Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Live Saturday

Twenty Detainees Spend First Full Day at Camp X-Ray

Aired January 12, 2002 - 20:14   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: They are calling it Camp X-Ray, the detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, where U.S. forces plan to question the first 20 detainees to arrive from Afghanistan. ITN's Kevin Dunn reports on the inmates' first night and day in their new quarters.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KEVIN DUNN, ITN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The military transporter carrying the al Qaeda prisoners -- among them, the British national who has not yet been identified -- flew into Guantanamo Bay on Cuba. The media were not allowed access to their arrival, and the prisoners could only be glimpsed from a distance once they were taken off the aircraft. American officers said, however, they would be treated firmly but fairly.

COL. TERRY CARRICO, U.S. ARMY: We're treating them to maintain positive control. And most of the time we will outnumber them, and whenever they're out of their cells. So positive control, firm and fair, and I'm very confident -- very confident that we have the situation well in hand.

DUNN: Human rights groups have expressed concern at the conditions in which the former Taliban fighters will be held, in individual wire cages, partly open to the elements. And the United States is refusing to call the detainees prisoners of war, which means they are not protected by the Geneva Convention.

DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: They will be handled not as prisoners of war, because they're not, but as unlawful combatants. The -- as I understand it, technically, unlawful combatants do not have any rights under the Geneva Convention.

DUNN: Eventually, up to 2,000 prisoners will be confined at Guantanamo Bay, which the United States holds on a lease of more than 100 years from Cuba. The base has unprecedented security. And because it is not on American soil, the detainees will have no recourse to American law. The U.S. has not said how or when it will put them on trial.

Kevin Dunn, ITN News.

(END VIDEOTAPE) LIN: Thirty more detainees in Kandahar; 20 in Cuba. And U.S. warplanes pommel targets in eastern Afghanistan. The military mission clearly continues in the U.S. war on terrorism, but, of course, still no sign yet of Osama bin Laden.

CNN military analyst General Wesley Clark joins us now from Little Rock, Arkansas, for more analysis of what is going to happen with these detainees in Guantanamo.

Good evening, general.

GEN. WESLEY CLARK (RET.), FORMER NATO SUPREME COMMANDER: Good evening, Carol.

LIN: All right, we heard Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld made a distinct point of saying that these detainees in Guantanamo are not prisoners of war, but they are -- as he calls them -- unlawful combatants. Why is he going out of his way to make this distinction when it comes to these rights that these prisoners may or may not have?

CLARK: Well, it's very important that we be able to interrogate these men and get the information from them. We'll have a variety of different government agencies down there dealing with particular individuals. I'm sure they'll be people not only from the Defense Department, but maybe from other elements of the United States government who've got intelligence leads they want to follow up. And this is for an indefinite period.

And so, I think it's very important that these people not be considered prisoners of war. That way there's no clock ticking and they don't have the protections against interrogation and so forth that might be expected out of the Geneva Convention.

LIN: But does it raise any -- does it raise any questions about intent or -- primarily, intent that the U.S. government has toward these detainees, since they've openly said that they don't really know who these people are or what exactly it is that they even know.

CLARK: There are big questions here, Carol. First, there's a question of, are they going to talk? And, if so, when, and what are they going to say? And this is going to be a challenge in itself. And then there's the question of, what happens after that? Will they all be put on trial? Will some be sent home? And, if so, to what end? And we don't know any of those answers.

LIN: And if they are put on trial, who actually tries them? I mean, would they be part of these military tribunals that the Justice Department is talking about setting up? And, if so, would some of them -- these detainees -- be coming to the United States for those trials?

CLARK: Well, it's presumed that they would be tried by military tribunals. But they wouldn't probably come to the United States. These tribunals can be held at Guantanamo. We've got quite large facilities there. We can bring in all the people we need to conduct tribunals there, if that's the case. But you're then faced with the issue, well, what happens after the tribunal? Assuming that they're going to be incarcerated, where is that going to occur and for how long and what are those conditions? And how do you keep them from coming to the United States and asking for all of the rights that people have when they come to the United States?

LIN: Exactly. Even if they were to make that request right now, the defense secretary is essentially saying they don't have the right to ask. That they can be detained indefinitely and under the ground rules of the U.S. military that is holding them.

CLARK: That's right, because they're not on U.S. soil.

LIN: How dangerous is this group that's being brought over to Guantanamo? You know, I read about the details of their journey; how drugs are available in case they get out of hand. It's, you know, two American soldiers for every one passenger; that they're tied to their seats. Is this a little over the top?

CLARK: I think they have to be treated as extremely dangerous. They rebelled in Mazar e-Sharif; they've indicated that they're willing -- some are willing -- to kill themselves. There is still some holdouts from this group apparently in a hospital, and holding off the authorities with -- with weapons and threatening to kill themselves. They did rebel when the Pakistanis captured a group; they took weapons away. So these men are extremely dangerous.

Now in Guantanamo they're going to be kept separated in individual confinement areas by chain-link. But they will be able to talk. And we know from our experience, and our men who were held captive in Vietnam, they do talk. And Prisoners do make escape plans, and they do do their best to resist. And these are men who are -- they've proved they'll literally stop at nothing. So they have to be treated as extremely dangerous.

LIN: Dangerous, but perhaps knowledgeable. General, what if there is an individual or a group of people there who actually know where Osama bin Laden is and know how to get to them? Can a deal be struck that these people in Guantanamo get their freedom in exchange for that information?

CLARK: I think nothing would be ruled out at this point. But I think the United States is also going to be mindful that these people are going to be dangerous for ever, in the sense that with their degree of commitment -- unless they really give up on that commitment -- they could become a threat 10 years after release from prison. And so, we'll be looking very carefully for any deals that are cut, I'm sure.

LIN: All right. Thank you very much, General Wesley Clark in Little Rock, Arkansas, on this Saturday evening.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com