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Thousands Gather To Honor Life Of Conservative Activist; California Bans Most Officers And ICE From Wearing Masks On Duty; Trump Says Bondi Doing Great Job After Blasting Her On Social Media. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired September 21, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:36]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: You are in the CNN NEWSROOM on this Sunday. I'm Pamela Brown with Boris Sanchez, and we begin with some breaking news for you today.

Massive crowds have packed State Farm Stadium near Phoenix, Arizona to attend the memorial service for slain conservative activist, Charlie Kirk. That stadium, near capacity right now, with some people already being turned away and directed to overflow areas.

Mourners began lining up as early as 2:30 this morning, local time, to get a seat, and a spokesperson for the Glendale Police Department telling CNN that in total, more than 200,000 people may try to attend the event.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was devastated. I cried. Tears of -- and I am just -- I really had a strong -- I wanted to be here to honor him and his life and his family and what he stood for.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was like a brother in Christ who was shot and killed, and it was like I felt that. Like it felt like a member of the family and it was -- it was really hard.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was like losing a brother. Like, I am an only child, so it was hard for me. And I haven't mourned like that since the death of my father and it is very tough.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: We are, of course, expecting to hear from many high profile speakers today, including President Trump himself, who just moments ago we saw deplane at Luke Air Force Base and board The Beast on his way to State Farm Stadium in Glendale.

We are also expecting to hear from Vice President J.D. Vance as well as members of the President's Cabinet, who are expected to deliver remarks including Secretary of State Marco Rubio and Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.

We will also, of course, be hearing from Charlie Kirk's widow, Mrs. Erika Kirk. We are going to bring you live coverage from the event all afternoon.

Let's start on the ground with Arlette Saenz in Glendale.

Arlette, what are you hearing?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Boris, this memorial service has been underway for just over an hour, as we have really heard, many personal testimonies from people who directly knew the slain conservative activist, Charlie Kirk.

Now, we've heard people speaking in very personal terms, in Christian terms, as they talked about his connection with God and his faith. We've also heard stories from people who worked with him, including one individual who helped introduce Charlie Kirk to his wife, Erika Kirk.

These are all remembrances that people want to share with the tens of thousands of people who had gathered here at the State Farm Stadium in Glendale, Arizona. There is barely any empty seats in this house, as people have come to pay tribute and honor the life of Charlie Kirk.

Now, while you've heard people speak in very spiritual tones, there has also been references from multiple speakers describing Charlie Kirk as a martyr and saying that his movement is just beginning.

Statements like that have prompted large rounds of applause from the crowd that has gathered here, but we spent some time before the service began really speaking to people who decided to spend their Sunday here at this service. There are young conservatives who said that they connected with Charlie Kirk over his Christian faith, and others who said that they've really been inspired by his ability to reach out to people with differences of opinion, to talk through those matters.

Here is one of the women that we spoke with earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He has had a very strong impact, that he is showing -- he is showing fairness. He always showed fairness to everybody. Even when he was having his get togethers at the campuses, he would always invite the ones that didn't agree with him to come up and talk first. You know, to get a dialogue going, talk to one another, you know that's huge. Not many people do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: Now, as you mentioned, President Trump landed in Arizona just a short while ago. He will be making his way here to the stadium, where he is expected to be the final speaker for this event.

We will hear from many Cabinet members and Vice President J.D. Vance, who has talked about how he believed Charlie Kirk helped bring him into the MAGA Movement. We've already seen people like Secretary -- HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. and Pentagon Chief Pete Hegseth arrive. Also on hand today is the Tesla CEO and a former top administration official, Elon Musk.

[15:05:10]

When he actually entered the arena, there were some people who spotted him and there were loud rounds of applause that erupted for him. So that kind of paints a picture of the type of people who are here at this event, as they're trying to honor Charlie Kirk's life and his influence that he had on the conservative movement, especially young conservative voters.

SANCHEZ: Arlette Saenz, thank you so much for the update there.

BROWN: And with us now is CNN Washington Bureau Chief and political director, David Chalian and CNN senior White House correspondent, Kristen Holmes.

David, i just want to take a step back and look at this big picture. When you look at who is in attendance there, there are so many administration officials, right? President trump, we know, is enroute there to the stadium. Some of the speakers credit Charlie Kirk with their position in the administration. You look at RFK, Jr., Tulsi Gabbard, Pete Hegseth, and then you're going to hear from --

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF AND POLITICAL DIRECTOR: J.D. Vance.

BROWN -- J.D. Vance, too. I mean, the Vice President. That's right. I mean, even going back to when he was running for Senate, right?

CHALIAN: Yes.

BROWN: Just help us understand the significance of this.

CHALIAN: Well, you know, Steve Bannon, a big mouthpiece for the MAGA Movement said it was sort of akin to a MAGA state funeral, and it is a moment where we see a political movement in mourning and it is an extraordinary moment in the aftermath of this horrific assassination and political violence, a sort of coming together of the movement that Charlie Kirk was so intertwined in its lifeblood.

I mean, he brought not just an organizing principle to it in terms of generating enthusiasm of young people, getting them registered, getting them to participate as a part of this movement. You know, but he was part of the fiber of the movement.

I do, you know -- I am looking to see today as this unfolds how much of this service is in remembrance of Charlie Kirk versus how much of this is trying to promote a political agenda and a political project going forward? And that -- what that balance is, i think, is something we will be sort of assessing as the day goes forward.

SANCHEZ: And we know, Kristen, that President Trump has had a hand directly in figuring out what remarks and what balance he is going to strike in the context that Dave gave us. What are you hearing from sources at The White House?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I think that one thing to keep in mind is that when we hear from sources close to President Trump, that this is going to be deeply personal and that this is something that he has a hand in, what President Trump views as a speech in mourning might not be the same that everyone views as a speech in mourning.

And so, it is unclear whether or not he is going to touch on these different political aspects. Of course, as we know, one of the first things that he did after announcing that Charlie Kirk had died from that assassin's bullet was going to the Oval Office and make a statement that was incredibly passionate, but also placed a lot of blame -- it was a political speech. He placed blame on the left.

Since then, we've seen the administration go after various leftist groups saying that they are going to shut them down or investigate them. It is unclear whether what tone President Trump is going to strike when he actually takes the podium today, and I think one of the things I've heard is that he has still been tweaking the speech up until he actually takes the stage. Obviously, as we know, he also is one to adlib.

I do want to make one quick note about people who are in attendance. You mentioned all of these people crediting their careers to Charlie Kirk, but in addition, someone like Elon Musk, who had a fairly public falling out with the entire administration showing up there today shows you several things about who Charlie Kirk was to all of these different figures in the movement.

Sources told me at the time when Scott Bessent and Elon Musk got into their verbal/slightly physical altercation that Charlie was on the phone with both of them afterwards. He had them both on the show, and he essentially told them he wasn't going to pick sides, but he wanted them to speak their piece on his show.

We also know that when Donald Trump was publicly feuding with Elon Musk, that Charlie Kirk, who was in constant contact with the administration, was also talking to Musk, essentially saying this isn't helpful to the movement, this isn't helpful to conservatives, but yet, whatever tone he was striking when he was having those conversations, Elon Musk still showed up here today and that just shows you the kind of person he was as he was trying to navigate these various relationships and clearly did so well since these people are showing up today.

BROWN: Yes, I think that that is an interesting point to make and truly a testament of the role he played as mediator. And as David said, he was in many ways the lifeblood of the MAGA movement. I mean, I know through your reporting, my reporting, Charlie Kirk spent a lot of time in this White House. I know in the very early days, right after the inauguration, he was there in The White House helping to get it up and running.

He had very close personal relationships, and we talked about how he helped people's careers, but also there was the personal level, and that is why I think you're hearing from people like Susie Wiles, the President's chief-of-staff who we rarely hear from. She has already gone on the podcast which J.D. Vance hosted, that was Charlie Kirk's podcast.

[15:10:16]

She is going to be speaking today. What are you expecting?

HOLMES: Yes, I think that's really striking. This is not somebody who likes to speak publicly, even in interviews, she rarely sits down for an interview. So this just goes to show you how seriously this administration is taking this and how close this person was.

And one of the things I constantly got asked about in the aftermath is, what are you hearing from The White House? And I will tell you what I was hearing from The White House was grief. It was anger. It was sadness.

They felt as though a friend of theirs had been taken away, and there had been talks at some point floated that Kirk might join the administration. Instead, he really helped staff the administration, and he worked on behalf of getting President Trump's people through the Senate and getting them into their office, and they really relied on him for that.

CHALIAN: And Susie Wiles, specifically, the night of the assassination, spoke to her staff at The White House and urged them not to soften their voices that that that's not how Charlie Kirk would want them to proceed to make sure that this did not instill such a fear in them, that they didn't continue to speak out for their beliefs and pursue the President's political project and the President's agenda.

SANCHEZ: All right, David, I had a chance to speak with Van Jones last night, and he recently shared publicly that the day before Charlie Kirk was assassinated, he had sent Van a D.M.

The two had been having this very public debate about this murder in North Carolina of a Ukrainian refugee, and Van shared that Kirk invited him on his show, saying that he believed the two could disagree about the issues agreeably. Notably, Van also shared with me that he wrestled with Kirk's legacy because there is that version of Charlie Kirk that wants discourse, but then there is another in which the rhetoric is bellicose and caustic, even offensive to people like Van, and there is a lot of people out there that are now wrestling with Kirk's legacy.

CHALIAN: Yes, I mean, there is no shying away from the fact that Charlie Kirk was a controversial figure and a lightning rod in the American political landscape and discourse. Everything we've just described about his power within the MAGA Movement. And remember, we are talking about somebody who was 31 years old.

You think about what you're describing, he obviously had an enormous amount of talent as a human being to be able to have all the influence we are talking about. That doesn't mean that he didn't have policies and rhetorical comments as part of his world as a political actor that did not completely inflame his political opposition. It did.

Now, he has as you said, he invites that that opposition to engage in dialogue. That was part of his bread and butter, and I can understand why someone like Van would appreciate that, but that doesn't mean that even in this moment where obviously this entire political movement is still going through grief and memorializing him, that we shouldn't also understand that for the folks that he was on the other side, they found his politics, his policies, anathema to everything they believe about America.

So controversial, but clearly influential.

SANCHEZ: No doubt.

BROWN: All right, David, Kristen, thank you so much.

Stay with us.

SANCHEZ: Still to come, tens of thousands gathering in Arizona. Some of the biggest names in conservative politics, including the President pay their respects to Charlie Kirk's impact.

Our coverage continues in just moments. Don't go anywhere.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:18:22]

BROWN: And we are bringing you the live memorial service for Charlie Kirk outside of Phoenix, Arizona. Tens of thousands of people are right inside State Farm Stadium where the event is underway right now.

SANCHEZ: Many prominent conservatives are attending, including President Donald Trump, who is due to speak later today.

CNN's Josh Campbell joins us now live from outside the stadium.

Josh, how has law enforcement been preparing for what is no doubt a challenging day?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, the 30 acres behind me that make up the State Farm Stadium here in Glendale, this is among the most highly protected piece of land in the country right now and that is because of who is about to arrive.

We know that President Donald Trump has now landed here. His motorcade is enroute here to this location. Just in the last several minutes, you saw an already robust security posture start to change. Helicopter assets launched, a Blackhawk helicopter I am looking at. Another helicopter looks like the Customs and Border Protection.

This is all part of this massive security package after the Department of Homeland Security labeled this a SEAR 1 Security Event. That is a designation for events like the Super Bowl and other high profile events. Again, tens of thousands of people in attendance, as well as several dignitaries. It is also worth pointing out just the number of Cabinet officials here from the Trump administration who will also be in attendance.

Now, I want you to hear from some of the people that we've been talking to in and around the area that have been coming. Again, a lot of people arrived. They waited hours and hours to get in, asked a lot of them why they came, what this moment means to them. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of his message was Christ based, and it means a lot to support him. Not just in death, but even when he was alive.

A lot of his message was for the youth.

[15:20:02]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is just amazing to know that this massive amount of people could actually follow, follow good and righteous. And hopefully it will hit people who have negative thoughts about just our nation and maybe we can all come together because that's what we need to do.

CAMPBELL: Thanks for talking to us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.

CAMPBELL: Thank you so much.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: God bless you.

CAMPBELL: Yes, you as well.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: God bless you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMPBELL: Just getting a sense from people why they came here on this day and there are a couple themes I am hearing from people that I have been speaking with.

One, they're obviously trying to grapple with both having to be at a location where Charlie Kirk's life is being celebrated, but they are also in mourning because of someone that they followed and they respected, obviously slain there in Utah.

The other thing I am hearing, that's a constant theme is people talking about the future generation. It is not just them that are themselves having to experience this, but I've heard almost to a person that, look, it is the next generation who will have to contend with this increased and continued division that we continue to see.

A lot of people I am talking with saying that we hope -- they all hope that we can move past this. Of course, time will tell, guys. SANCHEZ: Josh Campbell outside State Farm Stadium, thank you so much.

Trump administration officials are now condemning a new bill signed by California Governor Gavin Newsom, which bans most law enforcement officers, including federal immigration agents from wearing masks on duty. The move comes as a direct response to the recent immigration raids in L.A., where ICE agents wore masks while making arrests.

BROWN: Homeland Security Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs Tricia McLaughlin called the bill "despicable and a flagrant attempt to endanger our officers."

CNN's Julia Vargas Jones joins us now.

So Julia, what are you hearing from state officials?

JULIA VARGAS JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, they are doubling down, basically, as Governor Gavin Newsom was presenting this new legislation, Pamela, he said that the argument here is that anyone on American soil has the right to due process, even undocumented immigrants. He said that the public has lost their trust in public officers and federal law enforcement here, and that this bill is actually an attempt to restore that trust. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): The impact of these policies all across this city, our state and nation are terrifying. It is like a dystopian sci- fi movie.

Unmarked cars, people in masks, people quite literally disappearing. No due process, no rights, no rights in a democracy where we have rights.

Immigrants have rights and we have the right to stand up and push back, and that's what we are doing here today.

This is a disgrace!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JONES: Now, Newsom said that this is supposed to go into effect on January 1st, and some of the details here, Pamela, it will ban all kinds of masks, but that will exclude anything that is a medical mask. It includes undercover agents. It excludes any kind of tactical gear and that does not apply to state police.

This is saying that basically agents will have to identify themselves, show identification and say which federal agency they are part of if they are conducting operations in Los Angeles.

Now, it is supposed to go into effect on January 1st. The Governor said that he is already expecting some pushback, and that pushback has already been coming, as you mentioned, from the DHS with Tricia McLaughlin saying that this is an affront to those officers. She said on X: "While our federal law enforcement officers are being assaulted by rioters and having rocks and Molotov cocktails thrown at them, a sanctuary politician," referring to Newsom "... is trying to outlaw officers wearing masks to protect themselves from being doxed and targeted by known and suspected terrorist sympathizers."

That is an argument that Newsom has already refuted. He said that DHS has failed to provide any kind of data to back that up, that there has been a rise in assaults or threats to those kinds of officers. But aside from this pushback from DHS, what is more important here is the question of how this will be enforced in the coming months.

You know, we've heard from the California Attorney General here in California, acting California Attorney General, that agents will continue to use masks as they carry out those operations. So we will have to see in the coming months how this will be enforced in the streets of California.

All right, Julia Vargas Jones, thanks so much.

And coming up, President Trump has arrived at State Farm Stadium outside Phoenix as the memorial for Charlie Kirk continues.

Much more coming up.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:29:06]

SANCHEZ: Just moments ago, President Donald Trump arrived in Glendale, Arizona, for the memorial of Charlie Kirk, and we are expecting to hear from the President along with other several prominent Republicans and administration officials in the coming hours.

Our panel is back with us now. CNN's David Chalian and Kristen Holmes, also CNN political commentators, Xochitl Hinojosa and Shermichael Singleton. Thank you so much for all being with us.

Shermichael, first to you, what are you expecting to hear specifically from the President at a time of political division in which, since Kirk's assassination, he has mostly pointed the finger at the opposing party?

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think he will probably talk a lot about how critical Charlie was to his electoral success in November. I think about former political scientist, Joseph Overton. He will talk about -- you think about the Overton window and how difficult it was for Republicans to talk about what was perceived as acceptable issues among younger voters.

Charlie completely flipped that upside down. I mean, I remember David Chalian talking about some of those exit results last November, where you saw an increase of young men, even surprisingly, some slight increases among certain demos of younger women.

[15:30:12] The President performing better than he did in 2020. The Vice President not performing as well as then President Biden at the time with that young demographic group. And so I would suspect he will talk and focus a lot on that, and I think for Republicans writ large, Boris, the question is going to be, how do you maintain and continue that momentum, particularly for younger men, where I think Charlie was really, really effective with moving that needle forward, not just with young White men, but I would argue a subset of young men of color as well, who are very interested in some of his pronouncements about masculinity and about sort of traditionalism and the role of men in society.

I think a big question for us is how we are going to keep that mantle moving forward.

BROWN: And, you know, as we were talking about earlier, David, look, Charlie Kirk no doubt was influential, but he was also controversial and you were saying earlier, Xochi, that you don't agree with him on anything other than maybe his faith is what you were saying. As someone who didn't agree with what he espoused, how are you looking at today? And just the amount of people who are showing up, all of these administration officials, even the President of the United States speaking at this memorial service.

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, he obviously brought people together. And he also -- I mean, to Shermichael's point, he really energized a younger generation of people. And I think there is no doubt about that.

What I would love to hear from the President is more of a unifying message. We have yet to hear that from him. Immediately following the shooting, he did not have that type of message. And folks on the ground, the CNN reporting on the ground when you're talking to the conservatives that are there likely mostly Trump voters, all Trump voters, probably, a lot of them are saying they want our country to come together. They are saying that they want people to continue to talk about political violence, to and to both leaders, Democrats and Republicans to come together in a unified message.

So I think that the President needs to set that tone for the country right now. The country really wants it. They people are scared. People I know, elected leaders of both parties are scared, but we should both -- both parties should be speaking out when a tragedy like this happens.

And so my hope is that, yes, from the President and also from Democrats, that Democrats, I don't think today is the day to talk about all of our political differences. I think today is a day of mourning for our conservative friends and for family members and friends of Charlie Kirk. And I think that Democrats need to respect that.

SANCHEZ: And to that sentiment, I wonder Xochi, is there something democrats could learn from the amount of influence that Charlie Kirk had on young people, especially at such a young age? David made a point earlier that he was only 31 years old and look at the amount of influence that he was able to create.

HINOJOSA: Well, I think a lot of it was authenticity. I think that he was someone who spoke his mind, did not hold back and young voters really like that. They don't like the scripted speech that comes from the politicians. They don't like the divide.

I think one thing that really stands out about Charlie Kirk is he like to have these conversations in public and like to disagree with people. He invited our friend, Van Jones on his show just a day or two before he passed away, and they were having a disagreement about the Ukrainian woman. And so it is -- that is what young voters like. They want these honest conversations.

They want us to put aside our political differences and just talk about the issues and I think democrats can learn from that.

BROWN: And there is a lot of talk, obviously, about the politics. But you mentioned his faith and just learning more about sort of the evolution of Charlie Kirk. He started off his career as an activist more as a secular conservative political activist. And then as time went on, COVID happened, he became more outspoken about his faith, about his evangelical faith, and you're seeing a lot of that play out in the memorial service.

SINGLETON: You are -- you know, this is so fascinating. I was just looking at a study that came out maybe two to three months ago now that was talking about these trend lines that are moving in, what I would argue are more favorable direction as a proud Christian and I am very proud of my faith and I think many Christians out there are probably becoming more comfortable talking about their faith in a more outward way.

You're seeing younger people move more to going back to church, attending church, those trends --

BROWN: Men, in particular.

SINGLETON: Those trends were going in the opposite direction four years ago. Now, look, I don't have any data that shows Charlie was directly responsible for that, but I would find it hard to believe that he didn't have some type of an impact in some of those numbers moving in that direction.

SANCHEZ: Everyone, please stand by. Our coverage is going to continue in just moments. The memorial for Charlie Kirk unfolding in Glendale, Arizona, as President Trump arrives at the stadium where he is set to speak.

Don't go anywhere.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:39:35]

BROWN: And welcome back to our live coverage of the memorial service for conservative activist, Charlie Kirk. We are bringing you a live look at the tens of thousands of people right inside State Farm Stadium in Arizona where President Trump is expected to speak later today. Of course, we will bring that to you live when it happens.

But first, President Trump, for his part, is praising Attorney General Pam Bondi today, predicting she will go down as, "one of the best Attorney Generals of the ages" and that's notable because that comes just one day after he blasted her on social media.

SANCHEZ: Yes, on Saturday on Truth Social, the President ratcheting up the pressure on Bondi to bring criminal charges against several of his political opponents, including New York Attorney General Letitia James.

[15:40:18]

CNN's Julia Benbrook joins us now with the details.

So, Julia, what prompted this?

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, President Donald Trump had several late night social media posts related to this. One in all caps, where he said "Justice must be served now." He then followed that shortly after with a stunning post where he directly addressed Attorney General Pam Bondi, and we know this because he even started the post using her name.

In it, he called out several frequent targets of his frustration, including former FBI Director James Comey, Senator Adam Schiff and New York Attorney General Letitia James.

He claimed, without evidence that they are all, "Guilty as hell." And then went on to say this. Making it clear he has at least some expectations here saying. This: "We can't delay any longer. It is killing our reputation and credibility. They impeached me twice and indicted me five times," and then again in all caps, "over nothing, justice must be served now."

As the President left The White House today, he did take some questions from reporters, and he was asked if he would fire Bondi if she refused his demand to aggressively pursue some of his political foes. Take a listen to the part of that exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Are you going to fire Pam Bondi if Letitia James is not indicted?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: No. She is doing a great job. Pam Bondi is doing a great job. I think Pam Bondi is going to go down as one of the best Attorney Generals of the ages.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BENBROOK: Now, all of this came not long after Erik Siebert, the U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia said that he was stepping down. Siebert was under intense pressure from the President to make certain moves, and Siebert told his staff he was resigning. Trump said, though, that he did not quit. Instead, he said that he pulled his nomination after he received strong support from Democrats.

Now, according to a source briefed with internal conversations, Siebert and his team had been bracing for this possibility as the Trump administration was ramping up political pressure in recent weeks. Trump says that he has selected one of his former personal lawyers and a senior White House aide, Lindsay Halligan, to replace Siebert in that role. Trump has described her as a tough, smart and loyal attorney and highlighted that he has worked with her for quite some time.

BROWN: All right, Julia Benbrook, thanks so much.

And now we want to bring in CNN legal analyst and former Trump White House lawyer, Jim Schultz.

Hi, Jim. So you used to work for Donald Trump. What is your response to his latest comments on Bondi? Attacking her? And then praising her?

JIM SCHULTZ, CNN LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, I think any boss can be critical of someone and then praise them after the fact. That's not -- that's not uncommon anywhere. But I think what -- as it relates to this Virginia issue, I think we have to pay attention to that in such a way that these cases have to develop over time. These cases have to be brought before a grand jury to bring an indictment. And if the facts aren't there, the facts aren't there and you can't bring those cases.

That's not to say you can't investigate them. That's not to say you can't, you know, aggressively pursue them. But if the facts aren't there and a grand jury or the lawyer handling the case don't feel comfortable moving forward with an indictment, then that person is not going to get indicted.

SANCHEZ: I wonder, Jim, what this does to any pretense that there is a separation, a division between The White House and the Department of Justice. If the President is explicitly saying that he wants to go after folks because they impeached him and they prosecuted him, I mean, in your mind, is there any scenario in which this is not political?

SCHULTZ: Once again, these U.S. Attorneys, very important positions. In the Eastern District of Virginia, you're talking about a hundred lawyers, most of them career prosecutors. So when what the President says and what actually happens at that level, there is a big -- there is a big gap between those two things.

Again, judicial system is involved as well in terms of, you know, grand juries and the like. Prosecutors fight all the time. Pick up the newspaper, read something in the newspaper that doesn't seem right, and open up an investigation and begin asking questions. That's not uncommon.

The fact that the President is pointing out something that he believes is corrupt, they can treat it the same way or not. That's really within their discretion to do so. And in this particular instance, I think, you know, in the Eastern District of Virginia, you have two Democratic senators. There is -- you know, without those senators agreeing to it by way of, you know, with their blue slip powers that they have, it is going to be very difficult to get anybody across the line that those two senators don't agree upon.

BROWN: Right. But just to follow up with you. Certainly, he is pointing out, as you say, what he believes to be corrupt, but he is overtly pressuring his Attorney General.

What do you think that does to public confidence in this Justice Department?

[15:45:11]

SCHULTZ: Look, I think that confidence is instilled in the Justice Department when bad people are put in prison and that when cases are developed, people are prosecuted and they go to jail for committing crimes. That's what really instills confidence in the justice system.

The rest of this is really crowd, though. You remember, the Biden administration had the same issues across the board as it related to lawfare. One of the worst as it relates to lawfare. So in this instance, I think in this heightened political environment, you still have the same justice system where you need grand juries to indict, prosecutors need -- agents and prosecutors need to investigate and prosecute the cases and then a jury has to convict them.

SANCHEZ: I think officials in the Biden administration would argue that they waited on evidence to prosecute some of the cases against President Trump, and there was immense anger at Attorney General Merrick Garland at the time for not prosecuting sooner, so just pointing that out.

Jim Schultz, we have to leave the conversation there. Very much appreciate the time.

BROWN: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Up next, we are going to talk with the spokesperson for Turning Point USA, which was instrumental in President Trump's election. He spoke just moments ago at the memorial of Charlie Kirk. We will bring that to you live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:51:06]

SANCHEZ: We are tracking the breaking news out of Arizona where the memorial service for Charlie Kirk is underway.

BROWN: Pictures from right inside State Farm Stadium show thousands of people in attendance there to honor the conservative activist's life and legacy. The packed arena is a visual display of just how many people Kirk's message reached.

Andrew Kolvet joins us now. He is a spokesman for Turning Point USA and executive producer of "The Charlie Kirk Show." And, Andrew, I know you've been working very hard to put this memorial service together today, along with many others involved with the organization.

Tell us, how are you reflecting on this moment? I know you were just on the stage speaking.

ANDREW KOLVET, EXECUTIVE PRODUCER, "THE CHARLIE KIRK SHOW": You know, I am reflecting on this moment and just in awe of what I am seeing. You know, on the other side of this camera are tens and tens of thousands of people, and their hearts are lifted up today. They are joyful even in their mourning and in their grief and I think that's because Charlie pointed us all to something that was bigger than ourselves. He pointed us to a vision that was always going to be bigger than him or any one man, and what's what he went to campuses and said, be a part of something bigger than yourselves.

And we have Charlie's DNA as fingerprints all over this team and that's -- pulling off an event that should have taken six months to plan in about seven days is truly a remarkable feat, and yet another testament to his great legacy.

SANCHEZ: Andrew, I know that Charlie's widow, Erika, is expected to speak later today. Do you have any indication of what her message is going to be?

KOLVET: Yes, I do, I mean, I want her to be able to tell the world, but, you know, she is going to -- she is going to talk about the Charlie she knew, and she is going to explain how the mission is going to go forward and how you know, this overwhelming response, I mean, we have so many chapters that -- people that are inquiring about starting their own chapters and donations and people want to knock doors in the next election. There is so much momentum here. What has been unleashed here is truly, truly remarkable.

And we have her back a hundred percent. She knows that we have her back a hundred percent because not only is she amazing, but it is exactly what Charlie wanted should something happen to him. And we are going to support her and we are going to support that vision that Charlie and Erika really gave birth to together.

BROWN: Tell us more about that. You said this is what he wanted should something happen to him. He knew what the threat level was. Bring us inside of that: The plans and her role now as CEO of Turning Point USA and what that will look like.

KOLVET: Yes, I mean, Charlie lived daily with very serious threats. And, you know, it was a constant conversation that we were having behind-the-scenes about dealing with those threats. Him and Erika talked about this in very real terms. And yet he knew that one of the most powerful things he could do is go right into where the people were. It was a superpower. And he was fearless about it because he accepted that he was sort of -- he had become something other, you know, something larger than life for so many kids and even people of all ages across the country. And, you know, Erika was his vault. She was his support.

And he talked to her, you know, on their long walks together, he told her everything that was going on, you know, before they went to bed, and she knows exactly what he was planning next. She knows everything.

You know, somebody very important, and I will keep it private for the sake of privacy, but somebody very important called her the night it happened and asked, what do you know? And the question was in reference about Turning Point, about this organization, about what Charlie has been up to, and she replied, "I know everything."

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So I just would say Erika Kirk is a fierce, fierce, wonderful, human -- loving lioness. She is a wonderful mother, and she is ready for this moment.

Somehow, she is ready for this.

SANCHEZ: And we are looking forward to hearing from her. I do want to let you, Andrew, and our viewers know we just got our first look at President Trump at State Farm Stadium there with a group of his closest advisers, including his sons, Eric and Don, Jr., as well as his chief-of-staff, Susie Wiles, who we will also hear from later today.

Andrew, i wonder what you think of so many of the conspiracy theories that are spreading online about his death. There is a lot of noise related to what happened to Charlie. I wonder how you respond to it.

KOLVET: Well, listen, you know, I am not going to get too deep into the weeds there because I think a lot of it is meant to distract from this larger story. One of the things that we have been reflecting on as a team is just how much bigger Charlie is than even the person that pulled the pulled the trigger.

I haven't even been thinking about that person, to be honest, because of all of the reactions and the vigils and the prayers and this event. Charlie's legacy is so much bigger than any of that that would distract us from this moment and so I would just say, I want to keep the main thing, the main thing, and that's that something is happening, something is bubbling up, something is growing all around us. And unless you're closing your eyes and plugging your ears, you are as aware of it as I am right now in this moment, all across the country, even across the world. So that's what I am staying focused on.

BROWN: We were just looking at those pictures of President Trump and members of his administration who were there. I know, I mean, this is a very unique for this kind of turnout for a private citizen. I mean, that's what he was. Help us better understand the close personal relationship Charlie had with President Trump and other administration officials in The White House.

KOLVET: Yes, I mean, there is no doubt Charlie loved the President and the President loved Charlie and Charlie loved J.D. -- the Vice President, J.D. Vance, and the Vice President loved Charlie.

And you can go up and down the line of all of these dignitaries, all of these Cabinet Secretaries and Cabinet officials, they love Charlie because Charlie always came through. And so many of them candidly owe their current position to some of the work that Charlie was doing to advocate for them. Heck, get them elected. Even President Trump said that Charlie helped get him into office and was probably responsible for it when you had the youth vote swing so dramatically.

And I just love this because Charlie actually never liked going to D.C. He called it the Imperial Capital. It made his skin crawl. And I just think it is so fitting that in this tragedy, but in this beauty that I am surrounded by, that so much of Washington, D.C. has come to phoenix to be with Charlie. It is truly remarkable.

SANCHEZ: And you heard the crowd there reacting to President Trump as he stood and gave them a closed fist.

Andrew Kolvet, thank you so much for the time. We are, again, sorry for your loss and we are grateful for you sharing Charlie's story with us.

BROWN: He was a close personal friend. Thanks, Andrew.

KOLVET: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: So we are going to stay live in Glendale tracking the latest where members of President Trump's administration are scheduled to speak soon at Charlie Kirk's memorial. Stay with CNN.

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