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CNN Live Saturday

Woman Who Rescued Boy Tossed From Car Lied; Zoloft Murder Closing Arguments Set For Monday

Aired February 12, 2005 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: It is 2 p.m. on the East Coast, 11 a.m. in the West. Good afternoon, I'm Christine Romans at CNN's global headquarters in Atlanta, in for Fredricka Whitfield.
Ahead this hour from North Korea to Iran to Iraq, the players in President Bush's axis of evil are making news. We'll talk about the threats and the possible strategies.

Plus...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD DEAN, CHAIRMAN, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CMTE.: I'm very thankful and grateful. I'm humbled. And I'm ready to go to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: No wild outbursts with this victory. A serious and subdued Howard Dean takes the helm of the Democratic Party. Is he ready for the task ahead of him?

And this man's a House freshman with a bright future and a past that sets him apart. Louisiana Congressman Bobby Jindal spotlights today's "Novak Zone."

Those stories in a moment, but first a look at the headlines "Now in the News".

Stories in the news right now, at least 17 people are dead after a car bomb blew up outside the main hospital in a Shiite city south of Baghdad. More than two dozen others are wounded. Among the dead, six security guards. The area is the scene of frequent attacks by Sunni insurgents.

The leaders of Israel and the Palestinians say they're taking action today to give life to promises of a cease-fire. Mahmoud Abbas is trying to slow down or stop militant attacks, and Israel says it is allowing dozens of expelled Palestinians to return to their homes in the West Bank.

Vatican officials are expressing optimism about Pope John Paul's health saying he's able to continue working. They're even talking about traveling in August to the World Youth Day in Germany. The pope is out of the hospital after recovering from serious breathing problems and the flu. Rescue workers are still searching for victims from this week's deadly dam break in southwestern Pakistan. At least six villages were wiped out by the flood waters, killing at least 145 people, with dozens more missing. In northern Pakistan, at least 80 people have been killed in a series of avalanches the past two days.

Nuclear troubles for President Bush. North Korea announced last week it's walking away from six-party negotiations over its nuclear program. For the latest from the Bush administration, we go to CNN White Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.

Hi, Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Christine.

As a matter of fact, the White House and its allies are involved in tense discussions over what to do next. Now, if North Korea decides it's not going to abandon its nuclear weapons program, should the United States abandon those six-party talks while U.S. officials are considering a number of options.

That is exactly what they're talking about. One of them is to suggest to treat North Korea like Iran. That would be meaning to refer North Korea to the U.N. Security Council for possible economic sanctions. The problem with that approach, they believe, however, is that Russia and China would not likely sign on.

Another possible option is to toughen the efforts to block North Korea from transferring nuclear technology to so-called terrorist states. The U.S. has proof that North Korea has sold nuclear components to Libya in the past and even perhaps Iran as well. The U.S. would put on more pressure on North Korea's neighbors, particularly China, to take a look, to monitor their borders, North Korean flights and shipments.

And then, finally, of course, U.S. officials say the most immediate short-term strategy is to put as much pressure as possible on the members of the six-party talks, Russia, China, Japan, and South Korea, should try to get them to be much tougher on North Korea, to try to get them to come back to the negotiating table.

All of that, of course, in the context of a flurry of diplomatic efforts that being made. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice will be meeting with her counterparts, her Chinese as well as her South Korean counterparts. One of those, as a matter of fact, South Korea's foreign minister who held consultations with Vice President Dick Cheney just here yesterday at the White House.

And of course, we're also told as well there are going to be Chinese officials, a delegation that will be traveling to North Korea sometime in the weeks to come, to try again to push them back to the negotiating table. Christine?

ROMANS: Indeed, leadership from that region so important, because North Korea nukes very important for North Korea's neighbors as well, not just the United States.

MALVEAUX: Well, absolutely. They pose more of a threat to the neighbors, to those in the region. And also, there's such an important economic relationship between North Korea and China. As you know, North Korea depends on China much for its trade, for its energy, even for food for its people. So the real hope here is that China will be able to twist the arm a little bit more, of North Korea, to get them to come back to the negotiating table. They believe that this is a lot of brinksmanship, bargaining before they go back to the negotiations.

ROMANS: All right. Suzanne Malveaux at the White House. Thank you, Suzanne.

North Korea is only part of the problem for President Bush. Iran is also pursuing its own nuclear problem. Something Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld addressed today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD RUMSFELD, U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: The hope is that the -- whether the Europeans or the IAEA could proceed on the diplomatic path and to find a way to persuade Iran that their seeming path towards the development of a nuclear weapon is not something that would contribute to stability in the world.

And that there is not much daylight as between the approaches of the United States and the Europeans. I think there's very broad agreement that it is not in the interests of the world that there be a nuclear program in Iran.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Last week U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said the U.S. has no plans to attack Iran at this time.

But with the U.S. taking a firm stand on Iran's nuclear program, some wonder if all the Bush administration rhetoric is a case of deja vu. CNN's David Ensor has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID ENSOR, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice over): As the CIA's man in Iraq, David Kay could not find any weapons of mass destruction, though U.S. Intelligence said they were there. Now he worries about history repeating itself.

Looking at Iran, after Iraq, is a particularly vexing problem. Because we now know how wrong we got it, in the case of Iraq. It was not a marginal difference.

ENSOR: In Iran's case, the first revelation about the then- secret weapons related facilities in Natan and Iraq came from Iranian dissident emigres, who continue to offer additional tidbits almost weekly. That reminds Kay of some not so reliable information from the Iraqi associates, then emigre leader Ahmed Chalabi, before the Iraq war. KAY: My suspicion we're going to find out in Iran, just like in Iraq, we had no human operatives on the ground and that our best source of information were people who defected and had other agendas.

ENSOR: Back in the fall of 2002, Bush administration rhetoric about Iraq was ramping up.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We cannot wait for the final proof, the smoking gun that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud.

ENSOR: Fast forward to 2005, and the rhetoric is about Iran; warnings to Tehran to give up its nuclear programs or face uncertain consequences. On January 20th, Inauguration Day, Vice President Cheney told an interviewer, that quote, "The Israelis might well decide to act first and let the rest of the world worry about cleaning up the diplomatic mess afterwards."

(On camera): What did you think when Vice President Cheney warned that the Israelis might attack Iran?

KAY: I actually don't think it was an effective threat.

ENSOR (voice over): Mot effective, argues Kay, because times have changed since 1981, when the Israeli jets knocked out the Iraqi nuclear program with just one raid.

KAY: I think the Iranians know what the Israelis did. And that's why they've scattered their program and made it very difficult to locate.

ENSOR: Kay says the administration is making a mistake, not to sit down with the Iranians and offer them security guarantees from a super power that they cannot get in their ongoing discussions with European diplomats about giving up their nuclear programs.

(On camera): But administration officials privately say they have doubts that a deal could be done with, and then honored by Tehran. Officials tell CNN a methodical review of U.S. intelligence on Iran's nuclear facilities is under way. And the administration is in no mood to soften its warnings to Tehran -- David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: Two weeks after Iraqis went to the polls in landmark elections, we're about to find out the results. Officials in Baghdad say they will announce final vote tallies tomorrow. And by midweek, pending any disputes that might arise, the official numbers will be announced.

Meanwhile, there's no letup this weekend in the violence in Iraq. In the worst attack, 17 people lost their lives when a car bomb exploded at a police checkpoint south of Baghdad. Insurgents also launched bloody attacks in northern and southern Iraq. CNN's Nic Robertson reports from the Iraqi capital. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The blast occurred about 10:00 a.m. in the morning. Police say a suicide bomber drove a car full of explosives up to the gates of Al Musaib (ph) General Hospital about 70 kilometers, 45 miles south of Baghdad, detonated the explosives, injuring 26 people and killing 17 others. They say among the 17 dead were six security guards working at the gates of the hospital.

In the north of Iraq, in the city of Mosul, police say they have found the bodies of six Iraqi national guardsmen. They say the guardsmen had been shot in the head and the chest. Eyewitnesses say a note pinned to the -- to one of the dead Iraqi national guardsmen read, this is an Iraqi national guardsman who took part in the offensive on Falluja. An apparent reference to the combined U.S. and Iraqi offensive on the city of Falluja in November last year.

And in the south of Iraq, police say that a judge was killed. This judge had been a former senior judge in the town of Basra, under Saddam Hussein's regime. He had returned recently to be a lower court judge in Basra. Police say as he was arriving to work this morning, two gunmen on a motorcycle pulled alongside his vehicle, shot at the vehicle killing him, and wounding his two bodyguards.

One of the bodyguards is believed to be in critical condition. The other, according to police, is in a coma -- Nic Robertson, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: Howard Dean is now dean of the Democrats. But is he the right man for the job? We'll talk about what lies ahead for the former Vermont governor.

Also ahead, did a prescription drug make this boy commit murder? And if it did, who should be punished? That is on the docket in today's legal round table.

Plus, from a newcomer who raps about religion to some old-time favorites, we'll head to L.A. for a look at this year's Grammy contenders.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: Well, he's the news face of the Democratic Party. Earlier today, Howard Dean, former Vermont governor, and sometimes- controversial Democratic candidate, was chosen Democratic national party chairman.

Dean told party leaders that if Democrats want to win nationally, they have to win locally. It is the heart of his plan to help Democrats recover from last November party losses. Joining us from Washington is CNN Political Analyst Ron Brownstein.

Ron, so, Dean is the man. You know, it's a big turn-around for him. Just a year ago, they were talking about the Dean scream, and now he's going to be the authority of the party.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: He's back. You know, figuratively, the last time most Americans saw Howard Dean, he was being led off the stage in Iowa with a hook after his eruption following his loss in the caucus.

But you know what, Christine, he organized very well for this job. You know, one thing that Howard Dean has always had is a grassroots organization. He put it to work in contacting the DNC members. He had an audience that was sympathetic. The 447 DNC members, Democratic National Committee members, who decided this are more liberal than the party overall, more liberal certainly than the country overall. So they were receptive to him.

And third, he sort of fits in with the tenor of the times. If you look at what's been going on with the Democrats since the election, for better or worse, they have chosen a strategy of confrontation with President Bush. The large vote against Condoleezza Rice, the large vote against Alberto Gonzalez. Howard Dean sort of reflects that sentiment within the party. Many of the people introducing him this morning, emphasized one word, he's a fighter. That's what Democrats seem to want right now.

ROMANS: Yet, he has said that the way to take on the Republican Party is not by showing everyone how terrible the Republicans are. He said the Republicans, they're the party of the past. The Democrats have to prove to people that they're the party of the future. Can he do that?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, I think there's a lot of ambivalence about Howard Dean in this role among Democrats. Publicly, he dominated this race. In the end, none of the other candidates, announced candidates even stood on the ballot against him. They all dropped out because he had such overwhelming support.

Privately, it was a different story. A lot of elected officials are uncertain whether he's the right guy for this job. Partially because he was defined as a liberal in the presidential race, but more temperamentally, I mean, he was someone who said a lot of things as a candidate that he eventually had to take back. The capture of Saddam did not make us safer. Osama bin Laden deserves the presumption of innocence.

There's a question about whether temperamentally that he's suited for a job that is ultimately is subordinate to the elected officials. The jury's out on whether he can play in that role.

ROMANS: So Dean's got a few years to start putting together his stable for the next presidential election. Let's talk about the wagering for 2008. Let's start with the Democrats. We've got a poll here shows how it's been playing out. It looks like the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll, Hillary Clinton, 40 percent, John Kerry 25 percent, 17 percent for John Edwards, and someone else, we don't know who it is yet, 6 percent. Democrats choice in '08, what do you think?

BROWNSTEIN: TBD (ph), well, usually when you're polling this far out, it's mostly a reflection of name identification; who's the best known? John Kerry and John Edwards were on the ticket. Obviously they're well known. Hillary Clinton is well known, too, because of -- as being the former first lady. In this case it is probably a pretty accurate reflection. If Hillary Clinton runs, like George Bush in 2000, she will be an overwhelming favorite. And the competition will be who will be the anti-Hillary. Who will be the other choice? And that's what the race would be, if she decides to run.

That's when you look at the GDP's choice when you look at the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup Poll. Rudy Giuliani tops John McCain. Everyone in New York where I live was so just raring to go for that Senate battle between Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani. Maybe they'll get a chance at it in '08?

BROWNSTEIN: Could it be Stephen Douglas and Abraham Lincoln in 1860? Running against each other for president after running for Senate. Look, Rudy Giuliani and John McCain, also in the same way, this far out have the highest, best name identification. John McCain ran last time. Rudy Giuliani imprinted into the country's consciousness post-9/11.

Both would face serious hurdles, though, in practice, on social issues in particular, they might run into -- especially Giuliani, who is pro-choice, pro-gun control and pro-gay rights. He'd face a lot of resistance in practice from social conservatives, who are not the single biggest constituency in the Republican primary electorate.

I think it's not really clear what the top tier of the Republican race is going to be in 2008. Giuliani, McCain are likely to be ahead in the polls. Mitt Romney could be a formidable contender, Bill First was on that list. But I think it's going to take a lot more time to sort out than the Democratic race if Hillary runs.

ROMANS: You talk about moving to the middle Hillary Clinton, earlier this week, talking about abstinence education, talking about some issues that some Republicans -- some on the right were saying, oh, she's trying to steer further into the middle. She's trying to become, or at least appear less liberal. Although her supporters say she's always believed in these sort of things.

BROWNSTEIN: She would seem to have a good model for that in her husband, Bill Clinton. Who really, in 1992 and 1996, significantly changed the ideological profile of the Democratic Party in everything from the death penalty to welfare reform to balancing the budget. If you look at what Hillary Clinton is doing, it's clear she's trying to define herself in a more centrist manner, not only on abortion but immigration, defense issues as well.

The question will be whether she can change the perception people have on her based on issues on whether it's a deeper, personalized assessment of her that's going to be very difficult to dislodge by, you know, enunciating a different view.

ROMANS: Yes, it is definitely the flipside of her name recognition.

BROWNSTEIN: Absolutely.

ROMANS: All right. Ron Brownstein, thank you so much for joining us, Ron.

BROWNSTEIN: See you in New Hampshire.

ROMANS: All right. I'll get my hotel reservations right now.

BROWNSTEIN: OK.

ROMANS: Thanks, Ron.

Howard Dean hasn't been the only one looking for the nod this month. Up next, a preview of just who might get the big yeah as the countdown to the Grammies continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: In other news across America in Los Angeles, a dramatic rescue of a 13-year-old boy. He was nearly swept down the Los Angeles River and into the Pacific Ocean. A firefighter strapped him into a harness and lifted him to safety.

In Manchester, New Hampshire some 70 New Hampshire Army National Guard troops are back from Iraq where they were greeted by signs reading, Welcome Home, Daddy. The troops were based in southeastern Iraq for nearly a year. Undertaking a number of humanitarian missions every soldier in this unit returned home safe and sound.

And the mailman won't be delivering to the NBA anymore. Karl Malone is expected to officially retire on Sunday. Malone is the league's second all-time leading scorer, but never won a championship in his 19-year career.

Get ready for the Grammies, the music industry's biggest night. What's in it for the fans tomorrow night? Let's go to CNN Pop Culture Correspondent Toure who is live in Los Angeles.

Now, if you win a Grammy, you get the little statue, you get the prestige. But winning a Grammy, also, I mean, it can be a bump in your record sales, too. These artists want one of these things.

TOURE: You know, you do get a little bump in sales like Nora Jones two years ago. This is the dog and pony show, where they introduce you to everybody you may not have heard of.

This is not a life-changing award. Like you win an Oscar and your name becomes academy award winner da-da-da-da-da. This is not so with the Grammys. Of course, Marisa Tomei would beg to differ, Christine. But this is a lesser award than winning an Academy Award.

ROMANS: Talk to me the difference between record of the year and song of the year.

TOURE: Excellent question. People want to ask this all the time. Record of the year goes to artists and producers. Song of the year goes to songwriters. Record of the year is about the performance of the song. Song of the year is about what's written out on paper.

So a song like, "Yeah" that Usher made, you couldn't cover it. You couldn't notate it even. It's about what the two of them did in the studios with the sounds and the spaces.

Song of the year, say perhaps like Alisha Keys, "If I Ain't Got You," is a beautiful piece of -- it is beautiful on paper, and somebody else could come along and cover it and make it better or worse, or what have you, Christine.

ROMANS: We've heard about the Internet hurting the record business. A lot of buzz about this when you're talking about Grammys, when you're talking about some of the celebrities and musicians. This still a problem for the industry?

TOURE: Well, downloading a little bit less of a problem than it was two or three years ago. But the issue's actually shifted a little bit. Because now we have all the audio blogs. You have heard a lot about blogs, now there's audio blogs, where people will post songs, a lot of times a new song, a new R. Kelly song. There are a couple of new Beck songs on the audio blogs now. You can go on there and download songs. Now, this is illegal downloading, yes. But the record business is looking the other way, so far, because this is a great way for viral marketing, and putting new songs in the iPods of early adopters.

ROMANS: All right. Toure, last question, most important what are your picks? What do you think? Anything jump out at you, you think is a sure bet?

TOURE: You know, I really don't know. I mean, if there's justice, Kanye will win. He's got the best album of the group. It is a fantastic record. I've been listening to it all year long.

But, you know, Ray Charles, we all know what happened when somebody recently deceased is involved in an award show like this. And so it could be Ray Charles. But then, you know, all these R&B and hip- hop people could divide their vote, right? And Green Day could step up and win with the rock 'n roll constituency. It's a truly suspenseful Grammys for once.

ROMANS: Oh, the drama. Toure, thank you so much. Talk to you soon.

TOURE: Thank you.

ROMANS: He put his own stamp on this year's State of the Union. We'll meet the man who organized the ink-stained fingers, ahead in this week's "Novak Zone".

But first, one day later, more answers, still more questions in the case of an unwanted baby boy in Florida. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

Checking stories "Now in the News": Deadly attacks continue across Iraq. In the bloodiest incident, a suicide car bomber killed at least 17 people in a town south of Baghdad. More than two dozen others were hurt. The attack was at a police checkpoint near a hospital.

In Washington, a warning from President Bush as he presses Congress to overhaul Social Security. In his weekly radio address, President Bush predicts a rash of tax hikes or cuts in benefits if Congress decides not to pass his reform plan. Among other things the Bush plan calls for partially privatizing Social.

He failed in his bid for the presidency, but he will play a major role in the next battle for the white house. As expected, Howard Dean was elected chairman of the Democratic National Committee earlier today. Among other things, Dean vows to go on the offensive against Republicans and better explain the Democratic Party's position on issues.

The story of a baby tossed from a moving car caught the nation's attention. A good samaritan stopped to help and rushed the baby boy to a hospital. An inspirational tale, but it never happened. The good samaritan was really the baby's mother. She concocted the whole story. Police say Patricia Pokriot hid her pregnancy and did not want that child. This afternoon she's being held for psychiatric evaluation. Pokriot has not been charged.

Patricia Pokriot had a 10-year-old son who is also now in the state's care. The boy's father was denied custody due to a previous child abuse charge.

Brian Andrews of CNN Miami Affiliate WFOR has details.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN ANDREWS, WFOR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Scott Hargreaves was actually at the courthouse with his fiance to get married and ended up in a special hearing for the custody of his son. He's the father of Patricia Ann Pokriots' 10-year-old son Scottie. The state, though, won't give him custody, because, they say, he has an outstanding child abuse charge.

QUESTION: Have you see him recently?

SCOTT HARGREAVES: Two weeks ago.

QUESTION: Have you seen her recently?

HARGREAVES: Two weeks ago.

QUESTION: Did she look pregnant?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: She didn't look pregnant at all?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: Did she ever say anything to you at all about being pregnant?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: And your definite it's not your child?

HARGREAVES: Definitely not. Absolutely not, no.

ANDREWS: The state seeking custody of Scottie and baby Johnny now that their mother has been institutionalized. Patricia Ann's mother also attended the hearing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's got a microphone in my face.

QUESTION: I know. Do you think she's going to be OK, though?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Put it away.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, then turn it off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Then turn it off.

QUESTION: Do you think that she's going to be OK?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I hope so.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: That report from Brian Andrews of our Miami affiliate WFOR.

There's a safe haven law in Florida to protect parents of abandoned newborns, but these parents have to follow the law to get protection. The newborn must be approximately three days old or younger. He or she must be left at a fire station or emergency medical station with full time firefighters paramedics or emergency medical technician. The newborn may also be left at a hospital. In exchange for leaving the child at those locations, a parent is allowed to remain anonymous and will generally avoid being the target of a criminal investigation unless the newborn is abused or neglected.

Police say a woman who's nine months pregnant fought off and killed a female attacker who was armed with a knife. Now authorities are investigating whether the attack was an attempt to steal the fetus. The incident happened in suburban Cincinnati -- Thursday, rather. Police say Sarah Brady acted in self-defense and she won't be charged. Brady wasn't hurt in the attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SGT. TOM LOOS, FORT MICHELL POLICE: I spoke to about 15 family members who told me that, although her delivery date kept moving forward, that her latest delivery date was supposed to be yesterday or today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Both women had registered for gifts at the same baby store. Investigators are looking into whether the attacker used the registry to contact Brady.

A South Carolina murder trial will soon go to jury. But will that jury decide the guilt of a boy or the guilt of a prescription drug? We'll pose that question to our legal eagles.

And later on, a massive display of public art is unveiled today in Central Park. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: In our legal briefs, closing arguments are set for Monday in a South Carolina courtroom. A teen on trial accused of fatally shooting his grandparents, blames the drug Zoloft for his actions. Now, new FDA findings on the drug could put a twist in the trial.

To discuss this case and others, New York criminal defense attorney Richard Herman joins us.

RICHARD HERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good afternoon.

ROMANS: And in Cleveland, civil rights attorney and law professor Avery Friedman. Gentlemen, thank you.

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Hi, Christine. Nice to see you.

ROMANS: Let's start with the Zoloft trial. Because this is interesting. Some say it's Zoloft on trial, and others say this is a kid on trial for shotgunning his parents -- his grandparents to death, rather.

Richard, let's start with you. If you were defending this kid, would you bring up the Zoloft? would You be trying to say that this drug made this kid do it?

HERMAN: Christine, the defense is screaming that Zoloft is on trial here, I mean. This is such a horrific crime. And the preconceived ideas of the jurors coming in, a young man shooting both his grandparents in bed while they slept, that's horrible. But this Zoloft drug has created an issue here. And there's been conflicting testimony and battle of experts as to the impact of this drug on pediatric patients, especially in the dosages that this young man was taking. And it's a dream for defense attorney in a case like this, to have this issue, raise it for the jury and you just never know this case may fall on this. Some one or two jurors may go ahead and say this drug has caused it.

FRIEDMAN: No.

ROMANS: You know, Avery, the thing about this that is interesting, is this kid after the fact, you know, according to the details of this trial, came up with a very well thought-out alibi of the black guy who came in and committed the crime. And the police were out looking for this other person. Does that show maybe trying to -- an alibi, does that show someone who is a criminal, who's not just a sick kid?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, this is the second time in South Carolina that somebody white kills members of their family, and they blame it on a black guy. The evidence in this case, the way it came out is that, two weeks after he murdered his grandparents, he was bragging about the fact that they deserved it.

And then the defense put on a primary witness, a psychiatrist who hadn't practiced for years, Dr. Kapit (ph), and he said basically I examined him three years after the crime. Well, Dr. Kapit went kaput. And I think this jury is going to look at the evidence and say, you know what, I understand the -- we understand the Zoloft problems, but the evidence is so clear, Christine, that he knew what he was doing. And I'm predicting at 90 minutes of arguments on Monday and deliberations, Mr. Pittman is looking for conviction.

HERMAN: Really going out on a limb there, Avery. Very good, that's great.

ROMANS: Let's talk about the FDA saying that, you know, now putting out some tighter warnings on this particular drug, much after the fact. Does it have any kind of influence on the jury? Does it have any place in the courtroom now that the FDA seems to are more concerned about this drug, in particular for children, for minors?

HERMAN: I think the evidence is already before them. And I don't think that's even going to come into evidence in this case. And they're just trying to...

FRIEDMAN: Actually, you did. Richard, it actually did come into evidence.

HERMAN: OK, well...

FRIEDMAN: There was some evidence introduced on the FDA's switch in position. I, frankly, think, and you may disagree with me, I think it's going to have very little effect, because this young man had a motive. He burned the house. He bragged about it. And while Zoloft, I mean, there are issues about it, based on this case, on the evidence, it's going to be really difficult for the defense to convince the jury to acquit here.

ROMANS: A lot of people take antidepressants and they don't kill somebody. But the problem is, which came first, obviously the child was troubled. That's why he was on the depressant in the first place. How do you prove that? HERMAN: This was a pediatric patient. This was not an adult patient. These drugs are not, as I'm told prescribed for pediatric patients. And if they are, they're supposed to be under strict medical supervision.

FRIEDMAN: I agree.

HERMAN: And it's my understanding he was not under that supervision. That he had doubled and tripled the dosages. As a defense attorney, this is what you have to grab on to. It's a very, very difficult case.

FRIEDMAN: Right.

HERMAN: You may raise an issue.

ROMANS: Are we going to see more cases of people blaming crimes or events on the drug they were taking? Because let's be honest, more and more Americans are taking prescription drugs.

FRIEDMAN: We've seen it forever. We've seen it forever. I mean, I think the defense has to go with what they have. Even though FDA has changed its position in this case, the fact is, that there was so much evidence that this is really a bad guy, and that's really what we're looking at. It was a clever defense. I don't think it's going to work Christine.

ROMANS: You know, when you see the pictures of this kid, you know, thin, crying in the courtroom. And then you hear about the crime, you have to wonder what the jury is going through. I mean, looking at the -- who they're seeing in front of them, and then -- how much of a disconnect is there between this young, thin, shy looking, kind of meek looking child and the pictures I'm sure in the details they're hearing -- Avery.

FRIEDMAN: I think if I'm defending, and that's actually what Richard does, to me, I'm going to look at that individual and focus about his purported vulnerability. He's small. He's crying. He did it when he was 12-years-old. He didn't know what he was doing. He was affected by the drugs. These are powerful arguments. I just don't think it's going to work.

ROMANS: Let's move on -- move over here to another tearful defendant, and this is Lynne Stewart. This is the terror trial in New York City. Really interesting, Richard, what you think about this. She is still maintaining her innocence. She says she was not helping terrorists in a terrorist network, she was just defending her client. Does she have room to keep going on this, or is this woman going to jail?

HERMAN: Hey Christine, she's definitely going to jail. She's facing 20 years here. And frankly, she got what she deserved. She didn't have to represent this client and she chose to. And by representing this client, she was under the guidance of what's called a special administrative measure. I have the document that she signed and agreed to be bound by in representing this client. And that expressly forbid her from transferring any information about this client to anyone. And when she stands up with a known terrorist as a client, this guy blew up the World Trade Center. He was attempting to blow up the Lincoln Tunnel and George Washington Bridge. He's an Egyptian terrorist. And when she stands up and makes a statement that the cease-fire is canceled, and she doesn't only do it once, she says it twice for his followers. I mean, that is two times, two violations of this. That's 10 years right there.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

HERMAN: In addition, in addition, while she's visiting in the can there, he's under special security. She's not allowed to -- allow him to speak to anybody. He's in isolated protection. While the co- conspirator is sitting with him engaging in a conversation in their own language, she's deflecting that with the correctional officials by making up gibberish conversation. Look, she lost it.

ROMANS: Do you agree my friend?

FRIEDMAN: Actually, Richard got it right. The fact is, she signed the SAM. The regular -- you got it right. I was expecting a defense argument here. I'm not sure what it is. They argue breach of lawyer/client privilege, right to counsel. Let me tell you something, these facts are powerful. Richard nailed it. And the fact is, it should be mandatory 45, now that the sentencing guidelines are unconstitutional, Judge John Coddle (ph), the federal district judge have discretion. But you know what, she's got one of the best lawyers in America, Michael Tiger (ph). It's heading to the Court of Appeals.

ROMANS: All right, Gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us today. Avery Friedman, also Richard Herman. Thanks a lot, guys.

HERMAN: Good afternoon. Take Care.

FRIEDMAN: Nice to see you. Take care.

ROMANS: You, too.

One time defender of Michael Jackson now prepares to testify against him in the popstars child molestation trial. Actor Corey Feldman became friends with Jackson as a teen star in the 1980s. Now, he'll testify about what he calls Jackson's inappropriate behavior. Feldman was interviewed on ABC's "20/20."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARTIN BASHIR, ABC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Why does it disturb you now?

COREY FELDMAN, ACTOR: Because when I look at the pieces of evidence, and I see that one of the pieces of evidence is Michael Jackson looking at pornographic material with a child, and the child is 13 or 14-years-old, and the fact that I witnessed that exact occurrence in my own life, at the same age, has to give me reason to pause and say, if this happened with me, and the kid's saying it happened with him, then this can't be all made up. And it can't all be lies. Because at least that one little thing right there I know is completely accurate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Feldman was subpoenaed by prosecutors to testify in the trial.

He's the first Indian American in Congress in 40 years. Up next on the "Novak Zone" Bobby Jindal talks about the pressures and opportunities the election brings.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: A freshman with a future. Congressman Bobby Jindal of Louisiana may be new to elected office, but he's no stranger to Washington.

He joins CNN's Robert Novak in this week's edition of the "Novak Zone."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERT NOVAK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to the "Novak Zone." We're at the Longworth House Office Building on Capitol Hill in Washington, D.C., talking to one of the newly elected members of the House of representatives, Congressman Bobby Jindal, republican of Kenner, Louisiana.

Congressman Jindal, you were just elected president of your freshman Republican class coming in only 33-years-old. This is your first elective office.

Do you have a seat at the leadership table as a president of the freshman class?

REP. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: Absolutely. One of the things I promised the voters in Kenner, Louisiana was that I would make a greater impact than the average freshman Congressman. Now, I'm new to elected politics, but I've been in D.C. before. I was assistant secretary in the Bush administration. This president's first administration. I also worked as the executive director of the Medicare Commission. So I've worked with many of the chairman, many of the members of leadership, including Chairman Thomas and many others. So absolutely, this position as president of the freshman class gives me an opportunity to be heard, also to give my input in terms of participating with leadership.

NOVAK: Congressman, you also have been named a deputy whip. Does that mean that if there is a choice, a conflict between what you think your constituents down in Louisiana might want and what President Bush wants, you have to go with the leadership, since your part of the leadership now?

JINDAL: Absolutely not. I mean, obviously, there's a greater responsibility as being of that leadership. But as our leaders always tell us, they never expect us to vote against our consciences, never expect us to vote against our districts. What it does mean is, I get an opportunity to participate every week with leadership, and learning about and helping to set that agenda. I've got a responsibility to communicate with my colleagues. And I think it is expected I'm not going to vote against my leadership on procedural votes. I'm not going to give control of the House floor to the other side, but absolutely not. On the issues, I've taken specific positions, back in my district and throughout my career. And I think leadership would expect me to vote consistently with that position.

NOVAK: On the night of the State of the Union Address, you played a little role in marking the great election in Iraq. Tell us about that.

JINDAL: You know, there was a great editorial cartoon in my hometown paper, the "New Orleans Time-Picayune" where it said, the voters of Iraq have given the insurgents the finger. And it showed a picture of them holding up their purple-stained fingers. And I thought, wouldn't it be a neat gesture if we, the members of the Congress, also stained our fingers in a show of solidarity. I think no matter how people voted for the war or against the war, no matter whether they're Democrats or Republicans, we can all be excited that the Iraqi voters braved so much to vote. We can be excited that democracy and freedom is being spread there. One of the most amazing moments -- not only when the mother of the fallen soldier hugged the Iraqi women, but also when the Iraqi voter stood up and waved their finger to me and -- to the entire House, not to me. But she was so excited to see all these people waving back at her purple-stained fingers. It was just a bipartisan...

NOVAK: You supplied the ink, though?

JINDAL: We did. We had purple ink. It was not permanent ink. We did have purple ink. It was a light-hearted, but a very important moment.

NOVAK: Congressman, you were -- as you mentioned you were assistant secretary in the HHS Department.

How is it different being an elected representative and being a presidential appointee?

JINDAL: You know, what's motivating me is I wanted to make an impact. I want to come here to make a difference. Certainly, when you're an assistant secretary, you get to be in the room with the chairman and other senior members, and you get to participate in that negotiating process. But it's very different being an elected member, even a freshman member, even a junior member of Congress, and that you are treated differently. As somebody who has a vote, it's a different way to make an impact. It's a different way to offer amendments. It's a different way to actually be in the room and say, what if we did this. So, you know, you even get treated differently by your fellow colleagues, by members that I worked with in the administration. Once you're an elected official, even they'll treat you differently because now you're one of them.

NOVAK: Mr. Jindal, you have two small children back in Louisiana and you're commuting every weekend to see them. When I came here almost half a century ago, a Congressman like you would move his whole family to Washington. Did you ever consider doing that, and isn't it a strain?

That's a sizable commute from Louisiana to Washington, D.C.

JINDAL: Well, I've got two beautiful children. The burden falls unfortunately especially heavy on my wife. But no, we never thought about moving the family here, for a couple of reasons. You know, I was jokingly telling you this before, my mother-in-law made it very clear, you can go where you want, but the grandchildren stay here. And we've got parents, and in-laws, and cousins, and aunts, and uncles and in-laws all living in Louisiana. So, it's -- Actually, it's better for us. We want our kids to grow up around their family.

And secondly, I think it's a good thing for members of Congress to have their kids in schools back in their district. I think it's a good thing for members of Congress to be rushing home ever week. I think it's a good thing for members of Congress got to be stuck in traffic. Have to go buy their groceries at home. I think it makes them more sympathetic and better able to understand the concerns of their constituents.

NOVAK: The point I hear from a lot of Congressmen is -- today, is that they spent all their time raising money for their campaigns, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) campaigns. Is that true?

JINDAL: Well, you know, look, that's a part of the political process. I think, the fact is that we take very public positions. We take specific votes. There are people that support that, and will want to help by volunteering, by donating. By working to get you reelected. And there are people who oppose you based on those votes. That's a part of a Democratic process.

NOVAK: Mr. Jindal, it's been well over 40 years since there was an Indian American in Congress. I remember old Judge Saund, Democrat from California. But he left Congress in 1963. Is your election an inspiration to other Indian Americans around the country?

JINDAL: It may very well be. I think, it's a great example of why this is the greatest country in the world. It's not just Indian Americans. It's not just other immigrants. It's not just other children of parents who were the first in their families to go to high school. I think my election shows that through hard work and through education, this country really offers unlimited opportunities. And I've said over and over, one of the reasons, the main reasons I ran for office was to make sure that the American dream continues to be possible for my children.

NOVAK: And now the big question for Congressman Bobby Jindal. Congressman, what is the one goal that you have set for yourself in your first term as a member of the House of Representatives?

JINDAL: My background in particular is in health care. The most important thing I would like to see us do is to continue moving toward, or maybe more quickly towards a private run health care system. I think we're better served when the government is not making decisions. The government, bureaucrats are not deciding for us how we get our health care, but rather we empower patients to work with their doctors.

NOVAK: Bobby Jindal, thank you very much.

JINDAL: Thank you.

NOVAK: And thank you for being in the "Novak Zone."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: You can see more of Bob Novak tonight on the "CAPITAL GANG" at 7:00 p.m. Eastern. The gangs guest tonight is Senator Kent Conrad of North Dakota.

It looks like Halloween in February. Up next, the story behind Central Park's 23 miles of brand-new bright orange garb.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: Don't ask what it means, it just is. A (UNINTELLIGIBLE) river running through New York Central Park. A grand art exhibit, courtesy, Christo and Jeanne-Claude. Seventy five hundred gates, lined 23 miles of foot paths through Central Park. The artists used more than 1 million square feet of fabric to set their work in motion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New York City seems to be the capital of hubris and greed and treachery, and here this is a work of art, for no other reason. No one's making a profit on it. And they're doing it strictly for the sake of art. It's different. But that's what art is all about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Only in New York. The free art exhibit is expected to remain in place for 16 days.

There's much more ahead on CNN SATURDAY. At the top of the hour, it's "NEXT@CNN." At 4:00 CNN LIVE SATURDAY looks at one military family relying on pen and paper to lessen the distance between home and battlefield.

At 5:00 "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" looks at Grammy Award nominee's L.L. Cool J. and Shania Twain.

But first Daniel Sieberg with a preview of "NEXT@CNN."

DANIEL SIEBERG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Ahead on "NEXT@CNN" for an inside look at the government lab where fake documents are detected and it's role on the war on terrorism. Also, we show how easy it is to find out sensitive information about other people over the Internet. And how easy it is for other people to do the same as you. Those stories and lot more coming up, right after a check of the headlines from the CNN newsroom. TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired February 12, 2005 - 14:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: It is 2 p.m. on the East Coast, 11 a.m. in the West. Good afternoon, I'm Christine Romans at CNN's global headquarters in Atlanta, in for Fredricka Whitfield.
Ahead this hour from North Korea to Iran to Iraq, the players in President Bush's axis of evil are making news. We'll talk about the threats and the possible strategies.

Plus...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD DEAN, CHAIRMAN, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CMTE.: I'm very thankful and grateful. I'm humbled. And I'm ready to go to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: No wild outbursts with this victory. A serious and subdued Howard Dean takes the helm of the Democratic Party. Is he ready for the task ahead of him?

And this man's a House freshman with a bright future and a past that sets him apart. Louisiana Congressman Bobby Jindal spotlights today's "Novak Zone."

Those stories in a moment, but first a look at the headlines "Now in the News".

Stories in the news right now, at least 17 people are dead after a car bomb blew up outside the main hospital in a Shiite city south of Baghdad. More than two dozen others are wounded. Among the dead, six security guards. The area is the scene of frequent attacks by Sunni insurgents.

The leaders of Israel and the Palestinians say they're taking action today to give life to promises of a cease-fire. Mahmoud Abbas is trying to slow down or stop militant attacks, and Israel says it is allowing dozens of expelled Palestinians to return to their homes in the West Bank.

Vatican officials are expressing optimism about Pope John Paul's health saying he's able to continue working. They're even talking about traveling in August to the World Youth Day in Germany. The pope is out of the hospital after recovering from serious breathing problems and the flu. Rescue workers are still searching for victims from this week's deadly dam break in southwestern Pakistan. At least six villages were wiped out by the flood waters, killing at least 145 people, with dozens more missing. In northern Pakistan, at least 80 people have been killed in a series of avalanches the past two days.

Nuclear troubles for President Bush. North Korea announced last week it's walking away from six-party negotiations over its nuclear program. For the latest from the Bush administration, we go to CNN White Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.

Hi, Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Christine.

As a matter of fact, the White House and its allies are involved in tense discussions over what to do next. Now, if North Korea decides it's not going to abandon its nuclear weapons program, should the United States abandon those six-party talks while U.S. officials are considering a number of options.

That is exactly what they're talking about. One of them is to suggest to treat North Korea like Iran. That would be meaning to refer North Korea to the U.N. Security Council for possible economic sanctions. The problem with that approach, they believe, however, is that Russia and China would not likely sign on.

Another possible option is to toughen the efforts to block North Korea from transferring nuclear technology to so-called terrorist states. The U.S. has proof that North Korea has sold nuclear components to Libya in the past and even perhaps Iran as well. The U.S. would put on more pressure on North Korea's neighbors, particularly China, to take a look, to monitor their borders, North Korean flights and shipments.

And then, finally, of course, U.S. officials say the most immediate short-term strategy is to put as much pressure as possible on the members of the six-party talks, Russia, China, Japan, and South Korea, should try to get them to be much tougher on North Korea, to try to get them to come back to the negotiating table.

All of that, of course, in the context of a flurry of diplomatic efforts that being made. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice will be meeting with her counterparts, her Chinese as well as her South Korean counterparts. One of those, as a matter of fact, South Korea's foreign minister who held consultations with Vice President Dick Cheney just here yesterday at the White House.

And of course, we're also told as well there are going to be Chinese officials, a delegation that will be traveling to North Korea sometime in the weeks to come, to try again to push them back to the negotiating table. Christine?

ROMANS: Indeed, leadership from that region so important, because North Korea nukes very important for North Korea's neighbors as well, not just the United States.

MALVEAUX: Well, absolutely. They pose more of a threat to the neighbors, to those in the region. And also, there's such an important economic relationship between North Korea and China. As you know, North Korea depends on China much for its trade, for its energy, even for food for its people. So the real hope here is that China will be able to twist the arm a little bit more, of North Korea, to get them to come back to the negotiating table. They believe that this is a lot of brinksmanship, bargaining before they go back to the negotiations.

ROMANS: All right. Suzanne Malveaux at the White House. Thank you, Suzanne.

North Korea is only part of the problem for President Bush. Iran is also pursuing its own nuclear problem. Something Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld addressed today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD RUMSFELD, U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: The hope is that the -- whether the Europeans or the IAEA could proceed on the diplomatic path and to find a way to persuade Iran that their seeming path towards the development of a nuclear weapon is not something that would contribute to stability in the world.

And that there is not much daylight as between the approaches of the United States and the Europeans. I think there's very broad agreement that it is not in the interests of the world that there be a nuclear program in Iran.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Last week U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said the U.S. has no plans to attack Iran at this time.

But with the U.S. taking a firm stand on Iran's nuclear program, some wonder if all the Bush administration rhetoric is a case of deja vu. CNN's David Ensor has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID ENSOR, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice over): As the CIA's man in Iraq, David Kay could not find any weapons of mass destruction, though U.S. Intelligence said they were there. Now he worries about history repeating itself.

Looking at Iran, after Iraq, is a particularly vexing problem. Because we now know how wrong we got it, in the case of Iraq. It was not a marginal difference.

ENSOR: In Iran's case, the first revelation about the then- secret weapons related facilities in Natan and Iraq came from Iranian dissident emigres, who continue to offer additional tidbits almost weekly. That reminds Kay of some not so reliable information from the Iraqi associates, then emigre leader Ahmed Chalabi, before the Iraq war. KAY: My suspicion we're going to find out in Iran, just like in Iraq, we had no human operatives on the ground and that our best source of information were people who defected and had other agendas.

ENSOR: Back in the fall of 2002, Bush administration rhetoric about Iraq was ramping up.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We cannot wait for the final proof, the smoking gun that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud.

ENSOR: Fast forward to 2005, and the rhetoric is about Iran; warnings to Tehran to give up its nuclear programs or face uncertain consequences. On January 20th, Inauguration Day, Vice President Cheney told an interviewer, that quote, "The Israelis might well decide to act first and let the rest of the world worry about cleaning up the diplomatic mess afterwards."

(On camera): What did you think when Vice President Cheney warned that the Israelis might attack Iran?

KAY: I actually don't think it was an effective threat.

ENSOR (voice over): Mot effective, argues Kay, because times have changed since 1981, when the Israeli jets knocked out the Iraqi nuclear program with just one raid.

KAY: I think the Iranians know what the Israelis did. And that's why they've scattered their program and made it very difficult to locate.

ENSOR: Kay says the administration is making a mistake, not to sit down with the Iranians and offer them security guarantees from a super power that they cannot get in their ongoing discussions with European diplomats about giving up their nuclear programs.

(On camera): But administration officials privately say they have doubts that a deal could be done with, and then honored by Tehran. Officials tell CNN a methodical review of U.S. intelligence on Iran's nuclear facilities is under way. And the administration is in no mood to soften its warnings to Tehran -- David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: Two weeks after Iraqis went to the polls in landmark elections, we're about to find out the results. Officials in Baghdad say they will announce final vote tallies tomorrow. And by midweek, pending any disputes that might arise, the official numbers will be announced.

Meanwhile, there's no letup this weekend in the violence in Iraq. In the worst attack, 17 people lost their lives when a car bomb exploded at a police checkpoint south of Baghdad. Insurgents also launched bloody attacks in northern and southern Iraq. CNN's Nic Robertson reports from the Iraqi capital. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The blast occurred about 10:00 a.m. in the morning. Police say a suicide bomber drove a car full of explosives up to the gates of Al Musaib (ph) General Hospital about 70 kilometers, 45 miles south of Baghdad, detonated the explosives, injuring 26 people and killing 17 others. They say among the 17 dead were six security guards working at the gates of the hospital.

In the north of Iraq, in the city of Mosul, police say they have found the bodies of six Iraqi national guardsmen. They say the guardsmen had been shot in the head and the chest. Eyewitnesses say a note pinned to the -- to one of the dead Iraqi national guardsmen read, this is an Iraqi national guardsman who took part in the offensive on Falluja. An apparent reference to the combined U.S. and Iraqi offensive on the city of Falluja in November last year.

And in the south of Iraq, police say that a judge was killed. This judge had been a former senior judge in the town of Basra, under Saddam Hussein's regime. He had returned recently to be a lower court judge in Basra. Police say as he was arriving to work this morning, two gunmen on a motorcycle pulled alongside his vehicle, shot at the vehicle killing him, and wounding his two bodyguards.

One of the bodyguards is believed to be in critical condition. The other, according to police, is in a coma -- Nic Robertson, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: Howard Dean is now dean of the Democrats. But is he the right man for the job? We'll talk about what lies ahead for the former Vermont governor.

Also ahead, did a prescription drug make this boy commit murder? And if it did, who should be punished? That is on the docket in today's legal round table.

Plus, from a newcomer who raps about religion to some old-time favorites, we'll head to L.A. for a look at this year's Grammy contenders.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: Well, he's the news face of the Democratic Party. Earlier today, Howard Dean, former Vermont governor, and sometimes- controversial Democratic candidate, was chosen Democratic national party chairman.

Dean told party leaders that if Democrats want to win nationally, they have to win locally. It is the heart of his plan to help Democrats recover from last November party losses. Joining us from Washington is CNN Political Analyst Ron Brownstein.

Ron, so, Dean is the man. You know, it's a big turn-around for him. Just a year ago, they were talking about the Dean scream, and now he's going to be the authority of the party.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: He's back. You know, figuratively, the last time most Americans saw Howard Dean, he was being led off the stage in Iowa with a hook after his eruption following his loss in the caucus.

But you know what, Christine, he organized very well for this job. You know, one thing that Howard Dean has always had is a grassroots organization. He put it to work in contacting the DNC members. He had an audience that was sympathetic. The 447 DNC members, Democratic National Committee members, who decided this are more liberal than the party overall, more liberal certainly than the country overall. So they were receptive to him.

And third, he sort of fits in with the tenor of the times. If you look at what's been going on with the Democrats since the election, for better or worse, they have chosen a strategy of confrontation with President Bush. The large vote against Condoleezza Rice, the large vote against Alberto Gonzalez. Howard Dean sort of reflects that sentiment within the party. Many of the people introducing him this morning, emphasized one word, he's a fighter. That's what Democrats seem to want right now.

ROMANS: Yet, he has said that the way to take on the Republican Party is not by showing everyone how terrible the Republicans are. He said the Republicans, they're the party of the past. The Democrats have to prove to people that they're the party of the future. Can he do that?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, I think there's a lot of ambivalence about Howard Dean in this role among Democrats. Publicly, he dominated this race. In the end, none of the other candidates, announced candidates even stood on the ballot against him. They all dropped out because he had such overwhelming support.

Privately, it was a different story. A lot of elected officials are uncertain whether he's the right guy for this job. Partially because he was defined as a liberal in the presidential race, but more temperamentally, I mean, he was someone who said a lot of things as a candidate that he eventually had to take back. The capture of Saddam did not make us safer. Osama bin Laden deserves the presumption of innocence.

There's a question about whether temperamentally that he's suited for a job that is ultimately is subordinate to the elected officials. The jury's out on whether he can play in that role.

ROMANS: So Dean's got a few years to start putting together his stable for the next presidential election. Let's talk about the wagering for 2008. Let's start with the Democrats. We've got a poll here shows how it's been playing out. It looks like the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll, Hillary Clinton, 40 percent, John Kerry 25 percent, 17 percent for John Edwards, and someone else, we don't know who it is yet, 6 percent. Democrats choice in '08, what do you think?

BROWNSTEIN: TBD (ph), well, usually when you're polling this far out, it's mostly a reflection of name identification; who's the best known? John Kerry and John Edwards were on the ticket. Obviously they're well known. Hillary Clinton is well known, too, because of -- as being the former first lady. In this case it is probably a pretty accurate reflection. If Hillary Clinton runs, like George Bush in 2000, she will be an overwhelming favorite. And the competition will be who will be the anti-Hillary. Who will be the other choice? And that's what the race would be, if she decides to run.

That's when you look at the GDP's choice when you look at the CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup Poll. Rudy Giuliani tops John McCain. Everyone in New York where I live was so just raring to go for that Senate battle between Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani. Maybe they'll get a chance at it in '08?

BROWNSTEIN: Could it be Stephen Douglas and Abraham Lincoln in 1860? Running against each other for president after running for Senate. Look, Rudy Giuliani and John McCain, also in the same way, this far out have the highest, best name identification. John McCain ran last time. Rudy Giuliani imprinted into the country's consciousness post-9/11.

Both would face serious hurdles, though, in practice, on social issues in particular, they might run into -- especially Giuliani, who is pro-choice, pro-gun control and pro-gay rights. He'd face a lot of resistance in practice from social conservatives, who are not the single biggest constituency in the Republican primary electorate.

I think it's not really clear what the top tier of the Republican race is going to be in 2008. Giuliani, McCain are likely to be ahead in the polls. Mitt Romney could be a formidable contender, Bill First was on that list. But I think it's going to take a lot more time to sort out than the Democratic race if Hillary runs.

ROMANS: You talk about moving to the middle Hillary Clinton, earlier this week, talking about abstinence education, talking about some issues that some Republicans -- some on the right were saying, oh, she's trying to steer further into the middle. She's trying to become, or at least appear less liberal. Although her supporters say she's always believed in these sort of things.

BROWNSTEIN: She would seem to have a good model for that in her husband, Bill Clinton. Who really, in 1992 and 1996, significantly changed the ideological profile of the Democratic Party in everything from the death penalty to welfare reform to balancing the budget. If you look at what Hillary Clinton is doing, it's clear she's trying to define herself in a more centrist manner, not only on abortion but immigration, defense issues as well.

The question will be whether she can change the perception people have on her based on issues on whether it's a deeper, personalized assessment of her that's going to be very difficult to dislodge by, you know, enunciating a different view.

ROMANS: Yes, it is definitely the flipside of her name recognition.

BROWNSTEIN: Absolutely.

ROMANS: All right. Ron Brownstein, thank you so much for joining us, Ron.

BROWNSTEIN: See you in New Hampshire.

ROMANS: All right. I'll get my hotel reservations right now.

BROWNSTEIN: OK.

ROMANS: Thanks, Ron.

Howard Dean hasn't been the only one looking for the nod this month. Up next, a preview of just who might get the big yeah as the countdown to the Grammies continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: In other news across America in Los Angeles, a dramatic rescue of a 13-year-old boy. He was nearly swept down the Los Angeles River and into the Pacific Ocean. A firefighter strapped him into a harness and lifted him to safety.

In Manchester, New Hampshire some 70 New Hampshire Army National Guard troops are back from Iraq where they were greeted by signs reading, Welcome Home, Daddy. The troops were based in southeastern Iraq for nearly a year. Undertaking a number of humanitarian missions every soldier in this unit returned home safe and sound.

And the mailman won't be delivering to the NBA anymore. Karl Malone is expected to officially retire on Sunday. Malone is the league's second all-time leading scorer, but never won a championship in his 19-year career.

Get ready for the Grammies, the music industry's biggest night. What's in it for the fans tomorrow night? Let's go to CNN Pop Culture Correspondent Toure who is live in Los Angeles.

Now, if you win a Grammy, you get the little statue, you get the prestige. But winning a Grammy, also, I mean, it can be a bump in your record sales, too. These artists want one of these things.

TOURE: You know, you do get a little bump in sales like Nora Jones two years ago. This is the dog and pony show, where they introduce you to everybody you may not have heard of.

This is not a life-changing award. Like you win an Oscar and your name becomes academy award winner da-da-da-da-da. This is not so with the Grammys. Of course, Marisa Tomei would beg to differ, Christine. But this is a lesser award than winning an Academy Award.

ROMANS: Talk to me the difference between record of the year and song of the year.

TOURE: Excellent question. People want to ask this all the time. Record of the year goes to artists and producers. Song of the year goes to songwriters. Record of the year is about the performance of the song. Song of the year is about what's written out on paper.

So a song like, "Yeah" that Usher made, you couldn't cover it. You couldn't notate it even. It's about what the two of them did in the studios with the sounds and the spaces.

Song of the year, say perhaps like Alisha Keys, "If I Ain't Got You," is a beautiful piece of -- it is beautiful on paper, and somebody else could come along and cover it and make it better or worse, or what have you, Christine.

ROMANS: We've heard about the Internet hurting the record business. A lot of buzz about this when you're talking about Grammys, when you're talking about some of the celebrities and musicians. This still a problem for the industry?

TOURE: Well, downloading a little bit less of a problem than it was two or three years ago. But the issue's actually shifted a little bit. Because now we have all the audio blogs. You have heard a lot about blogs, now there's audio blogs, where people will post songs, a lot of times a new song, a new R. Kelly song. There are a couple of new Beck songs on the audio blogs now. You can go on there and download songs. Now, this is illegal downloading, yes. But the record business is looking the other way, so far, because this is a great way for viral marketing, and putting new songs in the iPods of early adopters.

ROMANS: All right. Toure, last question, most important what are your picks? What do you think? Anything jump out at you, you think is a sure bet?

TOURE: You know, I really don't know. I mean, if there's justice, Kanye will win. He's got the best album of the group. It is a fantastic record. I've been listening to it all year long.

But, you know, Ray Charles, we all know what happened when somebody recently deceased is involved in an award show like this. And so it could be Ray Charles. But then, you know, all these R&B and hip- hop people could divide their vote, right? And Green Day could step up and win with the rock 'n roll constituency. It's a truly suspenseful Grammys for once.

ROMANS: Oh, the drama. Toure, thank you so much. Talk to you soon.

TOURE: Thank you.

ROMANS: He put his own stamp on this year's State of the Union. We'll meet the man who organized the ink-stained fingers, ahead in this week's "Novak Zone".

But first, one day later, more answers, still more questions in the case of an unwanted baby boy in Florida. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

Checking stories "Now in the News": Deadly attacks continue across Iraq. In the bloodiest incident, a suicide car bomber killed at least 17 people in a town south of Baghdad. More than two dozen others were hurt. The attack was at a police checkpoint near a hospital.

In Washington, a warning from President Bush as he presses Congress to overhaul Social Security. In his weekly radio address, President Bush predicts a rash of tax hikes or cuts in benefits if Congress decides not to pass his reform plan. Among other things the Bush plan calls for partially privatizing Social.

He failed in his bid for the presidency, but he will play a major role in the next battle for the white house. As expected, Howard Dean was elected chairman of the Democratic National Committee earlier today. Among other things, Dean vows to go on the offensive against Republicans and better explain the Democratic Party's position on issues.

The story of a baby tossed from a moving car caught the nation's attention. A good samaritan stopped to help and rushed the baby boy to a hospital. An inspirational tale, but it never happened. The good samaritan was really the baby's mother. She concocted the whole story. Police say Patricia Pokriot hid her pregnancy and did not want that child. This afternoon she's being held for psychiatric evaluation. Pokriot has not been charged.

Patricia Pokriot had a 10-year-old son who is also now in the state's care. The boy's father was denied custody due to a previous child abuse charge.

Brian Andrews of CNN Miami Affiliate WFOR has details.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN ANDREWS, WFOR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Scott Hargreaves was actually at the courthouse with his fiance to get married and ended up in a special hearing for the custody of his son. He's the father of Patricia Ann Pokriots' 10-year-old son Scottie. The state, though, won't give him custody, because, they say, he has an outstanding child abuse charge.

QUESTION: Have you see him recently?

SCOTT HARGREAVES: Two weeks ago.

QUESTION: Have you seen her recently?

HARGREAVES: Two weeks ago.

QUESTION: Did she look pregnant?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: She didn't look pregnant at all?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: Did she ever say anything to you at all about being pregnant?

HARGREAVES: No.

QUESTION: And your definite it's not your child?

HARGREAVES: Definitely not. Absolutely not, no.

ANDREWS: The state seeking custody of Scottie and baby Johnny now that their mother has been institutionalized. Patricia Ann's mother also attended the hearing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's got a microphone in my face.

QUESTION: I know. Do you think she's going to be OK, though?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Put it away.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, then turn it off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Then turn it off.

QUESTION: Do you think that she's going to be OK?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I hope so.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: That report from Brian Andrews of our Miami affiliate WFOR.

There's a safe haven law in Florida to protect parents of abandoned newborns, but these parents have to follow the law to get protection. The newborn must be approximately three days old or younger. He or she must be left at a fire station or emergency medical station with full time firefighters paramedics or emergency medical technician. The newborn may also be left at a hospital. In exchange for leaving the child at those locations, a parent is allowed to remain anonymous and will generally avoid being the target of a criminal investigation unless the newborn is abused or neglected.

Police say a woman who's nine months pregnant fought off and killed a female attacker who was armed with a knife. Now authorities are investigating whether the attack was an attempt to steal the fetus. The incident happened in suburban Cincinnati -- Thursday, rather. Police say Sarah Brady acted in self-defense and she won't be charged. Brady wasn't hurt in the attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SGT. TOM LOOS, FORT MICHELL POLICE: I spoke to about 15 family members who told me that, although her delivery date kept moving forward, that her latest delivery date was supposed to be yesterday or today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Both women had registered for gifts at the same baby store. Investigators are looking into whether the attacker used the registry to contact Brady.

A South Carolina murder trial will soon go to jury. But will that jury decide the guilt of a boy or the guilt of a prescription drug? We'll pose that question to our legal eagles.

And later on, a massive display of public art is unveiled today in Central Park. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: In our legal briefs, closing arguments are set for Monday in a South Carolina courtroom. A teen on trial accused of fatally shooting his grandparents, blames the drug Zoloft for his actions. Now, new FDA findings on the drug could put a twist in the trial.

To discuss this case and others, New York criminal defense attorney Richard Herman joins us.

RICHARD HERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good afternoon.

ROMANS: And in Cleveland, civil rights attorney and law professor Avery Friedman. Gentlemen, thank you.

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Hi, Christine. Nice to see you.

ROMANS: Let's start with the Zoloft trial. Because this is interesting. Some say it's Zoloft on trial, and others say this is a kid on trial for shotgunning his parents -- his grandparents to death, rather.

Richard, let's start with you. If you were defending this kid, would you bring up the Zoloft? would You be trying to say that this drug made this kid do it?

HERMAN: Christine, the defense is screaming that Zoloft is on trial here, I mean. This is such a horrific crime. And the preconceived ideas of the jurors coming in, a young man shooting both his grandparents in bed while they slept, that's horrible. But this Zoloft drug has created an issue here. And there's been conflicting testimony and battle of experts as to the impact of this drug on pediatric patients, especially in the dosages that this young man was taking. And it's a dream for defense attorney in a case like this, to have this issue, raise it for the jury and you just never know this case may fall on this. Some one or two jurors may go ahead and say this drug has caused it.

FRIEDMAN: No.

ROMANS: You know, Avery, the thing about this that is interesting, is this kid after the fact, you know, according to the details of this trial, came up with a very well thought-out alibi of the black guy who came in and committed the crime. And the police were out looking for this other person. Does that show maybe trying to -- an alibi, does that show someone who is a criminal, who's not just a sick kid?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, this is the second time in South Carolina that somebody white kills members of their family, and they blame it on a black guy. The evidence in this case, the way it came out is that, two weeks after he murdered his grandparents, he was bragging about the fact that they deserved it.

And then the defense put on a primary witness, a psychiatrist who hadn't practiced for years, Dr. Kapit (ph), and he said basically I examined him three years after the crime. Well, Dr. Kapit went kaput. And I think this jury is going to look at the evidence and say, you know what, I understand the -- we understand the Zoloft problems, but the evidence is so clear, Christine, that he knew what he was doing. And I'm predicting at 90 minutes of arguments on Monday and deliberations, Mr. Pittman is looking for conviction.

HERMAN: Really going out on a limb there, Avery. Very good, that's great.

ROMANS: Let's talk about the FDA saying that, you know, now putting out some tighter warnings on this particular drug, much after the fact. Does it have any kind of influence on the jury? Does it have any place in the courtroom now that the FDA seems to are more concerned about this drug, in particular for children, for minors?

HERMAN: I think the evidence is already before them. And I don't think that's even going to come into evidence in this case. And they're just trying to...

FRIEDMAN: Actually, you did. Richard, it actually did come into evidence.

HERMAN: OK, well...

FRIEDMAN: There was some evidence introduced on the FDA's switch in position. I, frankly, think, and you may disagree with me, I think it's going to have very little effect, because this young man had a motive. He burned the house. He bragged about it. And while Zoloft, I mean, there are issues about it, based on this case, on the evidence, it's going to be really difficult for the defense to convince the jury to acquit here.

ROMANS: A lot of people take antidepressants and they don't kill somebody. But the problem is, which came first, obviously the child was troubled. That's why he was on the depressant in the first place. How do you prove that? HERMAN: This was a pediatric patient. This was not an adult patient. These drugs are not, as I'm told prescribed for pediatric patients. And if they are, they're supposed to be under strict medical supervision.

FRIEDMAN: I agree.

HERMAN: And it's my understanding he was not under that supervision. That he had doubled and tripled the dosages. As a defense attorney, this is what you have to grab on to. It's a very, very difficult case.

FRIEDMAN: Right.

HERMAN: You may raise an issue.

ROMANS: Are we going to see more cases of people blaming crimes or events on the drug they were taking? Because let's be honest, more and more Americans are taking prescription drugs.

FRIEDMAN: We've seen it forever. We've seen it forever. I mean, I think the defense has to go with what they have. Even though FDA has changed its position in this case, the fact is, that there was so much evidence that this is really a bad guy, and that's really what we're looking at. It was a clever defense. I don't think it's going to work Christine.

ROMANS: You know, when you see the pictures of this kid, you know, thin, crying in the courtroom. And then you hear about the crime, you have to wonder what the jury is going through. I mean, looking at the -- who they're seeing in front of them, and then -- how much of a disconnect is there between this young, thin, shy looking, kind of meek looking child and the pictures I'm sure in the details they're hearing -- Avery.

FRIEDMAN: I think if I'm defending, and that's actually what Richard does, to me, I'm going to look at that individual and focus about his purported vulnerability. He's small. He's crying. He did it when he was 12-years-old. He didn't know what he was doing. He was affected by the drugs. These are powerful arguments. I just don't think it's going to work.

ROMANS: Let's move on -- move over here to another tearful defendant, and this is Lynne Stewart. This is the terror trial in New York City. Really interesting, Richard, what you think about this. She is still maintaining her innocence. She says she was not helping terrorists in a terrorist network, she was just defending her client. Does she have room to keep going on this, or is this woman going to jail?

HERMAN: Hey Christine, she's definitely going to jail. She's facing 20 years here. And frankly, she got what she deserved. She didn't have to represent this client and she chose to. And by representing this client, she was under the guidance of what's called a special administrative measure. I have the document that she signed and agreed to be bound by in representing this client. And that expressly forbid her from transferring any information about this client to anyone. And when she stands up with a known terrorist as a client, this guy blew up the World Trade Center. He was attempting to blow up the Lincoln Tunnel and George Washington Bridge. He's an Egyptian terrorist. And when she stands up and makes a statement that the cease-fire is canceled, and she doesn't only do it once, she says it twice for his followers. I mean, that is two times, two violations of this. That's 10 years right there.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

HERMAN: In addition, in addition, while she's visiting in the can there, he's under special security. She's not allowed to -- allow him to speak to anybody. He's in isolated protection. While the co- conspirator is sitting with him engaging in a conversation in their own language, she's deflecting that with the correctional officials by making up gibberish conversation. Look, she lost it.

ROMANS: Do you agree my friend?

FRIEDMAN: Actually, Richard got it right. The fact is, she signed the SAM. The regular -- you got it right. I was expecting a defense argument here. I'm not sure what it is. They argue breach of lawyer/client privilege, right to counsel. Let me tell you something, these facts are powerful. Richard nailed it. And the fact is, it should be mandatory 45, now that the sentencing guidelines are unconstitutional, Judge John Coddle (ph), the federal district judge have discretion. But you know what, she's got one of the best lawyers in America, Michael Tiger (ph). It's heading to the Court of Appeals.

ROMANS: All right, Gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us today. Avery Friedman, also Richard Herman. Thanks a lot, guys.

HERMAN: Good afternoon. Take Care.

FRIEDMAN: Nice to see you. Take care.

ROMANS: You, too.

One time defender of Michael Jackson now prepares to testify against him in the popstars child molestation trial. Actor Corey Feldman became friends with Jackson as a teen star in the 1980s. Now, he'll testify about what he calls Jackson's inappropriate behavior. Feldman was interviewed on ABC's "20/20."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARTIN BASHIR, ABC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Why does it disturb you now?

COREY FELDMAN, ACTOR: Because when I look at the pieces of evidence, and I see that one of the pieces of evidence is Michael Jackson looking at pornographic material with a child, and the child is 13 or 14-years-old, and the fact that I witnessed that exact occurrence in my own life, at the same age, has to give me reason to pause and say, if this happened with me, and the kid's saying it happened with him, then this can't be all made up. And it can't all be lies. Because at least that one little thing right there I know is completely accurate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Feldman was subpoenaed by prosecutors to testify in the trial.

He's the first Indian American in Congress in 40 years. Up next on the "Novak Zone" Bobby Jindal talks about the pressures and opportunities the election brings.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: A freshman with a future. Congressman Bobby Jindal of Louisiana may be new to elected office, but he's no stranger to Washington.

He joins CNN's Robert Novak in this week's edition of the "Novak Zone."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERT NOVAK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to the "Novak Zone." We're at the Longworth House Office Building on Capitol Hill in Washington, D.C., talking to one of the newly elected members of the House of representatives, Congressman Bobby Jindal, republican of Kenner, Louisiana.

Congressman Jindal, you were just elected president of your freshman Republican class coming in only 33-years-old. This is your first elective office.

Do you have a seat at the leadership table as a president of the freshman class?

REP. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: Absolutely. One of the things I promised the voters in Kenner, Louisiana was that I would make a greater impact than the average freshman Congressman. Now, I'm new to elected politics, but I've been in D.C. before. I was assistant secretary in the Bush administration. This president's first administration. I also worked as the executive director of the Medicare Commission. So I've worked with many of the chairman, many of the members of leadership, including Chairman Thomas and many others. So absolutely, this position as president of the freshman class gives me an opportunity to be heard, also to give my input in terms of participating with leadership.

NOVAK: Congressman, you also have been named a deputy whip. Does that mean that if there is a choice, a conflict between what you think your constituents down in Louisiana might want and what President Bush wants, you have to go with the leadership, since your part of the leadership now?

JINDAL: Absolutely not. I mean, obviously, there's a greater responsibility as being of that leadership. But as our leaders always tell us, they never expect us to vote against our consciences, never expect us to vote against our districts. What it does mean is, I get an opportunity to participate every week with leadership, and learning about and helping to set that agenda. I've got a responsibility to communicate with my colleagues. And I think it is expected I'm not going to vote against my leadership on procedural votes. I'm not going to give control of the House floor to the other side, but absolutely not. On the issues, I've taken specific positions, back in my district and throughout my career. And I think leadership would expect me to vote consistently with that position.

NOVAK: On the night of the State of the Union Address, you played a little role in marking the great election in Iraq. Tell us about that.

JINDAL: You know, there was a great editorial cartoon in my hometown paper, the "New Orleans Time-Picayune" where it said, the voters of Iraq have given the insurgents the finger. And it showed a picture of them holding up their purple-stained fingers. And I thought, wouldn't it be a neat gesture if we, the members of the Congress, also stained our fingers in a show of solidarity. I think no matter how people voted for the war or against the war, no matter whether they're Democrats or Republicans, we can all be excited that the Iraqi voters braved so much to vote. We can be excited that democracy and freedom is being spread there. One of the most amazing moments -- not only when the mother of the fallen soldier hugged the Iraqi women, but also when the Iraqi voter stood up and waved their finger to me and -- to the entire House, not to me. But she was so excited to see all these people waving back at her purple-stained fingers. It was just a bipartisan...

NOVAK: You supplied the ink, though?

JINDAL: We did. We had purple ink. It was not permanent ink. We did have purple ink. It was a light-hearted, but a very important moment.

NOVAK: Congressman, you were -- as you mentioned you were assistant secretary in the HHS Department.

How is it different being an elected representative and being a presidential appointee?

JINDAL: You know, what's motivating me is I wanted to make an impact. I want to come here to make a difference. Certainly, when you're an assistant secretary, you get to be in the room with the chairman and other senior members, and you get to participate in that negotiating process. But it's very different being an elected member, even a freshman member, even a junior member of Congress, and that you are treated differently. As somebody who has a vote, it's a different way to make an impact. It's a different way to offer amendments. It's a different way to actually be in the room and say, what if we did this. So, you know, you even get treated differently by your fellow colleagues, by members that I worked with in the administration. Once you're an elected official, even they'll treat you differently because now you're one of them.

NOVAK: Mr. Jindal, you have two small children back in Louisiana and you're commuting every weekend to see them. When I came here almost half a century ago, a Congressman like you would move his whole family to Washington. Did you ever consider doing that, and isn't it a strain?

That's a sizable commute from Louisiana to Washington, D.C.

JINDAL: Well, I've got two beautiful children. The burden falls unfortunately especially heavy on my wife. But no, we never thought about moving the family here, for a couple of reasons. You know, I was jokingly telling you this before, my mother-in-law made it very clear, you can go where you want, but the grandchildren stay here. And we've got parents, and in-laws, and cousins, and aunts, and uncles and in-laws all living in Louisiana. So, it's -- Actually, it's better for us. We want our kids to grow up around their family.

And secondly, I think it's a good thing for members of Congress to have their kids in schools back in their district. I think it's a good thing for members of Congress to be rushing home ever week. I think it's a good thing for members of Congress got to be stuck in traffic. Have to go buy their groceries at home. I think it makes them more sympathetic and better able to understand the concerns of their constituents.

NOVAK: The point I hear from a lot of Congressmen is -- today, is that they spent all their time raising money for their campaigns, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) campaigns. Is that true?

JINDAL: Well, you know, look, that's a part of the political process. I think, the fact is that we take very public positions. We take specific votes. There are people that support that, and will want to help by volunteering, by donating. By working to get you reelected. And there are people who oppose you based on those votes. That's a part of a Democratic process.

NOVAK: Mr. Jindal, it's been well over 40 years since there was an Indian American in Congress. I remember old Judge Saund, Democrat from California. But he left Congress in 1963. Is your election an inspiration to other Indian Americans around the country?

JINDAL: It may very well be. I think, it's a great example of why this is the greatest country in the world. It's not just Indian Americans. It's not just other immigrants. It's not just other children of parents who were the first in their families to go to high school. I think my election shows that through hard work and through education, this country really offers unlimited opportunities. And I've said over and over, one of the reasons, the main reasons I ran for office was to make sure that the American dream continues to be possible for my children.

NOVAK: And now the big question for Congressman Bobby Jindal. Congressman, what is the one goal that you have set for yourself in your first term as a member of the House of Representatives?

JINDAL: My background in particular is in health care. The most important thing I would like to see us do is to continue moving toward, or maybe more quickly towards a private run health care system. I think we're better served when the government is not making decisions. The government, bureaucrats are not deciding for us how we get our health care, but rather we empower patients to work with their doctors.

NOVAK: Bobby Jindal, thank you very much.

JINDAL: Thank you.

NOVAK: And thank you for being in the "Novak Zone."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROMANS: You can see more of Bob Novak tonight on the "CAPITAL GANG" at 7:00 p.m. Eastern. The gangs guest tonight is Senator Kent Conrad of North Dakota.

It looks like Halloween in February. Up next, the story behind Central Park's 23 miles of brand-new bright orange garb.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: Don't ask what it means, it just is. A (UNINTELLIGIBLE) river running through New York Central Park. A grand art exhibit, courtesy, Christo and Jeanne-Claude. Seventy five hundred gates, lined 23 miles of foot paths through Central Park. The artists used more than 1 million square feet of fabric to set their work in motion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New York City seems to be the capital of hubris and greed and treachery, and here this is a work of art, for no other reason. No one's making a profit on it. And they're doing it strictly for the sake of art. It's different. But that's what art is all about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Only in New York. The free art exhibit is expected to remain in place for 16 days.

There's much more ahead on CNN SATURDAY. At the top of the hour, it's "NEXT@CNN." At 4:00 CNN LIVE SATURDAY looks at one military family relying on pen and paper to lessen the distance between home and battlefield.

At 5:00 "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" looks at Grammy Award nominee's L.L. Cool J. and Shania Twain.

But first Daniel Sieberg with a preview of "NEXT@CNN."

DANIEL SIEBERG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Ahead on "NEXT@CNN" for an inside look at the government lab where fake documents are detected and it's role on the war on terrorism. Also, we show how easy it is to find out sensitive information about other people over the Internet. And how easy it is for other people to do the same as you. Those stories and lot more coming up, right after a check of the headlines from the CNN newsroom. TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com