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CNN Live Saturday

Interview With Jim Walsh

Aired September 14, 2002 - 17:08   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. officials point to the arrests in Pakistan and Lackwanna as advances in the fight against terrorism. Let's explore further the significance of these arrests. Helping to guide us on the topic, Jim Walsh, a political scientist and terrorism expert from Harvard. Good to see you.
JIM WALSH, TERRORISM EXPERT: Good to see you, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right, well, with Wednesday's arrest involving two al Qaeda operatives, is it believed that this really is still just the tip of the iceberg, or is this evidence that the al Qaeda operation is being broken up?

WALSH: Well, I think it's a little bit of both. I think we've made good progress this week and over the past several months.

On the other hand, I think we shouldn't kid ourselves. Al Qaeda is a resilient, adaptive organization. It's decentralized, and we should suspect that they'll try to adapt and come back and hit us in some way in the future. We need to continue to press forward to try to pick off these leaders one at a time, but just because we get one doesn't mean they're not going to be able to launch future attacks.

WHITFIELD: And of the two arrests on Wednesday, we know the identity of one, Ramzi Binalshibh. We don't know the identity of the second person. What do you know about Binalshibh and his hierarchy in the operation?

WALSH: Well, I think he's an important player, particularly in regards to the 9/11 operation. He's described in an Al Jazeera documentary that was aired on the 9/11 anniversary as being a key coordinator of that event. And as was indicated in your good report there, I think the real value of him will be that he will have up to date information. So if he can be persuaded to share that information or tricked into sharing that information, that could be quite useful.

WHITFIELD: Wouldn't expectations be fairly low that he would cooperate and share any of that information that he may have?

WALSH: Absolutely, Fredricka. I would suspect that anyone who is that high, a senior member of the leadership, is going to be reluctant to talk and, if anything, may try to spread disinformation, try to throw us off the trail.

But sometimes people give up information in ways they don't expect, because they don't know what you already know. And so it is possible to get some information from them. You'll know -- you'll remember that earlier this week, when we raised the terror alert from brown to orange, to a high alert, that was based in part on information we had gotten in interviews with al Qaeda operatives. So it is possible, though I think extremely difficult, to get information.

WHITFIELD: All right, let's talk about the Buffalo case -- five men, between the ages of 23 and 29, being arraigned here. Here's the charge: Conspiring to provide material support and resources to a foreign terrorist organization. It was made very clear by high- ranking Justice Department officials that had it not been for the cooperation of the Muslim community, perhaps this arrest may not have come when it did. How significant do you believe this is, that members of the Muslim community, particularly in Lackawanna, wanted to help out in this investigation?

WALSH: Well, I think it's important, especially given the week's earlier events in Florida. But on the other hand, I'm not surprised. There are millions of patriotic Muslims in the United States, Muslims who are horrified at the events of 9/11. There were Muslims who died on 9/11. And those people don't want to see more terrorist attacks against their home country, their homeland. And so I credit that community. But I'm not surprised. I think they're as patriotic as anybody else.

WHITFIELD: These five arrested men have been dubbed as being al Qaeda-trained, but that they're not necessarily being linked directly, there is no evidence yet to link them to an al Qaeda cell. Does that seem like a misnomer to you? Doesn't it seem like if you're going to be trained, that means that you're already probably associated with a cell?

WALSH: Well, yes and no. Remember that al Qaeda is really a loose organization. It has lots of people who have lots of different causes and motivations who have come through that operation for training. Some have gone back to Kashmir to battle India, some go back to Chechnya, others probably just disappear and give it up altogether.

So it's a loose affiliation of people. And just because you're in a training camp doesn't mean you're going to be a terrorist. Clearly, it's an indicator that one should be suspicious of those people and should follow up on their activities. But I think to use an overused phrase, we need to connect the dots and be careful, go step by step by step.

WHITFIELD: All right, Jim Walsh, thank you very much.

WALSH: Thank you, Fredricka.

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