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CNN This Morning

MSU Professor Describes Coming Face-to-Face with Gunman; Sen. John Fetterman (D-PA) Checks into Hospital for Clinical Depression; Ohio Residents Fear for Their Health After Toxic Train Crash. Aired 7- 7:30a ET

Aired February 17, 2023 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:00:00]

OLIVER DARCY, CNN SENIOR MEDIA REPORTER: And so they are arguing that it was because Fox News advances (ph) there, it's because it was in their business interests, and that's why we're seeing these messages come out today.

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much, Oliver.

DARCY: Thank you.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Oliver. And CNN This Morning continues right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHAQUILLE O'NEAL, FORMER NBA PLAYER: What do people do when you walk in the bank?

CHARLES BARKLEY, FORMER NBA PLAYER: They'd better run to me. When I walk in a bank, if that manager is sitting there when I get there, man, you better meet me at the door.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Good morning, everyone. That is Charles Barkley. Audie Cornish is here with us. Don has the day off. Poppy is in Utah, as you see her there, for the NBA All-Star game. Poppy, I mean, I am so excited --

CORNISH: Yes, jealous of your co-anchors this morning, for sure.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. Rough assignment, right, guys? I cannot believe they sent me here. I'm going to complain to the boss. This is terrible I'm just. I'm just in centre court. This is amazing. We have a really fun lineup for you guys. You saw I sat down yesterday with Shaq, with Chuck, with Kenny. I couldn't get a word in edge wise. It was awesome. You're going to see that at 8:00 A.M.

And then we're going to be joined, there you go, by Ryan Smith, the Utah Jazz owner, and someone who loves the state of Utah, you'll hear all about this Silicon Slopes. We'll talk about the tech scene here. And then the WNBA commissioner, Kathy Engelbert, and we're going to talk about a lot, including Brittney Griner. We've got an update for you on that. So, see you in a bit.

COLLINS: So, excited to watch also. I mean, it's the first time they've had the All-Star game in Utah in 30 years since the anniversary. So, I'm super excited to watch. We will be checking back in with Poppy. You don't want to miss that interview.

We also have a lot going on in the news developments this morning. Did hackers just attack the FBI? What we're exclusively learning this morning about a possible assault on the bureau's computer system. Plus --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PROF. MARCO DIAZ-MUNOZ, MICHIGAN STATE UNIVERSITY, SHOOTING WITNESS: I don't know if I scream just, you know, find covered, go under the desks. A lot of them went under curled up in a ball under their chairs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: We'll hear more from the Michigan State professor who was inside the classroom when the mass shooter stormed in and murdered his students.

COLLINS: Also this morning, the five Memphis police officers who were charged with murdering Tyre Nichols are due in court today. Shimon Prokupecz is standing by with what we should expect.

But we're going to start this morning with the professor that you just heard from who came face-to-face with the mass shooter at Michigan State University. He was inside a classroom with his students in Berkey Hall. It's the first building that the gunman attacked during that bloody rampage. The professor told CNN what the shooter looked like when he stepped inside the room and saw him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DIAZ-MUNOZ: I could see this figure. And it was so horrible. Because, you know, when you see someone who is totally masked, you don't see their face, you don't see their hands. You don't see -- it was like seeing a robot. It was like seeing something not human.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: CNN's Miguel Marques spoke with that professor. Miguel, it is just -- it's hard to even listen to him recount this nightmare, to talk about what it was like. How is he doing?

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he's not doing well. Look, he's a professor. He's very -- intellectualizes things. He is very clinical. He is having a tough time. He's taking a lot of pills over the last few days to try to get to sleep. But now he wants to be more in touch with his students. Look, there are so many mass shootings in this country. It is a question that all Americans have to ask themselves. Do you run? Do you fight? Do you barricade yourself in? What would you do in this situation? In many of the cases with these students, it happened so quickly. No matter how fast they reacted, it wasn't fast enough.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARQUEZ: So, you're in your class. It's 8:15 or so on Monday night. 45 students are in there with you. This man walks in. And he fires in quick succession like that. Did you realize people were being shot?

DIAZ-MUNOZ: Oh, yes. The first thing that runs through my mind is like this is not happening. This cannot be happening. It's like you don't believe such horror is happening to you. And at that moment, I kind of was preparing myself to be killed. I said, well, if I'm killed, I'm killed. But these are kids. These are 18-year-olds, 19- year-olds. And when you're a professor, you develop a sense of mentorship for them and you also want to protect them.

MARQUEZ (voice over): What would you do seconds to act, confusion, fear and chaos surrounding you? The classroom at MSU's Berkey Hall, Professor Diaz-Munoz has taught the same course in the same classroom for five years.

[07:05:05]

Room 114 is his favorite. The rectangular room around 50 feet long with room for around 80 students has two doors, front and back, and windows along one side. It has several rows of fixed seats and desks. Diaz Munoz was in the front when the gunman partially entered through the back door, said nothing and began firing.

Some students hid. Some froze. Some were able to escape through the windows. But even that wasn't easy.

DIAZ-MUNOZ: I told the students just escape through the windows, just kick the windows open and escape through the windows. And the first line of windows closer to the rows of seats are -- couldn't be kicked. I mean, it couldn't be broken. They're made out of very hard glass, probably for, you know, installation. So, they attempted that they couldn't open those. But then the second set of windows higher up, they were open and there was big enough an opening, so they started escaping that way.

MARQUEZ: So, they couldn't get out to the bottom part of the window, but over the top?

DIAZ-MUNOZ: No, but they did. So, they were climbing.

MARQUEZ: And you're on the ground floor.

DIAZ-MUNOZ: Yes. I was holding the door, telling them to escape through the windows.

MARQUEZ: What are you feeling, if anything? Guilt? Anger? Fear? DIAZ-MUNOZ: Guilt because I didn't throw myself at this guy to stop it. But he would have just simply --

MARQUEZ: You were also across the room though?

DIAZ-MUNOZ: Yes. By the time I reached him, I would have already been, you know, on the floor. Guilt that I didn't fight more and scream more to get help for those kids that were on the floor.

MARQUEZ: But you don't know that they could have been saved.

DIAZ-MUNOZ: I don't know that. Someone said to me when I was calling attention, they're gone. That's what they said, they're gone. And I don't know. Someone said something about their pulse. I don't know. I don't know when a human is gone and when a human is not.

MARQUEZ: So, to see this --

DIAZ-MUNOZ: Oh, yes, it is heart-wrenching.

MARQUEZ: -- to be the person responsible for them and then to see this --

DIAZ-MUNOZ: And to see that I couldn't stop it, it was the worst thing that I couldn't -- it's like they became like my family. They're like my kids. I have a daughter their age. So, to me, it was like, you know, seeing my daughter or anybody that age being killed and under my watch, on my I watch.

It broke my heart to see these two that I couldn't help.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MARQUEZ (on camera): So, top on the priority list for Professor Diaz- Munoz is to get back in touch with his students. He's been writing a letter to them, drafting it, trying to figure out what to say, how to say it. It's been tough going. It's like his family was injured and killed in that attack. Back to you, guys.

COLLINS: Yes. And it's something any professor thinks they'll have to say to their students or hopes that they don't. Miguel Marquez, that was a really remarkable interview. Thank you.

CORNISH: Now, in just hours, five former Memphis police officers charged with Tyre Nichols' murder will appear in court. All are charged with second-degree murder, aggravated assault, kidnapping, official misconduct and official oppression.

CNN Senior Crime and Justice Correspondent Shimon Prokupecz is in front of the Memphis courtroom. And, Shimon, just begin with what we're expecting to see and hear today.

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Right, Audie. So, it will be their first court, initial court appearance. They'll be arraigned on the charges that you just mentioned. So, they will -- certainly, the five officers will be in court. And it will be the first time we get to really see them since this horrific incident, since the video was released, since they were arrested.

We also expect to see Tyre Nichols' family. His attorney will be here. And we expect to hear from them as well. It will be first time also for the community members to come face-to-face with these five officers. As this investigation is continuing, more officers are expected to be disciplined, potentially terminated. The district attorney has said that they are continuing their investigation and more charges could come to other officers who were involved.

And also we're waiting for more video and audio that the police, the D.A., and local officials here have said will be released at some point, perhaps next week, so yet more to come. But significant in that this day will be the first time that the family members and that the community will come face-to-face with these officers and their initial appearance here behind me in just a couple of hours.

COLLINS: Yes. And we'll continue to check on that.

[07:10:00]

Shimon, thank you for being there.

CORNISH: Now, this morning, Pennsylvania Senator John Fetterman is back in the hospital battling something millions of Americans have experienced, clinical depression. According to his chief of staff, Fetterman checked himself into Walter Reed and is receiving treatment. Last week, Fetterman was hospitalized after feeling lightheaded. And last May, he had a stroke days before the Democratic primary.

In a statement, Fetterman's office wrote, while John has experienced depression off and on throughout his life, it only became severe in recent weeks.

Now, in an interview months after his stroke, Fetterman said he was up to the demands of being a senator.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): There really isn't anything that is going to stop me from doing this job.

I've been able to run a successful campaign despite having the issues with auditory processing, et cetera. So, I believe I'm going to be able to serve effectively.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Joining us now is CNN Political Commentator and Host of CNN's Smerconish, Michael Smerconish.

And, first, we want to start about his health coming into focus here, right? I mean, we're a long way from the Walter Mondale years. This must be the last thing he wants, though, politically.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I wish him Godspeed and I admire his courage and being so forthcoming and willing to talk about and acknowledge that the admission was for clinical depression. I'd like to think that this is an important milestone on the road toward de-stigmatization. And it couldn't come in a better time in this regard.

The CDC released a stunning report this week talking about the incidents of mental health issues among American youth, specifically high school students, 42 percent of whom are experiencing feelings of hopelessness. How about the idea that 30 percent of American girls in high school have seriously contemplated a plan for suicide?

We've got to de-stigmatize these issues. We've got to talk about them and we've got to put brain health on the same playing surface as physical health. And that's what I'm hoping will be the silver lining that comes out of this.

COLLINS: Yes. It is important to have those conversations. I have a 16-year-old sister. I was so disturbed by those numbers, Michael.

But also to hear a sitting senator talk about it. You know Capitol Hill well. Politicians aren't always honest about their health and what it looks like because they're worried it will hurt them politically. What do you make of him coming out so publicly about this but also what you've seen, the reaction, the tweets, the response to his fellow senators?

SMERCONISH: Well, I love the response because the response has been a supportive response. I'm not the only one to note that it was 50 years ago that Tom Eagleton had to stand down on the Democratic ticket as a vice presidential running mate with George McGovern. By the way, interesting footnote, he did go on to get re-elected from the great state of Missouri.

But 50 years ago, we were not ready to have this conversation. I have to believe that everybody now knows, we're all one degree of separation away from these issues. So, I'd like to think that there is an acceptance out there that wasn't a half century ago.

COLLINS: Yes, I think that's fair to say. I mean, we do talk about it differently, especially so much because of COVID, I think, changed the way that we talk about mental health.

CORNISH: Yes. But it's notable. Because just about everything is a political football these days and the fact that somehow this -- it does feel like there has been a shift, also maybe post-opioid crisis for the Republican Party in particular. Do you sense the kind of more embrace of that talk around mental health?

SMERCONISH: You know, I would like to think so. I had a conversation with Chris Christie not that long ago. And I said to him, Governor, you had a moment when you ran for president in 2016, when you talked about addiction in New Hampshire. And we then talked about the need to address exactly these issues.

I think -- I'd like to think that it's not one where people are going suit up in their usual partisan jerseys. God, I hope so.

COLLINS: Yes, agreed. Michael, thank you, as always. And you can watch Michael's show 9:00 A.M. on Saturdays.

All right, now to a CNN exclusive this morning, the FBI says that it's contained a malicious cyber incident on part of its computer network. The FBI says they're actively investigating this. A source is telling CNN that the New York field office was involved. It's one of the bureau's biggest and highest profile offices.

CNN Sean Lyngaas is tracking all of this. Sean, I know you have exclusive reporting just in on how the FBI is handling this, the idea is that they think they have it contained. What have you learned?

SEAN LYNGAAS, CNN CYBERSECURITY REPORTER: Well, Kaitlan, normally you call the FBI when you get hacked. Here is someone who has flipped the script. So, the FBI is responding to a computer intrusion and they are having a deal with it internally.

Here's what we know and here's what we don't know. What we know is that in the last few days, FBI officials have been investigating this incident and working to contain it and remediate it. According to reporting from myself and my colleague, Evan Perez, that started or at least involved a New York field office, which is a massive office and a really influential one for the bureau's work across the country.

[07:15:03]

And we've also reported that investigators believe that this may affect a computer system involving child sex image exploitation investigation. So, that would be very serious indeed.

What we don't know is who at this point carried this out. And what the FBI is going to do in response. Kaitlan?

COLLINS: Yes. And so what steps do they take to figure out who carried it out and what that looks like, and also how to fix what has been hacked and make sure that there is not more information that could be breached?

LYNGAAS: Right. So, they say they've contained it. And what that would involve would be isolating the computer system that was breached and sort of making sure that there's no beaconing or communicating between the intrusion, like the foothold that the hackers may have had with an outside system. So, they're working to cut that off. And then they're obviously trying to trace and identify who did this.

FBI has no shortage of adversaries. They're trying to arrest cyber criminals overseas. And so there is a lot of investigative work to do, Kaitlan.

COLLINS: Yes, there is. We will check back in with you to make sure that we're staying on top of it. Sean, thank you so much.

Also this morning, it's not just the people who are in East Palestine, Ohio, who are worried about their water, worried that it's not safe because of that toxic train crash, it is also the millions of people in and around the state. We're going to speak to the head of water quality and treatment in Cincinnati about what they're seeing. CORNISH: And a difficult diagnosis for Bruce Willis. What we're hearing this morning from the actor's family.

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[07:20:00]

COLLINS: There you see sparks coming off the wheel of the Norfolk Southern train about 43 minutes before it derailed in East Palestine, Ohio. Officials say that it shows basically the final stage of failure. That's what happened then. Of course, a major question that the people living there want to know what's going to happen next.

The EPA has been is testing the air in homes after the toxic wreck. Ohio Governor Mike DeWine is asking for the CDC for help now for people who have symptoms that could be related to the exposure to these chemicals.

But it's not just the people and residence of East Palestine who are concerned about their health this morning. One of the dangerous chemicals has seeped into the Ohio River. It is now traveling downstream. Millions of people are now concerned about their drinking water as well.

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REPORTER: What do you want to as the EPA administrator? What do you want to hear from him?

KRISTINA FERGUSON, EAST PALESTINE, OHIO RESIDENT: I want to hear that my creek is going to be clear. I played in that as a child. I went through those tunnels. I want my town safe.

REPORTER: You're not satisfied with the testing that's been done at your house?

FERGUSON: No. And you're going to smell it as soon as you go into my house.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Joining us now is the water quality and treatment superintendent of Greater Cincinnati Water Works, Jeff Swertferger. Thank you so much.

You served more than a million people in the Cincinnati area. You get 88 percent of the drinking water from the Ohio River. So, that is obviously why so many people have questions. I know you've been doing testing. What exactly do you test for? What does that look like?

JEFF SWERTFERGER, WATER QUALITY AND TREATMENT SUPERINTENDENT, GREATER CINCINNATI WATER WORKS: So, we're working with a lot of partners here, with regional partners from USCPA, and especially ORSANCO, the Ohio River Valley Water Sanitation Commission. So, we're working with that group, getting samples all up and down the Ohio River. And we're bringing it here into our lab and doing these analyses. Now, fortunately, we're not finding the high concentrations that they're seeing up in the East Palestine area. Our concentrations are much less and that's coming down the Ohio River. What we're seeing is especially one compound that was being detected. It's called viro acrylate (ph). That compound is actually decreasing a bit as it is coming down the river between its volatilization, being eaten up, but the concentration becoming less and less as it is moving towards us.

COLLINS: So, it's becoming less and less, but you're seeing a difference, though, since this train wreck has happened?

SWERTFERGER: Yes. So, this is something that we would not have detected before. We -- the test that we do, we have a suite of tests that we do all the time anyway to make sure that the water is safe. So, if there is anything in there we don't know about, we'll detect it. This compound would have been detected in that. We don't detect it. But we haven't detected it before. And now we're detecting it upstream of the city of Cincinnati.

COLLINS: One thing, Jeff, that we've heard from a lot of people is they're skeptical of the testing. I know we hear from you. We've heard from officials at East Palestine and EPA that they're doing this testing, telling us what they see. But how do people know they can trust the testing?

SWERTFERGER: Well, I think in our part, you know, we're drinking the water, too. I'm drinking it. My family is drinking it. I don't want to drink this stuff. So, I want to make sure that we're doing as good a job as we can to characterize what is happening and also looking at our treatment. We've done a lot of work looking at our treatment plant and making sure that we could remove it. And we feel that we have several barriers we can remove it. And even before that, we can actually shut down and not bring the water in for a while. So, if we see if the contaminant is getting close to us, that's usually our first action is just shut down and let it go by altogether.

COLLINS: Yes. And one aspect of this is the rain. I mean, we talked about the soil in East Palestine, the rain happening, washing it down. What concerns do you have about that?

SWERTFERGER: Well, we have monitoring systems that we have set up will detect something else or something else gets washed into the river, we will detect it and we'll have a good notice, several weeks notice probably before it gets to us. So, because of this monitoring system that we have set up, we feel that we're in really good condition to be able to detect something if it does get washed out there.

COLLINS: So, that sounds like you're saying that if people are concerned in Cincinnati, people who are downstream from East Palestine, that they should not have concerns. Is that what you're telling me?

SWERTFERGER: Yes, very much. Not only in Cincinnati but we're working with a lot of utilities up and down the river. Over 5 million people get their water from the Ohio River. And we're working with the water utilities in a group to make sure that we're all aware of what is happening, what treatment is effective and make sure this doesn't get into the drinking water.

[07:25:03]

COLLINS: How long does this change how do you your job? You know, you're monitoring now. I know 24/7 is basically what you all have said. But how long does this go on for? Because I think a lot of the residents in East Palestine are concerned that it's a short-term attention span and not something that people will be paying attention to as long as it needs to.

SWERTFERGER: So, this particular -- this event may be will be -- may be three weeks in duration in total for us. But, again, we have a monitoring system. So, if something else comes down, we will detect it and then we'll start over then with the monitoring.

COLLINS: And some of the residents in East Palestine, just given your expertise on this, they've complained about the idea that they're told the water is safe but they're still told to drink bottled water. If you live there, how do you square those two?

SWERTFERGER: Well, I think what the Ohio Department of Health was saying is get your water tested. A lot of people up there in East Palestine have their own private wells. And that's a very different situation than what we have when we have a centralized drinking water system. So, there is free testing that the ODH are doing for those people. So, absolutely, they should have their wells tested, not just now but later on in the future, too, to make sure nothing else gets into there.

COLLINS: Does it ever become a situation where do you think that East Palestine should be designated as a super fund site, where it gets the federal attention and it changes the contamination and how they are allocating resources for it? Should it be a super fund site?

SWERTFERGER: I don't know about a super fund site but I certainly think that there needs to be a lot of effort put into it right now to characterize what is there to clean up what is there. But, yes, I think they do need a lot of attention up there.

COLLINS: All right. Jeff Swertferger, thank you so much for sharing that expertise with us and your testing procedures and saying that you and your family are drinking the water, and so you do believe it is safe.

SWERTFERGER: Absolutely. Thank you.

COLLINS: Thank you, jeff.

CORNISH: The special grand jury looking into Donald Trump's actions in Georgia after the 2020 election has released part of its report. So, what is it in and why they're recommending charges?

HARLOW: And I'm live in Salt Lake City, Utah, ahead of the NBA's All- Star Weekend. We have got some great interviews coming up. I'll speak with the WNBA commissioner, Kathy Engelbert, also the owner of the Utah Jazz, the founder of Qualtrics, Ryan Smith, is here. And I have the best assignment in television today. Plus, you'll see my sit-down with, who else, Inside NBA, Shaq, Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith, coming up.

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