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Bolton: Trump's Call To Terminate Constitution Is Un-American; GOP Slowly Begins To Condemn Trump's Call To Terminate Constitution; Bolton: I may Launch 2024 Bid To Stop Trump From Second Term. Aired 8- 8:30a ET

Aired December 06, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

TRISTRAM WYATT, SENIOR RESEARCH FELLOW, UNIVERSITY OF OXFORD: -- or kind of molecule. And what's even stranger is we don't all have exactly the same 400 in our nose. And that's down to our genetics. It's highly variable. It might explain, for example, why we like a person or their perfume but not somebody else. It does explain, for example, why some people like cilantro in their guacamole and others don't. And there is a reason for that. It's genetic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: It's very individualized. That's the point. There's no absolute favorite or best smell. It can change moment to moment and person to person.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Sanjay, thank you so much. That episode of his podcast is out today. You can listen to it wherever you find your podcasts to learn more about smells.

And CNN THIS MORNING continues right now.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: All right, good morning, everyone. It is Tuesday, December 6th. Welcome to CNN THIS MORNING. It is Election Day and there is a lot to get to on this Election Day because the polls have been open in Georgia for about an hour now. Voters are lining up to cast their ballot in the final contest of the midterm election cycle. It is Warnock versus Walker in the Senate runoff and we're live at a polling place for you.

COLLINS: And as voters are going to the polls in Georgia, in Washington, some Republicans are slowly beginning to condemn what former President Trump said over the weekend about terminating the Constitution. But many still are remaining completely silent. Ahead, we will talk to John Bolton, Trump's former national security adviser, and hear why he says he's considering a GOP run in 2024.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Also, this morning, tens of thousands of people in North Carolina are still in the dark, literally and figuratively, without power and with no knowledge of who attacked their power grid and why. We will be joined this hour by the governor of North Carolina. He's with us in just a few minutes. But, first, listen to this.

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MARTIN LUTHER KING JR.: I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character. I have a dream today.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That was nearly six decades ago, and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. delivering his famous "I have a dream" speech on the National Mall, a dream that, like we just heard, people in America would be judged by the content of their character rather than the color of their skin. And today, whether you're aware of it or not, part of that dream is being realized.

Here's why. There are two black men. They are finalists for the Senate seat in Georgia. It is a seat that not only matters, but would be the difference-maker for a president's agenda and the direction of this country. It should not go unnoticed they are competing in the home state of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. And one of them holds the pulpit where the civil rights icon once preached.

And today no matter who wins, voters will line up, they're going to cast their ballots for a man who happens to be black, based not on his race, but on how voters see his character, something that lived only in a dream just six decades ago.

And with that in mind, we head straight now to Atlanta and CNN's Jeff Zeleny. Jeff, today is not only important for the history of this country, but it's important for the future, and the people of Georgia are playing a very pivotal role in that right now.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Don, you are right. This race is steeped in history. The first time here that two black candidates are running in a runoff for the Senate. Georgia, of course, one of two states in the country that require runoffs in the general election. That rule itself, of course, is also steeped in a different racial past.

But the reality here today is voters are going to the polls, and we have seen them streaming in at a pretty steady pace. There's not long lines, because 1.8 million Georgians have already voted because of how voting changed in America through early voting. But it is key for both sides to get their supporters out through turnout. That was their closing message yesterday. Let's listen.

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HERSCHEL WALKER, (R-GA) U.S. SENATE CANDIDATE: The best thing I've ever done, including the Heisman trophy, the Horatio Alger award, all those things, best thing I've ever done is run for office right here.

(APPLAUSE)

WALKER: A vote for my opponent is a vote for Joe Biden and a vote for Chuck Schumer.

SEN. RAPHAEL WARNOCK (D-GA): Matter of fact, call your father and your mother, your sister and your brother, call Lottie, Dottie, and everybody. Tell them it's time to vote. Tell them that a vote is a kind of prayer for the world we desire, for ourselves, and for our children.

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ZELENY: Senator Warnock there voicing confidence but urging Democrats to not be complacent today. Don?

LEMON: And Democrats have been urging people to get out and vote. They say 51 is better than 50.

[08:05:03]

Why are they urging people to get out, and why do they want 51 instead of 50, Jeff?

ZELENY: Well, Don, look, it just gives Democrats and certainly the White House some breathing room, if you will. Of course, Senator Joe Manchin has been at the center of most big policy debates. It could take some of that away. But also, in terms of committee assignments. Up until now, for the last two years they have been divided equally, Democrats and Republicans. That has really slowed down some of the judicial nominations and other nominations from the White House. So a clear Democratic majority, even 51-49, makes all the difference in the world because Democrats actually control the Senate.

It also changes the travel schedule potentially of Vice President Kamala Harris. She's been often having to stay in Washington, shuttling back and forth to the Hill to be a tie breaking vote. If Democrats win the seat today, if Senator Warnock wins, that means that she also does not have to be the tiebreaker so often. So it really does matter.

But that is also why Republicans are turning out today because they're trying to be a bit of a check and balance, if you will, on the president's agenda.

LEMON: All right, Jeff Zeleny, right in the middle of it all, Jeff, we appreciate it. Thank you so much.

And CNN's special coverage of today's runoff election between Senator Raphael Warnock and Herschel Walker Begins at 4:00 p.m. eastern time.

HARLOW: The FBI, state and local law enforcement officials all this morning working together trying to track down who attacked part of North Carolina's power grid this weekend. You'll remember gunfire left two power substations damaged on Saturday. No suspects have been detained. No motive has been determined that we know of. A local sheriff described the damage as intentional. Listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF RONNIE FIELDS, MOORE COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA: I will say this, the individual that done the damage knew exactly what they were doing to cause the damage and cause the outage that they did.

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HARLOW: Officials are racing to restore power, though outages could extend through Thursday. Joining us now is North Carolina's Governor Roy Cooper. Governor Cooper, thank you very much for your time. I'm so sorry that this happened, and you've got so many folks, their families trying to get kids to school, waking up in the dark, schools closed. You've called this a critical attack, and I wonder this morning what you can tell us about the investigation into who targeted these substations.

GOV. ROY COOPER, (D) NORTH CAROLINA: Well, good morning, guys. Thank you very much. People in Moore County, North Carolina, are hurting this morning. This was a malicious, criminal attack on the entire community that plunged tens of thousands of people into darkness. Our priorities now are health and safety, getting the power back on as quickly as possible, and making sure that federal, state and local law enforcement find out who did this and why and bring them to justice.

They've had to cancel school now for two days in a row. Businesses are losing money. We provided sheltering for people, working with local officials, mass feeding, bathroom facilities, lighting for street intersections. I was there yesterday, and all of the traffic lights are out, so you worry about safety and making sure that people are OK. This is a retirement community so there are a lot of adult care homes that do not have power. We are providing generators and help to make sure that people are safe here.

But there is a deep concern in this community about who would do such a thing and why they would do it. I visited the substation yesterday with Duke Energy officials. They are working around the clock to get the power back on. Right now, Thursday is the deadline that they believe that they can make. They're going to try to do it earlier, but they're having to bring in new equipment. And the state, local and federal law enforcement officials I met with them yesterday, they are working diligently, leaving no stone unturned to find out who did this.

HARLOW: You say you went to one of the substations with Duke Power to look. What did you see? Because I think I certainly am having a hard time envisioning, what does it look like when someone shoots at a substation? What did you see?

COOPER: Well, there are thousands of these substations across the country. And I think what happened here is going to cause us to reassess protection and hardening of infrastructure.

HARLOW: Right.

COOPER: If someone with a firearm can do this much damage and get power out to tens of thousands of people, then obviously we need to look at the different layers of infrastructure and hardening and make better decisions here. This was a specific act. The person or persons knew what they were doing and what it took to disable the substation. So what we're going to have to do is to work with state and federal officials.

[08:10:01]

And I think this needs to be a national conversation about the level of security that we have at these substations across the country.

LEMON: Can we talk about the motive here more? Because investigators, they have said -- and listen, we don't know what happened. It does have to be investigated. They say they have not been able to tie this back to what people have been talking about, this drag show that was taking place around the time the power went out. Are they looking to see if there was any connection to that and to domestic terrorism when it comes to that?

COOPER: Absolutely, they are looking at all of those. It's deeply disturbing to see the increase in hate speech and threats and violence against LGBTQ people across this country. It is unacceptable. I expect federal, state and local law enforcement will investigate that potential and others, leaving no stone unturned, because we have to find out who did this and why and to bring them to justice. But then we also have to look to the future as it affects our critical infrastructure. When we look at all the money that is being lost by businesses here at Christmastime, when we look at threats to people in nursing homes having lost power, hospitals having to run off generators and not being able to do certain kinds of operations at this point, all of those are deep concerns here, and we can't let this happen.

COLLINS: So I just want to be clear, in the aftermath of this, you still have not learned anything else about who could potentially be responsible so far, is that correct?

COOPER: So, the investigation is going on now.

COLLINS: Right.

COOPER: They're not revealing a lot of the details about the investigation, and I certainly could not from what I know. But I do know that they are looking at everything and all the potential evidence to find out who did this.

COLLINS: And the FBI had warned two weeks before this attack about potential -- increase in threats of going after infrastructure like this. Had you heard about those warnings from the FBI?

COOPER: Yes, indeed. And matter of fact, we have worked to organize and step up our protection of our infrastructure, particularly in the area of cybersecurity. We know that those attacks can be massive and could put down power or water or other infrastructure for a lot of people across the country, so we have been working on that. Clearly this is an area with the substations. Many of them are in remote areas. You have to look at the various levels of security. They have federal regulations that they must abide by, but I think that each one of these substations may be somewhat unique depending on where it is and what the vulnerabilities are.

So we have to have a serious national conversation about protecting our critical infrastructure because this is unacceptable to have this many people without power for this long. It was clear that they knew how to cause significant damage and that they could do it at this substation, so we have to reassess the situation.

COLLINS: Governor, can I quickly ask you, are there cameras at the substations?

COOPER: That is something that is part of the investigation and that they do not want to reveal at this time.

COLLINS: OK.

COOPER: But I'll tell you, as you look forward, we need to make sure that there are various levels of security and look at more security for these substations and other critical infrastructure that we have.

HARLOW: North Carolina Governor Roy Cooper, thank you, and, again, good luck to all your teams trying to get the bottom of this and get the power back on.

COOPER: Thanks, guys.

LEMON: This is, indeed, an attack from targeted, and it is domestic terrorism.

HARLOW: Scary.

LEMON: This is a whole new level here that we are reaching.

Police are still searching for a suspect and any clues into the stabbing deaths of four Idaho college students, and now investigators are looking into a new theory.

Plus, this --

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SEN. MITT ROMNEY, (R-UT): When President Trump says he wants to suspend the Constitution, he goes from being MAGA to being RINO. We're the Constitution party.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Mitt Romney, other Republicans speaking out about the former president's call to terminate the Constitution. Still, many are silent. We'll talk to Trump's former national security adviser John Bolton about that next.

[08:15:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: Former President Trump is now trying to deny he called to terminate the constitution days after he called to terminate the constitution. Trump, in a post on his website, Truth Social, is now blaming the media for using his exact words. Despite his post suggesting the termination of the Constitution remain online, on Saturday, he wrote, "A massive fraud of this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all rules, regulations and articles, even those found in the Constitution."

After days of silence, several top Republicans have now condemned Trump's comments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I must tell you that I think everyone that serves in public office, everyone that aspires to serve or serve again should make it clear we will support and defend the Constitution of the United States.

SEN. JOHN KENNEDY (R-LA): I disagree with the President. The Constitution can be amended, the Constitution can be interpreted, but the Constitution can't be suspended.

SEN. MITT ROMNEY (R-UT): The Republican Party has long been the party of the constitution. And so, when President Trump says he wants to suspend the constitution, he goes from being MAGA to being RINO. We're the -- we're the Constitution party.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: And that came after they were asked by reporters to respond to Trump's comments. And while some have spoken out forcefully, like Senators Lisa Murkowski, Mike Rounds, others are stayed silent. Some like Roger Marshall say they don't think it is a relevant question they should be asked about.

[08:20:04]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ROGER MARSHALL (R-KS): I don't know what President Trump said about the Constitution. I just don't think that's the issue. I don't think that's what you all should be talking about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell is expected to address what Trump said today, but joining us now is Trump's former National Security Adviser John Bolton, who was also the ambassador to the United Nations. And good morning, Ambassador. I've seen your response to this of what you've been saying about Trump's calls to terminate the Constitution. Do you think it should be disqualifying for a presidential candidate if they've made comments like this?

JOHN BOLTON, FORMER NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER, TRUMP ADMINISTRATION: Well, of course, it's disqualifying. You know, the President takes an oath of office prescribed by the Constitution itself. It says he will to the best of his ability, preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution. Trump himself took that oath. And effectively, he's now saying he didn't mean it. And if God forbid, he were ever elected again and took the oath again, we couldn't trust that he would abide by those words.

So, I think this is really existential. And even beyond being a matter of high principle, which I think it is, as a matter of practical politics, that statement, even as he failed to try and correct it over the weekend, that statement is a time bomb sitting on the desk of every Republican member of the House in the Senate, every Republican candidate around the country. If we don't very clearly very soon unequivocally reject it, naming Trump by name, this will come back to haunt us in November of 2024 in ways we can only imagine.

COLLINS: Do you really expect Republicans will do that, though?

BOLTON: I expect that if enough people speak out, that others will follow. I think across the country, if you ask Republicans and Republican-leaning independents, which is more important, Donald Trump or the Constitution, they would overwhelmingly say, approximating 100 percent would say it's the Constitution.

It's the failure of leaders to stand up and oppose this kind of rhetoric that empowers Trump. And it will be an issue. There's no doubt about it. I think the November 8 congressional elections prove that point. Donald Trump is the best asset the Democratic Party has.

COLLINS: Do you wish that you had stood up sooner?

BOLTON: Look, I lasted for 17 months. I did the best that I could. I'm sure I made plenty of mistakes, but the only thing you can say is we got to try and do the best we could. And I wrote what I hoped was a pretty definitive account of my time there, both for the general public to read now and for history to help judge Trump.

LEMON: Let me read something you wrote in your book, because you did -- there was -- you did talk about it in your book. He's -- you've spoken about this before. And it says, one highlight came -- you were talking -- this is what you were talking about. This is a context here. That Trump made these comments during a December 2018 dinner with Xi Jinping, the leader of China's authoritarian Communist Party. This was in Buenos Aires, right? Am I correct with that? And it says --

BOLTON: That's right.

LEMON: -- one highlight came when Xi said that he wanted to work with Trump for six more years. Trump replied that people were saying that the two-term constitutional limit on presidents -- on presidents should be repealed for him. And then you went on to write that Xi said the U.S. had too many elections because he didn't want to switch away from Trump, who noddingly approved. So, he wanted to subvert the constitution so that he could run again or run for as long as he wanted. That's a -- that's a prime example of wanting to -- by the way, the term that -- I think the lawmakers are getting it wrong. They're saying he wants to suspend the Constitution. Trump said he wanted to terminate the Constitution. But go on, please.

BOLTON: Right. Well, at least there he said amend the Constitution. I mean, he's now given up any pretense. And that's why I think that the comment about terminating the Constitution is existential. There's simply no way you can waffle on it. And to say, well, maybe Trump won't be the nominee, maybe it's not an issue now. It is an issue.

And it's just unacceptable for a party in a constitutional system to accept as anything, any kind of a leader in that party, somebody who opposes the Constitution that underlies it. And I think if we don't speak up and make that clear now, we're going to regret it. So, that's why I've said I would contemplate getting into the 2024 race myself if others don't step up to it. This is -- they say, this is a matter of high principle, but it's also self-interest for the party. And it stuns me that so many people don't see that.

LEMON: But you would say you would consider getting into it. If you -- look, whenever there's -- it's politically expedient, people will put out statements right away, right? And although there have been some in the Republican Party who are speaking out, not enough and not clearly and not in a loud manner.

And I'll just repeat. They're saying suspend the Constitution. He did not. He said terminate the Constitution. One lawmaker, they're saying that's not something that we should be talking about. Then what -- that's not for him to determine what should we -- what we should be talking about at this moment.

At what point will you decide that you want to get in because I don't see a whole, you know, force of Republicans who are going to come out and condemn Donald Trump for this, let alone anything, especially coming after what happened, you know, with a dinner at Mar-a-Lago with, you know, an antisemite?

[08:25:22]

BOLTON: Yes, well, there's a long list of objectionable behavior by Trump. I don't have a specific timetable. I think -- I think people are in a position now, however, where the presidential -- the field of potential presidential contenders is in cooee. So, there's a chance both to shape the field and to shape the debate. And I'm very interested in doing that.

I would like to get on to real issues like national security threats to the United States and get Donald Trump behind us. But unless enough Republicans are willing to stand up and do that, it's not going to happen. And by the way, with all due respect, it won't be the media criticism of Donald Trump that takes him out at the scene, and it won't be criticism by the Democrats. Ultimately, Republicans have to do this. Now is the time to do it.

HARLOW: Can I --

LEMON: Right. 100 percent on that. HARLOW: Go ahead.

LEMON: No, no, that's all I want to say.

HARLOW: Can I ask you about, before you go, those national security threats to the United States and to the world while we have you, Ambassador? And let's start with Iran. I wonder if you agree with former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton who said on CNN just last week, the U.S. should not in any way, be negotiating with Iran on anything right now, including on the nuclear agreement. You wrote -- I mean, you've been so clear about your position on Iran. You wrote in August, that any negotiations encouraged terrorist activity. So, it sounds like you two are on the same page?

BOLTON: Well, Hillary Clinton sees the light. I'm delighted that that's her position. That is the correct decision. I wish -- I wish Joe Biden would articulate it.

HARLOW: OK, and on Russia, I would like to quickly play for you what Secretary of State Antony Blinken just said about any potential "offramp" for Russia in the war on Ukraine. Let's play that and get your thoughts.

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ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: One of the things that you can imagine is the Russians trying to find an offramp that would be a phony offramp, by which I mean, oh, let's have a ceasefire. Let's just freeze things in place. Get a frozen conflict, never negotiate about the territory that they have seized, and continue to hold. Rest, refit, regroup, reattack.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLTON: Do you share the concern of the current Secretary of State?

BOLTON: Sure, I wrote op-eds to that effect in August and September predicting that's what Putin would do. And frankly, if he had been well advised, he would have done it back in September because he can't do it now. The only offramp for Russia in Ukraine, I think, was very well articulated by the prime minister of Finland several weeks ago. She said, how does this end? It ends when Russian troops leave Ukraine. That's how it ends.

HARLOW: Yes.

COLLINS: Can I ask one more question just before we let you go? You saying that you're now mulling a 2024 run? were you considering that before Trump tweeted on Saturday or Trump said on Saturday that the Constitution should be terminated?

BOLTON: No. You know, I looked at it very seriously in 2016. I went to the Capitol shows in Iowa and New Hampshire and ultimately decided not to. And I didn't think I would in this cycle. But my point really is that the Republican Party's got to step up to the moment here. And if I can -- if I can help precipitate that, then I would seriously consider getting in. And I think -- I think somebody has got to do it. We can't go on like this.

HARLOW: Former Ambassador John Bolton, thanks so much for your time this morning.

BOLTON: Glad to be with you.

LEMON: Thank you.

HARLOW: All right, it is election day in Georgia again. You see Herschel Walker there meeting and greeting voters just moments ago. What is his message? Will it resonate? Stay with CNN all day for live coverage.

Also coming up, Veronica Miracle is live in Moscow, Idaho.

VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: More than three weeks after full- color students were murdered, frustrated family members are speaking out since there's been no arrest.

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