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Operation Near Guthrie's Home Ended Without Any Arrests; Rubio Tells Europe "We Belong Together" In Major Shift In U.S. Tone; Immigration Enforcement Policies At Center Of DHS Funding Fight; ICE Plans To Expand Its Detention Centers To Multiple Locations; Gen. David Petraeus Speaks To CNN From Munich Security Conference; Pres. Touts New Inflation Numbers As Polling On Economy Sinks. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired February 14, 2026 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST: When his students expressed to him privacy concerns relative to their written work, his answer is to say if you want to protect the privacy of your work, you better type it on a typewriter, which I think sums up exactly where we are. I love the privacy when it breaks, you know, a crime case like the one that we're following. But I think the concerns expressed in the poll result are very realistic.

[14:00:22]

OK, if you missed any of today's program, you can always listen anywhere you get your podcasts. We thank you for watching. And we will see you next week.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: Hello everyone. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

And we begin with new details in Arizona as the search for "Today Show" anchor Savannah Guthrie's mother approaches the two-week mark. Last night, SWAT and forensic teams swarmed two locations near Nancy Guthrie's home for several hours. We're learning one man was questioned and released. And the operation ended without any arrests.

CNN also observed authorities examining a gray Range Rover in a parking lot before they towed it away. It's unclear whether this was related to the Guthrie investigation. And all of this comes as investigators earlier in the day say they found DNA on the 84-year- olds property that does not belong to her or those close to her. Several gloves have also been recovered. The glove on the left was found about a mile away from Guthrie's home according to "The New York Post" and appears to resemble the ones worn by the suspect captured on Guthrie's doorbell camera.

CNN correspondent Leigh Waldman is following the latest from Tucson, Arizona. Leigh, what more are you learning?

LEIGH WALDMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fred, just about 15 minutes ago, we got an update from the Pima County Sheriff's Department about that activity that our team saw about two miles away from where we are last night. Just to remind everyone, dozens of law enforcement vehicles, we saw SWAT vehicles, forensic vehicles all on location just two miles away from where we are now.

The sheriff's department sending that update saying this was a search warrant related to the Nancy Guthrie case, conducted at a home there. They also tell us they conducted a traffic stop where a person was questioned and then released. No arrests have been made at this point. And I think everyone in this community is just waiting on pins and needles as we approach now two weeks since Nancy Guthrie disappeared from her home, which is behind us.

We don't have much information about who they're looking for at this point. The only profile we've gotten from the FBI right now is they're looking for a man between 5'9 and 5'10 with a medium build. There's been over 30,000 leads, tips called in to not only the sheriff's department, but also to the FBI. They're chasing down every single one of those leads. And the sheriff telling one of our CNN affiliates that every single time that they chase down this lead -- these different leads, we should expect to see a kind of a flurry of activity like we saw just last night.

Now, we spoke to neighbors here today as we're at this two-week mark as we've had media in this community for so long now waiting for the return of Nancy Guthrie or the arrest of the people behind her abduction here. Take a listen to what neighbors are saying. They're also desperate for information.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE LIPPMAN, NANCY GUTHRIE'S NEIGHBOR: Absolutely wish they were giving more information. I think the sheriff is a very experienced veteran of law enforcement, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he's experienced with what this case is all about. And I mean, I feel like they got in, they invited the FBI in or the FBI came in pretty quickly. But maybe it wasn't quite quickly enough.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALDMAN: Now to remind everyone when we first heard about FBI involvement that came February 2nd saying that they were assisting the law enforcement here on the ground in the search for Nancy Guthrie. But let's focus back on Nancy herself. Her family has made desperate pleas for her return home. We learned early on from her children that she's on medication. She needs that medication to survive to be comfortable. We've learned from sources that Nancy has a pacemaker. That's why it's a desperate search to try and get this 84-year-old grandmother back home safely and to find whoever is responsible for her abduction here. Fred?

WHITFIELD: Yes. All right Leigh Waldman in Tucson, Arizona. Keep us posted as you learn more information.

All right, tomorrow night on The Whole Story, Ed Lavandera is in Tucson with the latest on the biggest questions in the search for Nancy Guthrie. The Whole Story with Anderson Cooper Sunday at 8:00 Eastern and next day on the CNN app.

All right new today, the U.S. making a major overture to European allies. Secretary of State Marco Rubio at a global security conference in Germany telling Europeans, I'm quoting now, "We belong together." It's a big shift from when Vice-President J.D. Vance warned the same conference last year that Europe no longer shared some of the U.S.'s values and called it a, quoting J.D. Vance at the time, "Threat from within."

[14:05:16]

That set the tone for a year of publicly strained relations between the U.S. and Europe. CNN correspondent Julia Benbrook is in West Palm Beach near Mar-a-Lago where President Trump is spending the weekend. Julia, take us through what Rubio said today.

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Fred the overall message of Secretary of State Marco Rubio's remarks at the Munich Security Council Conference was that the United States and Europe belong together and this was a highly anticipated and high-profile speech. In it, he worked to reassure European leaders that the United States remains committed to the long-standing partnership. But he did that without abandoning the underlying demand that Europe change its course on a number of matters essentially fall in line with what President Donald Trump is working toward or that the United States would be willing to go it alone.

I want you to take a listen to an excerpt from his remarks that really illustrates both of those points.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE: Under President Trump the United States of America will once again take on the task of renewal and restoration, driven by a vision of a future as proud as sovereign and as vital as our civilization's past. And while we are prepared if necessary to do this alone, it is our preference and it is our hope to do this together with you our friends here in Europe. For the United States and Europe, we belong together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BENBROOK: So while that message that they believe that Europe still needs to make reforms does remain at the heart of this. It is important to note that the overall tone, the delivery of Rubio's remarks was much different than the speech that Vice President J.D. Vance delivered at that same conference a year ago. Vance used his time at the podium to harshly criticize Europe for he says relying too heavily on the United States for support. And his delivery was still top of mind for many European leaders in attendance as they anxiously awaited Rubio taking the stage.

It does seem that his shift in tone was a welcome one. There were a few moments where Rubio did receive applause from those in attendance specifically when he said that America is a child of Europe and that their fates are intertwined. This moment comes as some allies have grown increasingly concerned and have questioned that the United States intends to abandon this long-standing partnership specifically as Trump has repeated threats of retaliatory tariffs. He has made it clear that he wants control of Greenland. And the Trump administration has abandoned some international aid as well.

WHITFIELD: All right, Julia Benbrook, thanks so much.

All right, still to come, DHS plans to spend billions building new detention facilities across the U.S. Communities are also reacting to the prospect of these plans coming to their neighborhoods.

[14:08:22]

And later, an incredible study about cancer treatment that could have patients scrambling to reschedule their next treatment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right, welcome back. The Department of Homeland Security is temporarily shut down. As of midnight, the Department and the multiple agencies and offices under its umbrella entered a partial government shutdown after Congress failed to strike a funding deal. Democrats are demanding reforms to immigration enforcement but Republicans say the demands go too far and ignore agents safety. Nearly all of DHS's 270,000 workers will remain on the job even if most won't receive paychecks until the lapse ends.

ICE --

CAMILA DECHALUS, CNN REPORTER: Well, Fred, there is a lot of fighting right now on Capitol Hill Especially over funding for the Department of Homeland Security. Now, this fighting really intensified in his last few weeks especially around the fatal shooting of Alex Pretti and Renee Good by federal agents. And that led many Democratic lawmakers to come out and demand a list of reforms to be made around immigration Enforcement in this country in order to exchange for their support of passing a funding bill for DHS.

Now, Democrats I spoke to say that this is really about accountability and about making sure that federal agencies are really aligned and making sure that they're prioritizing the safety of the public. Take a listen to what Democratic Representative Maxwell Frost had to say,

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MAXWELL FROST (D-FL): House Democrats are using our power and the power of the purse to say enough is enough, that people have spoken. We see poll after poll that people say this administration have gone way too far as it relates to this, I don't call it mass deportation, it's a mass kidnapping campaign of our own neighbors. And so we're representing our constituents by saying, no. We know that through the Big Beautiful Bill that they passed to give ICE essentially unlimited amounts of resources and give huge tax breaks to billionaires at the cost of health care for working people. We know they did that last year. But what we're saying is we're not going to give them a penny more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:15:00] DECHALUS: Now as you can see there Democrats are really outlining what their disposition is. But some Republican lawmakers I spoke to say that they're open to having discussions around reforms being made to federal agencies. But they say the top priority for everyone should be passing the funding bill in order to fund the Department of Homeland Security.

Now, where things stand at this point in time essentially both chambers the House and the Senate, they're not scheduled to return back to Washington, D.C. until February 23rd. But Republican leaders in the House and the Senate, they say that they will still try to call back lawmakers, give them a 48-hour notice if a deal is reached. But with the funding lapse within the Department of Homeland Security, that means where workers will remain on the job and that really does mean a lot of federal employees under the Department of Homeland Security, they will not get paid until this end. So there's a real sense of urgency right now for lawmakers to get a deal done. Fred. back to you.

WHITFIELD: All right, Camila DeChalus, thank you so much.

All right, ICE plans to spend $38 billion to convert 16 existing warehouse buildings into regional detention centers. "The Washington Post" reports in recent weeks, the agency has acquired buildings in Maryland, Arizona, Georgia, Texas, Pennsylvania and Michigan. And now Georgia Senator Raphael Warnock is seeking to block plans for ice detention centers planned in his state. CNN's Rafael Romo is here. And Rafael, you have been following the developments involving these Georgia facilities, the communities impacted and what now?

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, what now is the question many communities across the nation really taking a pause and trying to understand what's going on and how big these plans are. And what we know, Fred, is that it appears the federal government plans to build detention centers for migrants on a massive scale in multiple states across the country over the next several months at a cost of tens of billions of dollars.

According to documents published on Thursday, the estimated total cost for the new detention center model is $38.3 billion designed to strategically increase bed capacity to 92,600 beds that's because ICE expects an increase in enforcement operations and arrest in 2026. And the plan is to activate all facilities by November 30th. The immigration and Customs Enforcement plan was referenced in a press release by New Hampshire Governor Kelly Ayotte. One of the proposed sites for a detention center is in her state in the town of Merrimack.

The ICE plan also calls for what it calls the acquisition and renovation of eight large-scale detention centers and 16 processing sites as well as the acquisition of 10 existing turnkey facilities where ICE, ERO already operates. One of the new detention centers is located here in Georgia. CNN has confirmed with officials in the town of Social Circle, population 5,000, located about 45 miles east of Atlanta. That a million square foot facility there has been purchased by ICE to be converted into a migrant detention center for as many as 10,000 people possibly as early as April. According to a deed file earlier this month and obtained by CNN, the Department of Homeland Security paid more than $128.5 million for the facility. That's more than four times more expensive than the building's last assessment value of $29.3 million in 2023. Social Circle officials told me, they're very concerned about the impact this will have on their water and sewer systems that are already strained because the opening of the detention center means its population would effectively triple.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC TAYLOR, CITY MANAGER, SOCIAL CIRCLE, GEORGIA: As I've stated multiple times over the last month, we only have a limited amount of water to draw from to begin with in a capacity infrastructure system that is already stretched to its capacity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: In response to Isis plans to build two detention centers in Georgia, Senator Raphael Warnock filed an amendment to "Prohibit the use of federal funds for the acquisition, construction, renovation or expansion of ICE detention centers in both Social Circle and Oakwood" located about 48 miles northeast of Atlanta, a town that has also expressed its opposition to the plan.

According to "The Washington Post," Fred, in recent weeks, ICE has spent more than $690 million acquiring at least eight industrial buildings in Maryland, Arizona, Georgia, Texas, Pennsylvania and Michigan. So again, like I said at the beginning Massive scale for these detention centers.

WHITFIELD: Right. I know you've been to Social Circle. You know something about that warehouse building. So whoever owned it made some $100 million profit off the sell to the government. Was that privately owned or was that owned by the city of Social Circle?

ROMO: It was an LLC, was private privately owned. And we looked at the records. We looked at the records all the way back to 2023. And yes, back then it was assessed at $29 million, the sale as we just reported $128.5 million. Again, that's taxpayer money and they're paying four times as much as maybe some other person entity buying it would not have paid that much.

[14:20:23]

WHITFIELD: Wow. Fascinating. All right, thank you so much. Rafael Romo, keep us posted as you have been.

All right, still to come, what some leaders are calling a new world order taking center stage at the Munich Security Conference today. You'll hear from retired army general and former CIA director, David Petraeus, about the attempts from U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio to steady U.S.-Europe relations.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:25:10]

WHITFIELD: All right. New today, the U.S. is taking a major shift in tone with its European allies. U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio speaking at a global security conference in Germany where he struck a softened tone even saying this about the historic alliance.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBIO: Our home may be in the Western Hemisphere but we will always be a child of Europe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right a contrast to last year's tone from the Trump administration, that is the Trump administration has had a strained relationship with Europe this past year including leveling criticism of the NATO Alliance and threats to take over Greenland. Retired U.S. Army General David Petraeus who was also the CIA Director under President Obama and also led U.S. Central Command, he's at the Munich conference. And earlier I spoke with him.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: General great to see you. I wonder if you could give us your thoughts on Secretary of State Marco Rubio's tone and speech saying Europe and America belong together, his words, belong together.

GEN. DAVID PETRAEUS (RET.), FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: Yes, I thought it was a very good speech actually. And in fact he got a standing ovation. He did emphasize that the U.S. and Europe belong together that we come from the same civilization. But he also made the point that of course Europeans need to do more for their own defense. And also that some of our international institutions unfettered trade, unfettered immigration and so forth, have had some significant downsides. So there were some very good substantive points made but the tone was superb. And as I noted on a Valentine's Day, he got a standing ovation.

WHITFIELD: Then he felt lots of love. Because this is quite the contrast, right, last year just a few weeks into Trump's Second presidency, his Vice President J.D. Vance's speech shocked the audience and the world his reminder of what was said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The threat that I worry the most about vis-a-vis Europe is not Russia, it's not China, it's not any other external actor. And what I worry about is the threat from within, the retreat of Europe from some of its most fundamental values, values shared with the United States of America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: So some of the same leaders from last year were in the room today following Rubio today. I know you just said that the tone was superb. Was that the consensus among others? Was there relief or continued apprehension or even concern about the reliability of the U.S.?

PETRAEUS: Well that has been an undercurrent here to be sure. But again, I think the speech did a great deal to mollify some of those concerns. And again, he made some tough points as well, which do need to be made, that Europe again should be doing more for its own defense. And frankly, it is, The E.U. has committed 90 billion euros about 105, $110 billion to Ukraine, solving their fiscal and economic problems for the next year and a half. And then there's another 60 billion to follow for defense needs of Ukraine also.

And of course all the nations have committed in NATO now to 3.5 percent of GDP on defense and they're getting to that point. But that was a good reminder in that regard as well. And again noting that given some of the shortcomings of international institutions, we need to either rebuild them refine them or figure out how it is that we're going to deal with the problems that the institutions have been incapable of dealing with.

WHITFIELD: How do you go about rebuilding or better defining them especially after the Munich security report at the start of the conference stated that the world is in an era of wrecking ball politics led by U.S. President Donald Trump? Your concerns?

PETRAEUS: Well, there's always a little bit of sensationalism. You know, the title is also something about destruction. And what many of the speakers has emphasized that, look, there is damage out there, and so we need to do some rebuilding coming back together. But again, as Secretary Rubio made the point, we do belong together. We do come from the same civilization. We share the same values, and indeed, we need to stick to them and do it all better, each of us, noting again that the U.S. has global responsibilities, of course.

And having the Europeans step up the way they now are is crucially important to the overall ability of the U.S. to address what clearly are more challenges and threats and more complex challenges and threats than at any time since the end of the Cold War, if not the end of World War II.

[14:30:00]

WHITFIELD: Ukraine is top of mind globally. And of course, during this security conference in Munich, do you see the way forward involving the U.S. and NATO alliances or at least European alliances as a whole as helping to bring the end of that war?

PETRAEUS: Well, I certainly hope so and in fact as I mentioned the E.U. has demonstrated breathtaking speed compared with the usual pace of the often derided Eurocrats in Brussels. I mentioned the 90 billion for -- in euros, of course, for Ukraine. And I was just in Ukraine just got back on Sunday evening and it is brutally cold. And the Russians of course are trying to turn out the lights and turn off the heat. And they're doing that in large parts of the country.

But the next step really that is required is for the U.S. to approve the sanctions package that Senator Graham and about 89 other senators out of a hundred, support. So work that to completion with the White House. Get that to complement because the E.U. has also passed a 19th round of sanctions and are already working on the 20th.

If this all comes together given the state of the Russian economy where growth is almost nil, inflation is up, they're running out of the money in the National Welfare Fund which they have been diverting to the military-industrial complex. If this all comes together and India now will buy less oil as a result of the tariff deal done with President Trump and that was good leverage used there, Russia may not be able to sustain this war over time. They may need a cessation of hostilities.

The Ukrainians believe that they are now killing and wounding more Russians each month than they're actually able to recruit. And keep in mind that the Russians have already taken over 1.2 million killed and wounded which is more than the United States military took in all of World War II. So again, the key should be to get Putin to the point that he needs a cessation of hostilities and will actually negotiate seriously instead of the way that the Russians have been negotiating so far. There's no question who the obstacle to success in the negotiations is at this point.

WHITFIELD: All right, General David Petraeus, thank you so much through church bells, cold and rain and all. I appreciate it.

PETRAEUS: Living the dream, Fredricka. Thank you.

WHITFIELD: It's a beautiful thing. Thank you so much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right, still to come, the latest on the search to find Nancy Guthrie. I'll speak with a retired FBI special agent when we come right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:37:22]

WHITFIELD: All right. We're learning from law enforcement officials in Arizona that a federal warrant was carried out at a residence last night in connection with Nancy Guthrie's disappearance. The Pima County Sheriff's Department says no one was arrested during the search which was based on a lead that investigators received.

Throughout Tucson, residents are showing their support for the missing 84-year-old through yellow flowers and ribbons, a symbol of hope. Retired FBI Supervisory Special Agent Richard Kolko is joining me right now for more perspective on all this. Great to see you. So, I mean, this town is heavily invested in bringing Nancy Guthrie home safely. How do authorities kind of balance the operation at hand with maintaining the public's trust and confidence?

RICHARD KOLKO, RETIRED FBI SUPERVISORY SPECIAL AGENT: Well, the public wants to know everything. I understand that. There's a huge news environment here that's trying to fill the holes and people are very fascinated by this case. But law enforcement has to go about the way they normally do business, which is not bring out everything into the open.

I mean, the sheriff talked about this as a lead that brought them to that house. They did the search warrant. They had three people that they held outside the home. We don't want to say things about them that turns out aren't true. So that's another reason they need to balance what they do with the media so that they don't disperse anybody that, you know, isn't rightfully involved in the case.

WHITFIELD: The FBI has increased the award leading to the location of Guthrie or perhaps even the arrest of those responsible from $50,000 to $100,000. What kind of barometer is this in the investigation?

KOLKO: Well, historically, rewards work. The FBI has had their top 10 list forever. You see a lot of cases around the country that always have rewards. But the big thing here that I think is you have to make that decision to pick up the phone and call law enforcement. We saw those videos the other day and pictures at the home at the doorbell and then we saw that person walking away. And that's the big thing that's important to me was what's called his gait, the way he walked away.

Somebody recognizes the way that person moved, the way they bent over. Whether it's a sibling, a friend, a neighbor, somebody who played high school football with him, whatever it is, you just recognize that. But my point is sometimes people say that and they go, you know, I think that looks like so-and-so. But they don't make that leap to call the police or call the FBI. They're afraid they'd get involved. They might embarrass the person who they think is not, you know, might be wrong and for a variety of reasons they just avoid making that call.

So sometimes that reward may bridge that gap and they say, you know what, that looks like so-and-so. There's a pretty good reward. I will call. Call 1-800-FBI and see if that makes the connection.

[14:40:06]

WHITFIELD: And what do you read into this, what, two-mile radius search? I mean, wouldn't this area already have been canvassed earlier in the investigation?

KOLKO: It would, but as you see, they had to go out and do that search again for the glove. These are very manpower, time power, time intensive operations. It's not simple to do that, going and knocking on every door, getting everybody to pull the videos. It takes a while. Collecting those videos, knowing how -- where they came from, library, recall, and then reviewing them. There's a lot of work. And then one lead always leads to another. So if we ask you for your video, your ring doorbell, you might say, oh yes, my neighbor also has three trail cameras up.

You didn't know you had to go get those. Now you have to go find trail cameras. So when we heard that there were thousands of leads generated in the first 24 or 36 hours after those videos were released, people don't realize that once those leads are covered, they often lead to one or two or three more leads. So you interview somebody and they say, oh yes, go interview so-and-so as well. WHITFIELD: Right, nothing is too small. Richard Kolko, thank you so much.

KOLKO: Of course.

WHITFIELD: All right, straight ahead, many business owners have had a difficult time staying staffed under the threat of ICE immigration raids. The impact for florists scrambling to get Valentine's orders delivered.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:46:02]

WHITFIELD: All right, there are new signs inflation could finally be stabilizing. The Labor Department reported yesterday inflation cooled lower than expected over the last year, now down to a rate of 2.4 percent in January. That's the lowest in eight months. Welcome news for President Trump as polling shows a strong majority of Americans, 60 percent of them, disapprove of his trade agenda. While speaking to troops in North Carolina yesterday, Trump touted the new inflation numbers, saying the economy is better than ever.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We just had fantastic reports on inflation way down, costs of products way down. We're hitting all-time high stock numbers. We're hitting all-time high S&P and Dow numbers. You saw that a few days ago. We had the best economy in history, but this is blowing it away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Is the U.S. economy impacting every American equally? With me now, president of the National Urban League, Marc Morial. Mark, great to see you.

MARC MORIAL, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL URBAN LEAGUE: Thanks for having me.

WHITFIELD: So you are here in Atlanta. You are going to be stopping in at least nine other cities for the National Urban League Demand Diversity Tour. So you just heard the President there. Is it your feeling that there's optimism and the economy is impacting all Americans, including people of color equally?

MORIAL: It's an exaggeration to say that simply one month of better data, a little bit lower inflation, but not down to the 2 percent benchmark, represents a great economy. Because right now what is -- what we really see is a two-tiered economy. If you're an investor in the stock market, then what the S&P and the Dow do is going to benefit you. But for working Americans today, black Americans, the unemployment rate is too high.

For most Americans, the rent and the mortgage payments are too high. The tariff tax is costing the average family an extra thousand dollars a year in expenses. So it's an overstatement to suggest that a little bit better data for one month represents a great economy. And so there's still uncertainty. There's still pain. There's still record layoffs. This is what we've got to understand. There are yellow lights flashing on the future of the American economy.

WHITFIELD: What's your recommendation to this White House? So many administrations, you have been in there. You offer your remedies or recommendations from the National Urban League. Is this White House receptive to your ideas, or have you had an opportunity to do that this go-round?

MORIAL: They have not been receptive. But what I would say is end these tariff taxes and repeal the big ugly bill. The damage long term that those two things are doing and will do, we've not felt yet. Let me give you a perfect example. Ford Motor Company, a great American manufacturer, which thought they might benefit from these tariffs, had a loss in 2025 and one of the largest losses in the fourth quarter that they've had since the Great Recession.

So these policies are not really working, and therefore we have great concern. And I think they ought to be reversed, and we need a reset when it comes to economic policy.

WHITFIELD: And why is that? Largely because of tariffs?

MORIAL: I think tariffs is one thing, and I think the shifting in the big ugly bill of resources from education and health care and programs that are vital to benefiting just a handful of billionaires impacts the American people. So this is a two-tiered economy, and my concern is that that widening is going to continue.

WHITFIELD: You're a former mayor of New Orleans. Your hometown has been targeted by the Trump administration's immigration crackdown in December. Similarly, Minneapolis saw a surge of ICE agents, as we know. However, Border Czar Homan, Tom Homan, says a drawdown of agents will begin in that city after intense protests and two Americans killed.

[14:50:09]

So the governor of Minnesota, Tim Walz, is now saying, you know, that state should be reimbursed. They should pay for what they broke, is how he put it. What will that battle look like to get the federal government to reimburse a city or state?

MORIAL: It's going to be a very tough battle, but the bottom line is the immigration policies have been hand-handed, chaotic, confusing, and an overreach, and they've been violent and destructive. And this is not what the President ran on. He said, I'm going to go after those that have criminal records. And so for cities and states that have been damaged, think about the business owners who had to shut down. Think about the business owners whose workers would not come to work.

There has been an economic loss due to failed policies when it comes to immigration. The American people support immigration enforcement. What they don't support is heavy-handed militarization of American communities. WHITFIELD: What's keeping you hopeful?

MORIAL: What's keeping me hopeful is the energy of young people. What's keeping me hopeful is that many Americans are standing up, using their First Amendment voice. They're using the right to assembly. They are invoking the courts where necessary to challenge policies that are damaging and that are hurting. We're launching our D3 tour, Defend Democracy, Demand Diversity, and Defeat Poverty, because we're doing a call to action to the American public to say, what should we be about? We should be about protecting democracy. We should be about demanding that equal opportunity and fairness be embraced by all American institutions.

And we need economic policies that recognize that the middle class is being pushed into poverty. Can you imagine that there were more middle-class Americans in 1971 than there are today? That's a stunning and remarkable number. But the fact of the matter is, is that the economic challenges that people face affects not only the poor and the most vulnerable, but working and middle-class Americans, student loans, mortgage payments, credit card debts, are rising and causing great pain. So we need a reset when it comes to economic policies.

WHITFIELD: And you'll be talking about that, among other things, at Ebenezer Church here in Atlanta?

MORIAL: Big Bethel, African Methodist Episcopal Church, with Pastor Jay Augustine. And I'm looking forward to it. The AMU Church is one of our great denominations. Yes.

WHITFIELD: Thank you so much. Marc Morial President of the National --

MORIAL: Congratulations to you. You've got a great career.

WHITFIELD: Thank you so much. You're very kind. Thank you.

MORIAL: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: All right. Still to come, a new study shows the time of day cancer patients are treated may make a significant difference in their prognosis.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:57:35]

WHITFIELD: How well your cancer treatment works may actually depend on what time of day you receive the treatment. That's the stunning new finding of a study published in Nature Medicine. Researchers looked at two groups of patients with lung cancer. One group got their medication before 3:00 p.m. and the other afterwards. The early group experienced their cancer progressing slower among some other positive discoveries.

With us now is Christoph Scheiermann. He is a professor of pathology and immunology at the University of Geneva and one of the co-authors of the research study. Welcome. CHRISTOPH SCHEIERMANN, PROF. OF PATHOLOGY AND IMMUNOLOGY, UNIV. OF GENEVA: Thanks for having me.

WHITFIELD: So, would you characterize this as a potential major breakthrough in how this kind of cancer is treated or all cancer treatment approaches?

SCHEIERMANN: For sure, this is the first randomized clinical trial. So, there's definitely a major breakthrough for this specific cancer. Whether this holds true for other cancers, that remains to be seen. But it's a major breakthrough for sure for lung cancer, yes.

WHITFIELD: All right. So, why does getting your treatment earlier in the treatment have such an impact on its efficacy?

SCHEIERMANN: So, that's a big question, right? Because it seems not really logical just by changing the time of infusion for a few hours that you have such a big effect size. So, it seems that if you infuse in the morning, you have a response that is completely different to when you infuse in the evening.

And so, the reason for this is that the cells that you target and also the molecule that you target, is probably more prevalent at a specific time point than the other. And that's probably why, at this time point, the treatment is the most efficacious.

WHITFIELD: So you study circadian rhythms. What made you look at cancer treatments as part of your research?

SCHEIERMANN: It just happened. We found that the immune system, which is very, very important in the antitumor response, is exquisitely sensitive to these circadian interventions. And so what we found was that if you treat in preclinical models, the cancer specific time of day, then you have an effect, whereas by just doing it six hours later, there's virtually no effect whatsoever. You might as well infuse water.

WHITFIELD: And so I wonder quickly --

SCHEIERMANN: And I think it's something that you'll also see in the clinical trial.

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WHITFIELD: Sorry to interrupt you. I'm wondering quickly, does earlier in the day mean that, you know, your body's more alert, or you're moving around doing things and somehow that makes your treatment be absorbed in your body differently?

SCHEIERMANN: So the immune system is just more sensitive to that specific intervention? And then what happens afterwards, once you interfered, then it becomes less sensitive. And so the response is locked. And that's why you see many weeks, many months and years later that response still being different between time of day. So the first time point, probably the first infusion is key.

WHITFIELD: Fascinating and very hopeful. Professor Christoph Scheiermann, thank you so much.

SCHEIERMANN: Thank you.