I think some of his perceptions can be.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, so Trump's envoy, as we said, is expected to meet with Putin today. So, in terms of what to expect, and this kind of was building on what you were saying earlier about the different approaches here.

President Trump has said the clock is ticking. Russia seems happy to watch it tick. Lavrov said talks are moving in the right direction. But is that just Moscow stringing things along? Because for Putin, the longer talks go on, the better the deal seems to get.

ERLANGER: Well, the longer they go on, the more Trump seems to blame Zelenskyy. He's very reluctant to blame Vladimir Putin, which is one reason why the frustration yesterday was modestly interesting, because I think he really feels Ukraine as being difficult and not recognizing that it has somehow lost the war. Ukrainians don't feel they've lost the war.

I mean, they're perfectly open, I feel, to some territorial compromise that isn't set into law. I mean, their constitution says that Crimea is part of Ukraine, and they won't give it up. So, what Trump is suggesting, what the Americans are suggesting is the U.S. would recognize Crimea as Russian, but no one else has to.

Now, that's a big change in American foreign policy for the last 70 years, but it doesn't compel Ukraine to do something Ukraine doesn't want to do. I mean, after all, the Baltic nations, Russia had seized and annexed them after World War II, and the United States refused to recognize their annexation, and in fact, many years later, they were freed when the Soviet Union began to fall apart. So, these things happen in history.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, huge change, as you say, but we don't know what the implications of that foreign policy change will have for other countries, for China, for example.

I want to, before we go, take advantage of your diplomatic expertise here. So, we have reporting that Donald Trump has privately told advisors that mediating a deal has been more difficult than he anticipated. So, did he really think it would be easy? I mean, it seems naive. What does that say about his approach to diplomacy and the advice, perhaps, that he's getting?

ERLANGER: Well, that's a good question. I mean, he's a businessman, and businessmen do deals, and he wants to do a deal with Russia. I mean, Ukraine's in the way. He wants to normalize business relations and diplomatic relations with Russia and his pal, Vladimir Putin, and I think the problem with the Trump court in his second term, as he's gotten older, is he's surrounded himself with acolytes and sycophants.

[03:10:00]

And he mistrusts some of the people who tell him different forms of reality, and they are attacked themselves by his MAGA acolytes, who tend to be younger and more ideological. So, I think the question implies the answer, which is that the world is more complicated than New York real estate is, and Trump, in a way, knows that.

I mean, he tried that with North Korea in his first term. He got frustrated and walked away. I think he just thinks, oh, you know, it's terrible.

People are dying. It's so simple. Let's stop the war.

Well, it's never that simple. People fight for real things.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, absolutely. Listen, we'll have to leave it there. I really appreciate getting your analysis.

Steven Erlanger, thank you so much.

ERLANGER: Thank you.

BRUNHUBER: Cardinals from around the world are expected to meet at the Vatican this hour as they prepare to choose the next leader of the Catholic Church. The Vatican says nearly 130,000 people have gathered to pay their respects to Pope Francis before his funeral on Saturday.

You're seeing live pictures right now as his body's been lying in state at St. Peter's Basilica since Wednesday. A few hours ago, its doors reopened for the third and final time before the Pope's coffin is closed. The Vatican says 50 heads of state and 10 reigning monarchs will attend his funeral.

CNN's Barbie Latza Nadeau is live in Rome. So, Barbie, bring us up to speed on the latest preparations for the funeral and what we're expecting to see and who will be there.

BARBIE LATZA NADEAU, CNN REPORTER: Yes, you know, it is just the atmosphere in Rome is just incredible today. It's a national holiday here. So many Romans, many people who don't have to go to work are making their way to St. Peter's to try to get to see the Pope lying in state.

But the preparations for the funeral have been underway, obviously, even before his death. These things are a finely-oiled machine. But what makes it so unique this time, this particular Pope wants to be buried in a church that's about six kilometers away from St. Peter's.

So what you're going to have is sort of this corteo (ph), sort of his coffin will be taken through the streets of ancient Rome, around the monuments. It'll go past, as we understand the route to be, past the Colosseum and past some of the ancient Roman forms. So that's really just going to be almost a magical moment tomorrow.

And the funeral starts at 10:00. It'll be a high Catholic mass. It'll be very long.

And then he's going to be greeted at the Church of St. Mary Major by the homeless people and the impoverished people with whom he shared such a connection. You know, these are the people that he invited into St. Peter's when he celebrated his birthdays and his anniversaries.

And so it's a really touching way to end his reign and to be buried in this church that meant so much to him and means so much to the Jesuits and means so much to his order and to the people that are close to him.

So it's going to be a really incredible day. Heads of state, Donald Trump will be here, monarchs and royal families across Europe. And so it's just a really special moment for the city of Rome, Kim.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, absolutely. I can imagine. So while all of this is going on, there have been meetings ongoing,

the general congregations in the lead up to choosing the next pope. So give us a look ahead. What happens next?

LATZA NADEAU: Yes, you know, the conclave obviously is on everyone's mind after and before tomorrow, but certainly after tomorrow. They haven't set the date for the conclave yet, but the cardinals will be gathering. We know that the Sistine Chapel is going to be closed from Monday.

So all those tourists here who had their tickets are going to have to get their refunds. They won't be able to visit the Sistine Chapel because they'll have to prepare the Sistine Chapel for the voting process.

And one of the preparations that's most important is to put the stove in which the ballots are burned and that white smoke eventually comes out of the chimney. But there's politicking going on. People are choosing their favorites, trying to make alliances because you have to have a two-thirds majority among the voting cardinals to elect the pope.

So a lot of that is done ahead of time, obviously, but every vote will count. And it's a secret ballot. So even if they make alliances on the outside, who knows what they're actually going to vote once they're in that sacred place.

But the conclave, everyone's eyes will be on that chimney when that conclave starts, Kim.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, indeed. Barbie Latza Nadeau in Rome, I really appreciate that. Thanks so much.

Well, those who knew the man who eventually became Pope Francis are reflecting on his legacy. CNN's David Culver reports from his hometown of Buenos Aires in Argentina.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID CULVER, CNN SR. U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A familiar voice to the world. But deeply personal for Ana Maria Cariaga.

[03:15:02]

CULVER: For WhatsApp, no? Using WhatsApp, which I didn't know the pope used WhatsApp, but it sent a voice message for Ana Maria.

CULVER (voice-over): Ana Maria knew Pope Francis long before he was pontiff. They met through her mom, Esther.

CULVER: So he was in technical school and at that time he was in a laboratory doing work and her mom was his boss.

There was a moment that Pope Francis, as just Jorge Bergoglio, turned in some work and her mom noticed, well, you did that really quickly. And he said, well, I just copied. They're all the same.

And she said, no, take it back. You need to redo it and do it right. And in this way, the Pope has often referred to Esther as the person who taught him work ethic.

CULVER (voice-over): The Pope shared that story in his final book, "Hope", writing that Esther, quote, "taught me to think, by which I mean to think about politics." It was in this back room of Santa Cruz Church that Esther and fellow dissidents, including members of the Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo, gathered to plan political protests during Argentina's so-called Dirty War, the government's brutal campaign against suspected dissidents.

But in June 1977, that resistance became personal. Soldiers took Esther's daughter, Ana Maria, into custody. She was just 16 and three months pregnant.

Francis would later write, quote, "she described how she had been kept in chains, hooded, stripped naked, beaten, her face suffocated by plastic bags, her body burned with cigarettes."

Four months later, Ana Maria was released. But the regime soon turned its focus to her mother.

CULVER: December 8, 1977, after her mom and a few others were meeting here in this church, they walked out. And as soon as they stepped out, 12 of them were taken into custody.

CULVER (voice-over): The Pope wrote how his dear friend Esther was tortured, drugged, and thrown alive from a plane into the ocean. One of up to 30,000 people killed or disappeared during Argentina's darkest days.

Her remains weren't identified until 2005. Francis, then Cardinal Bergoglio, asked that she be laid to rest at Santa Cruz Church, where her fight for justice began. He never forgot her.

Esther's portrait hung in his private study at the Vatican. And he stayed in touch with Ana Maria over the years.

Last August, Ana Maria's daughter, the child she carried in captivity, met with Pope Francis at the Vatican.

CULVER: He recorded a video message for her just last year, not even a year ago.

And part of his message that he sent out to her was to maintain in your mind the memories and to keep present what happened, basically to never forget.

CULVER (voice-over): Remembering so as to not repeat a painful past.

CULVER: And even though Pope Francis never made it back here to Argentina as Pope, folks we spoke with said that he was still incredibly present. And you saw it there with Ana Maria and her family. He built those relationships over 76 years living in this country. And then in the 12 years that he was pontiff, he maintained them, even if that meant sending voice notes or videos through WhatsApp.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: And you can join CNN for Pope Francis' funeral on Saturday. Our special coverage begins at 8 a.m. in Rome, 7 a.m. in London, and 2 a.m. on the U.S. East Coast.

There was growing fallout from the deadly terror attack on tourists in disputed Kashmir. Relations between India and Pakistan plummet to their worst level in years. We have more on that story and others coming up, please stay with us.

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[03:20:00]

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BRUNHUBER: Ties between Pakistan and India are cratering after the deadly attack in disputed Kashmir that left 26 tourists dead. On Thursday, Pakistan suspended trade with India, closed its airspace, cancelled visas for Indian nationals and expelled Indian diplomats. Now those actions are retaliation for similar measures from India the day before.

New Delhi also suspended a crucial water-sharing treaty for the first time and shut a key border crossing. India says the measures are in response to Pakistan's alleged support for, quote, cross-border terrorism.

India's Prime Minister on Thursday vowed to pursue the attackers to the ends of the earth. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NARENDRA MODI, INDIAN PRIME MINISTER: Today, from the soil of Bihar, I say to the whole world, India will identify, track and punish every terrorist and their backer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: On Thursday, Kashmir police named three suspects allegedly involved in the terror attack but didn't say how the men were identified. Two of the three are Pakistani nationals. Pakistan denies any involvement.

I want to bring in CNN's Sophia Saifi who's live in Islamabad. So Sophia, bring us up to speed on the latest and the possible fallout if this escalates even further.

SOPHIA SAIFI, CNN PRODUCER: Well, Kim, there is a very strong sense of deja vu here in Pakistan, an uncomfortable sense of deja vu because back in 2019, we saw something similar unfold when there was a militant attack in Indian-administered Kashmir. There were then airstrikes within Pakistan proper, which then led to a dogfight and then a de-escalation.

The issue at hand at the moment is that the attack that took place in India a couple of days ago was actually attacking civilians.

[03:25:05]

So the concern right now is who is going to be targeted if India does carry out an airstrike within Pakistan? Will it be in Pakistan proper? Which province will it be in? There is a lot of trepidation here at the moment.

Pakistan's Foreign Minister, yesterday as well as today, have come out and said that India is playing a blame game, that it's being irresponsible, that it's calling for war when it hasn't provided any evidence to Pakistan or to the world, according to the Pakistani foreign minister, linking Pakistan to the attack that took place in India.

Pakistan's Defense Minister has stated that if a single Pakistani civilian is martyred, then India will pay through the nose. So there is strong language coming out of Pakistan. Of course, India has suspended the Indus Water Treaty, which has held since the 1960s.

That's going to eventually have a huge impact on water supply into Pakistan, which is an agrarian society as well. At the same time, we've been speaking to people who live near the line of control, the border separating India and Pakistan-administered Kashmir.

They're incredibly concerned, because they have always been at the forefront when things begin to escalate between these two nuclear- armed nations.

They're cleaning out their bunkers. They're preparing their children. Things are somewhat normal.

But again, a reluctance amongst the general population of Pakistan for any sort of military escalation. However, people are going to support anything that does happen.

There is, of course, that sense of patriotism here as well. But concerns as to how Delhi will react and how then that will eventually maybe snowball out into something out of everyone's control.

The U.N. has called for restraint. And we're just going to have to wait and see if that is what happens or something worse. Kim?

BRUNHUBER: Yes, that story will keep following. Sophia Saifi in the Pakistani capital. Thank you so much.

Israel now admits it was responsible for an aid worker's death in Gaza last month. The United Nations says the 51-year-old relief worker was killed when Israeli troops attacked this U.N. guest house.

Initially, Israel's foreign ministry accused the U.N. of baseless slander for saying Israel was responsible. Israeli officials now say their initial investigation shows the worker was killed by Israeli tank fire. The IDF says it regrets the incident and is working to prevent more like it from happening again.

Ukraine's capital is trying to get back on its feet after the deadliest wave of Russian strikes in months. But just a day after those attacks, a U.S. envoy plans to talk peace with Moscow. That's ahead.

Plus, we're following reports from China about the first tariff exemptions in the trade war with the U.S. You're watching "CNN Newsroom."

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[03:30:00]

BRUNHUBER: Welcome back to all of you watching us around the world, I'm Kim Brunhuber, this is "CNN Newsroom." Let's check today's top stories.

U.S. envoy Steve Witkoff is expected in Moscow today for possible talks with Russian leader Vladimir Putin. On Thursday, Russia carried out deadly strikes on Kyiv, killing at least 12 people and wounding 90. U.S. President Donald Trump urged the Russian leader to stop the attacks, Trump didn't say if he would impose more sanctions on Russia.

The Vatican is expecting another day of big crowds ahead of Pope Francis' funeral tomorrow. We're told nearly 130,000 mourners have already paid their respects as the Pope lies in state at St. Peter's Basilica. The Vatican says 50 heads of state and 10 reigning monarchs will attend his funeral.

Pakistan has suspended trade with India, closed its airspace, cancelled visas for Indian nationals and expelled Indian diplomats. That's all retaliation for similar actions from India. On Wednesday, the tit-for-tat measures follow a terror attack in the disputed Kashmir region that killed 26 tourists earlier this week.

Beijing could be making its first concession in the ongoing trade war with the U.S. Import agencies in Shenzhen say China appears to have quietly rolled back retaliatory tariffs of 125 percent on some microchips and semiconductors made in the U.S.

Chinese authorities haven't officially confirmed the exemptions, but they are speaking out against President Donald Trump's repeated claims that talks are underway to resolve the trade war.

The foreign ministry called it fake news, saying China and the U.S. haven't engaged in any consultations, let alone reached any agreement. Trump has said he's optimistic about a deal that will lower tariffs on China from the current 145 percent.

Reporters asked him about the talks with Beijing on Thursday at the White House. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Can you clarify with whom the U.S. is speaking with China? They're saying it's fake news that trade talks are happening.

TRUMP: Well, they had a meeting this morning, so I can't tell you. It doesn't matter who they is. We may reveal it later, but they had meetings this morning.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[03:35:09]

BRUNHUBER: Marina Yue Zhang is an associate professor at the University of Technology Sydney. She is also the co-author of the book "Demystifying China's Innovation Machine - Chaotic Order", and she joined us from Canberra, Australia.

Thank you so much for being here with us. So we're reporting that China appears to have quietly rolled back retaliatory tariffs of 125 percent on some semiconductors made in the U.S. How do you read this move and do you think Donald Trump can now say, see, my plan worked?

MARINA YUE ZHANG, ASSOC. PROF., UNIVERSITY OF TECHNOLOGY SYDNEY: I don't think so. I think both sides are playing a kind of game still. And judging by the ambiguity in Trump's messages that, well, the who are the, so to speak, is that message, that gesture can be perceived as he blinks first.

And -- but of course, China is, I read in social media there, there are a lot of posts suggesting that China is indeed cancelling the import tariffs on semiconductors. But semiconductors are very special products because they're hardly end products. They're used as intermediary in other products.

So most of those products are for exports market. And if China doesn't do this and this will make an export market exports even further than challenging.

So you can see that's kind of a China quietly using a very pragmatic approach to sort of de-escalate the tensions between the two countries. But I don't think that will be perceived at least by the people in China, by its own citizens, as Beijing conceding ground to Trump.

BRUNHUBER: Yes, I guess I mean, it's still a question who blinked first here. I mean, President Trump slapped these huge tariffs on China. China reciprocated. Trump now in general seems to be backing down.

So is this how China hoped this would all play out?

YUE ZHANG: Well, China is, especially in this game, I think both leaders, they have totally different styles of leadership. And Beijing is not going to engage in any of this kind of ceremonial diplomacy by -- meeting by Xi meeting Trump.

If Beijing is going to meet Trump, that is an agreement, concrete agreements have been achieved through negotiations behind doors.

So Xi is not going to engage in this social media diplomacy. So if I use Chinese traditional military philosophy, this is some of this art of war. That is, well, if I use strategic defense, that actually is the best offense, because Beijing could buy time.

So that Beijing can build its alternative channels for export for export markets and also sort of helping the local domestic manufacturers to build channels to serve the domestic market.

BRUNHUBER: All right. So in the meantime, then, even if tariffs are reduced or eliminated, I mean, how much damage, both economically and politically, diplomatically and so on, has been done here?

YUE ZHANG: Well, pretty bad. I mean, I don't think Beijing wants to reach this stage of face off because but pretty much trade used to be the anchor for the bilateral relationship between the U.S. and China.

But now this trade obviously is ground to almost zero. These tariffs over 100 percent, so this is pretty bad.

And the competition between the two countries are at the three levels. And the first is obviously military, national security. And put that aside and trade technology, trade and technology, especially technological dominance of each country that is pretty heating up.

And the third is that both countries are using diplomacy to increase their spheres of influence. And this is if the competition are going on at all these three levels, that is almost a full blown competition.

[03:40:07]

BRUNHUBER: Yes. Well, listen, we only have about a minute left. But since you're talking about sort of, you know, bilateral relations there in spheres of influence, especially I want to widen this out.

Now, you've written of President Trump, quote, his Make America Great Again doctrine conflates national renewal with international disruption, transforming U.S. influence from a stabilizing force into a tool of coercion. So from a trade perspective, where does that leave America's allies? It's really forcing them to make some difficult choices here.

YUE ZHANG: Indeed, a very, very challenging choices for countries like Vietnam, even Australia, because those countries, especially countries like Vietnam, they're relying heavily on China's supply chains, but the export markets are relying on the U.S. So this is really not not going to be good. But for countries like Australia, I mean, Australia is facing the federal election.

And this is, again, a very tough choice for those countries. China itself, as because of the size, it can last a bit longer. And especially Xi doesn't need to answer to any electoral cycle.

So it's sort of a time is at China's side. But for those countries, it's tough. BRUNHUBER: It's certainly a fascinating faceoff between these two

superpowers. But the reverberations are felt around the world.

Marina Yue Zhang in Canberra, I really appreciate it. Thank you so much.

YUE ZHANG: Thank you for having me. Bye.

BRUNHUBER: All right, still to come, Canadians are leaning into patriotism ahead of upcoming national elections. How they plan to use their votes to combat threats from President Donald Trump. That's coming up straight ahead, stay with us.

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[03:45:00]

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BRUNHUBER: U.S. President Donald Trump's tariffs, threats and insults have resulted in a surge of patriotism in Canada. Voters say Monday's national election will be a turning point in their relationship with America. Some say they might switch parties in the hopes of securing a stronger response to Trump's threats.

Here's CNN's John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Rock Maple Lodge spans 200 acres, more than 2000 maple trees, 11 miles of lines to carry the syrup back to be boiled, filtered and bottled.

This is Peter Hamilton's business and his escape.

He also farms wheat, soybeans and corn, sells some timber.

PETER HAMILTON, CANADIAN VOTER: So to be here 54 years and absolute, just thrilled that we're able to do this.

KING: Sounds like you're working harder now, though.

HAMILTON: I would like to go back one more time to play some hockey.

KING (voice-over): A proud Canadian, now more than ever. Yes, a lifelong conservative, but Canada First is Hamilton's motto as voters here pick a new parliament and a new prime minister.

HAMILTON: The bottom line is the Liberals and the Conservatives have got to work together here. They can't be nitpicking and arguing amongst each other. We have to work together to make this country go ahead.

KING (voice-over): Work together, he says, because suddenly the United States feels so far away. Rock Maple Lodge is in Ontario, just 65 miles from Toronto. It's just 100 miles to the border and Buffalo. But it doesn't feel that close with Donald Trump in the White House.

HAMILTON: There is no friends, no more. The biggest thing in Canada is we have friends all over the world. How many friends does Americans have right now?

KING (voice-over): The Trump effect on Canada's election cannot be overstated. You see more Canadian flags now, more of these signs, too. Federal elections here are often defined by east versus west, urban versus rural, English versus French, liberal versus conservative, but Trump versus Canada defines this one.

Just weeks ago, some of the flowers here at Lola Blooms came from the United States. Not anymore.

Sisters-in-law Lindsay Smith and Kaitlynn Strain are buying elsewhere now. Their answer to Trump's threats of tariffs or making Canada the 51st state.

LINDSAY SMITH, CANADIAN VOTER: It's more Donald Trump. I feel like he's a bully in this situation. We're supposed to be allies, we thought we're on like a friendship level.

KING (voice-over): Some of the vases and other hardware still come from the states. But Smith and Strain are looking for alternatives.

KING: And when you hear him call you prime minister, governor, or say that, you know, this would make a great 51st state. What's that make you think?

KAITLYNN STRAIN, CANADIAN VOTER: Very insulting.

SMITH: We need a strong leader who won't stand up for. Bullying.

KING (voice-over): They both traditionally support the Green Party, but both are leaning liberal this time.

KING: If the liberals are going to win or the conservatives are going to win, you want them to win by what a healthy enough margin so that they're viewed as a strong leader?

SMITH: Yes. You put your vote where it counts a little more in this situation.

KING: Is that just because of Donald Trump?

SMITH: Yes.

STRAIN: Unfortunately. Yes.

KING (voice-over): Canadians see this as much bigger than who gets the most seats in Parliament and gets to pick a Prime Minister. It's about spending more in the military, buying local, finding new markets and new partners. Dropping any thought the ruts with Trump can just be smoothed over.

[03:50:04]

TOBY GORMAN, CANADIAN VOTER: I put up a flag myself. I never thought I would put up a Canadian flag. But I think when it comes down to crunch time, Canadians really gather up.

KING (voice-over): Toby Gorman is an environmental journalist and author and a pickup hockey player in the Canadian Beer League. Passionate about the climate crisis, but likely to pass on his top choice this election, it hopes he can help liberals win a big enough mandate to counter Trump.

GORMAN: If it was any other election without the U.S. situation, without, you know, the crisis we have going on, I would probably go with green. Just push it.

KING (voice-over): Gorman says he is hardly alone here in rethinking everything.

GORMAN: We're just sick of them. You know, and it's only been three months into the tournament. You know, he's going to an excess. He wants to crush us economically.

I think at first it was kind of like losing your best friend. We're like, you know what? What just happened? Like what's happening?

But now I think we're at the point where it's like, well, we can move on.

KING (voice-over): That's a big shift. This election defined by the belief Canada and the United States are suddenly more rivals than neighbors. Suddenly no longer skating in the same direction.

John King, CNN, Cordis, Ontario.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: And we meet the tailors who will be carrying on a centuries old tradition to dress the next pope. Stay with us.

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BRUNHUBER: We're seeing live pictures of St. Peter's Basilica, where nearly 130,000 mourners have now bid farewell to Pope Francis. That's according to the Vatican. His body is lying in state for a third and final day ahead of his funeral tomorrow.

Cardinals from around the world are expected to meet the Vatican this hour as they prepare to choose the next leader of the Catholic Church.

So while the process to select the next pope won't start until sometime next month, the Gammarelli family hopes to dress whomever is elected. The family has served as tailors to popes, cardinals and other clergy for centuries.

CNN's Ben Wedeman explains.

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BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Pope Francis was a man of simple tastes, usually dressed in a plain white cassock. His predecessor, Benedict XVI, was big on tradition.

Few know better the whims of papal fashion than the Gammarelli family. Tailors to the clergy, from priests to bishops, cardinals to popes.

Every pope has his own style, says Lorenzo Gammarelli, because apart from being a pope, they are humans who have their own taste.

[03:55:07]

Around the corner from Piazza della Minerva in Rome, they have more than two centuries of experience.

WEDEMAN: The Gammarelli family has been in business for six generations, open since 1798.

WEDEMAN (voice-over): For the past eight conclaves, Gammarelli has prepared three outfits, small, medium and large, ready to wear for whoever is chosen.

Here it's business as usual until an order arrives from the pontiff.

Keep in mind, it's not like making an outfit for another person, Lorenzo tells me. When it's for the pope, we concentrate fully on that outfit.

He was hesitant to talk prices. I asked if I wanted to buy a bishop's outfit, how much would it cost?

First, you have to become a bishop, he responded. Not likely.

Stockings are more within the price range of those rising through the ranks. Rozenn Dedeyan from France bought a pair for her priest.

ROZENN DEDEYAN, FRENCH TOURIST: So we were in front of this very famous shop, and I knew that the Pope's socks came from here. So I asked him, would you like a pair of socks from Gammarelli? And he said, oh, well, if you insist.

So we bought the socks.

WEDEMAN (voice-over): Pope Francis became a Gammarelli client when he was appointed cardinal 24 years ago. Today's cardinal and client could be tomorrow's pope.

Who do you think will be the next pope? I ask, who is most papabile? Of the latest popes, says Lorenzo, we were only able to guess Pope Benedict would be elected. All the others were a surprise.

Ben Wedeman, CNN, Rome.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BRUNHUBER: And you can join CNN for Pope Francis's funeral on Saturday. Our special coverage begins at 8 a.m. in Rome, 7 a.m. in London and 2 a.m. on the U.S. East Coast.

All right, thanks so much for joining me. I'm Kim Brunhuber, in Atlanta. "Amanpour" is next, then there's more news on "Early Start" with Rahel Solomon in about an hour.

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