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Democratic Party Leaders Like Biden but Don't Love Him; Ben Smith is Interviewed about Politics and the 2024 Race; Beyonce Makes History at Grammys; NATO Exercise Mimicking War with Russia. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired February 06, 2023 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[06:30:58]

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: So, we are following breaking news this morning. Tragedy across Turkey and Syria as more than 1,300 people have been killed, thousands more injured, after a powerful magnitude 7.8 earthquake. Buildings crumbled, trapping people in that rubble. Now rescuers are scrambling to reach them. And there have been aftershocks, including a 7.5 magnitude one within the last hour. We'll continue to follow.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: And as we monitor that, we also have new CNN reporting this morning about what's happening in Washington as Democratic Party leaders say that President Biden may still be the ticket for 2024, even if they're not passionate about him. This after the president and vice president turned out for the Democratic National Committee meeting in the critical battleground state of Pennsylvania. That's just ahead of President Biden's expected delivered second State of the Union Address on Tuesday.

CNN's Isaac Dovere is live in Washington.

Isaac, you've been talking to these sources. What are they saying about how they're viewing what that 2024 ticket could look like?

ISAAC DOVERE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yes, good morning, Kaitlan.

I was in Philadelphia last week for that meeting of the Democratic National Committee. Those are the state party chairs, the most involved party operatives. And they say, look, they are so happy with what Biden has gotten done. Really satisfied with the sense of calm that he's brought to a lot of things in Washington and in the party overall. But they just don't feel that exact passion, that love for him that maybe they felt for Barack Obama or that Republicans in the base feel for Donald Trump.

I was talking with Jamie Harrison, the DNC chair, about this and he said to me, look, you don't find Joe Biden's face on a t-shirt. That's true. But Donald Trump's face might be on a t-shirt. He lost in 2020. And you see a lot of that feeling from Democrats going forward into what will be the State of the Union Address tomorrow night and what we're thinking will be Joe Biden's pitch as he starts running for re- election, talking about the competency of government making things work, not so much being the cultive (ph) personality around him.

COLLINS: Yes, I mean, that's never really been the case with President Biden. But obviously he is still expected to announce that he's running in March or April, whenever they make that ultimate decision.

What do Democrats say? You know, are there any candidates out there? Because this is often what you hear from White House officials is, well, else would you want in this place? Like who else do they believe could actually deliver here?

What do you hear from Democrats on that?

DOVERE: Well, look, more - even more to the point, in the 2020 primaries, there were a lot of candidates who were getting more excitement at rallies, who were getting bigger crowds and all those things, but one by one they lost to Joe Biden for the nomination and then Joe Biden won the presidency. So, that is one of the things that you'll hear out of Biden advisers too, look at the way that this went so far.

But when you look at the other Democratic contenders out there, there are a lot of questions that remain about Vice President Harris, whether she be would able to pick up the mantle if Biden surprised everybody and didn't run for re-election, and whether there are be other people out there. There are other emerging Democrats but no one quite is at the level so far in people's minds as being able to galvanize the party, or maybe the country, the way that you saw with those campaigns around Barack Obama or around Donald Trump.

COLLINS: Yes. And at the end of the day, the want the one who can win.

DOVERE: Exactly (ph).

COLLINS: Isaac Dovere, thank you for that reporting.

DOVERE: Thank you.

LEMON: Can we just - can we just bring Ben in right now because we're going to talk to him about something else. We'll read the lead-in later.

Ben, thank you, because I want you to respond to this.

Is this - this - is this a disconnect between the people and the party leaders, because if you look at what with Biden, you know, with his - when he made the speech and he went to the convention or whatever, people love him. The people on the street love him. But the people in the party are like, ah, I'm not so sure. So, what -- is this real?

BEN SMITH, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, SEMAFOR: You know, I think there are a lot of Democratic voters, particularly, for instance, black voters in South Carolina, who really love Joe Biden. And that's - and that's why nobody's going to run against him. For whatever party elites feel, whatever sort of journalists feel about him, actually. LEMON: Yes.

SMITH: That said, he - he's not a movement candidate. He's not filling stadiums.

[06:35:00]

But - but that's how he won the first time by being good enough for most Democrats.

LEMON: Yes.

COLLINS: But I guess the question is, do Democrats - what -- how do -- what is vote sentiment because that new "Washington Post"/ABC poll that came out yesterday said, among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents, 58 percent said they would prefer someone other than Biden as the nominee in 2024 actually.

SMITH: Yes, but I - I mean I think - but you just can't - I mean it's an old cliche, you don't beat somebody with nobody.

LEMON: Yes.

SMITH: And - and I think they're - I think - I think the Democratic Party is just totally - totally set to kind of settle for Joe Biden.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: To Kaitlan's good point, Jim Clyburn was asked about that poll number this weekend on ABC, I believe, right, and he was so critical in Biden getting the nomination last time around. And I just wonder what - what you think that support, not just from him, but those who boosted Biden when he needed it most, means this time around.

SMITH: You know, I just think it means that, I know the Democrats who have thought about -- you know, there's a cadre of Democrats who want to be president, like all of the ones in the Senate, and, you know, and that -

COLLINS: In the cabinet (ph).

HARLOW: Well said.

LEMON: Like all of them.

SMITH: Yes. And, you know, like every elected official. And I think every single one of them who has looked at it has decided it would -- because - that it would be political suicide to - to run a primary against him. I mean I knew somebody will in the end just because it's an incredible way to get attention for some back venture in the House, you know, the way Dennis Kucinich (ph) used to. But it just doesn't seems like there's, you know, a major figure about to step up.

COLLINS: So, can we turn to - to the media and how it has covered Trump's 2024 campaign so far as we prepare for Nikki Haley to get in the race, you know, mid next week. Many eyes on DeSantis and what he's going to do. Do you think at all the media is underplaying a Trump '24 potential

win given these latest polling numbers, like it did for 2016?

SMITH: Yes. You know, I kind of -- I mean I think the media, we all, after an election, sit around and decide what mistake we made last time and that we're not going to make that mistake again, then make some new mistake. And it does -- I mean there is this kind of unspoken consensus in the media that Trump isn't a serious candidate, I think. And if you look at the - there's not that much coverage of him. I mean Fox is actually kind of boycotting him, which is why you see a real drop off in cable coverage.

LEMON: Do you believe that? Do you believe that it's - do you believe he's not a serious contender or you think -

SMITH: Of course, he's a serious contender. He's ahead in the polls. And he's out there, you know, finding often the most extreme position on the social issues that are what motivates Republicans right now.

Like last week didn't get a lot of coverage, but he launched an - you know, a sort of new attack, not on the arguments around transgender youth medicine, which is where the sort of policy dispute to the degree there is one has been, but on transgender people at all ages, which is totally new, which is a thing that, you know, kind of crosses a new line. I think he'll be pushing Republicans toward the most talked about and the most decisive issues, which is where he lives.

LEMON: And what of it then, if you -- since you're, you know, in the media and now you're Semafor, you were with "The New York Times." And what - what do you make of, as you were saying, the Fox News and conservatives sort of downplaying Trump, trying to really just quiet him, don't you think?

SMITH: Yes, I think there - I mean I think there's kind of a conspiracy against him.

LEMON: So, what of that?

SMITH: I mean -

LEMON: Will that affect him?

SMITH: Yes. And they're trying - you know, they're certainly -- I think the last cycle they were -- people were afraid to challenge him and kind of thought that by, you know, giving mean, off the record quotes to reporters they could undermine him. It didn't work. You certainly see major powers in the Republican Party, Fox News, the Koch network, really going at him frontally in a new way. And that's new for him.

COLLINS: The Koch thing is - is really interesting.

HARLOW: Yes.

COLLINS: It's this memo, for people who didn't read it, basically saying that they are going to get involved in the 2024 primaries. They don't say Trump directly, but this internal memo talks about moving on from the past. That is basically everyone's like new cliche line when they're talking about Trump without saying that they're talking about Trump, right?

HARLOW: Yes.

SMITH: Yes, they spell Trump a whole lot of different ways in that memo. But, you know, but, in fact, that was, in some ways, quite courageous, right? I mean I think they're -- they're going to take a lot of heat. Anyone in the Republican Party who's challenging him is going after the most popular figure in the party and is going to take a lot of heat.

LEMON: Yes, thank you, Ben. I read ahead in the textbook, editor-in- chief of Semafor, former "New York Times" media columnist Ben Smith. Thank you very --

SMITH: Thanks for introducing me.

LEMON: I just -- I wanted you to get in on the last conversation because we were sitting here like looking at each other going, is that true? What do you think of that?

SMITH: Yes.

LEMON: So many different things about Biden that people -- like my mom, who is the sort of, you know, church lady every Sunday, votes rain, sleet, snow, or shine, she loves Biden. It doesn't matter. She's -- the classified documents, she goes, oh, well Trump had -- you know, the whole thing. And then you read what the Democratic Party leaders say and it's just sort of a disconnect. And then the polling -

SMITH: Yes, that's right.

LEMON: I just want to - I just want to know what is real.

SMITH: I mean that's been -- that's been how he -- that's why he's president.

LEMON: He's defied every - you know, logic for most people at least, or at least expectation.

Thank you, Ben.

SMITH: Thank you.

LEMON: Appreciate it.

History was made several times at last night's Grammy awards. Did you guys watch?

HARLOW: No.

LEMON: Did you guys watch?

HARLOW: I was snoozing. LEMON: Did anybody here go? I don't know. Chloe Melas is here.

[06:40:01]

She has a recap. We've got to talk about it. Whose night? Beyonce's night.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because we are witnessing history tonight. Breaking the record for the most Grammy wins of all time, be upstanding and show your respect, it's "Renaissance," Beyonce.

BEYONCE, 32-TIME GRAMMY AWARD WINNER: Thank you so much. I'm trying not to be too emotional. And I'm trying to just receive this night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: It's like, thank you, God. She had a moment. And, look, she can't even -- she doesn't even defy traffic because Beyonce was stuck in traffic, but she made it for this one. She made history last night. She became the most awarded artist in Grammy's history. Her album "Renaissance" won her her 32nd Grammy Award.

[06:45:04]

For more on that and the other big moments of the night, CNN entertainment reporter Chloe Melas joins us now.

Hello.

CHLOE MELAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT REPORTER: Hello.

LEMON: But - but just -

MELAS: Well, first of all, how did you make it back because I was not expecting to see you. I followed you all weekend for all your fun Grammy's behind the scenes.

LEMON: I had a really -- I had a really great time. It's not about me now. I'll explain that.

MELAS: OK.

LEMON: Can we just talk about -- thank you. Let's talk about Beyonce. History, not in the making, she is the GOAT, as Trevor said.

MELAS: So - so this is like a high and a low this morning for Beyonce fans. Such a high because she made history being the most awarded artist of all time with 32 wins. She had to win four to get there. She tied while potentially in traffic, according to Trevor Noah. That's why she wasn't on stage to accept that one. But then she made it. And it was so sweet seeing her sitting there with her hubby Jay-z and she was so emotional and, you know, really thanking the LGBTQ community because that's really who she made this album for.

But then she didn't win Album of the Year. And a lot of people were really hoping that this was her moment because she's never won Album of the Year before. Although I'm really thrilled for Harry Styles. I think he had -- it was a big year for him. But a lot of people aren't happy. I mean you could hear people in the audience screaming out, Beyonce should have won while Harry was speaking, which, obviously, Beyonce wouldn't have wanted because, you know, Beyonce -- a lot of celebrities knows how it feels to have their moment taken.

LEMON: That's the second time. Remember with Kanye.

HARLOW: Taylor.

MELAS: Well, see, OK, Adelle --

LEMON: And Taylor. Remember. Yes.

MELAS: But this was going to be the big -- this was Adelle versus Beyonce going head to head. It had been six years since they were head-to-head in that category. Adelle won six years ago. And many people felt --

HARLOW: Yes, and that great speech.

MELAS: And then Adelle kind of like apologized for winning because Beyonce fans really, again, so supportive of Beyonce. We love Beyonce. And so many people thought it was going to be either one of them. So you could see, though, that Adelle was visibly upset. I mean she was cheering for Harry and then she made a beeline out of there and left pretty quickly.

So, you know, I think that, you know, it goes to show you that they really don't know in advance who's going to win. I've always wondered, like, do they have an inkling like, come on, come, come to the Grammy's. we're going to sit you in the front because you're going to get something.

HARLOW: You're going to get something gold.

MELAS: But, no. You see real disappointment.

I loved that Taylor Swift, Harry Styles' ex-girlfriend, was one of the first to stand and give Harry a standing ovation. And she stood the whole time. So, I loved that. That's what a lot of --

COLLINS: That was a great album from Harry Styles. I mean it was the fourth time that Beyonce has lost out on this.

The other thing - there was history made last night with Kim Petras, when she was accepting her award, speaking about what Beyonce was saying in her - in her acceptance speech.

MELAS: OK. Well, Madonna comes out to, first, present - or to have them take the stage to perform, Kim and Sam Smith. And it was just incredible to watch that performance. And then they had won. And this is a big moment for the trans community. And so that was just really incredible to see. So much history. And then also I just want to point out Viola Davis becoming an EGOT winner.

LEMON: EGOT.

MELAS: Oh, my goodness. That means Emmy, Grammy, Oscar, two Tonys she has.

LEMON: We - there's so much --

MELAS: Wow, I feel so under accomplished, Viola Davis.

LEMON: There is so much to talk about, but I just -- before we go, quickly, humble brag. So, I was at the Clive Davis pre-party. And where I was sitting, everyone had to walk by me. And the only - well, a couple people I got up. But I got up when I saw Cardi B walk by because she's like my Instagram buddy. I'm like, Cardi! Offset (ph).

MELAS: You - I -- you're - you're the reason why I didn't go to bed because I was watching your Instagram Live.

LEMON: All right.

MELAS: Sharon Stone. We - we got to talk later.

LEMON: All right. All right. We got to go. Sorry, but I had to do a little humble brag.

We'll be right back.

Thank you, Chloe.

HARLOW: I love that. I hadn't seen those pictures.

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[06:52:47]

HARLOW: Ukraine's defense minister says their soldiers began training today on those Leopard tanks in Germany as other crews are already in the United Kingdom training on British tanks. Meantime, CNN is on the ground with access to NATO's recent war exercise.

Our Nic Robertson reports from Estonia.

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NIC ROBERTSON, INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (voice over): Danish Leopard II tanks, similar to those soon to be deployed to Ukraine, storming an imagined enemy position in Estonia. French troops attack fictional front lines as Estonian troops pretend to hold them off. All part of the Baltic nation's annual NATO winter exercise to gel the multinational alliance into a singular fighting force.

ROBERTSON (on camera): This year these military exercises feel different. The French have brought in far more troops than in the past. And with war still raging not far away in Ukraine, commanders say this training feels much more real.

ROBERTSON (voice over): Two-third of the 44 tanks involved in the exercise, British Challenger II tanks. More like these also soon deploying to Ukraine. Lessons learned here, valuable for the Ukrainians. Communications between the Challenger and Leopard tanks critical. But no doubt used correctly, they could be a game changer.

MAJOR NICK BRIDGES, BRITISH ENHANCED FORWARD PRESENCE, ESTONIA: Both can do -- can fight at night. And they've got hunter killer capabilities as well. So, they can engage a target while looking for their next target. So, very -- much more advanced time, sort of advanced sighting systems than what they virtually (ph) would have.

ROBERTSON (on camera): The Ukrainians say they want to use the Leopard II tankers, an iron fist to punch through Russian lines, give Putin a bloody nose and snatch back territory they lost.

ROBERTSON (voice over): The lesson here, that won't happen overnight. Typically, Danes train individual Leopard II operators in two weeks. A crew of four in two months. But it can take two years to combine them into a force able to seize territory.

MAJOR RASMUS JENSEN, DANISH ARMY: So, it's the tactics that takes time.

[06:55:00]

Then you have the theory, as a crew. And then you have to learn to drive as a crew within a platoon and within the squadron.

ROBERTSON: Estonian's defense minister, whose country spends a whopping 1 percent of GDP supporting Ukraine, watching the training, keen to get the tanks to Ukraine soonest.

HANNO PEVKUR, ESTONIAN DEFENSE MINISTER: I really hope that it's not too late, I really hope, because we all understand that there's a push from Russians coming in a - in a very, like coming months or coming weeks even.

ROBERTSON (on camera): So is this a make or break moment in the next few months in this war?

PEVKUR: Probably. So, it's a -- once again, when - when there will be no breakthrough in the coming weeks and months, then probably we will end or we will step in to the very long time of war.

ROBERTSON (voice over): This operation ongoing for another week as elsewhere Ukrainian troops begin to get their hands on beasts like these. How quickly they can use them effectively will impact well beyond Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERTSON: So the lessons learned here about combining the tanks with the infantry on the ground, this is exactly what Ukraine needs. One other thing we learned about these Leopard tanks, they can go backwards as fast as they can go forwards. Russian tanks can't do that. That shoot and scoot capability again gives them another advantage when facing off the Russians in the east of Ukraine.

HARLOW: It helps us understand their capability a lot.

Nic Robertson, fascinating report from Estonia. Thank you very much.

And next we have much more on our breaking news this morning. Thousands of people are feared dead in a very powerful earthquake in Turkey and Syria.

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