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Venezuela's Vice President Demands Immediate Release of President Maduro and His Wife. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired January 03, 2026 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Breaking news coverage which we are following right now, and moving moment by moment out of Venezuela. The de facto leader there has now for the first time appeared on camera demanding the immediate release of Nicolas Maduro and his wife, calling their capture a kidnaping.

Right now, meantime, Maduro, in that image, you see him. It was posted by President Trump. He is on his way to the United States to face drug trafficking charges in the Southern District of New York. Meanwhile the vice president of Venezuela, Maduro's vice president, her name is Delcy Rodriguez, she just spoke, we've got the audio in now. I want to play for you what she just said to Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DELCY RODRIGUEZ, VENEZUELAN VICE PRESIDENT (through translator): We demand the immediate release of President Nicolas Maduro and his wife, the only president of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Coming out against Trump, and that is extremely significant, not just because she saw what happened hours ago to the guy on top of her, but also because President Trump, about two hours before that video came out, said that Delcy Rodrguez was on board with the U.S. plan. He said that she was willing to do whatever is necessary to, in his words, make Venezuela great again, and that she was doing what he wanted. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Who's going to take over? I mean, there is nobody to take over. You have a vice president who's been appointed by Maduro, and right now she's the vice president. And she's, I guess, the president. She was sworn in as president just a little while ago. She had a long conversation with Marco, and she said, we'll do whatever you need. She -- I think she was quite gracious, but she really doesn't have a choice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: OK. "We'll do whatever you need," he says she said to Marco Rubio and that she really doesn't have a choice. And she just said, this is a kidnaping, and send him back. And, you know, essentially thumbing his nose at Trump.

All right. Kevin Liptak joins us live from West Palm Beach, Florida.

So the timeline, Kevin, is that Trump said what I just played. And then within two hours, we got the statement from Vice President Delcy Rodriguez of Venezuela, which I just played. So now we're awaiting Trump's response to that. What does this actually mean?

You are there in Mar-a-Lago with the president. What's the response from him?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and I don't think it will be a favorable response from the president. You know, he did sound fairly confident that Rodriguez would be going along with this plan.

You know, after that press conference, he gave a phone call to the "New York Post." And actually, Rodriguez came up in that conversation. He was asked if U.S. troops would be on the ground in Venezuela running that country. And what he said was, quote, "No. If Maduro's vice president, if the vice president does what we want, we won't have to do that." And then he goes on to say, "We're prepared. You know, we have a second wave that's much bigger than the first one."

And so I do think, you know, now that Rodriguez is coming out and suggesting that she is not, in fact, on board with what the United States is doing down there, the president does seem to be setting up the prospect that the U.S. could go in with a second round of strikes. You know, he alluded to that in his press conference. He said that perhaps he didn't think it would be necessary. But saying pretty explicitly that he was ready to order that if the remnants of the Venezuelan regime didn't necessarily, you know, accedes to the U.S. running the country, which is what he said they would be doing.

I think all of this just underscores how little we know about what exactly the U.S. role is going to be in Venezuela going forward. You know, after the president came out and really kind of shocked all of us by saying that we, the United States, in his words, would be running Venezuela and then offered essentially no details about what that meant, this back and forth now between the president and the vice president of Venezuela only, I think, emphasizes how little we understand of how this will all proceed going forward.

And now, of course, you hear the president suggesting that there could be a U.S. Military role to ensure that the U.S. is able to run Venezuela. You know, he said in that press conference he wasn't afraid of boots on the ground. When I followed up with him and asked, you know, does he envision a prolonged U.S. Military presence in that country, he didn't really answer, and he sort of pivoted to talking about the oil, which we know has been sort of a preoccupation of his in Venezuela.

And so, you know, this is all setting up quite a dramatic, I think, day or week ahead as the U.S. works to ascertain who exactly is claiming power in Venezuela and works to assert their own power, that the president now suggests that the U.S. has in Caracas, but without necessarily explaining what exactly that looks like and what exactly that could mean for the U.S. Military going forward.

[15:05:00]

BURNETT: Kevin Liptak, thank you very much in Palm Beach by Mar-a- Lago, where you were in that press conference with the president, an hour long press conference, I should note.

Let's go live now, back to Caracas, where Mary Mena has been on the ground for us throughout the day.

Mary, as you and I have been talking over these past almost six hours, you have been saying that, that the vice president had been calling in to state media, but state media was, you know, essentially not really programing that she had just called in. There was speculation that she had left the country, even gone to Moscow. But then it turns out she is in Venezuela, and she appears to be at the vice president's quarters.

And she had this meeting and she was flanked by all of the military and other power players, including the interior ministry. And she gives that defiant statement.

What are you hearing from people? Do people buy it in Venezuela?

MARY MENA, JOURNALIST: Well, we need to remember that Venezuelans are used to live under an authoritarian regime. So there's fear in the streets that something could happen in the coming hours, coming either from the Trump administration that implied a second wave of attacks or coming from the government itself and its supporters. So the reaction, the immediate reaction of our regular Venezuelan is to stay at home, to stay locked at home, waiting for the developments that keep changing with every hour in Caracas.

And many people have decided to go to supermarkets to stock for food because they don't know how many days or hours this could last. And also there are the calling from these loyalists to Nicolas Maduro saying they will not surrender. And that was a strong statement coming from the Venezuelan vice president saying that they have the law behind them and basically denying all the words that President Donald Trump said about her talking with them or making some sort of negotiations with the Trump administration.

She says that they are calling for a strong response from the international community and from the people inside of Venezuela.

BURNETT: Now, Mary, obviously there's opposition. There's the fact that Nicolas Maduro actually wasn't the president. He was the de facto president. But obviously, someone had won that election in the summer of 2024. So there's a lot of breaks within the country on where people stand.

But even in that context, Mary, where does Delcy Rodriguez stand? Does she have credibility? Does she have standing? Does she have any of those things coming into this?

MENA: Well, she's witnessed as a strong leader after Nicolas Maduro. She's been in several positions. Not only as a vice president, but in several ministers. She's been the selected one in case of, Nicolas Maduro is out of power.

As we are witnessing, like what Hugo Chavez did in his time when he left for Cuba, he said, if something happened to me, you have to vote for Nicolas Maduro. Right now, we are learning that the multiple decisions taken by the government with the absence of Nicolas Maduro, is to let lead the country, the Venezuelan Vice President Delcy Rodriguez. She is witnessed as a smart woman with knowledge in economics, but she's a strong leader.

She's been -- she's in charge, for example, the security forces that are detained more than 2,000 people over the past, over the past year in Venezuela, after the presidential elections.

BURNETT: Well, and that's a significant point, as you point out, not just running the oil, but also running the security forces and what that might mean in terms of her ability to maintain their loyalty, which is going to be in such question here over these next hours and days.

Mary, thank you very much.

We'll be checking in with Mary, of course, constantly here as our coverage continues.

Reactions are now starting to pour in from around the world, the world watching this, the United States going into Venezuela in the dark of night and taking the leader and his wife, capturing them and bringing them to New York. Venezuela's vice president now taking to the airwaves. And as I said, that message is defiant.

Her comments coming moments after President Trump said that she was on board and was going to do anything that they wanted after her conversations with Secretary Rubio.

All right. And right now, our international security correspondent, Nick Paton Walsh, joins me.

Nick, you know, look, these, moments like this I think back to moments where, you know, you and I were in Ukraine when that war began. There's a sense of shock and pause of, did this just happen, then a realization that it did. And then you breathe out and you start to see what it really means. OK. And I don't know where we are in that process right now. But world leaders are also raising that question.

What are you hearing right now? You know, we talk about the dollars and cents, the black and white of it, of Russia's presence there and China's presence there.

[15:10:06]

But that's black and white on paper. What's actually happening now in those rooms?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, I think the comparison here with Ukraine is at least Putin's intentions were very clear, which was to occupy militarily as much of Ukraine as he could. We still are somewhat in the dark as to exactly what it is that President Trump is trying to achieve here, how his White House will, quote, "run the country."

As you've been pointing out, it appeared that their immediate mechanism for that was essentially Delcy Rodriguez, the president, doing what she was told, making Venezuela great again, to quote the president essentially with the threat of what happened to Maduro happening to her, hanging over her. She's now, as we've been saying, defiantly taken to the airwaves to say pretty much the opposite.

Now, that may be simply for public consumption. There may be private deals occurring that leave Venezuela in a different direction, but that's a pretty tough tightrope for Rodriguez to walk. What we're seeing internationally, too, as well, though, isn't exactly the sort of general consensus of applause in the Western hemisphere, where what Trump refers to as the "Don Rowe Doctrine," a play on the Monroe Doctrine of the 1800s, is supposed to be gaining greater traction.

Yes, Argentina, Ecuador, whose presidents are clear Trump supporters, applauding this. But Colombia, Mexico, obviously Cuba, strident in their criticism. China as well. Europeans, I think, are very clear that they were no fans of Nicolas Maduro, but the French in particular, their foreign minister critical of this violation of what many perceive as international law.

So we're into a moment here where it was precisely these hours where after what can only really be described as a highly efficient, at times brilliantly executed American operation, we don't know at this point what civilian casualty toll there was as a result of it. But the efficiency of that capture of Maduro now begins to disintegrate.

And we heard Trump speaking, it was remarkable to hear him say, we'll run the place. And then essentially say, the guys behind me will be doing it. Really pointing to his chief of staff, his secretary of what they call Department of War, and Secretary of State Marco Rubio would be doing the job, but then elaborate to say twice that Marco Rubio had been speaking to Maduro's vice president, who would essentially be doing whatever was needed to get along with the United States and then see that unravel.

If you are globally looking to see how the Trump administration is handling the aftermath, the day two, the day three, this is very bad sign that the plans were not perhaps there or simply aren't going as they were meant to. That's going to be deeply depressing for I think those who hope this might be a suggestion that the U.S. is capable of a foreign policy maneuver that was executed with some degree of competence.

And I think also, too, for ordinary Venezuelans, any notion that maybe there was a guiding light to some of this U.S. Military intervention maybe beginning to evaporate. It's important to point out we're not seeing signs on the ground in Venezuela of any stark change at all really. There aren't celebrations en masse on the streets at the end of Maduro.

And most importantly, too, Maria Corina Machado, the Nobel Peace Prize winner, the basic leader of the opposition, well, she's someone who Trump has not quite rubbished but said it's not up to the job and she's not the choice he has for taking over -- Erin.

BURNETT: Yes, he also made that very clear.

Nick Paton Walsh, thank you so very much. Going to be back with us, of course, as our coverage continues.

And I want to just show right now an image that we've just gotten in. Actually these are satellite images showing damage in Venezuela after U.S. strikes, which just for anyone joining involved 20 U.S. bases and 150 aircraft, thousands of personnel.

We're going to walk you through the timeline of exactly what did unfold, starting at 10:46 p.m. Eastern last night. Stay with us on our CNN special breaking news coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:18:15]

BURNETT: We are back with more of our breaking news coverage. And so let's just show you those satellite images if you're watching before the break that I just mentioned, and I'm going to walk you through what these are. First of all, you're looking at a before view and an after view after the U.S. massive military operation which resulted in the capture of the Venezuelan president Nicolas Maduro and his wife.

So let's look at the right, the smoke rising, you see, is from a destroyed building at Fort Tiuna, which is a major Venezuelan military base in Caracas. So that's where you're seeing the smoke rising. And let's show you these images as well. We're going to show you one on the right. There's a crater along the runway at an airport in Higuerote, Venezuela.

So as we look at these images, which have just come in, let's go now to retired U.S. army and former U.S. security coordinator for Israel and the Palestinian Authority, Lieutenant Governor Mark Schwartz.

So, General, I appreciate your time. Let's just start with these images. This is all we have. I will say during the press conference, Trump, I believe, twice mentioned watching the video, and we have an image of him actually watching the video of the actual strikes itself. But, you know, if everybody could see it, we don't know if we're going to get that, you know, when they actually took Maduro and what happens there.

But when you look at images such that we have here and these are from satellite providers, what do you see?

LT. GEN. MARK SCHWARTZ (RET.), U.S. ARMY: Well, certainly this operation, there was many, you know, precision kinetic strikes to help create the corridor for the force that went in to seize Maduro, his wife and their son. And so these strikes are representative of going after probably air defense capabilities. Certainly the runway where, a lot aircraft, those of Venezuela, are based so that they couldn't take off and, you know, potentially interdict the force.

[15:20:06]

To your comment, Erin, about, you know, the president being able to watch this real time based on the overhead surveillance, that's not uncommon. We have, you know, compartmented facilities that are mobile and that can be set up for the president, for the secretary of war, and for other combatant commanders, frankly to allow them to do that in the event that they're away from the situation room or their main headquarters.

BURNETT: So, General, there's something else that Trump said that just in the context of the at least public defiance of the now de facto ruler of Venezuela and the military, at least that they're publicly showing, right, they're publicly showing defiance. In that context I wanted to ask you about, you know, something else Trump said, when he said that everybody was on board with what, you know, had happened here.

In these hours, when you talk about 20 U.S. bases, 150 aircraft, thousands of military personnel, and he said there were boots on the ground of the highest level, and then he sort of took a little pause and he goes, and I mean, the very highest level. OK, what does that say to you? I mean, they could put boots on the ground at the highest level about how high or who was there and what does that mean possibly about people in the Venezuelan government or military who would have been working with or assisting the Trump administration with this strike?

SCHWARTZ: Well, you saw the director of the CIA that was, you know, standing on the stage with the president when he was briefing.

BURNETT: Yes.

SCHWARTZ: And so clearly, you know, the president has alluded to publicly that there was CIA operatives. He basically signed the finding several months ago to allow the CIA to conduct covert action. He announced that publicly as well. So I suspect that knowing the capability and competence of the Central Intelligence Agency, they've been developing sources and capabilities in Venezuela for years, not just at the start of this operation.

But the finding basically allowed them to do other things that they historically, you know, weren't doing in preparation for what we saw play out over this past period of darkness.

BURNETT: One other question on that front, you know, we understand that there were and was an important CIA asset, OK, was the word that they used, General, that was important in this, right, in ascertaining where Maduro was and many of the details. But then Trump in that press conference made a comment that the $50 million reward that would go to anybody who assisted with the apprehension of Maduro and his whereabouts was going to go on claimed that the United States deserved it solely, and he and Marco Rubio were saying, and we're not going to pay that money.

What does that that say to you, right? I mean, do you think it's possible that -- but I'm not getting into what it would take to actually claim that money, but possible that there wasn't assistance of the level that was, you know, operationally crucial here?

SCHWARTZ: I believe the level of cooperation that helped enable the human intelligence picture was there. I don't think anyone is going to publicly say who's going to get the award. You know, you don't want to, if there's going to be an award, but clearly there's motivations for why individuals cooperate with the U.S. intelligence agencies and the U.S., you know, the Department of War.

So I wasn't surprised by that comment. I thought, I kind of took that as kind of an offhanded remark, but clearly, individuals have put themselves at risk, their lives at risk, Venezuelans probably, to help paint that intelligence picture, to enable this operation among the exquisite collection that we have within the United States.

BURNETT: All right. General Mark Schwartz, I appreciate your time, and thank you so much.

And when we come back, we've got more developments here just coming in from Venezuela on the vice president's defiance as Maduro and his wife are currently on their way to New York, somewhere between Venezuela and New York, possibly Guantanamo Bay.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:28:28]

BURNETT: All right, breaking news. You are looking right now at live pictures of Caracas, Venezuela this Saturday afternoon. The very latest there, we've just seen the vice president on camera for the first time after hours of silence and only calling in, striking a defiant tone against President Trump seizing the ruler of Venezuela.

This is the first image that we have of Nicolas Maduro, and I want to emphasize it is the only image we have of Nicolas Maduro put out by the Trump administration. Trump put this out, and I just want, as I'm bringing in Frida Ghitis, to get us to say one thing about this, because John Miller, our chief law enforcement analyst, formerly of the NYPD, had crucial color here.

Look at this picture. He makes a point to say those glasses that you see were put on by the U.S. Military so that he couldn't see where he was going. The earmuffs that you see are so that he couldn't hear what people were saying. The jacket of the man behind him, you can see the letters DEA showing that drug enforcement agents were involved in his arrest. And of course, that's on top of what you see, the very sloppy sweatsuit look of what he appears to have on or hurriedly been allowed to put on as they captured him from Caracas. His hands in handcuffs there.

And I do want to go to Frida Ghitis now, a senior columnist at World Politics Review.

And Frida, thank you so much for being with me. Let me just start with, and I want to ask about Nicolas Maduro and that image in a moment. But first, the images that we just have out of Caracas, the very first ones of the now de facto leader, the vice president, Maduro's vice president, speaking. And I'm just showing her here. And then we're going to flap around the room.

[15:30:01]

This is what the Venezuelan government put out. Just to look at the looks on the faces of everyone around. I mean, this gentleman right there, I mean, they look I think at best uncomfortable. I mean, look at this. They don't look secure. They look shell shocked, perhaps like everyone else feels. But this is their government.

I mean, just what do you see going on in this room, Frida?

FRIDA GHITIS, SENIOR COLUMNIST, WORLD POLITICS REVIEW: Well, you know, what has happened so far in Venezuela is that we have had a dictator removed from power but the dictatorship is still in place. These people, who are the regime that remains in place as far as we can see, are obviously for very natural reasons. They're concerned, they're tense. We don't know what the United States is going to do next. Nobody knows what the United States is going to do next.

I think for the people of Venezuela, the news this morning that Maduro had been removed from power by the United States was most likely very, very happy news. Venezuelans, the majority of them by overwhelming numbers, have wanted to see the end of this, of this dictatorship. But as the day has unfolded, this has looked like a less well-planned operation than we -- than they would have hoped.

I mean, we had the notion that the United States is going to run Venezuela is pretty shocking. The way Trump spoke about Corina Machado, the leader of the opposition. She just discarded her as incapable of running the country. This whole episode with the vice president, who Trump said that Secretary of State Rubio has been talking to her, and she's going to do what the United States says, and then she comes out and she says that she wants Maduros release, and they're not going to fold to a foreign power.

This is not looking very good. You know, in fairness to the Trump administration, many, many American presidents have tried to push him out of power by different ways. Trump is taking a very bold, most likely illegal path to doing it, but it's extremely risky. And this could end up being, if it doesn't work, it could make things worse for the people of Venezuela.

BURNETT: And so, you know, Frida, you know, Mary Mena, our reporter on the ground, has been talking about the silence right now, right? And a country that is used to chaos, that is used to rumors of coup detats, right? I mean, a country that is used to turmoil and strife and uncertainty, but that right now what stood out to her the most is the silence. That people are not going out on the street, that shops are not open, and that when people who are going out are trying to go out to get to the grocery store if it's open to try to stock up because they don't know what's coming next, right?

There's sort of this deep pause where they have inhaled and everyone is holding their breath and then waiting to see what happens next. I mean, this is earlier today, so it's very early, but empty streets is how she has described it throughout the day. I've been asking this question, Frida, both from a military perspective, but also to you, from your perspective.

How much time is there right now?

GHITIS: Well, somebody has to run the country. And, you know, Trump said that the men who were standing behind him are running the country. They seemed a little bit surprised. The regime has been running the country for more than a quarter of a century, since 1999. They have done it under very, very difficult circumstances, you know, under Maduro since who took office in 2013 the economy of Venezuela has contracted by three quarters.

It's a -- he took a wealthy country and turned it into a very poor one. So the people of Venezuela have endured hardship for a long time, and that for the regime, that means that they will not feel the pressure from the people because the people have done all they could. The only thing that matters now is the military angle. What -- mostly what the Venezuelan military do, what they're going to do.

And, you know, if this had unfolded the way we might have expected, you would have had, you know, failing and negotiated solution, you would have had some kind of arrangement with elements in the military that were willing to join forces for the benefit of the country to reintroduce a measure of democracy. But we haven't seen any of that.

And the other thing we haven't heard today, I didn't hear Trump in his very long and a little bit strange press conference, I didn't hear him utter the word democracy. The people of Venezuela have been fighting for decades to get their democracy back. Venezuela used to be one of the shining democracies of South America. They haven't had it. And Trump didn't utter that word. So it's unclear what's happening now.

The empty streets are a sign of the uncertainty that we're all experiencing and witnessing now.

BURNETT: Frida, thank you so very much, and such a crucial point that you make that he didn't mention the word democracy. Rubio has, of course. We heard we heard three explanations, democracy, drugs and oil. The one we heard the most vociferously from Trump was, of course, oil as the justification.

Frida, thank you very much.

[15:35:02]

And first, Maduro was taken on board the USS Iwo Jima. That's where that image was taken of him in the handcuffs, now expected to go to Guantanamo Bay and from there fly to New York. We don't know the timing on any of this, but we could see him in New York as soon as Monday. This is likely where he will be staying, possibly at New York's Metropolitan Detention Center, which is in Brooklyn. Details on the charges, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: All right, John Miller, our chief law enforcement intelligence analyst, joins us now.

So, John, I was just a moment ago referencing all of the incredible detail that you provided about that image of Nicolas Maduro that Trump had put out, right, that they had put earplugs on so he couldn't hear and eyes so he couldn't see.

[15:40:11]

But where are we right now? So if he's -- we don't know where he is at this moment. But he was on board the USS Iwo Jima. We believe going to Guantanamo Bay and then flying to New York. What happens in each of those steps?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: So he will arrive, and I believe he has, at a secure military facility outside New York City. There he will go through a process --

BURNETT: So you believe -- just hold on. Sorry, just to interrupt you. So you believe he's here in New York already?

MILLER: I believe he's here on U.S. soil in America outside New York City. That he's going through the process with Customs and Border Protection, basically being admitted into the United States as a prisoner in federal custody. That's paperwork that has to be done. All the T's are being crossed, and the I's are being dotted as he goes through kind of the immigration process.

Then he will be taken from that base to New York city, where he will be brought to a law enforcement facility where they will book him and book his wife on the charges that they've been indicted with in this rather lengthy federal indictment. Then they will go from there to a federal lockup where they will be lodged. And arraignment, which could be tomorrow, but much more likely will be Monday before either a federal magistrate or the federal judge who is in charge of the trial, will be the next step in his first public appearance where these charges will be read.

BURNETT: So do you believe then that -- I mean, it sounds like your expectation is that that he's at this military facility outside New York City now and that he would stay there. In other words, he would be sleeping there for the next two nights, and we would not see him in public until he is booked, right, which we anticipate would be Monday at some point.

MILLER: No, I think it will go faster than that. I think he'll be moved from there to New York City. And then move to this law enforcement facility for booking. I would expect he will be lodged in the Metropolitan Detention Center sometime tonight.

BURNETT: Oh, wow. OK. So that he would be at MDC tonight.

MILLER: Yes.

BURNETT: Now, can I ask you a question? And I know these are details, but you and I had talked earlier about how at MDC, there's a general population, right, and then there's sometimes a sort of a dorm like atmosphere where they will put at risk prisoners, right? And that had included, I'm sorry, a former president at one point in the same room as Sam Bankman-Fried, who's serving time for crypto fraud, and Didi, right?

These individuals were all in one room, along with, as I understand it, from talking to people in the room, other law enforcement convicted of pedophilia and other things, things that would make people not able to be in the general population.

Where would the Maduros be? And this is a question that's going to have two very different answers because she's obviously a woman. Where would Maduro go within that hierarchy at the MDC?

MILLER: Well, he would be considered a high risk prisoner among many in that facility. Their choices would be either to put him with high profile prisoners in the environment you just described. More likely, between now and arraignment, it would be my guess that the Federal Bureau of Prisons, which is a division of the Department of Justice, would find a secure environment where he would be away from other prisoners, where he would be kept under constant watch, at least up through the time he is arraigned.

And then they decide if this is where he will be kept awaiting trial, which could be some time. As you know, Erin, that can often be a year between the time someone is taken into custody and brought to trial, and if this is that facility, or whether they move him to somewhere else.

BURNETT: Just absolutely stunning to consider.

John Miller, thank you very much.

And I want to go now to Oona Hathaway. She is a professor of law at Yale.

And just, Oona, in the context of what John is talking about, where Maduro may, you know, that he may be in Manhattan detention facility as soon as tonight, and he could be in some sort of essentially a solitary confinement as opposed to that dorm facility that I just described, which is used for high profile prisoners.

I guess the question is here, legally, how quickly does this move? John is describing a process that could start fast and then take a whole lot of time.

OONA HATHAWAY, PROFESSOR, YALE LAW: Yes. Look, there's a lot of legal hurdles here. One aspect that I think addressed is the fact that Maduro is a sitting head of state. And there is an international law doctrine called Head of State Immunity that normally would insulate a head of state like Maduro from criminal prosecution than domestic courts of another state.

[15:45:13]

It's pretty clear that what the Trump administration intends to do is claim that he's not actually a head of state and therefore he can be criminally prosecuted.

BURNETT: Right. The de facto word that they put in the -- yes.

(CROSSTALK)

HATHAWAY: Yes, exactly. And that they will then claim that since he's not a head of state, therefore he can be criminally prosecuted. But his defense certainly is going to argue that it is, that he is a head of state and therefore isn't subject to criminal prosecution in U.S. courts. Of course, that all connects to the broader claim being made here, which is that this intervention was lawful in the first place, which, you know, is very -- it's clear that this is, as a general matter, an illegal war, and that, you know, launching a war to seize someone and bring them back to the United States for criminal prosecution is clearly unlawful.

BURNETT: Oona, I just want to highlight one very short but substantial word that you just said which is war. You said that this was launching a war, right? That's not how they describe it. They describe it as we went in and now, granted, they are saying they're running the country. But, you know, we got him and we're going to move on. Now, obviously, it's not that simple. We all know that.

But you're using the word war. You're a law professor. You're not using it lightly. Is that really what this is?

HATHAWAY: Yes. Look, under the United Nations Charter, there's a prohibition on use of force. This is clearly a use of force, which within ordinary parlance we call it a war. We engaged in serious military operations. We can all see the pictures of many military installations being blown up. If that's not a war, I don't know what is. And under international law, it constitutes a violation of the United Nations Charter.

And, you know, this is very serious business. Now, the president is talking about running the country. So this is not just that in and out operation. This is not just grabbing Maduro and bringing him back to stand trial, but this is a question of putting U.S. troops on the ground, which is what's going to be necessary to actually run the country. And he's done all of this without ever seeking authorization from Congress, which is the body that has the constitutional authority to make these decisions.

So there's a lot of problems here that haven't been addressed. And I think that will have to be addressed in the coming days, weeks and months as we decide how to proceed from here. But it's a lot of very troubling violations of both domestic and international law that I think we need to be thinking about.

BURNETT: Well, very sobering to put the word to it, to use the word war.

Oona, thank you very much, Professor Hathaway.

And we have much more of our breaking coverage ahead. We'll be right back.

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[15:52:18]

BURNETT: All right. Well, we're following this breaking news out of Venezuela as well as Mar-a-Lago at the news of President Nicolas Maduro and his wife's capture during an overnight raid by the U.S. Army's Elite Delta Force.

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CROWD: Venezuela. Venezuela.

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BURNETT: Now, that was in Madrid. Crowds gathered in the streets there. The expatriate community. There was some celebration around the world.

We saw that as well in Santiago, in Chile, there were celebrations there. Traffic stopped. That was celebrating Maduro's capture. And in Doral, Florida, actually is home to one of the largest Venezuelan communities in the United States and the Venezuelan diaspora, an impromptu celebration broke out. This is just at a gas station.

So there was celebration initially. But of course, as we've emphasized within the country of Venezuela, a silence, a silence on the streets and a silence right now.

Rafael Romo joins me.

Rafael, as I've pointed out during our coverage throughout today, you have spent so much time in Venezuela and covering the country. So you saw those celebrations, right? There is a large and broad Venezuelan diaspora, many of whom left in opposition or because they were targeted by the Maduro regime, right? So we see that celebration among that community. And then we have this press conference from Trump. We have the silence within Venezuela, literally on the streets.

How did we get here?

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Venezuela, Erin, has been living essentially under a dictatorship for the last two and a half decades, starting in 1999 when the late President Hugo Chavez rose to power democratically. We need to remind our viewers that in espoused a style of government he called 21st century socialism. Nicolas Maduro was handpicked by Hugo Chavez as his successor when the

late president realized his life was in danger due to a cancer diagnosis, and became the president of Venezuela in 2013, narrowly winning an election that year. During the nearly 13 years that Nicolas Maduro was in power, Venezuela, Erin, lost 72 percent of its economy, which prompted an estimated eight million Venezuelans to vote with their feet by migrating to other countries, including, of course, the United States.

And I remember seeing a group of men in Caracas, imagine this, diving for nuggets of gold and silver in a sewage canal in the middle of the city, which gives you an idea about how desperate people became after Maduro's politics were put in place. And his politics has been a mix of anti-imperialist and anti-U.S. narratives straight out of the Cuban propaganda playbook.

[15:55:04]

Erin, I remember attending a presidential press conference in Caracas where he called me and other CNN colleagues journalists of the empire, and that's what he would often say all the time -- Erin.

BURNETT: Journalists of the empire.

Rafael Romo, thank you so much. So incredible that you have actually been in those rooms. One of the reasons that we are so grateful for all of you watching CNN and our coverage today to have such expertise of people like Rafael.

Thank you so much for joining me today. Sara Sidner will pick up our breaking news coverage in just a moment.

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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: You are in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Sara Sidner in New York.