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CNN Live Saturday

Interview with Scott Leonard, Dante Chinni

Aired March 09, 2002 - 22:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CATHERINE CALLAWAY, CNN ANCHOR: It is a shot fired from an ABC boardroom that ricocheted across newsrooms and has landed in the headlines now. The ruckus is over the network's idea of replacing a legendary newsman with a popular funny man. Anchor Ted Koppel is not laughing, having found about all this second hand.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(voice-over): Round one in the entertainment corner is late night's own David Letterman. Squaring off against him from the ABC News division, journalist Ted Koppel. Throw in a wildcard from NBC, and you've got an entertainment versus news battle worth millions. Experts keeping score say "NIGHTLINE" is simply falling victim to the obsession of the bottomline, ratings and revenues.

And ABC is banking on big laughs to bring in the late night big bucks. All this fuss has generated much fodder for rival comedian Jay Leno.

JAY LENO, THE TONIGHT SHOW: That's the big story. Now you probably there's this thing ABC's Letterman going over there, "NIGHTLINE." Well today, CBS announced they're offering David Letterman a salary of $31.5 million a year. Well, I don't want to brag, but today, NBC offered me free arena football tickets.

This is all serious business for news veterans, concerned about a cultural shift and a growing appetite for entertainment.

WALTER CRONKITE, FMR. CBS ANCHORMAN: That has been a very important broadcast. Ted's done that beautifully, of course, he and his staff. And we do not have enough of that kind of serious look at the news on the air. I am disappointed that the networks, after all the years we tried to get on primetime with news oriented broadcasting.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CALLAWAY: To further discuss the possible demise of "NIGHTLINE" and the loss of hard news leverage in the media, I'm joined tonight by Dante Chinni in Washington. He's the senior associate from Project Excellence in Journalism, and Scott Leonard, who's in Los Angeles. He's president of Ad Marketing and advertising.

Gentlemen, thank you both for being with us tonight. I don't know about you guys, but this kind of surprised me. You know, I know it's television and all that, but "NIGHTLINE" is a staple. I can't imagine it being replaced with a funny man talk show.

DANTE CHINNI, PROJECT FOR EXCELLENCE IN JOURNALISM: Well, I think it surprises you or I think Ted Koppel was, as you put in the piece there, was even more surprised than the people over at the news division of ABC surprised. The head of ABC News, David Westin didn't know anything about this, supposedly. So it's -- it was a little shocking to everybody involved.

CALLAWAY: Scott, what did you think about it all?

SCOTT LEONARD, AD MARKETING: I don't think I was as surprised about Letterman moving networks, but certainly, Koppel's been such an icon for so long. And I would say I was pretty surprised.

CALLAWAY: So Scott, why do think this could happen or why would do you think this is going to happen?

LEONARD: Well, people are talking about ABC wanting a young audience. And I think that, you know, obviously it's about the money. ABC's not really going to shake something up if it's not about a serious amount of money. And they're looking to their future. They're looking to their short term profitability and certainly their long term profitability.

CALLAWAY: Dante, is it all about money?

CHINNI: I mean, absolutely. And I think the key thing is we are talking about at least short term profitability here right now, because ratings wise, when you look at "NIGHTLINE" and "LATE NIGHT WITH DAVID LETTERMAN," they're even. In fact, some nights, they're not even, but they're very close. And some nights, Koppel beats Letterman.

And also, even when you look at the demographics, it's very close. The average age for "NIGHTLINE" is about 50, 51. And the average age for Letterman is 46 or 47. But apparently those four years make a big difference in terms of ad revenue.

CALLAWAY: Money, yes. Let's take a look at a Gallup poll on all this and see what it has to say. There it is. If you were watching television late at night, which would you prefer? "THE LATE SHOW WITH DAVID LETTERMAN," 35 percent. "NIGHTLINE WITH TED KOPPEL," 50 percent. Wow, you know, can't always go by the polls, but you have to think that most people, especially in these times that we are in, want that hard news option.

We've already got late night television choices, people going back and forth, but Scott, you know, what kind of option are we going to have if you want some hard news at that hour?

LEONARD: You know, the truth is that there's more hard news available today, you know, certainly through broadcasts, through cable, and you know, over the Internet, than there's ever been. I mean, the world was a very different place when "NIGHTLINE" started. And I don't think it's going to be a problem.

CALLAWAY: Dante, what do you think?

CHINNI: I think obviously it's hurt the consumer at home, wanting to watch, you know, there's going to be a lot of humor, talk humor on. And right now, it's split between Letterman and Leno. If Letterman moves over to ABC, you can expect him -- CBS to replace it with more humor talk. And there's going to be less choices for the people watching TV.

But also, I think, for ABC they've got to be thinking about profits here because it's going to be splitting the audience, too. That audience right now that's split between two is going to be split three ways for the talk humor.

CALLAWAY: Yes, I was going to ask you about that, Scott. What about that? ABC, NBC, and CBS all three possibly having, you know, late night talk like that? Aren't they losing some of their audience?

LEONARD: Sure, but you know, to some extent, look at ABC's position. I mean, are they responsible for delivering news if the other two networks are delivering comedy? I mean, to some extent they have -- I mean, they're in the business of television. And they have a -- you know, they certainly have a responsibility to run their network profitably.

And if they feel like maybe moving their audience to a younger audience, which you know, the ad inventory's certainly sold at premium, if that's a good, you know, if that's a good thing for the network, then you can't say that they're the ones that are responsible for doing this.

CALLAWAY: Yes, but we've seen the poll. The poll was just brought to everyone, showing that most people would rather have that option of Ted Koppel at night. Dante, are we just taking it personal, as television journalists?

CHINNI: I mean, maybe to some extent, but you know, this would be a very, very bad thing for television news, particularly broadcast news, because if you can take a show like "NIGHTLINE" that is profitable, it does a very -- it makes good money by television news standards, and you can take it off the air, you've got to wonder what else is next and what happens to the nightly news programs and when Brokaw, Rather, and Jennings retire, what's next?

CALLAWAY: Yes.

CHINNI: I mean, do they start thinking maybe we can start phasing this out?

CALLAWAY: Yes. And Scott, do you have any final thoughts?

LEONARD: No, I just think that, you know, obviously the networks have to do what's in their best interest. I would be sad if there weren't news options. I have a feeling that if, you know, if David Letterman does go over to ABC, you know, something will happen that's very good for Koppel. Maybe they'll redo the show a little bit on another network. It's not going to go away. I mean, you know, obviously the demand there and somebody's going to fill it. So all in all, I think the world will be fine.

CALLAWAY: Hey, it is television. You never know. We've been pretty good lately about swapping networks and cable networks as well, on different programs, different anchors.

Dante Chinni in Washington, Scott Leonard in Los Angeles, thank you for being with us on this Saturday night. So you both have this -- you guys have the same hair stylist is all I can think, because look at yourselves.

CHINNI: Yes, doesn't matter what you're coast you're on, I guess, you know.

CALLAWAY: That's right. Thank you both for being with us tonight.

CHINNI: Thank you very much.

LEONARD: Thanks a lot.

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